Guild Wars 2

As a condition Thief Necro’s with anti-condition skills are tough.

It works with both condition and crit/power builds. Travel speed of Cluster bomb needs to increased though, too slow atm.

Signet of Shadows is fine, there are times where the blind helps a lot, comes down to how good the player is

Infiltrator’s is weak.

I don’t even think Heartseeker needed a nerf, neither did pistol whip. Both Heatseeker and Pistolwhip pre-nerf were not the best builds, Pistolwhip came very close to being the best build but there are 2 builds that were and are better now.

I like GW2 and think it will only get better, be patient.

5x Guardian or 5x Mesmer Hope this rumor is true lol.

Very bad suggestions, the Downed state is fine.

Great Sword build is a good build, try that and practice your timing. Best burst in game.

I enjoy 1v1 and 2v2 deathmatch a lot more than 3v3 death match. 5v5 conquest is awesome. 8v8 conquest is not that good.I would love the following for GW2:

1v1, 2v2, 3v3 deathmatch arena (everyone hapy)
5v5 conquest (reduce 8v8 sPvP to 5v5)
5v5 capture the flag (with 2 flags on each side to avoid turtle tactics)
8v8 Guild vs Guild

put ladders + match making system on all of them and seperate them in their own catagory and GW2 sPvP will be awesome.

No they don’t, the meta needs to adapt. Bring control + condition damage.

Yes I am, just take a break bro and come back when there are ladders. No point complaining, there is no subscription so we can play it when ever we want You can play other great games and when the E-Sport patch for GW2 comes with ladders, you can hop back in the action

Pimpslapper.2047:

This thread seems to be sidetracked a bit, but going back to those who call me a noob and a moron because of my post, I have a couple of things to add:

1. Did I say I cannot beat them?? No. I did not. Does the skill still need a nerf, YES, it does. A skill that can crit for 8k on a softie should not be spammable three or four or five times in a row. Period. It is a stupid, stupidly op skill that has no place in thief lore, and as I said this is coming from a thief main, see attached.

2. To those who assumed I do not know my way around PvP or the thief, you know the old adage…when you assume you make a kitten out of you. See attached, and keep the noob and moron comments to yourself. The second and third most played are necro (146 and counting and Ranger, 124 and not counting). I am not bragging because there are many higher levels, but I think after 324 games with my thief, I know what I am talking about. And to kitten with you noob HS spammers.

A spammable ability that crits 8k? nope.

Show me a hearseeker that crits 8k when the target is above 50% hp. Heartseeker crits high when the target is below 25%, which means it doesn’t matter if it is spammable… 1 or 2 heartseekers finish the job, no need for the third or fourth.

If you knew the Thief profession as good as I know, you would know that Heartseeker is fine and no where near the strongest weapon in the Thieves arsenal.

Heartseeker is fine.

Redesign the class to only do condition damage? no, stopped reading there.

The change to Basilisk venom was a buff in both PvE and PvP.

Play another class. There is no sense of contribution in WvW, just a massive zerg with no skill. Dungeons and sPvP is where the challenge lies

There is no “should”, I have never played my class like others. That is why I dominate, win and end up on top. Play the game the way you want, as long as you are good at the game, you will win.

I don’t really mind a nerf to the Backstab build, it is a bad and weak build anyways. The nerf should be directed at Assassins Signet! Change the damage boost to 15% more damage done for the next 5 sec uppon activation.

I will continue to rock my Blood Storm and Venom Control builds and dominate all.

mcavellero.8153:

Thank you for clarifying your post. Your answer – some classes can affect a invisible stomper but other classes cannot but it won’t make a difference. I would beg to differ in terms of “it” making a difference because every second counts. Also I wonder why even put in a downed state to begin with it if all abilities, regardless of class, cannot counter an invisible stomper(solo).

Why?

To stimulate dynamic combat and team work in PvP. Guild Wars 2 is about team work, the downed state and all the things that belong to it open up a lot of possibilities. My mate gets downed? A guardian can flash there and knock everyone back and rez him, a Thief can drop Shadow Refuge and rez him etc. Enemy players can react to these changes and the whole flow of combat can switch, it keeps the combat fun and dynamic. This also opens other ways of playing support instead of the tradional healer/buff/debuffer garbage.

There are certain traits that help with removing immobilize when you heal or use a movement skill etc.

I think that the conditions are fairly close in power, except for vulnerability which could use a boost to its effect.

It depends on the situation too, If I am going to use a heal I’d rather be immobilized than poisoned, if 3 people are going to bash my face in i’d rather be poisoned than immobilized so I can move and kite.

Both immobilize and poison are very good conditions in my opinion.

Why would you make a second Thief in a game like Guild Wars 2?

Emerge.9640:

It’s in W3, dunno what it is in sPvP. I’ve always like 1vX fights with unknowns around every corner.

Still, unload hits for 6-10k.

No argument regarding the power of an ability will ever be taken serious if it is related to WvW. WvW was designed to not be balanced, it will never be balanced and the whole point of WvW has been unbalanced fun and grief. There is gear difference in WvW.

In sPvP where balance matters, unload is garbage.

MikeB.3857:

TwiceDead.1963:

Ensign.2189:

Pistol 4 and 5 are strong skills as is.

Pistol 4 is a strong skill is it…? o_O
Could you elaborate?

It interrupts.

So it stops heals. It stops revives. It stops casts.

It doesn’t stop heals, some heals are instant. It stops 1 shot combo on allies, revives, stomps and casts which can be a heal.

Is Head Shot worth it to use the initiative to prvent a revive? rarely, if you have an AoE option like D/D, S/D or Shortbow it is better just to AoE damage the downed player and the person who is reviving him.

Is Head Shot worth it to use the initiative to prevent a stomp? yes, you are preventing the death of your team mate and you can control the stomper for 2-3 sec if you time it right so you get a lot of value out of your initiatve.

Is Head Shot worth it to use the initiative to DELAY a cast, since the cooldown won’t be triggered? rarely, I haven’t experienced many situations in which the target has a certain health value which demanded me to interrupt his heal with a Head Shot instead of just finishing him with Unload before the heal cast time would be over.

Is Head Shot worth it to use the initiative to prevent your ally from getting 1 shotted by quickness Pistol Whip or Hunderd Blades? if they have a stunbreaker or evade ready for immob? no. If they don’t? yes.

Head Shot has its uses, but it is not good enough to compete.

lol at 6-10k unload, good luck doing that in sPvP. Don’t even bring up WvW because there is no balance there duo to gear difference. Unload is weak.

nldixon.8514:

BigTeeHunter.4913:

So your saying you were almost stomped, set back, then stomped second time? You’ve bought yourself time, if your not back up by then, your probably not getting up. Sounds like you did a pretty good job of avoiding a stealth stomp there.

How do you figure that sounds like you avoided or prevented a stealth stomp? You still get stealth stomped. A Thief with a dagger off-hand (i.e., most of them) can disappear every three seconds.

Oh wow… you are that bad at sPvP, I feel bad for you. Think about what you have said before replying.

nldixon.8514:

Blazer Hellsing.9184:

Sprawl.3891:

Blazer Hellsing.9184:

Yes, why shouldn’t it be? Stability from other professions also has the same effect to an extent.

stability is a boon and can be stripped, you can’t strip stealth

Stripped=removed a.ka stopped/prevented. Yes you can infact stop/prevent the stealth stomp.

I am sorry bad PvP’rs, at least your “hurr durr backstab is OP” cries had a (weak) basis, this topic has no basis at all, there is nothing wrong with Stealth stomping.

How do you stop a stealth stomp? Because on my Ranger this is how it usually goes:

Thief starts to stomp (or uses a stealth skill to disappear). I wait until the stomp is almost before interrupting. Thief wait a second, reapplies stealth, stomps me. If I sit there and throw rocks while he’s stealthed, guess what happens?

Sometimes I might have my wolf out and he’ll howl and send the Thief running for a second, but he comes right back and starts to stomp again. Usually from stealth.

Thanks for proving my point that you Thief haters have no basis with this complaining about stealth stomping.

So a Thief stealths, stomps you wait and count in your head how long there is left and interrupt the stealth stomp, the thief waits some seconds for the exposed condition to be removed, stealths and stomps you.

Is that correct?

Do you realize that the Thief would actually have finished you faster if he didn’t even go for the stealth? since he wasted 2 seconds stealthing and 1-2 sec for the exposed condition to fade.

What if a Warrior was stomping you? What difference is there? not much.

Stealth stomping is only convenient and helps when the the Thief is low on health, which is logical and justified for a profession which has low health and armor by default.

Now there might be cases where I stealth and stomp you from behind so your interrupt doesn’t land etc. but the point still stands.

Also you ask how stealth stomping can be stopped 100%? Read:

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Shield_of_Absorption
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Magnetic_Inversion
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Staggering_Blow
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Gust
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Illusionary_Wave
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Air_Blast
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Chilling_Wind
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Reaper%27s_Mark
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/%22Fear_Me!%22
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Updraft
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Stomp
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Thump
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Tornado
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Big_Ol%27_Bomb
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Wave_of_Light
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Shadow_Escape
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Deception_

Thief haters should go back and complain about a normal/decent build like backstab build, while we good Thieves lol at you for not knowing that there are 3 other builds which are atleast two times better than backstab build in a serious sPvP/tPvP environment.

Sprawl.3891:

Blazer Hellsing.9184:

Yes, why shouldn’t it be? Stability from other professions also has the same effect to an extent.

stability is a boon and can be stripped, you can’t strip stealth

Stripped=removed a.ka stopped/prevented. Yes you can infact stop/prevent the stealth stomp.

I am sorry bad PvP’rs, at least your “hurr durr backstab is OP” cries had a (weak) basis, this topic has no basis at all, there is nothing wrong with Stealth stomping.

Stop whining little kiddos, patience is key.

Sazu, patience is key.

Yes, why shouldn’t it be? Stability from other professions also has the same effect to an extent.

vitigis.4160:

Sanis.1096:

really… elementalist… ELEMENTALIST… they have the worst downstate E V E R… you could have picked like mesmer or thief

^^^THIS^^^

Ele not only has the worst underwater skills for dmg in the game, but the worst downed state, bar none. OP is just…….wrong

You are wrong, if an Elementalist is downed and a Thief is downed, the Elementalist will emerge victorious. It all depends on the situation.

Certain downstate abilities are better in certain situations.

As a thief player, when I am downed with another downed player I will always end up losing the downed fight. If they are not downed and try to stomp me I can delay that for a good while and maybe get rezzed.

You can’t say that this profession has better downstate abilities than that one, it just doesn’t work like that.

Arenanet, never change. I beg you, never change this attitude. Decide the balance yourself by playing the game, don’t make the epic mistake Blizzard did with catering to forum cry babies. Read the forums and keep in touch with your player base.

We true gamers who value quality will wait patiently. I will always support you guys and have your back, to me you are the best MMO company I have ever seen! serious respect and gratitude! Thank you <3

There is venom control support, pistol whip roamer, D/D condition and people whine about Backstab builds? hahaha oh kitten didn’t know there are so many bad PvP’ers in GW2. Backstab build is a joke in any serious sPvP/tPvP.

Solid 8/10.

Remove the sharks from Raid on the Capricorn and add a ladder and rating system and it would become a 10/10 for me.

I love conquest and death match, don’t like capture the flag or kill the lord to win etc.

Ensign.2189:

I don’t understand why you’re proposing to brutally maul pistol #1 with the nerf hammer Blazer. Is it just to make pistol #2 a marginal skill?

Pistol 4 and 5 are strong skills as is. 2 and 3 are pretty underwhelming and the main problem with the set. In theory this should be a stronger dueling set than short bow, but the initiative damage dumps pale so badly next to cluster bomb that it’s barely worth the effort.

Pistol main hand is basically Sneak Attack (via P/D) or bust

Those changes improve every build with pistols.

The P/D condition build would actually become better because you can stack your bleeds higher and faster with the new Body Shot… more than you can do currently with Vital Shot spam which costs no initiative, improving the power of P/D build. Never said anything about Sneak Attack, that would still be in place so you probably misunderstood. Also you call the new Body Shot marginal? a 3i cost ability which does direct damage and applies 3 bleed stacks which should do decent damage and last for 8 sec from a 900 range. That ability is good and only gets better in a condition build. Current Body Shot is terrible.

The P/P power crit build would actually become viable because of higher unload damage and faster unload execution, the Vital Shot spam provides a good condition now. Black Powder is good in PvE, in PvP it costs too much and needs a -1 initiative cut. Head Shot would become viable for interrupting during the actual combat. I only use Head Shot as an anti-rez, nothing else. You know why? If you use Head Shot you lose a lot of initiative which are needed for damage and you only get a 0.25 (or 0.5) daze. If the damage of Head Shot is increased, then it would actually be a useful ability and you would have variety between using it and doing less but noticable damage and interrupting or chosing to spend your initiative on Unload or Heatseeker/Shadowshot in case of D/P for a lot more damage but no interrupt.

The D/P power crit build would be improved as well with improved Head Shot as mentioned above and it gets a little more defense with a -1 initiative cut on Black Powder.

The S/P power crit build would be improved as well and this might actually make this weapon set to dominant, but hopefully if improvements like these are implemented they will (or should) also nerf quickness to reduce the strenght of all those quickness 2 shot combo’s. If quickness is nerfed then this S/P build will remain balanced.

I had a better experience, dominate the game in raid of the capricorn, own every opponent I face, 0 death, game is going to be over soon… a ranger rezzed and jumps down, I run towards him, summon Thieves Guild and am like “time to get owned brah” and I get thrown in the opposing team by auto balance and I appear behind him on the rez point where he spawned and jumped down some seconds earlier… I see my Thieves Guild buddies running to me in the distance and the ranger turns to me and we both say “WTF LOL”.

Good experience but still a FML momen

Evilapprentice you are wasting your time to be honest. You raise a valid point but the hatred doesn’t let people to judge and discuss this topic objectively. Do you know why the Thief profession is the most hated profession?

The Thief profession has the following attributes:

- Mobility
- Low Health
- Low Armor
- Trickery (shadowstep, shadowreturn, stealth)

Any class in any game which has these attributes will automatically be a “high risk, high reward” class that punishes bad players and rewards good players. Why do so many people cry about Thief instead of making a Thief and playing that “oh so overpowered” backstab build? There is no level barrier or gear barrier in GW2 sPvP, so why? I’ll tell you! They play the profession, they own a few noobs but get owned twice as much in return by players who know what they are doing and then they realize that they don’t have the skill to compete with the good Thief players. Some players might choose to practice and improve, but most of them will cry on the forums.

I played Thief from the start and I can take on 2-3 of these noob thieves and defeat them with my D/D condition build. If anyone is complaining about a Thief and he complains about Backstab or Heartseeker, that is a clear sign that he is clueless. The 3 strongest Thief builds are venom control support, pistol whip and D/D condition build.

Let them cry all they want, Arenanet knows better. The Thief is not going to get nerfed anytime soon, in fact I promise you that sooner or later the Thief will be buffed. P/P is very weak in sPvP, Flanking Strike pathing is very unreliable and Scorpion Wire is not working properly, you can expect buffs to these points. Quickness will probably be nerfed a bit, but that will be a global change.

At the end of the day the best player wins in GW2.

I met an Elementalist in sPvP who kited and survived myself and 2 other people for a good 20-30 sec before we downed him, I doubt any of us would have gotten him in a fair fight.

Hillarious lol’d hard, but I disagree with some of the positions. This is how it should be:

God Tier: Mesmer, Guardian, Elementalist.
Cat tier: Engineer, Thief
Mice tier: Warrior, Necromancer, Ranger

Anyways thanks for sharing.

SamTheGuardian.2938:

What I think sPvP strongly needs

Ranking. I know it’s coming, but I want to challenge ArenaNet to not do Ranking like everyone else. You have this wonderful PvE side of the game with 2 million+ people playing. Most people are buying GW2 for that experience and many of them are scared of small scale PvP because of past experiences in other games getting ganked.

In a video describing sPvP Chaplan said
It’s about you bring your A game and I’ll bring my A game and one of us goes home licking our wounds

That’s exactly how it should be, yes. The problem I see is when you have two teams that are not in the same league as one another. You can’t pit a group of 40 year old business men who get together and play basketball after work on Thursday against NBA pro teams. In any sport you have this distinction of leagues that categorize players. A league should not only prevent pros / hardcores from competing with casuals but they should also have a reward system unique to that league.

NBA has it’s own yearly winner.
College basketball has its own, both are respected.

We need something like this for GW2. When ranking eventually comes in that’s step 1 but it’s only step 1. You also need monthly and yearly tournaments hosted by ArenaNet (letting the third-party party’s do this through private tournaments is not enough. We need private tournaments, yes. We also need ArenaNet to provide a reward system for the more casual type of sPvP players).

I’m envisioning a three league system.

Amateur
Lightweight
Hardcore

Once a player crosses over from one into the other they can’t go ganking in the lower skilled circuit/league (I’m a software developer of 12 years and can think of many ways this could be implemented in a way it would stay reasonably exploit free).

Each league would have it’s own monthly and yearly tournaments. If you did this you would open the door for sPvP to everyone regardless of skill level or how much time they could devote to practice each week. It would be a fun experience for all. The hardcore players would enjoy it more too. Can you imagine the pride in being the winning team on the hardcore league at the end of the year? Best of the best.

This is a good idea. This is a proven concept in real world sports.

Quality post, +1.

Great idea and I am sure Arenanet has already thought of this and put it on their “future addition” list like dueling etc.

I was thinking about this a few days ago aswell, +1 bro.

Nice video, lol’d at the Backstab. That thief is a sitting duck for the next 30 sec and in group fights he will die from random AoE. He is rocking 30/30/x and probably berserker amulet with full crit on gear, which means he has what? 10k+- health? Another glass cannon can 1 shot him.

Oh this was about WvW? I shouldn’t have replied then because complaining about balance in WvW is the most useless thing GW2 players can do. WvW was designed to be for fun and fun only, there is no balance and never will be. There is gear difference in WvW if I am not mistaken and the lagg and chaos makes normal builds like Backstab build seem OP.

Battlefield 3 = that way.

GW2 was very clear from the beginning before beta’s even that the game would have a good amount of I.A. with its professions and in PvP. While mesmer phantasm and clones, Engineer turrets, Guardian spirit weapons and Ranger Pets are annoying, they are not broken or overpowered.

The only real bad PvE element in GW2 sPvP are the sharks in Raid on the Capricorn map.

Elementalist is strongest profession in the game, it has the best tools to counter a Mesmer and has a decent chance vs everyone else. I have only seen 1 pro Elementalist in sPvP who survived and kited myself and 2 other people for a good 20-30 sec, doubt any of us would take him in a 1v1 and I take 99% of the people I fight in a 1v1.

Shame Unload was gutted to be totally useless, the tears over an Unload crit build would have been epic entertainment

Redscope.6215:

Blazer Hellsing.9184:

Redscope.6215:

Blazer Hellsing.9184:

I supported and still support Arenanet’s stance on PvP modes and that they only want conquest mode sPvP. If you ever do add a death match mode, please put a minus 50% damage modifier on those death match mode maps so people won’t die within 3 seconds of being focus fired and keep it at 3 players per team. This will make the game play more interesting and challenging.

Would that -50% apply to conditions as well? Think carefully before you respond.

In a game where everyone has a 15-30 second cooldown heal skill, if you lower the damage too much, nobody will ever die.

Yes it applies to all damage, condition, power and crit damage. I don’t know if you have ever been in a death match map or not, it is small and 3 people fighting 3 people, a decent focus fire and good timing and 1 person goes down. 2 people focus firing a person with quickness makes the target drop in 2 sec, let alone when 3 people do it. If death match is implemented, then a minus damage modifier to the maps of that game type is a must. Maybe not a 50%, but 30-40%, that is up to arenanet.

Death match mode with the current spike damage of the game? it will be unbalanced.

Well you answered correctly. I just wanted to see what kind of player you were :p

Lets just not argue the quickness buffs for now. Most people, including myself, think they need a massive nerf and I’m not planning on them remaining as-is in the future.

I was assuming you were talking about a new game mode. By your definition, deathmatch already exists. Just ask Anet to put up sPvP servers with a smaller max player count.

Getting back to your point, yes focus fire kills very quickly. My problem is, we’re in a small map and you’ve got a lot more room for a 1v1 situation. Bringing damage down too much would create an unending battle in where players would avoid and mitigate damage just enough so that their healing more than makes up for it. Then its just not fun. Then it becomes a forced focus fire style gameplay where if you’re not balled-up and focusing on one target, you’re going to lose.

Edit: And I use the term ‘fun’ personally. Not sure if you find balling up and focusing targets down fun or not so I can’t really make that call.

I agree with most of the things you say except the following:

- There is no death match mode in sPvP, we only have conquest mode. Death match would be: 2 teams of 3 players each fight each other in a small map, the team that loses all its players first loses. If you die, you stay dead. No bases, no points.

Also I forgot to mention that if they implement Death Match mode they should cap the team to 1 profession per team. Don’t need lame teams like 3x backstab thief, 3x Engineer, 3x phantasm mesmers, 3x guardian etc.

No, I don’t want lame builds running around with high health, high armour and high healing.

Spirit Weapons are all right, focus the Guardian. When they go with a spirit weapon build, they aren’t that defensive as some other Guardians and are easier to damage and take down. The hammer to the face knockback/knockdown is annoying, but not overpowered.

Redscope.6215:

Blazer Hellsing.9184:

I supported and still support Arenanet’s stance on PvP modes and that they only want conquest mode sPvP. If you ever do add a death match mode, please put a minus 50% damage modifier on those death match mode maps so people won’t die within 3 seconds of being focus fired and keep it at 3 players per team. This will make the game play more interesting and challenging.

Would that -50% apply to conditions as well? Think carefully before you respond.

In a game where everyone has a 15-30 second cooldown heal skill, if you lower the damage too much, nobody will ever die.

Yes it applies to all damage, condition, power and crit damage. I don’t know if you have ever been in a death match map or not, it is small and 3 people fighting 3 people, a decent focus fire and good timing and 1 person goes down. 2 people focus firing a person with quickness makes the target drop in 2 sec, let alone when 3 people do it. If death match is implemented, then a minus damage modifier to the maps of that game type is a must. Maybe not a 50%, but 30-40%, that is up to arenanet.

Death match mode with the current spike damage of the game? it will be unbalanced.