Guild Wars 2

Malefactor.2971:

Fritz.5026:

However, we have also seen floods of these gear progression type of MMO games released since then with the vast majority of them failing in less than 6 months. So obviously any attempt to say that gear progression is the best method for a successful mmo game would be seen with a certain level of doubt.

It could be argued then, that with GW2 making the switch in just 3 months that their original model/method was even less successful. Or at least viewed as such by Anet/NcSoft.

I would not agree to that. They had to have begun this switch within a month of the game being released to have the patch released with the content now.

That is not enough time for them to have made the decision based on retention levels.

This decision was made shortly after the game was released, which is why most players feel they have been the victim of a bait and switch. The game was advertised as not having vertical progression and gear farming. It was advertised as the pvp game many people who had lives away from their computer desk could enjoy.

Things clearly changed immediately after release for us to be seeing this patch go live now.

DegoLocc.5976:

LOL, some of you are so dramatical.

What do you want? To hit 80 and have nothing to do? You want to eat the carrot on the stick as soon as you roll your toon?! People like to feel like their character continues to grow past level cap, it’s called end game.

If you don’t like progression and time sink, MMO’s are clearly not for you.

I find responses like this very single minded. I would personally blame WoW for most of this as its the game that has set the precedent for 13+ million players. It may not be the first, but it had the largest impact.

There was a MMO game called DAOC that had an endgame that was just pvp. It did not have gear progression or better items to get. All it had was realm vs realm pvp for endgame. At the time it was one of the most popular mmo games available. I still remember going out to the RvR battles and seeing hundreds of players on the fields, it was quite amazing.

The point I am getting at is that you cannot say MMO games are not for people.

All you can really say is “gear progression MMO games are not for you.”

There is actually other ways to make MMO games than having endless gear progression as the ‘end game.’ That style of play was made so popular by WoW and its 13+ million subscribers.

However, we have also seen floods of these gear progression type of MMO games released since then with the vast majority of them failing in less than 6 months. So obviously any attempt to say that gear progression is the best method for a successful mmo game would be seen with a certain level of doubt.

here is an example of something a thief does that no other class can do:

i do not understand how a class who can do that feels they can legitimately complain about another class. I read posts in this thread such as a warrior can travel the field faster than a thief… i suggest you watch that video and retract your statement.

It seems similar to me yes.

The players who made up DAOC customers were all pvp fans. They did not play for vertical progression or endlessly getting better items. They played because they loved the RvR pvp.

I still remember it as the most fun MMO game i have ever played, and there was zero progression after you got to level 50 and finished your epic armor quest. It was just amazing pvp that kept you coming back day after day, and i loved it.

I was hoping that GW2 was going to go down the same path and be a pvp focused game where people played at max level because the game was so much fun, not to keep getting tiny upgrades running on a hampster wheel.

I did not need another endless pve progression game. There are so many pve progression games to choose from, I would never have chosen GW2 to fill that niche if I wanted it. If i wanted a pve game I would want tanks, healers, crowd control. I would want raids, mounts, and all the bells and whistles.

I honestly dont understand most posters on this forum.

Pinch.4273:

The drop rates are better when you’re not playing at the first tier (1-10)

so this will give players ever more reason to keep themselves segregated.

Its difficult to see this as a good thing.

Cyric.7485:

As I stated above, there is no gear grind currently.

i just stopped reading right there.

you are acting as if the ascended item treadmill is not a real thing that is going to affect WvW.

how can you expect me to take anything you say seriously.

i would say yes.

the fact that they are catering to the bottom of the barrel types who have no life and want to win through statistical advantages is causing me to want to play a different game instead.

i am not a no lifer. getting a new game is not a big deal to me. i can lose the 60$ on this game and not really care. however, all they are doing with their current path is making sure thats the total amount they will ever get from me. there are plenty of other options available.

Cyric.7485:

bow.6179:

I take kitten longer than 2 hours. This post is kittening dumb.

Lawl, seriously. Since when is it anyone else’s fault but your own that you lack the time and/or resources to play an MMO? Why are you playing an MMO if you don’t have time… to play an MMO?

I’m impressed some of you can even hold down a job or a social life while simultaneously deflecting your shortcomings onto everyone else, lol.

your post makes very little sense when these posters are playing a game that was advertised and sold as not having a gear grind which is why this game was appealing to the people who post with little spare time.

you are trying to act like these people are trying to be hardcore raiders or something which is borderline delusional.

Fiontar.4695:

Fritz.5026:

just for instance.

warrior 1 has 20,000 health, 1000 power, and 50% crit rate
warrior 2 has 22,000 health, 1100 power, and 55% crit rate

warrior 2 is 10% superior in the three listed aspects

you run those 2 combatants through a simulator and warrior 2 will consistently win the majority of the encounters. you cant argue that he wont.

its a mathematical fact.

You are completely leaving out the human factor. I routinely take out characters in WvW that, judging by their armor skins, are level 80 and well geared, with my level 63 Thief. I don’t always win, it may be 50/50 1 vs 1 when taking on such opponents, but if you were to pre-judge the match up just by looking at the stat difference, which is huge between level 63 gear and level 80 gear, you would calculate that I would always lose!

It amazes me that I would actually need to explain this at all. People really need to stay in school, but ok, whatever.

If two people of the same class are of equivilent skill and one of them has better gear than the other, the one with the better gear will win the majority of the fights.

this is not some type of opinionated guessing game, its a mathematical fact.

they may not win 100% of the fights, but they will average more than 50%. the match will always be skewed in their favor. Of course there will always be other factors involved that will allow the lesser geared player to win some of the matches, but it does not change the fact that the odds are stacked in the favor of the better geared player.

how can people honestly even argue this? its like arguing that 1+1 does not really equal 2.

just for instance.

warrior 1 has 20,000 health, 1000 power, and 50% crit rate
warrior 2 has 22,000 health, 1100 power, and 55% crit rate

warrior 2 is 10% superior in the three listed aspects

you run those 2 combatants through a simulator and warrior 2 will consistently win the majority of the encounters. you cant argue that he wont.

its a mathematical fact.

Coffeebot.3921:

In PvP content skill makes more of a difference than gear, and only PvP novices think they need the best gear to compete.

i would disagree with this line.

when there is better and worse gear available for a pvp encounter, the person in better gear has a statistical advantage and the person in worse gear has a statistical disadvantage.

this is not opinion, it is a mathematical fact.

TimeBomb.3427:

about 10.7% stronger than a potential exotic equivalent.

if there was a trait that made you 10% more powerful, most people would take it.
if there was a trait that made you 10% weaker, everyone would avoid it.

just to accentuate what a 10% difference means.

There is actually a very easy way for them to fix all of this so people cannot really complain. Change WvW to be linked to sPvP for gearing and things and just separate pve from every part of the pvp game.

As long as your pve gear grinders can go into WvW with an advantage there will be an issue.

Fiontar.4695:

It’s not a levy that once broken sets in motion a flood that can’t be stopped or attenuated.

in a sense it really is something that cannot be corrected.

sure they can turn around and make the items super easy to get which would alleviate the treadmill concerns, but there is a much larger issue that cannot be corrected.

once the majority of players get mad and leave, you can never get them to come back.
while they might be able to correct the game for an individual, its doubtful that the game will ever fully recover from this debacle if something does not happen very quickly.

if this is allowed to fester as it stands for the next month it will essentially be corporate suicide on the game.

at this point getting decent names that are not already taken is not easy, so take what you like and be happy.

also remember, most people will refer to you as your character name so dont pick something you dont want to be called repeatedly.

If you like it then its great.

At this point getting decent names that are not already taken is a difficult task, so I would not be too concerned with the name being ‘asuran sounding’.

that is just me though.

Undeadkemea.4865:

Haha yeah! Oh and I forgot to mention….WARRIORS GOT BUFFED YAAAAAAAAAAAAY!!!!!! Seriously what is up with that, go over to the warrior forum and you still see them crying xD So seriously f-ed up xD

i am just curious about these big warrior buffs.

do you mean the finishers added to the harpoon gun?
or do you mean the 10% bow auto attack damage that noone ever uses anyways?

I am not trying to be mean, but i do not understand this whole “give them a chance” mentality.

This is not this companies first rodeo. I just dont understand. They are supposed to be professionals who have been doing this for years and years.

Alberel Leonhart.9640:

Togashi Jack.9531:

He’s not complaining about new content, more that its a specific timing issue? Why is it only 3 days? Why is there a 1-time only chain during the last day? A large portion of the player base will not be able to participate because of other obligations and setting up event schedules like this effectively says “Play the game or miss out.”

For the record, I’m pulling a double shift tomorrow, likely out and about on saturday, and have obligations every sunday. I will miss this sunday’s 1-time only event chain, and any future 1-time only event chains that they decide to have on sunday. I’m going to miss out on this event completely. I’m one example of what the OP is trying to get at.

There has to be a moment they ‘switch on’ the new zone. This can only happen one time. Thus the event is one-time only. I thought this was rather obvious…

have you played the last couple WoW expansions where the zones change as you progress through the quest lines? They could provide something like that for people who miss the event.

I am not a fan of one time events or things like this either. to me it just reminds me of “omfg you have to be online at 7:30 for raid time or you get left out!” things like that are why i dont want to play gear treadmill games, but sigh.

I would not want to get someones hopes up. At this point the games future seems very unstable to me and I could not in good conscience have a friend end up purchasing the game based on a short free weekend.

I personally find it difficult to invest any serious time into a character because the game feels unstable to me and I do not want to get invested in something and then become bitter over it. How can I ask someone else to?

Their decisions really just confuses me if you take all the personal feelings out of the equation.

Obviously there is a market for gear treadmills or games such as wow, rift, and so on would not be successful.

However I find it difficult to believe that A-net thinks the most profitable section of their playerbase rests firmly within this crowd. They advertised and sold their game with the expectation that this would not be a gear treadmill game.

At this point doing a complete turn around seems the quintessential suicide maneuver.

I am being completely objective about it. Its akin to selling someone a laptop and then shipping them a desktop. Its sort of similar, but it is not what the person ordered and most people are going to get mad about it.

drwookie.6391:

Fritz.5026:

When the next tier is released.

I’m actually looking for an honest answer. Basically my question boils down to their plan moving forward. What takes priority?

that was a logical and honest answer.

notice this section on the patch notes "The drop rarity of Rare and Exotic weapons from certain places in the world (champions, veterans, and players in WvW) has been increased. Rares and Exotics should be much more likely to drop and every champion should be guaranteed to drop loot. "

they are ensuring that the older tier is much easier to attain.

they will make sure the current top tier is easier to attain when they release a new tier.

this is the method nearly every gear grinder game follows.

i am sorry if its not what you want to hear, but the writing is on the wall.

When the next tier is released.

edit – assuming they are following their predecessors. when a new tier is released the old tier is moved into the other areas of the game for easier access.

Shilian.5873:

Fritz.5026:

OEXTRA.1780:

I’m greatly disjointed in how most of you forum gamers are behaving. Yeah sure the new armor rank has its ups and downs but why are ya’ll acting like it’s the end of the world?

first off most people would have stuck with a dedicated pve game if they wanted to grind items like its their job. there are already several fully fleshed out games dedicated to grinding items that cater to the no-lifer crowds making them feel like spending their life in front of a monitor is rewarding in some way.

and secondly, its been 3 months and they already have the next ‘tier’ of gear released. do you honestly think this will be the end of it?

There is always sPvP, by the way.

so if i dont want to be a gear grinder i can forget WvW ?

seems legit.

Hocofaisan.2593:

So no one thinks its a big deal that mesmers and engineers break group healing now?

yes it kind of messes up builds like shout warriors.

I think NPC pets should not be included in the target limit.

I say play your own gender, but in the end its up to you.

i can only assume hes talking about the traits that give buffs based on adrenaline level.

even if the skill now gives full adrenaline on use, which would be nice, i dont see how it changes much. if you are using a weapon that has a good adrenaline skill you will still want to use that skill, if not you would be sitting on a ton of adrenaline anyways.

mulch.2586:

Either decide that you want it or decide you don’t want it. The game will continue to play the same with your exotic set.

i have to say this line just makes no sense to me.

i have to assume you mean “if you never go WvW.” and just left that off.

really i would like to see some GS changes. tone down 100b a little to stop some of the crying, but make the adrenaline attack and other skills better so it feels more like a complete weapon instead of a 1 trick pony.

thats just me though.

Braxxus.2904:

http://youtu.be/PJkTMqJOWvU

Rollin’ that ^ on my engineer right now in WvW and shredding everyone 1v1 as a ranged class. Best part is there’s no huge wind up of a visual “tell” that i’m about to throw a truck load of death their way.

Honestly though I’d be totally fine if they nerfed rifle, hammer and greatsword since they’re the only viable specs atm as long as they buff MH sword, shield, longbow, mace, adrenaline use opposed to hording it for passive buffs, etc. You know, all the crap that is pretty much complete kitten currently.

i cant express how much i hate game videos people try to turn into music videos instead of just letting the game sounds play…

but you are rolling people with that engineer build. thats just silly, lol.

“oh you dont have tier3 gear? you need to go grind the new dungeon for items or you will just get owned in WvW. sorry.”

OEXTRA.1780:

I’m greatly disjointed in how most of you forum gamers are behaving. Yeah sure the new armor rank has its ups and downs but why are ya’ll acting like it’s the end of the world?

first off most people would have stuck with a dedicated pve game if they wanted to grind items like its their job. there are already several fully fleshed out games dedicated to grinding items that cater to the no-lifer crowds making them feel like spending their life in front of a monitor is rewarding in some way.

and secondly, its been 3 months and they already have the next ‘tier’ of gear released. do you honestly think this will be the end of it?

Jasher.6580:

19k-25k hundred blades is okay… yet they nerfed pistol whip… I’m genuinely confused. Both root the character, both are channelled attacks, yet the guy with the heavy armour and high health gets to keep that ridiculous damage.

Confused.

because you are looking at things in a vacuum.

a warrior cannot turn invisible to avoid being attacked.
a warrior cannot teleport away when things are going badly.

also your numbers are so inflated its ridiculous.

brute.1607:

That was the reason why I thought about making a warrior because every class gets nerfed except for them. All I see is buffs for them.

lmao.

all those combo finishers to the harpoon gun were some leet warrior buffs.

Ganzo.5079:

its not the patch note the biggest delusion of this night (on EU) but this, and i have really no kind word left:

http://kotaku.com/5960951/the-lead-designer-of-guild-wars-2-is-answering-your-questions-right-now

Maarius 2 hours ago

how important for you is vertical progression in GW2?

IsaiahCartwright @Maarius 2 hours ago

All progression is important to us, we want to make sure our rewards and progression systems hit a spectrum of players and makes everyone feel excited to play the game.

I do find this kind of disturbing.

GW2 does not have the ability to compete with dedicated pve games in my opinion. shallow combat, limited abilities, no raids, and its missing most of the bells and whistles of pve games like mounts and all of that jazz.

they should stick to their strengths which was being a balanced mmo style pvp game.

trying to be guild-warcraft is just going to end poorly for them like everyone else who tries.

I personally think most people are taking the 2 people thing way out of context.

These people are realistically doing little more than adjusting numbers on skills.

If I spent 40 hours, one work week, just sitting there tuning numbers on skills I would get ALOT adjusted.

I could understand the way people are acting if they had only 2 people trying to graphically design new abilities, animations, and everything else…. but all of that work has been done already.

These guys are basically play testers / number adjusters at this point.

this is a textbook example of buyers remorse.

people talking about warriors just confuse me.

the majority of the changes were adding finishers to the harpoon gun.

they got a 10% buff on long bow auto attack, because you know warriors actually use long bow and stuff.

i mean what is the uproar exactly?

I just wonder how many people who keep acting like warrior is god mode actually play a warrior. The warrior I made was certainly effective, I am not arguing that, but when I had him oriented to do damage so I could kill things quickly I also died pretty easily. I just never felt like I had this ‘god mode’ people speak of which is what confuses me.

Sin.8174:

HS spam worked on bad pvp players who were glass cannons or didn’t know a thing about dodging or timing. Now? it’s a laughable tactic.

wait.

were you not earlier saying that only thieves had to know about dodging and timing?

i thought other classes were exempt from needing these skills from your statements.

you are just contradicting yourself at this point.

Sin.8174:

How is spamming 2 even viable?!?

It’s not. Not even close to viable in PvE…

Dude. Seriously. Stop spreading false facts.

whatever you say chief. i mean its not like its been a successfully used tactic for months now by many players or anything, lol.

you can go to youtube right now and pull up multiple videos where spamming #2 is the main tactic when a thief is using d/d. I just watched a video last night of a thief who used shortbow and when anything got close went d/d and spammed #2 with every bit of initiative they had. they did fairly well and thought they were a skilled player.

dont let those little things like facts get in the way of pretending its not real though.

Sin.8174:

damianlxl.3621:

Fritz.5026:

i would say thief.

you can go to the thief forum right now and see a p/p video where all the guy does is spam 3-3-3-3 and he still does well.

it doesnt get much easier than that.

I have also heard however that thief dies really fast if you are not paying attention.

I do like the medium armor aesthetic best; but I am apprehensive to play a really twitch class when I am already having a hard time keeping up with the pace of the game.

Fritz does not play a thief, guarenteed. he’s the type that sees a ‘Cheese’ PvE/PvP thief video and screams NERF.

If you are a beginner, stay away from thief until you get comfortable with the dodge commands. Thief gameplay is one that’s constantly on the move, about situational awareness, and yes, they have lower survivability than most when it comes to armor.

However, there are some nice skills that help with survivability in PvE. We have a variety of invisibility inducing skills that can be chained together as long as we stay out of combat. (Makes it nice for bypassing some tough, clustered areas)

We also have amny tools for a quick escape when we’re about to be wtfpwned by a big monster. However, using these skills appropriately, managing initiaive, and knowing monster animations is a big part in whether or not you’ll survive.

Once mastered however, thief is a blast to play.

sin is the type who likes to make things sound more dramatic than they really are, guaranteed.

every class has to dodge and stay on the move, it is not unique to the thief class, not even a little bit.

it just happens that thieves can spam 1 button for their damage rotation while everyone else has to use multiple skills for their damage rotation.

everyone uses 1 heal, 3 utilities, and 1 elite.

most classes also need to use 5 attack skills, except thieves who can get by spamming 1 button.

logically this makes the thief the easiest to play.

i would say thief.

you can go to the thief forum right now and see a p/p video where all the guy does is spam 3-3-3-3 and he still does well.

it doesnt get much easier than that.

also, you have to realize they knew they were going to be late a while ago. I am quite certain they did not get down to the deadline and be like “oops we are late.”

They knew hours ago. It would just be polite to keep people informed.

Its not good form to miss your own deadlines.

in the real world if you miss deadlines bad things happen. you get failing grades, fired from your job, back-charged, and on and on.

i realize that game developers get away with bloody murder because they basically have a captive audience, but its still not very polite to your customers.

at the very least a small announcement should be made so people can be informed.

anyhow, this is not the first, or last, time i have seen this, so i guess i will go do something else for a few hours and hope something changes in the meantime.

in my opinion GW2 is not good enough to be turned into a gear grind game and its just a mistake for them to try. It does not have the depth of combat that other mmo games have for pve, it does not have the bars full of skills, it does not have large scale raids, and on and on. All they are doing is catering to a vocal minority of bottom feeders who think because they have no life and can play all day every day they are entitled to be better than everyone else through artificial stat boosts on their gear. these players essentially are saying they want better items so their actual player skill is not the deciding factor…. which is quite ludacris considering they already can play more than everyone else and should be better players by default. how bad are these players really…. the bottom of the barrel no lifers with no skill if you ask me.

GW2 however is a great game to keep advancing as a PVP game. The limited skills and equal gear means its much easier to keep balanced for PVP fans. I would rather see them spend that time and effort into expanding the PVP section of the game. I think A-net is messing up and without a monthly fee they may not really notice for a long time.

Selo.1250:

Nayru.4537:

Sounds like a noob more than anything.

No, the 8000 reply topic is pretty much about that. “I have to make an effort to get these items, but i want them for free”
“Im so angry i wont get the best items in the game for free, even though i dont need them for the content im doing as a casual player”

a person could just post the opposite of what you say though.

you act as if since you can play all the time you are entitled to be better than everyone else and you should auto-win through artificial stats on your gear instead of just being a better player.

just because people want the game to be about skill instead of artificial stats on gear is not a bad thing, unless you are the type who thinks you should auto win because you grinded out those artificial stats.

i personally dont see grinding out gear as some amount of player ability, unless you consider sacrificing your life some type of skill.

Nayru.4537:

Fritz.5026:

Nayru.4537:

Fritz.5026:

Dee Jay.2460:

Fritz.5026:

Dee Jay.2460:

A few notes about “Casual Players”.

1. Casual Players don’t read the forums. They take the game as it is and have little interest or involvement in what goes on around it.

2. They don’t generally feel entitled to anything. They will do content that they can, and ignore stuff they cannot do.

3. They aren’t very vocal, considering their portion of the player base.

4. Time spent playing isn’t actually all that an important indicator for player mentality.
_________________________________________

People who post on the forums are naturally more engaged in the game than most players. They care more and are more invested. Hence they are more opinionated too.

I would say you are wrong on nearly all counts. your notes and definitions are your opinions, and i would personally disagree.

just because someone is not hardcore does not automatically mean they dont care about the game or wont post on the forums. thats just being ridiculous.

But it isn’t. People like to title themselves “casual” because it makes them appear more balanced.

The vast, vast majority of the game’s player base simply does not care about what goes on around the game. They don’t care about content they can’t beat and don’t care about items they can’t reach.

I assume you are an “involved Gamer” who likes to think they are “casual” but the fact that you are posting here and discussing the game proves that you are 10 times more involved with it than your average player.

again, i would disagree with you on pretty much every single thing you said.

if a person puts time into something, if they are casual or hardcore, they will generally care about that thing. saying otherwise is just pretending human nature doesnt exist.

a casual person may post on the forums more than they actually play because they have time at work and constant access to a computer, but cannot actually play games. pretending forum posting is some type of indication of being hardcore is just ignorant.

i cannot find anything logical you base your opinions on except that you just want it to be that way in your own mind.

I’m certain casual players dont post on the forums while at work, I don’t think you know what you’re talking about.

i suppose it is completely unheard of for people who work at computers all day to get bored and post on forums to kill time.

i mean thats just crazy talk right there.

Yeah it is, you’re talking about casual gamers. They don’t do that. They play 5 hours a week. They don’t roam game forums all day at work.

if you say so chief, you are obviously the brains of this operation.

i would continue to dispute the point, but you obviously will not change your mind regardless of any amount of facts i present, so i dont see the point in putting in the effort.

i would think any adult with real world experience would know better, but hey, there is no guarantee i am actually talking to an adult, so maybe my expectations are skewed.

Nayru.4537:

Fritz.5026:

Dee Jay.2460:

Fritz.5026:

Dee Jay.2460:

A few notes about “Casual Players”.

1. Casual Players don’t read the forums. They take the game as it is and have little interest or involvement in what goes on around it.

2. They don’t generally feel entitled to anything. They will do content that they can, and ignore stuff they cannot do.

3. They aren’t very vocal, considering their portion of the player base.

4. Time spent playing isn’t actually all that an important indicator for player mentality.
_________________________________________

People who post on the forums are naturally more engaged in the game than most players. They care more and are more invested. Hence they are more opinionated too.

I would say you are wrong on nearly all counts. your notes and definitions are your opinions, and i would personally disagree.

just because someone is not hardcore does not automatically mean they dont care about the game or wont post on the forums. thats just being ridiculous.

But it isn’t. People like to title themselves “casual” because it makes them appear more balanced.

The vast, vast majority of the game’s player base simply does not care about what goes on around the game. They don’t care about content they can’t beat and don’t care about items they can’t reach.

I assume you are an “involved Gamer” who likes to think they are “casual” but the fact that you are posting here and discussing the game proves that you are 10 times more involved with it than your average player.

again, i would disagree with you on pretty much every single thing you said.

if a person puts time into something, if they are casual or hardcore, they will generally care about that thing. saying otherwise is just pretending human nature doesnt exist.

a casual person may post on the forums more than they actually play because they have time at work and constant access to a computer, but cannot actually play games. pretending forum posting is some type of indication of being hardcore is just ignorant.

i cannot find anything logical you base your opinions on except that you just want it to be that way in your own mind.

I’m certain casual players dont post on the forums while at work, I don’t think you know what you’re talking about.

i suppose it is completely unheard of for people who work at computers all day to get bored and post on forums to kill time.

i mean thats just crazy talk right there.

Dee Jay.2460:

Fritz.5026:

Dee Jay.2460:

A few notes about “Casual Players”.

1. Casual Players don’t read the forums. They take the game as it is and have little interest or involvement in what goes on around it.

2. They don’t generally feel entitled to anything. They will do content that they can, and ignore stuff they cannot do.

3. They aren’t very vocal, considering their portion of the player base.

4. Time spent playing isn’t actually all that an important indicator for player mentality.
_________________________________________

People who post on the forums are naturally more engaged in the game than most players. They care more and are more invested. Hence they are more opinionated too.

I would say you are wrong on nearly all counts. your notes and definitions are your opinions, and i would personally disagree.

just because someone is not hardcore does not automatically mean they dont care about the game or wont post on the forums. thats just being ridiculous.

But it isn’t. People like to title themselves “casual” because it makes them appear more balanced.

The vast, vast majority of the game’s player base simply does not care about what goes on around the game. They don’t care about content they can’t beat and don’t care about items they can’t reach.

I assume you are an “involved Gamer” who likes to think they are “casual” but the fact that you are posting here and discussing the game proves that you are 10 times more involved with it than your average player.

again, i would disagree with you on pretty much every single thing you said.

if a person puts time into something, if they are casual or hardcore, they will generally care about that thing. saying otherwise is just pretending human nature doesnt exist.

a casual person may post on the forums more than they actually play because they have time at work and constant access to a computer, but cannot actually play games. pretending forum posting is some type of indication of being hardcore is just ignorant.

i cannot find anything logical you base your opinions on except that you just want it to be that way in your own mind.