Guild Wars 2

deathTouch you’re arguing with people who don’t exist

Glad that got cleared up, one of the important things to my guild is ethics. We don’t exploit in any aspect to the game and we’re proud of it.

I explained what I did to make money before this here
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/players/How-do-people-have-so-much-money/first#post353133

I still think it’s better the way it was before. Clover RNG is fine because the odds of getting clovers is high enough that after enough tries the chance of not getting the clovers is negligable. The RNG using 4 lvl 80 weapons before the update was harsh but still gave you a reasonable chance for a base weapon after trying enough times.

Now the chances are so low, I’m not very good at math but I’m sure someone can calculate the chance of not getting one after 2000 tries, I’m sure that number is high enough to cause worries.

Either way, not much point in arguing it anymore, everyone has made up their mind about it. I believe the situation is bad for the game, others believe it’s fine.

I’ll come back to this issue if we ever get enough data to see what the chance to get a base weapon is per attempt, and then have someone to calculate what the chance is someone will get one with 1000 attempts or 2000 attempts. Right with a relatively data pool the chance to get a base is 0.5-0.6% per attempt so someone who can do math good can figure out what the chance is is you take a sample size of 1000 or 2000 but the chance may not be accurate due to lack of data.

azazil.9541:

*"it would kill my market and stop me from making easy money off base weapons.

The funny thing it was actually fine before the “bug fix”, it was nearly impossible to make money off it then without exploiting the bug."*

This are just your words…

Yes, it’s the truth, it was nearly impossible to make money off the base weapons if you got them legitimately. It was possible to make a lot of money off them if you exploited the bug.

Nowhere did I say I was making money off exploited weapons. I got the weapons legit so I wasn’t making money off them.

Reading comprehension.

azazil.9541:

Cerise.9045:

azazil.9541:

Cerise.9045:

Alright fine, you guys are right, this new system is perfect the way it is, the old system where the chances of getting a base weapon with enough tries was more reasonable was terrible.

You win, lets encourage arenet to keep the changes, I’ll keep making hundreds of gold off this new system.

Good for you but are you sure you readed first post of this topic ? And if you are angry for it going to cut your earnings sorry bud but we are talking here for greater good not for personal story and gains.

My suggestions are for the betterment of the whole game, it would cost me hundreds of gold if my suggestions are used because it would kill my market and stop me from making easy money off base weapons. I just want the game to be better.

But if you want the base weapon process to stay dumb the way it is then great, I get to make more money this way.

The funny thing it was actually fine before the “bug fix”, it was nearly impossible to make money off it then without exploiting the bug.

Well if you readed my suggestions at first page and others I’m Just suggestioning “Precursors must be account bound with some type of recipes”.. and i guess and looks like we agreed on that.

and also looks like you confessed using exploits before patch for making money with selling precursors.

I didn’t even know about the exploit until the bug was fixed. How are you suggesting I used it?

azazil.9541:

Cerise.9045:

Alright fine, you guys are right, this new system is perfect the way it is, the old system where the chances of getting a base weapon with enough tries was more reasonable was terrible.

You win, lets encourage arenet to keep the changes, I’ll keep making hundreds of gold off this new system.

Good for you but are you sure you readed first post of this topic ? And if you are angry for it going to cut your earnings sorry bud but we are talking here for greater good not for personal story and gains.

My suggestions are for the betterment of the whole game, it would cost me hundreds of gold if my suggestions are used because it would kill my market and stop me from making easy money off base weapons. I just want the game to be better.

But if you want the base weapon process to stay dumb the way it is then great, I get to make more money this way.

The funny thing it was actually fine before the “bug fix”, it was nearly impossible to make money off it then without exploiting the bug.

Alright fine, you guys are right, this new system is perfect the way it is, the old system where the chances of getting a base weapon with enough tries was more reasonable was terrible.

You win, lets encourage arenet to keep the changes, I’ll keep making hundreds of gold off this new system.

lackofcheese.5617:

Cerise.9045:

Making base weapons more RNG based to obtain DOES NOT MAKE LEGENDARIES HARDER TO OBTAIN

Actually, despite your bold, italics, and capitals, it does.

Cerise.9045:

this has nothing to do with making legendaries rarer or harder to get

While I won’t speculate on the reasons for ArenaNet choosing RNG as the source of precursors, I definitely can speak about the effects. The lower the chance of getting a precursor from the recipe, the rarer it becomes, and the harder it is to get.

The 5 base weapons in my bank say otherwise.

It’s just RNG.

Making base weapons more RNG based to obtain DOES NOT MAKE LEGENDARIES HARDER TO OBTAIN

All it does is make it require more RNG.

The increase in rarity on the base weapons made them value at 80% or more of the total value of a legendary weapon.

80% of getting a legendary is based on throwing a 5000 sided dice and getting a specific number

someone had their head on backwards when they thought this was good game design

I’m really happy I got this part of my legendary out of the way on launch, before this stupid move was made.

Let me put on my game design hat for this.

Want to make a legendary cost more money?

• Increase the price of icy lodestones, or increase the amount of ecto needed.

Want to make taking a legendary take longer?

• Increase the skill point requirement, or the karma requirement.

Want to make people hate the game and question the developers sanity?

• Take a component for the legendary that used to have a reasonable chance of obtaining it trough the forge or had the alternative of buying it at a reasonable price and change it so that it’s rarer than winning the lottery or more expensive than any of the other components for the legendary combined.

this has nothing to do with making legendaries rarer or harder to get

All this does is make it MORE RANDOM

@jihoko I’m sorry you typed up such a huge post, but ChairGraveyard

Your post is aimed at “people who want a legendary base weapon with no effort”

These people do not exist, at least none of them have posted in this thread so far. So your whole argument is with people who don’t exist.

This is not true.

Before the “bug fix” every 1000 level 80 rare weapons thrown in the mystic forge produced on average 8 legendary base weapons.

This information was gathered by several people in my guild using only level 80 weapons, not the bugged level 65-75 weapon combinations. This was done with over 10000 weapons used and the average ended up being about 8 per 1000 So we ended up with a lot of base weapons. In other words, 1 per every 150 rare weapons.

After the “bug fix” this has been reduced to LESS than 2 per 1000 on average. We’ve gotten close 5000 trials(roughly 15000 weapons used) . In other words this is less than 1 per 500 rare weapons.

Other guilds I’m in contact with who have performed the same tests have gotten the same results.

Temper.7265:

For some people,the market is the game.They play the Auction Houses,Trading Posts or whatever and rarely set a foot into the world that the devs built for them.And if they go bust,it dosn’t matter,they can just buy more in game currency with RL cash (legal or otherwise)

Sadly this type of eco gamer can have adverse effects on a games economy for players that actually play the game attached to the trading systems.

While it’s not my cup of tea,to hurt a games economy,some type of people gain pleasure from this eco manipulation.It’s not about the games community for them,it’s about what they can manipulate economy wise,because….they can.

At any rate,I never buy or sell on the markets in games because I prefer to just play the game that came attached to the market system,and if items that are required to progress become out of my price range or just plain unnatainable,I move on to another game.

I never manipulate the market, I just work with the numbers it gives me, I explained my main method for getting money on page 1.

Why do you think people need to buy money with gems or gold farming sites? I made my money perfectly fine without either of those.

roqoco.4053:

Being rich in MMOs is overrated. The only use of gold is to get items that should act as long term goals too quickly, so that you have little else to do in the game. Everything else in the game is quite easily obtainable by just playing the game normally.

Wut? I played GW1 for 7000 hours and had obsidian armor in less than 300. I play the game because the game allows me to do things that I have fun doing. I don’t play just to reach some arbitrary goals, that’s why I never look at the game one day and say “well I guess there’s nothing to do now”. I keep playing the game and keep enjoying it. And if I get cool stuff before everyone else then I enjoy it even more. Being richer than everyone also helps.

What’s wrong with having a class that rises above other classes in group situations and is not as good in 1v1 situations?

The increase in rarity on the base weapons made them value at 80% or more of the total value of a legendary weapon.

80% of getting a legendary is based on throwing a 5000 sided dice and getting a specific number

someone had their head on backwards when they thought this was good game design

I’m really happy I got this part of my legendary out of the way on launch, before this stupid move was made.

Let me put on my game design hat for this.

Want to make a legendary cost more money?

• Increase the price of icy lodestones, or increase the amount of ecto needed.

Want to make taking a legendary take longer?

• Increase the skill point requirement, or the karma requirement.

Want to make people hate the game and question the developers sanity?

• Take a component for the legendary that used to have a reasonable chance of obtaining it trough the forge or had the alternative of buying it at a reasonable price and change it so that it’s rarer than winning the lottery or more expensive than any of the other components for the legendary combined.

Just buy more bag slots with the handy gem store!

While I can farm a full exotic set in a few days or afford it by playing the TP for a day, most people seem to need weeks, even more than a month to hit the “gear ceiling”.

Or they can just enter their CC info and hit it in 5 minutes.

I use karma boosters in WvW that’s about it.

Cisza.9540:

So Dusk costs 300g. You can make it in a week or 2 when “playing” AH. It’s a part of legendary weapon. Ppl had no problem when they heard that it will takes months to get their legendary. But then someone else did the hard job and got it in 2 weeks, so crying started – “I’m not that good/smart/have enough time – so give me legendary for free.”

Same thing happened with Diablo 3 Inferno Mode:
1. Blizz said: “Inferno will take months to beat” – Funs: “Hurray”
2. Group of 4 hardcore players with hours and hours spent in game, really skilled etc etc beats Inferno in 2 weeks – Funs: “I’m too kitteny to beat inferno, I want same achievement as they did even thou I’m crap and 13 y/o, nerf Inferno”
3. Blizz nerfs Inferno.
4. Players stop playing Diablo.

I really, really hope AN won’t do same mistake as Blizz.

They already did the opposite.

The same week people got the first legendaries ANet put a cap on karma gained per day so it now takes months to get one.

This is the equivalent of blizzard putting a cap on inferno that only allows you to complete one quest per week.

They’re not making it harder, they’re just artificially stonewalling people.

They are bugged for me a well.

This was changed in a patch a few days ago. For some reason ANet decided to change how gathering works and put it into the game without including it in the patch notes. Why the secrecy?

Is this an attempt to stop botters? I’ve yet to see any gathering bots.
Is this an attempt to stop exploiters? What exploit are they trying to fix?
Why does this affect people just playing the game normally? Didn’t they test these changes?

Please add changes like this to the patch notes.

Super commonly known way to make infinite money without exploiting coming up now pay attention. This is the easiest way to make money and as long as you’re doing it with a fast moving item it’s extremely low risk. Try this with slow moving items at your own risk because you could wake up the next day and see the item dropped by 10 silver or nobody is buying your stock or both.

This method is called “flipping” and all the cool kids are doing this in extremely large quantities and it’s the easiest thing ever so why aren’t you doing it?

step 1 ) find a random item on the trading post, lets say large fangs
step 2 ) look at the highest buy order for the item, lets say for the fangs it’s 45 copper
step 3 ) look at the highest sell order for the item, lets say it’s 60 copper
step 4 ) to figure out what you’ll actually earn multiply sell price by .85, so it is 51 copper
step 5 ) subtract the buy order price from the sell order price, if it’s 0 or a negative number, go back to step 1, in this case we’re in luck! . 85*60-45 =6 whole copper! so keep going to step 6
step 6 ) place a buy order at the lowest buy offer for like 10 of the item you found, the fangs would cost us 4 silver 50 copper
step 7 ) wait for the buy order to be filled, if it takes too long go back to step 1, since fangs move at light speed go to step 8
step 8 ) retrieve all your bought items from the TP, then make a sell listing for them at the lowest sell listing Do not undercut, you’re ruining profits for everyone including yourself. The trading post uses a filo system which means if you’re the latest person to list an item, your items will sell before the people who put the items up before you! If you match the lowest seller your items will sell just as fast as they would when undercutting because of this system. Since your items won’t sell faster when undercutting, there’s no benefit to doing it
step 9 ) wait for the items to sell, if it takes too long you just found a slow moving item go back to step 1, since fangs sell lickity split, they should be gone before you switch to the pickup tab
step 10 ) congratulations you just made 60 copper without moving a single step away from the trading post NPC! Bask in your new riches.
step 11 ) go back to step 6 and repeat 6-10 about a million times or until you get carpal tunnel syndrome
step 12 ) you are now rich, watch as people accuse you of being an exploiters as they fly into a jealous fit of rage once they see all the money you made off humble large fangs

You can’t see around corners by changing the FoV

I gambled all my money on some random crafting material when the game came out. I bought hundreds of them.

One week later all those crafting items went up in price by 2000%, so I multiplied my money by 20.

Now I make money by flipping high profit items in batches of 250.

SHM.7628:

Cerise.9045:

Silencer

Are you saying the people who were getting 100k+ karma in “an hour and a half” were somehow exploiting?

Of course they weren’t, they were doing the same things that people have been doing since BWE1 and every stress test. There is no exploiting here at all, arenanet even acknowledged their work by congratulating them on their legendary.

Nobody got rolled back, nobody was banned.
It’s called playing the game.

Wait a minute. 100k karma an hour? How is that even possible? I don’t see how its possible to do that without hacking the game.

“Hour and a half” was a quote from the post by silencer.
What happened was that people who got their legendary without exploiting were getting anywhere from 70k simply grinding or upwards of 120k with hardcore grinding and karma boosters per day. Somehow silencer turned this into “an hour and a half”.

You are probably using some kind of magic anti DR hax then because if I do more than 10 events in an hour DR hits me no matter what event I do or how far they are apart.

Why aren’t overhauls to the gathering system put into the patch notes?

ANet was completely aware of how much karma people were getting during beta doing these things, and they were completely fine with it.

ANet is completely aware of how much karma the people who got their legendary were getting, and they were completely fine with it.

There is no exploiting involved in any, there are no loopholes, of this, all of this has been well known since people started playing the game for the first time. ANet has made this clear by supporting the people who obtained their legendary. If they got it through exploiting, they would have been banned.

Now people are getting slapped in the face by doing the exact same thing. No exploits, no loopholes, just playing the game the same way it has always been played, except now the game is telling people to stop playing completely.

Silencer

Are you saying the people who were getting 100k+ karma in “an hour and a half” were somehow exploiting?

Of course they weren’t, they were doing the same things that people have been doing since BWE1 and every stress test. There is no exploiting here at all, arenanet even acknowledged their work by congratulating them on their legendary.

Nobody got rolled back, nobody was banned.
It’s called playing the game.

Suraknar, all the DR is doing is making the grind for gear take longer and make it more monotonous, so it has the opposite effect of what you want the game to be.

It’s not even a grind for gear, gear is easy to get if you really want it, you need to look around and talk with people to figure out a good way to get it sure, but once you figure out how to get the components and money it doesn’t take too long. Sure a lot of people have trouble figuring out a good way to get these things, but there’s nothing arenanet can do about people not wanting to take 10 minutes to learn how to make money.

Arenanet put in cosmetic gear for a reason, to provide long term goals. You have cultural armor that costs over 100g, weapons that cost anywhere from 50 to 500g in materials. Usually the coolest ones are the most expensive, you can even get a greatsword that looks like the summoned greatsword from the elementalist elite skill.

Before you get even close to getting any of these things, you’re already way past done “exploring” the world. The word isn’t infinite and neither is the number of events. Sooner or later you will have to end up repeating the same content or move on to a different game. I have over 7000 hours played in GW1. A lot of that was doing pvp, which takes place on the same handful of maps, a lot of that was repeating visits to areas I already cleared 5000 hours before that. But I still had a lot of fun doing that because I liked playing the game.

Maybe you’re the kind of person who gets bored after they’re done exploring and there’s nothing new left in the game for you to see, but there are a lot of people who have fun playing the game because it’s a great game and playing it after finishing it gives them progress towards new long-term goals.

One of the great tings about Guild Wars is that the long terms goals don’t give you better stats than anyone else. Instead of repeating the same dungeons over and over to get +10 strength which lets you go do the next dungeon over and over, you can do whatever you like doing most and the rewards are purely cosmetic.

So when you’ve explored everything and you get bored with the game, I’ll still be having fun with the game getting cooler armor and weapons for my character.

Putting the DR in the game made the game a lot less fun for people who plan on spending more time on the game beyond just exploring every zone. Instead of playing the game and slowly working on new cosmetics to make their characters cooler, what happens if you play the game for 15 minutes is the game giving you a message saying “YOU HAVE BEEN MARKED AS A BOTTER/EXPLOITER AND YOU DON’T GET ANYTHING ANYMORE GO PLAY A DIFFERENT GAME”

What kind of way is that to treat people who will be playing the game longer than the people who just want to explore a bit then move on to a different game?

Suraknar, all the DR is doing is making the grind for gear take longer and make it more monotonous, so it has the opposite effect of what you want the game to be.

It’s not even a grind for gear, gear is easy to get if you really want it, you need to look around and talk with people to figure out a good way to get it sure, but once you figure out how to get the components and money it doesn’t take too long. Sure a lot of people have trouble figuring out a good way to get these things, but there’s nothing arenanet can do about people not wanting to take 10 minutes to learn how to make money.

Arenanet put in cosmetic gear for a reason, to provide long term goals. You have cultural armor that costs over 100g, weapons that cost anywhere from 50 to 500g in materials. Usually the coolest ones are the most expensive, you can even get a greatsword that looks like the summoned greatsword from the elementalist elite skill.

Before you get even close to getting any of these things, you’re already way past done “exploring” the world. The word isn’t infinite and neither is the number of events. Sooner or later you will have to end up repeating the same content or move on to a different game. I have over 7000 hours played in GW1. A lot of that was doing pvp, which takes place on the same handful of maps, a lot of that was repeating visits to areas I already cleared 5000 hours before that. But I still had a lot of fun doing that because I liked playing the game.

Maybe you’re the kind of person who gets bored after they’re done exploring and there’s nothing new left in the game for you to see, but there are a lot of people who have fun playing the game because it’s a great game and playing it after finishing it gives them progress towards new long-term goals.

One of the great tings about Guild Wars is that the long terms goals don’t give you better stats than anyone else. Instead of repeating the same dungeons over and over to get +10 strength which lets you go do the next dungeon over and over, you can do whatever you like doing most and the rewards are purely cosmetic.

So when you’ve explored everything and you get bored with the game, I’ll still be having fun with the game getting cooler armor and weapons for my character.

If I do more than 1 event per 15 minutes I get my rewards cut out.

Only solution to this that I can think of is sitting in a camp all day doing the same event over and over and over and over and over until I am done working on my legendary.

Does that sound fun to anyone?

I think the last patch lowered the DR treshhold.

I made 7k karma in about1 hour doing events, before the patch the DR would have kicked in at 4k karma

Edit: my mistake, tried to get some more karma, got slapped in the face with DR before I got 5k

Rukia.4802:

I think it’s good what they’re trying to accomplish, would you rather this be WoW where stacks of elementium ore go from 200g a stack to 16g – 20g a stack due to botters essentially making any farming you do a complete waste? I sure as hell don’t.

DR may be horrible now but in the long run it will be adjusted and you will be thanking ANet for the system later. Jon already stated that they don’t frown on farming, so it will be fixed to where we can farm safely. That’s all I needed to hear.

For too long bots have completely ruined economy, and if I decide to farm something I expect to make a good profit off of it for my time.

karma has no gold value, it can’t be sold, it can’t be traded in any way, it has no connection to the economy in any way

You pretty much summed it up, if you want to avoid DR completely and still get rewards you need to sit in one camp and repeat one even over and over and over and over.

However it’s not really efficient for karma, those events usually take 5 minues and take 10 minutes to restart, so you’re looking at maybe 1.4 karma per hour…. that’s insane. The people who were farming for the legendary before the DR were getting 10k karma per hour easily, 15-20k per hour with a booster if they were really trying.

I made to make a guardian to keep up with other people farming for a legendary… sadface.

I don’t really think anyone finds WvW more fun when there are 100 people from your team on the map and 5 people from the other team. Sure it maybe be fun for 15 minutes, but the novelty wears off really fast.

The Mega Destroyer is the funnest world boss.

Whoever designed him should rework the shatterer, claw, and tequatl. And should be in charge of future world bosses.

Only thing disappointing about the mega destroyer is that it uses a really commonly used destroyer model. Couldn’t we have gotten a model like the Great Destroyer? All the other dragons get an infinity champion supply, why can’t Primordius?

The only reason this is happening is because people were allowed to make hundreds of gold through these exploits and get away with it.

People who asked to “promise to delete their gains” when they got unbanned after getting money and legendary base weapons through exploits, but they never deleted anything, and ended up having hundreds of gold and in some cases upwards of 20 legendary base weapons like dusk and dawn just setting in their bank or they were put on the trading post.

The recent bug that allowed legendary bases to be made with level 65 items made this even worse. Some people got 10-20 of these weapons, and they never faced any consequences for exploiting this bug.

This led to the economy being flushed down the toilet, probably permanently.

A lot of the damage can still be repaired, the first thing anet has to do is delete all the dozens of base weapons that people got essentially for free. Then they need to look through the logs of people who are KNOWN exploiters and ban the people who sold or kept the legendary base weapons weapons they got for free, because there are a lot of them still in circulation, and untold amounts of them being kept in peoples banks. If these people sent away the money they got from selling these weapons for hundreds of golds, this money needs to be tracked through the logs and removed from the economy.

I’m on a server marked as “Full” and I run into 2-3 people every hour on the level 15-75 zones. The only zones where I ever run into enough people to actually do group events are Cursed Shore and Malchor’s Leap(for temples only prety much) Frostgorge sound has content up to level 80, but the only event where I ever see any people is the Claw of Jormage. Once he dies and I start running around to do other events, all the people went poof and I’m back to doing events on my own again.

I’m very happy to have zones like Cursed Shore where I can do events with other people without having to spam map chat for so long the event already finished and restarted from the beginning by the time someone replies to it. Although Cursed Shore is completely on the opposite side of the spectrum, there are so many people every single event related monster except champions/veterans dies before it can even do a single attack animation.

It would be nice if there were places to go with a middle ground between these extremes. Doing events in Iron Marches doesn’t magically become more fun just because it drops level 80 loot now, there need to actually be people there to make the events more interesting.

If every zone becomes a level 80 zone then it would just spread people too thin to regularly run into other people.

If this solution could be merged in with a system that congregates servers for maps, like reverse-overflow servers, it could make the game a LOT more interesting.

These issues are too complex for a yes or no answer to provide useful information.

I spent $150 to get the collector’s edition.

500 hours, 2 80s in full exotics and magic find sets, 5000 kills in WvW, nearly 100 tournaments won, almost done making a legendary weapon. So yes, it was worth it.

Want to keep playing this game for a long time, but it seems like the game doesn’t want me to play it, I had 3 weeks of broken dungeons not giving me anything, and now doing events isn’t giving me anything if I play more than 30 minutes. If they fix all this and stop breaking something different every week I would gladly buy the game again if I had the chance, or buy an expansion.

Arcalas.9368:

Humposaurus.5764:

@Arcalas and all other farm bashers, great that you like to not farm and that you have not had issues with the DR. But please try to also look from an another player’s perspective. Some of us (a minority or not) like to farm efficient.

If your a gamer that havn’t had problems with the DR, then thats great for you. But don’t come here telling other people that what they are experiencing wouldn’t happen if they played this game the way you do.

We all like to play our games our own way. Some like to get to the max point ASAP, while other like to stare at a tree 5 minutes. Should we be punished for playing the game? The answer is obviously NO!

As for the statement that we rush through to many events to quickly. It isn’t our fault that DE’s give gold medals after a single kill. Why should I waste my precious time on completing one event, when I can tag 5 events in the same timeframe?

Instead of implementing a system that hurts efficient players, they should have gone and:
- Either up the difficulty of the DE’s so it will be harder for them to complete.
- Make it that you need to at least finish 70% of the DE in order to obtain gold. Also make the difference between bronze, silver and gold larger. Right now the difference between silver and gold is maybe 50 karma.

Hump i know it looks alot like im trying to tell ppl how to do something but u have to see what could happen if they didnt have the DR in the game. If DR was not in the game some farmers would stop playing the game after they got everything they wanted in about 2 to 3 weeks. But i have a feeling anet will change how far the DR will go later one when more stuff comes out or they see not many ppl are farming some areas like orr.

Honestly just wait to see what anet does cuz things do change just like they made it some what punishing for some ppl who over do it. Example is with the token rewards at first it would take u forever to get some of the token rewards and now they made it so on your first time on a path u get 60 at the end instead of 30 when finishing that path. Things change just wait it out to see.

Wut? I played GW1 for 7000+ hours over the past 7 years. I got obsidian armor in the first few months with less than 200 hours played, and yet I kept playing the game for another 6800 hours. Why? Because it was a fun game that I loved to play.

GW2 is also a fun game that I love to play, for about 20 minutes, because then DR slaps me in the face and tells me to stop.

It’s not the players wanting to leave the game, it’s the game making people leave the game.

JonPeters.5630:

While we need a safety net to stop unanticipated economy-breaking exploits and botting, we have no desire to stop farming. Farmers are a part every online economy and when they are doing normal game activity they do not cause any harm. If a player finds a normal game activity fun and would like to keep doing it, that’s fine with us.

Thanks for this explanation Jon, this post has cleared up a lot of paranoia and confusion.

The part about the economy is still confusing though. Since the change to karma weapons making them impossible to sell or use on the forge, there is no known way to trade karma with other players or use karma for economical gain. So why the suppression on karma gain specifically?

This isn’t the first time ArenaNet tried to curb farming. Remember Ursaway? In GW1 Ursaway was the best way to farm and clear hard content for a year or so, then ArenaNet suddenly decided it’s not ok anymore, so they change the skill and now everyone runs shadow form assassins(after a dozen nerfs).

The different between these cases is that the Ursaway nerf only affected the Ursan Blessing skill, you could just do a different build and still farm things. The DR on karma affects everyone.

Xagar.6512:

People need to understand that the DR affecting events done by normal play is a (admittedly terrible) bug and not intended (just with Occam’s Razor).

This is the most likely reason.

Tallenn.9218:

Irishbrewed.6537:

If someone could clarify what exactly they are doing when they get DRs it would be greatly appreciated.

This is why I have been asking people to start uploading videos with examples of DR triggering.

I am in the same boat- I play what I consider to be “normally”, and have not as yet run into the DR code. Many other people are saying they are also playing “normally”, but DO seem to trigger it. I’d like to get a look at some footage, and see what it is they are doing differently.

The people who were going for a legendary were getting 70k+ karma per day, some were getting 120k karma in a day easily when using a karma booster.

these people are not doing anything differently than what people were doing during every single BWE and the stress tests

ArenaNet knew exactly how much karma were getting for playing the game before the game was released. Reducing this karma gain by such a huge amount makes no sense unless it’s actually a side-effect of trying to stop bots or something.

Using the exact same method people were using to farm legendaries, the DR kicks in after getting about 4k karma, and you stop getting karma after another 500 or so.

So instead of getting 70-120 karma per day, which arenanet never had any problems with at all, you now get 4500 karma doing the same things.

I really don’t think this change was meant to affect regular players, it was meant to affect bots and exploiters but someone put an “if” where an “else” was supposed to be, and then they just pushed it live without properly testing it.

Lets just hope it doesn’t take 3 weeks to fix this like the dungeon patch did…

Fiontar.4695:

I wanted to inject something, because it’s very relevant to the entire concept that players need to be prevented from advancing too quickly, or playing too much.

I hit the level cap with my Elementalist at around the 135 hour mark. I have now logged almost 245 hours with that same character. I haven’t touched a dungeon yet. I have only done a little WvW and even less sPvP. I have never sat in one place grinding. I’ve bought or crafted the more easily available Exotics as I’ve been able to afford to during normal play, currently two accessories short of a full set of exotic armor, accessories and three exotic weapons.

I haven’t played to pursue the End Game Gear Grind. I’ve played to have fun enjoying the game world. I still only have map completion in the 60s. I play the game like it’s one massive Skyrim and have been having a blast doing so.

The original design was correct. The entire game is “end game” There is no need for an “end game gear grind”. It doesn’t matter one spit that I hit the level cap in two weeks, or that I have over 365 hours of total time played on my account. I was still having a blast playing the game as it was originally intended!?

DR doesn’t really do anything about the “endgame gear grind”. The crafted gear is still the easiest gear to get by far and it has the same stats as dungeon gear and karma temple gear.

I played GW1 for over 7000 hours and was still having fun. Right now I have 5000 kills in WvW, approaching 100 tournament wins in SPvP, I have 2 level 80 characters, I completely every path in every dungeon, most of them several times. I did them even though a BUG with the DR was giving me 6 tokens and 2s instead of 60 tokens and 26s, why? Because they were fun. I explored the whole world and saw everything it had to offer, I did every single event and heart in the game at least once, I explored jumping puzzles and went into every nook and cranny to discover cool new things and learn more about the lore. Am I getting bored with the game? Hell no. With things the way they were, I was looking forward to another 8000 hours of playing the game at least.

But now I’m constantly being slapped in the face by DR telling me “STOP PLAYING THE GAME” and “GO PLAY A DIFFERENT GAME” and every time it rears its ugly head it sounds a little more convincing than the last time.

DR doesn’t really do anything about the “endgame gear grind”. The crafted gear is still the easiest gear to get by far and it has the same stats as dungeon gear and karma temple gear.

But it does make it so instead of spending 3 weeks to get the karma for a legendary that people have already made, it now takes 4-6 months, probably longer as you’ll probably get burned out long before you get there unless you are some kind of robot.

ArenaNet knew exactly how much karma were getting for playing the game before the game was released. Reducing this karma gain by such a huge amount makes no sense unless it’s actually a side-effect of trying to stop bots or something.

I’m kinda hoping the DR is just bugged or wronly implemented, like the dungeon DR giving people 6 tokens instead of 60 on their first clear.

We need some kind of indicator on the UI that tells us that we’re doing too many events per hour and we should go craft or spvp or play a different game or something.

I spent the day looking at how bad the DR is. It seems like I can play normally for about 30 minutes before DR kicks in, then I have to switch to an alt and go gather stuff doing my best to avoid all events. Then I switch back to my main and karma is back to normal for another 30 minutes. At my previous rates I was about 2-3 days away from finishing my legendary. At the best rate I could get today, it looks like I’ll be spending another 15-20 days if I can manage to keep up the motivation to farm with the breaks.

It’s really disappointing because I was looking forward to being one of the first people in the world with a legendary, now it’s going to take so long the race is already over.

Ask the people who were making 70k+ karma per day to get their legendary.

Vaerah.4907:

To expand, DR leads to less mudflation. Can’t see anything wrong with that.

This would make sense, except that bots and exploiters don’t get affected by DR, so they continue to flood the market with increasingly cheaper goods.