Guild Wars 2

Windu The Forbidden One.6045:

-We can use Fear on robots without emotion.
-We can use chill on ice elementals.
-We can use bleed on creatures without blood (air elementals, ghosts, etc)
-We can use blind on creatures without eyes (air elementals, jellyfish, etc)
The list goes on.

So either, fix the way conditions work on enemies or remove immunities altogether.

ALL of them need fixing, i know its a game but come on.

I think what is worse is the fact they are all ugly (weapon skins) or bugged (hands)

Dand.8231:

ArmageddonAsh.6430:

and what about the classes that dont have Transformation elites/skills.

It’s not like I’m saying give free buffs to the classes that do, and ignore the classes that dont. I’m suggesting that the new skills getting added to the game potentially follow this toggle on/off model.

In all likelihood, the classes that dont have these sorts of transform skills will be getting some at some future point as well.

ArmageddonAsh.6430:

Sorry i would have to say a BIG no to this.

Ok…. do you have any reasons why? Constructive feedback? Why you feel it’s a bad idea? Perhaps what parts of the idea you DID like? What could be done to improve upon it? For all I know, “no” could mean you’re simply cranky cause you missed your afternoon coffee

These transformation skills such as Tornado, Lich and such are meant to be a sort of “amazing” “OMG” moment and for them to be able to go in and out of them at will would take alot away from that.

Then you have the balancing and it would require new transformation skills for classes that dont already have them, they would have to be worked to fit into the class mechanics, would have to balanced and everything else/

I just prefer having the transformation skills the way they are – seriously strong (mostly) can win fights but also come with a long cool down. All i want is something for Mesmer, maybe turn us into a sick giant purple butterfly ^^

and what about the classes that dont have Transformation elites/skills. Sorry i would have to say a BIG no to this.

We have no skills that cause fear, so i highly doubt that we ever will. we are a confusing class, not a scary/feared class. Now i actually like the:

cloudysan.4397:

: 1 stack of confusion=1 stack of whatever the enemy would get so basicly 3 clones=3stacks of confusion=3 stacks of 1sec bleed+3sec poison.
If it was that way imagine how high the potential damage could get. Maybe he meant every time you get confusion no matter how high the stacks(like scepter’s #3 -> 1 proc of the trait)…but one could time it and abuse Illusionary Retribution with tons of clones.

This would give us the condition “Burst” that other classes have. It would be VERY strong so would need tweaking but combined with 25Dueling, Perplexity Runes it could really make the Mesmer condition build something special.

Coming 5point Illusions with Retal on CoF 6-8stacks of confusion as well as 6-8 other conditions at random every >25 seconds would be GREAT and actually make the CoF shatter even better.

Though i think the conditions that should be able to proc should be: Burning, Bleed, Poison, Torment.

Fear = No, it just doesnt suit the class we have NO access to it without runes
Chill = No, same as above
Blind = No, shouldn’t have CC goes for Immobilize, Cripple, Weakness as well.

An interesting idea, though i think it would be better if it had a choice of ALL the conditions – minus Fear (doesnt suit us) confusion (confusion procing confusion? lol) and have it apply ONE at random.

The problem also comes with the fact that 1 second of poison and burning for example is stronger then 1 second of bleeding so to make it more balanced they would need to adjust the stacks or the duration

Derek.9021:

TheDaiBish.9735, that’s the dumbest thing I’ve ever heard balance wise. Can you imagine something being immune to bleeds? That would be honestly gamebreaking.

No, this game needs MORE bosses/Mobs that are immune to certain conditions, maybe even to direct damage while it has boons like a shield that just absorbs and HEALS the mob/boss while it is up.

Currently the game is purely NO skill, its nuke, nuke and even more nuke. Anet needs to do something with mobs and bosses and doing things like this means that people cant just turn up to a boss press auto attack and go AFK until its dead.

Make it so the player has to be aware, has to react and not just think about damage, damage, damage.

Its time they fixed things like the fact that rock creatures can be inflicted with bleed it makes NO sense as well as making all the elementals immune to things like Burning, Chill and such

The problem with confusion is that it IS a weak conditon. Ignoeing the broken 6/6 bonus as that will get a cool down the damage done by confusion is peetty weak unless you have both high condition dueation and high conditon damage though the same can be said for torment it is constantly damaging you and even morw so when hou are moving this is a HUGE benefit to range classes fighting melee.

I agree that tormenting should have a 4/6 bonus. The problem with that would be what? It couldnt be on hit as that would just to powerful. Maybe when you get hit would be a decent option though or maybe a strkng AoE on using an Elite with like a 90eecond cooldown but that wiuld have to be the 6/6 and move the on heal one to 4/6?

TheLazyOne.8509:

I’m curious, does Tormenting proc on healing, regaining health, or on USING a heal skill?

I am guessing its like the other on Heal ones, so every time you use the Skill 6 button, for Mesmers it would likely proc 3-4 times with the Mantra Heal Charging it up(1), heal1(2) and Heal2(3) with trait that would add another heal and another proc (before cool down added)

Now it doesnt matter, with its cool down, i THINK it its like the Might and swiftness on heal ones they could also be affected by them items that give you different appearances as well

EFWinters.5421:

Good post, but I don’t think it will all be implemented.

For me, removing player damage to gates and reducing treb range would work wonders.

Yes, with the new treb mastery its going to be insane. Already on my server we know if we have lost keep the best, quickest and easiest way to that is siege up one of the towers near it (Langor for example) build 2 or 3 trebs and you can easily knock both inner and outer walls down.

A few defensive siege like AC to protect yourselves from zerg attacks works great as well.

This sort of gameplay should NOT be required and it will ONLY get worse with all these buffs to Trebs

Synkru.7984:

I would like to see a dark phantasm version when wielding a twilight sword, kind a like Liadri’s clones. Oh that would be awesome!

That would be SICK
Maybe make it so all the purple effects are all Black as well with the butterflies and such as well

you should play a build that you like not one that you “need to” Are we talking SPvP, TPvp or even WvW? i would say anything (within reason – Shatter, Phantasm) are okay. You will struggle in TPvP due to us sucking in TvP with the current Meta.

WvW wise you have several options and it depends on your gameplay style, like if solo or running with zergs.

Because Torment is a MUCH stronger condition, the cool down was added to Torment when Anet released them without any sort of testing and saw how Engi could get 25stacks of it on AoE by spamming the healing kit.

Perplexity WILL be changed, i expect a 15-20second added to the 6/6 and maybe 10second cool down added to the 4/6 bonus. What i think they should do is change the 6/6 on Perplexity to:

(6): +15% Confusion duration. Confusion damage increased by 25%

Stops all the 25stack bursting that some classes can do but also keeps it worth while for condition builds. Warriors are already started to make builds around this rune set and that is a clear sign thakittens broken, a class should NEVER be able to make a build based around a rune.

Nuka Cola.8520:

kitten s.7421:

Nuka Cola.8520:

Okay okay i guess i’ll have to tell you why i think this build sucks… 1) you have Sword MH on both sets. 2) Since phantasm HP increase and sig of illusion significant HP decrease its not worth running EVEN in a pure phantasm build, take Veil for more stealth cheesing, Phatasmal Defender, Mantra of Resolve or even dat sig of domination for the 3sec stun so iDuelists can land all their bleeds/damage. It always depends against who you’re playing against so if its a condi engi/necro mantra of resolve is more useful, if its another mesmer i’d go with Veil and so on.

You have 15 points in Domination~ Dazzling has no use for a phantasm build (especially yours), 10 points is enough. Dueling~ Don’t have Phanta Fury in a build fully focused on phantasms and i also prefer having DE even in a phantasm build so ‘if’ my phantasms are dead from aoe (engi nades for example), i can always hide behind them as a shield for ranged/none piercing attacks, but this is just a preference, you do what you want. I always ran 25 in inspiration like a nab for dat 15% additional phantasm damage when running a phant build (before IC nerf) but its NOT worth it at all anymore. There’s also no point whatsoever to even invest points in Illusions because Illusionary Distribution is useless for what you try to achieve and Compounding Power is mainly for shatter builds.

Cool Have you tried the build? No? Well then. Guess who has been playing this build since launch and who has had amazing success 1v1 with it. Also i see you completed failed to read anything that i have posted. But its fine i will play my build and own and you can do wahtever you want.

Okay!!! /15char

I totally agree with you but some people just can’t accept their build isnt that great. Compounding Power is USELESS in a Phantasm build as they only buff YOU and not the clones and illusions (though i think they should!)

It should either be 10 or 20 into Dom, the 15 point trait is VERY useless when you have so little access to interrupts. Points in Illusions are all wasted the 5 point bonus has NO benefit to a Phantasm build and as stated Compounding Power is useless in a Phantasm Build

Weapons wise, i would have gone with Sword/???(my pref is Focus) and Greatsword great range weapon, killer Phantasm, Might and Vul as well as creating clones on target

selan.8354:

yeah it is a bug but anet responded and said they will fix it with the next hotfix

Would that be the one that just happened? can anyone test to see if it works correctly now?

Anyone know if Anet releases details of changes in new builds? If not i think it would be nice if they did as i can never really tell what has actually changed.

Palu.3405:

ArmageddonAsh.6430:

selan.8354:

hahaha, yesh totally agree with u. making it trigger on interrupts was a huge mistake…i mean…erm trebs….they interrupts multiple targets at one.(not sure if it works on that but would have to try that out), interrupts can be spammed by warriors, engis and also thieves….how could they not see that coming? they even had to hotfix/overnerf tormenting rune, because they realized that engi could spam it too…oi

i think the on interrupts has to be removed and replaced with something else in this case if they wanna buff confusion builds.

Yep, why they fixed the Tormenting one as Engi could spam healing kit and get it to 25 stacks lol but not do anything about Perplexity. I think having them on Interrupt is fine, what they need to do is give it a 20-30second cool down though

Another thing they could do. Move 4/6 bonus to 6/6 and give it a buff and give it a new 4/6 bonus, maybe another duration or damage increase. Maybe even a damage increase to those affected by Confusion?

Something like:

1) 28 condition damage
2) 15% confusion duration
3) 55 condition damage
4) 20% chance to cause confusion on hit (15 second cooldown)
5) 100 condition damage
6) 15% confusion duration, 25% increased Confusion damage

I actually really like this suggestion. I don’t know how easy this would be to implement, but this would make the rune better for classes that can apply confusion on their own whilst still making it a good rune for other classes. While I don’t have a problem with the current rune, this would be a good alternative that wouldn’t give the most benefit to interrupt spammers.

I would assume it wouldnt be to hard, they already have runes that give you a % increase in damage for various reasons with 1 being connected to target health, i dont see how this would be any harder to implement.

The problem isnt how hard it would be to implement it would be all the crying saying how its to powerful for mesmers and a nerf to everyone else

Ross Biddle.2367:

Can’t say I was referring at all to scepter clones lack of “doing anything”. Obviously they could stand to get a feature. In fact I’d like to see scepter clones transfer 1 condition on them to their target. Clones pick up a lot of collateral conditions, and live more than long enough to attack a few times before they die. Good chance to send those conditions back to their target.

Now THATS a cool condition based clone, unique in the current drab “clone applies shiz” mesmer weapon ideas.

Maybe this would be to overpowered – How about when they die ALL conditions they have on them + 1 on Mesmer gets transferred to the target? as well as the on death traits lol

DevonCarver.5370:

Convenant.7092:

Devon’s a PR.

What the heck is a PR? I am a designer and the coordinator of the WvW team. I am in charge of making the decisions as to the implementation of and final versions of anything that gets put into WvW. While part of my job is to post on the forums to keep y’all informed, it’s also part of my job to not make promises that we can’t keep. So, my answers come off as vague, because that’s as much as I can say. If I’m saying anything, you should consider that to mean something, because if it is a topic I have absolutely no information on, I won’t talk about it at all.

Really? Based on the current mess that is WvW i would suggest maybe spending more trying to make GOOD decisions when it comes to WvW, becuase currently who ever is making all the decisions they are terrible and mostly unwanted by the playerbase…

TooBz.3065:

Inspired by keenlam what if the iMage cast a flame burst (Elementalist Fire Staff #3)?

How about, rather then it cast flame burst, it casts a confusion based attack – Like it fires a purple flame like projectile and it hits the target causing 5 stacks of confusion for 5 seconds and it then explodes into purple butterflies with a radius of 180.

Allies hit with the “blast” would be given Retaliation as well as shield kind of like Chaos Armor that lasts for 2.5seconds and inflicts 2 stacks of confusion for 5seconds to anyone both range and melee that attack them with no ICD. Enemies that are hit in the radius are inflicted with 5stacks of confusion for 2.5seconds

hardloop von edgehoven.8512:

compare it with other professions scepter abilities and traits too
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Scepter#Mesmer

I think out of the “caster” classes (so ignoring Guardian) i think Mesmer has the worst Scepter skills part of the problem being thakittens a mix of a condition and power weapon, look at Necromancer Scepter that is a REAL condition based weapon.

We have the Sword for a Melee power weapon so why isn’t the scepter turned into a REAL condition weapon. It’s pathetic that the Necromancer chain is FASTER and offers way more in terms of conditions, as shown in a poast above injust how much condition the auto attack from Necromancer offers in the same amount of time it would take Mesmer Auto attack create 4 clones (to get the on death traits) is a joke.

Imagine if iCounter was turned into a Grasping Dead AoE style Torment dealer rather then just its current state thakittens.

The Scepter could be SO much btter NOT overpowered just better condition weapon but the problem is Anet doesnt know what it wants the class to be, doesnt know what they even want some of the weapons to be.

Ross Biddle.2367:

What you, like almost all mesmers on this forum don’t seem to understand is that all things, whether it be spike damage, or conditions, come from our clones. Our weapons provide half of any equation. The clones and related traits, the rest.

Okay, lets take a look at Mesmer clones

Staff Clones = Conditions, Boons and damage
Sword Clones = Damage + Vul
Scepter Clones = Damage
Greatsword Clones = Damagex3

Now our auto attacks for Staff and Sword for us does the same thing as the clones – minus the sword clones dont strip a boon (i think) Greatsword clones just do damage as well but its x3 per an attack and at range.

Then you have the Bleeding trait which is better for Greatsword then the Scepter, so i think that is why the greatsword doesnt get anything else, though Staff gets that plus the normal conditions that they give

You also have the fact that ALL clones from ALL weapons give the same on death trait bonuses, so why is that the Scepter auto attack and the Scepter Clones offer NOTHING else and thats the point if “The clones and related traits, the rest.” is true then we are surely losing out with the Scepter seeing as the Auto attack offers nothing and the clones offer nothing – Sure its nice that if creates clones but thats all it does on death traits dont always work when someone is moving, out of range and such

On death traits should be a bonus, not the only ways of applying conditions. Confusing images is to eazy to dodge. iCounter is wasted if you dont get hit. Auto attack is insanely slow and others nothing other then a aclone with itself is nothing but fodder for on death traits with no conditions on the auto attack chain, no conditions on clone attack. iMag is a joke and totally ignored as its no threat what so ever

TIFour.1076:

They clones do cause conditions. When they crit, they inflict bleed because of the sharper images trait. Beyond that, the clone spam of Scepter 1 lets condition Mesmers make use of the apply conditions on death traits as a mechanic to control a fight.

It shouldn’t need a trait, the Clones from Staff dont need trait to cause conditions or boons, so why should Scepter clones? Not really with how long the cast time is, people can keep moving and have little/no affect from the on death traits and again those traits would affect the staff clones as well even if the staff doesnt spam clones DE, PR, Mirror Images and other ways can still cause the same affect

Take a look at Necromancer Scepter for example

Necromancer Scepter Auto Attack Chain = 1.5seconds, 8seconds of Bleeding, 4seconds of Poison

Mesmer scepter Auto Attack Chain = 2seconds 1 clone

So in the time it takes Mesmer Scepter to create 4 clones to get some of the conditions from the traits Necromancer Auto attacking would give 48seconds of Bleeding (which stack intensity – upto 6 stacks) and 24seconds of Poison while Memser would get a random condition, Cripple and Confusion if they have all been traited for and thats without taking any Necroamncer traits – you could take 33% extra condition duration for Scepter and 66% chance on critical to cause even more bleeding

Trog.2918:

The second is with GS1 and a weird obstruction bug. I was stood right next to a mob (well chicken actually, was doing the ambient killer daily) and was trying to blast it but all that came up was ‘obstructed’. This also happened on a door while doing my story line. No matter how close I stood or at what angle, it kept saying ‘obstructed’

Yes! I find Mirror Blade and iZerker miss things as well, this is mostly WvW related as thats mostly all i do. I find that NPCS on walls can hit me but i cant hit them without either of us moving and just get “obstructed” surely if they can hit me then i should be able to do the same

Another is on siege with Oil being the worst right in front of it and auto, Mirror Blade and iZerker will miss – this also happens sometimes with iWarden as well wheich is freaking annoying when there is NOTHING in the way, everyone else is hitting it perfectly fine so why the hell cant i -.-

Palu.3405:

Please, tell me why you think scepter and torch aren’t condition weapons. I would love to hear your suggestions on how you would improve them in a balanced manner.

Already have, sure they are decent but they arent exactly great either. Slow Auto atatck, both on projectile speed and cast time is kind of annoying, wouldnt be to bad having the 2nd and 3rd causing conditions and/or make the clones DO something i doubt a Staff Clone sort of thing would work but maybe there attacks could cause a condition as well

Confusing Images is just to easily to dodge. A few more seconds of confusion wouldnt hurt being that it isnt the strongest condition out there.

iCounter i would would be better as an aura, so that we can run or attack at the same time, 2 seconds of having to stay still is like putting a target on us, the fact that you have to also wait after they hit before moving otherwise the torment wont proc on them is kind of annoying

however, the biggest weakness is iMage, it just well – it sucks. Will only hit a target once making IE useless in 1Vs1 fights, the Confusion duration is no where near long enough and the projectile speed is to slow. I wouldnt say they need huge buffs or changes, just a few tweaks here and there

Fix Auto attack, speed it up abit maybe add a condition or 2 to the chain other classes do it with auto so why not us? Fix Confusing Images to easily dodged, maybe increase duration by a few seconds. Fix iMage as well make it so that it can bounce multiple times on same ally/target. increase Confusion duration to 4-5seconds and increase projectile speed

These would be a nice a nice start.

Anyone else think these 2 weapons are dying to become Condition weapons? i think if fixed they would surely fix (if done right) the weakness of Mesmer Condition builds? Sword+Focus seem pretty much perfect for power builds. i think with a few tweaks Scepter+Torch could become just as strong for Condition builds.

What do you guys think?

The clones will override your phantasms.

After the Initial attack Phantoms are wasted. You have have several you can have out and i have NEVER seen a clone over write a Phantom. So that is a moot point.

Confusion is bad, cripple is irrelevant since the mob(s) isn’t moving and conditions besides vulnerability are bad 25%+ damage off of 25 vulnerability stacks not only improves your own dps, but your team mates as well.

Confusion is good, all damage helps. Cripple is great for kiting, not everything stands still. you dont need 25stacks of Vul to kill anything, all the PvE mobs are easy enough to kill without a single stack of Vul. So again, thats not really anything that great and if you are hitting 25 stacks it means others in the group are doing it as well, unless all you do is auto attack.

Or you could be autoattacking, and judging from the tooltip, get 4 attacks done within the 2 seconds you have iCounter up. Even if you got hit in say, a second that’s still two hits you could get in with sword auto.

Or You could use iCounter, hit it with Torment and do 1800+ damage even more if you have a even just a semi condition built and then continue attacking. You can also gain Retal from it which is even more damage with trait.

Right, and I said sword is best because it gives you full melee uptime and maximum DPS, so why even mention scepter? Again, confusing images is a channeled abilty and you can do more damage off the sword autoattack, plus like I said above, confusion is bad in PvE.

full melee uptime means nothing if you are using 2 weapons that share a cool down and changing the sword to a Scepter doesnt mean you have to change range you can still melee using the Scepter and have access to other skills as well.

I have seen (and done) like 5k+ using Confusing Images, plus the confusion stacks you can do more then that in 5seconds using Sword Auto? Confusing Images Confusion is nearly 500 damage per a skill used for 5 seconds and thats with my crappy condition damage.

The scepter isnt only a Condition damage and can still be very strong in power builds as well.

cesmode.4257:

Are greatsword/ power&crit builds much better than staff / condition builds?

depends how you define “better”
+ I would say you could kill people faster
- Not as much defense

+ More damage
- Less Mobility

Being the key differences

DuckDuckBOOM.4097:

MacLeod.4208:

DuckDuckBOOM.4097:

MacLeod.4208:

ArmageddonAsh.6430:

MacLeod.4208:

Great topic Pyro!

Since it is the torch phantasm, it seems like it should burn foes. Since it can stealth the player, perhaps when it bounces to an ally it should stealth them for 1 second…just long enough to break target. Thoughts?

Something tells me, as much as it would rock it would just be to powerful

I was wondering about that. But it does only attack every 6 seconds.

But it would also bounce to any of your other phantasms or allies. If it hits a thief ally mid backstab combo, that would really screw things up for him. If it hit’s a phantasm, suddenly you got constant invisible zerkers that you cant see coming. That’s too OP.

I can see how it would make a thief mad, that’s a good point. That pretty much breaks the idea right there. It would be fun to see it though. =)

But I don’t think that the 1 sec stealth would make anything a “constant invisible” anything. They would at most be stealthed for 1 second out of every 6. Even that might be OP, I don’t know. Thanks for your thoughts! It is fun to think about how to change things.

Constant invisible was probably the wrong words to choose. Constant reapplication. Mesmers can be confusing to dodge/fight because they have up to 4 sources that you need to look out for. Phantasms will tend to run up to someone a bit before attacking or start whirlwinding around. Combos have specific tells to look out for. Having all those tells disappear every 6 seconds, even if it’s for only 1 second, will bring the QQ to a whole new level.

Could make it so thakittens even just 0.1seconds just so that target is dropped?

DuckDuckBOOM.4097:

MacLeod.4208:

ArmageddonAsh.6430:

MacLeod.4208:

Great topic Pyro!

Since it is the torch phantasm, it seems like it should burn foes. Since it can stealth the player, perhaps when it bounces to an ally it should stealth them for 1 second…just long enough to break target. Thoughts?

Something tells me, as much as it would rock it would just be to powerful

I was wondering about that. But it does only attack every 6 seconds.

But it would also bounce to any of your other phantasms or allies. If it hits a thief ally mid backstab combo, that would really screw things up for him. If it hit’s a phantasm, suddenly you got constant invisible zerkers that you cant see coming. That’s too OP.

Maybe make it so the stealth ONLY affects the Mesmer and its clones and Phantoms, i have to admit i would love a stealth Zerker melt people and them have no idea what happened.

Anyway, as stated the iMage doesnt need a full scale change from top to bottom. It just needs what it does buffed.

1) Shorter Cool down
2) Faster Projectile speed
3) More/longer stacks of Confusion and Retal
4) Bounce more then once on someone

^ Pretty much all it needs, what would need to be decided on how much they are buffed before they become to strong. I would think something like

25 second (20traited) cool down
50% increase on projectile speed
2stack increase on Confusion with a 1second increase on base duration
50% increase on Retal base duration would be enough i think

I like the clone on auto attack – Confusing Combatants, Debilitating Dissipation, Crippling Dissipation work very well in condition builds (and count for the auto attack)

Sure it could be better, sped up added a condition or 2 but its pretty decent Confusion, Cripple and a random condition isnt to bad. Yeah iCounter is a bit iffy, but once you learn WHEN to use it it can be very strong as It is like its like 1,800 damage plus another 1,800 if they stay moving with only 393Condition damage

Confusing Images can be pretty decent and still hit quite hard (just like Sceper Auto) with solid power and it shouldnt hit as hard as Sword auto as it isnt a full melee weapon – Auto attack on Scepter has 900range

I have actually been playing around with Condition/Confusion build that uses CoF with the retal trait

MacLeod.4208:

Great topic Pyro!

Since it is the torch phantasm, it seems like it should burn foes. Since it can stealth the player, perhaps when it bounces to an ally it should stealth them for 1 second…just long enough to break target. Thoughts?

Something tells me, as much as it would rock it would just be to powerful

colesy.8490:

Running sword mainhand in both weapon sets gives you full melee uptime (you’re not required to shift between melee and 900+ range like you would when going gs and sword/x, plus IIRC mainhand sword is our highest DPS weapon) plus blurred frenzy is available immediately on cooldown.

But if you went with Scepter MH on one set you wouldnt need to go to range and you have Torment as well on block as well as Confusion. By the time BF is back off cool down you could have used iCounter and Confusing Images and then back to Sword/focus in time for BF to come off cool down

colesy.8490:

For open world PVE, run whatever you want. For dungeons, sword/focus + sword/pistol are the best weapon combination to run (plus in your second weapon set can just use a pistol and you’ll get the sword abilities anyway, not requiring you to buy a second sword) with greatsword in your inventory for the very rare cases that range is required.

Seeing as the cool downs would be shared between the swords why would you want to take 2? I would have thought that taking the Scepter would be a better option, even if you are not in it for that long

DuckDuckBOOM.4097:

Skill use every 6 seconds with a cast time of 0.75 seconds. Skill use every 4.8 seconds with Phantasmal Haste.
The skill bounces twice and cannot bounce to a target more than once.

Phantasmal Mage 6.3s 5.27s

Anyone know which one of these is correct? Both of them are from the wiki but different pages. Also the bounce never hitting a target more than once? That just seems silly and maybe old, especially given that they changed the bounce mechanics recently. Anyone tested this with the new changes?

When proposing these buffs, you need to keep the current traits in mind.
Just thinking about 20/0/0/0/30 with elasticity/haste. If the bounce can hit someone more than once, you can double both the conditions and the boons received/conditions removed.

So with the proposed buffs and the numbers it would create: 15 sec CD to summon, ~5 second rate of attack. 5 stack/10 sec base would turn into 10 (if bounce works) stacks for 20 seconds every 5 seconds. Just 1 mage would be able to maintain 25 stacks of confusion on one target. That’s just 1 of them that is also giving boons/removing conditions. Then you want more conditions on it? It definitely needs a buff, but that is too much. Also, it’s a defensive/condi phantasms so it shouldn’t do as much damage as a power phant.

What I would like to see is chaos armor on allies instead of retaliation. The randomness would add a bit more to the deception since most people expect only the main mesmer to have chaos armor instead of the clones. Every 5 seconds, a new set of clones/mesmers now have chaos armor. Would be a silly game of magical chairs. Bringing the cooldown a bit would be great. Maybe if the confusion was changed to 1 stack of torment (bounce for 2) instead so it would do consistent damage. The chaos armor will do the confusion instead.

I have done tests and it has NEVER bounced back to a target/ally. This is a HUGE disadvantage for it in 1Vs 1 situations. It also makes IE useless with it in 1 Vs 1 situations. These tests i did were yesturday.

The cool down could be adjusted of the Mages attack to counter it, but in its current state does ANYONE actually try and kill iMage? the ONLY Phantasms i kill are iZerker and iDuelist. Mage is NO threat what so ever in its current state.

oZii.2864:

I like the idea of mage being good when he is out. All the phantasms are recognizable with zerker and duelist probably considered the most dangerous.

I like all these ideas. Definitely the base duration increase on confusion that way if you spec duration it becomes a threat if you don’t kill him.

Yeah, 3 second base is pathetic. People can just ignore him has he is no threat what so ever in its current state. Now if Master of Misdirection was GOOD and iMage buffed just them 2 changes could make Confusion worthwhile again.

Master of Misdirection: Increase Confusion Duration by 50%
iMage: Increase Confusion base duration to 10seconds

This would mean that the iMage would HAVE to be targeted and killed rather then simply laughed at and ignored. They could even build into it that it removes Boons from targets and conditions from allies as well.

Master of Misdirection currently adds like 0.75seconds onto Confusion from iMage. which is just pathetic.

Something else that could be done to make it more of a support/defense phantom rather then pure damage like the iZerker.

Targets get: Confusion, Poison and Torment
Allies Get: Retal, Protection, Regen

Keep it to a bouncing attack but make it so that it WORKS. It doesnt seem to like bouncing back to people thakittens already hit (from my tests)

I think the Mage is VERY weak, for a 30second cool down (untraited) it is PATHETIC. Nothing else can be said i mean look at iZerker, its like a 20second cool down untraited but does ALOT more damage, is more useful and on a shorter cool down and can trigger like 4-5 bleeding with sharper images.

Personally i think it needs a BIG buff:

1) Decrease The cool down to 25seconds untraited (20 traited)

2) Increase Confusion stacks to 5 stacks per a hit, Duration base 10seconds

3) Increase Retal to 5seconds

4) Make it so that it adds another 2-3 conditions – Bleeding, Burning, Poison, Torment would be nice choices

5) Increase base damage by 50%

6) increase projectile speed by 25%

djtool.8372:

Then perhaps it is wvw. I cant imagine the phrase “full zerker” being used to describe just taking the amulet.

Yeah, what Mesmer actually plays S/TPvP, i gave it a try yesterday it was a total mess full of Spirit Rangers, Necros and condition upon condition…

I would agree, seems kind of weak 6% isnt that great. I would take Doom, Maybe Corruption as well. You have to remember though you cant have On crit chance (like Earth) on one set and Doom (weapon swap) on the other set as they share a cool down.

So if Earth proced and then you swapped weapons the Doom wouldnt proc as it would be on cool down thanks to Earth.

I personally think unless you are a norn or Charr all the greatswords look silly on Meswmers – they are just to big and look kinda silly :/

selan.8354:

hahaha, yesh totally agree with u. making it trigger on interrupts was a huge mistake…i mean…erm trebs….they interrupts multiple targets at one.(not sure if it works on that but would have to try that out), interrupts can be spammed by warriors, engis and also thieves….how could they not see that coming? they even had to hotfix/overnerf tormenting rune, because they realized that engi could spam it too…oi

i think the on interrupts has to be removed and replaced with something else in this case if they wanna buff confusion builds.

Yep, why they fixed the Tormenting one as Engi could spam healing kit and get it to 25 stacks lol but not do anything about Perplexity. I think having them on Interrupt is fine, what they need to do is give it a 20-30second cool down though

Another thing they could do. Move 4/6 bonus to 6/6 and give it a buff and give it a new 4/6 bonus, maybe another duration or damage increase. Maybe even a damage increase to those affected by Confusion?

Something like:

1) 28 condition damage
2) 15% confusion duration
3) 55 condition damage
4) 20% chance to cause confusion on hit (15 second cooldown)
5) 100 condition damage
6) 15% confusion duration, 25% increased Confusion damage

Nubu.6148:

Could you pls stop crying . These runes are a huge buff for conditons mesmers .

BUT – they are a LOT bigger buff to other classes that dont even have Confusion traits…

selan.8354:

Carighan.6758:

I’m sorry, I’d rather want this nerfed and my actual Confusion ability buffed again.

This runeset is a very meh bandaid to a problem which exists because the current way Confusion is implemented just doesn’t work.

yeah agreed. i think anet invented this rune with the idea to buff confusio build, but instead gave confusion to other classes that now can stack it better than the ones that actually speced for it…
the fact it triggers with each interrupt makes this rune way to op for certain classes. i’d rather have that nr6 trait on that rune completely changed and confusion buffed. otherwise how is anet justifying the bb nerf icd? wasnt that to prevent us from stacking confusion?hmmmmmm.

Totally agree, i think its a joke that other classes can get this to 25stacks ALONE with just these 6 runes, we cant even do that (easily – at all?) and we have all these Confusion traits…

Its like its 2 different groups that are doing the buffing and nerfing, and they dont like talking to each other.

khoi.2841:

hi osicat,
I just leveled my mesmer to 80 and have several questions about the shatter cat heavy 3.0 build.
First question is that would it be okay to switch Rune of hoelbark to Rune of air? And switch portal for some condition removal skills like nullfield?
Second Question is that would it be okay to switch the Valkyrie to Beserker gears for more cirt?
Last question is that how do u get the back piece?

I currently run a similar build (traits, gear and Sword+Focus) i have changed the Runes to a mixture of Might buffing runes as well as swapping the staff to a Greatsword all with different sigils. So i think (personal opinion) that you could make changes, i also dont run with Portal and take Decoy, Mirror Images and Feedback instead.

Gear wise, this all depends on how squishy you think you are all ready. I personally think that they could be changed a bit, the build has a nice amount of toughness so as long as you dont lose to much that you can be burst down by a surprise attack then i think you would be okay.

The back piece i dunno, could be ascended from Laurels or from FoTM but Osicat would have to confirm that

djtool.8372:

Jackums.3496:

If you’re running a phantasm build, the GS is hands-down the single best dueling weapon, matched only by the pistol. Since Berserker was fixed, it hits like a truck (7.8k in PvP), and its cripple is extremely useful for slowing your opponent, whether they’re fleeing or trying to close the distance between you. That and its multiple hits, just like Duelist’s, benefit from Sharper Images. Then you have the range on the GS, which allows you to summon your phantasms, then sit back at a distance and shave away at your enemy’s health with a pretty hard-hitting auto-attack. Finally, you have the great CC in iWave.

I would like to find one of these 7.8k critting GS’s. Maybe you’re speaking of WvW

Also want to find opponents with no range or gap closers, that sounds sweet.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion. I disagree with this one. Best “dueling” weapon setup for phantasms is likely sword or pistol in the off-hand, although it mostly just comes down to the player.

I have seen full Zerker GS users hitting for ALOT. I have seen them hitting for 6k+ so it all depends on the opponent build. I have even seen iZerker hit for 9k! on an ele

Carighan.6758:

ArmageddonAsh.6430:

I would consider neither worthy of TPvP, might get away in SPvP.

Meh, sidegame. They both work really well in WvW and PvE, especially Interrupt-build in the latter. Instant 25 Might Party buff. Less reliable but much faster than other classes do it.

Again, they are build with Stealth and Interrupt. They are NOT stealth or interrupt builds.

Yes he did. It was a picture of a Meser in the Vampirism gear and at 10% health triggering the 6/6 rune (kinda like Vapor form) and the dude thinking he was hacking/cheating.