Guild Wars 2

Dagger Storm is almost useless in PvP or WvW anyways… I really just use that skill while I’m low to gain health with Signet of Malice. That skill doesn’t do much damage – max 4K with critics… That skill needs some, uhh, damage not CD obviously.

Durzlla.6295:

Imperadordf.2687:

Durzlla.6295:

It does give you super speed as the 3rd GM (which is stupid that it takes up a GM slot), and it’s not actually distortion, if Mirage cloak gave us distortion Mirage would be absolutely kittening fantastic and I guarantee no one here would be complaining about it as much as they are.

Mirage cloak essentially sacs your mobility for a better pure defense evade since you can activate it at any point in time, including while you’re airborne or CCed, unlike dodge. Whether that’s worth the mobility trade off is debatable though.

Since they said specializations were upgrades to the classes, I think they should add a little blink to the cloak to make it useful. Otherwise I’m not getting into this spec which uses the weapon I hate most.

Have they said that elite specs are supposed to be upgraded? Because last I saw they said they were supposed to be side grades IE no overall improvement, just variation. But that was back when HoT was announced so their stance could’ve changed.

If it did change, yes, a blink would be fantastic, if not they better make superspeed work in all directions, but if they do it’d be alright.

They have changed. And yes, I don’t know the normal evade’s range but I’ll take it as 500, and I expect them to make a blink with 250 range.

Fiskerton.2739:

musu.9205:

superspeed does not work backward

Use the about-face button, or use the right click camera control.

I mean, doesn’t Superspeed last 3/4 second?

Durzlla.6295:

It does give you super speed as the 3rd GM (which is stupid that it takes up a GM slot), and it’s not actually distortion, if Mirage cloak gave us distortion Mirage would be absolutely kittening fantastic and I guarantee no one here would be complaining about it as much as they are.

Mirage cloak essentially sacs your mobility for a better pure defense evade since you can activate it at any point in time, including while you’re airborne or CCed, unlike dodge. Whether that’s worth the mobility trade off is debatable though.

Since they said specializations were upgrades to the classes, I think they should add a little blink to the cloak to make it useful. Otherwise I’m not getting into this spec which uses the weapon I hate most.

I am not a pro Mesmer player but even a starter would realize the difference between normal evade and Cloak…

I mean at least it should make you faster right? I don’t think Mesmers would give up an evade for 3/4 seconds Distortion which doesn’t give you any mobility.

Leo Schrodingers Cat.2497:

Imperadordf.2687:

Leo Schrodingers Cat.2497:

Signet of Malice is a 25% passive speed boost. Useful for jumping puzzles. Can help you outrun a centaur.

Signet of Shadows*
Malice is the healing one.

Btw I CAN OUTRUN A CENTAUR!!

Nice catch. But can you…. OUT RUN A POCKET RAPTOR?!

Nobody did. Nobody do. Nobody would.

Leo Schrodingers Cat.2497:

Crinn.7864:

DE is bad for the same reason s/d condi thief is bad, because it doesn’t measure up to the monster that is d/p daredevil.

For a new thief build to be “good” it has to be better that d/p daredevil, but since d/p daredevil has everything a build could ever need and then some there is little chance of there ever being a “new meta” for thief.

As long as d/p DrD is 42, no new espec will ever be good.

So in your words, D/P DrD is the only way to go, when for the longest time core thieves have been murdering people before elite specs, and still do in some of the most ridiculous ways. I’m glad you’re not the one who decides what is meta and what is not.

He didn’t say D/P is the only way. He said if something needs to be meta it needs to be better than D/p Daredevil. But right now D/P Dash DrD has everything a thief needs, so there won’t be another meta until D/P has beaten.

Thanks for the advice! I’ll probably add you and try the things you said. I also heard Bunker Chrono is pretty good, but couldn’t find any builds – guides about it. Is there a guide about it?

You are lucky dude. I sometimes get 5K Backstabs… Anyway getting a 8K backstab is pretty good because if you can repeat it with Blinding Powder + Backstab combo it would instantly down some players

KrHome.1920:

Imperadordf.2687:

Ok guys, I don’t know if I am just kittened or this build is trash, but I tried full damage S/D condi ( power – condi – precision ) and defensive condi ( carrion ) and it was, horrible.

I tried to #2 then #3, caltrops, bounding dodge, and chain #3. I barely got the health of the elementalist 100 to 60. And you know what happened after that? He used heal I was using my skills in this order; #2 – #3 – Caltrops – Dodge(Bound) – Chain #3 – #5 – Auto attack – #2.. and goes like this. But it didn’t feel like OP. I must be doing something wrong actually because I was doing literally no damage to anybody. Welp

You are doing it wrong. I mean… Bound? Wtf.?!

Build + Playstyle:
https://metabattle.com/wiki/Build:Daredevil_-_S/D_Condition

My build was exactly like that. But I felt like I’m so squishy so I changed my build to a defensive build and my dodge to Bound.

I don’t know..

Taobella.6597:

you dont need cover when you 100% uptime stealth all you do is mark your target wait 7 second pop bali 1 shot your target lol

Almost everyone can kill you in 7 seconds actually…

Leo Schrodingers Cat.2497:

Signet of Malice is a 25% passive speed boost. Useful for jumping puzzles. Can help you outrun a centaur.

Signet of Shadows*
Malice is the healing one.

Btw I CAN OUTRUN A CENTAUR!!

Ok, I just hit 80 with my Mesmer and I was itching to try it in PvP. I found it really fun to play and I am playing Power Chrono right now, but I don’t know that I am doing good or bad. I usually get 15+ kills and almost don’t die with it, but I still lost some games. I am currently using this – http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vhAQNAseWncfCNqhlpB2fCMrhFcjqMASgfBNI2teruVv1eF-TpRCQBg7QAkk9H04JAAAPAgMcEAUYZAA

Any tips, advices and help is appreciated.

Thanks

Ok guys, I don’t know if I am just kittened or this build is trash, but I tried full damage S/D condi ( power – condi – precision ) and defensive condi ( carrion ) and it was, horrible.

I tried to #2 then #3, caltrops, bounding dodge, and chain #3. I barely got the health of the elementalist 100 to 60. And you know what happened after that? He used heal :( I was using my skills in this order; #2 – #3 – Caltrops – Dodge(Bound) – Chain #3 – #5 – Auto attack – #2.. and goes like this. But it didn’t feel like OP. I must be doing something wrong actually because I was doing literally no damage to anybody. Welp

What you are saying is NOT about S/D condi. ALL condition damage builds are overtuned right now. You can’t just blame S/D for this.

As I said earlier, “Don’t blame the poor sword”

TwiceDead.1963:

Imperadordf.2687:

Ohoni.6057:

Every class has at least 798 billion projectile denial skills

This sounds like a PvP issue.

It is. But I don’t think rifle has enough DPS - Not to be confused with burst - to do continuous damage. P/P is still a better option in my opinion.

Burst is more valuable if you only have a tiny opportunity to do damage, and since there’s a kittenton of projectile hate in the game, you only have tiny opportunities most of the time.

P/P Still has more reliable burst than rifle though, in that it’s far easier to deliver, so there’s that…

Tiny, but almost useless because of Malice mechanic. Malice generates too slow that you might sleep, have breakfast, go to work, get back home, have dinner and whoops, you still don’t have enough Malice to do damage. It is so ridicolous.

They wanted to make a balance mechanic and they literally killed the spec.

Azukas.1426:

babazhook.6805:

By the way no matter how one tries to spin it Condition s/d adds 6 poison for the use of 15 ini which is around 800 damage per tick.

Claiming one has to factor in all of the other traits and utilities as being “part of s/d” is no different then my claiming s/d cleanses 5 conditions in a second for 0 ini which the build I linked to can in fact do thus concluding it “op”. If you want to include all of the other traits that add conditions as being part of s/d then any trait or utility that REMOVES conditions muct be considered part of any given weaponset.

The build I linked to is not even taking all the cleanses that are available to it.

We’re not talking WvW we are talking PvP.

You’re build in terms of PvP has zero redeeming qualities. You can’t team fight, duel on side points, or even play a decap +1 roll. The s/d condi can do ALL of those things albeit not as mobile as the D/P dash meta build.

Please no one really cares about WvW when talking game balance. The mode isn’t balanced in the least.

Thank You

But you always mention other traits and utilities Potent Poison only stacks 6 stacks of poison with Infiltrator’s Strike for 15 initiative which is the max initiative limit. For 15 initiative you can do much better with S/D Power or D/D condi or P/P condi/power. Sword doesn’t have any other condition than Potent Poison which is only 6 stacks.

There is a thread about S/D power in this forum. I don’t wanna get infracted so I can’t tell you the name but that guy reached RANK 6 IN NA WITH S/D POWER.

S/D condi relies on it’s utility skills which all thieves can access. Steal, Caltrops, Condition Damage Venoms. For steal, every thief uses it. For caltrops, every condition thief uses it. For Venoms, you need to have a fast attacking weapon ( Dagger or Pistol ) to make them more useful. S/D condi is almost nothing but Potent Poison.

Today, I was playing PvP as D/P Berserker, and I faced a condi thief with S/D. He spammed 2 Inf Strikes on me and I had Withdraw as heal and Dash as dodge. I cleansed the first 2 Inf Strikes, he hit me with Caltrops and AA. Then I dodged the immobilize of the third Inf Strike and I knew he had like 3-4 initiative so I continued to fight and he was like “Oh boi she is crazy”. Then I dodged his Steal and used D/P #3 – Steal – Stolen ability – Blinding Powder – Backstab on him and he was at like %10 Hp and I was ( if i remember correctly ) at % 60-65. If you can cleanse at the right time, you can make this build useless and make the thief die or retreat. He is left with his 2-3 initiative when you cleanse his Inf Strikes and Caltrops.

In Thief vs Thief, S/D condi is useless. Bandit’s Defense just destroys them and they are easy to kill after that. “Do I have to take BD in case of facing a S/D condi?” – Well, if you don’t take a cleanse, stunbreaker or a defense utility skill, you already lost doesn’t matter which class/build you are.

S/D condi is a viable build, but only has 6 poison ticks for 15 initiative in it’s weapon skills which is definitely NOT WORTH. Every Thief has base damage, but if you’re getting one shot/get beaten by this build WITH CLEANSE, you should really don’t play the game at all.

No offense, but you don’t have to be a Platinum to cleanse the poison – ( bleeding – confusion which are NOT INCLUDED IN THE S/D SKILLS ) from this build.

Thank you.

Condi S/D is viable but I believe there are more unbalanced condition builds. They should nerf them first AND people really need to stop whining about thieves. This thread was not a whine, but many people come to thief forum just to say “NERF THIEF THIEF IS OP THIEF SHOULD BE REMOVED” and these are really annoying :|

Azukas.1426:

TwiceDead.1963:

Azukas…
You’ve been saying a whole lot I’ll give you that, but you have nothing to show for it.

Proving it should be very easy for you, just record a match of you facestomping with your build, then share it.

You refuse to do that, and instead insist on showing highly questionable screenshots, which makes people question your credibility (surprise surprise).

Burden of proof lies with the claimant.

It’s already been proven. At this juncture we aren’t questioning if it’s over tuned but how to scale it back.

My suggestion is no poison on immob

But not only Inf Strike has immobilize :| They would nerf all condi thieves with that change. I suggest lowering condition damage overall. lol

Ohoni.6057:

It is. But I don’t think rifle has enough DPS – Not to be confused with burst – to do continuous damage. P/P is still a better option in my opinion.

That may be true atm. I haven’t run the numbers, but to the theorycrafter in me, Malice was intended to be the balancing factor there, that against an enemy that stays alive for a while, the Deadeye might be lower DPS than Pistol over the first ten seconds, but that ramping Malice should lead to being higher DPS over the last twenty seconds, or something like that. Now maybe that’s not the balance they achieved, but it’s one that would make sense to me. I think that a kneeled Rifle DE should balance out to be higher DPS than a mobile P/P, and if it doesn’t right now, that’s just numbers.

Yup. They need to lower Three Round Burst’s and Death’s Judgement’s damage and make malice regenerate faster.

Ohoni.6057:

Every class has at least 798 billion projectile denial skills

This sounds like a PvP issue.

It is. But I don’t think rifle has enough DPS - Not to be confused with burst - to do continuous damage. P/P is still a better option in my opinion.

Crinn.7864:

Imperadordf.2687:

Ohoni.6057:

I have the worst time trying to kill enemies with a staff from 1500 range.

Every class has at least 798 billion projectile denial skills

Necromancer has exactly 1 projectile hate skill. (reaper has a additional one)

It may be that way, but when you need to shoot a projectile, EVERYDUCKINGTIME they bring up 798 billion projectile denials.

Elxdark.9702:

Imperadordf.2687:

I don’t think this build is a good matchup with Dragonkitteners. You know, they just roll their face and do some dance moves, some sweet moves on their keyboard and the game says: U R DED BOI

But overall, S/D power is some godlike thingie on 1v1s.

It is actually really effective against dhs, the only thing you need to avoid is the pull.
You have x4 stuns for 3s daze each one and you strip their stability and protection everytime so they can’t really do anything against dazes also your main attack source is sword #3 which is always unblockable applying constanst pressure to dh because they don’t have great mobility.

Say whatever you want, my hate for those kitteners won’t change.

God kitten Dragonduckers

Ohoni.6057:

I have the worst time trying to kill enemies with a staff from 1500 range.

Every class has at least 798 billion projectile denial skills

Ok, this may sound silly, but I really think that TANK DEADEYE can be viable. The specialization has A LOT of damage and tanky build can be useful.

This build will cut it’s damage to half but, it can tank some damage and deal damage at the same time.

Lol.

Otherwise, yes. You should build full berserker or marauder to do real damage.

I don’t think this build is a good matchup with Dragonkitteners. You know, they just roll their face and do some dance moves, some sweet moves on their keyboard and the game says: U R DED BOI

But overall, S/D power is some godlike thingie on 1v1s.

Deadeye – new elite spec – is really good at doing damage but it’s mobility… It bothers me more than anything. Look at metabattle.com for currently meta builds and tips.

- Yes thieves are in a pretty good point in WvW right now and good at +1 in sPvP. In PvE, you can build whatever you want. It doesn’t matter because of the potential damage of Thief. But you can go Trickery – Deadly Arts – Daredevil to easily clear mobs.

- The meta weapon sets right now are;
Power Dagger/Pistol – Shortbow
Condition Damage Dagger/Dagger – Shortbow
Power Staff – Pistol/Pistol

I don’t think I played enough DE to go in a discussion like this, but I still disagree with you about mobility. I am not saying “HURR DURR DEADEYE IS TRASH ARENANET STOP DOING EXPACS PLZ” but Deadeye still has some problems about malice regeneration and some extra mobility.

KryTiKaL.3125:

Seriously, I see so many people mostly only bring up Death’s Judgment when they are talking about Deadeye damage yet they apparently completely ignore Three Round Burst. That is your bread and butter damage, even along with Double Tap. I’ve pulled an easy, little effort 8k-10k Double Tap in PvE vs groups of mobs and I’ve run a Sigil of Fire on the Rifle to get AoE damage out when I crit (which is often).

I’ve also put out pretty effortless 15k-20k Three Round Bursts on mobs, if they even survive that long. Mostly only saw those numbers on Veterans or Elites, got even higher on Champions (40k vs bounty Champions). Even when fighting packs of mobs I was able to individually wipe out enemies fast enough that the group would get cleared pretty quickly.

Even in PvP you can 1v1 pretty easily. I pretty consistently beat Plat ranked players in 1v1s with my Deadeye, its a single target burst Elite Spec, its pretty tailor made to blow up a single target and Thief in general has always had very good escape tools. I’m sure you guys are aware of Stealth, yes?

Really have no idea where the people on this forum are getting the idea that Deadeye is “weak”. It is absolutely strong, most of you are just doing it wrong.

No no I didn’t mean to say “Deadeye’s only damage source is DJ.” I was saying it’s damage is really good especially Death’s Judgement.

Deadeye is good but you mostly need to kneel or stop moving to do good damage. The spec’s damage is really good but mobility is what makes the class “weak” in 1v1’s. Otherwise DE has the most burst damage in PoF specializations.

reddie.5861:

in order to pull this number u need to do have the stacks up and run complete glass cannon build + might stacks.

i played deadeye had bit of fun with signet for power(forgot name im sorry) yes it hits hard but then i went on my orginal power thief put signet on also and i wreck just as hard as i did on deadeye + fact that i felt much better cus of survivability.

im sure deadeye has things it will shine at but any thief duo will wreck some mindless roamers deadeye wont be any better at it then any other thief in blob fight deadeye shots dont pierce i believe so sniping is mad hard when everything running around like fools and for roaming i personally think once u make mistake on deadeye ur gonna get ur face smashed cus of lack of mobility on the class

That’s what I was talking about. If Deadeye can’t kill his enemies in a short time, he’s gonna get wrecked easily. Same with his enemy. If you can’t kill Deadeye in a short time, you’re gonna get DEATH’S JUDGEMENT MOTHERkittenER in your face.

Asur.9178:

Imperadordf.2687:

…And sometimes P/P is more viable than Staff or D/P in PvE.

Lol.

P/P can kill single targets better than Staff and some mobs just destroy you in close range so, “sometimes” it is more viable.

YuiRS.8129:

You can play through solo PvE with a single pistol. You can also kill some players with a single pistol. It’s just really bad and not worth using.

I didn’t really understand what you are saying but in PvE P/P is certainly better in slaying champions and bosses. And sometimes P/P is more viable than Staff or D/P in PvE.

reddie.5861:

Imperadordf.2687:

Leo Schrodingers Cat.2497:

Imperadordf.2687:

Deadeye is a WvW class. Useless in 1v1, usable in sPvP, cancer in PvE.

Is that in a good way? Or a bad way?

In WvW, Deadeye destroys every living thing on it’s sight. It is good that way. But in 1v1, most classes would kick the kitten out of DE. In sPvP, you can do +1 pretty good. Squishy characters can’t stand a chance against a Deadeye they can’t kill in 5 seconds. In PvE, since the specialization has no AoE, DE can’t clear groups of mobs properly or in a limited time. I recommend using the spec with Pistol/Pistol or waiting for it to be buffed.

thats kitten, id beat any given Deadeye spec on daredevil warrior prolly also.
who ever can play Ele will do the job aswell. any condi kitten will do it.

the rifle is way to slow, u can go P/P but im just laughing at any P/P thief (yes its strong) i dont even attack them i just interupt them they blow them self up on p.impact.

deadeye is good at things but its far from destroying anything on sight daredevil outshines deadeye in WvW.

none the less i had bit of fun playing deadeye in the test but it doesnt give me the thief feeling.

I respect that, but I must disagree. I know most Deadeye players can’t play the class probably right now – including me – but when you face a Deadeye and can’t kill him in 4-5 seconds, the class really shreds through everything. I’ve seen 109K Death’s Judgements.

But you are right about the predator part. Most classes can kill Deadeye in the blink of an eye right now. But we’ll see. I hope they do some work on the spec.

Ohoni.6057:

Agreed. This is a “feels bad” issue, I get why they have it, but it will just never be a fun mechanic for players. Here’s my compromise suggestion:

If you use #5 to stand up, then it behaves like it currently does, no change there.

But if you hit a direction to move, you will instantly stand up and start moving, but you will impose a stack of Crippled on you, maybe only half a second, maybe a second, not a huge amount, but enough to slap you on the wrist a bit for getting up too quickly. This would help keep kneeling riflemen “less mobile,” but not make you completely immobile.

^^^^^^^ This guy is right.

You should make a post about this and explain it widely.

Leo Schrodingers Cat.2497:

Imperadordf.2687:

Deadeye is a WvW class. Useless in 1v1, usable in sPvP, cancer in PvE.

Is that in a good way? Or a bad way?

In WvW, Deadeye destroys every living thing on it’s sight. It is good that way. But in 1v1, most classes would kick the kitten out of DE. In sPvP, you can do +1 pretty good. Squishy characters can’t stand a chance against a Deadeye they can’t kill in 5 seconds. In PvE, since the specialization has no AoE, DE can’t clear groups of mobs properly or in a limited time. I recommend using the spec with Pistol/Pistol or waiting for it to be buffed.

Yup, maybe if we create tons of threads explains this, I hope they would change or re-work it.

Azukas.1426:

Sly.9518:

Azukas.1426:

Sly.9518:

Azukas.1426:

Sly.9518:

Ario.8964:

Could you do more damage with power? Sure but let’s look at the requirements for doing that say, on power s/d: Every skill has to hit AND crit, can’t afford having it blocked,

Fun fact Condi skills have to hit as well, and can’t be blocked as well, otherwise no damage is applied. And let’s not forget the Condi damage can be mitigated completely with Resistance and through proper cleansing. And let’s not forget the cover Condis are completely shut down by any form of projectile hate which makes the main damaging condition very easily manageable, and the build relies on blowing semi long cd a Dodge multiple Ini Attacks and a stem to do the Burst damage. That alone is a lot of resources used for a Burst but hey some people in this thread try to claim one Steal and a Dodge is all it takes to kill everyone. But I understand that in this game some players die to 1 spammers. Can’t balance around everyone.

Actually you just have to properly use your skills to outplay everything you just named. Basi venom will stop a block cold and allow you to lay down a ton of condi that need to be cleansed. If used on Inf strike to break the block and then u dodge. By the time human reaction time catches up and they stun break they’ve already eaten your damage; whereas, Basi > Inf strike > Flanking > Larc any decent player would have stun broke and evaded ur main damage.

As for projectile hate yes that’s a thing but it doesn’t stop the Inf Strike & caltrops which is where most of the damage comes from. Also Steal goes through the projectile hate and that is 5 confusion & 3 more stacks of poison. This is how I was able to dismantle Chaith of all people.

I think the people who are arguing against this need to PM me so we can set up a live demonstration. Until then we’ll have to move forward with the understanding that most people do not have any experience with the build in discussion. I will also explain exactly how it works & why the synergy works so well so people can fully understand why this build is over tuned.

Oh so Power can’t use Basi Venom at all? Since I was disputing the claim that apparently Condis don’t have to hit to apply damage as the post I quoted.

And I already proved to a top 70 player last season that claimed it was OP by thrashing him over 20 times and died once to it.

And again there is tons of counter play to it though Cleanses, Resistance, projectile defense, blocks, Evades etc.

Which meta build/class did you use?

Used D/P daredevil with PI using Marauder Amulet the same build Berserker Amulet, then I used Core Thief using Berserker Amulet, then S/D Power using Marauder Amulet. then I used Menders Ele. I was gonna hop on to DH but that person was done losing over and over on the “OP” build.

Then he wasn’t very good at Thief.

Nope, you just can’t accept you are wrong.

Until level 80, run power for most of your items. After 80, you can go full berserker (which I don’t recommend but your choice), full condition (insane damage with Dagger/Dagger) and Marauder or Valkyrie. Marauder is the best choice in my opinion, because it has good damage and gives you almost 5k HP. Valkyrie is a little bit more defensive and what Arenanet recommends when you use your level 80 boost.

Dagger/Pistol and Shortbow is the most used and the most powerful build in today’s meta. It is not easy to use but if you learn how to use it, the reward is almost perfect. For this build, I recommend using Trickery, Deadly Arts or Critical Strikes, Shadow Arts and when you are level 80 replace Shadow Arts with Daredevil.

For the utilities, it really depends on your playstyle, but you can use Withdraw as healing and cleanse, Spider Venom or Assassin’s Signet – depends on you, Assassin’s Signet is very good for bursting down targets and Spider Venom stacks 4 poison if I remember correctly – Caltrops for a little bit more damage or Signet of Shadows for some movement speed and some conditions, Signet of Agility for some precision and endurance regeneration or Blinding Powder for stealthy plays and at last, I recommend Basilisk Venom or Dagger Storm as your Elite skill. These really depends on your playstyle as I said but my Dagger/Pistol build is;

Trickery – Deadly Arts – Daredevil
Withdraw as healing
Signet of Agility, Spider Venom and Caltrops – For PvP, I use Shadowstep instead of Caltrops -
And Basilisk Venom for PvP, Dagger Storm for PvE.
My gear is full Marauder right now but if you want to one shot someone with this build, you can go full Berserker.

Tips;
Learn how to use Pistol #5, Dodge and Dagger #2 for stealth.
Learn when and how to engage with #3 and Dagger #2.
Don’t be greedy, learn when to go all-in and when to fall back.
Most of these come with experience, but you can watch professionals like AikijinX and Terissimo. Aikijin’s video link is on the forum right now – I couldn’t find the link – and Terissimo has a Youtube channel with 8K subscribers.

If it was unbreakable it would be beyond broken. But yes, unblockable attacks for 1,5 or 2 seconds seems fair enough.

Deadeye is a WvW class. Useless in 1v1, usable in sPvP, cancer in PvE.

Asur.9178:

Faaris.8013:

If you count range 900 in, then Thief with pistols is probably top. You can basically play the whole game with double pistol, it’s very effective.

Lol.

I completed the HoT story with P/P. Not the whole game but you can do %90 of the game just by playing with P/P. Not easy, but you can. P/P is really effective it can burst down many mobs.

Azukas.1426:

Sly.9518:

Ario.8964:

Could you do more damage with power? Sure but let’s look at the requirements for doing that say, on power s/d: Every skill has to hit AND crit, can’t afford having it blocked,

Fun fact Condi skills have to hit as well, and can’t be blocked as well, otherwise no damage is applied. And let’s not forget the Condi damage can be mitigated completely with Resistance and through proper cleansing. And let’s not forget the cover Condis are completely shut down by any form of projectile hate which makes the main damaging condition very easily manageable, and the build relies on blowing semi long cd a Dodge multiple Ini Attacks and a stem to do the Burst damage. That alone is a lot of resources used for a Burst but hey some people in this thread try to claim one Steal and a Dodge is all it takes to kill everyone. But I understand that in this game some players die to 1 spammers. Can’t balance around everyone.

Actually you just have to properly use your skills to outplay everything you just named. Basi venom will stop a block cold and allow you to lay down a ton of condi that need to be cleansed. If used on Inf strike to break the block and then u dodge. By the time human reaction time catches up and they stun break they’ve already eaten your damage; whereas, Basi > Inf strike > Flanking > Larc any decent player would have stun broke and evaded ur main damage.

As for projectile hate yes that’s a thing but it doesn’t stop the Inf Strike & caltrops which is where most of the damage comes from. Also Steal goes through the projectile hate and that is 5 confusion & 3 more stacks of poison. This is how I was able to dismantle Chaith of all people.

I think the people who are arguing against this need to PM me so we can set up a live demonstration. Until then we’ll have to move forward with the understanding that most people do not have any experience with the build in discussion. I will also explain exactly how it works & why the synergy works so well so people can fully understand why this build is over tuned.

I think most players with a brain would easily dodge half of the combo you mentioned. I used S/D in WvW, and almost everyone used a stunbreak and dodged away from the combo. I know you won’t even pay attention to what the others say, most people know here it is a decent build. But it is barely overpowered. Anyone here can do what you say without S/D. Is it unplayable against? No. Is it counterable? Yes. You complain about it’s condition damage? D/D can do better. You complain about it’s power-based damage? D/P can do better. Do you complain about it’s single target damage? P/P can do almost anything it can. Do you complain about it’s overall damage? Staff can do almost anything it can. Why are you still complaining?
1- You got one-shot by this build. Because one-shotting or quickly killing people is OBVIOUSLY not a Thief’s job, right?
2- You faced really really bad opponents so you became platinum.
3- You became platinum with your newly created account because it is really easy to be platinum with new accounts.
People with some knowledge of the game can be a challenger against this build. Nothing overpowered about it. Just a decent build which requires less intelligence and reflexes to be effective. Enough said.

Don’t blame the poor sword

People who claim “S/D Condi is op” are just salty because of they got destroyed by a condition damage set. S/D has almost nothing to do with what you say. You say Steal, WHICH IS OBVIOUSLY EXISTS ON EVERY THIEF, you say Lotus dodge, WHICH OBVIOUSLY EXISTS ON EVERY DAREDEVIL, you say “quickly stacking poison”, WHICH DAGGER/DAGGER CAN STACK QUICKER.
There are WAY MORE powerful sets than S/D condi and you are blaming the poor sword? Shame.

Learn some fast combos and how to use the Stolen abilities.
Learn when and how to attack.
Try to learn some skills of each class so you won’t be surprised when you face a different foe.
Don’t be greedy, if you can’t kill your enemy in 5-6 seconds, fall back and regenerate some initiative.
You are free to hate Dragonkitteners.
Terissimo – imo – is a top tier player. You can watch her videos. She explains almost everything when fighting against a specific class.

Sontaran.5904:

Another issue is that traps like needle trap are a long rectangle, so even in pvp where you have a point, it’s hard to get someone to step on it. Rangers and guardians get much more utility out of theirs in my opinion, but when you do land needle trap, it’s pretty awesome. I was about to die against a necro in pvp yesterday and right before, he hit my needle trap and I ended up winning the fight as a result.

As you mentioned, he probably forgot there was a trap so he stepped on it. There is no way that a mentally stable person would step on an obvious trap like these.

Damage buffs or condi buffs will not increase their effect too. Their cast time should either get removed, or they should have 1/6 or 1/8 cast time.

Traps. The skillset that no one uses when playing thief. The skillset that only PvE mobs get caught. The skillset that shouts “HEY MAN I’M HERE CAN YOU PLEASE SIT ON ME SO I CAN BE EFFECTIVE”. The skillset that is so useless it only exists to occupy a utility slot.

In my opinion

-Traps should be thrown where you stand or should have 200 range. They are barely existing on people’s skillsets and nobody uses them.

-Traps are more likely to be used by Rangers. Because you know, Rangers, they are the ones who live in the wilds.

-They are SO OBVIOUS when getting set that when you’re setting a trap everbody knows that there is a trap.

I think there really needs to be a rework or the thing I said “thrown to places”.

Please ANet, they need some love too.

Ok I tried it today on sPvP. There was a support elementalist behind me and we destroyed the enemy DPS elementalist. I agree with you on the “locking yourself” part but I easily escape with Dash in the traitline. I know it isn’t the best build to play ( and I know D/P kills almost everything on it’s sight) but that is not a bad build either. I partly solved the Initiative problem with Steal +2 Ini ( in Trickery) and 2 Unloads can be done continuously.

Conclusion, decent build, but not meta.

I know every build is acceptable in PvE but I think stacking vulnerability that quickly on other team’s DPS could be very useful in PvP.

I’m on phone right now so I can’t generate the build properly.

I don’t know much about the meta right now but I heard D/P is on the rise. I’ve been trying some combinations and I think this one is really good. I only tried it on Maguuma but that was more damage than I expected. I am running full power on it and traits are Trickery, Critical Strikes and Dash Daredevil. Utilities are Withdraw, Assassin’s Signet, Skale Venom to inflict vulnerability, Blinding Powder and Dagger Storm for some situations ( Getting surrounded by enemies, foes with CC chains).

The combo is you use #4 to blind the enemy and 5 vulnerability stacks, then use Skale Venom with auto attack for quick vulnerability, use Blinding Powder and hit a little bit more and you Steal if they escape or if you are low on initiative.. If you do this quick, you can get to 25 vulnerability stacks in 4-5 seconds. Then you swap to P/P and unload the kitten out of your pistols with at least 20 vulnerability on them.

I know that might not be the best build but you can take Shadowstep instead of Blinding Powder if your foes escape.

What do you think about it?

You have my very thanks.