Guild Wars 2

Anet has pushed the MMO genre forward in a lot of ways, but unfortunately they have been following one of the most archaic strategies in communication.

They don’t want to tell us what they’re working on or the progress because then “we’d yell at them for delays or missed dates because or broken promises”.

Instead they are getting yelled at for perceived incompetence, lack of communication, lack of support, broken promises, and a lack of clear vision.

Perhaps if they shared with us they trials and their triumphs so that the community felt actually engaged in this fledgling PvP portion of the game, they wouldn’t be losing even their most staunch supporters.

Or are you embarrassed by the lack of ingenuity and progress you are making?

Evan Lesh.3295:

First, we need to solve the problem of people leaving before the game begins, its simply a flaw in our roster design. Then we need to determine a suitable punishment for people who leave during a match, and do not return.

On top of these, it sounds like some people are describing a bug forcing 4v5’s. We do not know what would be causing this or whether it is a new problem or not. It’s hard to tell when there are multiple ways a team could be missing members.

To clarify, bugs take higher priority over features like custom arenas. However a punishment system is a feature that takes considerable more time, and must be weighed against our current features plans. We always have the option to re-prioritize just like we did with matchmaking.

Just my two cents…
Now that matchmaking is active and all tournaments are free, I would imagine they are taking up a much larger percentage of your PvP traffic. If people are experiencing an 80% rate of uneven matches, which completely destroys the entire PvP match experience.

It must take the highest priority and all avenues to address it must take the highest priority.

I know its a kitten if-you-do, kitten it-you-don’t scenario when it comes to not releasing new features, versus correctly supporting the ones you have been able to squeak out (which let’s be honest, has been embarrassingly little, how can it take any real coding to have stood up 1-round tournaments from 3-round tournaments, but you didn’t even take the time to set the rewards correctly for the longest time)

If you can’t correctly support the limited features that are currently available with your resources, get together in a big Anet meeting and either allocate more resources, or hire more resources.

Advent.6193:

leman.7682:

Fuzion.7613:

Turn time warp into a signet
Signet of Time

• Passive Movement Speed (20%?) Would have with mesmers lack of mobility.
• Apply 4 seconds of Quickness to Yourself and Ally’s within 600 range
• 140 Second Cool Down

I like.

I also like. Helps PvE and PvP. ANet, kindly offer this person (Fuzion) a job. Thank you. Note, duration could probably use some modding.

I main a mesmer in PvPand hate QQ threads. That being said, TW is probably a bit too good in its present form. The tone of a match is set in the first major teamfight and winning it is a pretty big advantage especially as the mid-points typically give you very good visibility about the map which translates in being able to coordinate your rotations much better than the re-grouping opposition. Not having TW in that teamfight first major teamfight is a pretty large disadvantage.

I like the signet advantage, but for that long of a cooldown I would probably increase the quickness duration to 6s or decrease to cooldown to 100 or 120s. There are also some other flavorful, interesting possibilities for the passive signet: 5% chance on critical to remove the gcd (or reduce by 50%) of that ability, 5% chance on critical to apply quickness to your next ability, 5% chance on critical to finish the cooldown on your other signets (or cantrips), 50% chance to gain swiftness after using a cantrip, but I do like just the base 20% movement speed increase too.

Yea, I experienced something similar to this using the mesmer’s blink ability against a bullrush.

I was up on the stairs of the keep at Niflhil when I saw a warrior haste rush at me so I blinked max range down the slope toward the middle of the map right as I thought the warrior was about to get to me. What ensued was a ridiculous, physics-defying, path-finding animation as the warrior zoomed right up to me and still hit me. Fortunately I was still able to staff-2 just barely out of the way of 100-blades, but it stuck out to me that this must surely be a bug resulting from the increased warrior movement-tracking buff in an earlier patch (as someone said earlier).

I have witnessed something similar a couple more times, but it isn’t too often that it gets that ridiculous. Also, as someone said, if you wait for the bull rush to end and then use your evasion they won’t follow; however, if they are hasted, the animation+network lag could result in you taking a few K dmg from 100 blades before you make it out.

I think the newest map could work as an 8v8 tPvP map and was likely designed as the boiler plate for such an idea.

Soryuju.8164:

mouse.1689:

BlueprintLFE.2358:

Rangers downed pet heal is Astonishingly strong underwater… I killed a ranger underwater today on Capricorn (1v1) and we had mid, there were 2 sharks chomping on him and me DPSing him in his downed state, his downed damage ended up downing me, AND HE REZZED from his pet with 2 sharks and me damaging him. It was ridiculous, since you can’t stomp underwater. The ranger whispered me and was laughing “lol that just happened, that kitten is op.” I couldn’t believe it. We really need to be able to stomp someone underwater.

Second this. Had a similar experience on Capricorn a couple nights ago, except it was 3 players beating on a downed Ranger on the point for over 30 seconds. He was outhealing the damage, and would have rezzed had the game not ended.

Anecdotal evidence, to be sure, but it’s pretty ridiculous. Underwater stomps would be nice, but barring that, Ranger’s rez may need tweaks for water specifically.

I’m honestly amazed this hasn’t gotten more attention, but I guess it’s just because most people avoid underwater combat as much as possible. Rangers are far and away the strongest underwater class, more so than Thieves, simply because of their UW downed state. Whenever I take my Ranger out onto Capricorn and fight at the Ruins, I just consider whatever damage I can do to opponents before going down as bonus damage. Downed state is when the battle actually begins. Unless you get 3+ players and sharks focusing you, you’re pretty much guaranteed to win any fight once you go into downed state. Fun as that is, it needs to be addressed.

I can agree that I have certainly enjoyed the pet rezing underwater with my ranger.

Downed state is great and will be one of the best, differentiating feature of the game if they can ever get the e-sport PvP support off the ground.

Barely getting off a rally, or perfectly coordinating a team stability to support rezing will be major points of attraction in good matches.

I know I already said thise once in the topic and left a link, but it really can’t be emphasized enough…

GET THE LOGITECH G700.

Do not think about it.
Do not do any more investigation.
Just buy the mouse.

It was made for games that need about 10 bindings. It is has great build quality and very easy-to-use and functional customization software. It actually has a removable rechargeable AA battery (eneloop) and the charge lasts about two days. Also when you plug it in it charges and transmits data over the micro-usb cable.

I can give you my bindings as well if you like.

G700 + Sidewinder X4 is the best quality-price-performance options for GW2 and it really isn’t even close.

Again, before you think about it anymore…
JUST BUY THE G700.

After watching that Auron video, either it is a joke and he is actually really good or those people who say he is good are also bad, just worse than him.

Either way, good troll.

http://www.amazon.com/Logitech-Wireless-Gaming-Mouse-G700/dp/B003VAM32E/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1355356486&sr=8-1&keywords=g700%5C

Without a doubt. It is awesome for GW2 and MOBAs.

I bind all of my abilities except for weapon 1 and elite to the mouse.

It took me until rank 17 before I got my first sliver or crystal as well. I seriously thought I was bugged, but now I have teens of both.

Honestly, 8v8 is best for “grinding” glory which is what most people are likely interested in sPvP.

Originally I was all for 5v5 and wanted the heaviest focus put on those servers, but until we have a matchmaking system that can better garuntee full 5v5 servers, I find myself having more fun in 8v8s. (Or until the playerbase hopefully returns)

Yea, a cnd dmg heavy invis thief can certainly be very hard to deal with in a typical Shantasm loadout.

However, as with pretty much anything when you are a mesmer, you can alter your build a bit to mitigate their advantage during a match if they become a major problem.

D/D tank eles are a bit harder since the really good ones can plan for your boon mitigation abilities and then just pop them all back up, making for a near impossible 1-on-1

I’d consider it. What kind of time requirement are we talking here?

In a typical game, I don’t think they are unbeatable at all. Most mesmers, particularly the best builds (shantasm is what I play), will be set up to handle conditions very well. Caltrops thieves can be hard to deal with (especially before stealth was fixed), obviously certain necros, good trap rangers, cnd eng… they can all cause some issues.

However, if the mesmer is particularly good and sees you from a little ways off, he can switch up his abilities to cnd mitigation and then becomes more than an even match for all the above.

As people have said D/D eles can stand up pretty well 1v1 as well.

Funnily the most trouble I had with is a really good D/D pet necro. He did a good job dodging my shatters and all the pets/minions he had coming at me sustained dmg enough that my evasion wasn’t very effective.

Ace of Spades.6325:

AllieMurdock.1785:

As the ArenaNet point of contact for this stream, I’d like to comment on something that was mentioned earlier in this thread.

There were no pre-set questions for this stream. We did have a list of topics that we wanted to make sure to touch on, but this did not include pre-set questions. We did not specify any areas, other than PvE/WvW (for the obvious reason that this interview was geared towards sPvP), which should not be discussed.

This was not a scripted discussion by any means.

What we were hoping to do was answer questions during the live stream that were being asked in the own3D channel. However, due to connection issues, we were not able to do the live stream and therefore did not take questions from the chat.

Anyway, thank you all for taking the time to watch the video and give us feedback. It’s greatly appreciated!

-Allie

you are twisting the truth, people did not complain that there was a list of pre set questions. I called you out that there was a list of taboo questions, that you did not want to answer. And they were all the questions that people really wanted an answer for.

It is not freedom of speech if you obligate people to NOT ask certain questions. I am also pretty sure that you knew what i ment, and that you twisted my post not in good faith.

If it turns out that you misunderstood it, i will apologize, but it just look like a low blow for now.

Pls, do not try to twist what people say, it is not elegant or just.

You seem like an angry person. I’m glad you have this location to vent as opposed to the rest of the world.

I wouldn’t go outside either if I was you, I hear there are people out there that don’t think your opinion is worth their day being ruin… also, clearly everyone is also plotting against you in a sinister conspiracy that, luckily, you are brilliant enough to see right through.

Still, no reason to risk it, just stay at home and try your best to ruin Jonathan’s day… his job is disproportionately better than mine without your efforts =).

Cheers.

Ummmm, I agree? I don’t really play this game at all anymore (simply cause I couldn’t ever get friends together enough to get a competitive tPvP team going) but even at my peak, it was maybe 10 hours a week for me.

But that really wasn’t what this topic was about. I was just hoping for more incentive for those that are willing to spend 40+ hours a week in the game to not spend all of them in PvE/WvW. Give those people who are willing to grind, an incentive to do so in the competitive scene that translates to the other parts of the game.

Personally, PvP in GW2 didn’t feel like any sort of a grind to me. I felt like I got about as good as I was going to in pugs and sPvP with mesmer, guard, and ele (was going to do necro too) and was never too interested in grind to something that makes me look more shiny (although buying all the chests was an okay distraction).

While this topic has gotten unfortunately chippy, I could not disagree with the OP more… also, from my friends that played GW1 hardcore, Xom is more on point.

But still, this is a terrible topic that is begging for a lock.

See, I think the rating system they are implementing will actually mitigate that. As I understand it… if you are personally good, but are getting rolled by premades, well then your tPvP ranking won’t be good for a while.

The upshot of this, you will then either be playing against other pugs, or against bad premades that also can’t bet other premades. Again, this will encourage people to build community and start playing together more in order to get better.

The simple fact is, if you are part are not part of a premade but yet all of you are still really good individually, yea you might get beaten by some mediocre premades, but that is because you are actually worse than that premade team. This ranking system should give you that appropriate ranking to keep you from constantly getting stomped though =).

Downed state is one of the best, if not the best part of GW2 pvp. It increases the team coordination and skill required by a large amount.

Well, I guess the idea is that in PvP you are improving your skill… and hopefully teamwork as well while participating.

That is like saying whenever you play a shooter in a competitive environment you are grinding… Whenever you are in a competitive environment, getting better in the competition is the goal through the hours of playing, any other perks are gravy.

Zeke Minus.5720:

This was already posted here.

Yep, and by Xeph too. I figured it probably was, but I searched for 5 or so minutes and didn’t find it in a couple topic where it said it would be linked (like this)

Oh well, I don’ think the stream can be given too much attention =).

In talking to some of my hardcore GW2 playing friends (I’m a casualcore at best), we tried to identify what it would take for them and their large PvE guilds to get seriously into PvP.

The main factor that they find is missing has nothing really to do with the esport features like matchmaking and spectator mode (which personally I find the most important), but instead tangible incentives for their character that persist into the rest of the game (PvE, WvW). Additionally, we identified that since WvW actually accomplishes this to some degree as well as provides a more casualish PvP outlet for more primary-PvE players, the end result is that s/tPvP interest is more hurt by WvW than helped.

I understand that we don’t want any of the “grind” or progression to from come PvE into s/tPvP, even to the degree that it does in WvW; however, that doesn’t mean that things can’t flow the other way, does it?

Why not bring back the emotes used in GW1 to show-off rank? Why not bring back the world announcements for significant PvP accomplishments (such as the upcoming daily and monthly tournaments)? Why not allow skins from PvP to be used in the PvE environment?

Anet seems to be taking baby-steps in this direction by including daily and monthly PvP achievements and even making it possible to win gems in PvP (better than gold), but even these things aren’t being advertised enough (both major PvE guilds I talked to were not aware of the gem rewards 3 days after the patch hit).

Personally, I’d like to even go more extreme. Like have a new dungeon that requires a QP to enter and then immediately after the final boss fight, you actually have to fight another group that completed the dungeon in a mini PvP “map” with no respawns for the best possible dungeon reward.

Obviously there is a ton of things that could be done and, as always, time and resources are the issue…. It would just be nice if, at the same time that all these great esporty features landed, there were supporting incentives given to re-ignite and grow the community.

As most people have said, I think 1v1 arena is a terrible idea. That is not how I want the game to be balanced nor even how I would want to play the game, for me it is all about the team sport aspect of it.

That being said, a “/duel” to pass time and kitten around with friends would be a good deal of fun and would certainly make the mists more active, populated, and lively (I’m sure a good deal of PvErs would come in just to settle a friendly squabble).

I think the treb is a great microcosm of the game’s balance. Something that can appear very powerful can really be mitigated quite easily with good knowledge and teamwork .

This game seems to have two big skill jumps, one where things like treb and 100 blades go from unstoppable to minor inconveniences and then another where the game becomes less about bunker and burst and more about team support and roaming/rotating in sync.

Once they roll out the features need to nurture and develop the playerbase through those skill curves, they might have a winner on their hands =)

I don’t know how many people have gotten a chance to watch this, but it is definitely worth a listen. The real meat of the PvP design philosophy and future features occur at 21 and 31 minutes with concern about the “dwindling” player base addressed at 47.

Full stream: http://youtu.be/hByqoWsnz-I
Upcomming features: http://youtu.be/hByqoWsnz-I?t=21m20s
Upcomming patches: http://youtu.be/hByqoWsnz-I?t=30m43s
Playbase retention: http://youtu.be/hByqoWsnz-I?t=46m

Obviously all the credit for the stream goes to GW2Guru, and I can’t thank them enough for putting it on. I was about start discounting the possibility of returning to the game in the next few months, but now I find myself eagerly awaiting the progress Anet seems well on their way to accomplishing.

There is a lot more valuable stuff in the video besides the areas that I outlined (it was just what grabbed me the most), like good conversation on balance for pros vs. for newbies (matchmaking will do a great job mitigating a lot of this), the map-loading bug fix timeframe, downed state balance (ele zero-to-hero), etc.

I think this is the most information Anet has ever given out about their plans and they chose a really good venue for it (with the top teams represented). I think there should be a better effort made to unify the community and advertise/communicate that something like this is going on and how important it is for the community to be engaged in it.

Obviously most of the things mentioned in the video can’t happen fast enough for us players, but thanks again Johnathan for the great communication!

Yea, I’m pretty much gone at this point I think. I might check in once a week or so, maybe once a month to see if some new stuff is out there. It was fun while it lasted, but it seems Anet won’t give the PvP devs enough support to give us enough support.

Haha, oh my, I haven’t been lucky/unlucky enough to have this happen to me, but i agree that could be extremely annoying. I think for the most part (regarding dmg at least) rally/player-kill-credit is done correctly, but yea, this example might show a need for some “range” factor.

On the other side of that, what about a ranger (or other max range char) that downs an ele at 1200 – 1500 range and then the ele mist forms away another 1200 range or so, can you mitigate not getting the credit for that kill at ~2700 range?

Actually come to think of it, I do remember attacking the treb and having a random rez a couple of times, but there were always in team fights not on the 1v1s so it was a little less obviously annoying.

Yea, it is certainly frustrating. But I guess understanding is half the battle. The other side is by really making a personal effort as suggested in this topic.

Or just waiting…. actively or inactively.

Yea, sadly I’m constantly astounded by how “dead” PvP has become. I really only play during peak hours, but even then there can’t be more than 500 or so players active in t/sPvP. I can’t imagine how vacant it is during off hours.

I mean really, a game that has sold 2mil+ and you have around 500 concurrent active PvPers?

That’s less than .025% of the player base.

Think about that…

I agree with you statement in the context of the chaos of a 8v8 pub. However, if you are paying attention, a stealth’d thief that is just standing in one place defenseless is begging to get bursted down in under the time it takes them to stomp.

Stealth does nothing to mitigate dmg and the classes that can stealth the easiest also tend to be the most glass cannons. I have found myself almost baiting thieves to go for a stealth stomp/revive and then getting two kills for the price of one.

That being said, stealth + quickness makes it really difficult to punish or counter the stomp/rez, but then again, those are two very powerful abilities that just got blown on a stomp or rez. Also, I’ll agree that shadow refuging a guardian for a rez might be a bit too hard to deal with, but hey, gotta reward coordination like that, right?

Great post EatThisShoe! (Sorry I got your name wrong before)

Yea I agree, actually, I think the mesmer actually has some absorb/redirect of projectile skill, but I have never considered using it. I guess the challenge would be creating a block/retaliate (not the boon) skill that was good enough to apply to a variety of situations without being too powerful.

I think this is one of the few areas where the game’s limited skill selection (10 for most classes) actually fights against it. Other MMOs where you have 20+ skills can afford to have some more specific counters and abilities without having to worry about clashing with other, more broadly relevant skills.

Personally, the most competitive I have played a game was CS1.6, and also have played my fair share of TF2 (which ironically is a great example of a “stealth” class that seems OP in PUBs but isn’t much of a factor in competitive play).

I do think there is real value on what you touched on regarding the blocks and counters being re-worked to translate more to offensive abilities than simply prevent dmg. That way, a bunker’s only real way to “burst” would be to redirect several attacks successfully and maybe use one offensive ability in there. Also, for any class, accomplishing the true max burst for that class would include at least one successful block/counter chained together with offensive abilities.

By simply giving the more “defensive” classes access to more and better block/counter abilities, you could make them harder to kill without really making them “bunkers” dependent on toughness and regeneration while adding more twitch skill in both the defensive and offensive side of the game.

I also agree that stacking retaliation in intensity instead of duration makes sense, but then again I could rather my multi-hit counters to be an ability that is easier to see than a boon that I can just pop-off.

Anyway, its fun to think and talk about this stuff, and I think there are certainly some awesome things that could be done (after thorough testing), but again, there is a lot more things that I would prioritize above this.

I’m sorry, but this topic makes no sense at all.

What you are saying is “I don’t like the downed state, but these darned things that allow people to use skill in leveraging the mechanic better than I do, well, please remove them.”

Part of the strategy in team-based PvP in this game is choosing how and when to utilize your haste/invis/stability (arguably the three most powerful things in the game). Do you use them in the middle of team fights? Do you wait to use them exclusively for downed teammates? Each has their particular advantages and disadvantages, personally I have found a lot of enjoyment in executing great revives and stomping out another’s attempt at a great revive.

I wrote another topic talking about the “holy trinity” you referenced and the pros/cons if you are interested:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/pvp/pvp/Here-s-your-Holy-Trinity/first#post623913

I agree with his post somewhat. This is, after all, an MMORPG. It would be very difficult to implement an FPS’s level of twitch aiming skill in a game of this genre. As you said, this game already gets closer to that level of skill on the defensive side of the game than most games in this genre.

Additionally, I have heard several opinions voiced to contrary of “EatMyShoes” point of view. There are several people already off-put by the amount of the game that does require a more twitch-like level of skill as opposed to the more “typical” static, strategic level of PvP gameplay in the genre (something GW1 apparently did the best).

Finally, a couple of my friends that came over from WoW made a point to exclaim how they were initially challenged by the sheer amount of ground targeting precision required by several classes in this game.

While I agree that it would be great to somehow approach that twitch-level of skill offensively in an MMORPG, I think that GW2 already does a better job of it than any other game in the genre. Maybe in the future some additional considerations can be made to help this idea without having to overhaul the entire system, but again, as mouse said, what exactly could be done?

Its also worth noting that Anet is likely banking on people moving to PvP once they have exhausted their enjoyment with PvE. Additionally, we have seen the beginnings of an incentive-driven effort to drive people towards PvP in the form of the new daily and monthly PvP achievements. Maybe some of the PvE achievement MAXers will be enticed enough by that to come on over on occasion. However, in talking to one of my friends who was an extremely hardcore GW1 PvEer and PvPer and now is, of course, only a hardcore GW2 PvEer, we identified some other incentives that are missing and likely necessary to really draw people over to sPvP.

One of the reasons he is completely uninterested in s/tPvP was the complete lack of crossover between PvE and PvP. In GW2 nothing that you accomplish in sPvP translates to gear, bragging rights, or anything really in PvE, something that GW1 actually did quite well with loot, emotes, ranks, and world announcements.

I understand that we don’t want players to be able to bring PvE advantages into PvP, but why can’t we allow the rewards to flow the other way? Aside from re-creating a lot of the “bragging” perks from GW1 in GW2, also allow loot and gear perks to flow from sPvP into PvE/WvWvW.

Furthermore,I know a lot of what I’m describing is what Anet intended in their implementation of WvWvW. However, the fact remains, if you don’t create more incentive and interest in sPvP, it will continue to be the least supported and active portion of the game. Honestly, WvWvW satisfying the PvP desire for many players while having rewards that translate back to PvE probably exacerbates the lack of interest in s/tPvP.

Again, with the current state of economics in the game, I don’t blame Anet for the centered focus on PvE that they currently have…. but that doesn’t mean I wouldn’t like to see the focus and economics be given every opportunity in the world to better level-out.

I do have to admit, the most discouraged I have ever been about this game is when Mr. Sharp let “slip” that only 2 people were working on the PvP portion of this game.

While PvP is the main reason I am interested in this game, or really any game; I actually thoroughly enjoy PvE as well, although my 5 ~ level 25 chars probably don’t reflect that too well (just a time issue really). It has been staggering the level of support and additional content that has been deployed on the PvE side of the game.

The Halloween events, PvP maps/gametypes, skins, and on and on and on… It was far beyond anything I had ever expected. Now we have moved onto the Lost Shores and it is at least as impressive of a new content dump. This would be impressive for a subscription MMO let alone unprecedented in a sub-free MMO. I can only imagine what the expansions going to be like. (Also, how many resources are deployed in developing that right now? What percent of that is PvP features vs developing PvP feature pre next expansion?)

It takes me back to my first big “wow” moment with the game. It was the BWE 3 ending event, you know, the hunger games-esque PvP setup. At first I thought it was pretty lame and uninteresting, but by the end of it, I was completely mesmerized by the event and just amazed by the fact that they had created this whole PvP concept for the one-time only event.

It led me to believe that the devs at Anet are extremely talented, creative, and capable of turning out an evolving, interesting, and engaging product… I believe I have unequivocally witnessed that potential realized in the astounding PvE content and support that has been delivered; unfortunately that has not nearly been the case in PvP.

As several people across the topics have already mentioned, it is likely due to the simplest of numbers games, economics. PvE and WvW is simply where the players, interest, and money currently is. Honestly, the player base is likely a lot less demanding and aggravating to deal with and bugs or other issues can be hidden for a while longer and end up being a lot less “game-breaking”.

I have no doubt that Anet can deliver on the promise of an e-sport level of PvP if they only decided to. Hopefully once they feel they have a sufficient amount of self-perpetuating PvE “endgame” (see: Fractals of the Mist), they will decide to appropriate the amount of PvP support necessary to deliver on their promises.

Until then, at least we can count on the resources deployed giving appropriate measured responses and making progress when they can… I just hope our constant expectations and demands don’t wear them out before help arrives.

In a word, yes.

Especially for very competitive play. It would be nice to see some more variety in game types to get more people involved in the basics of PvP and providing a nice change-up for fun in seasoned players… however, there are many more things higher on the totem pole.

Wow, what a great topic. I really hope the devs read this; its just one of the most well informed and thought-out collection of responses I have seen on these forums.

I was going to write up my own thing, but after reading everyone’s response…. Yes, I agree with most of those things =P

I don’t think people yet realize how big of an effect these changes will have on mesmer.

Imagine if an enemy dodging, or blocking, or anything really can actually take away your weapon. I agree with line of sight and range mattering (and actually thought it was a bug that it didn’t), but actually landing the “attack” seems a bit ridiculous… It also doesn’t make sense; what am I “hitting” them with so that i can simply summon an illusion?

Yea, I could agree more. If there is really just two of you working on balance and esport feature, you are truly working your kitten off.

On the other side… that is an incredible lack of buy-in, and heck, even honesty on the part of Anet regarding the role of PvP in their game.

Yes! I thought I was losing my mind quite a few times that this happened. What a random bug to surface all of a sudden.

I will agree that I think it is extremely difficult for a warrior to take down a mesmer 1v1… extremely.

However, it is also very difficult for mesmers to deal with good necros, cnd thiefs, and bunker eles. Actually, a good dps ranger is a mesmer’s biggest bane in a teamfight (except mabye necro), although this really only happens in sPvP which, as we all know, is no indication of balance.

I say that because your comments seem to be geared towards sPvP, if mesmers are nerfed, I don’t think it will be due to their 1v1 ability, it will be their haste/team-portal and other support abilities while being able to 1v1 most classes.

I will agree that mesmers are disproportionally hard to play against at first, but most of that is just a flashy mind-game. Really good players that know what a Shantasm-build mesmer is doing don’t have a very hard time dealing with them at all. (IE kill swordsman, dodge/block/shade shatters, only blow burst on known target)

So I actually find myself on the learning-side-of-the-stick quite often against a skilled necro, eng, thief, guard… just not against people that consider 8v8 sPvP as the benchmark for skill and balance =).

PS – The main reason I ranked ranger and warrior so low is that they: 1, don’t fill a major support role on a team, and 2, can have their non-support role (burst, bunker, cnd, etc) filled even better by another class who can also fill a major support role.

Primo.4385:

Hi I’m new to GW2 and I’m looking forward to competitive PVP.

hot joins
gets zerged
learns nothing

OK I’ve been playing for awhile and I think I’m ready for tournaments

joins free tourney
has no idea what is going on, has never played 5v5, is basically useless
gets crushed by premades

Looks like I need a dedicated team to play this game competitively

tries to find a team
only like 4 people in mists and 2 are AFK

Welp, that wasn’t fun sorry guys

logs ofkittenuninstalls

Yep, sadly this is what I have had to deal with in trying to get a dedicated team together. I’m still holding on, but… well, Nov 15th will go a long way as to whether or not I’m playing after Christmas.

Main: Mesmer
Alt: Guard (really main also), Ranger, Ele

Tier 1: Mesmer, Ele
Tier 2: Guard, Thief
Tier 3: Engineer, Necro
Tier 4: Warrior, Ranger

Ele is just up there because bunker eles in good tPvP teams is just rediculous and probably the most OP thing in the game at the moment.

Mesmer’s ability to mitigate team conditions, 1v1 powerhouse, excellent mobility/survivability, and just silly-good ults make for a class that is too good at most things to not be on the OP-side of good.

I play a support-heavy shout Guard and think it is pretty balanced, esp after the save yourselves nerf. Their ability to change the state of a point fight with team stability and shield is very valuable. I think this class/role has some of the best potential for growth as a strat calling roamer.

Thief is an amazing jungler that is very hard to punish as well as a game-changer with stomp support defense. Even the poison share build has great value for a team, and is probably my favorite to play with. (Ever played against a invis/posion thief and a guard at the same time? Its rough).

I don’t know much about the next two on my list other than the fact that they have a large varieties of builds and usefulness. It seems in the hands of the best players, they can be both very powerful and very aggravating depending on the build. I’m going to build a necro to learn more and might buy another slot for an eng.

This is probably where I diverge from the player-base the most I guess, but I really don’t value Warriors very highly. They just all seem so… manageable. If I ever die to a warrior I felt like I did something stupid or just didn’t react well. That being said, they can provide a lot in team fights if played well. I also think their downed-3 ability is a bit underrated as to the effect it can have in close games.

Finally, what can I say, I really enjoy my crit-burst ranger and seem to do really well with it… in sPvP. Haven’t really given it a major go in tPvP, and it certainly seems that every thing the ranger can do can be done better by another class… But hey, we got a pet and I don’t feel under-powered while quickness critting away at a warrior =).

I was actually right in the middle of writing a post when it dawned on me that the biggest thing sPvP was lacking in the game was the ability to build community and keep people engaged. I briefly said as much, and here comes along a nearly perfect topic enumerating those concerns.

Bravo OP, bravo.

Numot.3965:

So making quickness the opposite of chill then? That would be interesting. Still would have the same “spam everything” impact for players though. I think it would be better if it was removed entirely and quickness abilities just got some other effect. Like just have frenzy be break stun, gain fury + adrenaline.

Well, considering that nothing would actually technically occur any faster, its not like it would increase of “spam”. Its even unlikely that the cooldown of an ability even cut in half would reduce it to the 4 seconds or so that quickness lasts.

I think it would have the effect of allowing damage to be more sustained instead of a high-peak burst. Which in turn would add a bit of strategy in both how to best make your damage peak (once or twice) and also how to deal with it as you would actually have an opportunity to respond.

I actually really really like the OP. Congratulations, a post with concise, well worded complaints/suggestions, I am impressed.

Especially interested in the suggestion to reduce weapon switching time… That really isn’t something I have thought about, but I’m pretty sure I would appreciate it being shorter.

Here’s an interesting suggestion, instead of having quickness reduce the GCD in half, instead cut the individual cooldowns of every ability cast during the effects of “quickness” in half.

Well I didn’t expect this to turn into a conversation about whether or not the downed state should be in PvP…

I would go so far as to say a majority of the team coordination and strategy in teamfight stems from the balance of using ability to get people down vs using the same abilities to ensure those people don’t get up.

I was trying to highlight that complexity by detailing how those three mechanics go a long way toward defining those strategies.

@Aloe – Yea, its pretty excellent… more than being extremely useful, it just gives you the feeling that “ kitten it feels good to be in control of this fight”.

Watching Paradigm mesmer portal into the guild lord and then time warp and kill him in like 2 seconds is pretty hilarious… then just port right back.

Knote.2904:

Oh also, since I can’t edit.

If the TTK raises a bit overall it would also be nice if downed state was a little weaker, maybe 20% or so less downed health just so it’s slightly easier to finish people off with just dmg as opposed to only with stomps.

Would have the side effect of making the “let em bleed out” strategy not as strong and obnoxious. And would also let casuals feel less irritated by downed state. Whenever I play hotjoin I almost never stomp anymore, it’s just tedious and if the person isn’t on a point I just let them rot or sit back and slowly pew pew them to death.

And I can’t imagine how frustrating it must be to be forced to sit there for like 20-30 seconds before dying.

I’ve thought about this and considered making a post in this regard. I hope this is something the devs are looking at. I wish the median life of a downed state was that of a glass cannon theif with some variance from there.

Aga.8641:

I’m fine with quickness, it really helps take down bunkers quickly, however I’m not fine with time warp, it’s far too strong. And without a shadow of doubt quickness should not effect stomping or ressing, it’s so broken that it does atm and I hope ANet does change this…

Yea, I would say “Stand Your Ground”, “Time Warp”, and “Shadow Refuge” are the best team abilities in the game. Time Warp is the most powerful out of them for sure, but again it has the largest cooldown by far.

Personally, my favorite ability is “Stand Your Ground”, the team retaliation and stability can be a subtle or not-so-subtle turn in the tides of a battle.