Guild Wars 2

To answer the original question: we, as a class, have been kicked into the dirt enough to where we’re kind of accustomed to it. I’ve referred to Mesmer Stockholm Syndrome over the years, with good reason.

The hard part is figuring what any case of wanting to nerf or adjust things is either:

• A valid complaint. For example, the current state of Confounding Suggestions can be argued to be a bit too good. With that in mind, it’s sensible for Mesmer players to offer some (workable) way to bring it in line. We let ANet go at it under their own … logic, CS won’t get tweaked, it’ll get frigging neutered.

• The aforementioned Mesmer Stockholm Syndrome. IMO, anyone who thinks MtD is fine after the nerf, makes me wonder what they’re up to. After all, said trait was originally 1 stack/clone, and was almost never used. We finally get some mileage at 2/per, and ANet craps on it again. Meh.

As always, your own mileage might vary. I claim no advanced psychological understanding, merely opinions created through observation.

I personally feel that CI is finally just as “strong” as it needs to be. I’ll admit that we have some traits that could use a bit of finetuning, but not this one.

Ah, Mesmer Stockholm Syndrome is in full effect, these days. Truth is, if anything, the wrong Mesmer abilities/traits have been … “adjusted,” lately. (Feel free to replace “adjusted” with “nerfed like mad.”)

Get out of my head. I was just about to say that they obviously read the nerf list …

Considering we never got the reworked Confusing Combatants, I’d fully support a raising of the stacks Mistrust applies.

MtD needs put back to 2 stacks/shatter, IMO.

I’d agree with a boost to Ineptitude, unless ANet’s planning to fine-tune the current state of Burning in the game.

Confounding (since it’s probably going to be nerfed) can get a per-target ICD, like Ineptitude. A global ICD would rended CS useless for multi-target usage.
(Ironically enough, since they now _can do per-target ICDs, it’d also be a good time to add one to the #6 on Perplexity … we’d finally be able to use ’em AoE again.)_

Healing Prism might need some more upward fine-tuning, since honestly -from what I can tell- its nerfing was a casualty of multi-ability synergy, and not the trait itself being OP.

Chaotic Dampening needs tweaked back upward, as many have said already. In its current state, why would I use it?

CuteLilKittenHugz.2064:

And we want it back as it worked before – we don’t want it back with anything less than its original 50% to bounce to additional targets.

Ironically, Cute: That 50% was a buff … the original Ricochet -IIRC- was 25%. Even more ironic that ANet’d buff Ricochet, then months later, crapcan it with an obviously bullskritt reasoning.

Honestly, I’d be all on board if not for the knee-jerk nerfs all over the place. Hell, with what two classes I mainline … it’s been a bit of a bumpy ride.

What ticks me off the most is that the nerf-a-thon started the same. frigging. DAY. as the patch. Seriously, why not wait a month or two, then see what parts of the tree need pruned.

It’s one thing to … trim a trait or ability (Power Block, for example), it’s another entire to chainsaw it down (Hello, MtD!), or just plain out remove the bleeding thing (Confusing Combatants and my Thief’s Ricochet would like to talk to you).

Hmmm. Then it would logically behoove them to fix the broken interaction, not nerf the trait/ability that is only part of the “Big Issue.” At least that makes sense to my own eyes.
Healing Prism … the new Temporal Curtain?

Obviously they don’t want heal-mers? In seriousness, I’ll again say that the obsession with ICDs that ANet’s side displays ruins the heck out of (potentially) fun things.
Not to mention, but was H. Prism healing for that much? I’ve not personally tested it, but Mesmers don’t typically heal like -say- Elementalists.

Needless to say, I’m all for more Robert. Hell, just let him run the balance squad.

Hand over my MH Pistol, folks. (Seriously … all these offhands, and still no new mainhand, after 3 years? That’s all sorts of kittened up, man.)

Mesmer’s still fun. However, I would’ve loved to actually see the Confusing Combatants change go live. Let alone MtD not getting nerfed the same frigging day the patch went live.

Xaylin.1860:

ASP.8093:

Also, we did get Lute Guy. Lute Guy is male.

Whua, please don’t mention it.

I feel slightly trolled by having the Minstrel being the representative for Glamours.

Well, it’s not like they’d give us a pic of Anise’s stylish self to rep Glamours. Even though she is pretty darn glamourous …

I might redo my own setup as Zerker/Carrion, or perhaps Celestial. Toss a set of Perplex Runes on. ANet wants to play the “P/P is only single-target, hurrr!” game, I’ll kittened well make some sorry mooks regret it.

Funny how bouncing bullets seems to be considered “Un-Thiefish,” but:

1. Bouncing arrows are OK?
2. Aren’t Thieves “tricky” fighters, anyway? Seems logical they’d be able to do trick-shots, eh?
3. Why is it, that the “interesting” or “fun” setups are the main ones to eat a nerf-batting?
4. And, mobility/speed as an excuse to limit Thief range options flew straight out the bleeding window the very moment speed signets/traits were equalised across the board. I could see being stuck with 900-1050 range back when Thief was both insanely mobile, and the fastest S.O.B. on two legs. But now? /shakes head

At this point, one begins to feel like a squishier Warrior, or something. Or is this just me?

Here’s what you do, Chaos.

1. Read “Equoid” by Charles Stross.
2. Mentally revisit the Unicorn imagery afterwards.
3. Enjoy your bad-kittenness
4. Wreck Mes-haters
5. Profit

Tringsh.2380:

FYI every thief/Staff forum thread has been deleted. This hasn’t been the trend for rifle threads. Your thoughts?

My thoughts? They’ve decided on Staff, and don’t want to “ruin the surprise?” Go figure, right when Thief players grow … accustomed to the idea of Rifle, right? :P

Between this and Ricochet getting the axe, there went my personal favorite setup.
(pours some freakin’ grain alcohol on the tombstone).

Sebrent.3625:

Forum bug … wish that had been “fixed” instead of MtD … we’ve at least had more time to “playtest” the forum bug :-p

Please. By now, ANet considers it a “feature,” and we all know it. o.O

You’re kidding me. MtD already got whacked? (Seriously, I was playing around with the new stuff till almost 7 PM EST … we were still good, then.)

I swear, this really smells like the Mesmer version of the Dhuumfire business.

1. Add Torment to Mesmers in general, and create MtD Trait.
2. Buff the Torment from MtD
3. Decide that overall Mesmer condi application is too much
4. Not only remove Confusing Combatants before it goes live, but also nerf MtD
5. Guaranteed, even if condi application across the board is dropped/modified, MtD will still be dropped down. And, we’ll still not get CC back in.

cyyrix.6105:

Petition for Anet to ban Karl and Jon from touching mesmer, leaving the decisions up to Robert Gee.

All of my Yes. Hell, keep ’em away from my Thief, too. >_<

Man. Thief could have at least kept the range boost. I’m irked … closest thing to proper Bullet Hell, and they nerf it down.

Fold it into Pistol Mastery, mayhap? Although, honestly, a complete P/P rework wouldn’t be a thing I’d complain about.

As a huge proponent of Mesmers getting more OOC speed:
I can work with the new SoI … hell, it’ll actually get back on my freakin utility bar for the first time in months. Not to mention, popping Air Runes instead of Traveler for a bit more damage potential.

Paranoia looks to be right up my alley. Especially since I never got rid of my Rabid or Dire EQ. (begins drooling)
Although, “meta” lockdown is some plain out nasty stuff I’d try with Assassin or Zerker gear.

We don’t discuss ICDs … especially with how often ANet’s guys like to use the bloody things. Hell, I still want the proper, no-ICD version of Triumphant Distortion that was originally mentioned …

As for the topic in general? I have to admit some of the overall possibilities might just get me to swap my condi offhand. I’ve stuck pretty hard to Focus for its AoE pull … but that new Pistol Trait’s looking hella nice.

Focus with Traveler (or Speed) Runes, if you can afford ‘em. Centaur’s a good overall option, but you’re nigh-guaranteed to be missing your heal right when you might just need it.

Condition/Interrupt (-/4/6/-/4, ot 4/4/6/-/-; Scepter/Focus/Staff)

Good Thieves and other Mesmers are usually the biggest problem for me. Mainly because they know how to combat (and create) good mindgame. I’ve also had issues with D/D Eles and some Guardians.

Truth is, I’ll still take anyone on; even a disadvantageous fight can be turned around, if I’m on point and/or the opponent screws the pooch.

Well. Let’s be [relatively] honest, here. Fact is, Confusion was previously a PvP/WvW situation. Nuking zerglings, blasting skill-spammers in the brainpan. Then we had the crapton of nerfs to its damage potential [and Mesmer application effiency>_<]. Not to mention original Perplexity runes, which pulled glamour-nuker level Confusion out for any class with good ’rupts.

With that said, I personally don’t dislike the idea of splitting the damage of the condition. As others have mentioned, this would make it [arguably] workable in PvE. I simply hope that the Devs also keep enough of the “punishment” aspect in, for player-on-player scenarios. This, plus added application via on-crit and on-rupt options … could be plenty effing fun.

yolo swaggins.2570:

DarkSyze must be a mesmer because “thief needs to be nerfed” is his mantra.

Nah. He probably thinks Mesmers are OP, too. Hell, guy probably considers folk like me the Antichrist … considering we like both professions.

EremiteAngel.9765:

Simonoly.4352:

Saves the Thief a bit of time (1 second to be exact) if he just wants to steal off you again without having to first consume the plasma already stolen. But this is dependent on a Thief saving his/her Consumer Plasma for….a rainy day? Never really happens as it’s such a powerful steal that you will want to use it immediately if just for the protection uptime and boon strip safety. Won’t be very noticeable therefore for the most part.

this 1 second unfortunately may decide the outcome of the fight
and this just makes it easier to play the thief which we shouldn’t encourage too much since they are OP when played by skilled players.

We can use the bolded argument for any profession in the game, honestly. Thief is a serious problem for Mesmers, sure … but a skilled Mesmer is probably the close second for classes called “OP” by their opponents.
Truth is, the QoL change on Steal is something Thieves should have had from word-freaking-go. Now, if we can just get a bleeding range indicator on Portals …

Heh. My “best” moment of Mesmering?
This’d probably be ~2 years back. I ran afoul of a gang of Sorrow’s Furnace guys while roaming in EB. Luckily for me, I was running a pure Stealth setup. So, I end up chain-sneaking around these dudes for a goodly while until they manage to gang-bust my behind while all my sneak-mojo was on c/d.
Sure, I ended up waypointing … but I can absolutely taste the pure salt they had to be generating.

I’ve always liked the more tactical mindset of DoT builds (in any RPG, really). Nothing beats watching some fool slow-melt in front of your face. Gonna love HoT-era condirupt, man. /drool

Here’s the rub, IMO:
(Certain of-) us are rather expecting (nigh-)perfection when all that’s changed in the large-scale is we got one newish Dev who is working to upgrade (at the very least) both Mesmer and Necro’s glaring gameplay issues.

• How much do you honestly think one guy can pull off, seriously? Fact is, this dude’s pulled more to better both classes in a short period of time, than has been seen done in literal years.
• Do I think more needs looked at? Hell, yes! (For instance, we absolutely need more -preferably baseline- mainhands.) But it’s kinda messed up to sit and act like Mesmers got massively shafted, here. Especially when we’ve only seen 3 Specializations.

I’d have to go with some form of “spirit.” Wraiths, Aatxes(sp?), or the like. Necro has enough “corporeal” minions to go around, IMO. Although, this is merely the opinion of a part-timer Necro. /shrug

I’d definitely go Chrono first. Although, since I main Mes and Thief, I’m biased.
As for the others?

• I’d run Reaper on my Necro … especially with ANet finally putting some work into Syphons and Shroud. Gimme that Vampire mojo, man
• I’m ambivalent in regards to DH (not a fan of the name … although, I can see some interesting condi options on my Guard. So-so about the new Virtues).

Glamour, IMO, has been deader than a Necro’s Flesh Golem ever since the WvW Confusion Debacle. Hell, at least they handed us some new ways to slap Confusion on fools.

From someone who doesn’t use his Necro “often”:

• Looks pretty cool, imagewise. And at least you didn’t get a name as bad as Guard’s specialization.
• I’m digging the Chill/Fear interaction. Especially with some grabs to reverse the “ping-pong” biz onto the enemy.
• I honestly hope the Defiance bar is a Necro/Reaper thing. It would at least fit the
  “horror flick monster” setup ANet mentions as an inspiration. (You’d never see the likes of Pyramid Head getting tossed all over the freaking field of combat).
• Congrats on GS. So far, it at least looks like it’ll be a decent Power/Cleave weapon.

Otherwise, I just wish ANet’d get a lil’ less afraid of cranking Lifesteal. Reaper with additional sustain from -literally- taking folks’ life outta ’em … that could be plenty fun.

I’d give Sw/D a shot, tbh. Especially if Sword has some CCs … it’d help share the Lightning Rod love.

That’s a good question. Usually, Sinister’d just get you splatted as fast as Zerker, but with less effective damage (the whole condi-stack dilemma). With the stack cap being altered, and some conditions being reworked to stack in intensity … I’d be willing to attempt a Sin PvE spec.

’Tis a beautiful thing, when a non-stealther learns why Thieves are so heavily invested in stealth options. (begins clapping)

Dire P/D
#+15CharrThieves

Eiland.1405:

tetrodoxin.2134:

Eiland.1405:

Sebrent.3625:

For a class that doesn’t have the weapon skill movement shenanigans of several other classes

DO YOU EVEN MESMER?

10sec (8 or 6 traited) staff#2 “phase retreat”
12sec (10sec traited) sword#2 “illusinary leap”
And not on weapons but: blink and portal

A good mesmer is already uncatchable w/o any movement buff. This trait is gonna OP.
L2P b4 posting?

Whats with all these warrior players flooding the Mesmer sub lately? :P

Trolling other professions out of boredom as warrior specialization is unknown yet

I think you should troll a more nerf-proof profession. Too many aspects of Mesmer have been nerfed to poop due to cross-profession shenanigans. -cough!- Glamour -cough!- … -ahem!- Power Block -ahem!-

StickerHappy.8052:

Juba.8406:

JonPeters.5630:

Was hoping saying it once was enough but I’ll say it again. This is a work in progress. Try to give feedback based on the utility and synergy of the trait instead of the numbers. Slow every 3rd critical hit could also be every 10th critical hit. It could be 8s of slow instead of two. Obviously these numbers are an attempt to be accurate otherwise we wouldn’t even give them but a lot of this stuff will go up and/or down before HoT is released.

Jon

This trait “Time Marches On” is Too OP.

Compared to Warrior he have to spec into 2 trait lines (Defense+Discipline) and pick 2 Major traits to get a similar effect, but Chronomancer spec in 1 line and get it as a Minor trait.

Do you remember we got an offhand? My..the.. crying never stops….

Not to mention, the other ways Warriors can get full-on Swiftness. You’re seriously going to go jelly-mode? It took more than two freaking YEARS for Mesmers to get a
“Speed-boost” Trait, while being shafted with a non-stacking Focus Swiftness and an RNG-screwed Signet.

Also. We have zero idea what fun/powerful stuff Warrior Specialization will get, now do we?

Something we might want to keep in mind, here:

• Slow on crit might seem pretty “OP” atm, but don’t forget that even “burst” specs are going to be down on Precision.

For instance, the decoupling of stats from trait-lines will remove up to ~300(?) points from Precision-heavy builds. I don’t claim to be one of this forum’s math gurus, but that’s going to effect how often you crit. In addition, you’re losing some points out of Ferocity, which’ll effect how hard you crit

Otherwise:

• I’m still in shock about the soon-to-exist “Fast” Mesmer. I honestly thought that would NEVER happen. My Rune choices thank you.
• The Well trait does need a bit of an upgrade. Especially when you consider (IIRC) the lack of anything effecting Well C/Ds. Also considering the traits All’s Well competes with.
• Additional ways to generate clones? Oh, heck yes. Between that, and built-in IP/IE, condilock is mad workable. Hell, I might just go (Dueling or-)Dom/Chaos/Chrono for massive fun.

caveman.5840:

DeceiverX.8361:

I’m absolutely fine with the trap if they give the thief the ability to cleanse conditions in better ways via more trait lines.

this ^ … revealed destroys our access to condi removal

Tell me about it. Acro … or even Critical Strikes, at this point. But some other method not linked to SA is desirable. Necessary, even.

nightblood: Thieves technically have clones. Ambush/Thieves’ Guild.
As for mechanics? I’m starting to think modified “Conjures.” Shadow weaponry, perhaps?

Teach us your Gallifreyan ways, O Time Lord.

I’ll borrow one from an earlier post of mine:
Avenger

I’m thinking Nightmare or Warden, personally. Fits the “look” of a Druid-type, and my Ranger’s a Sylvari as is.

I’d be satisfied with more fine-tuned control, and pets gaining some scaling with EQ.
Now, OTOH, additional pets or skins for pets? Nothing I’d complain about, whatsoever.