Guild Wars 2

As a player which started with a Warrior, did level Him to 80, then did level a Guardian to 80, made Him my main character, then leveled a Ranger and a Thief and then rise another Warrior (all of them to 80), I must say: at the current state, Warrior.

You will not find problems to complete the whole map and dungeons in PvE with both Guardians or Warriors, except due inexperience. Both can faceroll almost any PvE content without help, and are capable to be the tankiest guys in dungeons. Warriors can do more damage without big sacrifices in their survability, whereas Guardians are better in support roles (aegis, damage reduction, AoE stability, Wall of Reflection, Tome of Courage…), but as I said no problem at all in PvE.

Instead, in WvW, despite both are great, the Warrior currently has an edge over the Guardian. Both are crucial in guild raids, the backbone of any army.

But when comes to roaming or dueling Warriors are better: they have more viable builds available (burst damage, full condition, perma-stun), they have more weapons and a large array of builds, and they can have 25% enhanced movement or perma-swiftness at no oportunity cost. And they can run in full berserker gear retaining a 18-19k health pool, or tank for more than 27k HP while still retaining strong condition damage or having the strongest crowd control tools in the game. They have awesome gap closers, very spammable (and can be traited to break out inmobilitations).

Guardians, instead, are slow, which means that either you spent a fortune in Traveler runes or will be exposed to be poked to death. Sure you can waste weapon selection and utilities trying to get that pace from swiftness skills, but no one will be near to the mobility available to Warriors. Using those runes will mean to discard Soldier or Mekandru, which means being ore vulnerable against conditions. You also will have less weapons viable to do the task: greatsword, sword, focus and scepter. I love the Guardian hammer, but if you need to keep the pressure against a Mesmer or Thief you will need weapons with gap closers, so that loadout probably will not work very well.

A bit the same happens in sPvP; as a Guardian you are almost forced to play bunker builds; as a Warrior you can be either a good bunker or a good dpser with excellent mobility.

I still use my Guardian for dungeons and WvW raids, but when comes to roaming and soloing now I swap to my Warriors: a lot more options available, and just more fun.

I had a lot of fun the last two days fighting in the Kodash borderline; the last moment defense in Bay fortress against the mass-golem attack at Monday night was thrilling, and yesterday we have great fights and cat and mouse fights against BLAK and WAY. I think that the three servers are showing a strong game in prime time, very balanced and fair. We have slightly better coverage, but everyone is working hard at the three servers and the forces colliding in the battlefield are providing a big show!

See you again this night

I usually wield Hammer / Sword + Shield instead of a bow or a mace; the main reason is to being able to disengage in WvW. Anyway:

For PvP either…

0/
10/ IV
30/ II, IX, X
10/ I
20/ III, X

…Or the same build but with the 10 pints in Tactics derived to Discipline to get XI (Burst Mastery). Some trades can be done: in Defense sometimes either VIII (Last Stand) or XII (Spiked Armor) can be a replacement for one of the initial choices.

For WvW is all about the Runes I use: with Melandru/Hoelbrack I use the same builds, with Perplexity is like:

20/ IV, VII
0/
30/ II, IX, X
0/
20/ III, X

This last one outputs less damage, but until the Perplexity nerf (which is almost here) proved to be solid. If the nerf hits very strong then the PvP builds could still work fairly well.

My main doubt is about the ten points invested in Tactics I (Leg Specialist) instead of using it in Discipline XI (Burst Mastery). Leg Specialist works wonders in my condition build, and I still like in this hammer one due I keep the main Sword and the Hammer has a cripple, but a 1 second paralyze seems a weak tradeoff for being able to spam burst more frequently.

TheGuy.3568:

Deathmond.7328:

Our complication that we still have useless weapons(sword and shield)and utility skills(spirit weapons and signets) in WvWvW. And this stupid feel that if you want to be a team player and good player in your static\guild etc. you need to play with GS\STaff|Hammer…maybe mace+focus and use shouts+one consecration or meditation for solo or roaming. So we play in this builds one year ago…and Anet says to us “go on…love this gameplay and forgot about your profession others skills and weapons”
…
So…Yeah…I am angry!

Sword…..useless….lol

Outside 1 vs 1 is a very poor weapon, and even then the Warrior’s sword is much better tool for duels and roaming.

My main complaint about the current state of the Guardian class is that is inherently bad for roaming: no swiftness (outside using Traveler runes instead of Soldier/Melandru, which damages your support/survability), low health (which forces you to choose between having a decent health pool with bad dps or going for dps being glass cannon) no alternative source of damage (no bleed or venom, and fire isn’t a reliable source due Guardians doesn’t have any weapon which stacks fire with the auto attack).

So, you can use Guardians for providing team support (stability, protection, regeneration, retaliation… and of course Tome of Courage) in WvW raids, for bunkering in PvP and to provide Wall of Reflection in Fractals, and that’s all. Guardians aren’t required -or even demanded- for dungeons (which is fine for me since it gets boring after a while), but is a nasty class for roaming in small groups or alone due you can’t have sustained swiftness without taking sacrifices in you loadout, you can´t make a condition-based build, your ranged weapons are mediocre and you lack ranged AoE. You can’t also make a build based on sustained cc.

But I’m not crying: I have 5 characters at 80, so when I want to have fun I just put my -main- Guardian in a corner, I take my Warrior and I use my crit build, my bleed build or my stun build and I get that fun.

Dune.2904:

And when you ask them, most of the Guardians who play that way don’t even run Full Berserker Gear. Soldier Gear! Why in god’s name would you play Soldier Gear in a kittening Dungeon Run.

Because we are boring of raising berserk players from the floor.

Seriously. In the game (PvE + Dungeons) only a few monsters are capable to one-shot you; going full berserker turns a Guardian into a glass cannon with barely 13.000 HP, which means that suddenly a ton of monsters are capable to insta-gib you, which also means that the margin for error/window for mistakes becames very, very narrow.

Now take a look about the most repeteadly done path in the game: CoF P1. The final boss is the most well known fight in the whole game and still you will find people falling back under the AoE knockbacks, failing in the use of evades, blocks or stability. But people in PUGs -fortunately- doesn’t usually die due they take corservative approachs about their builds to compensate their lack of skill or incidentals (which doesn’t only involves knowledge and practice but also things like lag). At the end, the job gets done, everyone lives and instead of taking “x” time takes “x2”. No big drama.

Full damage builds in dungeons only works when 1) Everyone knowns what must do (which doesn’t apply in PUGs) and 2) Everyone goes full damage. So, you can kill, lets say, the incinerators, so fast that they are dead before their damage became a threat. But when only half of the party goes full berserk then bad things happens, because sometimes foes doesn’t die fast enough, and then the “squishy pro elite zerks” start to fall like flies.

I run a 80% berserker Warrior in dungeons (weapons, trinkets, most of armor) but for my Guardian I like a lot more to use Soldier (P/v/t) armor + Soldier Runes (and a mix between zerk and knight trinkets). I provide group stability, group regenaration, group pasive healing, group aegis, group damage reduction, and if the team is squishy I can bring Tome of Valor for huge team healings. I also provide Wall of Reflection 35% of time if is needed, an unvaluable tool which in dungeons as Arah and high level Fractals successful prevents team wipes.

“Bu-bu-bu-but… is slow!” Who cares. We are talking here about PUGs, if you want it faster then play with the teammates from your guild or something else. There’s another reason for starters to not going full zerk as a Guardian: economy. Soldier, Knight or Celestial stats are usefull for every content in the game, full berserker si useless in most of WvW encouters (outside duels) for Guardians.

Dommmmmmmmmm.6984:

Buran.3796:

A Warrior wielding greatsword and sword and using the mobile strike trait and the Bull Rush skill is arguably more faster/has better mobility than any Thief build

Um… what? Surely you can’t be serious. I’ll race you on my Thief against your maximum mobility Warrior. I’m willing to wager 200 gold that there’s no way in hell Warrior has better mobility than Thief.

I don’t belive so. I use a Guardian for guild raids but for roaming I use a Warrior due how fast He can cover the landscape and how effortlesy can disengage and outrun enemy forces without giving up damage or tankiness.

Think about: the Warrior has an elite skill which happens to be both his best dueling elite and which can be traited to grant perma-swiftness (Signet of Rage). He can also have a 25% faster speed just using a trait (Warrior’s Sprint) without wasting a utility skill slot (Signet of Shadows, I’m looking at you!). It happens also that the same trait line (Discipline) in which are located both the signet cooldown reduction (Signet Mastery) and Warrior’s Sprint offers two ultra appealing perks: Fast Hands and Mobile Strikes. Fast Hands is uber useful as tactical tool, and Mobile Strikes combined with weapons as the Greatsword, Sword and utilities as Bull’s Charge makes most of attempts of stopping a warrior in a run away just hopeless except against zergs stacking skills over time -which aren’t that problematic due zergs are easy to see and avoid-.

My current build for roaming as a Warrior uses Melandru runes + condition reduction food, Dogged March and Last Stand; He moves faster than any other roamer I have found in WvW for weeks, He’s tanky enough to survive ambushes from a couple of thieves focusing his burst on Him and being able to run away without problem. Of course as a Thief most of players can just disengage risky fights just with stealth, but in terms of speed (to being able to go from end to end of the map) even remotely close to a Warrior you must tune the Thief in ways that badly hurts his output damage. That doesn’t happens with the Warrior.

Just to be clear: I’m not saying that Warriors are better than Thieves for foaming purposes -the aren’t), I’m saying that Warrior currently have better speed/mobility and that can be useful for that kind of gameplay.

A Warrior wielding greatsword and sword and using the mobile strike trait and the Bull Rush skill is arguably more faster/has better mobility than any Thief build; stealth can provide better survability but a lot of times is used mainly as a “panic button” which means that your Thief is not doing the job very well.

So… I think that there’s some classes that can be as valid for roaming as the Thief; I also think that due the nature of stealth the thieves performance is a bit weak in small groups.

As I said before 1 player beating several players in a row -some of them at the same time- is more about that player tailored to duel/roam and fueled by experience and motivation than about a particular class better than other.

I was watching yesterday some vids involving a single warrior fighting against 1+ players, some of them thieves, and having no problem against the use of stealth; even more: sometimes in terms of mobility and disengage they can outmach a thieve:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BboMWbNP-eU

Grats to the AR players in the Baruch borderline this night; you were able to take the central two times and recover the bay area and the hills another couple of times, providing strong fights -in which you did better and were more successful-. Maybe your population and cover over time isn’t as strong, but in “prime time” you’re a force to be feared, for sure. My respect.

I don’t think of Thieves being as problematic at all. First of all, in which context those thieves were killing the players? Something like this?:

1. Thieves specifically tailored to roaming/duels, having full exotics/ascendant gear, traited specifically to kill fast and having easy access to retreat skills in case of facing strong opposition, and which are using -expensive- food enhancements in order to better do they task.

1. Thieves also controlled by players devoted mostly to roaming/duels, with extensive experience in 1 vs 1/x combat which actively search for targets, with the solely purpose of killing players, having such specific kind of mentality and behavior.

…Which catch and kill some random players mostly not tailored in traits and gear to duels, with low/no experience in roaming, which probably didn’t even eat food enhancers and which attitude was probably to elude to fight at all cost except once in a zerg?

Because if that was the scenary I find those deaths justified and no “omg thives op” at all. To some extent the game is very balanced, is really HARD for any good player of any class to beat two enemy good players if everyone is traited for 1 vs 1.

In this game builds made for guild vs guild oftenly doesn’t work too well in 1 vs 1. I refuse to accept that 5 good players can’t beat 2 good players if they play in the same conditions. Which drives me to the conclusion that you where not 5 duel players but just 5 random pugs with no focus/gear/food/mentaliy to duel, in which case a defeat is just normal. I’m saying this as a Guardian/Warrior player, I dont think that Thieves are so hard, despite I known that with some builds to outmatch a foe in duels is impossible. Solution: rebuild your character to play in those situations or evade chances of being camped alone if your regular build is meant to play in large groups.

Morgenes.6985:

Fear the mighty Abaddon blob……. (see attachements)

Short overview of servers I have played on (p), or played against (a).

(a) Vizunah – blobbing
(p) SFR – blobbing
(p) Elona Reach – blobbing
(a) Desolation – blobbing
(p) Kodash – blobbing
(a) Jade Sea – blobbing
(a) Gandara – blobbing
(a) Riverside – blobbing
(a) Fort Ranik – blobbing
(a) Piken Square – blobbing
(a) Far Shiverpeaks – blobbing
(p) Millers Sound – blobbing
(a) Baruch Bay – DEFINITELY NOT BLOBBING…NEVER, NOT A SINGLE TIME!!!111
(a) Augury Rock – DEFINITELY NOT BLOBBING…NEVER, NOT A SINGLE TIME!!!111

ok!
Some people really have no idea what WvW is about or live in their own little world filled with rainbows, unicorns and bees flying around flowers when it comes to appraise their own server.

I was in the middle of the fight from your two last pictures:

My guild (DF) had like 10-12 players for most of the night due the server queue; when I was able to join to the map (around 23:10 local time) we were barely about 15, more or less like LEX -so we were teamworking in the same TS despite not always fighting together the same places-. We were warding the Astralholme camp and covering the trebuchets at the crag and resuplying when the main zerg arrived from the canyon; then forces from AR also arrived, starting a battle for over four minutes (fellow members from VF also took part in the battle). BULL arrived near the end, but at that time the fate of the battle was already solved.

I think that we weren’t riding a blob at all that night, and we were outnumbered for most of that fight. Anyway, I must ad that I had fun and I’m positively impressed by the Abaddon’s Mouth performance along this matchup, despite large zergs aren’t my favourite fights. Seems that to some extent the Stalin’s quote “quantity is a kind of qualkity itself” hides some amount of truth :p

Esplen.3940:

Jorase.5892:

silverfire.2547:

XP utility infusion for the win.

More skill points = more superior siege, or more skill points to convert into gold.

Made about 20 gold this past weekend off of skill points from WvW alone. Not as good as if I spent the whole time playing Trade Post PvP or PvE, but at least I got to do something I enjoy doing.

Gold off of skillpoints?

Teach me please.

Mystic Forge/Convert Skill Points —> Items.

Gold Find/Magic Find/Exp From Kills/Karma does not affect this at all.

Karma can be used to get Lost Orrian Jewelry Boxes and those ones can drop tier 6 items, which means money; karma is also useful (needed) to build legendary weapons. Due karma can be obtained in almost every department (PvE/dungeons/WvWvW…) the extra 15% karma infusion for amulets is very useful.