Guild Wars 2

Bumping this due to new Revealed skills incoming

Fix this kitten anet and stop ignoring it. Our thief community will keep making posts until you do one simple kittening fix that will take no time at all

I could legitimately see the dual skill for swords being the first ever skill to GIVE endurance back. Like, it does some cool evading ability and recharges 25% endurance or soemthing

Bumped again ! Agreed !

Tircainen.7169:

I don’t really get, why people are so obsessed with rifles for Thieves. It’s like everybody follows the rule how Snipers are the “coolest thing” in any FPS.
We are in a Fantasy World, not on Battlefield. We are Thieves. We are stealthy, sneaky, we love the shinies!
Anything else but a torch as a first next weapon would seem very odd to me. I was actually surprised in Beta, when I realized, it wasn’t one of our standard weapons.
And you could do a lot with it.

Let anybody else be marksman. Get in there.

Because rifles would be such a cool weapon for thieves to have. Think about it. Would you like to use a rifle in gw2 as a thief. I sure would.

Also, as a first next weapon, I could see a Kyoketsu-shoge [or something whip like], offhand sword, and a 1200 range weapon [rifle or longbow] being implemented.

Yes it should. How the kitten is anyone supposed to “target” something they can’t see. Never made sense. IF you go invisible, you should loose traget. Make it so the skill still channels but it doesn’t follow target it just fires and has a chance to hit the stealthed thief, like it should be

P/D and SHortbow with caltrops works wonders. Its the easiest way to solo a camp and towers. Use caltrops, smoke screen, Shadow refuge and daggers storm.

start by using hide in shadows, run into the camp, lay down caltrops and Smoke screen then dagger storm in smoke screen to get blinding bolts. Then shadow refuge, lay down choking gas and then caltrops again when it has recharged. Then just use P/D to pick off the champion. Works for towers as well

Cufufalating.8479:

Noooope.

I’ve you’d ever encountered a thief + rifle warrior roaming together you’d know that in no way do stealth + long-range mega damage attacks (Killshot) mix to create a fun game.

Rolling killshot and stealth into one class is probably the worst suggestion I’ve ever read on these forums.

Just imagine I was suggesting we give a stealth utility to warriors… thats how bad it sounds.

These skills were just ideas and I never said add killshot to stealth. I left the damage and everything out, just some basic skill ideas were put down. Sure, some were probably OP in heinsite but it would be nice to see a rifle on a thief, even if the skills were nothing like this. We lack a 1200 range weapon and a rifle would fit so nicely into long range damage and really give us that stealthy feel as we pick off targets.

Since new weaponskills and weapons will probably be on the horizon soon – well i would hope as it is getting rather boring with the same old weapons, I decided to come up with some ideas for rifles for thieves.

Lets see what you guys think

Rifle is high single target damage meant to pick out high priority targets from a long range.

- All 1200 range
Skill 1: Sniper Shot – 3/4 second cast
Shoot a bullet that deal more damage the further away you are Inflicts one stack of vulnerability.

Skill 2: Shadows Retreat – 3 Initiative –
Shadow step away from your foe and blast them with a crippling shot

Skill 3: Furious Shot – 4 Initiative – ½ cast
Fire a piercing shot that grants fury for 5 seconds.

Skill 4: Shot from Shadows – 5 initiative – ½ cast
Stun you foe with a powerful shot – stun duration 1 second

Skill 5: Meld with Shadows – 6 initiative
Gain an active camouflage for 3 seconds that is broken when movement occurs. Gain 5 stacks of might for 5 seconds. Your next attack deals +20% damage.

Skill 6: Stealth Skill – 1-2 second channel
- Headshot – 1500 range
Fire a brutal shot that deals high damage. Also dazes your foe for 2 seconds.

Hey, Just wanted to get people’s opinions. I only roam WvW and duel in SPVP and rune of the strength would be perfect for my build. But im wondering if it may end up being a waste of 100g in case they get nerfed. Do you guys think they are worth the 100g?

Shockwave.1230:

BFMV.3198:

Shockwave.1230:

BFMV.3198:

Shockwave.1230:

This skill isn’t used because it’s a bad use of initiative in most situations.

It impacts 2 weapon sets. S/D and D/D. S/D doesn’t need this skill to be viable. D/D is lacking though.

I think best way to change this skill is to make it a 2 part skill with the first option being a block similar to the Ranger GS skill.

The 1st option block skill effect can be numerous things, but the most interesting in my mind is a 100 unit pull that deals no damage so it doesn’t break stealth and can set up Tactical Strike or Backstab.

While the block is channeling, give the player the option to use dancing dagger in its current incarnation.

In order to make an initiative based block fair it would have to not infinitely block projectiles as some other channel block skills do. At most it should block 2 projectile attacks.

Tweaks to death blossom should also be investigated to make D/D more on par with D/P and S/D

Edit:
On second thought instead of a pull I think a port to behind the blocked attacker is way more balanced than a Cc. The port should have a max distance of melee range

I like your idea of a CC for dagger 4. Maybe throw dagger, if it hits, you then get a second skill to pull your foe to you. This creates a crowd control as well as provides diversity in the weaponsets.

CC on initiative is not allowed unless it’s an 8+ initiative skill. 8 second recharge CC’s is still super frequent, that’s why I changed my mind.

1 word. Headshot.
CC on a 4 initiative skill :P.
Plus, the dagger throw actually has to land first to chain into the pull. It wouldn’t just be a 4 initiative scorpion wire. You throw a dagger, then get to pull your foe, so its balanced fine

It’d be a fair counter arguement, if it wasn’t an interrupt only. Unless you consider interrupts to be crowd control. I consider interrupts to be a form of the idea of control, but not crowd control, as positioning isn’t impacted at all.

True, although I state anything that allows you to have “control” over an enemy, which an interrupt does in a way. Also the wiki states that Daze is in fact crowd control. But I can see your point.

Although you have to admit a crowd control skill or even just SOMETHING different that could be used on dagger 4 would be very nice. Currently, D/P is really the only set where every single skill is used.

Ohh and Shortbow :P

Shockwave.1230:

BFMV.3198:

Shockwave.1230:

This skill isn’t used because it’s a bad use of initiative in most situations.

It impacts 2 weapon sets. S/D and D/D. S/D doesn’t need this skill to be viable. D/D is lacking though.

I think best way to change this skill is to make it a 2 part skill with the first option being a block similar to the Ranger GS skill.

The 1st option block skill effect can be numerous things, but the most interesting in my mind is a 100 unit pull that deals no damage so it doesn’t break stealth and can set up Tactical Strike or Backstab.

While the block is channeling, give the player the option to use dancing dagger in its current incarnation.

In order to make an initiative based block fair it would have to not infinitely block projectiles as some other channel block skills do. At most it should block 2 projectile attacks.

Tweaks to death blossom should also be investigated to make D/D more on par with D/P and S/D

Edit:
On second thought instead of a pull I think a port to behind the blocked attacker is way more balanced than a Cc. The port should have a max distance of melee range

I like your idea of a CC for dagger 4. Maybe throw dagger, if it hits, you then get a second skill to pull your foe to you. This creates a crowd control as well as provides diversity in the weaponsets.

CC on initiative is not allowed unless it’s an 8+ initiative skill. 8 second recharge CC’s is still super frequent, that’s why I changed my mind.

1 word. Headshot.
CC on a 4 initiative skill :P.
Plus, the dagger throw actually has to land first to chain into the pull. It wouldn’t just be a 4 initiative scorpion wire. You throw a dagger, then get to pull your foe, so its balanced fine

Shockwave.1230:

This skill isn’t used because it’s a bad use of initiative in most situations.

It impacts 2 weapon sets. S/D and D/D. S/D doesn’t need this skill to be viable. D/D is lacking though.

I think best way to change this skill is to make it a 2 part skill with the first option being a block similar to the Ranger GS skill.

The 1st option block skill effect can be numerous things, but the most interesting in my mind is a 100 unit pull that deals no damage so it doesn’t break stealth and can set up Tactical Strike or Backstab.

While the block is channeling, give the player the option to use dancing dagger in its current incarnation.

In order to make an initiative based block fair it would have to not infinitely block projectiles as some other channel block skills do. At most it should block 2 projectile attacks.

Tweaks to death blossom should also be investigated to make D/D more on par with D/P and S/D

Edit:
On second thought instead of a pull I think a port to behind the blocked attacker is way more balanced than a Cc. The port should have a max distance of melee range

I like your idea of a CC for dagger 4. Maybe throw dagger, if it hits, you then get a second skill to pull your foe to you. This creates a crowd control as well as provides diversity in the weaponsets.

After looking at my skill bar today, I decided to finally make a post about the skill Dancing Dagger. Now I myself barley use this skill as we all know the problems it has. personally, I find it overlaps with the skill sets ontop of all the problems already facing it.

S/D – Infiltrators strike. This is a gap closer and a far better one, why have Dancing Dagger. I guess you could argue you have to port back to re use infil but still.

D/D – Heartseeker. more damage, more consistent, same initiative cost, better combo finisher. Need I say more

P/D – Body Shot. Always over Dancing Dagger. 1 – 2 second immobilize with a decent projectile >> kittenty Dancing Dagger

So, what I want to see from this post is everyones ideas on how to improve/rework Dancing Dagger.

My suggestion is to remove the god kitten thing and make a new kittening skill ! This is where I want to see everyones ideas ! ! !! !!!!

Roy Cronacher.1576:

I wanted to come in here and clear a few things up. We wanted to add this runeset because it will open up a lot of builds increasing build diversity. Keep in mind we will be adding more options over time to PvP, which currently are not available. We know perplexity is a touchy subject but it has been substantially nerfed. I’ll run through the changes with you guys so you can better understand what is different.

Currently Live: Superior Rune of Perplexity
(1) +28 Condition Damage
(2) 15% Confusion Duration
(3) +55 Condition Damage
(4) 20% chance to cause 3 stacks of confusions for 5s on hit. 15 ICD
(5) +100 Condition Damage
(6) +15% Confusion duration; Causes 5 stacks of confusion for 10 seconds on interrupt. 8s ICD

New Version: Superior Rune of Perplexity
(1) +25 Condition Damage
(2) 10% Confusion Duration
(3) +50 Condition Damage
(4)) 25% chance when struck to inflict 3 stacks of confusion for 5 seconds. 25s ICD
(5) +100 Condition Damage
(6) +20% confusion duration; when you interrupt a foe, cause 5 stacks of confusion for 8 seconds. 15s ICD.

Now here are the changes bonus by bonus
(1) -3 Condition Damage
(2) -5% Confusion Duration
(3) -5 Condition Damage
(4) +5% trigger chance, +10s ICD, changed the trigger from on hit to when you are struck
(5) no change
(6) +5% Confusion Duration, -2s confusion duration, +7s ICD

Granted a few of these changes were done for consistency to align with the entire rune balance pass such as pushing larger boosts towards the later bonuses, but the 4-piece and the 6-piece bonuses are the main areas to look at.

The 4-piece bonus which is changing from an offensive on hit trigger to a when struck trigger will make it much less offensive and controllable in many situations, especially larger team fights. This means it will be harder to ‘spike’ all of the confusion on one target. The ICD of the 4-piece also had 10 seconds added to it which is about a 66% increase in ICD.

The 6-piece bonus is going to have it’s confusion duration decreased by 20%. It also had around a 90% increase in ICD for the trigger as well.

While we do think this runeset is still good, we feel it is in a much better spot after a lot of internal playtesting and when comparing what other sets will now offer.There is a lot that is changing in this build and a lot of different pieces that intertwine together. I want to reiterate that every single runeset in the game has been changed and brought more in line with each other.

kitten this change ! ! I only used 4 perplex just for that 4th slot !
kitten U
kitten U kitten U kitten U!

This better not be kittening real. Source please ! kitten this nerf and kitten u anet if this is for real

Nice man, good to see fellow P/D thieves around. The hate we get today is insane! I have ran this build for WvW since November 2012 and the hate was never this bad haha. But kitten everyone else. We use what we can to kill.

Curiously, why Signet of Shadows over Shadow Refuge. i find SoS redundant. I sued to use but switched it out for shadow step rather quickly when I started. It just seems like such a waste

For gods sake anet, you have an entire WORLD here. You have so much to expand to, You havn’t even finished the continent of Tyria either. Stop this LS bullkitten and take some time off this 2 week content garbage. I would rather wait 6 months and you release cantha/elona and more of Tyria with new races, weapons, skills and the sort. Actually use the map you have and expand the world ! It’s sad to see a game with so much potential go to waste.

To be honest, the cancelled 4th guild Wars 1 campaign, Guild Wars Utopia. If that was released I would go back and play that.

Expansions please!

Thief
• Repel Trap—Trap: Set a trap that launches foes away when triggered.

Is this for real arenanet? An elite skill that is so pathetic, it wouldn’t even pass as a utility. This better not be true otherwise you have no clue about thief. just give us a decent elite skill kitten .

Its pretty much useless in all aspects of the game. Sure it may be used but it really is a terrible terrible skill.

Anet just give us something similar to shadow form from guild wars 1 ! !
X seconds: Enemy Spells can not target you. Evade all attacks. You may still attack. Also breaks stun.

Done ! ! A good thief elite.

That trap is garbage crap and if this is for real then anet, you have no clues about thief and just want to keep giving them crap. The healing skill was trash. Do not give us a trash kitten elite

I’m Against all stealth threads because its just whining people that need to learn to play and stop moaning about stealth. I have disagreed with every single nerf idea or change to stealth.

I do however agree with you on this. Seems like a really good idea and would like to see this implemented.

DanSH.6143:

Stealth is currently over powered.
No one likes fighting stealth-builds because there simply nothing you can do about it. If a thief wants he can enter stealth and escape. Mesmers can be in stealth almost the entire fight while their phantasms keep bursting their target.

A lot of people suggest direct nerfs to stealth, and I think that’s actually not a good idea.
The game shouldn’t have a complicated system to nerf stealth (one of the game’s core feature is simplicity – limited amount of skills/boons/conditions to make the game easy to understand).
And it shouldn’t completely punish stealth builds into a point that thieves and mesmers are free-kills.

I suggest a different approach, which ANet already made the first step into.
Add anti-stealth skills. (not really adding new skills, just adding anti stealth to current under-used skills).
Players should be given tools that they can chose to take over others, in order to deal with stealth builds. Skills like “Sic’ Em!” (though they should be better because sic em is too weak).

This is the list of skill tweaks I think we should have as a start:

Ranger
- Sic Em! (shout skill): The ‘Revealed’ duration should match the actual skill duration, which is 10s.
- Bonfire (torch skill #5): Apply (once) ‘Revealed’ for 5 seconds to nearby foes range.
- Hunter’s Shot (longbow skill #3): Apply ‘Revealed’ for 3 seconds to the target if it hits. by applying Stealth to self and keeping your target in sight it would serve better the concept of the skill.

Engineer
- Analyze (Utility Goggles’ tool belt skill): Apply ‘Revealed’ for 5s to the target.
- Rifled Turret Barrels (trait): Turrets’ active skills apply ‘Revealed’ for 3 seconds to the target if it hits. This might need an ICD of 10 seconds.

Guardian
- Zealot’s Flame (torch skill #4): Apply Revealed to nearby foes as long as the effect is maintained (it can be maintained for 3 seconds).
- Binding Jeopardy (trait): Also apply ‘Revealed’ for 3 seconds on immobilize (currently it only applies vulnerability.

Necromancer
- Banshee’s Wail(trait): Warhorn skills will also apply ‘Revealed’ if on hit.

Elementalist
- Lightning Surge(staff air attunement #2 skill): Apply ‘Revealed’ for 3 seconds to the target on hit.
- Lightning Flash(cantrip teleport skill): Apply ‘Revealed’ for 3 seconds to targets in the radius range(130).

Warrior
- “On My Mark!”(shout skill): Apply ‘Revealed’ for 3 seconds to the target.

Mesmer
- Signet of Midnight(signet skill): Also apply ‘Revealed’ for 3 seconds (on the active part of the signet).

Thief
- Shadow Trap(trap skill): when using Shadow Pursuit on the marked foe it also applies ‘Revealed’ for 3 seconds.

What do you guys think?

What do I think. LOL. I think you need to learn to play because your obviously a bad player that gets killed by thieves and doesn’t want to learn how to counter them. If professions can have anti stealth this is what i want.

Anti revealed trait like, whenever revealed is placed on you from an external source, revealed is removed.

I would also like anti stun skills against warriors, anti tool kit against engineers, anti phantasms against mesmers, anti fear/deathshroud against necros, anti healing and blocks against guardians, anti attunements [ie ele can not switch], and against rangers. hmm I can not actually think of one. How about anti pets/

There we go, if you want anti stealth that negates an entire trait line and makes thieves have literally 0 defense in an xv1 because if I try to fight 2v1 or 3v1 I will be revealed the entire fight, then I want immunity to revealed and counters to other classes.

Learn to play before whining on the forums. Just go pack to PvE where you belong because you obviously suck at SPVP and WvW

How about no. Just stop whining for nerfs for thief and l2p. If you say you don’t need to learrn to play then you can deal with blocking and not being revealed because you now know where they are.

No mercy. I fight dirty and use any tactic to defeat my enemies

Both power D/P and D/D are in fact viable for WvW roaming. It just depends on what you would prefer. From my experiences [P/D thief for 12 months], I can honestly say it has been a build that I have never switched from for roaming, and all I do in guild Wars 2 is WvW roam. Once you learn the build inside out you can really go places with it. Solo towers, Solo camps, Xv1 and survive !
It really is a fun build in my opinion and I am keen to see what the new Runes and Sigils updates can do for this build =]

WvW roaming run P/D condi full dire gear with koi cakes and tuning crystals. You will be pretty tough to take down and able to hold your own against 2-3 good players

Due to the new revealed skills, I am re igniting this old thread of mine that takes the thief into a more evasive gameplay, and also to spark suggestions about new skills that remove revealed/ make us immune to revealed.

I would love to see implemented to the thief down the track new weapons and weaponskills and utilities that focus more on being slippery through blocks and parry’s and evasion [Flashing Blades(gw1 skill), Critical defenses(gw1 skill)/more shadowsteps]. Right now thieves rely heavily on stealth for survival and im ok with that because I love my thief >:D.

Weapons like kyoketsu-shoge could be a 2 handed weapon that rely on complete evasion to become effective and shadow stepping around your opponents. I will put up some skill ideas in a future post to show you what I think. These would of course utilize stealth but will be much more heavily geared towards evasion.

In a future post, I will put up some skill/utility ideas that will give you some idea of what I’m thinking.
The first idea is Shadow Form, also a gw1 assassin skill, which could be a new Guild Wars 2 thief elite

X seconds: Enemy Spells can not target you. Evade all attacks. You may still attack. Also breaks stun. This would be a great way to start gearing towards the evasion builds and would really bring out some unique thief gameplay.

The second Flashing Blades: Elite or utility
X seconds, 75% chance to evade attacks. Whenever you successfully evade an attack, your attacker takes X damage

Those are my first few ideas.

Suggestions welcome =]

AS well as these new evasion skills, I want to see skills that make us immune to revealed/ removed revealed.

Like Blinding Powder. Removes revealed before stealthing and blinding:

I will explain: we were walking to SM at that time. We had 1 underlvld dude I believe. The thief player backstabbed a lvl 80 (war) for almost half of his health. Our group imidiatly responded on that. I as necro put marks around us, the ranger used entrangle , dunno what the others really did, but they stayed with us. (I had contact with the ranger trough Skype). We thought we hit the thief for much. But he just came out of stealth with his health full. after that the group attacked again. I remember the war useing that number 3 GS skill (sry don t know how it is called) at the thief (somehow thief makes him downed). Thief goes into stealth again. ( I said alright he only has 1 stealth utility over and that is refugee (almost all of these thiefs use refugee)). So our mesmer guildy (condi) comes with us. That made us 8. I said to the mesmer (which came on Skype too) alright put chaos storm in the refugee if he goes stealth (that was quite helpfull last time we fought against one of those). So the thief became unstealthed again (again with full health and no condis) So I fear the thief , our group imidiatly start attacking the guy. The guy puts a shadow refugee (like I had anticipated) , mesmer puts chaos storm up at the area of refugee . I said he is deff down. But he came back with full health + no condi s. My ranger buddy said the thief was hacking. He was just messing around with the group. after that he downed our underlvld guy (our bad we didn t res the guy and the guy dies). After that he just used the same skills over and over again (D5 I believe + blinding powder). He started downing alot of our char (I was the only one which was ressing but he finished quite quickly in stealth (so our bad again). After some time (15 minutes orso) he had killed 4 dudes and we were kited in a small part of EB (our bad again). ( I thought those dudes come back (because it is our low lands and they want revenge , but nobody came back). So we were with 4 he uses the same tricks over and over again. We had a guard , ranger , mesmer and necro. I said to the ranger and mesmer (stand in my marks if he wants to come to use he has to trigger them and we will dodge after the trigger), Sadly the guard followed him to Hylek , guard was downed quick (mayble we should have followed him , but the hylek were from the thiefs team). So it was 1 v 3. As I anticipated the thief triggered my (renewed) mark we dodge and mesmer puts on chaos field at the place were my mark was. The thief becomes visble again gets 2 good hits on the ranger. Ranger pops heal , he pops ranger steal (in inv) (I know he used combo water with dagger 2). He gets 2 hits again on ranger. Ranger gets downed mesmer follows thief I res ranger. Ranger is ressed. He starts jamming of our mesmer , I say run back! Too late he downed him, we try to save mesmer but mesmer gets finished. So we are with 2, I said to the mesmer run back! , He goes full on ranger , ranger I fear him away try to res ranger but he fears me away with his steal. He finishes ranger, but was quite low thx to terror. I imidiatly go full on him get him in stealh with DS 2, I thought now I have him. He came out of stealth not full so I started trowing everything at him (even corrupt boon (he had vigor and might)), so he started dodgeing alot and returns in stealth thx to a drake. After that he stuns me comes back with full health + no condis, he gets some big hits of. I use DS (gives him weakness), Ds somehow gets destroyed very quickly, I tried useing my heal skill , but he downed me and went back in stealth for the finish.

Lol, i say kudos to the thief that managed to kill 8 players because, even though all of you were obviously terrible, killing 8 players requires alot of skill . You guys are terrible players that need to learn to play because if a thief can kill 8 of you, your terrible and should leave WvW or, next time you see a thief, just forget about him/her and keep going. A warrior healing signet heals for more than Shadows rejuvenation and doesn’t require ANY investment and is active all the time [unless warrior heals]. So stop whining.

Also, if the thief back-stabbed the warrior for half his health, then you are saying he hit an approx 15k backstab, which is insanely high. That warrior is terrible as warriors are so tanky at this point in time and should NOT be getting hit for that. L2P issue for everyone here.

Lol, Im sorry Lordhelmos but this is just making me laugh. Thieves are already one of the most under powered professions. I love that thieves have received so many nerfs that people are complaining about things that are absolutely fine. Infact, Hide in Shadows should remove torment as well.

I can’t wait for the day where the profession becomes so useless that it HAS to receive some buffs

Vital shot needs a large buff. Thats all I have to say. I just hope the Dev’s read this because it is a really poor auto attack for pistols.

Edit /04/05/14: It’s great to see this post pop back up and see so many great ideas being posted. Hopefully we have the Dev’s interested by now and if not, hopefully we can soon.

I believe what Vital shot needs is greater direct damage and reduced after cast, that way it can stack bleeds for p/d and maintain DPS for P/P. It would be nice to see it twice as fast, although that’s probably pushing it a bit

100% I want the Assassin back. I loved it in Gw1 !

You have some interesting ideas here and I like how you have tried to think of something unique, especially Assassinate. However things like scapegoat would have to be at 25% health as doing it at 1% would not work. I really love Disorientation however that is extremely OP. 3 stacks to nearby foes on stealth is too much. Would have to be 1 stack to nearby foes whenever you stealth at the MAX.

Stifled screams is interesting but how would you be able to stomp them if they are stealthed?

Geiir.7603:

I see way too many posts about people who want more hard counters to stealth, but that’s not what this game need. A hard counter to stealth would be a 1-button-to-win skill against a thief. What we need to do is to change stealth so it forces the thief player to be more tactical about entering stealth, and not just spam it mindlessly.

I’ve had these ideas for quite some time and I’ve thrown them out in different threads over the last year. I’m posting this now as a thread by itself because I think this need some attention. If we don’t help Anet with ideas on how to improve it I think they’ll mess up and give us a wrong nerf (by maybe adding more skill that directly counter stealth and thieves in general). So, here it goes.

1. Stealth can’t stack.
At least not stealth from weapon skills and combos. This would fix the number one problem that people have with the thief; dagger/pistol. It’s really the only weapon set that people complain about, and it’s by far the ultimate troll set in this game. Access to stealth on-demand that doesn’t require any skill at all to use? I find it cheesy and unnecessary.

Why I think that stealth shouldn’t stack?
Because it would really force the thief to think twice before wasting initiative on it. It would force d/p thieves to be more tactical about attacking an enemy force. It’s too cheap of a weapon set and it can make the worst thief seem like a hero fighting off a larger force. Which he isn’t., he’s abusing a mechanic to troll other people. It isn’t helping the game or the thief achieve anything other than frustration/feeling of accomplishment.

I don’t want this to apply to stacking stealth using utility skills or heals.
Not even in combination with weapon skill. I feel that this should apply to weapon skills and combos only. This because utility skills should be strong and after using those skills the thief will be very vulnerable and open for attacks. They don’t need a nerf in my opinion.

2. Revealed debuff when leaving stealth.
This is a huge one, and some of you might think I’m crazy, but read it through please. I want the “Revealed” debuff to be applied every time the thief leave stealth, wether he attack or not. This would really, and I mean really, force the thief to be more tactical and think twice before stealthing. We either have to run, or we have to attack.

I think that this would change the mentality of many thieves. We won’t just spam stealth mindlessly or Cloak and Dagger off critters just to heal ourself, we would actually have to think. This would definitely help forcing thieves to become more skillful and would highly increase the skill floor/roof.

Cheers!

I half agree with you on number 1: I think I should be able to stack stealth using Utilities but not through weaponskills. That way if people want to CnD or BP/HS then use blinding powder, SR or HiS then thats fine, it should stack. But maybe making BP/HS not able to stack could fix the problem.

2. Absolutely not. Arena net were going to implement this a while back and decided it was a stupid idea and didn’t, thankfully. Its tactical to use CnD to re stealth instead of attacking. Because it actually makes us think, do we bide our time or do we attack. With this idea, it makes me think, ohh i better run now as i can’t re stealth and recalculate and will just make thieves feel very limited in battle. This is a really stupid idea.

NinjaEd.3946:

Well for shadow strike for p/d could use a torment buff. It currently deals direct damage twice, and applies a mere 5 second torment. Even if they buffed the stacks to 3 for 5seconds that would be great, you can’t easily spam (and shouldn’t) this skill, so for the short time it lasts let it do its job a little better.

I personally think p/x can remain the same condition/power build just rework where its skills effects come from. For example make the aa hit harder direct damage and keep its weak bleed but buff sneak attack to apply a much longer bleed base (8 seconds or more). Since p/d is more of a condi set than p/p, you will still have stealth access to justify sneak attack being your primary bleed source. P/p will have a more suitable aa since they don’t enter stealth as easy and buff unload to deal increased damage every hit (2% per successful hit, cap at 10%?). This would drastically improve ricochet (not that its horrible atm) to make reaching that bonus damage fairly easy. Each cast of unload would ofc reset that counter so you can’ sit at 10% bonus damage for everything.

I kinda wish dancing dagger was replaced with some poison source. P/d has no poison access on its own, and torment isn’t all that impressive so its just bleeds for the most part doing your work, and condition removal will reset all that work. Like if dancing dagger was replaced with

Venomous trickery- Throw a dagger that bounces between and cripples foes (3s). The last target is punctured by the time bomb(4 seconds, does not stack). Combo Finisher: Physical Projectile. 3 initiative
->Detonate- Detonate your time bomb to create a poison field at your target’s location. Field duration 3 seconds, field radius 120 units. 3 second poison per pulse, pulses every second. Combo Field: Poison. 2 initiative.

You’d still be able to keep the cripple effect for chasing (although body shot would be better even if it costs 1 more initiative) or spend a bit more initiative for a field you can combo off. Usually 1-5 weapon skills the last 2 are something special and for pistol it is, but for dagger only CnD means something. Even in wvw it would be good, because you can throw it onto a stack and have them collect all that poison and reduce their heals without getting so close with sb and risk being choo choo trained.

I wouldn’t give thief confusion so easily, especially if its spammable. We already have such short lasting conditions because of our inititive system its why we lack sufficient condition duration compared to ranger or necro or engineer. I’d leave it, d/p doesn’t benefit from DoT and for ranged direct damage neither does p/p.

You make some good points here and I like what you suggest. Poison would be nice on a P/D set although i’d much rather see burning on either pistol 2 or dagger 4. We can get a poison from steal from 5 in deadly arts, which is good enough for now but poison on dagger 4 wouldn’t be bad at all. If dagger 4 was to have poison I would much rather it be a quick dagger strike that leaves them crippled and poisoned, because Dancing dagger is so terrible with LoS. I feel it overlaps too much with Body Shot, which does a far better job at gap closing.

I see what you mean about the confusion for pistol 4 however, I don’t think 1 stack would be terrible, as spamming would only give 4 stacks max from 16 initiative and that would leave you well and truly vulnerable.

I agree that Shadow Strike could do with a torment buff. 3 would be nice as it is 96% impossible to spam unless you are on the edge of a cliff or similar haha.

Quoted:[I personally think p/x can remain the same condition/power build just rework where its skills effects come from. For example make the aa hit harder direct damage and keep its weak bleed but buff sneak attack to apply a much longer bleed base (8 seconds or more). Since p/d is more of a condi set than p/p, you will still have stealth access to justify sneak attack being your primary bleed source]
I understand what you are saying about the auto attack for pistols as you have access to stealth on P/D however, that still doesn’t justify what an auto attack should do. It should be the bread and butter for the set. A buff to sneak attack would be nice but its not necessary. Right now, Vital shot needs a 20% damage increase and needs its aftercast delay reduced so that it can fire 4x in 2.50 seconds instead of 2x in 2.50 seconds.

So basically, pistols have been in a bad way since the beginning of time [Guild Wars 2 time that is], and us thieves have been asking anet repeatedly to fix this weaponset so that it becomes useable in SPVP, WvW and even PvE hopefully, although i only care about WvW and SPVP. I think that Pistols should be made into a condition only set for both P/D and P/P. This will mean anet can focus on skills that work well together and don’t try to overlap with doing both condition and damage. That means rework the auto attack and rework unload first.

What I would like to see for P/D and P/P is the ability to stack multiple conditions, rather than be stuck trying to stack bleeds and doing a poor job of that.

Firstly, sneak attack+ vital shot:
This skill is fine as it is, stacks some nice bleeds and does the job.

Vital shot needs a large buff. It needs to have a damage increase and fire twice as fast as it does now at least. This skill needs to properly stack bleeds or, it needs to be made into a fast acting chain that stacks multiple conditions. THis is the auto attack and should be the bread and butter for the build. Make it so that it is able to do its job and get those conditions down fast.

Second: Body shot
The immobilize on body shot was a nice addition and I have found it to be useful however its a little short. 1.5 seconds base seems a little better. Also anet, remove the vulnerability because it is useless and replace it with something worthwhile. I myself would love to see burning added to the thieves kitten nal. Currently, we are the only profession that can not burn in any way, save the use of terrible runes. I also remember one in one of the earlier interviews that arena net wanted to give thieves access to burning and I remember them saying they wanted to create something like “burning shot,” which sounds very much like pistols to me. I also remember them relating that to skill 2. So why not remove the terrible vulnerability that no one likes, and make body shot burn and immobilize.

Third: Shadow Strike
Shadow strike for P/D is good as it is I feel although any suggestions would be welcome that would help improve it.

Fourth:
Unload for P/P is the Problem. I am not going to go over this again as you can read the problems in multiple threads but basically, it fights with auto attack as the main source of damage and uses initiative in the process. Just rework this skill to lay some conditions/ remake a P/P dual skill that could fit with the condition only. P/P currently has know way to access stealth. Why not make the P/P duel skill

“rapidly fire 2 shots at your opponent, the first applies torment and the second stealth’s you.” this is probably too good but something like this would not go astray. P/P needs a way to enter stealth.

Fith: Dancing DaggerFor P/D
Dancing dagger is useless. Body shot does a much better job in most cases, does not become obstructed like Dancing dagger and is not a waste of initiative like dancing dagger. This skill also overlaps with S/D and infiltrators strike. It even overlaps with D/D and heartseeker. Just get rid of this terrible skill and replace it with a useful skill for offhand dagger that will help D/D, S/D and P/D.

Sixth: HeadshotFor P/P
Headshot is fine, but I think it could do with stacking 1-2 confusion.

P/D – cloak and dagger, absolutely amazing skill, no problems with this skill do not touch it.

P/P – black powder also fine

Any suggestions would be welcome

I think its time Anet finally gave us Burning. We are the only profession that can’t burn and anet stated in one of the game interviews about 6 months ago that they wanted us to have access to burning.

Rifle – A very high single damage target weapon at 1200 range. To give us that Sniper feel.
Hidden Blades – These would be used for extremely quick strikes. Mostly evading around the enemy and attacking from the shadows with shadowsteps.
Shurikens – probably offhand only
Kyoketsu-shoge – would pretty much be Whips but with the added flair and fit the theme of the thief. 900 range with good CC and DPS as well as being very slippery

I would like to see as either a thief elite or as an F2 profession skill something similar to Guild Wars 1 Shadow Form for assassins.

Maybe as an elite – X seoncds: Enemy Spells can not target you. Evade all attacks. You may still attack
As a profession skill. Evade all attacks for X seconds. Siphon X life from your foe whenever you successfully evade an attack

I would love to see something like this implemented to give evasion thieves something more to work with and a really good elite, although we do have some good elites already

It’s ridiculous how anet has ignored this trait for so long. It has been complained about since release and STILL nothing has been done. It’s not even a tough fix! This is just lazy from anet.

To fix simply add “Immune to revealed for 1 second,” as most of the complaints come from being revealed from a channeled attack.

I nominate Helios Angara.9520. Now I know this is meant to be for kind acts in Guild Wars 2 however, this guy deserved his nomination far before this in Guild Wars 1. I’m nominating him for the acts of kindness he has given to me and other people in Guild Wars 1. He was known as the “legendary zkey farmer” when introduced to me by another friend, as he farmed MANY zkeys and gave most of them away. They were worth 5k[platinum] in Gw1 a piece and he gave Hundreds away to people, people he barley knew in order to help them out. His kindness extends to me and he helps me farm my Obsidian Armor set, the best armor set in Gw1 worth quite a bit, by farming alot of zkeys and asking nothing in return. This act of kindness as well as the many others he helped out before then I have never forgotten and will always be thankful for. I think Helios deserves a random acts of kindness reward for being a loyal and faithful friend and player to strangers, guildies, alliances and friends alike in the Guild Wars industry, since 2006.