Stop trying make Dragon Hunter happen.
I laughed when i read this,
then i cried because it’s true.
:(
Great feedback! I agree with everything you have written, in particular:
Deflecting Shot is interesting but feels gimmicky.
I like what they were trying to do with this skill but it doesn’t work with GW2 combat, i completely agree with you. We have access to blinds in far better ways already. I would like to see this skill redesigned.
I agree with what you said about Traits too, for me Dragon Hunter traits are the biggest problem with this elite spec currently.
I completely agree with what you said about ‘Heavy Light’, ‘Dulled Senses’ and ’Zealot’s Aggression’, i think they should be combined into one grandmaster trait.
You guys merged all the medi traits into 1 since everyone needed to take them in order to be viable at dps and yet here you are doing the same thing all over again.
Exactly! I remember watching the livestream when DH was announced thinking exactly what you just wrote!
What do you think about the minor traits ’Defender’s Dogma’ and ‘Pure of Sight’?
I think ‘Defen. Dog.’ is in the wrong trait line, feels like it belongs in Valor traitline.
I am not a fan of ‘Pure Sight’ either, even with LongBow guardians are largely going to be in melee, weapon swaping once the enemy is close. Plus isn’t this trait a copy paste from Rangers?
Since this skill is meant to be supportive i was thinking a redesign along the lines of ‘Bow of Truth’ spirit weapon. For example we fire a magical arrow through our allies and it provides some positive effect.
Let’s talk Deflecting Shot.
Out of all the Longbow skills i feel like it’s the most underwhelming. While our other Longbow skills have minor issues the basic idea/mechanics for them work fine.
I feel like the “destroys projectiles” feature of this skill is a horrible gimmick.
Ranged attacks are so fast and vast in number that this skill barely has any significant effect. Even if you were fast enough to react to the enemies attack or predicted the projectiles incoming it is barely a drop in the ocean to the barrage of projectile damage incoming.
When we have access to such skills like ‘Sanctuary’, ‘Wall of Reflection’, ‘Shelter’, ‘Shield of the Avenger’ and even the new F3 shield, this weak difficult to use projectile destroyer just feels like a horrible gimmick that should be redesigned.
Thoughts?
(edited by Arnath.2319)
Guardian main since launch of GW2, the Dragon Hunter in its current state is completely useless. Dragon Hunter is a massive nerf to this profession. There is zero reason to use the Longbow, there is zero reason to use traps, and there is zero reason to use the traits.
- New Virtues need to be instant, no cast-time. Spear of Justice has to work with the Virtue trait lines or that entire trait line i useless to Dragon Hunters.
- Longbow 1 needs to be much faster and hit harder, Longbow 2 needs to not root you in place, Longbow 3 needs a complete redesign the range attack absorb is a horrible gimmick, Longbow 4 needs to fire faster and fire behind us, Longbow 5 needs to apply the fence at the start not the end of the cast.
- Traps need to be changed to Wells, or at the very least make them ground targetable. Traps are useless at ranged, they work okay with melee weapon like Hammer.
-Dragon Hunter traits are terrible and need a redesign from the ground up, not a single good thing about them.
Currently Dragon Hunter is useless. I am shocked this even made Alpha testing it is that bad.
Uhm, options?
It’s not like there is one ultimate way to play, with or without ever using virtues.
How is eliminating one entire trait line giving us options?
If they reworked “Supreme Justice”, “Permeating Wrath” and “Defender’s Dogma” to encourage the use of F1 it would give us more options not less.
The new virtue Spear of Justice is supposed to be spammed, it stacks upon itself for even greater burning.
The trait “Big Game Hunter” further encourages us to use our F1 at the start of battle.
The Raidiance trait line works well with this design, “Justice is Blind” and “Renewed Justice” synergies perfectly.
However the Virtues trait-line is completely useless to the Dragon Hunter, the two key talents “Supreme Justice” and “Permeating Wrath” encourage us to never activate our F1.
Also embarrassingly one of the traits in Dragon Hunter “Defender’s Dogma” also encourages us not to activate F1.
Currently condi burn Guardians never activate F1, it is crucial to our current gameplay.
Is it intended by the Devs that one entire trait line becomes worthless with the Dragon Hunter? Was this elite specialization meant to improve condi guardian or weaken it?
Are we meant to spam F1? Or never activate it? Make up your minds Devs, please.
(edited by Arnath.2319)
…where other classes have synergy with their new weapon and skill…
Exactly, traps would have situational use if they were baseline and not attached to the DragonHunter. They work best with Hammer.
But that’s not how elite specs work, at least not for the other classes. Our weapon and skills should work with each other perfectly, as of now they do not.
Why do the other classes receive awesome stuff and Guardians receive nothing ArenaNet?
Interesting when you compare us to the other elite specs i didn’t think about it before.
Other classes receive awesome stuff while the Dragon Hunter removes awesome stuff, how is this fair ArenaNet?
I agree. Traps are currently 100% useless.
Why did they give us a ranged weapon but melee only traps?
Every other professions weapon and skills blend with each other, why do DragonHunters have to suffer?
Just to clear that up: I’m no fan of the current Dragonhunter (also made a lenghty post about it even before BWE).
However, please keep in mind that we’re at the start of BWE1, Anet promised they want to listen to feedback. If they don’t then by all means they deserve to be flamed, but right now I think we should provide constructive feedback.
The Basics of the Dragonhunter are actually good. For example, the choice of the Longbow was nice (scepter isn’t bad, but it feels awkward – to me at least). They just went overboard with some of the conditions they wanted to shove in and figured, that there’s no way the DH can keep the DMG with all those… and so it kinda became a joke.
While i agree that this is Beta and the devs made it very clear they care about our feedback, this is the Guardian forums… the devs famously ignore us. I highly doubt they are reading these posts. Even if they did the refuse to listen, shield and spirit weapons still suck three years in and we have provided years of feedback for that.
Sadly i have the horrible feeling what we see now is what we will get live.
The Dragon Hunter needs some serious fixes/redesigns to be viable.
Right now there is no reason to take DH, it is weaker in every single aspect.
I agree. The sounds were the first thing i noticed.
[twang, twang, twang] I am so sick of hearing the twang of the bow!
Magical arrows require magical sound effects.
Dragon Hunter has the ground work to be good, but right now it’s an embarrassing epic train-wreck that needs serious fixing.
- Virtues NEED to be instant cast.
- Longbow 1 needs to be heaps faster and hit harder, 2 needs to not root you in place, 3 is garbage and needs replacing, 4 needs to move faster and also fire behind you, 5 needs the cc to proc first not last.
- Traps are garbage, pure 100% garbage.
Traits are hilariously bad. They lack synergy, they are random all over the place mess. Traits need a redesign from the ground up.
Right now there is no reason to go Dragon Hunter. NONE. Scepter/Torch does superior damage and provides better quicker utility. Bow is slow and weak, traps are pathetic, traits are horrible.
But lets be honest, the devs don’t read the Guardian forums. How many years has it been and shield/spirit weapons still suck.
Sigh.
I can’t access Beta yet but from watching live-streams and hearing others test the LongBow in game the very first thing that i noticed is the horrible sound effects on the LongBow.
The DragonHunter trailer video had some amazing sound effects, but right now it sounds like standard bow like Ranger.
Creating a guild that is “pro-heterosexuality” is offensive and against the rules, it would be like creating a guild that was “pro-white”.
That is quite a narrow view of the big picture. A guild that is pro-______ in itself is not offensive or against the rules, it’s how those members conduct themselves towards those who don’t share the same views.
Do its members conduct themselves with pride, or with hatred?
Just because a guild is pro-something, does not mean they spread hatred –
does [LGBT] spread hatred towards heterosexuals? Hell no, they’re awesomeThe same guidelines should apply to all guilds, whether you like them or not
pro-____ guilds are offensive when they are clearly trying to counter and aggravate a struggling minority. In particular issues of gender, race, and sexuality. A pro-hetero guild is a clear example of that. It is incredibly insensitive.
This thread has already been reported and will soon be locked/deleted. I am done feeding the trolls.
I find it hilarious when people try and claim homosexuality is a “political issue”.
Is heterosexuality considered political? Is issues of race considered political? Gender political?
No one ever complains about the hundreds of heterosexual characters in games but as soon as a single gay couple appears it becomes “political” and “shaving it in our faces”.
Issues surrounding gender, race, sexuality are NOT political.
Now if GW2 made a Tweet supporting a particular presidential candidate THAT would be political and very wrong.
If the OP and others have any issue with homosexuality and marriage equality they have the choice not to play the game if it makes them uncomfortable. Be a mature adult and walk away, there is no need to make hateful comments/threads.
Creating a guild that is “pro-heterosexuality” is offensive and against the rules, it would be like creating a guild that was “pro-white”.
Hypocrisy at its finest!
It’s not hypocrisy. Check your privilege.
Straight people have nothing to be proud about.
Once straight people have gone through centuries of discrimination, bullying, being murdered, and other horrible unspeakable acts, then and only then can you have your “pro-hetero” guild.
You can create a “Straight Ally” group, a group that focuses more on straight people who support all sexual identities.
I can tell by the language you are using that your intentions are not in the right place.
“parades my sexual views”
That shows me that you are clearly mocking the LBGT guilds. No one is “parading their sexual views”.
Also those guilds do not exclude straight people.
Creating a guild that is “pro-heterosexuality” is offensive and against the rules, it would be like creating a guild that was “pro-white”.
Is it worth adding some Sinister or Carion armor/accessories mixed with the Zerker?
Burning hits so hard now with condi damage.
In fairness i will say that Jon mentioned in chat today that Engineers will be getting nerfed.
Karl said that the reason this patch is going live now is so the devs can continue to balance the professions.
So either every single other profession will be nerfed in line with Guardian or Guardians will be buffed to be in line with every single other profession…. hopefully.
Maybe someone needs to start a post on reddit that can gain a lot of attention ?
Tried that, failed.
Every other profession is blind to the Guardians problems, and if you try and mention them you get attacked viciously.
Everyone believes we still live in 2012 when we were great.
This reminds me of Paladins in classic WoW.
I am extremely disappointed that ArenaNet caved to the small minority of selfish rude players. There was nothing wrong with the price.
The only valid complaint was the changing of the FAQ making it look like they were trying to rip off customers, but they have now addressed that.
Thankyou ArenaNet for being so generous and mature as usual, it breaks my heart that they will loose thousands of dollars because of these changes just because of a selfish spoiled minority.
The nerfs are unjustified, watching the streams on Twitch and Engineers dealing out significantly more burning then Guardians makes me cry.
Every profession shown is doing insane damage and as soon as they started showing Guardian everyone started laughing at how bad we were. Even the person playing on stream said out loud how terrible Guardians are now compared to the major revamps every other profession received.
It horrifies me how quiet the devs are being on these major nerfs, it’s even more horrifying how the guardian community is staying so silent. Do people even play this broken profession anymore?
Anytime i try and mention how bad Guardians have become i just get abused by other professions, apparently we still live in 2012 when Guardians were gods… sigh.
And what do we have to look forward to in HoT? Traps? Sigh…
This patch will kill Guardians and nobody seems to care.
(edited by Arnath.2319)
I would really like to hear from one of the lead devs on how they can justify keeping Guardians in the dark for so many years.
I want the devs to explain to us why they believe broken shield weapon and broken spirit weapons are ok.
I want the devs to tell us why they believe being “in a good spot” justifies our profession receiving no significant changes since the launch of the game while every single other profession receives massive power creeps.
For once i would love the devs to be honest with us instead of lying, instead of stabbing us in the back, instead of hiding in the shadows. Come out and justify why you hate Guardians so much!
Guardians got nerfed.
The devs proving once again that they hate Guardians. We are now officially the most broken profession in this game.
I honestly think that dragonhunter is why we we’re nerfed.
Why? DragonHunter traits are terrible. Unless they nerfed our core traits to try and make DragonHunter seem better, an incredibly lazy move if that is the case. They needed to buff DragonHunter significantly, now the entire profession suffers because the devs were lazy.
Ventari’s Tablet is a better Spirit Weapon then our Spirit Weapons, sigh…
It also has better shield mechanics then our own shield weapon.
Wouldn’t it be great if Guardians got some of this new fancy tech for our broken shield and broken spirit weapons.
They could give guardians new condi for us only….spirit fire. So they can nerf plain fire and buff spirit fire as is, because eles will be too OP with burning stacks. (cele’s are OP as hell now )
I would love to see this, one of the big problems with condi guards is our lack of conditions. Even in HoT with the burning changes and bleeds on traps condi guards are unlikely to be viable. We need a consistent condi that can be applied on multi targets consistently that isn’t tied to unreliable traps.
Maybe the first minor trait in DragonHunter that gives us the new Virtues can also give us a mechanic that applies “Spirit Fire” on weapon auto attack critical strikes or something like that.
We already have bluish fire when we activate our virtue. Btw eles getting trait “dodge to remove fire condition” so we are more kittened vs ele as now (even now we cant win vs ele)
It doesn’t have to be fire, any unique condi that only we can use will be good.
For example the greatsword five skill ‘Binding Blade’ is damage over time and can be applied to multiple enemies at once.
For Example, Dragon Hunters first trait:
“The guardian’s resolve has further increased, allowing virtues to be manifested as physical aspects. In addition all critical strikes made with your main hand and off-hand weapons apply ‘Binding Blade’. ‘Binding Blade’ now stacks.”
Wish you guys would stop whinging about the name and instead help the Developers improve the actual concept or skills. It’s really a silly waste of time.
That’s nothing but your own personal opinion.
Also it’s not like it is a huge thing to change. It can be done quickly. Don’t worry, it won’t make your expansion release late or anything like that…
The naming of the elite spec and some of the trait/skill names would take less then twenty minutes to do.
Changing the animation on ‘Dragon Maw’ would take slightly longer, and if they give us new unique weapon and armour to go with the new elite spec name then that would take even more time. However they could sell the old glove and longbow skins on the gem store to compensate extra development time?
I think the biggest concern is the possibility DragonHunters are part of a already developed story in HoT, for example one if the biggest theories currently is Braham finds Eir dead and goes all dragon crazy with his mothers longbow. If they have already devolved lore/story as part of the expansion then DragonHunters are sadly here to stay forever.
They could give guardians new condi for us only….spirit fire. So they can nerf plain fire and buff spirit fire as is, because eles will be too OP with burning stacks. (cele’s are OP as hell now )
I would love to see this, one of the big problems with condi guards is our lack of conditions. Even in HoT with the burning changes and bleeds on traps condi guards are unlikely to be viable. We need a consistent condi that can be applied on multi targets consistently that isn’t tied to unreliable traps.
Maybe the first minor trait in DragonHunter that gives us the new Virtues can also give us a mechanic that applies “Spirit Fire” on weapon auto attack critical strikes or something like that.
Ok… seriously. How would DH immediately displacing the current Guardian meta be a good thing?.
I agree with you, but keep in mind that Guardians have been ignored since launch of the game, Medi guard is the bread and butter for everything and after two-three years it has become extremely stale (at least for me).
I didn’t expect Dragon Hunter to be superior to Medi Guard, but i was hoping it would have at least been a viable option.
As it currently stands Dragon Hunter is considerably weaker then our Core Traits for both PVP and PVE.
the LB could changed to scepter/focus which perform better compare to what i saw.
This.
Sceptre/Focus would have been extremely superior over the LongBow.
He still uses Shelter heal, still uses Medi skills.
The only trap he used was the elite trap and with sceptres immobilize you could swap that out for something more useful like the new elite shout or the cookie cutter Renewed Focus.
Overall Dragon Hunter seems really useless in PVP.
Well that was disappointing…
- Medi Guard will still be meta in PVP.
- DragonHunters are over powered against Thief’s who stand there and do nothing.
- Traps still look horrible for PVP.
That’s about it, anyone notice anything else?
(edited by Arnath.2319)
For those unaware this weeks Ready Up will give us “the first look at how the Dragon Hunter fares in PvP.”
“Ready Up has finished. Check the YouTube link below to see a replay of the stream.”
(edited by Arnath.2319)
A good build will not take Dragon Hunter in its current form. Our core traits are far stronger, specing into DH is deliberately nerfing yourself.
That is the biggest problem with the Dragon Hunter traits, they lack synergy with other trait lines and our core Guardian abilities.
They need to do a complete redesign of the DH traits in order for it to be viable.
Great ideas! The current Dragon Hunter traits are so boring and weak to the point there not worth taking, hopefully ArenaNet will make some changes like you suggested.
Threads need a dislike option, this is a terrible idea that ignores all the problems that the name Dragon Hunter brings, Dragon Bane is equally as bad.
They need to remove both the word “Dragon” and “Hunter” and go with a single generic name.
Did you not read the page after page of feedback before making this thread?
I vote for the name Inquisitor.
I place my vote for Inquisitor.
Make it happen ArenaNet!
Dragons are not inherently evil, they are a force of nature, would you call a thunder storm “evil”?
Not all dragons are evil, Glint was our friend and her egg might be good too, plus the Pale Tree and those Sylvari born from it are good.
Everyone in this game is hunting dragons, if we are to specialise into dragon hunting then we MUST receive some significant advantage over every other profession in game.
Since we have that advantage we should then logically teach every single other profession to become Dragon Hunters to maximise our potential at defeating the Elder Dragons.
And when ArenaNet release new future elite specs we will be forced to ignore them since logically it would make sense to stay Dragon Hunter maximising our strengths in defeating the dragons until there all gone.
The Dragon Hunter theme is completely illogical in every single way!
Not a single person as been able to provide a logical explanation for the terrible Dragon Hunter theme.
… other than Anet. That’s what matters.
No they haven’t given a LOGICAL explanation.
Not a single person as been able to provide a logical explanation for the terrible Dragon Hunter theme.
It is completely illogical in every single way. Lore-breaking, gameplay breaking, profession design breaking.
LAWLWUT? We have never been forced into condi ever. Introducing the GM traits forced us into nothing.
I said the devs TRIED to make condi guards viable, we were obviously never forced to take those bad traits.
The DH line gives barely anything towards having a condi spec. I don’t know why you’d think it would be a good idea to call it as such.
It’s the devs who want it to be condi spec not me, did anyone watch the livestream? They were saying repeatable that condi guard is a real thing now with the DH.
Wait a second…
I thought Radiance looked to be the condition options. Some of our new elite line just happen to also apply some.
They tried to force guards into condi a few times since release, when they released the new grandmaster traits for example.
If the devs really want condi guard to be a real thing they need to make some serious changes.
Would Permeating Wrath be something like Chilling Nova? Especially since they were discussing making it pulse the burn around your foe, instead of around the Guardian.
I hope they make this change however even if they did it’s in the wrong trait line, Dragon Hunter is going to b e our condi line then traits that improve our condi abilities that currently reside in Zeal and Radiance should be in Dragon Hunter.
And STILL even if those traits were in DH and they did make that change to Permeating Wrath i don’t think it would be enough to get condi guards viable.
Sorry, but calling DH our dedicated condi line is a joke at best. One trait that gives bleed from traps is not going to be the deciding factor in whether or not condi guardian will establish any prominence.
I agree, that is why i said condi guards still won’t be viable even in HoT.
I think the devs want DH to be the condi line, but i don’t think they realise that bleed on traps is not enough, especially since traps have such a massive cooldown.
I just wish we could get a dev response on this, is it even a possibility that the name/theme can be changed? Or are we all wasting our time giving this feedback?
A simple “we are considering changing the name/theme please continue providing feedback” or “we apologise but we are far to deep into development to change the name/theme it is permanent” would be greatly appreciated.
Would Permeating Wrath be something like Chilling Nova? Especially since they were discussing making it pulse the burn around your foe, instead of around the Guardian.
I hope they make this change however even if they did it’s in the wrong trait line, Dragon Hunter is going to b e our condi line then traits that improve our condi abilities that currently reside in Zeal and Radiance should be in Dragon Hunter.
And STILL even if those traits were in DH and they did make that change to Permeating Wrath i don’t think it would be enough to get condi guards viable.
Meanwhile Dragon Hunters get a glove.
Not gloves. Glove. A single glove on one hand.
Yet another reason why Dragon Hunters suck.
SighDuck…