Guild Wars 2

I was one of those “white knights” that defended the vision of the manifesto.
Now I feel outright silly for doing so.

I’m pretty disappointed in the way things have gone, and can only hope that ArenaNet decides to listen to the players (nearly 10,000 posts, that’s more than anything I’ve seen FOR vertical progression).

I would love to see things changed back to how they were. I don’t want another gear treadmill. I quit TOR and WoW because of the gear treadmill. I came to GW2 because I wanted something different. I wanted a game that focused on the world, and story, instead of the gear.

Now it all focuses on the gear once again, the numbers, the gear checks, the gear levels, the stats.

I’m extremely disappointed, to say the least.

This idea might be better suited in the suggestions forum, amongst one of the other threads about the same subject.

You might have better luck there.

I see what you mean, and I agree completely. I want to suggest to you to look over your original post again, though.

You stated “Every time you turn around it’s a bugged event, bugged skill point, bugged quest bug bug bug bug…”, which doesn’t give anything detailed to help them fix the issue of bugged events. Plenty of people have stated already that events are bugged, and that they’re frustrating.

You also said, “Special one time event….bugged for a lot of people”, which again doesn’t point out what the issue could be, and doesn’t quite help them solve the problem to make it better in the future.

I’ll use your iPhone 4 idea as an example: Imagine if the people that got the iPhone 4 knew there was a problem, and all they said was, “There’s something wrong with this! It isn’t working right!” but didn’t give any decent ideas on what the issue could be. Sure, it would help Apple realize there’s an issue, but it wouldn’t help them narrow down just where they went wrong.

Chris.7653:

Well again, this was me stating my own opinion on the matter. Why would I do it? Not to rub ANet’s nose in it, nor to say they are doing bad, but to let them know the state of at least this customers experience and maybe if they see this post, and others as you mentioned like it then they will go “ok let’s adjust some of our process” and it makes the game better for everyone.

I understand what you’re attempting to do, and it’s a great notion, but still. It’s counter-intuitive.

Take this for example: Imagine buying a chair and then later finding out that it’s had some problems in the beginning. There’s the mass recall and people are returning their chairs to get new ones or whatever else.

Does it make sense to still point out to them that the chair is defective? In my opinion, it doesn’t, because they already know it and they (most likely), will want to make a better version of the chair next time, without the flaws, because it would be terrible for business if they kept doing the same thing over and over.

Edit: I just want to say that voicing your opinion isn’t bad at all. That’s encouraged and we know ArenaNet wants to hear it, but there doesn’t need to be another thread on the issue, because it just clutters up the forum and it really does make it disorganized on what ArenaNet has to dig through to find what they need to make the experience better. Just some food for thought on the idea.

I can understand why you think that’s helpful, but really, it doesn’t provide much help.

ArenaNet know that bugs and glitches can impact the fun of the game. They don’t need to be told this. It’s counter-intuitive to tell them what they already know.

Now, what I’m trying to say is, posts like this don’t help ArenaNet. Like I said, they’re aware how the bugs and issues can impact the fun. They’re working on it as much as possible.

All threads like this do is cause arguments between people, and make for a lousy time for anyone else.

In short, telling ArenaNet, “This is bad, there are bugs, and you did bad.” doesn’t help anyone, because yes, they’re already aware of such things, and yes, they are aware that customers might not be thrilled with the current state of things because there are other posts on the forum that mention such things.

All we’re trying to suggest to you, Chris is that, yes… they’re aware of these issues.
Yes, they’re going to fix these issues.
No, they can’t fix them within an hour they find out about them (unless they’re really lucky)
Yes, you have to be patient.
And finally, yes, they are absolutely aware of the disconnects and problems.

If you have a serious problem and are having a hard time playing, you can take it to the Technical Support forum and ask for help. Otherwise, like Hunterdan said, this isn’t valuable feedback because saying, “You have issues.” is very vague.

Edit: I know this is going to be taken out of context in some form just to claim I’m a “White Knight”.

Welcome to software development. Chris, I’ll let you in on a little secret: No matter how much time anyone in software development has to make something, things will always go awry and there will be bugs, and glitches. Preventing all this from happening is near impossible.

What you must have is patience. That’s the key to it all.

Software development is fickle and bugs happen no matter what. This isn’t new to anyone in the MMO business.

I get what you’re saying.
The only thing I see wrong with that idea is that, even when you get this new content and the enemies are more powerful than you… what happens? You have a challenge for a while, but eventually you’ll overpower that content just as much as you would with my idea.

I think both ideas work out pretty well for their own separate reasons. The only thing that I think my idea would have over yours is that, content wouldn’t be negated over time. All content could remain relevant and keep people doing them.

This is my example for that: When I played WoW, I loved the raids, they were a lot of fun. But then I got more gear, got super powerful, then all the raids that I did were just… steamrolled. Then when the next expansion came out, all that world, all of that raiding was all negated.

The way the plateau of gear is now, all content has the potential to remain relevant.

(If I’m understanding your idea right, of course. It’s 2 a.m. here. =p )

Well, there’s the issue with your idea, Mario.
“Suppose that new content comes out where the enemies hit harder, have more health, etc.”

That’s just artificial challenges. It doesn’t provide an actual challenge. The way those challenges work is that they’re just “number” challenges. What I personally think that ArenaNet could do is have outward scaling of challenges, instead of vertical. By this, I mean:

Have different types of dungeons. Maybe there’s a dungeon where it’s purely all about building and defending your little outpost from hoards of enemies. Building and repairing walls, putting up cannons, repairing the doorways (kind of like how WvW works)

Maybe they could do one where it’s a ship / boat battle against pirates. You have to target specific parts of the enemy’s ship to weaken them, sink them faster, and all sorts of things. Those could all very much require cooperation and teamwork. Then after the ship is disabled, you raid their ship and fight off the remaining crew or whatever.

My idea is, instead of just having the game based off numbers for these dungeons, have it more based on strategy. If you go that route, there are countless numbers of ideas that can be used for dungeons, all of which could be very, VERY different from the others.

Well, if you saw my other post, I clearly stated nothing more than 10 people for a dungeon or raid.

And I also mentioned OTHER ways to get these kinds of gear through challenging content rather than raids and dungeons.

Edit: I have a vision in mind for why 10-people dungeons or raids would be different and more challenging, but it’s tough to put into words. All I can say is, it would open up for the idea of different strategies by possibly splitting up the group. Think kind of like the Lovers of Ascalonian Catacombs, that’s what I was thinking, in a vague sense.

Well, all I’m saying Cezton, is that most of the people I’ve seen here have been wanting to get gear treadmills going, and don’t like the cosmetic idea behind upgrades of gear.

I, personally, would love to see raids of medium-sizes (10 people? Cool. More than that? Nah).

I can definitely agree that the loot quality can be improved, and even ArenaNet has said that the loot quality for dungeons is crappy and they want it fixed or given better stuff.

I like the way you did just describe your idea on the end game and how to improve it, too. The problem is, and I don’t mean you, but a lot of people tend to coincide “endgame” with “gear treadmill”. That’s where a lot of this goes wrong, because then it just turns into yet another MMO that’s all about gear.

I think that raiding for cosmetic items (or whatever you desire), could be so much more enthralling for people to participate in because it wouldn’t leave anyone out, but it would give a choice on what you want to do for endgame.

If they put in an equally challenging way to get these cosmetic items other than raiding, dungeons, or whatnot, I’d be all for that, too. It would go along with ArenaNet’s idea of, “play how you want”. By this, I don’t mean “buying with Karma, after you farm enough events”, I mean actual challenges and objectives.

I also agree with the more rewards for Karma, too. But all we can do is wait and see what they come up with, because I’m pretty sure they’re not going to just plateau right where we are. We’re going to see a lot more karma sinks coming in down the line, but we just have to be patient.

All I’ve gathered from this thread so far is,

Pro-Gear Treadmill people are saying, “I wanna grind and get better gear! I don’t care if they come out with even raids where everyone can do them, and the gear you get is cosmetic. I don’t care if those are challenging. I don’t care if they add more things to do in the game. All i want is a gear treadmill, so I can feel relevant!”

Anti-Gear Treadmill People: “We don’t want this because we like the game how it is! It’s nice to finally have a game where we’re not forced to do a gear treadmill every content patch and expansion! We want to be able to enjoy the content that ArenaNet makes, instead of feeling obligated to grind and gear up in order to SEE content. We’ll see it if we want to!”

I’m curious if any of these “gear treadmill” people would enjoy raiding if there wasn’t a gear treadmill involved, and it was purely for the challenge, fun, and cosmetic gear? Something tells me, no.

If this game was designed to be a subscription based game, the entire game would be entirely different, Eridani. The thing with GW2 is that, they want new players to join the game a lot. They want to make the game grow. That’s why they try to focus on getting new people in. It’s not the subscription that matters, it’s the amount of people that buy the game. This game has a LOT of potential to keep growing through new people.

Now, a subscription based game, the difference is… they want to retain players as much as possible, and keep them hooked into coming back repeatedly, in other words, they want to shove that carrot on a stick down your throat; hence why just about every subscription based game out there is a WoW clone. They don’t try to bring in new people as much as keep the people currently playing, well, paying and playing.

So yes, if it was a subscription based game, right now, it wouldn’t be doing as good because there isn’t that gear treadmill and that carrot on a stick that’s MANDATORY to have fun. I like where this game is going right now, because there’s already going to be a content patch (the 22nd), and there’s so much for this world to grow with in terms of content—without the need for a subscription fee.

Heretic, the thing with GW2 is…. the world is massive. It is, by far, one of the biggest worlds I’ve seen in an MMO thus far. The game isn’t dying (as far as I can tell), and the game is definitely thriving.

The world is so big that people are spread out throughout the world in TONS of different zones. You won’t be running into 25+ people all in one area (unless it’s a big event), because people are everywhere. It’s all spread out, and this is good in my opinion.

The servers are mostly High and Full, that is not the sign of a failing game. Besides, just wait, once the 22nd comes by, the servers will be packed once again with people doing ALL of those holiday events and stuff.

Winterclaw.4273:

Actually GW2 should be losing players, at least some. Most games get a lot of players when they release and them hemorrhage some of that player base. No game has a 100% retention rate, not even EVE or WoW. I think for most people, they’ve stopped playing or stopped seeing people playing like it was opening weekend and declared the game dead.

Whether it is a problem or not remains to be seen.

Oh, I agree entirely. I’ve been playing MMO’s since about 2004. I know how it goes. Will people leave the game after playing it to test it out? Of course! I will even admit I’ve done the same.

But to claim the entire game is dying because of that is just, well, it doesn’t help provide a meaningful discussion about the actual issues that are a part of the game. It detracts from the issues and gives others’ the wrong impression.

The guild I was a part of, they started out playing the game and a lot were enjoying it. After the first month or so, sure, they stopped playing and went to other games, but I’ve met many other people that have been playing the game since release and have yet to even put it down.

There’s always the other side of the coin that some people don’t look at, and that’s just not helpful when it comes to discussing the game. People see what they see, and they proclaim that as fact, but because they don’t see the other side of things, they proclaim it’s dying or dead.

But see? This discussion right now is detracting from the actual issues of the game, so I’ll stop derailing the thread more. =p

See, the problem I see isn’t the talk about the criticisms of the game, or the negative feedback.

The problem I’m continually seeing is people declaring the game dead, that it’s a ghost town, nobody is ever playing it and so forth. If you want to make those claims, back it up with evidence and not merely hearsay.

I love reading the criticisms of the game, the things that could be improved, the things that could be fixed. I agree with quite a few of them.

The issue is that most of these threads that talk about criticisms also delve into the entire “this game is dying, the sky is falling, you failed us, you aren’t listening to us” arguments.

People need to learn to be patient to see just what ArenaNet is working on and doing. You truly can’t expect massive game-breaking changes within 2 months of an MMO’s release. You have to give it time. If you don’t like what you see in the coming months, then by all means, do the right thing for yourself and stop playing.

The bottom line is this, there’s a difference between criticism, positive / negative feedback and creating hearsay and doomsday claims just for the sake if trying to drive your point forward.

Looks like Crystal Desert is winning their current WvWvW match against Dragonbrand and Tarnished Coast.

Although, I guess that’s besides the point. Allowing people to transfer so quickly – to other servers will just make people transfer to the winning server of their WvWvW group.

I do like the idea of not being able to transfer to a server that your server is competing against in WvWvW, and that would be fine so long as Guesting would be available so people can still play with their friends, if they just so happen to be on that server.

They read everyone’s suggestions.
Can they make every change so quickly so everyone will be pleased? No, of course not.

Just because they don’t respond to your thread and say, “Yes, sir! We will do exactly as you tell us to do!” doesn’t mean they aren’t listening and reading. They’re wading through all the useless posts (like the OP post, that’s an obvious troll), and the legitimate posts, and working with that.

This might be a great idea!

Do the right thing and toss it in the Suggestions Forum, and try to garner support for it.

It’s there for a reason.

All I can think is, before the servers were restarted for the patch, those mobs were alive a lot longer.

After the server restarted, the mobs had their timers for existence reset, so you got less XP.

The thing I’ve noticed is that with this game, it sure does have its issues, and they’re being worked on, but that’s not the issue..

The issue is that people on the forums claim their opinions as fact. “The game is not fun at 80 because there are bugs”, that’s a classic example. They claim it’s not fun and that it’s entirely true for everyone else. That’s a classic troll, which brings in the knights who feel the need to defend it, which I don’t see a problem with.

The problem is they try and use that to try to insult the game by claiming that since THEY don’t enjoy an aspect of it, no one else does either, or by saying a certain aspect of the game will make THEM enjoy it, it will make everyone else enjoy it, too.

That’s what most of these come down to, people use anonymity to spread their opinion as facts.

There’s always this crazy website you can go to that has news.

https://www.guildwars2.com/en

I might just be insane, or something, but just about every bit of news I’ve saw on Facebook is … right there.

There’s even a section labeled “News”, which… has news.

That’s so true. The forums are generally where the most foul and angry people go to.
Go to just about any forum and all you’ll see is absolute hyperbole, and overboard comments and complete and utter disrespect for anyone and anything in their path.

Anonymity makes so many things worse, especially for game developers. You’ll have three people on the forums constantly talking about how “the game is terrible”, “everyone is quitting”, “there are bugs everywhere”, “the devs need to remake the entire game, because of my personal opinion” and that is just volatile to see. Can’t forget to add in the fact that anyone that enjoys said games, are fanboys to the utmost extent because they didn’t conform their opinion to the others’…

Basically, the forums of any game or the single most volatile thing for a game, because people go overboard. They can’t make constructive criticism because they feel free to become entirely insulting to everyone and everything due to anonymity.

Oh, just thought another one: When a thread gets locked down for trolling incessantly, and then the person goes into an outrage.

This game is amazing, and ArenaNet knows what they’re doing, there’s no doubt about that. The more control they have over the forums, and the more trolls they can get rid of, the better, because maybe then we can have more civilized discussions and suggestions without constant insults and demands.

Ah, don’t listen to the troll, Anonymous. The large majority of the playerbase is absolutely LOVING this game to death. Only the small, tiny minority are on the forums whining incessantly about their issues and trying to rile up people and make others think the game isn’t as fun.

When all’s said and done, so many people are enjoying this game, it’s great. The community in-game has been one of the best I’ve seen in any MMO. I, for one, will enjoy this game for a long long time.

Did you seriously just copy and paste your response to spam in another thread, Evil Elf?

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/suggestions/No-money-level-80-issue/first#post350180

I believe you did.

It amuses me at the people saying that the servers being Full on Saturday and on Monday them not being AS Full is a sign of the game dying.

I love to be the one to point out that, on Saturday, a lot more people are able to stay up later and play later as there’s no school / work on Sunday. Mondays, people aren’t able to stay up so late because they have school / work on Tuesday.

And I’ll add in the fact, … in primetime (depending on what timezone you’re in), people could already be asleep by the time you log on. For example, Pacific Time Zone is three hours behind East Coast.

Someone at 6 p.m. in Washington logs on, and it’s 9 p.m. for someone in NY. Of course, that person in NY is going to be going to sleep fairly soon or already asleep, so they can wake up early to start their new day.

That is not a sign of the game dying. That is a sign of life.

Raiding tends to be rather shallow, in my opinion, of what could really be done with content. Adding in a gear treadmill is just entirely un-fun, because each and every time, you get the best gear, another patch comes out that makes all that gear completely irrelevant.

However, raiding can be a lot of fun, if the gear treadmill does not exist and all the items you get in it are purely for cosmetic purposes. It would provide a wonderful challenge, and hopefully content that people would not be able to rush through instantly and give them something to work toward.

I don’t see how adding in raids where 10 people can group together to get cosmetic-looking items is any drastically different than dungeons with 5 people.

I highly doubt Arenanet is going to go the route of putting in a gear treadmill constantly and ruining the content of the game and making it as shallow as 90% of all the other MMO’s out there.

People need to realize that there is so much more to what an MMO should be than having a gear treadmill constantly.

It’s okay though, there will always be fans of the gear treadmill, and maybe, just maybe, they should realize that this game is what it is and to either adapt or not.

Sadly, people realize complaining about something that hopefully won’t change is the way they want to go than realize that there’s an entire game here other than a great treadmill.

I remember, when I played WoW oh-so-long ago…
I would run dungeons constantly and farm for a mount in Stratholme.
Then I’d get hit by that blasted lock-out because I ran the dungeons so fast.

Lo and behold, I wandered off for the 30 (or maybe 15?) minutes, while I waited for it to allow me back in.

As I looked outside the window of my room, and up into the sky… I realized…It wasn’t falling after all, and I was still able to play the game by doing a myriad of other things!

The lesson here is: Nothing is stopping you from playing the game. There’s so much more to this game than just grinding, if you cannot figure out what those things are for yourself (because even if people pointed them out, you’d ignore them, or attempt to refute them), then perhaps this just isn’t the game for you, which would be a shame since it has so much more to offer than just grinding events.

I just got this bug as well, and it happened during the Shadow Behemoth Group Event in Queensdale.

As soon as it happened, I crashed. As I logged in, the Shadow Behemoth was dead, and I got no credit for it.

Please fix this bug ASAP. Thank you.

I always see these comments about chat suppression, but I never see any type of evidence about it.

I can claim things, too. Maybe ArenaNet would like to see some proof of this “say two things and get suppressed” problem you’re having? I certainly haven’t had any type of problem with it, and I talk in /map a lot.

I would love to see screenshots of this 45 minute suppression and “only saying three things, and having everything changed” issue.

Pictures are worth a thousand words!

Great patch! The fix to the kits and the auto-attack is absolutely great! Can’t wait to see it in action—along with all the other bug fixes for engineers! Can’t wait to see it all.

Pretty much what Rpgtabbycat said.

The only problem with people nowadays is that, they expect the game to change just for them—and they expect to change everything within a week.

Me and everyone else I know, have been enjoying the game IMMENSELY. We haven’t rushed the content, and we’ve all been enjoying it as much as possible. This game has great staying power, and will last the majority of players a long, long time.

Well done, ArenaNet.

I’ll never understand the logic of:
“You like the game a lot, so you’re a fanboy.”

It really just doesn’t make sense. People defend something they like, and they’re “fanboys”. Do you feel justified in disliking something others like and calling them a fanboy?

Oh, wait, I think I figured it all out. People that call others “fanboys” are just trolls.

Either way, a lot more people than you think are enjoying the game and having fun with it. Just because you don’t like it, doesn’t mean everyone else doesn’t like it. You may want to re-evaluate how you play the game if you’re not having fun, or perhaps take a break all together and come back when/if this game becomes the game you w-i-s-h (really? Profanity filter for i-s-h?) it to be.

I can understand why the anti-farm code is disliked by people, especially those that are attempting to craft (I, personally, am not a fan of it, since Fine Crafting Materials are somewhat hard to come by), but unlike a lot of people I realize that this world is big and vast and there’s more than just one area to farm for these crafting materials.

Is it a setback? Sure. Do I like it? Not really. Are there ways around it? Definitely.

I think that was one of the points of the anti-farm code, to have people go out and go to other places to get the materials instead of staying huddled up in one area.

Of course, I could always be wrong.

indelible.6981:

Noxu.7203:

From my understanding of indelible

You address the thread like the majority are of your perspective. They aren’t. Feel free to count posts

Since you didn’t provide any input on how to make the game better, in your sole opinion (because, since I can’t speak for everyone, neither can you), then your criticism has been noted and invalidated, thank you for your time.

From my understanding of indelible, and what he wants is….

no events, no heart quests, no levels?

I /think/ you’re playing the wrong type of game, if you don’t want that.

Do you want to just roam around the world and just attack things without cause or reason? Or do you want to have GW2 focus on a lack of killing or doing anything? I’m not quite sure what you’re getting at, to be honest.

If you say there isn’t enough variety in the dynamic events or heart quests, I could prove you wrong. There was an event in Ebonhawke where we were tasked with getting a large group of animals back to their cage by bull-whipping them.

Kessex Hill had a heart quest where you turn into a big and sniff about for truffles.

Saving prisoners from the Krait is another one event. Collecting items that lay about and returning them to the event host is yet another idea that comes to mind.

So again, maybe I’m just not understanding what you want… whether it be more variety (which honestly, in my opinion, there’s already a /lot/ of variety for events and heart quests), or you don’t want them at all, all together—which, in the end, would lead to grinding enemies over and over for no apparent reason whatsoever.

Saying they don’t care because they didn’t throw in a magical fix to your ‘problem’ the moment you say it is just silly.

You’re terribly silly. Very, very silly.

I largely disagree with the OP, greatly and utterly.

This game is similar to WoW in the way that it’s an MMO and that you level up. The dynamic events are by far, much different than going to do a quest, reading the text, and collecting 10 boar hides, and turning them in. The events all have a story to tell, through interactive playing, not by reading.

Heart quests are similar to quests, but nothing alike. You don’t even have to usually do the heart quests in the same way you would do a normal quest, because as I’ve noticed, there are always events going on during the heart quests, which allow you to do them without even having to talk to the people. They are FAR more interactive and fun than just collecting boar hides.

The heart quests are simply just guides to show you where events take place, that’s all they’re meant for—if you’re using them to level up, then I would have to say you’re looking at them for all the wrong reasons.

I definitely agree on fishing! It adds a little something else to the game, to keep me all the more entertained!

There’s a lot of character progression and development in the game. I’ve actually been more addicted to this game than any other MMO out there, so far.

Unlike some, I don’t need a carrot on a stick to have fun with a game, and enjoy it thoroughly. It’s a LOT more fun for me than the usual “constant gear grind” in so many other MMO’s to date. It’s a breath of fresh air in the MMO genre, to know that I can have fun, without having to constantly do the repetitious gear grind over and over again.