Guild Wars 2

Sprinkles.6748:

This isn’t about burst-dps being able to instantly kill a bunker build. It’s about bunker builds holding out indefinitely vs any one other build and sometimes vs two other players. I really don’t see why you think bunker builds should be able to completely withstand anyone. That sounds a little biased…

Because as I said above if they cant withstand 1 person for a decent period of time then they are not needed, if they are not needed then condition damage is not needed, that only leaves burst for most efficient play. Burst implies large amounts of quick front loaded damage, for a burst to take out a bunker it would have to do so quickly with its “burst” What is not to get here? Honestly people who think you should beat a bunker with burst rather than sustained dps, or conditions seem biased towards those classes.

I used to be a bunker, but never agian. Being a bunker sucks and is quite boring at the moment. I am either babysitting a node twiddling my thumbs for most of the game, or I am facing 1 person who I just trade blows with until he gets bored and leaves, or I am steamrolled by a large group focusing fire and using conditions( which then your team rages that you couldnt handle 4 ppl for the two minutes).

None of that is fun for either team imo, nor is it fun to have to fill a role your profession is pigeonholed into. Like I said before bunkers should curb burst damage from instantly bursting everyone down, in a bunkers drops in one big burst then they are not needed. Please elaborate on how this new meta will evolve when burst is king? I have clearly stated how I think the meta does/should pan out, I would like someone to do the same

They definitely need work, sustained healing and condition removal need a serious lookover from the devs. Right now there are bunker builds that can hold indefinitely against condition and sustained damage builds, this is absurd. Bunkers should have to blow everything to counter a burst blowing everthing, this way burst curbed. Both sides should have to give it there all; this means that a burst can blow their wad and leave if the bunker doesnt make a mistake but if the bunker makes a mistake they die. If anything this system still favors burst.

@ Fenixz “Anet have stated over and over again that it is intended for dps/brust oriented builds to destroy full all in tanking builds so the game can be DYNAMIC and interesting from the 1-st to the last secound.”

Yes they have said it repeatedly, each time they do it is dumb. It has been brought up several times if full on burst counters full on bunker then by proxy burst counters condition( it can kill them before they stack conditions), if the glass cannon burst can then counter other burst because of their low defenses and health then all that is left in the meta is burst.

If a bunker cannot stalemate a dps 1v1 then they are pointless, why would you have one if a thief can come burst them down in a few seconds? The hard counter to many bunkers are condition builds( arena net follows this even if they pretend they dont e.×. poison reducing the effectiveness of healing), this does not mean that they should instantly kill a bunker but 1 condition should be able to whittle a bunker down over time; with the amount of time needed exponentially decreasing with the number advantage.

This breaks down into the following meta: Burst kills condition before they can destroy bunkers, bunkers soaks up burst till allied condition or burst arrives to kill the attackers, CC prevents healing and rezzing, Support counters this by facilitating healing and rezzing. This is a lot more interesting than a burst arms race. It allows for several builds and classes to take part in competition and develop their niche.

Many of you say that the fact that burst isnt able to instantly kill bunkers is preventing GW2 from being e-sport material, I would say that it is the only thing that could allow it to be.

I am in awe of the halloween redesign, so much so I had to come on here and give a major shout out to the developers in charge of this. I love it, by kitten it is awesome.

Zyrusticae.7245:

Sigh.

(Also, this is thread is already debunked because necromancers are never complained about.)

This is what they said several weeks ago about the elementalist, and then bam people started complaining so I pointed it out and revived the thread. When it dies and in a few weeks Necro is the QQ FOTM then I will be back and will quote you.

On another note, yes some builds are better than others; this will always be true. Competitive people will always play what they believe is the best; this will always be true. If you nerf something then players move on the next best thing, then that is nerfed, then so on till the nerfs go too far and then people migrate to a different class, then they buff: which leads to certain really good builds; this cycle repeats. This is the mystic wheel of the mmo, like life and death there is no escape.

There are some really good Guardian build, Elementalist builds, Warrior builds, Engineer builds, Mesmer builds, Ranger Builds, and yes (Oh my) Necro Builds ( such as crit Lich which will be the new QQ in the future just wait and see & and the necro bunker buster build, which bunkers will soon start raging about.) As long as each profession has 2-3 competitive builds then that is fine. Balancing out for an infinite array of builds would eat up development time and be near impossible.

tl;dr- As long as each class has it’s own little slice of OP then they are not really that OP. ( i.e- If everyone is special then no one is )

@ Shaolin

What wat? for real? The numbers feel right and concur with forum hype so it must be true? That is a terrible argument, and only acts to prove rickshaw correct. I am confident that the poster didnt make the numbers up but dont undermine his efforts by providing subpar counter args.

Killthehealersffs.8940:

Zatria.5783:

There is no team play reward here. You can be a support class (like they force elementalists) and get no points for keeping people alive.

I played wow from 27/05/05-01/04/12 as a healer
I would like to know , when healers in WoW get honor points for healing the others :P

Disc Priest here and what are you talking about? You get a substantial amount of honor from winning the match, you get the mandatory welfare honor, you also get the honor for kills if you are in the area of the kill. This is not a great sysem as you have bots and afkers benefiting too much but the alternative that GW2 has still has some flaws.

Getting kills for being in the area of the kill should still be the norm, in group skirmishes sometimes you are healing or CCing other players when an enemy you werent doing damage too dies. You helped win the fight, so you should get a little points for being in the skirmish. I would also like to see them increase the base ammount of points you get for winning in Tpvp only, since personal points dont matter as much in that kind of play. That is just my 2cs though.

I feel like the current system punishes bunkers and support classes while raising up burst builds. In Spvp the most points go to the busters, in tpvp the same is mostly true. I know, I know, points dont matter in tpvp but why should a dps roamer get access to cool gear/weapons when the bunker has to wait 3 times a long?

Vaerah.4907:

In the thread where someone said elementalists are OP. Now I have seen it all.

He is a madman they said, surely he is intoxicated they said, now I have seen it all they said. Well, Called it, Elementalist found 1 measly build that makes them competitive in tpvp, now the crys for nerf plox ring louder the the celestial trumpets. Notice how it was only after bunker ele’s came in that ppl really started to hate on the bunkers, ppl want an instant gib fest, and they want it now. Who cares if they cant focus fire, who cares if they arent using any sort of tactics, the game should just be a burst cannon free for all.

Now I am going back to engineer and waiting for the nerf crys to migrate over there

If you balance 1v1 then 5v5 becomes unbalanced unless you take out all control, healing, and aoe abilities. What is perplexing to me is why they opted for the new trinity of bunker/burst/condition (which was stated by Jon Peters to be the way the rock, paper, scissors fell). He said that burst should counter bunker which should counter condition which counters burst.

Ignoring the fact that this makes no sense as logically as condition should beat bunker, bunker should counter burst, and burst should destroy condition; this is actually much harder to balance to then healing, tank, dps which WoW and clones have championed.

If you want 1v1 then as stated above it should be like any fps, with no real distinction from classes, no differences in abilities, same health pools, same durability, same damage. I dont feel like many people would find that fun. In a fps you are all spacemarines/soldiers it makes sense that you are the same. But a plate wearing Warrior having the same health and toughness and damage as a elementalist in cloth seems crazy.

I cant interact with npcs or click allies/enemies. I can tab target so it isnt bad but it I can click target my allies which is annoying. Am I doing something wrong or is anyone else having this issue

50 of them in this area, as jezath said above( I believe he is in darkhaven as well) there was another group farming underwater. I would say around 100 were in the map easily. Botters are getting more and more brazen, and the numbers of them are exploding,. They dont fear repercussions; this makes me wonder if bots will start showing up in wvw primetime completely destroying a servers competitiveness.

I wouldnt bot because I mostly pvp and do pve/wvw solely for fun but the vibe I get is that since there is no danger in botting many people are going “why not?”

@ tomlin- I tried that, but 50 rangers spamming crossfire and 50 bears eating your face means that you need a lot of ppl to break them down…….and when you do the path system rezzes them and has them run back.

I believe they move them to mess with bots, works for a day or so.

Just ran into wvw, saw some people over by a skill point and wanted to try to get in on the action. What I found was 58 bots with 58 bears running in circles farming skitts. It would take 1 person, just 1 in game gm who can ban to make the difference. Botting is announced by players in the general map chat constantly, said gm could go check it out and ban them.

Yes there is a sticky at the top, and we should probably only post about this there but many people are getting frustrated. We know you are working on it, we are just tired of seeing the problem get worse instead of better. For each tread that is closed or shut down at least we know someone is having to see it. As frustrating as I can imagine the constant nagging is, it is equally frustrating player side. I would post this in the sticky but it appears that you have gotten fed up and locked it.

Your game rocks my socks, I love it and will continue to play it but grrrrrr these bots are making me hulk out lol. Screenshot provided below, names and personal information were blacked out as per code of conduct

This is a useless skill, it takes longer to cast than to rezz someone, it takes longer to cast than it does for them to stomp your ally, earth and wind attunement procs are not working. Please lower the casting time so that it can be useful, we do not want it to be unfairly good, just on par with the time it takes to normally rezz someone. It was overpowered before but now if is worthless, no one argues otherwise.

Sorry to have to post this here but you dont seem to read the elementalist forums, I can find 5 dev post in the last 11 pages of the ele forum. We at least would like to here a little reasoning behind its current design. A sentence or two would be fine, but please try to address one of the threads about this problem.

Thank you, love your game.

Larynx.2453:

I don’t get how it’s hard to understand. He doesn’t want to be queued with premades.

And no, paid tournaments are not a solution.

Ummm what? I have a few question still because this is just mad confusing

He said spvp, this kind of pvp randomizes teams each game. If they all que together then they will get split up. If they are split how does it hurt you in any way? Is it because they are just better than you?

How do you have a premade in spvp? With Vent/TS/Mumble? Wouldnt that defeat the purpose if you are forced to be on different teams?

Why can you not join another server? It is called hotjoin for a reason, this isnt WoW were you are stuck against some premade team, they will be split and you can leave for no penalty. I highly doubt that there are tons of premades magically sticking together clogging up the majority of servers.

You sure he didnt mean free tpvp? If so then he should deal with it. There is spvp specifically for that, with all the safeguards mentioned above……….It just occured to me that your post and his are so ludicrous you might be joking. I have not slept in a long times so maybe my sarcasm meter is off, so I hope that is what it is. A cruel sick joke.

Quote system wont work but I have to agree/disagree with you Masternebz. If you constantly go 1v1 as a Ele you are gonna have a bad time. The game is not balanced for 1v1, some classes duel a lot better than others(heck I believe mesmer has a “dueling” trait tree). Anyone one who thinks the game is balanced 1v1 havent listened to developers and havent played enough.

These skills are to help you in a group fight while being focused or if a 1v1 is absolutely necessary. They will help you live when you would otherwise die. A player of average skill can’t destroy a Ele who is really skilled, although I will agree the gap between how much skill is required to beat people of lower skill is large.

The knockdown from Air #4 is instantaneous and very hard to see coming, it takes half a second to switch to air and pop it. Earth #4 does require good timing and capitalizing on a players mistakes, but so do most knockdowns.

We do have to work harder to do less damage then other professions, we also have to work harder to take more damage than other professions, and yes we will also see more nerfs to our class in the future; making it harder to do both. Sure sometimes it feels masochistic, but we are not as broken as some would lead you to believe.

I still dont know why people have such a hard time with D/D Ele. Switch attunements intelligently is key:

D/D has good evasion skills such as Air D/D # 4, Fire # 4; using Earth #3 on a target in the distance in group fights, or using Air #5 to rush out of battle.

Good knockdowns Air # 4, Earth # 4

Switching attunement to water, using # 5 and using glyph of elements to heal will bring you nearly back to full with almost no healing. Plus it grants a low regen if you are at least 5 points in water; it is negligible but every bit helps

Switching to Earth gives you protection, in a 1v1 or prolonged or skirmish this means you can switch to earth, trait earth shield to proc when at 50%, pop regular earth shield when at 25%, do the above Water dance and bam you are full again.

Using Cantrips is a really good way of staying defensive without losing too much dps, properly traited the cantrips grant might, vigor and regeneration.

You can heal in mist form, just make sure to switch to water first for maximum effect. You can also summon the healing elemental while in mist form which acts as a great buffer.

Dodging is a necessity in this game; you have 2 regenerating damage negating chances with dodge, Air #4 acts as an extra dodge, traiting cantrips for vigor gives you more endurance and thus more dodges.

A good trick for burst quickness builds HB warriors or thieves is to pop Air #3, this aura stuns 1 them sec everytime they hit you. See a thief steal or a warrior running towards you ready to bullrush+quick+hb then popping this will give you crucial time to Air# 5 knocking them down and jump away.

By the time they are up you will have switched to earth attunement and used Earth #4 to knock them down again. They are now used up, all cds blown and ready for a pounding.

Lastly, you will die sometimes, you will mess up one of the above at some point. It happens, it sucks and we just have to run back. This profession requires a lot of attunement dancing and quick reflexes to use the abilities you need to live while still destroying all those who dare oppose you with your damage abilities.

If you have any questions or concerns with the above plz address them, I main as a D/D ele with 1067 toughness/15kish health and die very rarely while still dishing out all the meager hurt the devs have granted us. Hoped this helped.

While I am not on the forums complaining, I have noticed more and more people leaving spvp and tpvp. Most Mists are deadly quiet and have a lot fewer people than a week ago. Also less and less people seem to be in the hotjoin que which includes all servers. Sure around 30-40 are full but that seems rather low for the population of the game cross server.

I think some people are concerned that areas once full of people now have a much smaller population. This game is still in its honeymoon phase, it feels like the game should have a lot more people in various parts of progression. Several people are leaving the game in pvp because the maps are getting old and there is still no word other than “soon” on when the esport is supposed to start. I imagine some pvers are leaving as well because they have run out of stuff they want to do.

I love this game and want it succeed, it is an innovative and fresh look at the stale MMO genre. However people are leaving; not in droves like the doomsayers are preaching, but it is a steady trickle when the game should be growing as a whole. Repeatedly saying everything is fine does not help. Some people really are worried that this great game won’t be as successful as it should be, I just hope that new additions( at least what was promised for pvp in the beginning) comes soon or people will move on.

Thank you, please dont flame me, I have condition removal ready for any burning effects.

Rezo.4815:

Or in this case a heartseeker thief.
Relevant : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hh5zjK7ITpQ

Hilarious, and true

The funny thing is with my D/D ele some ppl in my guild think I should still be nerfed. Kitten forbid I dodge and use my cantrips to stay alive and do damage…….so OP.

(plz for the love of kitten dont remove cantrips Anet, I know you want to. And I know I said that D/D does damage plz dont remove daggers from our item list…..I can see you salivating, but plz no lol)

Lol I just rolled a mesmer alt and was thinking the same thing. I am gonna stick with ele because I love it but man mesmers seem like easy mode after playing D/D ele all this time.

I only started doing pvp this week but I am already up to lv 14, tourney chest always give me a glory booster so I keep one up when playing most of the time. That 50 extra points goes a long way. I really wish they had some way to display ranking, would love to see if any Dragons are roaming around.

Excuse me? Your post will hopefully be deleted due to its negative insulting tone but before it is let me say a few things.

First of all afkers are few and far between in this game, this game has fewer afkers than any game due to the fact it does not give blanket points for winning, it gives glory for playing.

Secondly, me and my guildies do nothing but pvp, both spvp and tpvp; none of us have had any problems on this issue and there are 45 of us constantly playing. If this was such a big issue we would have encountered it.

Thirdly, If you are in a bad hotjoin then leave. It is called hotjoin for a reason, people can come and go freely. This is the most casual level of pvp in the game, winning/losing isnt really the goal; the goal is to have fun and play.

Last but not least if this is such a kitteny game then come on the forums, act like a decent sensible person and voice your discontent. Do not rage, inflammatory language doesn’t get you anywhere; try constructive comments, Anet is good about addressing peoples concerns. Believe it or not they want this game to succeed.

tl;dr: Rage bad, Exaggeration Bad, Chill bro and be constructive in your complaints

Why not just make it if you quit early you dont get a chest at all? 1hr seems pretty harsh though, of course I run them with guildies so we have our own ways of punishing ppl who ditch.

I have a few issues with this, not biting criticism mind you but some things that immediately jumped at me.

1. If tpvp had a real world counterpart then teams would only pick ppl with max gear and free tpvp would see many people leaving if their team was significantly undergeared.

2. It would split Anets attention, from what I see from their post they have a small but dedicated group of programmers. These guys are pretty awesome but the key word is small, adding this would be an increased work load. I would prefer them to focus their efforts and more important things, like hosting competitions and having a tpvp world ranking system.

3. I feel it would be dead. Not to generalize but most when most ppl talk progression in pvp they want to be able to have an advantage on ppl with lesser gear. Why would players want to spend countless hours of being ganked to have the same experience they do now.

WoW forces you play with worse gear to get gear that would prevent you from getting ganked, GW2 offers an equal playing field already. Were is the incentive to play with inferior goods?

Warriors with a warhorn can remove all movement impairing effects and grant swiftness for themselves and allies at the same time with our #4

str 30, arms 30, disc 10 sorry my bad, I run a similar set up with my axe/mace build. In my experience it wasnt that reliable of a combo and its damage wasnt as godly as many seem to make it out to be, but hey maybe it is just not my style and I just not good at it. I am still figuring builds and stats out when it comes to pvp but in my experience it seems fine when players know what you are up to with HB builds

I still dont understand how people say it kills them instantly. Are you a glass cannon yourself? The only class I was ever able to burst kill instantly was a glass cannon elementalist and the occasional thief. Other than that I would get them down to 40-30% health, which is kinda what pvp burst should do; you blow you wad too early and they live/you die. What is everyone doing that lets it bring down guards and the like down in two seconds?

I am not gonna roll a hb war agian( well I might since gs has 3 legendaries, instead of one joke skin) but I am interested in what I was doing wrong. I was str 30, Arms 30, Disc 30. Was speced for crit chance ( 90% with fury) and crit damage( +40%??I dont remember)

I switched from axe/mace vun/crit to greatsword hb spam to see what all the fuss was about and after about 8 games I went back. Bullrush+quickness+hb is a very fail combo most of the time if you play anyone who knows what they are doing. I didnt like it for the following reasons

1. Bull rush has a long cooldown, can be dodge and everyone has some form of stun break.

2. HB being stationary means if it is hitting you most the time you are doing something wrong. A quick dodge away and bam, I am open for a massive counter attack. It does good burst but I like my glass cannons to be more mobile so that I dont get blown up instantly…speaking of which

3. This combo isnt complete without quickness, for a mobile damage dealer it is awesome and the extra 50% damage you take is tough but manageable. However it makes skills like HB suicidal. If they get out of the stun or have a buddy you are dead meat fast.

4. Only really good 1v1. GW2 is not a dueling type of game so some classes will be better at it than others, but HB wars seem to be good only good at dueling. They offer no group utility, and fail horribly in group settings. I prefer stacking vulnerability and stunning since it help my damage but still helps my party.

5. Its a one trick pony. I will admit when it connects it is amazing and does really good damage, but when it fails you are kittened. You just popped all of your skills, stunned yourself briefly until you can cancel HB , and you just ruined your survivability.

Maybe I played the HB wrong and it is insanely god tier but the concept seemed fairly simple, guess that is why it was so easy to counter. I’ll stick to Axe/mace, it is not as bursty but it gets the job done and isnt reliant on one move to make or break the entire build

Duveth.5742:

i like gw2 leveling its probably the best of all mmorps, im lvl 70 but the fact that there isnt engame content has made me leave the game before i get max level, wow leveling is kittenin boring, but the endgame in wow is so epic that the leveling worth it (and the world pvp while leveling make it even better), gw2 pvp is the most boring pvp i ve played, there is no progression, no skill required, its so slow, u cant burst someone downed state make it even slower, every class have a heal, the only spvp mode is boring as hell, this game could be good but anet focused in the wrong things, leveling will be only 100h max, i consider a mmorpg is good if i play at least 1k hours, the endgame is more important than leveling, u repeated the same fails as swtor and d3.

Your comment makes me wonder if you have played any pvp at all.

Some people like progressive content, they like that before you can beat X you need to have or have done Y, it gives them a feeling of accomplishment. Just because people like to accomplish something in a game does not mean they lead unfilling lives, for some reason this is a common attack in these kind of threads.

In the end it boils down to the fact that some ppl like that kind of content, some dont. That is the extent of any meaningful conversation these forums could have on the subject.

Arc.9374:

The amount of classes in this game that can perform even at an average level by simply popping a couple of big cooldowns and single-buttoning their way to victory is astounding.

When combat is over so fast since healers are gone and there is no resilence( hate mentioning mechanics from “that” game) what else is to be expected? In this system burst dps is king, same is true for pve mostly as well.

In games with healers and much lowers damage done by players to players fights last longer and burst dps has to chose when to blow their load; if they do it too soon then they are left spent and open for a counter attack, too late and they are dead.

As long as combat is so twitch happy then cafeful consideration and timing on abilities will always take a back seat to boom your dead builds.

GankSinatra.2653:

33% reduction from losing? lolno.

Did you not notice how EVERY new game you join from the mists is a loss? Because people just leave when the team is losing? Surely reducing glory gained would help remedy this, lol.

Also you already suggested in the same post that we should get a static bonus for winning. There is your incentive to try harder. But losing 33% of my glory because the enemy team has 3 mesmers, 3 thiefs, and 2 guardians? Yeah, no thanks.

You sir have an amazing name, and your post is like a tl;dr of mine. I like you and wish you nothing but bunnies and cash in your future.

So if I am leading the pack in points for my team and we are winning; then all of a sudden 79% into winning the game I get autobalanced to the other team( thanks to the new update it isnt 99% now at least) not only dont get the bonus for winning, but I have my glory cut 33%? No thanks, and luckily it will never happen.

I have championed your second idea everytime I have come across glory related threads, it is a no brainer really. My only change would be that the game is bumped up to 10 points and only gained in combat.

There is already a glory bonus to the winner, 25 points I believe. Maybe it should be bumped up a little but 150p is ridiculous. In hot joins winning and losing mean less due to the casual nature of them, instead how well the player does personally is rewarded( sometimes wrongly with the zerg favored system). This emphasis player skill so good players arent brought down by a bad team.

Furthermore, the points for losers are there for a development purpose. It is so that players wont leave a losing game. If you know that you will get a pitiful amount of points why stay when you can hot join into a winning team instead for a large amount of points. Hot joins are for the casuals, tournaments are for the more hardcore crowd.

Zaroua.2714:

You need to be able to choose 4 options:

1. I’m a solo player and I don’t care about playing vs premades
2. I’m a solo player and I certainly don’t want to fight vs premades
3. We’re a premade and we only want to fight other premades
4. We’re a premade and we don’t care who we fight

This would be the same as just spiting the two groups, imo of course I could be wrong. To avoid writing each catagory and wasting space I will refer to them as 1-4 in descending order.

I feel that 2 & 4 would be the only options chosen. Given how no added bonus is given for premades fighting other premades 3 would be fairly undesirable. Since challenge isnt enough of an incentive to garner a large base of players for the option (imo, mind you), 3 would just be more work when you could pick 4 and have the chance for a challenge or a chance for an easy win for the same reward.

Option 1 would be a fools errand because you would know you will be at a disadvantage, will likely lose, and will have no greater reward for your added risk. Most people puging would prefer to play other pugs so that they are at an even playing field, and few would want to risk getting rolfstomped by organized teams (imo).

If most pugs pick 2, then effectively those that pick 4 would be really picking 3. This means that (mostly) pugs would fight pugs, and premades would fight premades. So this would just be a roundabout way of just seperating the two, when you could just split them and save a lot of coding and hassle. (which I am against for the reasons above in my previous post)

Hsulf.9370:

mmm yeah maybe, but you’d have to also stop all leaps & movement skills etc i.e thief short bow 5, ride the lightening, and more to boot.

Also no passing of the flag, i.e chaining stealth thief grabs flag and gives it to bunker guardian who strolls to base.

Still a lot of restrictions but would be fun.

Man, I hate referencing that which shall not be named again lol, but leaps and the sort are fine, and have worked in capture the flag maps for a while. Stuns, crippling, knockdowns seem to help balance these skills out. Not tring to argue or anything, just pointing out what I have seen in the past with that style of pvp.

Hsulf.9370:

Chaining stealth thiefs and portal mesmers would make CTF pretty redundant tbh. Although I would love the game mod, it would never be balanced.

Just make it so that you cant teleport or stealth when you are carrying the flag, like the mmo that shall not be named does. Maybe go further and make it prevent you from having swiftness as well so permaswift builds wont be the go to FCs. Seems like a quick fix to that problem.

Separating Pugs and Premades seems like it would increase que times and lead to premades wanting greater rewards for the increase challenge of fighting a premade over two pugs duking it out without as much organization. This is the problem that arised when WoWers tried to get premades v premades so that they would stop rolfstomping pugs due the advantages a premade brings to the table.

In my experience with WoW premades( I know, I know mentioning WoW twice makes me sick but I have had the most experience with it), I found that the biggest advantage came from communication, team composition and drive to win.

The biggest hurdle for the pug is team composition; however, this is not something I think can be fixed, a pug it is random afterall. Since tpvp separated from regular pvp (which ty Anet, smart move) those who play in tpvp normally play to win so drive does not seem to be an issue.

With drive taken care of I feel that focusing on communication is the key to closing the gap between the two. If the game offered an in game voice chat system that players could join at the beginning of the match, then pugs could communicate near the level of premades who use vent or mumble.

I am normally for making the pug smarter and more efficient, rather than splitting the player base, a simple addition of a chat system that players could use with little or no hassle seems like a step in the right direction. I have been up for a long time so maybe my idea doesnt make sense but it seems sounds in my extremely tired state lol

Kalar Meadia.8439:

You do realize that short of deleteing Thief and Mesmer you will never NOT be frustrated with them, right?

I am sure even if Anet removed the two classes people would still feel the need to log into the forums and complain how OP they were, how x skill was OP, and that balance is ruined forever since they didn’t scrap the OP classes sooner.

Sezu.8564:

Zachariel.5463:

shrewd.5319:

I don’t understand all this crying about most professions. The only 2 professions that need nerfs in all aspects are guardians and mesmers. All others are just fine.

Guardians are fun to kill with my mesmer, Mesmers are fun to kill with my ranger (and I main mesmer) so no sure why you think those two need nerfs. I know how to counter mesmers as I play one so I have no problem. No clue why so many people come to complain about not doing any research on how to counter a class. There is a reason you can switch your utility skills out of combat. If you see a group or a lone opponent switch your skills fast to counter them. If you don’t have time just do your best.

Hurr durr, have you even tried to take out a Guardian with anything besides a mesmer? It’s not about knowing how to counter a class, some(most) classes aren’t capable of that in the first place.

As any self respecting Guardian will tell you conditions destroy them, so besides mesmer you got necro. conditon ranger and engineer. Not my opinion, just hop over to the “Guardians are Breaking Tournaments” thread on the subforum page and see what they say themselves.

Sylosi.6503:

Colton.9460:

I see a lot of threads that go as follows…

You must be reading a differnet forum, because on the one I’m reading I see the vast majority of complaints of OPness are directed at classes like thief, mesmer, guardian, whilst other classes such as necro are generally regarded as weak.

I have explained a couple of times that ele and necros dont get a lot of ppl complaining about them for nerf reasons, it is an exageration to prove a point. The point being is that when I see a Holy trinity thread, I constantly see one of the trinity taken out (most likely by the person who plays that class) and shifted to another proffesion they have a hard time handling.

Angry Flying Squirrel.3041:

Colton.9460:

I see a lot of threads that go as follows:

1st post: Guardians are OP; gadzooks Batman I can’t just dps them to death fast at all, needs major nerf.

2nd post: More like Guardians, Mesmers, and Thiefs; need a specific build or strat to kill them, no thanks nerf plox!

3rd post: More like Guardians , Mesmers, and Engineers; for kitten’s sake nerf them. Sincerly yours, a Thief

4th post: Guardians are definitely god tier like Engineers, Elementalist, ( dang aoe kills my clones, no thanks nerf plox), Warriors, and Thiefs. I am totally not a Mesmer, promise.

5th post: Are you kitten me? Warriors are way more OP than Gaurdians.

6th post: Nah Gaurds are fine, but Necros have way too much tankiness and the conditions melt away all my health. Love, a Guardian.

7th: I think you guys are forgeting the cheapness of Ranger pets and how they destroy me in secounds, but nerf Necros, Guardians, Thiefs, Engineers, Elementalist, and Warriors too. Mesmers for life!

Sometimes I hope the devs just go with their gut and dont listen to the community. If they did everone would do 1 damage, all have the same health, same abilities, and be on the forums raging that nerfs are still need to majorly OP classes.

LOL no one is saying Necro’s are OP. Link a single thread that says Necro’s are op.

Use the search function, you will find people saying we have too much survivalbility and Guardians defending themselves by saying the Necro class makes every Guardian weep. The point is not that everyone is complaining equally about each class, and I have already said that elementalist and necros do not have more than 1 or 2 ppl complaining about them for nerf reasons.

The point is that threads tend to devolve into people taking sides agianst classes other than their own if they have any difficulty with it. They will bandwaggon with everyother class being OP but when their name is mentioned they will say no no X totally destroys my Y, then they list who is really OP. Most people dont play necros or elementalist, but trust me one day our QQ fotm will be up and it will be QQageddon.

shrewd.5319:

I don’t understand all this crying about most professions. The only 2 professions that need nerfs in all aspects are guardians and mesmers. All others are just fine.

That is your opinion, other ppl have similar opinions about other classes. Your post is the kind this thread is about. If your post is a joke, then I must say well played good sir; if not then /facepalm.

Arheundel.6451:

Spitu.8657:

Seriously? I see it used in every tPvP match and it is basically making Thief/Mesmer mandatory to have in your team if you want to win.

You can’t be concerned ( aka whining) about serious PvP problems because you get assaulted by FOTM kids who want the game to remain as it is now, 7 times out of 10 I’m the only ele in tPvP and in over 200 matches I can say that I’ve played against another ele no more than 20 times during the Kylo map.

The problem is already obvious in sPvP:

40% are thieves
25% are mesmers/engineers
20% are guardians/rangers
10% are warriors
5% are ele/necros

And the percentages get even worst in tPvP:

35% are guardians
30% are mesmers
20% are thieves/warriors
10% are engineers
5%…are ele/necros

Just because a class is played more doesnt mean that if is necessarily more powerful, Paladin type classes, and rogue-like classes, and classes that just seem cool( read multi clone phantasms are awesome=Mesmers) are played more. Most games with class choices see domination of these classes, almost to the point they are the only selectable option presented.

Not to mention, if somone comes onto the forums and hears someone QQn about how certain classes suck and only 3 major classes are worth it, then they go " why would I play a broken class, Ill just roll what everyone says is awesome". Then somone beats them as the apparently favored class and they run to the forums to rage that someone beat their god class. So then the cycle repeats.

How else would a thief/rogue proffession play out. The class atypically has low health, poor defenses, stealth, high utility, and high bust damage. This is hardly a problem with modern mmo’s it is what rogues/thiefs have been since D&D first began.

It is like saying that the major problem ever modern mmo has is that Warriors are durable, Elementalist/Shamans can use nature magic to heal and do damage, or Guardians/Paladins can heal themselves to boster their survivability.

These are not new concepts and have been time tested by nearly every RPG, Action RPG, MMORPG, or Table Top RPG in the past15+ years. Only with the advent of the mmo that shall not be named has the player base of games been so quick to jump at any difference in classes, citing brokeness not lack of skill for their personal failure

Qoute system wont work( frequent bug recently) but

@ Ithir- Necro is my baby; and it is true we need work but I think that once the bug fixes are taken care of we should be fine. To my knowledge we have the most bugs by far, and it is hard to really know how the class will handle when most of our abilities work.

Comparing classes is risky business ( Tom Cruise lol). Versatility, utility, synergy (interclass or personal?), (omiting usefulness since it is so vague), durability, burst, ect are most of the time class specific. Not every class needs to excell at every role, the devs have decided to let each class have its own set of roles; providing a interesting and unique type of gameplay for each proffession.

This type of balance is refreshing, and one of the reason I love GW2. When players really master using DS our tankiness will be very nice, on par if not better than heavily armored proffs. Warriors/Guardians excell at what they should, us necros are condition slinging, tough as nails minion masters; although I will admit guardins get minions, our conditions at least set us apart.

Don’t mistake me for a fanboi, I really want Anet to fix the bugs and really want to see more vairiety from the pvp maps; but as fair as class balance I think they are doing well .

I have seen several mesmers QQ about how aoe kills their clones too fast, other than that you are correct. I hardly see people complain about Necros either (we have over a 100 bugs atm), the point is that there is alway someone who thinks someone else needs to be nerfed

I see a lot of threads that go as follows:

1st post: Guardians are OP; gadzooks Batman I can’t just dps them to death fast at all, needs major nerf.

2nd post: More like Guardians, Mesmers, and Thiefs; need a specific build or strat to kill them, no thanks nerf plox!

3rd post: More like Guardians , Mesmers, and Engineers; for kitten’s sake nerf them. Sincerly yours, a Thief

4th post: Guardians are definitely god tier like Engineers, Elementalist, ( dang aoe kills my clones, no thanks nerf plox), Warriors, and Thiefs. I am totally not a Mesmer, promise.

5th post: Are you kitten me? Warriors are way more OP than Guardians.

6th post: Nah Guards are fine, but Necros have way too much tankiness and the conditions melt away all my health. Love, a Guardian.

7th: I think you guys are forgeting the cheapness of Ranger pets and how they destroy me in secounds, but nerf Necros, Guardians, Thiefs, Engineers, Elementalist, and Warriors too. Mesmers for life!

Sometimes I hope the devs just go with their gut and dont listen to the community. If they did everone would do 1 damage, all have the same health, same abilities, and be on the forums raging that nerfs are still need to majorly OP classes.

Yes it is normal, have you never played pvp online before?

Schurge.5194:

The great irony of this game is that its “casuals” are more elitist then the “hardcore” in other games. Case in point:

Tirien.1326:

If a game needs progression in order to be fun the game isn’t fun in the first place.

I think we got two sets of gamers, the secure gamer (Casual) and the insecure gamer (Gear hunting/Achivement nut/World first/Etc).

The casual gamer is a strong gamer, he plays the game the way it is ment. No grind for him/her since they do 1 dungeon each day or maybe even 2, mostly for the fun of it. To enjoy guildies/Family/friends and the “reward” in game is just a +.

The insecure gamer needs some form of reckognition for doing what they do, but in the end nobody cares what you do or what you wear in games, nobody. I know it must feel bad when you have grinded and played for 200-400-600 hours just to show people something, and to know that people really don’t care about it.

I think some people need some form of accomplishment from gaming, but what to do when they find out that nobody cares about what they do? I would love to get a psychologist on this.

It’s grindy inly if you make it so. It’s not suppose to take a day.
It’s suppose to be fun, progression comes in last before fun.

If you play a game for progression you need to find a new genre, or quit gaming completely, because the progression in games is nothing, and nobody cares about it. So why bother?

Don’t flatter yourself – no one cares what you think of them. Gamers who play for achievements and progression do it for themselves not for others. Accomplishment feels good. It seems that you have to tell yourself that everyone else is doing it wrong so that you can feel better about yourself.

I agree so much I wanted to see it agian. /slowclap

Hickeroar.9734:

asmariya.1096:

I dont understand you people, who doesn’t want mounts?!

I wouldn’t MIND having (non-flying) mounts, but the hate people spew because there aren’t any is ridiculous. The game doesn’t need them, so if we don’t get them it’s NBD.

Is this a serious post? I can’t find one post in this thread that is overtly negative or hateful from people wanting mounts. For the most part it seems the majority of hate sprewing posters are agianst the mounts and think if you want them you should just leave the game.

Leiloni.7951:

Colton.9460:

I like that I dont have to grind to do content, but to tell people to gtko is just childish and harmful to the community as a whole. People can have different opinions, it is no more your game than it is theirs. If players ask Anet for a grind and they deliver, will you leave? If so then keeping with your opinion; “good ridance go play something else scrub.”

This game was built around the idea of no gear grind and ANet made that very clear. So adding that into the game would change the entire game. So we are completely valid in telling him to find a new game. Not in a mean way, but in a constructive way – what he wants is already out there in dozens of games. This is one of the only games that has what we want.

To answer your question – yes, I would be gone because that would mean I would also have to grind for gear and I came here so I don’t have to do that. Don’t try to force your ideas on us – this game was not made for that and you’ll just have to accept that. Enjoy what ArenaNet made for us, don’t try to make it something that the game devs themselves said they don’t want it to be. I don’t know why you would even think that idea makes any sense.

I hope the “you” that is refered in your post is not directed at me, because if my post didnt make it clear enough I like that there is no mandatory grind. All I was saying is that people should be respectful of what other players consider fun and what they think would improve the game. Instead of “go play something else”, why cant it be “this game is not really set up for that playstyle, why not try x,y, or z playstyle? I find it quite enjoyable”

Some people just seem mean spirited lol. I play games to try and make my character as epic as possible, GW2 lets me do that. I can make him look a bad motherkitten and set up a build that I think is awesome. Getting better gear doesnt add to my playstyle because if everyone needs the gear, then it is no longer special, it is obliged. I can feel this way and still understand and respect different kinds of players though.