Guild Wars 2

a t s e is the best warrior.

I’m sure most groups will just drop the idea after they give him 25 frenzy stacks

CoF P3 is quite easy and fast, and then you hit the end boss. That end boss is the most frustrating encounter in the game. It’s not hard ,but he just constantly goes invulnerable over and over and over and over. It’s not fun. It’s just deliberately made slower for the sake of making it slower.

Though, I haven’t done the path in not only a long time, but with an optimized group. Maybe it’s not so annoying with a group with optimal DPS. hint Brazil

You exploited to get there, non-legit kill enjoy your ban pls go.

Def Pinoy.7029:

What a wall of excuses. Why not just accept that fact that there are scammers out there that are kicking party members at the last boss to either sell the spot or get a guildy/friend to get the xp/gold/mats.

I don’t believe he denied that. He simply said it’s not the case 100% of the time, which the BHB’s from reddit/casual-land would like everyone to believe.

If I’m going to kick someone, it’s going to be when they make me run out of patience. If they make me run out of patience at the end of a run, so be it. I’m generally pretty accepting of terrible players, as long as they don’t make something harder than it has to be.

Warrior, uncontested.

Best self-buffing potential, high solo DPS, high base defensive stats, amazing access to evades/blocks.

Your crit chance is really, really low.

Anyway, if you’re dead set on running a build like that; I’d just go with 15/15/0/20/20. That’s a really good hammer build setup, will work with mace as well.

Is there a good reason for wanting to avoid Berserker gear? Or is this just kind of one of those ‘special snowflake’ things

I love story time with atse.

This was an interesting conversation that sparked in a guild chat earlier, and I wanted to share it here, to get a wider range of opinions on the matter.

What do we, the dungeon community, consider a legitimate, or non-legitimate speed run/record?

Recently; there have been several speed ‘record’ videos posted by various guilds, most of them hosting a various range of either obvious, or debatable exploits. What is the general opinion of ANY exploit use in a speed run record?

My opinion, is that a legitimate speed run record is one that doesn’t intentionally bug/skip encounters (see: common garden decorations), and all of the main objectives within the dungeon path are completed.

Here are some of the recent speed ‘record’ videos:

5min AC Story
3:57 SE P1
5:57 SE P3
11:11 Arah P1
10min Arah P3

In each of these videos, there is at least 1 questionable tactic being used. Do you agree with that? Please, let’s try and have a proper discussion about this. Let’s decide what we, as a community think should determine a legitimate record run.

Do we condone all exploits, or do we prohibit all of them? How do we decide what is, and isn’t an exploit?

Discuss.

Would just like to add, if people are really trying to say that JQ are only doing well by exploiting, based on one incident. A lot of people from SBI witnessed a member from one of SoS’ largest guilds teleport hacking around, kind of like blink spamming (was an ele).

Does this mean, based on the logic that some of you are trying to use, that I can say SoS are only winning because of teleport hacks?

Don’t be so silly. JQ are just overpowering everyone currently, mostly during the night. SoS will have to work hard to slow them down.

SoS has Jedahs, the undisputed king of satire. You should definitely go to SoS.

Secretly I already have the records for every profession. I just have no proof and don’t plan on sharing any. My word is law.

Bright.9160:

Most people complained that they didn’t bring the reflects that are available to them in a fight that not just favors reflects, but almost requires them.

I think that’s a semi-reasonable complaint, too be honest. ANet’s design philosophy was/is that you can do all dungeon content with any group composition. Not saying I agree with how they wish to balance content around that philosophy, but if the fight is insanely difficult without the use of reflection/absorption skills, that’s probably a ‘balance issue’ with the encounter.

I havent touched that path in months, so i dont have first hand experience of the fight,

Player Character.9467:

We will also host kittentail parties.

If I wasn’t aware of the terrible filter this forum has, I’d think you’re pretty weird.

Sounds like EMP are a little bit butt flustered

Can do like… 26g/hour if we try hard, maybe more.

Use your brain and ask yourself: “What did ANet intend players to do with events?”

Complete them? or reset them over and over to ensure it doesnt complete while you take advantage of a sub-part of them?

haviz.1340:

skill clicking guardian

I wonder if it was… It couldn’t have been

huehuehue

hendo.1940:

They tell me ranger is strongest solo “class” in the game

This is actually something very simple to understand and explain (in context of open world).

No other class has a Bear.

p4 would possibly be a bit more difficult if all the bosses didn’t bug if you so much as sneeze on them :|

I think it would be in all of our best interests if we let this tournament go ahead as currently planned and not try to push any changes. People have to respect the amount of work involved in planning and running these, and try to understand that there are reasons that Nike and the other main organisers are doing what they are.

Zelyhn and others, I completely understand your criticism towards how this (and the previous) tournament has been organised, but I’d like to ask that you let it run ahead as planned. We can look at hosting a proper community-run tournament for the next one, given people are willing to cooperate. Give this one a chance, and maybe we’ll end up with better ideas again for the third tournament.

Not all tournaments have to be run to the same degree. Variation could make for more entertainment and I don’t see a reason why there can’t be a DnT-set and a community-set, same as when we split the restricted and unrestricted rulesets on gwscr.

spoj.9672:

J Eberle.9312:

People who are complaining about x are usually the people incapable of doing x.

Colesy incapable of FGSing confirmed.

I had this exact thought

He’s saying that you can’t ignore the strongest assets a class has. Eles strongest asset is their conjures, warriors is their banners and/or mobility. As in, “An ele without conjures is like a warrior without banners”.

I mean I guess you could argue that Eles still have a very strong asset in their might/fury stacking abilities, but w/e.

Actually nah, this argument is dumb. idc

anking.6245:

For PvE, a Zerk guard can deal good DPS and still bring utilities to the table like Reflection, such as for high level Fractals (of course, I don’t know many guards who full zerk in Fractals).

BUT! Is any of this particularly better than a zerk Warrior?

No. Warriors are ahead of use in every category except some niche moments in fractals and dungeons. To quote a recent post:

Redscope.6215:

Bunker
Warrior > Guardian (Healling sig, perma-regen, high HP, 100% condi immune)
Damage
Warrior > Guardian (Hundred blades, eviscerate, killshot, perma-fury)
CC
Warrior > Guardian (3 hammer stuns, 2 mace stuns, 1 shield stun, cc utils)
Condi
Warrior > Guardian (bleed, cripple, blind, burn, torment, weakness, immo)
Healing/Support
Warrior > Guardian (perma-regen, banner buffs, shouts heal, AoE group rez)

But don’t worry guys, you can still burst Courage and give everyone ONE block on a 90 second cooldown! That counts for something right? … Wait, blind condi does the same thing? … Crap, I guess you’re SOL.

But, frankly, I enjoy the guardian’s skill variety much more.

That quote is the most stupid thing I’ve ever read.

I’d find it more bearable if I didn’t feel like I was wearing white gear, considering the damage output. Surely it can’t just be the crappy breather(s)?

J Eberle.9312:

Obtena.7952:

The Mexican Cookie.3690:

Obtena.7952:

I was under the impression you were aware of these activities, having seen you participate in the Guardian forums in these discussions.

I could be grossly mistaken, but I’m under the impression that the only people who do this in current day are non-factor/tryhard players, not the bigger figures in the community, unlike in the past.

I could be wrong again, but I imagine the people arguing with you here in this thread aren’t the ones going to random build threads and bashing them for kicks and giggles.

I wasn’t suggesting they currently are doing that. I was indicating that the poster should have been aware of negative player interactions, even prior to LFG tool introduction.

Firstly, it goes both ways. There were lots of people before the lfg who were casual players who were just as abusive towards others as there were evil elitists roaming around taking scalps. And secondly you cant claim to know who cast the first stone because you weren’t there for each and every individual’s situation. And thirdly, you’re trying to say that the problems now are caused by what happened in the past which you can’t really prove.

He’s pointing out actions taken by the “elitist” (man I hate having to use that term) community that have led to negative relations between the two common parties. He’s also pointing out that it goes beyond ingame, and the forums have been a big factor as well, his example being when we used to all go and troll the life out of every non-meta build (I don’t think any of us have done that for many months, but it did happen). That’s an example of “elitists” not leaving PHIW players alone when they’re minding their own business.

Maybe I’m giving him benefit of the doubt but I don’t think he’s trying to argue that the ‘PHIW’ community is without blame, but rather he’s pointing out where ‘elitists’ have done wrong, as that’s the thread topic.

I completely agree with you, Spoj. As I said. I only pointed it out because there’s a pretty cute little double standard going on here.

As I said in my OP, I don’t care what people do to complete a speed run. Just don’t hack or skip any of the primary objectives. This is how I think most people feel after making this thread.

spoj.9672:

How much do you put in your sammiches? O_o

You have to fry the bacon, toast the bread, cut up tomato and lettuce, trim the crust. Takes at least 5, more if you include the element heating up

Bismuth.3165:

7- Zerker gear is the best in dungeons (not fractals),

If you’re going to compile a list, you could at least put more effort in to post accurate information.

Although the idea behind this is funny, those guys are spamming like that for farming groups, not a dungeon group.

Apparently leukemia is a touchy subject.

Because one was deemed acceptable by a respected theory-crafter, and the other was not. Most people are sheep, they’ll accept what they’re told and not give it any second thought. As it is, I think both are kind of lame.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Yea this threads done

#SummonModBot

You don’t really need party quickness, you should look at party quickness as a kind of bonus that you get for having a Mesmer, which is really good at providing projectile reflects/absorbs.

You’ve got the right idea, though. The general idea is that you should be maintaining as many vulnerability and might stacks as you can, for as much of an encounter as possible. For example, having 25 stacks of might at the start of a fight is good and all, but can you maintain that for more than 5 seconds? If the boss doesn’t die in 5 seconds, you’re kind of missing out during the rest of the fight, so if you don’t think you can maintain 25 for a long time, but could keep up say… 20 for a long time, you should go for that instead. Oh, and best not to forget fury :P

You should look at each dungeon and decide what you need. Do you need reflects? If so, take a Mesmer and/or Guardian, if not take a class which does a better job of providing DPS. Always try and keep a good supply of vulnerability and might/fury, these are the most important (de)buffs for your party to maintain, as they’ll have the most impact on your party.

Put simply, stack as much offense as you can within a team build. Think whether or not you need a guardian or a mesmer for the dungeon you’re about to do, or if you’d be better off with more Warriors or a different DPS class.

Chest drops are RNG, stats such as magic find will not help you get better loot from chests.

DusK.3849:

Anyone else notice that the same people saying that the only viable gear is zerker gear are often the exact same people complaining about specific content because it kills them too fast?

I find the people that say that, are the people who say content is too easy. Not too hard.

I can make generalizations as well.

I play how I want in every run I do

I’m quite cool

He’s clearly just the best arah thief, you nebs should buy lessons from him

evolverzilla.2359:

The Mexican Cookie.3690:

evolverzilla.2359:

They said that selling spots is not agains the rules, not kicking people for not paying…

You are really immature. End.

If someone is invited to the party, under the clear understanding that they are expected to pay for a service, the provider of said service can kick anyone who refuses to pay, because the people who refuse to pay are therefor griefing. It is griefing to knowingly join a party which has been clearly advertised is offering a PAID service, and then expect not to pay.

The same occurs when you accept those players in your party without receiving your money. They can enter the dungeon and be part of your party. If you accept someone in your party and kick them then YOU are griefing them. Dont´accept people in your party when they don´t meet the requirements.

They can even say that they send the money or was traying to send the money when they are kicked.

And ANET said that selling spots is not ILEGAL they don´t said NOTHING ABOUT kicking players.

SO shut off this argument and ASK ANET for a response about this.

It’s not griefing to kick someone who is intentionally griefing your party. Not paying for a service when you know that the party is providing one is griefing, period. The service providers can kick them for that, and it is allowed. ANet can’t stop me kicking someone from the party if they are deliberately wasting my time.

Your argument is nonsensical at best. You’re trying to imply that a provider of a service is griefing if they kick customers/clients who refuse to pay for the service. How does that even make sense? If I’m selling lemonade and someone sits in my store telling me I better give them lemonade for free or they’ll sue me, I’m going to get security to kick them out of my store. I’ve done nothing wrong, the people selling dungeon slots for money have done nothing wrong. The wrong comes from people asking for a SERVICE, and then expecting not to pay.

I can kick people from my party for whatever reason that I deem legitimate. If they haven’t been in the run for 99% of it, if before I even enter the dungeon they appear to be a total mong, if they try to force the party to do things that I don’t agree with, I will kick them, and I have every right to. If they haven’t contributed anything to the run, they are not being griefed. They have not been ‘robbed’ of anything, they did not work for the rewards they were trying to get.

Really mind blowing that you can even try defend people who knowingly join a party which has clearly stated they’re providing a PAID service, then expect to get the service for free and use blackmail to make sure they get it. Yes, it makes so much sense for people to be able to join a party which is selling dungeon runs and then say they’ll report the runners if they kick them for not paying. Pathetic.

Anicetus.1253:

TA isn’t night and SE has day parts.

TA is night, and I’m not even sure what that SE part means

EDIT: WOW ANDREW IM NOT BRAZIL

They’re called casual runs for a reason. They’re meant to have fun; you aren’t an elite guild just because you force your members to run record level team comps in your daily gold farm runs. That’s called being tryhards.

If anyone is looking for an Arah run, pm me ingame. Can and will do all paths

Obtena.7952:

I’m not speaking in absolutes here. Are there tolerant elitists? Yeah. Are there intolerant PHIW? Yeah.

I think what is missing here is recognizing that there are certain values that people hold that impact their actions. OK, that’s abstract:

If you value your time ingame, it’s fair to say you want to do things as fast as possible, so you likely adopted DPS only approach in PVE. You team with people but they don’t necessarily value their time as much as you do. It’s likely the guy who values his time is not happy.

The more that people value time, the more they are affected by other players. They are more likely to act on that intolerance than someone who’s values are NOT affected by other players. It’s not a hard concept to understand but it could be difficult to accept if you happen to value time or some other value that is affected by other players.

You’re right, I agree

So where does that take us? Where are we going now that you’ve established this?

haviz.1340:

The Mexican Cookie.3690:

Remember my ‘what makes a record legit?’ thread? If you’re happy to show a video of it, it’s fair game. So sure

And one very good point of that was something like “if anet doesn’t fix it in a month it’s valid”.

The flaw with that point is that you’re just putting in place an arbitrary ‘timer’, which doesn’t have any particular importance. The consensus was that exploits are fine, if you are happy to show them on video to people then you can do what you want (short of hacking). Essentially, its the stance that the majority of games take for speed runs.

btw; we also played in some other dungeons: http://youtu.be/DFSs5jVthTA

I typed up a wall of text, and then the forums decided that it didn’t want it.

Sure, Sandy. That works.

TL;DR of what I had typed (I had typed a lot): The reason I’m upset is because rT are a big reason why I ended up bending over and putting all that work into revamping gwscr. People weren’t happy with the state of it, so I listened to everything you had to say regarding records in guild wars 2, and I’ve been trying my best to deliver. When you submit something like this as the world record, using rules that conflict with what we all agreed on, it just makes me think that I did all of it for nothing. They aren’t my rules, they’re your guys rules. I’m simply helping you make them a bit more ‘fun’. If you don’t agree with a rule, or want to see one added/removed, let it be known.

inb4 boohoo Cookie wts kleenex coupon

Wukunlin.8461:

I change my stance all the time

Wow, stances are for noobs. Shouts or gtfo

sorrychief.2563:

Sounds like to me your ele build sucks. What kind of dungeon ele doesn’t keep a spare focus?

He literally explained what he was doing in the first line of his post.

And for the record, staff ele looks pretty cool. Watched a trial of it in CoE earlier.

Floryn.6307:

Skillful and gw2 don’t go too well together, but then again, we go back to Dunning-Kruger Effect. Not understanding that is the issue. -)

I can accept that zerker is one of the efficient ways to complete dungeons, what I can’t accept is that some random self entitled pros are telling the rest of the world that PVT is not viable and that is bad.

The fact that I can accept that I don’t hold the absolute truth makes me immune to DK effect.

On the other hand lets check the symptoms and see if you recognize yourself in them
(Dunning and Kruger proposed that, for a given skill, incompetent people will)

• tend to overestimate their own level of skill;
• fail to recognize genuine skill in others;
• fail to recognize the extremity of their inadequacy;
• recognize and acknowledge their own previous lack of skill, if they are exposed to training for that skill.

I imagine all of those apply to yourself.

We get it, you like PVT gear. Go keep that to yourself, because the rest of us realize that you have no idea what you’re talking about.

Have you met my good friend Mr. Damage formula?

>Stacking in melee is an exploit because bosses don’t use some of their skills
>Probably stacks range at Lupicus to avoid getting kicked and is punished less for not dodging grubs.

Rhyis.7058:

The Mexican Cookie.3690:

No one in T1 ever accused WM of botting, perhaps it’s just the lower server players lack of understanding of WvW that results in this conclusion.

Uh, Kain is historically the lower tiered server. Mag’s been near the top since the dawn of time.

WM weren’t always in kain, they started off in Storm bluff isle, a server which spent most of its time in T1. WM is the guild in topic, not kaineng as the server. Obviously WM wouldn’t have been a concern to lower tier server population if they weren’t in their tier….

i.e. WM used to only play against T1 guilds/players, those players never accused WM of botting. Now WM are playing against lower tier guilds/players, and they get accused of botting.