Guild Wars 2

I had a similar encounter with a warri yesterday…
One of those perma-escape builds, GS + sword/shield.
Everytime I got him low, he would just leap off to reset, hop around and engage again (with me being reseted as well ofc). After his 2nd disengage, I just switched from pistol /shield to rifle, baited him into using his leaps again, and immobilized him right in the middle of GS #5, threw a couple more nades and stomped him.

He then whispered me, that I’m a f’ing nub, and should try a 1v1 with him (which we just had), but I didn’t payed attention to my back, when the rest of his guildies jumped me right after he send this message, so I got rushed and killed in around 3sec^^

He then whispered me again (after I already respawned) with " You got rekt, nub"…

Anyways, the fix is quite simple:
Deactivate the block-function for enemy players in wvw, a-net.
If they can’t block you, they don’t get you on their block-lists, and therefore can’t whisper you, which means that all enemy-players are blocked automatically, unless they know your account-name in the first place, but you still can continue to report cheaters, a.s.o.

Yes, I know, there are civil encounters as well.
I actually met a very friendly thief recently.
Between klovan and golanta we kinda killed ourselves (both in downstate), and he manged it to finish me faster than I could finish him. I then used the block-function to whisper him with “lol, up for a rematch?” on which he answered “yes, ofc”. We met next to the krait in the swamp and had a couple of nice duels, so it definitively would be sad to loose this option, for the sake of these kinds of interactions…

Still, my suggestion stays, I rather see it gone and loose the option to whisper people from other servers, than to deal with these little rage-spamers anymore.

Welp, now it is profession-balance, a subforum that will be closed today.
I guess your post just got trash-canned by a mod xD

Yepp, it was meant as more in the first place, but soon turned into a puddle of little pricks that spill nothing but revenge nerfs, or biased opinions not only about other classes, but the players behind it as well.
The last time a sub-forum was that toxic, was when a-net decided to remove the wvw- MU subforum.

I welcome to see this cesspool begone, since doomsday will not fall onto the profession-sub-forums. Last time people did argument that MU trolls will flood WvW discussion, but thanks to aware moderation, that never really happened. The same aware moderation is in place for the profession-subforums, so get your fingers ready to hover over the report button if QQ trolls flood your professions’ sub-forum.
And you know: You can always simply ignore them.

@ Sol:
Nope, I don’t want to explain you every aspect of why the balance is fine as it is (even tho, I’m not a necro-player, but I’d really love to see some buffs for the class).
Today this sub-forum will vanish, so I don’t see a reason to feed a (1 week old – lol) troll.

So instead of giving everybody something new and fun to play, you want to nerf everything into the ground to fit your skill-level.

Thank god that this forum is about to get purged tomorrow.

Depends how ballsy you are.
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fdAQFAUlUUpkrtdxmKseNSeBN6rkkpAyAsARGwBC-T1BFABCcBAQS5Xa6AqZ/BAeAAFq+zVKBDAgAczbGAWuyVuyVuy5m3co3c5CtUA6pMC-w
Typical S/D.
Pull your target, prybar, rifle #4, rifle #2, s/d volley, run up to it while the volley goes and finish with rifle #3 and #5.
Should even overload and drop a tanky frontliner…
The problem is that you don’t have Elixir S, and are pretty squishy (still better off than thief), so you should leave the stomping to other party members.
Also you’ll encounter problems with actually going for warris, since they like to run melandru and dogged march, plus lemon poultry soup. To counter this, either adjust your rota without netshot, or consume some delicious koi-cake, to gain at least “some” results.
Nomad commanders will mostly survive the full blast, tho.
If you feel less balsy, change the armor from berserker to knight.

There are a couple of condi and hybrid focus builds out there (rifle + IP + FT toolbelt == perma-burn with high reapply-factor), but with all the cleanse going on you will only yield mediocre results.

Same goes for the common condi-nade spammer, that is awesome for overloading people initially, but gets countered too hard in zerg vs zerg situations…
On the other hand, for small groups, or 15v15 gvg’s, its awesome to have a condi-engi around.

edit:
the infusions on the armor should be wvw infusions, missclicked it.

Actually you simply could run Runes of the Guardian instead of balthazar in the 2kit meta…
You’d get a nice offensive / counter-method in case you need to block, but loose overall burning duration, which only is applied now by IP (5.2 sec every 10sec) and unknown amounts of burn every 16sec…
balthazar on the other hand offers 175 more condi-dmg, 45% longer burn duration and a nice 3.9sec burn proc every 10sec (in a 360 radius, I believe) + quickness for 5 below 20% health

so yea, for the condi-meta, balthazar is the way to go, but if you run a celestial rifle build, guardian actually could be a viable choice for a more tanky approach.
Burn will hit less hard and for shorter durations, but is applied on a (in my opinion) more vicious way. Pew pew rangers, or GS mesmers actually will hate it.

Analyze against thieves…
Simply too hilarious.

Tomorrow this Sub-Forum will be gone.
You now have the chance to leave your lasts words on it, which will be stored in the archives forever.

I go first:

Tlts.

I actually makes karma-trains less viable…

and scouts could form up to a guild and charge a price for their service…
just a thought^^

edit:
forgot to switch from rifle to p/p on the condi build.
You don’t really need pistol #4 since flameturret already provides perma-burning, but close up it does nice raw dmg (with sinister stats) and #5 is awesome control.
If you rather pack more heals, switch offhand pistol to shield and blast your waterfield with it.

edit 2:
why the kitten did this become a double-post -.-

what the guy above forgot to mention is that there are fractal instabilities where turrets become your best bet.

Anyways, I can see now that you really want to run a turret build in PvE, and not just try to troll, so I went ahead and slaped a condi and power build together for you.
Power:
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fdEQFAUlUUp2q1UxELseNSbBF6cUxeAqT85HEgjC-TxRBABXp8DPdAEt/AAXAg8eAAUq+jZKBJFwo6qA-e
you don’t need auto-tool installation since some bosses will one-hit your turrets anyways, so you rather run faster (makes your life a lot easier) and can optionally blow your turrets up for trashmob-cc.
On projectile-heavy encounters, you want to switch rifle-barreled t. to fortified t. and rocket t. to fire t. tada, suddenly your build can do something unique and awesome: high reflect uptime.

Condi:
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fdEQFAUlUUp2qVVxELseNCbBBqUI6OWlZ/5DEgkC-ThRGABAcBAUS5XuPAgEV/ht9HdAVpEkQALWDA-e
this time it involves heavy might-stacking (and your condi-dmg does scale the burn of the flame-turret, one of the few examples where your turrets actually depend on your stats), but rabid gear is kinda meh. I’d recommend to run sinister instead (not supported by the build-editor so far)

So yea, these two builds actually try to incorporate every little aspect to a big picture and should work fine, even tho they still extremely underperform, in comparison to the meta…
One example: the condi build sacrifices output for swiftness, so you will have a hard time to avoid mobs, unless you make the decission to cut your output a little more and take the 2 points from firearms into tools for speedy kits (and invigorating speed instead of protection injection).

Rifle…
for bleed…
wat?
blunderbus (rifle) is not even traited, so you have 4 stacks of bleed for 65%, and even if you could crit ALL the time with your rifle, you’d get maybe 1 or 2 permanent stacks of bleed from sharpshooter…

vulnerability:
you get up to 3-4 stacks IF you could crit 100% of the time…
again, wat?

buring:
already permanently applied by flame-turret WITHOUT napalm specialist NOR sigil of smoldering…
Why would you pick them?

then you have sigil of night, which does not increase your turret dmg-output, just your own, which is absolute bottom level without any gear or traits towards power.

then you have runes of the eagle, which give precission, literally the only pic that makes sense in that moment, since you profit exactly zero from the 5% dmg-increase, nor from the ferocity…

Sorry, I have no idea where to start to fix this, and can only assume that you try to troll us…

Seriously, I’m a friend of experimental builds, and in some occasions, turrets become hilarious and entertaining in PvE, but I don’t understand the reasoning behind more than 80% of this build, and feel completely lost when trying to imagine what you expect from it other than downstate…

vincecontix.1264:

Guys stop posting in the pointless thread the op just wants to keep it going.

yea…
9th december… can’t wait for it.

I don’t speak about noobs on builds they can’t control, I speak about people who are experienced in their class.
actual pew pew rangers run hybrid with traps (since they are not dumb enough to trade off everything for a single burst), and run either greatsword, sword/dagger or sword/torch for melee, which kills you extremely fast, hambows are not mindless and will save their cc’s for the most tremendous moments, while controlling you with blind, and simply eathing the poor condi-aaplience you have with their naturally big healthpool long enough for their team to jump you. medi-guards will not jump you in 1v1’s initially (since they are very aware oft their poor cleanse), but focus you down in 2v1 or 2v2’s. As soon as they see that you don’t really apply any condis (you still run FT instead of nades or bombs), they clear you out on their own for the rest of the match.

You make this way to easy for yourself by assuming that everybody is as inexperienced as people in hotjoin. Which shows even more problems with your personal opinion on the class since you’ve never seen its performance in the hands of a skilled player, surrounded by skilled players.
But ofc, in hotjoin a skilled engi wrecks havoc on various builds, if he knows what he does. same goes for any other experienced player on any other class.

Yes, we do, and what you just described is the following build:
Toolkit / Flamethrower / Pistol + shield / supplycrate.

You have room for one more utility, so lets see what options you have:
Since you run p/s, you’re forced to run condi or hybrid.
If you run condi, your only 2 options are going into nades or bombs.
But doing so leaves you without any stunbreaker, so you are subject to stunlocks and insta-downstate.
If you pack any other stunbreaker then elixir gun, people will simply kite and kill you since your effective range is somewhere between 450 to 600, which also does subpar dmg, since you can’t stack bleed or poison effectively.
If you pack elixir gun, you can hope to AA people to death at best, which fails as soon as you meet someoe with condi-clears (like every other meta-build from any other class has) and/or stability (which also most of meta-builds for other classes pack).
So you end up with a condi-bunker than canÄt apply condis, and a cc-spammer that can’t rip stability.
Your crits still only burn every 10 sec, and your FT toolbelt has a 60sec recharge.

I mean, run it, see for yourself how insignificant burn appliance is, if you have nothing but that.

As I told the other guy in the other thread:
If you’re foolish enough to max out one aspect of a class (cc-spam in this case), then you will run your nose bloody on any generic build. Pew pew rangers f.e., that just push you off range and go into 20 sec of stability while pew’ pew’ing you to death.
And in case you didn’t notice: a condimancer eats you alive, corrupting your mightstacs to weakness and throwing most of your condis back on you, while also pressuring you with his own.
A terrormancer fears you to death.
A hambow cc’s you to death.
A meditation guard blinks to – and drops you you.
other engis will condi-overload you, and the cc’s you have will not support your own pressure on them (which is not there), but only buy you time from the inevitable downstate.

the only classes you could effectively control with this is thief, IF you see them coming, which will mostly not be the case.

Nope, because yours’ is off reality, bases on 15h playtime, and states simply untrue claims.Therefore it will spawn nothing but unproductive arguments, wasting your and everyones’ else time.

#1:
Engi loves wvw, since bombkit can become extremely effective in zergs, toolkit solves any range-issue, and most of our abilities are suited for multi-target combat anyways. In case of s/d, we actually want at least 2 enemies for max efficiency.
#2:
There is a reason why engi is commonly known as one of the most-suited classes for wvw roaming: fast, access to stealth, many escape options, high dmg output on both condis and power

Shrapnel, stop posting.

You still have no idea about the class, make ridiculous claims about it, and argument completely aside your own point.
You already got called out for this in the other thread, so you openend this one, just so the same people must/can/will call you out again.
Do yourself a favor: leave this topic alone for at least 3 months, dive deep into engi, and read in the engi sub-forum or metabattle.com what good builds are and how to play them.
If you got insight in these builds, for at least 100 matches in ranked team-Q, then you will be ready for this discussion, and I highly doubt you’d still support your own point (“ENGI OP – NERF NERF NERF” as seen in the last thread -.-).

Healix.5819:

Abusing the contribution system has been going on since launch. Simply hit the boss once and AFK – no point in participating since you’ll get the full rewards regardless. If they made your contribution actually matter, people not running DPS specs would complain and class balancing would become an even bigger issue. If they implemented contribution scoreboards, people would be called out after failed events.

And here comes the solution:
implement a passive system that keeps track of your actions.
Last dmg you’ve applied is more than 30sec ago? you failed the event personally.
You were operating (not afking) a turret at tequatl?
You get the event.

Don’t let the contribution scale on the dmg you dealt, but on the actions per minute.
If they drop below – lets say – 10 seconds (one attack every 6 seconds… c’mon even a scrub manages that), you get notified that you did not contributed enough for the event, which means that you get bronze event reward, but no chest (in case of a worldboss / farmfest event).

No more AFK’ers or speed-tagger.

You know that a system sucks, if a random, over-tired guy can barf out a better one in 10 min…

Ezeriel.9574:

Why would they get rid of this forum?

Because its a steaming pile of player-frustrations, spawned from repeatedly experienced downstates in WvW and PvP.
The majority of threads here is not about “balance”, but revenge-nerfs.
Therefore it gets closed on December the 9th.

GreyWraith.8394:

If you want to discuss balance issues that touch on multiple classes where will you post it?

In the CDI subforum, where it belongs to.
And if your suggestions consists of more than the usual “nerf this, because I die to it too often”, you have a better chance that it will be picked up there.
Bonus points for regular cleanse and removal of QQ-threads.

Fare well “Profession Balance”, we’ll not miss you.

HA!
And I just typed a rant about how QQ for nerfs gets listened to too often.
Silly me, finally we get rid of this cesspool.
Ty a-net, I highly welcome this change (and the option to report/remove QQ-trolls on the engi sub-forum.)

unlucky.9285:

if it is as meaningless as you make it out to be then you will not mind it being removed right? all the other things you have mentioned can be dodged or blocked ip will get you no matter what you do and it will do so over and over and over and over no matter what kit or weapon you are using.

wrong.
IP only procs every 10 sec, so clear it and live happily without it for the next 10sec.
Additionally, it will only proc on crits.
How to make crits impossible?
weakness, blind, block, aegis, dodge.
Additionally, a disabled player can’t crit, so kick / stun / knock us around, since we have no stability, unless we transmute fear (on meta-builds that is)
If you build packs none of those, you’re not suited for PvP anyways.

Why has it to stay?
Because we refuse to get the engi nerfed again, just because a minority can’t cope with the meta.

So here is what you did:
You were running a non-meta build, suited for high bursts so you can “one-shot” people, or so much survivability that you were literally camping alone on a node. But in order to get your precious high numbers / extreme sustain, you left out a huge chunk of all defensive/offensive mechanics your class offers.
Then you met a humble engi or ele who exploited exactly this short-sighted build, by eating up its burst / baiting its defense, and overloading it with condis / cc’s right after.
Because you got sled repeatedly by this player, and others with a brain, you had to come here and open a QQ thread.

So far you have presented no numbers or facts that would support your point while disregarding every other argument.

You don’t even QQ for nerfs anymore, you simply cry in vain.
And the only reason why people are still talking to you (and others), is because a-net tends to listen to whining.
I have no idea which class you play, and honestly, I don’t care. But one day, some kid will be sled by you, come to this forum and whine loud enough to ruin the game for everybody else.
And still this kid will continue to be sled after he pushed trough his nerf, since he wasted his time on whining, instead of actually playing gw2 and improving his skills in the current environment
This is what this thread currently does.
GG

Just a short reminder:
you can run the meta as well.
Don’t like it?
Goto hotjoin or unranked team-Q and enjoy slaying people there, since most of them will also not run the meta.
There is absolutely no shame in doing so.

Want to improve on your class and personal skills, while also getting ESL-ready?
Run the meta, get a couple of guildies who love it as well and rock ranked team-Q.
Git gud, or get out.

Ayrilana.1396:

In the personal story, how long was it until they actually engaged Zhaitan and the risen directly?

all races: 3rd chapter, right before choosing between the 3 factions.
this would be lvl 30 currently.

unlucky.9285:

Vajra.3914:

There is a reason why IP is not getting nerfed ever again:

- That was a trait supposed to make up for the big nerf on #1 pistol.

Plain and simple, if they nerf IP, they need to buff pistol #1, which eventualy would lead to more complain about A-pistol.

then make it only work while wielding a pistol…… it will still make up for the pistol nerf when you are using a pistol but it wont work with kits or rifle fair is fair

#1:
Yes, Pistol got nerfed pre launch so it will only apply bleed on directly hit targets, not on everybody within the impact-aoe-range.

#2:
IP got nerfed twice to be correct:
nerf 1:
Increased burning duration from 2 seconds to 4 seconds.
Increased internal cooldown from 3 seconds to 10 seconds.
Increased activation chance from 33% to 100%.
nerf 2:
moved from adept to master

#3: Pistol AA and IP were never directly related and all listed nerfs happened unrelated to each other.

No IP, was never meant to make up for Pistol AA’s nerf, else it would’ve been buffed, not nerfed.
No, IP is not overpowered, as already explained a few posts above.
Yes, engineer is meant to be a luck and rng-based class, so we naturally rely that heavily on crit-procs (even tho a good chunk of elixir-related rng got taken out recently).
This is what makes the class unique:
Hard to be predicted, both for the player and his opponents.

And you don’t die to IP usually, you die to the cc-lock, the bursts (Blunderbus /jumpshot / prybar / acid bomb / grenade-barage / a.s.o.), and last, but not least: the crate.
The only reason why you curse about IP so often is because it’s usually the last condition (along with poison) that will stick on you if you disengage from a engi and try to reset, in dire need of a finished cd on your condi-clear.
Ofc you will not notice the 12 stacks of confusion a engi just has put on you since you already spammed yourself into downstate, or the ~15 stacks of bleed that ticked nicely in the background while you were busy to jump around a nadestorm, hoping to dodge the chill-ones…

IP is just one of our many awesome mechanics, but not by far anything that solely carries the engi in PvP.

Want to nerf something meaningful?
The ability of scrubs to whisper and abuse those who simply outplayed them.
I’m done with this thread.

Plot?
Is this a TV series?
This is a frekkin MMOrpg, and its only purpose is to play together with / against other people.
And from what I see, there was no mmo-related development in the past few months.
I don’t speak about balancing little things here and there, I speak about developing and implementing content that can be played together with people.
So, what have we:
Eotm, almost a year ago since implementation, and its just a queue-overflow map with no impact on wvw whatsoever
Courtyard: 3/4 year ago and its just available for private arenas, with no impact on team or solo queue whatsoever
and thats it.

Have we got actual content (new maps / objectives) for WvW?
nope
Have we got actual content (new maps / gamemodes) for PvP?
nope
Have we got new skills or traits?
Yes, on march 20 (3/4 year ago, again) all classes got 5 new, mostly useless grandmaster-traits. And almost exactly 1 year ago, we got 1 new healing skill for each class, whom most are useless again.
Did the bug-lists for classes got shorter?
Kinda. Some bugs got fixed, a good load of new ones got introduced.

So here we are, 7 chapters deep into the current living world, with 2 new farmfests, 3 hours worth of dialogues, and a couple of new skins.
#Slowclap

You know, some studios actually go into a long break, then silently start to work on the next expansion, push the release-date a bit further to have time for polish and then amaze their player-base.
Read it from my lips, a-net:
You don’t have to be special snowflakes, just follow the path to success, laid down clearly by all the good MMO-predecessors out there, including GW1.

lordkrall.7241:

But do we really want a story that just goes from one issues to solution and the repeats for the next thing?

If you ask me personally, yes.
If I get a LS “episode” I expect to play a compelling mini-story, that starts at a given issue, struggles to solve it throughout it and accomplishes it eventually in a epic (or at least satisfying), compelling manner that also pushes the main-plot further.
July 15 release was a prime-example for a good story.
We start out with Mordremoths’ veins spreading so we have to head out and protect a few spots, have problems with dealing with Mordrem throughout it, and get presented a seemingly solution by taimy that actually leads to a vision that pushes the main-plot.

You know how I’d would have told the story?
(Disclaimer, this is just about my personal refrences, and I expect no-one to like it. I just give this out as a example for a alternative, satisfying concept)
Mission one:
We report to the pale tree, but instead if been given magical seeds, we get a message from a pact-soldier to meet with trahearne.
Mission two:
trahearne tells us about strange reports from the front where a horde of mordrem seems to pile up and prepare for a big ambush on camp resolve from the northern ruins.
We head out to scout them, only to find out that the mordrem are already on the move, but attack the hidden skritt-village instead.
We support the skritt on their defense-efforts against the mordrem and after their horde is sled, we find out in a chatter with their local leader that these “plant thingies” try to break into skritt-tunnels ever since a mysterious plant-woman passed them.
Mission three:
We report back to trahearne what happened and that the skritt will need the help of the pact to defend them in the future, in return for scouting services via their tunnels.
trahearne agrees and we head out, together with taimy, this charr-engineer and a bunch of pact-pioneers to fortify the skritt-village that is already under attack again.
Mission four:
After establishing enough defense to cover our journey, we follow the lead to caithe through the skritt-tunnels only to find her encircled by mordrem (that must have found a alternative way to this spot) and on the run.
Caithe manages it to reach the ruins and closes them behind her, while we deal with the left-over mordrem and maybe even a compelling boss-battle.
After the fight, mayory recognizes the symbols from her previous studies, opens the ruins for us, and we get presented all the unimprtant back-lore in a dialogue or cutscene from caithe.
We had a interesting chase, filled with humourus one-liners from taimy and her furry friend, some hilarious skritt-one-liners, and a whole bunch of sled mordrem, leading to a plot-pushing solution
The end, for now.

Nope, it does not increase your viewing figures.
Nope, it does not add a reason for new players to buy these episodes.
Nope, no one enjoys being cut off in the middle of a chapter.

This is a game, that tries to tell a story in chapters, so stop resolving your last cliff-hanger, only to open up a new one.
It serves no other purpose than to annoy your user base.
And in this patch you’ve not even solved your previous cliff-hanger, have not developed your story further since the last patch, and just added another cliff-hanger on top of the already existing one.

This is plain and simple bad story-telling.
I don’t question this stories’ content.
I question its method of presentation.

Thumps up on the new jumping puzzle tho, it was truly epic.
I wish you’d have put equal effort into pushing the story to another climax.

Idc If someone in some post on some thread said that we’re arrogant.
And I don’t see the use of distributing this info here…

All I see is my hobosack.
Which is why this thread exists.
Which is why I bump it.

Welp, you have 50% vigor-uptime and a 3sec block on 16sec cd…
All the defense you’ll ever need.

Not playing in NA.
If he has a EU shill account, he’s free to whisper and meet me in pvp on any build. I have a arena, ready to record this troll^^
Or is he shaking in fear to duell something else than his shill accounts? xD

Some holes you can’t plug that easily, if ever.
Against 3rd party software, a anti-cheat programm would help, but that requires all users to install one (works on your end).
the second option would be to execute a file-validation every time you start gw2 (imagine you get a disconnect in pvp and are required to wait the next 5min additionally)
and the last would be to give less data to the user and store more server-sided, which heavily increases the workload on servers, which would lead to even more severe lags…

So appart from improving the report-function (which is currently being worked on), and giving more feedback to players about what happens to hackers / their reports (again, something that currently is being worked on) Nothing can be done that would not either impact your gw2 experience or the server-performance.

All you can demand for is that the devs work faster, but I guess that shout comes from every direction where there is an issue with the game…
So sit down, use the botting report-function and wait for the report UI to be improved. They actually were fairly quick with fixing the gems-exchange in the TP after the last makeover, so one can still hope…

Sorry creld, but the sigils and runes are very much balanced.
Yes, Balthazar grants +45% burning duration, but looking into most other damaging conditions, all of them have their representatives with the same bonus amount
burning – balthazar – 45%
poison – orr – 30%
bleeding – krait – 45%
all 3 of them have a 10 – 30 sec proc of their respective condition as well, and while balthazar has the shortest proc on its t6 effect, it also has the least useful one on its t3 effect.
If we look into runes of strength its the same.
They may have the highest amount of boon duration for a single boon, but they don’t have any offensive or defensive proc.

In terms of general gameplay it is not an issue for a thief to steal the might, a nexro to corrupt it, or mesmer / guardian / engineer to strip it.

About ICP:
it was already nerfed once by making it not so easily accessible anymore. (got moved from adept to master). Its base-duration is only 4 seconds, but since it got moved up, you have to spend at least 4 into explosives, which is also our condi-duration line, so it’s on a natural 4.8sec base duration. So that are still only 4 procs burning at its base.
going below that would render the trait useless.
And we already have a burning proc on our toolbelt, which grants the next 3 hits to apply 3 seconds burning (9s in total) on a 60sec cd, if we pack flamethrower, which would cancel out either sloting a stunbreaker, toolkit or nades/bombs instead.
the last option would be to go p/p which would cost us a huge load of defensive options.
Yes, with runes of balthazar engi can maintain perma-burning just from its proc and ICP, but on the same time these are the only sources of burning meta-builds usually pack, so one cleanse renders 10 procs in a row useless.

Conditions are part of the game, so if you choose to run builds that do not cleanse them, than you’ve naturally chosen the weaker build, which was your own decision in the first place.

I personally have seen all kinds of meta-builds and I’ve never had a real issue with them.
Yes they are effective, since they try to get the most rewarding effects out of a class’ mechanics and synergy. This is why these builds are called meta.
To counter that, come up with a more effective build or copy them from metabattle.com
Everyone can view them, everyone can run them. And if you find them dull or not fun to play, you have 2 options:
- learn to like them (the game is not crafted around your personal preferences)
- come up with your own, maybe more effective builds.
All meta-builds were just a dumb idea from a random guy in the beginning, which turned out to have some awesome synergy with the class. If you find similar builds on your own, congratz.
if not: stop complaining.

And about “but you don’t see classes a,b,c in pro teams”. That one is a matter of team-compilation, therefore the decision of the team to run the classes that support each other the most.
And if I look into ESL streams, I can not see engis or eles dominating the field since they get dropped often enough by other classes as well.
So even looking on the top of the skill-ceiling does not reveal anything that one could call OP. else top-teams would consist of NOTHING BUT engis and eles. You see them around often, but certainly not dominating the game.

I just had a radical thought:
What if…
listen!
What if no class is OP per default?
What if there are really skilled players out there that dominate you from time to time if they figure out how you tick?
What if the builds they’re using are available for everybody to look into and spec against?
What if there is nothing magical about winning a match but to hold to your team and don’t engage in uneven situations in favor of your opponents?
What if all that needs to be fixed are the classes’ long bug-lists?
What if the balancing is actually totally fine?

to make that work you need 75 supplies, 3 people with masteries and coordination on TS.
And you still can fail if the guy on the treb has splash-dmg, and a brain, so that he fires next to the bubbles, not onto them.
You know, splash-range > bubble range.

example bay:
don’t let them in with catas from south in the first place.
pre-build AC’s that are hidden from LOS to the ballista spot from vale-camp and you can effectively defend against catas in that corner.
IF your server happen to be lazy on the scouting side and they already made it through outer with catas, use the treb on inner supply-depot to fire ON the wall next to the catas, not on the catas itself.

It is really just a l2p issue.

Wolfar.6508:

Arantheal.7396:

Awesome montage, and I was actually baffled that the people getting slaughtered were from RoS, my home-server.
I guess I should join wvw more often again, since It’s really a shame that I missed the opportunity to meet and duel you.
I’ve also a set of ascended cele gear sitting in my bank, and I think it’s time that it comes to a use.

Btw, I’d like to know on which server (Aurora or FR) you’re actually playing, so I can look out for the next chance to meet and fight with/against you

Thank you!

I am playing on Aurora Glade and you still got one more day, haha. The reset is tomorrow night soooo!

I’d like to. tonight is kinda bad since I don’t have time to log into gw, but if you’re on tomorrow before reset, whisper me.
Already did send you a letter ingame

Awesome montage, and I was actually baffled that the people getting slaughtered were from RoS, my home-server.
I guess I should join wvw more often again, since It’s really a shame that I missed the opportunity to meet and duel you.
I’ve also a set of ascended cele gear sitting in my bank, and I think it’s time that it comes to a use.

Btw, I’d like to know on which server (Aurora or FR) you’re actually playing, so I can look out for the next chance to meet and fight with/against you

clock since the last red post is set to 13 days…
oh well, here we go.
bump.

Benjamin.8237:

Personally I’d have the ICD lowered to 10 seconds to match a standard weapon swap cooldown, and make the ICD unique to each kit. That way we actually proc more often and reliably. But yeah I’m all up for this, used to make elixir gun builds even more fun.

30% uptime for magnetic aura?
50% uptime for fury?
30% uptime for superspeed?
one aoe-cc every 10 sec?
60% uptime on slime-trails?
50% uptime on flame-aura?
from just one trait!?

I’m all up for bringing kit-refinement back, but there is a reason why the ICD should stay on 20sec, but for each kit individually…

Carighan.6758:

spoj.9672:

Not quite true. The correct thing to say is that necro doesnt have any unique mechanics.

Never said that. But AFAIK, other than their class mechanic no class has unique mechanics, do they?

err…
warri: unique banner buffs
ele: conjuring weapons for allies / healing mist
ranger: spotter (rest of other classes’ aoe-stat-buffs goes here)
mesmer: portal
engi: up to 5 weaponsets without swap-cd

and these are just a few…
note: all these are class-unique effects / skills / buffs that can not be achieved by builds from other classes, but are not part of the F1-F4 class-mechanics…
There is actually a lot that makes classes unique, appart from just their F1-4 mechanics.

This is also why people constantly point out that it makes no sense whatsoever to directly compare a trait / ability with a similar one from another class.
The impact such a change would have on the class, within its unique mechanics, is simply not the same, therefore (f.e.) asking to nerf Incendiary Powder (Engi), because Dhuumfire got nerfed (Necro) simply makes no sense whatsoever.

Regardless, on the original statement:
Necro is as unique as every other class as well, the only difference is that it brings nothing unique to a PvE group. This is not necessarily a bad thing since the raw dps of necros is definitively not “horrible”. They simply not make it more convenient for other classes to be around and their lack of blast-finishers also contributes to the general selfishness of necro PvE builds. They do have the potential to cap vulnerability, and therefore increase the group dps by 25%, but in reality that is already done by 2 warris or a single engi (which both pack extreme loads of group-support), which – sadly – renders the ability of vuln. capping on necro as kinda pointless.
However, in WvW and PvP the condi-play and control of the necromancer is absolutely fine and therefore they have a rightfully strong place in any zerg or tPvP group.

Yes, we all know why it was stupidly OP back in the day, but it’s a shame that this trait got nerfed this hard into the ground.

To bring it back, or making it viable, I’d like to see the following changes.

- Move Kit-Refinement up to grandmaster-tier
- Allow gadget master as master-tier trait
- Allow Leg-mods as adept-tier trait

- the internal cd stays on 20 sec for each proc, but is counted for each kit individually, allowing to reliably proc the effect you need, while profiting from all your equipped kits equally.

- Drop Mine (Grenade Kit):
Even tho grenades are most effective when dropped on your feet, it does not make sense to drop a mine when actually trying to use grenades.
New effect should be “Mad Bomber” – Give Fury for 5 seconds to you and up to 4 additional allies in a 360 radius.
I guess this would be a reasonable change, making the kit-refinement proc from grenades more viable for both PvP and PvE.
The other kit-procs are totally fine, even tho I’d personally prefer to have the magnetic aura and superspeed being switched between medkit and Toolkit.

Since Kit-refinement is now a grand-master trait, I guess these changes would be balanced and justified, and could not get exploited as heavily as before, simply because the internal 20sec cd is still present, but for each kit individually.

Also we’d now have a grandmaster-trait in the tools line that is actually worth to spend 6 points on. Don’t get me wrong, +50% endurance gain or aegis each 15sec is something nice to have, but nothing I’d consider “build-defining”. The only time I personally consider to go 6 into tools is when I’m building for s/d spaming. For every other build, only 2 points (for speedy kits) can be justified.

Nuff’ said.
Thoughts?

Ever played it in WvW or PvP?
Do you know why they are a solid part of GWEN in zergs?
And about PvE:
When leveling up my necro I had a easy time with axe/dagger. Rofl-killing any mob / veteran like every other class as well.
In dungeons / fractals you just equip rabid (or the new sinister stuff) or berserker and will be golden in terms of dmg and survivability for pug-groups.
World-bosses are a breeze, like on any other class as well, and farming events with staff is just too easy.

Really, it only becomes a issue if you’re a try-hard speed-runner.
That in itself is obviously not a bad thing to be, but re-desinging a whole class, just because a minority that is not even playing it to its fullest extend, wants it?
nope.

There are several bugs that need to be fixed (some even since lauch) and some small tweaks here and there are always welcome, but redesigning its mere core? For PvE?
Why?

I mean, PvE in gw2 only consists of 5-man content and appart from high-level fractals every single encounter is pure face-rolling, given that you don’t put a clock next to your PC so that you can judge people for spend seconds more on a boss, lol.

coglin.1867:

Chaith words it in an explanation, you through it out there in the form of an insulting accusation. that is the difference in how it is received.

just ignore the troll.
it will go away eventually.

There was only one guy here that really hated turret engis, and luckly his flamboyant behavior drove him away eventually.

Anyways, it’s not that most people hate them (except those who whisper you and whine), it’s that these builds are nowhere near meta for the engi, and therefore you will never compete on a proficient level in pvp.
the cooldowns are too long, the pressure is too low, which means that you maybe can hold a point fairly long (if you don’t get overloaded by condis), but to effectively defend it, you’ll always need the support from a second team-mate, and you can’t deal with more than 1 attacker without getting cc-locked and killed.

turrets are awesome, and in the right build, provide awesome utility.
net-turret f.e. works wonders together with nades to increase you chance to land your burst.
flame-turret is awesome denial due to its smokefield, and provide nice loads of burn, and in some FT-builds it even finds use as HGH-replacing might-beacon.
and rifle-turret is awesome utility in a exploding turrets / static discharge build, due to its low cd on both the utility and belt-ability.

but running full turrets limits your options in terms of sigils (no doom / battle / energy / hydromancy / geomancy for you), costs you loads of weapon-skills (no room for kits) and therefore limits you to spaming your AA and occasionally one of your other main-weapon abilities. Therefore you don’t have pressure, no survivability, and can’t do anything but hide behind tanky stats and hope that your team-mates will always jump after you in time.

Don’t get me wrong, delaying a point cap is viable, but in the end of the day, your team only has 4 effective members and one point with a healthbar.

As I said, turrets have their use, and can be devastating to your opponent if used in the right build, but a all-turreteer is nowhere near to be even remotely effective.

Still it’s up to you and your team to decide how you enjoy pvp, just don’t expect to be taken as serious pvp players then.

Got the hunter from somewhere in a SM three-way.
can’t say if it was a guard, the lord or one of the hundred players there, just found out about it when I was salvaging my inventory afterwards^^

welp, since I love high risk / high reward zerker s/d builds, predator all the way^^

the psychological effect of burning 75% – 100% health of a single target almost instantly, can only be bested by doing it with orange glowing bolts of death xD

>running with a pug commander on TS
>maybe 15 people at him
>no ele around
>give him waterfields / firefields whenever he’s calling out for them
>after 20min:
“whoever played that ele, gg”
>.<

Welp, it really depends what you want to do in wvw, since there is a lot of stuff that requires pretty different builds…

First off: whoever told you that celestial is not viable for engis in wvw, should crawl in shame under a rock and never dare to come out again.^^

Basically there are 4 things to do, and we have various builds for each.
namely:
- small-scale roaming with a group of maybe 3-5.
- zerg frontliner support
- zerg backliner aoe-spam
- zerg backliner focus

I’ll give you a viable build for each, but keep in mind that small tweaks here and there are always a good idea to get an idea about what you like to do the most, and therefore should focus on.

small scale roaming:
celestial build with focus on condi-overload and sustained pressure on long range:
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fdAQFAUlUUpErlcx+KseRCbBNqxAqKIyN2xPfgAkUA-T1hIABAcBAQS53a6Aod/B4UCao6P8+AAIEwiFA-w
You can also run it with pistol / shield, but then I’d recommend to switch sitting duck for hair trigger. Personally, I prefer the soft-cc I get from rifle over the reflect / stun / confusion of p/s, but to each his own.

-frontliner support
a cleric healer-build that focuses on as much healing per sec as possible. the build-editor does not get the numbers right with the modifiers from benevolence and monk, but in practice you put around 1k hp/s out to allies.
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fdAQFAUlUUpPrlcx+KseNiaBF6MuxAIyQmlPGhDA-T1xDABM8AAIUJYlq/80+DXp8DgLAAe6AIDQxYA-w
And again you could switch rifle for p/s, but personally, my kitten got saved by rifle #5 too often to drop it just for another blast, especially since TK already provides a block. Also, play around with TK #5. perfect for dragging eles into the wrath of you train, and if have the nerves to save Elixir S, even when the hammer-train comes after you (you have high toughness and also 73% dmg-reduction while being stunned), then you have the perfect tool to stomp front-liners even in the middle of their train.

-zerg backliner aoe-spam.
I personally don’t like it. Condis get cleared too fast and retal can potentially kill you on this build, but for completion:
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fdAQJAqelUUpErlcxdLseRSaBNq0AyQcCRFyP3gA8UA-T1hIABBp8DgTAAgq/MmeAO2fg3HAATKBJEwi1A-w
coated bullets is more a place-holder for the trait of you choice, even tho it can be hilarious from time to time. feel free to take away one point from firearms and get transmute in alchemy instead.
the build is pretty simple:
tk for survivability and deplacement of melee’s to disrupt the zerg, nades for general spamming and shield for the blast-finisher, as well as diving into the zerg with #5 if you spot them without stability.

- zerg backliner focus
now here is where the fun (for me) beginns.
It#s a glass-cannon with a bit of survivability and enough dps to melt any target you choose.
see them stacking? drop their commander.
see a shower-casting ele? ruin his day.
free-casting ranger? show him what ranged pressure means.
but beware, you should really be a sir dodge-a-lot, else this build kills you faster than others.
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fdAQFAUlUUpkrtdxmKseNCdBN6wMlfCyFUhPGgbC-T1BFABC8AAQS5Xa6AqZ/BAuAAFq+zVKBJFge6qA-w
Drag people with tk #5 out of their zerg / backline, overload them with prybar + s/d + blunderbus, stomp them, rinse and repeat.
for convienece you have increased crit-chance on range, so feel free to spam your AA right into their zerg as long as you want. You’ll get numbers between 2-2.8k, depending on their toughness.

It’s a matter of taste, dis-information and being lazy.
About taste:
Many people simply don’t like the steampunkish design of the class and want to play a mighty warrior / guard, an epic caster like eles (avatar-influence says hello), be the master of death (necros) or want to be the all-superior master-teef → thief.
Other just find it remotely compeling but got driven away by the complexity and high skillfloor-required to play engi properly.

about dis-information:
welp, the eople above never really played an engi, and those who tried gave up without really looking into the class. So we have a kinda bad reputation because these people who tried, failed and rerolled a warri / guard think they’ve seen all we’re capable of.

about lazy:
It’s a shame that this class is so complicate to get into, so I can’t really blame people for not trying when there are so much more less-risk / same-reward classes. On the other hand, this huge gap of not understanding how a engi works makes it sometimes far too easy for us in pvp or wvw roaming^^
The downside is that elitists will kick you straight away from their dungeon / fractal queue.

solution:
join a guild, make friends, do something awesome (like soloing a boss when everybody got killed already) and get valued for the awesome engi that you are and never bother about lfg again. works for me, should work for you as well.

Daily reminder that you should read the patchnotes.

Complaining about inconsistency in this games’ design, without keeping track of the change / improvement / abundance of certain mechanics, and the reasons for it, makes no sense whatsoever and spawns a thread like this:
full of uniformed, illogical complaints, that are inconsistent in themselves.

Since it seems like you’re missing updates from the past 6-9 months, I’d like you to look into the release note subforum and read up on what you’ve been missing, IF you really intent to proceed with this thread. This would make it much more convenient to argue / discuss about any gw2-related content with you.

Dayra.7405:

Arantheal.7396:

It’s intend is to give a light-headed, more action-based exirirence to those who:
- did end up in a queue.
- don’t like the 24/7 pressure in wvw.
- don’t like the slow, strategic approach in actual wvw-maps.
- prefer action-filled matches in WoW battleground-style.

- think that the scoring is non-sense in WvW
- hate the imbalanced matches in WvW
- don’t like the arrogance of the WvW-player and commander
- find 24/7 nonsense
- don’t want to hear commanders shouting in voice-chat
- don’t like calls-for-scouts, attendance checks, …
- bored of empty WvW-maps outside primetime
- enjoy the variance the imbalanced map design brings (I like red, if it wouldn’t have outmanned buf 80% of the time I would love it.)
- want that WvW in its current shape dies-out to make space for something new, but still want to play a bit from time to time

tl;dr: stop liking what i don’t like…
mhm…

Just a reminder:
this not “Why do I hate WvW” this is “Why is eotm not WvW”