Guild Wars 2

Speaking as someone from a server that got swamped with free transfers and consequently queues, I’m worried about new arrivals having the power to push out the resident population. If this change goes hand in hand with raising barriers to transfers (after a properly managed balancing period), that’s less of an issue.

But in general terms, I’m all for this. You would have to adjust the cap during the seasons to handle the influx of players – maybe a different cap for each league.

Partial merger of rank 26 and rank 27 EU servers onto a rank 15 EU server during free transfers already resulted in multi-hour primetime queues. Anyone who proposes something like this has no idea about the population numbers.

“Save Bessie!”

Gandara was never in a Bronze league position, get your facts straight. This is of course the precise point, since we ended up as the only international Silver league server with free transfers. That and we already had a strong community with two WvW guilds confirming that they would move before free transfers were announced, though I suppose Anet had no way of knowing that.

Remember guys, the rule in America is this:

Best = Biggest

As far as WvW goes… DO NOT MERGE SERVERS

Gandara is rank 10, 3 weeks ago we were rank 16, and we finished the last season at rank 11.

Most do run hammer trains as part of the group, since they can eliminate any squishies/PUGs they catch with CC and roll over, and hammer trains can blast for healing while offering shout heals and lots of condition removal. It’s effective for focusing fire and providing cover for your backline.

However a good hammer train is not enough to win a fight, you need a backline that can focus damage and provide support while not getting caught out of position. I really don’t know how this compares to NA, but my experience says that your spike damage from an EU group is not coming from the frontline, and a lot of your healing power is also dependent on the backline. This should be obvious but the execution is much more difficult than just blobbing up into one hammer group and following the commander.

Kid Inkk – just search on YouTube (don’t forget the second k)

Tell your WvW regulars how many dolyaks you killed, then you might just get a hand with the JP

XacTactX.6709:

Also if there aren’t any unwritten rules in WvW that means I can troll GvG happening in the arena right, after all red is dead. This selective hearing you guys have isn’t going to get you far if PvEers decide to interrupt your sacred GvGs.

And you’d get rolled if you tried. There’s GvG etiquette because those players can enforce it and can get help from their spectators. PvE players can’t enforce an honour code for the JP, when they’re asking for respect what they’re really asking for is a free pass.

If you want to see honour, chivalry, whatever in the Obsidian Sanctum go and effect it yourself. You can help players from other servers or defend your own. But terms like honour and chivalry mean nothing without power.

If these gankers are really just the unskilled trolls that people claim that they are, they should be easy to deal with. Can’t defend yourself? Then don’t go to a PvP zone. You’re just a poor traveler caught by highwaymen, there’s no king’s patrol in the Obsidian Sanctum and you asking for respect and etiquette is like a sheep asking the same of wolves.

Was going to say that this is a duplicate thread, but I can’t find the one with almost the same title.

There is none, get over it.

Minfast.5489:

Gandwagon to take the win. If they don’t achieve max ppt atleast once in each matchup it will be a disappointing tournament for them.

Ah, now that has a much better ring to it than Wagondara.

Been avoiding WvW but I heard that the quality of our PUGs now is atrocious. So if Gunnar’s and Piken guilds aren’t hampered by queues they’ll have easy loot and PPT.

If you really want to help Gandara at this point, find another server to play on. The queues aren’t only be bad for your experience, they harm ours.

I understand many players consider this to be a best destination, especially if their own servers are struggling. However if that is the only reason for coming here then you have already cheapened the basis for a relationship.

We have a lot of friendly people on this server and an open community, if you have moved here or are thinking about moving here then start a conversation with them. Just remember that a lot of people are frustrated because they see the queues we have now and know what is coming, and guilds that moved here without showing an interest in the existing community. We are also in the middle of one of the worst matchups ever, not only for our enemies because they are getting stomped and spawncamped, but because it’s tedious for us as well.

Thanks for consigning me and everyone on Gandara who actually has fun playing WvW as a community to Blob of the Mists, if that’s all you’re looking for go join another server please.

Yes, you were warned. Only reason there’s no queue on GBL is because in our current matchup there’s no enemies there. Half the WvW population probably isn’t even bothered with playing this week because any enemies we see get mobbed in 2 minutes, which means queues are actually shorter than they should be.

My guild cancelled both of our weekly WvW ops for this matchup.

Some people are saying that queues will die down eventually, but really they’ll explode out of proportion once the tournament starts and we have a more interesting match.

You need to be clearer in your communications I already saw a couple of PT guys over here.

“Da Pram Tram [PT]”

They would have come to us with our without free transfers and they came before the bandwagon. Sad to see that this hit AG hard, and I do hope you recover. This shake-up really has done more harm than good, the one comfort is that we will still be seeing those same guilds in silver league, albeit on different servers.

We really got fixed with free transfers by the roll of a die, if we hadn’t faced Dzagonur (230 rating points below us) that week we could have gained points more easily and maybe gotten into the 800 range, then things wouldn’t be so chaotic. Didn’t try to promote ourselves as a free transfer server, either.

Oh yes, random tip I missed that relates to point 1: Use /supplyinfo

Make your zerg stack up where you are standing then type that command to give you a supply count. If you’re standing next to a depot, call out the people who don’t have supply. Before you start a siege you need to know how much supply you have, and for god’s sake don’t get hit by a supply trap or a trebuchet cow. You may need to bring extra in case people wander off or waste their supply.

1. Carry your own siege. This discourages your zerg from placing more blueprints than you have supply for and shows that you really are in charge. Commanding is expensive, don’t expect to make money doing it, but a successful commander can also draw in siege donations to offset the cost. One of our guys was mailed 250 superior rams recently, though I think he burned through them already.

2. Superior everything, and I mean everything. Guild catapults if you can afford them. If you don’t want to throw down omegas all the time that’s fine, but sometime it can make a difference if you’re in a fix. Normal prints are fine too as a budget option for less hectic scenarios.

3. Be ready to acknowledge your mistakes, but don’t apologize too much. Your zerg expects you to be in charge. It’s up to your community to make a welcoming environment for new commanders, and if they don’t, try to get that conversation started. Some people are just trolls and you can ignore them entirely.

4. The most important reason to claim is for +5 supply, combat bonuses are nice too. Keep in mind that if the capture isn’t “credited” to your guild, you won’t have the option to claim for a few minutes.

5. It depends on the keep. There is always a way in, there is always a way to counter defensive siege, but it comes down to knowledge, experience, and preparation. Know how keeps are typically defended, know when to persist and when to give up. Sometimes just by prolonging a siege you can drain supply, but that defensive advantage makes it very hard if your forces are otherwise matched.

6. Sometimes it is, I think it depends where you play and what kind of opposition you have. In this case make sure you are always communicating, then you can help each other out either directly or indirectly.

7. As long as you don’t get emotional or upset you won’t drive people away. Do what you can with the group that you have, and more will start to follow. Most people understand that more can be accomplished in a group than can be accomplished alone. If you’re clear about the fact that you’re looking for more experience and will listen, there should be people among your zerg who are willing to help you out with the learning process.

Well PT wouldn’t last a month here, given the quality of commanders and guilds we have they’d lose all their players and without numbers they’d quickly fold.

I believe Cilag got trolled.

However, if PT plays here I will take the opportunity to work with the other server’s guilds to make sure you get wiped repeatedly every raid until your guild skill-less zerg tears itself apart. If you have any good players our guilds will poach them all.

Since RoF have moved into silver league, and a guild from RoS decided to transfer (to Gandara), Blacktide’s genuinely a contender for top place in bronze league, and free to move to. They are doing really well this week!

If you want the silver league action and you are willing to make a small investment (800 gems) for a long-term home then consider Aurora Glade or Ring of Fire, great communities that have some really excellent guilds.

Look at our queues, keep in mind that the season hasn’t even started yet and that more people are wanting to bandwagon our server. If you come here you are taking away from our experience and your own. Maybe it’s time to consider a server where you can still actually play the game.

If you are happy just playing EotM because you’re stuck in queues all the time, then I guess you are still welcome to Gandara but in that case please stick to EotM.

We had a recruitment post. We made it into a “we are full” post BEFORE free transfers opened. We also made a “do not come here” post last week. We have a website, listed contacts, a community website that is on the official list, and people posting all over these forums with “Gandara” in their signature. Oh, and we have queues. Fat, fat queues, every single night.

So excuse all those Gandarans who are utterly baffled and quite annoyed too everytime another guild announces they have moved here without any other kind of notice.

20 (some of those people coming along for the free loot) is unfortunately nothing for a night crew versus some of the other Silver League servers we’ll be facing. For example FSP has a proper NA guild. A good reminder for EU players thinking we’re as strong as the blowout this week suggests we are – we’re not.

Fort Ranik and Miller’s Sound have much less of a presence this week than the previous 2 times we faced those servers in the last couple months. There’s almost no point stepping into Gandara Borderlands this week because those servers almost never have the numbers to put players on that map.

We’re still full. I know that Blacktide has been picking up additional guilds this week, they have forums, TS, free transfers, very high pop… The only thing that Gandara has that Blacktide doesn’t is me, and I’m quite an unpleasant individual, so reconsider where you want to go.

Check out the screenshots of our queues, they’re legit.

You are all doing this incorrectly.

Flipped is T0 or paper.
T1 is the first upgrade, reinforced walls
T2 is the second, reinforced gates.
T3 is the third, fortified walls.

Otherwise T2 is a really ambiguous label because it could mean that just the wall is upgraded or it could mean that the gate is upgraded as well.

Gandara doesn’t have the coverage to dominate PPT, even with these transfers it’d be difficult if not impossible to match the other servers.

Besides which, we’d rather keep our server than win the tournament. If that means dropping the PPT game so those kinds of leechers get the message, we have the network in place to do that.

Good. Give the innovative players a chance to shine, rather than letting cookie-cutter masses have all the say. I’d rather this than have to wait for the end of the Tournament, which I couldn’t care all that much about anyways.

There are still great servers looking for more guilds and players. Even Deso needs people, and their PvE is da bomb!

If you are really looking for a new long-term home there are many servers that have room for you.

We are already hitting substantial queues across all maps during primetime, I urge EU zone players thinking about transferring to Gandara to reconsider. These EU servers are still seeking additional guilds and players, please read their threads in this recruitment subforum:

Aurora Glade
Gunnar’s Hold
Far Shiverpeaks
Ring of Fire
Ruins of Surmia
Blacktide
Vabbi
Fissure of Woe
Underworld
Whiteside Ridge

Any questions can be directed to
Jojenks
Luranni
Ezekiel the Paladin

EDIT: It’s 4 in the afternoon on a Thursday and our EB queue is at 50, if anyone needs to know precisely how bad it is.

Yuki Chuki.2457:

Agree. Also, I so love the server stacking it causes. Nothing better than to be a regular that fights on a near daily basis for his server and is only able to log in after 8pm because of work and then can’t play because of all the queues. Seriously! Before I could play whenever I wanted. The only map that sometimes had a queue was EB. Maybe 5 people during the weak and on wekkend peaktimes 20-30 at worst.

Now we’re have queues on every single map during the week. The shortest queue yesterday and the day before were 10+, EB now constantly had 40-60 people in queue between 8 and 10 pm (then I gave up..).
I really don’t want all this additional people. I love WvW but due to the peak time queues we now experience due to all the stacking and the limited time slots I’m able to logg in, I now nearly can’t play WvW.
Making rewards dependent on how your server does was such a great idea. I bet, all the servers the people moved away from are thrilled too….

Gandara, right? It’s getting ugly.

Since it’s impossible to tell who actually came from UW, let’s just say that comment isn’t directed towards “Bob”.

We’ll direct the overspill as best we can, I know that AG will be dropping to rank 13 and needs to replace its out-transfers, any other Bronze League servers that need these transfers are welcome to speak up. Gandara concluded its recruiting last week and we would not like to be brought up as a potential destination for EU players, which is why I chose to speak firmly.

UW refugees who have not been invited to transfer to Gandara will not be welcomed by the Gandara WvW community. I can’t speak for the PvE community or for every player but there is a wide consensus that further transfers will be harmful to our community and will be looked down upon.

Edit: This post will come across as excessively hostile and arrogant for anyone just hopping into this thread, the reason for that is very real concern about large guilds showing up unannounced on our server and disrupting our existing community. I stress that many servers (Aurora Glade, Gunnar’s Hold, Far Shiverpeaks, Whiteside Ridge, Ruins of Surmia, Blacktide, Vabbi, Fissure of Woe, and yes, Underworld) are still looking for additional WvW players and guilds in the EU time slot.

If you haven’t had the pleasure of playing against AG, I can confirm that you’ll find a lot of strong, skilled guilds there. It’s a great place for players looking to join and advance with an experienced guild, and for guilds looking for capable allies with a real fighting spirit and ethic.

Whether or not they retain numbers as a server, AG’s guilds all pack a punch and will continue make their presence felt on the battlefield.

As far as EU guilds go, we’re not looking for any more. Scouts, roamers, commanders are still welcome.

Realist.5812:

Also, riddle me this, how is giving me only one map to play on (the map I play least on) MORE FUN???? That statement is devoid of all logic.

Bertrand.3057:

In most matches, night populations are not large enough to sustain action on all four maps. The proposal is an attempt to redress that by consolidating the population onto a single map. EBG is very well suited to host imbalanced night populations because each server’s position is easily defensible.

You can disagree but there is a logic to it.

Realist.5812:

Riddle me again, you don’t play during this time that you want to hilariously destroy, so tell me how you can even speak of its merits?

Really?

Bertrand.3057:

I myself am a Canadian (guild leader, commander, scout, roamer) playing on an EU server.

Bertrand.3057:

I’d be playing during my own server’s borderland blackout much of the time but feel this could improve that experience.

Bertrand.3057:

goldenwing, I understand since my primetime is night watch for my server.

Bertrand.3057:

Side note, for those who claimed to have read my post and then suggested I’m ignoring the fact that the night shift might be someone else’s primetime, a geography lesson is in order. I indicated already that I play on an EU server, but live in Canada. Canada is not in Europe.

Realist.5812:

This proposal is great, I’ll never be able to enter the borderlands. What a well thought out and logical idea. This deserves some kind if award.

I really hate reading these " ’MURICA ONLY " threads. It really makes me wonder about the education system over there and how it breeds this kind of ignorance.

Your problem is with 168 hour long matches, take it up with that.

I can tell that you hate reading these threads because you clearly didn’t bother reading any of it. Instead of just glancing at the thread title, which is restricted to 45 characters, give a read through then try again.

Gizmo.9178:

No. Restricting someone’s playing time or what they can do is wrong, no matter how small the amount of people you think it would affect. It is still wrong. Your time is not more valuable than anyone elses time.

This is precisely the kind of post that shows a lack of understanding of what this thread is about. This is not an attempt by “primetime” players to restore PPT balance by imposing restrictions on “off-peak” players. It’s an open discussion about the viability of the 4 map game when there are not enough players to populate 4 maps.

The people who would be affected are the people whose opinions are being specifically solicited, I conceived this idea with my own experience as a “night watch” player in mind.

The responses from Luranni, goldenwing, selan, Alcyone, and Jayden Ennok have been, I feel, the most useful for this discussion because they speak specifically to what the current night watch experience is or what it might become. Apologies if I missed anyone.

Thanks for the continued responses, especially from those who can speak to their server’s so-called “night shift”.

Even if this proposal is too controversial and too much opposition, I think I’ll have succeeded if I’ve successfully communicated this fact (which is recognized both by many who support and many who oppose the idea): The dynamics of WvW change radically when the population is low.

The point is not that it’s someone’s night time, or that primetime is over (Side note, for those who claimed to have read my post and then suggested I’m ignoring the fact that the night shift might be someone else’s primetime, a geography lesson is in order. I indicated already that I play on an EU server, but live in Canada. Canada is not in Europe.), the point is that population drops off across the WvW population pool.

The WvW population in a matchup might be 10-20 times smaller than its peak population, yet it is still distributed across 4 maps. The game simply doesn’t function in the same way, either from an experience standpoint or a scoring standpoint, when populations are so thinly spread.

There are a few people who have indicated they enjoy the unique experience of these low activity hours, and I will say that it does have its charms. But if you were pitching this as a game mode in isolation (i.e. forget the server’s other populations exist), I think it’d be absurd to suggest having 4 maps would be decently balanced or that it would offer a consistent experience given the total number and the variance of players who play in this time slot.

T1/T2 are of course the exception, certainly it’s an obstacle to this proposal that stacking of coverage during this time slot has already happened.

I, er… You are brilliant <3

Thanks for clarifying, I’m glad that you’ve spoken up for your guild’s niche. Because of the ethical issues that were raised earlier, particularly by ManuCraft, it has to be people’s opinions who play during this time frame that make or break this proposal.

goldenwing, I understand since my primetime is night watch for my server. It’s not really about whose primetime it is, it’s about targeting the fact that activity dips at certain hours across a region.

I agree that low population is a huge issue with the quality of play during these hours, and I think having that low population spread out across 4 maps is a large part of why it’s less fun to play during those hours.

Thanks to everyone who gave a thoughtful response. I emphasize that the main driver behind this proposal is not to combat nightcapping or to balance PPT. The fact is that the experience for night watch crews is markedly different from daytime and primetime, and it’s detrimental to the experience. In most matches, night populations are not large enough to sustain action on all four maps. The proposal is an attempt to redress that by consolidating the population onto a single map. EBG is very well suited to host imbalanced night populations because each server’s position is easily defensible.

I don’t find the suggestion that I am failing to consider the needs of night crew players – whether they are SEA or Oceanic players on NA servera, NA players on EU servers, or simply people with unusual schedules – fair or appropriate. On the contrary, I’m specifically soliciting the opinions of these players regarding how this change would affect their experience in the game. Comments from these players will, I believe, do the most to advance this discussion.

Thanks all for your feedback, I especially appreciate the input from Southeast Asia and Oceanic players whom would be most directly affected by such a change. It would be great to learn more about your background and current experience of this game. I’d be playing during my own server’s borderland blackout much of the time but feel this could improve that experience. I’m also curious how many of the respondents have extensive experience with their own server’s low coverage period.

I would like to reiterate that I recognize overnight is not a universally applicable term, not being from the same region as my own server. However you phrase it, it is a period where WvW activity across servers drops off substantially for a given region, which is what this proposal is meant to address. Given the global, 24/7 nature of this game, this is a fact that will never change.

Were this implemented, the borderland blackout would be staggered between NA and EU; about 2am-8am GMT for EU and 8am-2pm GMT for NA. Where does this fall for SEA and Oceanic players, and which is more appealing?

Illogical,

1. There are hard numbers about where players are, whatever the server the majority is from that region. That is what shapes the flow of the game and that is what solutions need to be designed around.

2. The reason why some servers have more people at that time is because they STACKED. I probably shouldn’t blame them because that’s what the current design pushed them to do, but correct me if I’m wrong.

3. It’s not about winning, it’s about giving everyone an environment where they feel they can compete. Whether that’s just fights or PPT, this applies to both.

I only proposed a 6-8 hour closure, not an 18 hour one. The fact is that coverage wars have destroyed servers and royally kittened the ranking table for 18 months and counting. This proposal is a compromise because the above is the main problem, I balk when regional players say WvW should be shut down or certain regions locked out, you can’t control where your friends are. Anyways, the “overnight” experience on most servers pales far in comparison to the typical daytime/evening experience of a regional player and this should be a step towards improving it, while also addressing many other serious issues.

Shonie, the point of this proposal is to address coverage wars directly. I’ve been on my server since headstart and only did PvE when I began. Maybe you are right that it is too late to fix anything but a constructive attitude would be appreciated.

DeWolfe, I did explain in the second paragraph why I use the term, of course I recognize there may be other ways to describe this time.

Regarding servers with more coverage, the fact is that there are many servers without coverage at those times. I realize it’s contentious to propose breaking up servers, whatever the time zone, which is why I am looking forward to people’s views.