Guild Wars 2

Just a few questions:

Do you know all of the classes fairly well?

Do you keep track of your and your targets active buffs during the fight?

Do you constantly move around, swapping pets and using their special as much as you can?

Do you spam your cool downs or wait for more advantageous moments to use certain skills?

Do you know exactly what your major and minor traits do?

Is your gear synergistic with your build?

I’m not trying to degrade your frustrations but I am one of those people that get perplexed when I hear people struggling so much with Ranger.

Slic.9541:

aspirine.6852:

You may think otherwise, but that does not make it wrong. That you managed to kill a few terrible players to say the least does not make a ranger viable.
Bear ranger, hb warrior, heartseeking spamming thief…. Not to mention the ele that well almost did nothing in ruins but eating your arrows.

I like rangers. I have always used a ranger on this game and I have builds for every occasion. Sure rangers might require good players to play them, but if you play them right they are much viable right now as of my opinion. I have been roaming a lot and that’s about the only thing I do…I have filmed a lot of good fights and they take forever to end. This is an entertainment video and it’s for those rangers who actually stick to the class no matter what ‘nerfs’ they get. I am a ranger and will always be one, I will always come up with a build that brings the ranger up to the top. Trust me a well done ranger build can beat any class/build in my opinion and experience.

You really don’t have to defend yourself. You play the Ranger very well and adapt to make the class viable. The kitten ing and moaning of others that are too lazy to figure it out shouldn’t really be worth your time. Just being honest because I think you might be too nice to say it. Good work again on the video, I’ve always enjoyed them.

Durzlla.6295:

PvP players tend to be better than PvE players because if you kitten up in PvP, even just a tiny little bit like missing your cripple, it can be the difference between victory and defeat so PvPers tend to be a little better at the game as a whole.

I Disagree. I am not sure you can take one facet of the game and claim that because you are good at it, it makes you better than others also playing the game that are better versed in different skill sets.

Not to add fuel to any flame but the Ranger is a difficult class to play well. If you want to play the Ranger (and you should after that great investment) then do a lot of research on it. There are a lot of viable Ranger builds that will find you success.

Builds and gear aren’t all of it though. If you want to be great in pvp you’ll need to know all classes inside and out. This gives you the ability to read the situation and know what to expect so you can react accordingly.

Rangers are awesome. Many people here that play the Ranger make it work for them with great success – you just have to find your niche in the class.

A helpful tip: Don’t read a lot of the forum postings about Ranger belly aching. Every class has pros and cons. If you constantly read the ‘con’ posts then you’ll start to have an overall negative feel for the way the Ranger plays and you will not be able to find what works for you or, more importantly, have fun.

dreztina.4820:

Pinko.2076:

I guess I would have liked to do a fight club, but was ganked by 5-6 TC instead. Thanks for holding up your rep TC.

I’d be surprised to see any TC at a fight club. The population does not strike me as fond of fair fights. From what I’ve seen, all TC cares about is that they win, how they do it doesn’t matter.

We had a fair showing of TC at a fight club for most of the evening. We had a lot of great duels.

Stop bellyaching about who does what and just enjoy the duels.

Xsorus.2507:

All it takes is playing a Glass Cannon of any class other then a thief to realize how silly stealth actually is.

This is a pretty good statement.

I think that the longbow is very suitable for a Guardian.

capuchinseven.8395:

Loki.4139:

saiyr.3071:

Ha, everyone wants DB’s Oceanics.

Yeah they do, specially TC.

They’ve been trying so hard. They’ve been approaching every guild in DB. It’s funny.

Confused why you would think that’s funny, rather than common sense. Even if there was a 0.000000005% chance of it happening, as there is nothing to lose… why not?

He is just trying to loftily discredit TC.

Happyrock.5273:

I dunno if this has been said, The only Nerf I think that is really needed is, The stealth mode finisher.

With my nerco, If I’m downed from a thief and they go into stealth, I just wait to die, I can’t do anything. Any other class I could attempt to fear away for a small chance to live.

Yes. Removing Stealth finishers would be enough for me.

Lysico.4906:

only 70 now but will be

10
0
30
30
0

spec (with healing on buffs and symbol traits )… Thinking cleric armor or is that overkill ?

That or knights. Running GS and Staff. Mostly wpvp (farming orr at times)

I use clerics with 0/0/10/30/30 and I have great success. I’m not having problems with high end pve (dungeons and fotm 40+) content and pvp I am able to fight ~3 ppl at a time and survive just fine. Your damage output is going to be very low however.

JJBigs.8456:

Gear: Full zerker, Ascended Gear, 30/30/x/x/x. Armor=Ruby Orb’s Zerker.

Shortbow = Hits 800-1.2k. With 25 bloodlust stacks, can go up to 1.4k maybe.
Greatsword = Hits 2k-3.6k(Top DPS on the Leap finisher and 1 other)
1H Sword= 1.5-2.3k DPS (Needs a revamp as the dodges are annoying)
AXE OFFHAND = THIS IS YOUR KING DPS. 12X Whirling Defense, my end burst was 9.9k, meaning hits leading up to it was 6k>>7k>>etc.. quite alot of DPS AND reflects.

So, your 1.5-2.5k Ele Fire Auto attack better than this how? Also, why do you guys use bow? Just because its a “Ranger”? I use bow like i use all my ranged weapons, sparingly. Only on epic boss fights where zerker is impossible etc, but for general PvE, and dungeons like CoF, CoE, SE, etc… this is wayyyyy more dps.

I just want to double check and make sure that you are aware of this: The final number of your channeled skill (whirling defense) is a summation of all 12 hits. So less than 1k damage per hit.

I play an evasion/heal/condition Ranger traited into BM with apothecary gear. I love it and I don’t often find players or mobs that give me much trouble. And with all that success I hardly ever play my Ranger anymore. I play my Guardian instead. I have more utility (awa group support) and flexibility as a guardian and most importantly I find it more entertaining.

Spamming your auto attack in general is a good tip. You might look foolish but not nearly as foolish as the thief who comes out of stealth in down-state.

I feel like this build as well as Chris’ is pretty good except you’ll never kill anyone. If you can manage to dps someone down (after a long while) they’ll almost always have to option to just run away from you with great ease. How do you deal with that?

Please (as it has been said many times before) let our pets share our AR in fractals. We can actively avoid a lot of agony-dealing attacks but our pets can not.

Also I’d like to bring up again the issue of Pets in the Jade Maw boss fight. Even when dead my pet was targeted three times in a row by Jade Maw. This is very frustrating and always leaves the ranger up for ridicule b/c everyone is wanting to finish the fractal at this point but Maw keeps targeting my non-crystal-holding dead pet.

There is a problem with getting lava stacks in the Grawl Shaman Fractal. If you get any lava stacks on you it persists through death and through loading screens / zones. It last for one hour. Leaving Fractals and going back to LA seemed to fix it (that or leaving the group.)

It was horrendous and we had to quit the fractal most of the way through.

Mind the screenshot, it may have strong language.

Solid Gold.9310:

I think your seeing fractals as a job you have to do, and hate, and not a game you should be enjoying.

Yes it is a game but a lot of us budget a set amount of time that we can play it. SO we would like for that time to be productive. If we are going to just sit in front of the computer while our character basically goes through a lot of loading screens and you accomplish nothing, then I’d rather do something else with my time.

I would like to see people get punished for just leaving a fractal. Had a guy rage quit when we wiped on a boss, which was a fluke. We were doing quite well. We ended up four manning it and it was one of the best pugs I’ve joined. Impatient people that waste others’ time should indeed be penalized.

I did HotW path 1 the other day with a pug group and it was agonizing. When we got to the second boss, on the stairs, they all kept wanting to run up above him and try to kill him without getting hit. They failed several times. This is one of the easiest bosses to fight and they were complaining that it couldn’t be done without a couple of heavies, which I know it isn’t true.

Read the post about players getting worse and worse about handling boss fight mechanics because they want to exploit, so much so they can’t fight straight up anymore. It’s frustrating and I want to say that I’ve been seeing this too.

I didn’t get any for a while, then I got a good run on them. I know this is in my head but it seemed I got more rings when completing the daily on lvl 16 or 18. Now that I’m doing both 10 and 20 dailies I’m having great luck, whereas before I was not. Chin up and keep at it.

Arsenic Touch.7960:

Bastionhawk.7120:

Arsenic Touch.7960:

Bastionhawk.7120:

The name Ranger isn’t indicative of being ranged.

Anet’s definition of a ranger is indicative of it being ranged, so that’s all that matters.

Rangers are proficient with the bow. They rely on a keen eye, a steady hand, and the power of nature to slay their targets. Their loyal pets, which rangers tame and train, distract enemies while the rangers strike safely from a distance. As an adventurer profession, rangers wear medium armor

Rangers rely on a keen eye, a steady hand, and the power of nature itself. Unparalleled archers, rangers are capable of bringing down foes from a distance with their bows. With traps, nature spirits, and a stable of loyal pets at their command, rangers can adapt to any situation

Their own definitions. So let’s stop the parroted “Rangers aren’t ranged” argument when clearly anet defines them as such. Which is where the largest issue comes from when people speak of the ranger.

You can define a ranger however you want, you are still wrong. If the class name were “Archer” then yes, based on the Latin root of the word it would be indicative that the class would be good with a bow and arrow.

Bringing this point up is to inform others so they do not sound ignorant when they talk about their own class. (I mean the word ‘ignorant’ in the sense of ‘unaware of’ not in an abrasive way.)

Except I didn’t define them, anet did. As I stated, those are Anet’s definitions and their definitions of the ranger are the only definitions that matter, so saying I’m wrong and ignorant is saying anet is wrong and ignorant. Do you really want to open that can of worms?

I think plenty of people have opened that can.

Arsenic Touch.7960:

Bastionhawk.7120:

The name Ranger isn’t indicative of being ranged.

Anet’s definition of a ranger is indicative of it being ranged, so that’s all that matters.

Rangers are proficient with the bow. They rely on a keen eye, a steady hand, and the power of nature to slay their targets. Their loyal pets, which rangers tame and train, distract enemies while the rangers strike safely from a distance. As an adventurer profession, rangers wear medium armor

Rangers rely on a keen eye, a steady hand, and the power of nature itself. Unparalleled archers, rangers are capable of bringing down foes from a distance with their bows. With traps, nature spirits, and a stable of loyal pets at their command, rangers can adapt to any situation

Their own definitions. So let’s stop the parroted “Rangers aren’t ranged” argument when clearly anet defines them as such. Which is where the largest issue comes from when people speak of the ranger.

You can define a ranger however you want, you are still wrong. If the class name were “Archer” then yes, based on the Latin root of the word it would be indicative that the class would be good with a bow and arrow.

Bringing this point up is to inform others so they do not sound ignorant when they talk about their own class. (I mean the word ‘ignorant’ in the sense of ‘unaware of’ not in an abrasive way.)

StevesDad.8213:

Bastionhawk.7120:

The name Ranger isn’t indicative of being ranged.

Best contribution to the thread by far, thank you so much for this awesome post! I screenshotted it even

If you are going to pose an argument for something then you should know the right criteria.

The name Ranger isn’t indicative of being ranged.

Griffons and something like Eir’s pet, Garm.

No it doesn’t. The only way to up your pets condi dmg is to trait into it.

It is pretty strong imo. I think it should be this strong in pve and perhaps half as strong in pvp.

I agree Dee. I think this is the exact reason thieves get more attention than other classes.

This guy vvv

Shukran.4851:

ommaigawd another thief thread.

the solution every thief hater would like to find is make thief useless so everyone can kill them just pressing 2 keys.

thief receive so much complains because opponents doens’t want to improve themselves.

tl:dr: ommaigawd qqthief thread, l2p pl0x

Was so quick to defend his class and be rude while doing it, he completely missed the point of discussion.

Go the the Heart of the Mists and try all the weapon sets, runes and sigils for free. You can redo you build as many times as you want. You could also use the wiki or the search feature on the forums. This question has been asked an answered many times.

When a thief kills me for this reason (invisible for well over half the fight) I just let it go. I generally see that class as something of a joke. I also live by the standard that if you have to be invisible more than half the time then you are no good at pvp anyway. That is why the class exists. For those sort of people.

Here is my biggest issue with thieves. (this is not an insult) In most cases there is no skill required on either side of an encounter with a thief. It is simply over too quickly. 14-20k damage in under one to two seconds is madness. It doesn’t matter what the thief has to sacrifice in order to get this to work. I do not think it is good or fun gameplay.

I have plenty of fun fighting the thieves that are built to survive a little bit and there is a genuine back and forth in the fight.

My opinion is that there just needs to be a general reallocation of power in the balance of the thief.

You have 25% with the signet. That particular tooltip wasn’t updated.

Empathic Bond at the end of Wilderness Survival.

I’ve gotten exotics, two of them named, and rares in WvW recently. That’s RNG for you.

This has been a really fun match up so far. Keep up the good work SoR and BG – I know TC is having a blast.

Are you looking for someone to change your mind? Why did you make this post?

Anthrage.2519:

So I’ve long experienced the situation where you do F2 and your pet runs to your target or executes it’s primary attack instead…which it would be great if they fixed btw…but I had a case yesterday where the pet seemed to execute it’s 2nd or 3rd skills instead.

I’m not 100% sure there is not some other reason why it did that, so I put the video up - is this a F2 fail or was it something else?

This happens sometimes. If you execute the skill and he is about to do one of his other skills or he gets interrupted then the F2 skill will go on a 3-4 second cooldown. The same if you are using a skill and then get interrupted, that skill has a longer temporary cooldown then the other skills on your hotbar.

Korrtz.3510:

Bastionhawk.7120:

This is the situation. I’ve agreed with the notion that there are things within this particular class that need to be looked at. I personally do not want to see this class get a big nerf.

Now whatever it is you are overcompensating for you can just stop. I can tell you that your comments above are why most people are going to write you off. You can’t just insult a group of people (or just one person) and expect them to actually listen to you. I think you are wrong in your opinion and you think I am wrong in mine however you’ll never have a productive conversation if all you do is belittle people to …make yourself look better (i guess that is why you do it). Next time you think you have something great to say you should stop and think before you post. Also, make sure your comments are pointed at the right person – I don’t think this post was meant for me in all actuality.

By the way – with all the hatefulness you are expressing I just wanted to point out to you that this is a video game forum. Please consider getting a little perspective on life before angling negativity to other people.

Taking yourself a little too seriously there bub? Can’t hack some smack talk? Oh well, I guess we should nerf writing styles too, that’s a good idea. Can you put out a style guide? Can you also help clean up government decorum and professional sports teams as well? They have filthy mouths with all those verbal exchanges.

Ever hear the term “give an inch, and they take a mile”? A few tweaks here and there is a slippery slope, but I’m sure you do not care at all, as long as your concerns are dealt with. But what about people that don’t like the bouncing arrow? or the initiative system? the skill trees? the venoms? the caltrops? If everyone’s concerns are just as valid as yours there will be no class left to play. Do you even understand that? I say learn to play because that is what a game is about. You seem to think I am hateful here when I am just enjoying myself and the challenges the game presents. Who knew that all I had to do when I encounter a tough mesmer is complain on the forums to let me win. The fact that you are unwilling to rise to the challenge makes me wonder why you play these types of games at all. Single player games are designed to have you win them but I suspect you need the ego rub more that the gameplay.

Yes I am protectionist, but after seeing what happens to games when this sort of discussion gets taken too seriously and ruins the entertainment value, I have good reason to suspect your fairy-dusted words of “fairness”.

There is a difference between being firm and being ugly. You’d do well to remember that distinction.

I play this game for fun because it is just that, a game. If you want to equivocate real life situations to the balance of virtual fighting of zeros and ones then I can’t relate with your frame of mind.

Again. You are making generalizations about me and my overall character based on the fact that I think there needs to be some work done. You are overcompensating. I’m done responding to you. This back and forth is in no way productive.

No Walking.6349:

What gear do you use?

CRrabbit.1284:

Cleric jews + Zho’s set, both are the cheapest exotic sets. ~20g you should get all done. Weapon I would suggest go for PTV (e.g AC weapon) instead of cleric weapon since I found that I have more healing power than I need. It will end up ~2900 armor, 20k HP, ~2700 atk, ~1600 healing power with 500+HP regen per sec for you and 1000+HP regen for your pet, both of you are as tough as bunker guardian. I can deal with 90% 1v2 situation (except for 2x BS thieves) and 50% 1v3 situation. For zerg fight, you won’t die since you stand far behind in most of time. Even if you go deep front, SB3+Lightning reflex+switch to sword2 = you are 1800+ range away.

CRrabbit.1284:

Cleric status means power/toughness/+healing (rings, earings, amulet), those exotic are cheapest in AH at least several days ago.

Doomdesire.9365:

WvW/PVP go for a thief

PvE go for a ranger

Rangers are stupidly weak in WvW right now…

Not true in my opinion regarding Rangers in WvW.

I think the real issue is that most people are determined to play the ranger in a certain way that is not conducive to success in the WvW setting. I wouldn’t want to play anything else tbh but I am a little biased.

Yes I do not use the activated ability on signets b/c they are not very good. The passives work well for me atm though.

It was your choice to roll a thief. If you’ve played MMO’s ever then you know that most of the time they start out super OP and then are worked down to a manageable state. To the people who started in the OP version of the class – they think the class is unplayable however most of the time it has just had the playing field leveled a little bit.

Wendigo.1470:

Wait, don’t pets use their skills automagically? Do I have to activate their abilities beyond an auto attack?

<< 3 day old noob.

They use all skills automatically but the first skill listed on the pet stats screen(K). That skill is activated by you pressing (by default) the F2 button.

I would suggest finding some mobs and having only your pet attack them. See what kind of damage your pet does and see how effective the F2 skill is when you activate it. Try that with all of your pets. Once you’ve done that start working in that particular usefulness when you are in combat as usual.

I personally watch the area around my health bar and my pets health bar so know when to swap out, use a skill or even call him back for a moment.

Wilow.3061:

Bastionhawk.7120:

Korrtz.3510:

Bastionhawk.7120:

I wonder if you are a thief talking about ‘easy buttons’. That would be interesting.

Really?

Thank you for providing such a perfect reply to my post. Completely removing any sort of personal responsibility and placing the fun of the game, or lack thereof, entirely on the shoulders of a single class you feel plays the game in an unfair way.

And yes, I play a thief. But also a mesmer, guardian, and elementalist, but please, continue to throw excrement like a child and avoid having to rise to any sort of challenge presented by the game.

You may think your post was in jest, but it still proves my point beautifully. You feel cheated and feel the the thief class should be handicapped. In order to improve your gaming experience you are calling for someone else’s to be reduced, how noble of you.

Hyper-defensive as you are, I still got a nice laugh out of your severity. You take yourself and this class too seriously. Facts are facts. The class needs tweaking.

Tweaking yes, every class still needs tweaking. But many of the people attacking thieves are calling for flat out nerfs (ala 50% less damage on abilities). I would be up for abilities doing less damage, but they need to compensate us with something. So far, the balance has been a little one sided, making some abilities flat out not worth using…ever. When a nerf to an ability makes that ability not usable, you go too far.

As for facts are facts, yes, I guess I can’t argue with you there. I still haven’t seen any “facts” in this thread though. I’m sure if you really wanted you could have fraps or something running with your hero window up, and show us something that is broken backed up with your ability (aka not staying still afk, or in the middle of frenzy, or wearing your zerker gear then claiming you have 3k+ toughness with 25k+ health afterwords). Many posters are saying all the see in PvP (they probably mean WvW) are pacts of thieves, so such a video shouldn’t take too long to produce. Just exit your starting area and you are bound to be waylayed by a group of perma stealthed thieves waiting for meat.

I agree. I think it is fair to point out that while a few of people are focusing on my comments I should also point out that I’m not one of those people who think the class should be nerfed.

Korrtz.3510:

I have a really simple solution for the people that seem to have rage all over thieves or anything else that they find challenging.

I propose a difficulty adjuster, so if you encounter an enemy, whether player or npc, you can just adjust it to easy and finish the fight in sweatless style. Getting frustrated with a jumping puzzle? Easy button and there is a path straight to the end! Levelling? Bah, easy button bumps you to 80 while you leisurely enjoy a cup of camomile tea. You too can remove any challenge in GW2 with the easy button!

I wonder if you are a thief talking about ‘easy buttons’. That would be interesting.

NightyNight.1823:

What exacly is their ‘’VALID POINT’‘?’Some screenshots whit some damage, In WvW? If I bring you a screen shot whit kill shot 33k now Warriors are OP?
Everyone can do high numbers, its about dealing them and how they can be countered.Some screens whit some thief killing you doesn’t prove a thing other than you getting killed because you did nothing to defend yourself.
And BS build is hardly viable in tPvP.That build will never work on someone whose actualy using brain.3 hits combo its so obvious ,too stupidly easy to counter.Its a bad build for 1v1 ,only good for killing the large mass of stupid.
That build is so defenceless against most cases its pathetic.Try killing a necro whit 3 health bars, a guardian, a warrior whit 30k HP, an elementalist you know , the kind of elementalist everyone plays .Its never possible.So to come here and request to nerf already a bad build its just insane.

You are far to biased to have a discussion with about this. Thieves could have a one hit one kill button and you’d probably still think there was nothing wrong. Try looking at these issues from the outside and be objective. I think it is you that needs to use your brain a little bit. Also – what valid proof are you looking for? Osaliske laid out some pretty good points. I think you might not have the ability to defend your own case. It is easier to discredit everyone else rather than formulate your own defense isn’t it?

NightyNight.1823:

Bastionhawk.7120:

NightyNight.1823:

Bastionhawk.7120:

NightyNight.1823:

The damage being taken to you is irrelevant.You have no proof or even an argument to why is it OP or what ever you say its true.Story telling doesn’t cut it.It can be said the same about every other proffesion.Take Warrior for instance , kill shots up to 33k.Don’t complain about 20k ditched in a combo of 3 skills , its ridiculous.

Except it isn’t story telling. Everyone is experiencing this from thieves. The killshot is ridiculous but I haven’t seen one like that ever and has been months since I’ve been hit with one that just took me out. Thieves are a problem that is everyday and everywhere.

Yes , it is story telling.Some numbers on some screenshot doesn’t prove a thing.I could sit in place , let myself killed by some random guy ,then show the numbers , ohh Warrior is so OP.Thieves are fine , no ones having problems in sPvP or tPvP whit them.All the complaints come from idiots whit 0 experience in WvW.

You can skew anything to look like it is something else if you present the evidence that is in your favor. That is a no brainer. That does not mean that there isn’t a problem. Btw, if thieves are ‘fine’ then why is there an entire developer made thread setup for people to talk about how they are not fine? They don’t need nerfing imo but some pretty good tweaking is in order.

This tread exists only because of the ammount of whiners that don’t know how to play.Doesn’t mean thief actualy needs tweaking.If anything thief needs some improvements because on a proffesional level Thief doesn’t perform as good as some other classes.But I realy don’t expect you to see beyond a ridiculously bad build and WvW.
95% of you whiners never even brought a valid argument to any of your complaints , only shown some Screenshots whit numbers that don’t prove A SINGLE THING.

Constructive. People will not take you seriously if you constantly belittle people with opinions. There are ‘whiners’ and there are people with valid complaints.

And…Professional level? What? Give me a break. Don’t take yourself so seriously.

I also noticed that the trait that gives pets might on crit was not working properly either.

NightyNight.1823:

Bastionhawk.7120:

NightyNight.1823:

The damage being taken to you is irrelevant.You have no proof or even an argument to why is it OP or what ever you say its true.Story telling doesn’t cut it.It can be said the same about every other proffesion.Take Warrior for instance , kill shots up to 33k.Don’t complain about 20k ditched in a combo of 3 skills , its ridiculous.

Except it isn’t story telling. Everyone is experiencing this from thieves. The killshot is ridiculous but I haven’t seen one like that ever and has been months since I’ve been hit with one that just took me out. Thieves are a problem that is everyday and everywhere.

Yes , it is story telling.Some numbers on some screenshot doesn’t prove a thing.I could sit in place , let myself killed by some random guy ,then show the numbers , ohh Warrior is so OP.Thieves are fine , no ones having problems in sPvP or tPvP whit them.All the complaints come from idiots whit 0 experience in WvW.

You can skew anything to look like it is something else if you present the evidence that is in your favor. That is a no brainer. That does not mean that there isn’t a problem. Btw, if thieves are ‘fine’ then why is there an entire developer made thread setup for people to talk about how they are not fine? They don’t need nerfing imo but some pretty good tweaking is in order.

NightyNight.1823:

The damage being taken to you is irrelevant.You have no proof or even an argument to why is it OP or what ever you say its true.Story telling doesn’t cut it.It can be said the same about every other proffesion.Take Warrior for instance , kill shots up to 33k.Don’t complain about 20k ditched in a combo of 3 skills , its ridiculous.

Except it isn’t story telling. Everyone is experiencing this from thieves. The killshot is ridiculous but I haven’t seen one like that ever and has been months since I’ve been hit with one that just took me out. Thieves are a problem that is everyday and everywhere.