Guild Wars 2

AnonMD.7263:

After posting in Profession Balance and getting no replies after two days, I decided to actually post this in the forum of the class it actually affects.

You got no replies because this is a terrible idea, and doesn’t work for ANY group fight. There’s no point going to the length of doing this when you can just give 5-10 seconds before decay, which makes more sense.

Yes, legendary one handed weapons costs more, but that’s legendary (and I agree they could be made a kitteneaper). Otherwise, I don’t get how you can think that Axe/Mace (or other dual weapons) is weaker than GS. What makes you believe it has lower DPS ? 100b ? It has lower mobility, yes, but other stuff and slightly better dps.

Sin.4130:

Brigg.6189:

I’m not sure I get what the problem is here.

The problem is that nearly nobody use dual wield In GW2 because you have absolutely no advantage from using this. It is weaker , more expensive then any other weapons set

If you mean from the point of “cost” as in PO, crafting materials, etc, they are not that important compared to the different skills you can have with dual wielding. Plus, it might be a little more (have not checked crafting), but it’s a very small difference. You have much more combination of weapons that 2 handed weapons. And dual wielding is as good as two weapons, just the skills change (so they can depend on the situation).
E.g. GS + Axe/Mace is very common in pve.

mtpelion.4562:

Bear on the job.6273:

Hundred Blades at 1500 range while moving…seems legit.

So Hundred Blades can be countered with Reflect or Block now? Cool story.

Nah, you only need to move. That’s a special skill you can use with wasd.

Vicariuz : Shortbow ranger have been quite nerfed. And thief … as said by Luka one of the class that require the less skill and that still can do “Insta-kill” (not only on glass cannon).

@Luka : Necro are UP.

@Winterfell : what about a teamfight ? If one get moaed, that becomes a 4vs5 for 10 seconds (which is a huge amount of time).

Luka.6831:

Visual confusion is the Mesmer concept. What about it?
Insanely high damage? Cant say that Id agree. We get nice damage on shatters but generally we rely heavily on traits for damage. We don’t have inherently high damage. We have great utilities though, one of the best I must say.

Relying on traits for doing damage ? Sounds like every other classes. And yes, the Mesmer can put more damage than lots of class. The game is unbalanced atm, you can’t deny it. Just look at Necro.

@Ljiona : there’s melee and melee. Lots of classes got melee weapons, but most of them are in fact ranged, even if it’s a shorter range. There’s 3 classes that are really melee : guardian, thief and warrior. And they both have help to get in contact. In fact, they’re some sort of “ranged” that move out and in melee range. The warrior actually has to be near the target to hit it.

And personally, I don’t see the advantage of melee weapon. Being able to hit 3 people at the same time with the Chain attack ? That’s all ?

@ Pachi : Yeah, without being babysited by a group, like in the video, that’s impossible.
If you look at the video, there’s at least a Mesmer and a Guardian with him. The mesmer use Moa (and other stuff ofc), while the Guardian use the Tome to heal the whole group. No wondering how he does that. So the warrior should be considered as a carry ? Quite odd in a mmo.

I think this thread very interesting. Because the warrior use mainly melee weapons, but his survival at melee is lower than the one of ranged classes (because the melee brings disadvantage, but I don’t see the advantage).

I don’t see why 100B would be OP with that change. Currently, the only way to land it is with bolas/bull/flurry or something that immobilize. Then, Frenzy and 100B. It is already really easy to dodge (bolas is easy to escape, as bull’s), not counting the stun breakers. When the warrior manages to do that, he can put a 100B. If he manages, he’ll kill the other, if he can’t, he’ll die. What would be the point of being able to do 100B at will ? Self root yourself ? Continue to another 100B after the enemy is gone ?

Although, that change seems silly, all classes would be copy/paste of the others. Each class need unique mechanisms (what we don’t have currently).

tom.7468:

Hsulf.9370:

2) Balance everyone to have exactly the same downed state i.e 1 knock back, 1 dps move.

yes and just delete 7 professions in the process sounds like a great idea its finally a balanced game!

/sarcasm
by the way if you think mesmers downed state is good have you seen warrior? its just vengeance finish him back up again.

Are you serious ? Warrior is a class with one of the most crappy #3. Vengeance means you have 15 seconds to DEFEAT an enemy, and you begin with ~6k hp. If you don’t defeat him, and he’s only downed, when you’ll be defeated cause of Vengeance, he’ll rally. Honestly, when I see a warrior with vengeance, I don’t even bother. If I really am low on hp, I put a small stun/cc, but that’s all.

And currently, it seems stupid that some gets a mono interrupt, while others have an AoE interrupt. If you want to win in Pvp, choose the class with the best downed skills.

Well, obviously, Healing Signet need a buff. If you compare it to Mending and Healing Cure, the hp/s is lower. And Healing Signet does only heal, no adren (even useless) nor condition removal.

If you’re gonna pvp, asura obviously. They get a real advantage because they’re small, harder to see what class they are, and their animations are smaller (which means harder to predict).

Well, Downed skills are really unbalanced. E.g. the #2 : for some classes, it’s a mono interrupt, and for others it’s an AoE interrupt. WTF ?

It’s a bit more balanced. Maybe it’s an issue to the pve, but I don’t believe they’ll let the Mesmer behind in terms of pve. Maybe you’ll have to change from Phantasm build in Pve for some times.

And don’t worry, the playerbase is beginning to get aware that AoE works well against Mesmers (and Thief too).

@gwawer : I would do so too, if Valve hadn’t kittened up with the matchmaking of Classic Comp.

@Pinkbunnies : 2 players together should ALWAYS bring you down, except if you manage to escape.

If you have read what you’ve written, you can see that mesmers have nearly only good points. What’s the drawback of a mesmer ? And more, mesmer is op because it’s a class (like thief) that is very easy to get a assassination build, or anything, that is very hard to counter.
It takes you 5 minutes to understand how to do that with thief/mesmer. It takes you hours to time perfectly you stunbreak, stability or whatever, it takes you hours to know who to hit and what to do first against a Mesmer. Yes it’s op.

That’s exactly what I said.
This is obvious that the endgame balance is not here. Then why nerf ? To provide a more balanced game until the game finally get more balanced. It’s not perfect, it’s a stall.

And mesmers are far from being the class that need the most bugfixes.

@etiolate : And what if the traits need to be balanced ? Fix it then change it to a whole different thing ?
As I see this update, it’s a stall to prevent the infestation of mesmers and thiefs that are currently IG. That’s obviously not the final plan for every class. Especially since every class has lots of bugs on traits and skill. That’s not a valid argument.
Of course, being nerfed hurts. But balance will come (hopefully), you can’t just say it’s unfair.

Well, of course, if we need a rework of our skills, that should be done too with traits. Else there will be op combination or useless traits (like now).

If the mace #1 grants vigor (on second and third attack), that would focus even more the mace as defensive.

The Hammer #4 is very situational, due to his self root. Maybe reduce his effect and being able to cast it moving. Although, there will always be skills “follow up”, you can’t have only skills on their own (that’s even against the idea of combo you had).

About the longbow burn, the rifle already applies a dot condition (bleed) on mono target. Having longbow doing that too is a bit redundant. Or else change rifle with longbow (more realistic, but that’s not very important).

I’m pretty sure there’s international servers. The fact is, gw2 is much bigger than gw1, therefore need static servers instead of the old servers “on demand”.

To me, the point of downed state is proving the value of a statement very important : Never underestimate the value of overkill

There’s some good ideas into that, Def, but probably overpowering the warrior (you still have to consider there’s traits, runes, sigils too).

Although, that doesn’t seem really to orient the warrior into a role. There’s a lot more way to keep your enemies closer to you (immobilize, cripple, hammer) which is good, so the warrior would be sort of a cc specialist ?

And longbow damage #1 is worst than wet noodles. I have the feeling i’m throwing 2 sticks rather than using a bow.

@Zanthrax : well, so far, the game is in a too early stage to make balance change (although they’ve already nerfed thieves and mesmers, who were obviously op).

But the minimum we should get is at least some fixes. We got bugs, and nothing is done ? Ain’t normal.

@Senai : Wait, did you read the update notes ? Lots of classes got bugs fixes.

(Although, there’s a discussion on pvp forum about warrior : https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/pvp/pvp/Dear-Jon-My-thoughts-on-Warriors-and-unique-improvements/first#post370597)

Well, the bug list of warrior is still the same size as it was the release day, amazing, huh ?
And Fix Hand is only the part of the iceberg it’s easy to see. There’s a lot more (won’t make the list).

Considering the state of the game, the fix needed first, etc, the warrior is fine. The game has been out for 5 weeks, that’s few. That’s why I added “in the long run”. You can’t have a game with perfect balance so early.

@Shukran : Every class has basic stats equalized and the same growing stat ratio currently. The only difference reside in the basic stats that are differently distributed. Basically, the op is whining about classes being different. Which seems silly, especially when they’re talking about warrior, which is considered as the worst pvp class (at high level, so if you’re having difficulty dealing with it, learn to play).

@Wildclaw : Well, the base stats are different (therefore the hp), but what the warriors have base hp, they need to put in damage. I’m pretty sure the total amount of stats is the same for every class.

“Take no damage from attacks”
Yeah, I probably mixed up, the Ep in Gw was about everything. Although the duration is a bug.

Well, for now, the warrior is fine, but in the long run, the fact that we can multiple things without excelling at one won’t make the warrior viable.

I don’t use GS, but i’m talking about the use that most warriors are doing of it. No need to be so contemptuous. That was about people (a lot) which often come on the warrior forum whining about HB.

Edit : And EP is bugged, 3s instead of 5, and still damage from condition. Works more like the Shield Stance.

You can chose whatever server you want. There’s no restrictions, Euro should go in Euro, etc (although it’s recommended).

I don’t understand people that come here to say “n build is outdated, here’s my build, it’s better”. The way GS works currently is … bad. Because there’s the combo : Bull, Frenzy, 100B. Which is easily avoidable, and with a glass cannon build.

Nonetheless, this post is about the gameplay of the warrior, which is “vanilla”. There’s nothing special about the warrior, and so nothing that can make him better than another class in the same role.
The warrior is not very good at condition, he’s not very good at being “tanky”, he’s not very good at support, and so one. And as with build, you cannot be a bit of damage and a bit of support (without sacrificing efficiency), there’s no reason the warrior should exist.
Currently, adrenaline is exactly the same as a cooldown, but the cd starts at the beginning of the fight. I remember there was more interesting things to do with, in Gw.

@Josher : So, if we want to play something interesting, there’s Necro, and that’s all ?
The warrior is not “effective with little effort”. He’s effective against people who don’t know how do deal with him, that’s all. I’ll understand your post as “Go play a necro, noob”.

Globally, the warrior skills are inferior to others. They do maybe a bit more damage, but have no other effects.

And about bugs, Schwarhrheit, there’s also lots of others traits and skills that need to be fixed. Though it’s not the point of the thread.

If you use different abilities in different orders to obtain group boons, Aoe, etc, why not simply put them in the base skills ? The only difference being that the “bonus” will only apply 1/2 skill.
Honestly, I’m not really a fan of combo (well, at least as what you propose), I feel that’s something cool right now, on the paper, but in the end, I fear that’ll be some more vanilla meh, that force the player to alternate his skills. The improvement needed is more in terms of gameplay, something that’s not already in another class. Something unique, that’ll really make a difference between a warrior and another class (even and especially when they do the same role, e.g. support, dps, etc).

About banner, too, the thing is, the banner pops on the ground, and i’m generally in a fight. In that case, my weapon is more useful than go picking the banner (animation) plus buffing my allies (new animation). Personally, I would feel the banner more useful if we could hold it when we pop it. Instead of designating some place, get it in my hands.
That case, I could pop it, buff my allies, plant in on the ground, and continue fighting.

I don’t know about the combo, I don’t feel it will change something.

I’m not sure of it’s what you said, but basically, instead of say, doing 1-2-3-4-5 skills, that would be 1-2-1-3-1-4-1-5 ? (ofc, it’s a bit random, but that would just mean to put a basic attack aka #1 between each skills ?). I don’t really see where that would improve the warrior about the “vanilla”. Especially that if we still have cooldown on our skills, there will be a point where we couldn’t use anymore our combo (all skills minus one (probably the #1) are in cd). Or then swap weapon to make combo with the other set ? Then, that would be 1-2-1-3-1-4-1-5-1-swap-2-1-3-1-4-5 etc.
The only point I can see here is that would provide the third attack of #1 faster using the other skills to combo it.

I think there’s more to search about adrenaline, which currently is just a bar to fill in and then use a more powerful attack (or not, with GS).

Sure that warrior GS doesn’t do massive dmg on stationary target. Badly, our greatsword is all about cc and defense. Oh wait …..

Retaliation : Spiked Armor
Blind and Burning : Longbow
But I agree with you on the form, we are straight forward in our aim (although there’s many way and builds to do it, with different efficiency).

Yea, it sounds logic that the red bar and auto attack is related. They’re probably based on the same calculus. Though it seems strange while standing still too. Or maybe that’s a result of the attack not being straight, like ranged, but in a cone ?

I agree with you in GS skills. But I think that there shouldn’t be some skills that can’t be cancelled while other can be for a 4sec cd. I don’t see the point of putting a high cancel cd on a skill even if it’s not meant to be cancelled.

Actually, you’re right, I wasn’t thinking much about Rush. That’s why I didn’t talking about it.
If I would say some skill to feint (e.g. for GS), I would say Whirlwind and 100B. Well, with 100B, it’s just that the full duration is completely useless because the other player is gone long before the end.

Just thinking about Rush. You could actually do that. Most people dodge when they see someone charging. I could then switch at mid range to ranged (longbow or rifle), eventually cripple, etc. Or just benefit from a low stamina.

The think is, feinting, or timing your skills is something very situational. And here (as I see), it’s mainly about GS skills, which I don’t use a lot.
My point wasn’t specifically about that, but more about cancelling shouldn’t be at high cost in general.

Backbeard : I’m not sure that’ll really put a safety net.
Let’s say you’re at 40%. If you receive a hit (burst damage e.g.) that’ll put you down to 15%, the Defy pain will activate AFTER the hit. Which means that if someone can put you down from 25% to 0%, that won’t work.
Although, I recognize that few skills can do as much damage in one hit (Evis and Kill shot for warrior). Also, the cooldown of Defy Pain (as Endure Pain) is quite long. And both have only ~3 sec for now.

@ kyokara : That doesn’t match with the tooltip, but you’re probably true. It appears that for now, Endure Pain works like the Shield Stance : 3 sec and blocks only incoming hits (although no block animation for Ep, ofc).

There’s already a cooldown when you interrupt something by dodging.
And a high cost will simply suppress the value of feint. Being able to feint is way smarter than just activating the skills at the good time, which is already not nothing. If you don’t have fully control of your character, you can’t play it smartly.

@Zhaitan : Actually, it’s the opposite.
The axe allows a very fast adrenaline charge, which means great burst damage. Greatsword, on the other hand, rely more on vuln, and 100b. But yeah, 100b is kind of burst damage.

That invisible in WvW really killed me some times. Like I was ramming gates, and suddenly people around me began to die. It took me some seconds there was some red names flying around. Too much to act quickly enough.

@Artaz : that’s a high cost for cancelling animation, there should be another way.

Well, I think the auto attack calculate your range at the beginning of the attack (or potential attack). Which means, that if you move, even a bit, the hit will actually land (if done manually). Granting that we move a lot in WvW, you gotta mash the #1.
I think that the calculation at the beginning should be reconsidered (adding potential extra range from move ?).

And Endure Pain is bugged, as you said, it’s more 3 sec than 5. Compare a mechanism that works with one that works only for half of it’s duration.

dre.8973:

not even the fastest centaur in tyria can outrun rush+whirlwind+1h sword charge spam.

Badly, some filthy cowards manage to do so. They’re called “thief”, but I would call them “thugs”.

And when they’re invisible target, it’s just the more annoying thing ever. Especially when they see you ….

@Proeliator : Maybe look at GW (the first), where there was a auto target for melee. Which means the character was following his target. And the warrior had a really better defense. So there was no need of a gap-closer. The warrior was thought so that he could survive the time to get in melee range.
Currently, if you have no gap closer, it’s really hard. And what advantages does the melee weapon got over the ranged ? A bit more damage.
I think it works for now, but you can just get erased of the map before you got in melee range, even with gap-closer. If, let’s say 2 ranged focus you, you won’t made it. Or you won’t have enough hp in close range to be efficient.
And in a teamfight, melee will probably be the first target.

I’m not sure though that it was what he meant.

@Ragnar : Once again, this has nothing to do with class balance. I don’t make claim or whatever about prio bugs. And please don’t overdo what I said. We have bugs, as every class. Surely not as much as some broken classes, but we do. And yet no fixes for now. That will come, because I doubt Anet suddenly decide that warrior was a bad idea and that they should left it as it is. In fact, they couldn’t even if they wanted. But the fact is, warriors would like to play with less bugs (as everyone).

@ Tomas : I’m not crying or whatever, if you’re just here to say : “stop whining, we’ll get a fix”, we already know that, and that’s not the point. If you had read what I said in the “20 posts”, you would have understand what I mean.

When using invul, you mean endure pain, dre ? Because it has been stated that his duration wasn’t 5 sec, but more near 2-3 sec. Bugged.