Guild Wars 2

Anelyn.4593:

Remove dhunfire. Replace with a trait fit for power builds.

Add torment to scepter 3 – depending on number of conditions you apply a stack of equal value torment (ie: 3 conditions on target, stack of 3 torment applied).

Since the second most complained about thing is Terror, move it to where Dhuumfire is. Make Terror a power based attack instead of a condition damage attack and dramatically increase its damage. Give it an additional chance to crit for each unique condition on the target.

Change fear to work just like a stun instead of a condition (duration isn’t increased by consecutive casts) and increase fear duration to 2 seconds instead of 1 like many stuns.

I think you all are looking in the wrong places for this. Conditions are powerful because they have a single stat feeding into them. Classes that use conditions are then ‘overpowered’ because they can ignore power, crit, and crit damage in favor of condition damage, toughness, vitality, and healing power. The solution should be to first get condition damage on the same page as everything else.

The best solution would be to remove the condition damage stat entirely and just make condition damage based off power. But if this isn’t possible, why not cut condition damage accross the board by a set percentage (30%) and then allow them to crit.

THEN if you still find condition damage to be overpowered (which I can’t imagine would be the case considering it’s so easily avoided currently), you can rework armor/toughness to reduce base power damage by X% and further reduce crit damage by Y%.

I still think the larger problem is the simple fact that condition being a single stat where power attacks need 3 is the problem. We already see the vast majority of bunkers happen to be condition spec’d for this very reason. If you push conditions too hard without compensating how easy they are to negate in the first place, you’ll remove their worth entirely.

The game already needs to put in a Shadowbane’esque style dispel system just so conditions can do their job as it is imo.

**In Shadowbane there was only dispel. Conditions and boons were ranked. You’d need to dispel boons in order to get to conditions and some of the truly powerful conditions you’d need to remove nearly every boon you had to get to it.

They are going to do something when they get rid of the magic find stat. If they drop it and boost stats up accordingly and this suit doesn’t lose so much primary stat it may turn out better. But really the only classes that I see benefiting from ths suit are rangers and guardians.

haven’t seen many good Necro videos period… so lets turn this into a necro video thread.

Change Terror to deal a relative amount of upfront damage (500ish?) and be power based. Fear for 2 seconds base. Trait it up to 3 seconds. Make it so its duration can’t stack and must be reapplied just like stuns do. This isn’t that complicated and the net result doesn’t change much. It just removes the scripted feeling of combat for the Necromancer and requires a slight amount of effort to pull off effectively. Is this what you want done to fear?

Now as far as condition bursting, how do you resolve it? The overwhelming majority of players think Dhuum should apply 2 stacks of torment for 4 seconds. Is this enough to resolve your condi burst issues? Is this enough of a nerf to give the Necromancer access to an anti-training move like an AE knockback or the like?

The problem people have with Necromancer is their damage seems high, but even with this damage they don’t feel like they contribute much because they’re face down without much effort at all. How much damage does a Necromancer need to lose before its defensive issues are finally recognized?

So make it act like a stun. Do damage only once on application. Fear for longer. Increase damage. Power based not condition based.

Go Thief if you’re playing a melee Ranger.

Make it do the same damage as poison and put revealed on the target for the duration of the burn.

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

@Atherakhia: Your premise, however, is flawed. Death Shroud is indeed balanced along the assumption of a 1v1, but because of that, it is too weak for 1vX where X>1. If they balanced the values for 1vX, it is too strong for 1v1.

And the idea is not to nerf Death Shroud, but rather make it so it is relevant in more situations, but not overpowered in any of them.

Having a Life Force dump is a neat idea, but given Death Shroud is a necros only real defense, I find it highly unlikely that said dump skill would find any use at all outside of the easy PvE content (i.e., not dungeons).

Really depends. In organized PvP the only thing that matters is pressure and control. The game doesn’t really have much in the way control options, especially for the necromancer. A lifeforce dump as an escape tool (AE knockback and stealth per above example) is very enticing in 1vX scenarios. It’s valuable for getting targets off the point. It’s valuable to positioning.

But that’s only a defensive implementation of a lifeforce dump. What if they gave a skill that consumed lifeforce at a increased rate but made life blast have an increased chance to crit, increased damage, and each crit did something silly like apply torment.

Consume all your life force and grant 100/200/300 power and condition damage for the next 10 seconds for each 33% you used?

Zikory.6871:

But with torment do you think it would be worthy of being a Grandmaster trait?

I question its worth with burn to be honest. It’s a grandmaster talent in a power line afterall. Depending on the number of stacks, it could be of value as a replacement. If it has 3 stacks of torment for example it does nearly the same damage as burn if the target is moving.

I’m more concerned with what ANet decides is the problem. It would appear they have problem with terror builds. I could see them nerfing dhuumfire AND changing master of tower to a grandmaster trait.

Better solution would be to simply nerf condition damage across the board by XX% but allow them to then crit. This way power builds benefit from the crit and crit damage. Condi builds benefit because they can also collect crit and crit damage. Bunker builds are nerfed because players can no longer simply go all condi damage, toughness, and healing power/vitality and expect to provide any real pressure. It increases the value of allstat gear so maybe true hybrid roles could be a reality in this game (currently condition damage is an all or nothing kind of thing). It could open the door for toughness/armor to affect condi crits in some fashion maybe (though probably not needed because condis have numerous downsides their one main benefit is they ignore toughness).

It’s a bandaid. I imagine next week they’ll nerf it for real. Given the discussions in that thread, they’ll probably change it to Torment instead of Burn (which I’m cool with btw).

Stick to the premise that MMO’s and PvP games in particular are not balanced around 1v1. There’s a reason /duel doesn’t exist in this game afterall.

Now that said.. the other way it’s balanced is the simple fact that this class lacks stability, stun breaks, and escapes. Use this tools to take full advantage of killing the Necro.

If we’re dead set on really nerfing deathshroud, the best thing you could do is buff it in my opinion. Give the Necromancer an ability to use in deathshroud that consumes all life force in favor of doing something. The more it uses, the better the effect.

For example…

A skill when used at above 90% life force consumes all life force, knocks targets away 600 yards and stealths the necromancer for 10 seconds. When used above 50% knocks targets back and stealths for 8 seconds. When used above 25% knocks back stealths for only 6 seconds. When used below 25% stealths for 4 seconds and knocksback. If deathshroud is drained and ends because you run out of life force, it only knocks back.

But that’s only one of infinite possibilities. If you give players a life force dump mechanic, you’ll probably find people would use it more often than deathshroud itself.

Why would you suggest nerfing scepter and staff range? The issue isn’t even related to these weapons as their ability to spread conditions is quite limited and on long cooldowns. If you issue is AE conditions and you want to range limit them, your target should be epidemic.

Is doomfire even the issue for the power build? I thought most still used close to death?

Well sPvP balance changes tend to be warranted in WvW so I’m fine with that. The PvE implications I’m not really concerned with because I find PvE this game absolutely dreadful. But I realize I may be alone in that opinion.

But yes, it’s a pain to have to hunt down finding threads like these. Especially this late in the game where they have hundreds of responses, in 4 different threads all in the sPvP forum.

We’re getting dangerously close to introducing resilience.

Conditions and Bunker builds are a problem because they have a single stat feeding them. Notice how the majority of bunker builds are also condition spec’d? It’s because these classes can ignore crit and cirt damage completely. In WvW it’s the same thing with apothecary gear where players ignore power too.

Reduce condition damage by XX% across the board and allow them to crit and you’d probably see an end to condition and bunker dominance in this game.

Or you could just make armor reduce damage by 1%, conditions by .5%, crit damage by .25%, and crit chance by 2%

reedju.5786:

In that case please don’t change anything. I think some things released 2 patches ago could have really used further testing, I really was a fan of slow and steady approach. Go into the qualifiers with what we have then take a serious look afterwards, there is no small or simple change that will balance this between three games modes.

I agree with this guy. Good or bad, players have lived with it for a few days now and worked things out. The complaints in this thread have been complaints for months and if you were that concerned with the tournament you shouldn’t have had a patch to begin with.

Let the tournament play out and you will have all the data you need because you should be able to find streams of every single scenario you asked for with the top players on both sides. Even if it doesn’t match the current meta, you’ll still see people out there making things work. I’m sure you’ll see tons of 5x Hunter or 5x Mesmer teams. All Thief teams etc.

At this point you may as well wait.

jcbroe.4329:

With the new change in full Knights Armor with some berserker mixed in (I’m sitting on 50 crit chance and 42 crit damage), with full Marksmanship to pick up Remorseless, doing the simple rotation of stealthing into Rapid Fire always nets me between 7.5-9k Rapid Fire channels, and that’s without the Sigil of Fire proccing.

I mean, I’m sitting on 3k armor, at 1500 range, and I’m able to channel almost 10k damage in 4.5 seconds, every 12s. AND Precise Strike isn’t a guaranteed crit (bug), which would probably put the damage at a consistent bottom range of 8k.

There really aren’t that many other classes that can do that damage at range AND build for the evasion and escape tools that rangers have access to.

At 1500 range, maybe. At 900-1200 range though?

Dragon’s Tooth
Phoenix
Feast
Comet
Path of Scars

I’m sure I could name a half dozen more with little real effort. And almost all of those are AE. 8k over 4.5 seconds is not a lot of damage. Thief can do it with unload 3 times in a row :/

Kal Spiro.9745:

Atherakhia.4086:

The issue for me is the fact it’s 3 traits moreso than it being underwhelming. A lot of traits are underwhelming and very situational, which is fine.

I think the first 2 should be combined, the grandmaster moved to master, and the grandmaster changed to piercing shots.

No no no no no… did I say no? NO!
Why are you trying to mess with piercing shot? You’re trying to force me to choose between personal invulnerability and having a useful weapon, really? That’s not acceptable.

I have no idea what you just said.

We’re talking minor traits here… meaning Piercing Shot would be a minor trait.. given to you for free for putting 25 points into marksmanship. Which means they can replace it with something else entirely.

Romek.4201:

maby can sell this scrolls in auctionshouse too – so PVPers could make gold^^

I would trust the scrolls would be so cheap that there wouldn’t be much profit in it. 1 laurel a scroll seems reasonable considering you’d need 80 laurels to go to 80 and then an addition 150 to gear the character out with ascended gear. But yea, buying them would be nice too

If not removed, it should at least change to something less obtrusive than a clear glowing shield. Why not a blue flaming circlet hovering over your head or something.

Gnat.9405:

What about changing Signet of Undeath to operate similar to Grenth’s Balance in GW1 but with HP and Life Force? Sacrificing HP to fill LF until they are 50/50.

70% HP, 0% LF would turn to 50% HP and 20% LF. Just something simple to give us more access to LF.

Also if my ideas are bad it may be because I’m am strictly a PvE/lite WvW player so don’t flame too hard.

The problem with this is you’d just drop combat and regen all your health anyway. If you were to do this, you may as well just start with a full life force bar. I doubt people would do this in combat as DS isn’t more valuable than your normal skills. It’s not like lifetap for warlocks in WoW.

The issue for me is the fact it’s 3 traits moreso than it being underwhelming. A lot of traits are underwhelming and very situational, which is fine.

I think the first 2 should be combined, the grandmaster moved to master, and the grandmaster changed to piercing shots.

RashanDale.3609:

Atherakhia.4086:

Change the burning condition to deal the same damage as poison and make it apply the revealed debuff for the same duration as the burn.

what would be the kittening point of having a Burning-condition then, if it does exactly the same thing as poison does bar the reduced healing?

to put revealed on the target?

Allow players to buy scrolls of experience with laurels.

The goal should be to make Longbow feel like a unique weapon. Leave conditions on shortbow and let longbow remain the power alternative.

1 – Slightly increased damage for the 0-900 range. 901-max range has an additional 10% chance to crit or a +30% crit damage bonus.

2 – Change the channel down to 3-3.5 seconds. Leave vuln here. The channel time is the real DPS killer.

3 – 1.5 second channel aimed shot that deals very high damage

4 – I agree and this is where I would have put stealth if I hit myself on the head and thought stealth was needed in the first place.

5 – Nothing wrong with barrage. A shorter channel I’d be cool with though.

Marksmanship
Minor Trait 1: Pet and Ranger gain opening strikes
Minor Trait 2: Opening Strikes have a 100% chance to crit.
Minor Trait 3: Piercing Arrows

that’s where I would start.

Change the burning condition to deal the same damage as poison and make it apply the revealed debuff for the same duration as the burn.

The single most complained about condition in this game is burning. Everyone argues it does too much damage and that it doesn’t stack so only one person truly benefits from it.

The single most complained about mechanic in this game is stealth. Everyone argues it’s too powerful, there aren’t any counters to it, and it removes fun from the game for people who don’t have it.

Why not kill 2 birds with one stone and have burning put revealed on the target? Logically it makes sense because you wouldn’t expect someone to be able to hide in the shadows while burning.

I say change burning to do the same damage as poison and make it so for as long as a target is burning, they also have the revealed debuff.

Is there a reason it has to be limited to deathshroud? And does the solution have to be so convoluted? The main issue is having multiple targets attacking the necro and burning them down while the necro can’t defend itself.

In other games when classes are designed this way, the limited mobility they do have tends to be very good. Why isn’t that the case here? Why isn’t stability and stun breaking more common for this class?

If you want an easy solution outside of shroud, why not just allow necromancers to detonate their wells knocking back targets. Each well could then do something else depending on the one sacrificed. One could chill, another could cause AE damage where they land, etc.

Now while I like a lot of where this thread is going, it seems needlessly complex. Why not just have it so when you leave deathshround you gain protection for 4 seconds?

Why not make it so when deathshroud expires as a result of life force being depleted (meaning you didn’t just turn it off) you gain protection and cast an PBAE knockback where targets are thrown back a distance depending on how much health you have when you leave deathshroud.

If you have 75% or greater, they’re thrown back 300 yards.
If you have 50% or greater, they are thrown back 600 yards.
If you have less than 50% they are thrown back 900 yards.

This in conjunction with better life force generation (bleeds giving life force so you can gain some while in shroud, scepter generating life force on the second attack, etc) so you can use shroud more often would probably have a meaningful impact without being too complex or over-the-top.

I will speak solely on conditions as I don’t play the Necromancer often enough to offer an informed decision on the class’ higher level play. I do know that when I do play it I’m aggrivated at how easily it’s trained down and the fact that there’s no way to get people off you in an emergency is poor class design. But if you’re saying it’s a L2P issue on my end, I can’t argue it.

Now that said, with conditions… their strength is the simple fact that they have 1 stat feeding into them. This is also their downfall as they tend to support an all-or-nothing playstyle (you either go all conditions or no conditions). What I feel they should do is simply cut condition damage accross the board by 30% but allow them to crit. This way you pull down the bunker builds some because they can’t just stack vitality/toughness, healing, and condition damage. You maintain an even level of condition damage (because I don’t necessarily find them overly strong damage wise right now for bleeds). And you allow classes a little more freedom in exploring other options when traiting.

Now as for burn, I also agree that it needs to go. Bleed should be the primary condition. Since poison and burn can’t be stacked they should probably both be utility oriented moreso than damage. Make both do 2x bleed damage like poison does, but change burn to a anti-stealth tool. A burning target will have revealed for example.

Setun.4368:

Reisinger.4203:

Yeah after the SB range nerf nobody is forcing us to play longbow…

Range correction isn’t a nerf. People who’ve been playing since beta said that the range on sb shouldn’t have been what it was at launch.

The problem with the nerf is they basically made Axe and SB identical weapons. Same range, effectively the same #2 skills, and #3 axe is roughly the same as #4/5 bow. SB is already a better power weapon than longbow so now it’s up against axe in the power area too. It’s a toss between conditions and #3 shortbow vs offhand options for axe.

Burnfall.9573:

Op

I have to disagree with you entirely, especially with this statement “. But even with stealth being as powerful as it is, the Thief class still doesn’t outshine Elementalists, Mesmers, Guardians, or Rangers in small group roaming.”

It seem to me you don’t do wvw much, as already mentioned many times; thief is the 1 Superior class for roaming, mobility, finishers, tankers and survivalbity and not forgetting Invincibility with Perma-Stealth activated.

I got another reason why i disagree with you Op,
with 3,320 video results of thief soliong and roaming small and outnubered zerges; 8-30+ man zerg.

http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=thief+wvw+zerg

I Hope that clarifies your mis-statements.

I have one of each class mentioned. I do fine on each of them. Do you need me to go through the effort of linking WvW videos of each?

FranBunnyFFXII.3508:

Atherakhia.4086:

I’ll be serious…

My complaint with this class revolves around how boring it is to play. I realize I’m setting myself up for failure because I don’t really want to play a melee ranger, but shortbow and longbow are boring. You literally do nothing but run around in circles auto-attacking things until your opponent eventually dies of boredom himself.

you kinda missed the point of playing an archer archetype there….

No I didn’t… I’ve never played an MMO where the archer didn’t do anything but auto attack. The only time other than GW 2 that I did nothing but auto-attack all day was back when WoW allowed macros and I made an IWIN button to top the DPS charts (See: Zanzer Patchwerk).

Shortbow still has the boring auto attack playstyle that’s reinforced because every attack does no appreciable damage. Longbow shouldn’t be the same thing. Longbow should be the power alternative to shortbow’s condition focus and be more interactive and fun with burst, crits, and options.

Conan.8046:

Chopps.5047:

Frost trap…dropped? It’s one of the best slot skills we have though. I’m the opposite of you because I can’t figure out why anyone would take muddy terrain or spike trap when they could use frost trap instead. Do you want to blast frost armor or give a tiny damage spike? Do you want some crappy cripple, or do you want them to have to suffer longer cooldowns on abilties as well as move slow? The choice is obvious to me because it’s a combo field. Rangers can blast it themselves now.

For someone who played a Ranger so long you haven’t a clue.

Cripple for 2.5 seconds and 3 stacks of bleed – 20 second cooldown.
Chill for 1.25 seconds – 24 second cooldown

So cripple lasts twice as long and does damage and recharges faster. That’s why people prefer spike trap. This assumes your opponent isn’t completely stupid and moves out of the trap once triggered.

While a bit harsh, he’s pretty much right. The traps in general are used primarily for the condition damage and AE control on points. The slightly stronger snare isn’t worth the loss of damage that frost trap provides in my opinion.

Conan.8046:

Atherakhia.4086:

Chopps.5047:

Well, it’s not that I don’t agree. It’s that you’re wrong. Players are valuable—not professions. Teamwork and reliable allies are how I rank the value of other players in Strikeforce T1 wvw zerg/roaming.

Regarding your other comment about “it’s not learn to play”, anyone who has spent a great deal of time with longbow immediately recognizes how the new hunter’s shot helps. It is indeed people not knowing how to play that leads to the QQ.

If I gave you an improved wrench to loosen a bolt but you’ve never actually used a wrench before, the new features won’t make sense. “Why do I want this” the naive person asks, “I just need more torque” when in fact it has a mechanism that’s better than just more torque that the naive user knows little about.

I know you and I aren’t going to agree, that’s fine. I’ve been playing MMO’s for 20 years and all of that was spent playing this same style class. It’s not a L2P issue ‘for me’. It’s just not fun. I make the class work, I’m successful with it in PvE and PvP/WvW. It’s just not what I want and while the developers seem interested in improving this class for the first time in about 5 months I figured it was time to post on this forum again for a change.

Don’t worry, in a week the red will disappear and so will I. I completely recognize I’m being selfish and biased. It’s just I love this type of class and this is the worst implementation of this type of class I’ve ever seen and I want it to be better.

What sort of change were you looking for if you don’t mind me asking?

Not much really.

Normalized longbow damage so it does competetive damage with shortbow over the overlapping ranges. The extended range (900+ now) changed to a crit improvement. Either increased chance to crit or a crit damage improvement.

Rapid fire to be cut down to 3-3.5 seconds for the same damage.

Frost trap dropped (Why use Frost over spike? Not sure why both exist…) in favor of a modular skill that does different things depending on weapon used. Longbow would obviously get a ‘aimed shot’ type skill which is a large damage burst. 20-30 second cooldown would be ideal.

Then some trait improvements. Marks in particular is bloated with good traits, but the minors, while ‘good’ could be scaled down to 2 and one of the minors changed to allow arrows to pierce. Alot of other traits just don’t make sense where they are.

Nothing excessive as you can see. Just something to make the class feel like I’m doing more than running around auto-attacking while giving the class a true power build option that is more than a one trick pony.

I’d stay where you are. The lower pop servers like FC, ET, AR, NS, HOD, etc will be more fun. The players tend to be more skilled. There are no queues. There’s no lag. I’d avoid the top 3 tiers at all cost.

Prysin.8542:

JonathanSharp.7094:

ensoriki.5789:

Take the medium of the two.
Necro’s are eating up quite a bit of damage, and putting out a significant amount that well still feels somewhat absurd for how long they’re maintaining themself with shroud.

Without that lifeshroud however it’s not really a biggie and they go down fairly quickly. So sure at the beginning of the fight they’ll go down easily after that it’s a pain.

Nods. I’m simply illustrating the fact that we often hear things from the players that are diametrically opposed. And thus, if it’s hard to do “what the players want”. This is a good example of that.

what one could do, is switch two classes..

while this is not really the discussion, the thief can tank heavily while still dishing out massive damage, making it overly strong in 1 v 1. The necro cannot tank while it can do massive damage…. bridge the two, move necro up to medium armor, take thiefs down to light armor.

While neither choice is 100% justified, it would balance out the playing field by making necros less squishy, and making tanker thiefs less tanky.

Thieves can’t tank for [censored] so not sure where that’s coming from. Not to mention a Necro has 2x the health of a Thief…

Chopps.5047:

Well, it’s not that I don’t agree. It’s that you’re wrong. Players are valuable—not professions. Teamwork and reliable allies are how I rank the value of other players in Strikeforce T1 wvw zerg/roaming.

Regarding your other comment about “it’s not learn to play”, anyone who has spent a great deal of time with longbow immediately recognizes how the new hunter’s shot helps. It is indeed people not knowing how to play that leads to the QQ.

If I gave you an improved wrench to loosen a bolt but you’ve never actually used a wrench before, the new features won’t make sense. “Why do I want this” the naive person asks, “I just need more torque” when in fact it has a mechanism that’s better than just more torque that the naive user knows little about.

I know you and I aren’t going to agree, that’s fine. I’ve been playing MMO’s for 20 years and all of that was spent playing this same style class. It’s not a L2P issue ‘for me’. It’s just not fun. I make the class work, I’m successful with it in PvE and PvP/WvW. It’s just not what I want and while the developers seem interested in improving this class for the first time in about 5 months I figured it was time to post on this forum again for a change.

Don’t worry, in a week the red will disappear and so will I. I completely recognize I’m being selfish and biased. It’s just I love this type of class and this is the worst implementation of this type of class I’ve ever seen and I want it to be better.

I’ll be serious…

My complaint with this class revolves around how boring it is to play. I realize I’m setting myself up for failure because I don’t really want to play a melee ranger, but shortbow and longbow are boring. You literally do nothing but run around in circles auto-attacking things until your opponent eventually dies of boredom himself.

A lot of the skills aren’t ‘fun’ to use because it’s just a lot of nothing. Poison volley doesn’t do anything noticeable and poisons don’t work well/if at all. Using shortbow 4 and 5 are effectively the same exact thing and are used for the same general purpose. Longbow has a very bad auto attack, a second move which is a slightly less-worse bad auto attack that applies vuln now.

Flashy numbers are fun. It makes you feel like you’re doing something productive. It’s also the primary way to apply pressure in a PvP setting. Single target, low, sustained damage isn’t going to pressure people. The primary way to do it is either controllable burst or AE. Neither the class does very well at from ranged. So in order to feel like you’re doing something productive people tend to enjoy doing burst damage or AE.

It’s a clunky mechanic.
It came at a DPS loss for one of the worst weapon options in the game (pistol/pistol is worse, don’t worry).
It wasn’t enough or what people have been complaining about for 9 months.

It was probably done because they’re at a complete loss on what to do with the weapon and they remember back during christmas time everyone enjoyed that event where you played as the scout.

We’ll see what else is done in the future. It would be nice to come back and play this class again.

People play this game for different reasons. Some people want the class they’ve enjoyed in other games to live up to their expectations. If the class is living up to your expectations, congratulations. If it’s not, their recourse is to post about it on the forums.

If you feel Longbow is viable now, there’s nothing wrong with it. But just because people aren’t impressed doesn’t mean they don’t know how to play or they want the class to be overpowered. I’m not impressed. I find this class to be the second least valuable class in WvW and the most boring class and least interactive class of the 8.

Posting QQ posts about people QQing isn’t going to change my opinion obviously, but you’re more than welcome to ignore my posts if you don’t agree.

Wanting the class to lack mobility is fine. This is often done for this type of class in other games (Confessors and Warlocks come to mind) but these other games ensure that the limited mobility the class does have, is solid. They also give the class options when they’re being focused down.

Why doesn’t the class have an AE knockback?
Why aren’t health drains more common and have better coefficients?
Why aren’t regens available?

If I had my way…
I’d have bleeds generate LF slowly.
I’d allow wells to be collapsed knocking targets away.
I’d provide protection on exiting deathshroud with a 30second internal cooldown.

If you want to improve mobility just change stomp to a 900 yard leap that AE knocksdown instead of AE knocksback. It’s been suggested several times on the Warrior forum.

As for rush, I still don’t understand why this skill works the way it does when Swoop seems to be far more reliable and the skills are effectively the same overall. Are you concerned that Rush would be too powerful if it wasn’t affected by movement impairing effects?

Now as for the talk on making 100b a burst move, I don’t understand the point behind this? Are we under the impression 100b is too powerful? Because I can’t remember the last time people complained about it. Is the concern arcing slice is awful? Because it is… fury isn’t that hard to come by.

Just because you design the Necromancer to intentionally lack mobility doesn’t mean you ignore the same complaint about the class for 7 months. If you want it to have next to no mobility, then you’d expect its limited mobility that it does have to actually be more reliable. Stability should be all over the class and not just on elites and traits.

There’s also ways to ensure a class can survive the pain train then simply giving it blink. Why not give the class an PBAE Knockback? Why not give it immobilizes instead of chills? Why not make Torment actually convince people to stand still?

The problems with the class are obvious but little is being done to resolve them. Simply making deathshroud more tanky will never solve the problem.

Chopps.5047:

Atherakhia.4086:

Chopps.5047:

Nah, zenith, marks/skirm/nature magic ranger is a strong, bursty build and plenty of people are using it. I’ve ran rampager, zerk, or valkryie for the last month and am having lots of fun and winning battles in wvw. I lose some too but that’s when I get outplayed or countered.

The problem with these bursty builds is they’re only good when looked at with the ranger in mind. It’s no where near the burst nearly every other class is capable of and those other classes have other advantages on top.

Burst is the problem with this class more than anything imo.

How much do you think a Maul hits for in a typical valkyrie build?

90% crit damage 6745 crit on a level 80 thief. No idea on their armor value. Was about average though. Like I said earlier though… I’m setting myself up for failure because I want this class to be somethign ANet doesn’t want it to be (a bow user). I realize I’m expecting too much and it’s my own fault for having the complaints I have.

Xsorus.2507:

Atherakhia.4086:

It’s not necessarily that longbow’s damage is lacking. It is, obviously… because a power build with shortbow is just as/more effective… but I’d be fine with the damage longbow did if the class was actually capable of doing BURST damage.

Burst is what makes a difference in a fight. Single target sustained damage doesn’t do anything. The only reason Necro’s make it work is because they’re doing more damage to everyone and not just a single target.

Burst is what this class lacks. It’s boring as all hell to play because it doesn’t have it. There’s a reason this class’ sole build right now is regen/condi spec.

You must not of played a Maul Build before

You can pop people for 10k with the right setup.

Granted the Sustain on it blows, and you’ll die if you fight any competent bunker build, but we do in fact have Burst Damage.

Oh I have… I kind of set myself up for failure with this class because I want it to be something ANet apparently doesn’t want it to be. A bow user.

Trust me, I’ve tried it all but I just couldn’t make it fit with what I wanted despite playing the ranger archetype for 20 years in mmos. It’s my fault, I freely admit it.

Durzlla.6295:

If you want burst you’re playing the wrong prof, thief IS burst, ranger is SUSTAIN, if you want burst you’ve come to the wrong place.

Every class is capable of some burst. This is a PvP game… the only damage that’s valuable is the kind that can provide pressure. There are only 2 ways to do that: burst and AE. The ranger just doesn’t have any. The little it does provide is pet reliant and we know how that works out in WvW with the zergs.

ItIsFinished.9462:

Atherakhia.4086:

THERE’S JUST NO EXCITEMENT ABOUT THIS CLASS! I literally do nothing but strafe in circles auto attacking things until they eventually die from boredom. This class doesn’t provide any real pressure because there’s no burst to speak of. It doesn’t provide any real peeling because the snares/stuns aren’t very long lasting. It can’t push because the skills are mostly all single target.

This class desperately needs some real burst attacks to provide pressure on the enemy. It needs to have a viable option outside of condition damage and regen builds because these builds are only effective because condition damage is a 1 stat function. If they ever get around to balancing conditions in this game, the Ranger will have nothing left.

Just from reading these two paragraphs, I can’t seem to figure out why you chose Ranger as a profession. A thief would have fulfilled your desires if your looking for burst.

I am a Thief now… or was anyway. But the reason I made the Thief was exactly for the reasons you mentioned. It’s just more interactive. Even low burst wouldn’t be so bad if this class was more than auto-attacking 90% of the time and 9% of the rest made up of me using skills for no other reason than they’re on cooldown.

But like I said in the OP, I’m setting myself up for failure because I want the Shortbow and Longbow to live up to more than ANet appears they want them to. Axe mainhand is fun and the off-hand options give some variety. But I made a ranger to use a bow to begin with and the class just never lived up to it.

For me anyway.

Chopps.5047:

Nah, zenith, marks/skirm/nature magic ranger is a strong, bursty build and plenty of people are using it. I’ve ran rampager, zerk, or valkryie for the last month and am having lots of fun and winning battles in wvw. I lose some too but that’s when I get outplayed or countered.

The problem with these bursty builds is they’re only good when looked at with the ranger in mind. It’s no where near the burst nearly every other class is capable of and those other classes have other advantages on top.

Burst is the problem with this class more than anything imo.