If they based the Sylvari off anything, I’d go with dryads. Tree/plant people really aren’t that uncommon in fantasy. Like Ents!
That’s very well executed! It retains the style of art used in a lot of the GW2 imagery, but still has a unique flavor to it.
What media did you use? Digital? Watercolor? Digital watercolor?
Do you have a portfolio/DA page somewhere where you offer commissions? (you can PM me, if you’d like)
^
The Sylvari are not that much more connected to plants than a human is to a mouse. They are omnivores after all. I mean… come on, they have a farm right outside the grove. And harvest fruit barely ten paces from the farm.
Besides, the pumpkin is already dead after being removed from the plant. Its purpose is to rot and feed the seeds, so carving it up doesn’t matter.
This is just a bad idea, it really is. Anet has lost a lot of my trust with my event. While I love a lot of it, a lot of it is well… shady and clunky. There is no real reason to exclude so many people, even Americans who the time is set for! If I had known about this soon enough I could have taken Sunday off at least but without enough warning and the poor timing I’ll miss it because I’m working.
I really don’t think I’ll be doing much more of the event other than mess with the giant mine-able candy corn if this is how they intend to treat it. This has just killed my motivation to do more than that.
I’m dissapointed with Anet over all this. For a while I could only think of how well everything in the game worked so nicely. (To an extent, dungeon bugs, etc) But now I rather go punch the WoW Halloween boss some more. At least I get to see his grand entrance whenever I want and his events repeat. I dunno, to me it feels like they’re slipping bit by bit.
I’m pretty peeved about this. I’ll be missing it by an hour or two because, gee whizz, I have to work! :/ The whole “appealing to the highest peek of players” works for stuff like down time. Downtime for fixing bugs and patches is needed, you can’t avoid it, so then it makes sense to sometimes annoy the players that are on less.
This event? No. No that’s dumb. There is no good reason they could not have worked around to make this a more than one time thing.
Spoiling it by seeing it before the event? Oh so it’s better to see it afterwards when you can never see the real deal? This just reeks of poor decisions. Seeing the event on youtube will not be the same and it would have been so incredably easy to make this event viewable by anyone that had a smiggen of time on Sunday to get on.
(edited by Ba air.1372)
Most of the Wardens seem to be ranger, which works nicely for Sylvari. I have an unhealthy amount of Sylvari of various professions though. I picked elementalist for my first plant because he was based on an outside character… and a tree man breathing fire is just amazing on so many levels.
Any profession can make sense easily for Sylvari, even a deranged engineer. They’re curious and love to learn new things. Personally I prefer Sylvari rangers over others because you can start with a lovely fern hound.
I like this idea. It really shouldn’t be so hard to get some silly halloween skins but I don’t see the harm in some being hard to get. I’d be happy with some silly skins to run around in for a week and then forget. Everyone gets something without destroying any of the precious rarity.
Why is something not cool if everyone has it? That’s ridiculous . If it’s cool to you, it’s cool. If it’s coolness relies on it being rare then what’s the point? Oooh, I have this rare thing that I actually don’t like, but holy kitten, other people don’t have it!
That exact same scenario applies pretty much everywhere in life so I dont see where youre going with that.
Look, there are so many things in this event to do, why let the fact that you didnt get a skin ruin it?
Um? That’s it’s petty and silly to not like something as much just because it’s common. The skins don’t matter to me period as I don’t have the patience or desire for them. The argument that them being common would make them less cool is eye roll worthy though. (I see this argument time and time again in WoW players, it’s not any better with them.)
Why is something not cool if everyone has it? That’s ridiculous . If it’s cool to you, it’s cool. If it’s coolness relies on it being rare then what’s the point? Oooh, I have this rare thing that I actually don’t like, but holy kitten, other people don’t have it!
Like Ganzicus said, it goes: Story option one for the first ten levels, story option two for the next ten levels, then the order picking to level thirty, and lastly you hit the main overarching storyline which involves your order but your choices have little impact at this point.
It doesn’t look like a child to me, it just looks like they’re farther away.
You might just have to gloss over a lot of the story as far as how your character takes it, at least for the first 10 levels or so worth of story. Pretty much all of them try to do away with chaos. I feel that the White Stag line goes most directly against chaos and destruction though, so probably not the best.
I think a big problem with the argument that the NC might not be evil is that you have to see the problem from an extremely detached mindset to think that.
Imagine, instead of the big picture that maybe they have a point, that your friend has gone missing. Maybe they’re dead, maybe they’re shaking in a cell awaiting their turn to be mutilated, or maybe they’ve joined the court and they won’t hesitate to go after you. Your partner’s gone missing. Are they being tortured now? Are they being made an example to the others; rotting in a cell to sicken their cellmates? They could be fine, but they wouldn’t go out for days without telling you…
Is it safe to step out of your home? Stray too far from the path and the nightmare hounds might be at your heels. If you survive, will you have wanted to? If the only way you got away was because you ran faster than the others, how would you deal with the guilt knowing they suffer so you could escape?
Would you be able to see their good side when your captors are laughing and debating how to slice up you and your friends today like you would discuss what you’re having for lunch? Imagine having to make the choice to let them torture you to death or becoming one of them and doing the same to your loved ones.
I based these questions based on what npcs in the game have faced from the Nightmare Court. Are they real people? No, but you can’t completely remove the human, or Sylvari in this case, element from this. Even if the Court did have a valid point, it doesn’t, what they’re doing is downright evil. They attack innocents without remorse. Hell, they even go after non-Sylvari. I’ve had to rescue several packs of Skritt just today.
It doesn’t really matter what others call themselves, so long as it isn’t offensive.
Why does some one being offended give them more rights than some else?
I know mmos tend to have there own rules to keep the peace that would other wise be unconstitutional.
But this way of thinking is really getting out of hand.
Simple, you are causing discomfort to another player. Anet would like to keep players happy. You might be slightly displeased to have to pick a reasonable name but less likely to quit than someone that sees Anet not fixing offensive things.
Unconstitutional does not factor into the argument in the slightest. A private company like Anet gets to say what does and does not go on their game. The freedom of speech applies only to the government.
As for the plant names… eh, it’s pretty typical stuff for any game where you can name your character. The about of Tauren (for those that don’t play wow, they’re cow people) named something with “beef” in it is staggering.
Your guild sounds pretty awesome but I have a question… I play wow in addition to gw2 and it takes up more of my time as I am a casual (two-three nights a week) raider. I likely wouldn’t be able to make a lot of the guild nightly events because of raid times. Would I still be welcome as a casual/social member otherwise? I mainly want a place to have some friends while I level, explore, and a little rp.
I do a lot of gathering and bouncing around low level zones, so I’m happy to donate supplies and help others with leveling.
The skin color just looks like one of the lighter greens. Maybe mint. The hair is probably just white or a light gray. I think the only part of her that’s not in character creation is the face model.
Very lovely, do you have a deviantart account or something similar with more of your work?
Basically they are pansexual. (I think) They like who they like, which is nothing wrong with but I agree, alot of same sex relationships, they shouldve eased that down abit for the people that have a problem with it. I don’t have a problem with it at all , let the be clear.
Lolwut? No, no they should have not. It’s eased down enough in every day life, all two somewhat obvious homosexual relationships in the entire game do not need to be erased because someone doesn’t like gays. They can be butts out in the real world and deal with it in the game. If anything needs to be eased down, it’s the amount of hetereosexual relationships. Like someone else said, it would be more realistic to have more homosexual relationships, especially with the Sylvari!
Someone will always have a problem with something in a game. You can’t please everyone and these couples aren’t hurting anyone. Well Faolin isn’t exactly healthy for Caithe but that’s a whole different kettle of fish.
I’ve never said it should be erased. Read. c:
And how would you ease them down without erasing them? You can’t do that without removing them from the storyline, which, frankly, would be gross. Gays can’t be part of the story because someone might get offended by the whole three minutes the random gay npcs are on screen? That’s not right and it’s hardly like they’re any more obnoxious or in your face than any other couple in the game.
The Moon Shield storyline was about a thousand times more mushy and agonizing than the Green Knight couple or Caithe and her issues. It is a very predjudiced idea that they should be removed from the storyline to be more palatable when they are no different than any other couple. Hell, at least the Green Knight lovers have the excuse of being bright eyed saplings to explain how mushy they were. The Moon Shield heterosexual couple… not so much and man were they whiny.
Basically they are pansexual. (I think) They like who they like, which is nothing wrong with but I agree, alot of same sex relationships, they shouldve eased that down abit for the people that have a problem with it. I don’t have a problem with it at all , let the be clear.
Lolwut? No, no they should have not. It’s eased down enough in every day life, all two somewhat obvious homosexual relationships in the entire game do not need to be erased because someone doesn’t like gays. They can be butts out in the real world and deal with it in the game. If anything needs to be eased down, it’s the amount of hetereosexual relationships. Like someone else said, it would be more realistic to have more homosexual relationships, especially with the Sylvari!
Someone will always have a problem with something in a game. You can’t please everyone and these couples aren’t hurting anyone. Well Faolin isn’t exactly healthy for Caithe but that’s a whole different kettle of fish.
Heh, the road by my house is “Sylvan.”
This is my feeling on MMORPGs (Not RPGs, specifically MMORPGs) making You, the Player Character, The Hero: It doesn’t work. The very concept is immersion breaking. Being A Hero works, but not The Hero.
I seriously have never understood this issue. What’s so hard about ignoring the fact that other players are playing through the same story? How is it any different than two people playing the same singleplayer RPG? I don’t see how my personal story is cheapened in any way because someone else played through their personal story. I don’t look at other players and think, “Oh no, they’re all supposedly buddies with Destiny’s Edge too. I guess I’m not special.” I don’t see other players as factoring into the story, and I don’t think you’re supposed to.
Well why should you have to ignore that others play the game? I’m not saying the highly personal story is really that bad but it does horribly break the immersion of the story. In a single player game you are not constantly surrounded by the evidence that everyone else is the chosen one and there is a lot more impact from your character in a single player RPG that an MMO really can’t live up to.
The story isn’t bad but from a character building standpoint I can’t regard it as much more as a pretty cinematic that happens every so often after I beat up a lot of things. It’s not a feeling of not being special, it’s more that it’s just so glaringly obvious you aren’t the big awesome hero the story says that it falls flat. The model where you are a hero but not THE hero works nicely because it balances you doing something impressive and heroic without having to ignore that everyone else in the game world is THE hero to feel immersed.
The story I like but I can’t say it’s very personal.
Let’s not get this thread locked down with a religious debate. That’s not needed nor the point of the thread. Homosexual relationships in this game aren’t any more forced or cringe worthy than the straight ones, especially with the Sylvari.
MY BELOVED~
So what, exactly, makes an elementalist “challenging”? Switching your attunements? I’m confused.
Keep in mind everyone, a guardian can wield more than a greatsword.
Maybe the reason you’re having trouble with other professions is because you’re attached to your elementalist. I know I’m having a hard time playing anything other than my engineer; I switch my kits just as much as an elementalist switches their attunemenets, and it’s not that hard.
Just attunement switching? Not in the slightest. The class is insanely squishy and basically requires good knowledge of the four attunements and their use back to back to be at their best. Switching weapons on another class does not even come close, especially on Guardian. Basically each attunement is less effective than a weapon kit or weapon so switching attunements doesn’t mean new set of skills that work just as well, it means a set of skills you have to combo with the other three sets to be effective. It’s not switching so much as juggling.
(You can get away with just fire if you’re just wandering around and PvE leveling but anything harder makes that pretty ineffective. )
Eh, the only thing that’s even mildly bothered me is how hard it is to get a screenshot of my main’s face because he doesn’t keep his head still. I like their running animations to be honest.
Oy, let’s keep the whining about Ele problems to a min in here! There are a million threads for that!
And to Albrizz, Guardian is pretty fun… it’s just really simple with a greatsword. I do tend to go to my little guardian for a break sometimes though. X)
this thread is funny as all get out you must love being in a constant downed state with abilities that do nothing and spending TONS of gold to fix your items every second. Ele is ruined for me I loved it is GW1 but they screwed us hard core in GW2
Majority of playing experience > the occasional times I’m downed. Most of the time I die it’s because I’ve fallen off a cliff/bridge/annoying high place. Yeah it’s easier to get downed as an Elementalist but I hardly spend “tons of gold to fix my items.” I will say that that aspect of Elementalist is somewhat of a skill issue.
Deputy Mira makes Trahearne’s voice seem emotional and inspiring in comparison. It’s really hard not to laugh during that quest with how horrendously bored she sounds with all the death and dying going on.
From what I’ve seen in the books: Sylvari bleed (it oozes rather than gushes), can be poisoned, and can eat meat with no problem. Caithe even gets drunk enough to pass out in one of the books. There’s really no “pure lore” to go back on there, they pretty much suffer what they do in the game mechanics from bleeding to hunger. It’s mentioned that they can get “feverish” as well, so they can get ill.
I think they need special healers because the makeup of their bodies are so different, not really because every system they have is different, it’s just not made quite the same.
As for sharing human illnesses… likely not very common. The viruses and bacteria would probably have a problem adapting or affecting the different blood/immune system. Stuff like fungal rot seems more on the dot, it’s mentioned by a healer in the Grove.
The lack of recognition from the Pale Tree made me sad. Hello, she’s the mother of all sylvari, how could she forget one of her kids completely? The dialogue ignoring what race you are really takes me out of the story.
I agree with this
Devildoc.6721:Key word is subtle, all these sexual orientation things need to be subtle.
And I have no problem with the orientation either just needs to be subtle becasue we do not know what some of the players age ranges are.
Orientations outside hetreosexual aren’t something that needs to be hidden from children. :I OMG!!! Our kids learn to be accepting and realize that not everyone is like mommy and daddy?!
Seriously this is just gross. Besides, I’m pretty sure this game is T rated anyways.
I wouldn’t say that it’s really the challenge that appeals to me Oghier, but the necessary fast pace of the class. Like I said, I’m not that good. I play most of my games on easy mode. Playing some other classes as they should be played just takes a lot of the bit of leveling to me. Not much really feels like a threat and purposefully shooting myself in the foot to get the same experience is not what I’m after. I like the guardian skillset, it’s really really fun, but I just don’t get much time to use it.
I have a hard time saying I’m in that small minority that just likes the game to be hard. This is just what I started with so now the rest of the game just doesn’t feel right to be able to faceroll over waves of risen with little problem. I’m really really not trying to sound like one of the hardcore people that want everything as hard as possible, there are a lot of times I’ve gone to chill in the Grove and talk to NPCs because leveling was getting so frustrating.
The playstyle of ele itself is just so different from everything else I’ve tried, it feels like a completely different game to breeze through everything on a warrior or thief.
I think a lot could be done for ele in terms of making atunement switching and combos a bit more fluid. Right now it still feels rather clunky but overall I’m not displeased with the class. Again, though, I only PvE and don’t PvP so I can’t speak much for damage where it matters.
Note: I play PvE exclusively, no PvP
I keep trying to play other classes but I rarely play for more than 30 minutes on anything but my Elementalist. Why? Well… most of them are just too… easy? I tried a warrior and got bored. My ranger, I love, but there’s so little effort when I can switch between long and short bow. Mesmer I need to work on more and for thief, the resource system doesn’t restrict the buttkicking in the slightest.
As for guardian:
- Aw yeah! Gather up all the mobs!
- DODGE ROLL- oh… they’re already dead.
- Pull more
- DODGE RO- oh they’re already dead.
- Stays still and spams greatsword skills.
- Woo?
What do you all think? Have trouble getting into other classes where you don’t have to fight tooth and nail against anything much tougher than a deer? (Exaggeration, please no “LOL NOOB” comments…) I started out as an elementalist and was shocked that almost everything else doesn’t have the same fast paced, dodge heavy crazyness. I stick mostly to D/D (with staff for any tough elites I stumble on to be group support).
I was talking with a guildie yesterday about this and he feels the same way about Necromancer (which I haven’t tried). How we see it, it’s not quite as fun if you don’t come out of a good fight by the skin of your teeth.
I don’t want to come across as an elitist that thinks that ele is only for the best. I’m, in general, not a very good player, I’m fairly clumsy and die a lot, but I really enjoy the be-quick-or-die nature of this class. Most other classes just don’t seem to come close to that feeling. (This isn’t a criticism of other classes, not at all, this is just personally what I enjoy. )
61 Sylvari Elementalist 9/10
I have some minor annoyances but so far the rest of the game makes up for it.
What if they just like the look of the gear? Cry noob all you want but I don’t see the point of hating on people that don’t have the “dedication” you want them to. Being judgmental because of someone’s choice of dungeon or gear is just silly. You go enjoy your harder dungeons and “superior” gear. What is this? WoW?
Well the re-distributeing aggro thing is probably the key there. When you can’t, good luck, it sucks. I did the priory line where you’re stuck in a cramped tomb. There is no escape.
6+ Risen on the Priory line with taking a single attack Mazdek is half my health… yeah no. :/ The only way I got it done with my thief buddy standing outside the aggro range of the risen while edging back and forth at max range from Mazdek.
Mazdek RUINED Caithe, Iowerth, and Trahearne in under a minute when he got bored of savaging me.
I doubt the Sylvari and blueberries are related either. Trees have different species and all…
No Caladbolg is just kitten. :/ Doing that mission on an elementalist at level with no access to my elements was horrible! I had to call in a friend to kick the Lich’s butt for me.
Ahhh, I really hate how they handled a lot of the quests past level 30 for Sylvari. The Pale Tree forgot who I am, Treahwhatshisname remembers me and then forgets not two dialogue lines later, and it all feels very “Hello ‘insert name here’”.
I love my Sylvari Elementalist to bits, but I’ll agree with others and say the class is a lot harder. Thief is faceroll compared to Ele.
I would try the Thief playstyle first and see if you like it. I’ve seen my friend’s thief in action, he’s really scary with her. The armor is neat to boot.
““If the sylvari are to survive, we must learn from the poison thorn and the stinging nettle, the vine that crushes the very sapling which holds it to the light. We will raise the nightmare. We will see Tyria remade in our image.
“We will grow until nightmare swallows the world.”" – http://www.arena.net/blog/dream-and-nightmare
No really, they’re evil. That’s taking over the world kind of evil. What do you think would happen after they corrupted the tree and changed the very nature of every sapling born after that? Become peaceful? No, they’re going to continue to cause pain and suffering to everything they can get their hands on. They will be a thousand times worse than the tablet, the tablet can be broken away from, the Nightmare, so far as we know, can not. The Court will force every Sylvari into Nightmare or slaughter them. How is that noble?
:o Do you do commissions for these?
Claw Island so irritating because of that. You’re stuck with way too many zombies that move faster than you AND hit like a truck! Just to make things worse, they’re main strategy is to knock you down or flank you. Earth attunement, it does nothing for this!
It doesn’t feel like much of an epic story when my main strategy boils down to a) circle strafe or b) circle strafe around a pillar. After a point I’m just making myself dizzy.
Trust me, it gets worse. There are a couple of brutal quests after the claw island one. Are they doable? I guess so. Are they fun? No. The mobs totally ignore your npc companion and come after you with everything they’ve got. My elementalist died 6 times yesterday trying to do her story quest.
The quests are not tuned with the elementalist in mind and have certainly not been tested with an elementalist. She simply can not handle 6 mobs at the time that hit like a truck, no matter how much I kite them. The low damage/low heals/stupid long cooldowns frustrate the crap out of me.
She’s level 56 at this time and after the quest I ditched her and created a warrior. I’m not going to touch my elementalist anymore until the profession gets fixed. I play games to have fun. Maybe I should take a look at WoW:MoP.
I think I know what quest you speak of, involving a lot of invisible mobs and even more visible mobs. >< I chain died because ofkittenfast moving zombies that hit like two trucks cemented together. Oh and when there’s like… fifty mobs on screen and a lot of them like you, so awesome. And by awesome I mean ow ow ow ow.
I’ve gotten my Elementalist up to 60 so far. I love him but I have to take breaks to play my ranger and guardian to restore some of my sanity after some areas.
RE: WoW: MoP
It looks like it’ll be fun, but if you don’t like being shackled with having utility = you do nothing really good at all (oh and all the other classes do your utility better but pretend you don’t notice that) stay away from Elemental Shaman. :P I picked up Elementalist because I just can’t keep myself away from elemental based casters… every game, same result…
3) Mostly what I do now: D/D circle strafe like if you stop for a second you’ll be roast dinner. Or roasted vegetables in my case. (Partially my fault too for often going after quests a level or two above me. >.>)
Ugh, this gets boring and annoying.
On the Claw Island quest where you had to deal with ~6 giants, I had to lure them out one at a time and run around in circles for 5-10 to kill each one, was hella dumb.
I feel water really needs to be buffed. You don’t heal that much and you do crap all damage.
Claw Island so irritating because of that. You’re stuck with way too many zombies that move faster than you AND hit like a truck! Just to make things worse, they’re main strategy is to knock you down or flank you. Earth attunement, it does nothing for this!
It doesn’t feel like much of an epic story when my main strategy boils down to a) circle strafe or b) circle strafe around a pillar. After a point I’m just making myself dizzy.
Oh man some story missions can be hell on earth for Elementalists. They tend to go three ways for me:
1) I’m lucky and the mission isn’t tuned to some insane degree. (Downgraded to level 30 for a level 31 mission? REALLY?)
2) I get my rear kicked so hard my pants fall off and I end up calling in a thief buddy to cheese it. (I’m looking at you level 28 Sylvari quest. You horrible thing.)
3) Mostly what I do now: D/D circle strafe like if you stop for a second you’ll be roast dinner. Or roasted vegetables in my case. (Partially my fault too for often going after quests a level or two above me. >.>)
I know you’re supposed to switch elements quickly and stuff… but switching to earth doesn’t give me much more survivability, especially without many traits to support it at lower levels. Everything but fire (and sometimes air) does such crap damage it’s hard to switch out of it when you’re playing the kill-it-before-it-kills-me game.
Guardian, Ranger, Engineer… they’re all way easier to level. Oh well, I still love my Elementalist but it’s gonna be a chore getting him up those last 20 levels.
The reason Jennah couldnt do anything straight away seemed to be because she was dazed from touching Kralkatorik’s mind. She needed time to recover her senses. The other possibility is that the spell may have taken much longer.
Also, probably the biggest difference that Logan made is he got the charr prisoners to fight giving the defenders a substancial increase in numbers. Considering Dylan died protecting the door of the building Jennah was in there was a strong chance that she wouldnt have survived long enough to cast her spell if Logan hadnt arrived.
That scene was just poorly done in general. Those are possible reasons but they still feel like a thin cloth thrown over gaping plot holes than something that makes sense. Then again, Jennah and her powers are just so vaguely established in the book. I’m still side eyeing that whole business that it took her that long to do anything when she was surrounded by other mesmers of great skill.
Besides… if Dylan died at the door, and didn’t have enough support to not get ripped up by hyenas, how on earth did the hyenas not get to her by the time Logan got to her if that was the risk?
I think there were just a ton of plot holes. Jennah was clearly capable of dealing with the ogres without Logan’s help, with the illusion. I mean, what kept her from doing that in the first place? Oh there are ten less hyenas, NOW I can do my spell!!!
The way the battle with the dragon was staged it really did feel like if they had had Logan with him, they would have pulled through. By a hair mind. It was extremely close and him being there could have been the little bit to push the tide of the battle. (It’s possible that killing the dragon would have stopped the assault on Jennah anyways… )
Then again, I felt Logan’s blind devotion to Jennah was way overblown and much too sudden. I don’t particularly like Jennah’s character. She’s creepy. >_>
Alternatively, it could be that the brutality of the Nightmare Court destroys the “innocence” of the Sylvari, and that’s why it can’t be “cured”… There’s nothing to cure, because whatever there was is completely gone. Because of their torture, they choose to inflict the pain upon others, so that the “truths” revealed by their suffering will be revealed to others? Just a theory, in which the Dreamers are correct in their assumptions that those who convert to the Nightmare Court are truly “lost”.
My own character’s story (outside of the game’s preset story, of course) deals with a resistance to the Court, so I’m very interested in theorizing what the Nightmare actually is.
Interesting theory! I know there is a Sylvari woman who has been having terrible nightmares that talks to another Sylvari near the Asura portals. HEAVILY paraphrased, the dialogue goes like this:
Male Sylvari: What’s wrong?
Female Sylvari: I’ve been having terrible nightmares and I just can’t seem to stop crying.
Male: That’s terrible, do you think they are your nightmares or someone else’s?
Female: I don’t think such terrible things could come from me!
Later:
Female: I just need to harden myself to them…
Male: No! That’s what the Nightmare Court wants, for you to stop feeling.
Female: I don’t even know who I am anymore…
It seems from these two that a Nightmare Court member does “lose” something. They lose their sense of self, which is incredibly ironic because that’s what the Court considers the tablet to be doing to the Dreamers. From what I can tell, once one falls into Nightmare, they’ve lost their self identity and lost who they were. Many still retain vestiges of their experiences, like in the moon shield storyline, but their personality is radically different.
I would imagine it would be near impossible to pull someone from that great shift, especially if you tack on the torture they have to endure. The old them is gone, replaced by what the Court wants them to be.