Guild Wars 2

You have to deal damage to a target first then the trait will work.
The clone will be create and target the last enemy you damage.

How about no until anet do something about mesmer abysmal DPS?
Right now I’ve seen that mesmer are compensated by their lag of DPS by their utilities and why would you want to nerf mesmer utilities too? Peer preasure?

link to DPS that mesmer trying to testing out
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/mesmer/So-what-s-your-DPS-on-the-new-golems
https://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/4fnnfo/dps_comparison/

BTW how does the staff score so high?

edit;spelling

Azukas.1426:

denis.9487:

Azukas.1426:

denis.9487:

Azukas.1426:

denis.9487:

Azukas.1426:

denis.9487:

Azukas.1426:

Obtena.7952:

Curunen.8729:

I can see you get a kick out of being a martyr, but this is getting long in the tooth now.

What’s the point in making a thread if you’re not open for discussion? I think it’s best to leave it be and accept you won’t convince the other 99% of the population that are not at the top of pro league, and neither will they convince you. Just agree to disagree and leave it be.

This thread is no different than the one the OP made in the Rev forum.

“What I think is truth, no reason to discuss. Let’s talk about how to nerf Rev’s now. "

You can imagine the result … actually you’re seeing it here. There is no open discussion. The second anyone attempts to discuss, they are simply wrong and ignored. A very disingenuous approach to having a discussion with people.

Here’s the issue. No one counter argues with facts or examples but just wants people to take thier emotional opinions as facts. Sorry it doesn’t work that way when I’m using examples, facts, and pro league players input.

If you want to discuss things please come at me with something other than “I feel”

Fact. Mesmer was never really taken pre stacking. Sure some pros made it work but what about the rest of us?? Also if you look back these pros often said other classes could do it better. Post stacking. You cant have more than 1 of any class. By default the 5th is Mesmer because of 2 skills. Condition output insane?? Does it beat condition rev or necro? So yes pros use the Mesmer. Pre hot had small niche and again pros basically handicapped themselves because they loved the class. Post hot. Give Moa/portal to the warrior since according to the pros are out of the meta and guess what. Warrior would be the 5th.
We are poorly balanced. Removing those skills might even the playing field and show how far apart it really is. As it is people still complain about pu/clones/signet of illusions. It’s easy to hate something you don’t understand.

Fact mesmer was stacked in Season 1.

Since June 23rd 2015 Mesmer has been in a REALLY REALLY good place. 10 months of having the good life.

Now let’s see if you can answer me one question. If Mesmer is ONLY meta b/c of portal and moa how come, according to you all, mesmer wasn’t meta before when they had Moa and Portal? That’s all they needed according to everyone here so why weren’t they meta then?

Thanks for your reply and I look forward to another

The one answer is cs. Allowing 2 casts of the elite. That is an entire different post though. You also failed to acknowledge any of my points. Helseth himself the king has gone on record saying thief was better pre hot.

So thief was better pre June 23rd. We’re dealing with right now not the past.

Get out of the past because for like the past year we’ve been top dog.

So yes I’ve acknowledged all of your points and what besides dble moa stands out?

Ok by logic. Our condition build was nerfed not buffed after hot. It is only taken because of the stacking rule and the double down of our 2 key skills. We are not op by any means. We are just taken like the side of salad that comes with the steak.

I already stated I’m not so sure about mesmer only being meta because of no stacking. We saw a team run it in pros but the team was no where near as good as rank 55. Could of a better team played with a mesmer? I personally believe so and others agreed with me. Then you look at what pros are saying now and you get the idea more were going to run it.

Now don’t get me wrong because I truly believe revs have too much. That’s another class that needs to get beat with the hammer BUT they can’t touch mesmer 1v1 or 1vX.

I can work with that. 1 team used a Mesmer. Most were using double rev. 1 game is such a small sample size to make any assumptions. What I gathered is the hate being generated by cs and using it to double elites. The stacking rule surely cast light on other classes. Hence the Mesmer stepping in. We are meta currently because we have had the same 5v5 pvp stand in a circle to win since launch. Again another topic but by no means an indication Mesmer is op.

Mesmer condi specs have always been OP and now they’ve gone and made one tournament viable.

Yes the 1 team in the finals is a bad sample size but seeing what we see now I believe condi shatter beats out 2nd rev.

I’m not here championing nerfs either. I’m just here saying I told you so and let’s rejoice in the greatness of mesmer.

Now I do expect nerfs tomorrow and I just pray the rest of the OP classes get it too.

1 team in final is a bad sample size, agree on that, any good experiment require an ample sample but you just skip the whole why no one pick mesmer

People picking up portal and moa because they are the last thing we have not because they are other option

PS
>not here championing nerf
>expect nerfs tomorrow

wut?

Fay.2357:

Ananeos.4587:

Fay.2357:

IDK why ya’ll continue to post here. It’s obvious that there’s no point to it. Just let the thread die and report OP for bumping if he keeps at it.

Yeah… I’ll take you up on that one. Everyone please report the thread.

Er, just to be clear, I didn’t mean report it now. Just stop posting and let the thread die. If op tries to keep it alive by bumping then report.

I see what you mean but this kind of thread create a big delusion about mesmer and then we have guys like lexander who only play thief, had a vendeta against mesmer, act like an expert on mesmer, a guy like lionchan with his nerf signet of inspiration TM, and a guy like ryo who said that Mesmer was always good at pve, back in the day mesmer were brough in for time warp and portal only

Azukas.1426:

…

Here’s the issue. No one counter argues with facts or examples but just wants people to take thier emotional opinions as facts. Sorry it doesn’t work that way when I’m using examples, facts, and pro league players input.

If you want to discuss things please come at me with something other than “I feel”

You don’t accept the patch history as a fact
You don’t accept the past history of mesmer in all the important tournament as a fact
You don’t accept that no stacking rule make people pick mesmer to play

You accept every nerf anet did to mesmer, how about shave off like the chill nerf?
You said that every one that disagree with anet own them an apology, i don’t even know what to say about this
Your fact is “mesmer is OP. You can’t argue this. It is a fact.”

Basically you don’t accept other people opinion only your own, you shut down every arguments by stating that your facts is the only one that are correct and other are wrong.

And yes the meta is only about moa and portal, if you want more condi, necro will do better.

BTW is this the video you are talking about?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hyXz8cV62Dk
It is about moa and portal again.

Walk slowy to Ryou.2398, give him a pat on the back and whispering softly in his ear saying “everything is okay”.

Why not just bring you “best of the best” build and it try out in pvp or wvw? even better yet raid! People will adore you and asking for more!

You obviously had already formed an opinion of your own, you don’t need second experience from other, just go and try out.

Azukas.1426:

Ananeos.4587:

If there were no stacking rule mesmer would be replaced by another rev.

I honestly don’t know about that now that these teams are playing with mesmers. The kit they bring is just too good to pass up. Also condi shatter will beat all meta classes 1v1. This can guarantee you the need to 2v1 a mesmer on sides.

p.s. To the posters who disagree with me. I’m sorry but the truth is the truth. Since June 23rd 2015 we mesmers have had it easy, and we have been one of the best classes in the game. This is not debatable and is fact. You might have a different experience but that’s because of your skill level…not the class.

Thank You

Dude… your truth is very selective, you got selective memory or something?
Sure, right after the 23rd update mesmer was great, that was before HOT, then came the nerf and nerf and nerf, the final straw that make every one lost their hope is the alacrity nerf, and that was because of raid, “66%” dps increase.

Your “one of the best classes” is very very very debatable, just check out the history such as how many people took it to a big tourny or the patch history.

Azukas.1426:

Fay.2357:

Azukas.1426:

Levetty.1279:

Look we know you can’t tell the difference between pro league using portal and the random troll cleric mesmer that keeps kicking your kitten in hot join but we don’t need an update everytime it happens.

Expressing exuberance for having arguably the strongest class in the game is a natural reaction. This is more so special because we just got nuked with the nerf bat last patch.

Join me in the gaiety!!

Arguably the strongest class implies that one is capable of discussion about it. Since that description obviously doesn’t fit, you should probably stay away from that turn of phrase.

Yet the pros and shout casters agree with me. The only ones who don’t are the players who play mesmer at a low level.

“pros and shout casters agree with me. The only one who don’t are the players who play mesme at a low level”

I disagree with you
Starting a tread that mesmer is meta after the no class stacking rule is up
Ignore that the only working build right now that is the mercenary condi build
Ignore that clones are easily kill in aoe or even auto attack

Mesmer is OP, yeah right

Wow, just wow, is this a suggestion coming from a mesmer player?
This is why I am starting to hate mesmer forum: more nerf us plz thread.

Lexander.4579:

…
because clearly gw2 pro playurs are not pro enough to realize the strength of mesmer’s portals and moa shutdowns and only now they are getting somewhere near understanding of the value of those 2 skills while at the same time mesmer is just as good in combat as any other class

This is just ridiculous, your reason is that portal and moa is some kind of a new thing, even thou it’s been there from the begining? portal has been used in pvp, wvw and even in pve (mainly jumping puzzle). It’s even in the mesmer trailer!
For moa, we already have complains about it ages ago until some one point out that it come with build in evade, and skill 2 for running away. Its a long casting time and long cd skill. The use was always the same: to shut down a single target.

I believe portal works like field, the last one the the mesmer cast is the one that will get to active, assuming you standing on the intersection of the portal.

Lexander.4579:

if you didnt see pro playurs playing mesmer it doesnt mean mesmer wasnt dominating in sPvP, mesmer has always been one of the strongest classes but required playing better than average in order to be used to the full extent

I am not sure if this guy is trolling or trying to starting a flame war or not.

First is his word: “playurs” not players
Second is “mesmer has always been on of the strongest classes”

On the first note, it might be because of a simple spelling mistake but the second quote is pure ignorant, if mesmer is always that strong why don’t we see them more in tournament in the past? or have you been living in a bizarro earth for the last 3 years?

no, HoT didn’t destroy it, the balance was always this bad, your “balance” stage was only a brief time, from 23rd update to the day when HoT was release
there were no good old day except if you play war, it was even worst, there were only shoutbow war and d/d ele the rest was a joke build, before that ranger and necro were fighting for the bottom tier

I think i need to get this into everyone head right now before the next patch come out or there will be no saving for mesmer:
Condi mesmer is not the second coming of this class but a last straw for this class because power shatter DOES NOT WORK for everyone except for the excetional few, power shatter mesmer is too risky, low damage compare to other class, even druid’s staff AA will out damage greatsword AA.

Next, the delusion of grandeur for this class, for non mesmer I can forgive them but for those that play mesmer and said that mesmer’s utilities and elite skills are op and need a nerf, these people need to have a look at other class or check if there are truely op and there is no defence against it? Here are some of the example:

Gravity Well: New flash, it’s already been nerf once and you guys want to have it nerf again!? What is wrong with you guys? Too many CC and lol “damage”? Have any of you guys try out Dragonhunter’s trap yet? Oh yeah and that one second casting time, a normal person will walk out of your target area before you even finish casting it.

Signet of Humility: One second cast time, 180 cooldown and it also come with build in evade. If it wasn’t because of some class that is nearly unkillable in melee like scrapper or some class that giving out aura like santa giving out present aka tempest I don’t think there will be a use for this skill. For double moa, mesmer have to set up illusion, use continuum split then use the signet, this is not some skill simple skill chain like other class. For some that said it is op because after they have been hit by moa they are hit again by CC, let’s face it you are getting hit by heavy CC and conditions, with or without moa you will die anyway.

Portal: Oh god, it’s been there since the begining and you guys said it’s OP now? Have you ever seen a mesmer in a tourney with a portal and make his team won?

In conclusion for this, please don’t jump on the nerf train just because you feel like “the cool kidz” are doing it, try it first for some time, check out other class and compare them to mesmer, because other class have their own niche and mesmer niche is becoming non existence.

countytime.8134:

An easy way to tell what classes are overpowered is to see which are overplayed. In the case of mesmers you’ll see them taking or defending objectives entirely on their own. Contrast that with some classes that you almost never see wandering in WvW.

There are a lot of classes that are powerful but can still be taken in a fair fight; necros, elementalists, rangers. But Mesmers have too many overpowered tools.

savage

Ok, my point is that they shold just give us full 3 sec block, the first phantasm spawn at 1 1/2 mark and the the second will spawn at the end if we got hit because let face it a full block of 3 sec is more usefull than having split it and taking some random damage during the split.
Also how did you get it recharge to 12 sec? echo of memory effect by Persistence of Memory and Illusionist’s Celerity too?

mesmer’s focus, Temporal Curtain, took 3 years to fix.
So I am guessing between 9 month to 1 and a half year.

BTW, don’t you guys feel like shield is very underwhelming ATM?
First they nerf blocking duration from 2 1/4 sec and 2 1/4 sec to 1 1/2 and 1 1/2, and we are ok with it? i mean the usual block of shield is 3 sec but mesmer having it split which is not equal to full block of 3 sec.
Also the damage from iAvenger is abyssmal too

TheOneWhoSighs.7513:

Hlord.5940:

I shall be the destroyer of hope and dream.
Portal in ESL? clearly that skill op, increase its cooldown to 180 sec and make it stay for only 5 sec.

If we’re even remotely considering that, then make the range 20000 and the portal entre duration 90 seconds.

You shouldn’t just flat nerf skills by a massive amount with no compensation, that’s quite silly.
Especially when it’s seriously the only skill mesmer really has left, outside of moa.

sorry, it was meant to be a sarcasm because mesmer has been massively nerf and the only thing left that people will seriously take a mesmer to a tourney is portal which doesn’t work well as we have seen it.

I shall be the destroyer of hope and dream.
Portal in ESL? clearly that skill op, increase its cooldown to 180 sec and make it stay for only 5 sec.

I enjoy going in 900 range of an enemy and spend another 1 and a half second casting phantasm which will take another half a second to attack or walk to one of the enemy and attack
-sarcasm
yes, they need a redesign or at least normalize they cast time to 3/4 sec, especially the utility phantasm

Mikkel.8427:

Personally, I’d prefer they increase the recharge of all the mantras by 50-100%, but give us the background recharge ‘bug’ back. As a bonus, they’d actually benefit from alacrity that way also.

To this day, I still don’t think that the “background bug” was a real bug and instead of nerf only mantra of distraction, they “fix” the whole “background bug”, just like instead of only nerfing well of precognition they nerf the whole alacrity

25% scepter auto attack speed increase!?!?!??!?

Base heal from restorative mantras is 2600….
with 300 healing power from healing prism, assuming you dont use cleric amulet or any other amulet that adding in healing power, it becomes 2660

Well 60 hp is better than nothing I guess…
I mean 400% is definitly more than 40% right? i am not that jealous of 9k heal much or anything, i just wish it could be abit more you know? What do you think guys?

My issue with the nerf is this:
alacrity is nerf BECAUSE of other class skills NOT BECAUSE OF MESMER SKILLS,
basically mesmer got nerf becuse of OTHER CLASS and NOT BECAUSE OF THE CLASS ITSELF.

emendez.3705:

lets face it mesmer condi build+stealth is pretty op
ive never seen a class win a 3v1 before chronomancer came out. I can’t say the others were skilled but i know i am(wvw roamer) and its pretty crazy the amount of invun i was seeing getting and condition spam and mesmer clones suck up slingle target skills/condi too well >.>

>mesmer condi build+stealth is pretty op
may be your build or the guy that face that mesmer were not spec to face a condi build because i am sure that if you said that the current condi mesmer is op you have not read the list of condi mesmer nerf since day one (the 20th patch).
>3v1
the other two were newbie or…. wtf you gank on a condi mesmer with 3 guys and lose?!?!?!

I am not quite sure if it belong in this forum or not but it have something to do with the chronomancer

I got a sylvari chronomancer and when i equip Chronomancer’s Epaulets it looks fine and all but when i start moving, they stab me in the head and if my calculation is correct i am pretty sure every asura with Chronomancer’s Epaulets will have them stabing at their head ALL THE TIME

My point is this, could the dev turn the angle on the Chronomancer’s Epaulets down a bit? around the same angle as light Glorious Epaulets armor would be perfect

you forgot the new classic one: “mesmer’s greatsword have the same dps that rival ranger’s longbow”

mesmer op?
before the 20th patch: nope, we were competing the last place with necro and ranger
after the 20th patch: okish and underwhelming in dps when compare to other class but at least shatter burst help in pvp

STRONK in both power and CONDITION?:
kitten son where did you get that from? condition traits was gutter, kill, remove on the launch of the 20th patch, day one nerf!
strong in power? more like we are only left with one workable build

stun and daze?
why u no brink stun breakuru? yeah that is, easily fix with stun breaker and stability, i bring in my stun breaker and why don’t you? hell stability is even better!

edit easly* to easily

Xyonon.3987:

Mender’s purity bug is since the mantra cd “fix”.

To have no cd was a bug since they didn’t mention this change anywhere. But it was the “fixiest” bug ever. sad they touched it

---

Another option would be a redesign:

This idea was in multiple minds and I still think it would be worth a try: When mantras would charge themselves over time. When you are out of combat and swap in a mantra, it will have 3 charges. Then after that, each mantra will get 1 stack after a mantra specific CD. Lets say considering cast time, cd and balance:

Healing mantra: a charge every 5± sec.
Dazing mantra: a charge every 8± sec.
Stability mantra: a charge every 8± sec.
Condi cleanse mantra: a charge every 8± sec.
Mantra of pain: a charge every 3± sec.

I’d enjoy these kind of mantras. Sure some traits would have to be adjusted, but I’d say it will make them very very smooth to play with.

so instead of a real fix they introduced a new bug? wow that is so kitten

i find your idea very interesting and might i add that the mantra are in the readied state when we change the skill or move to other map, having to recharge it every time when we change the skill and moving to defferetn map is annoying, this is ust QoL. changing

I don’t think it was a bugged, they did remove the mantra mastery trait line, now i wonder if they will add it back
BTW was Mender’s Purity bug introduce after the mantra “fix” or it had been there since the 23rd patch?

I don’t think it is working, i’ve seen alot of dc in ranked game alot and no, they are not changing their class just dc

Mender’s Purity still bug with Mantra of Resovle

Queing the mantra recharge after using ether feast will put the mantra on cooldown

Further test proof that after using a healing skill and if the mantra is not ready it will put it in cooldown

princode.2750:

as of now chornomancer is seriously broken…I can have nfinity amount uptime of alacrity on players. I love the new concept but please fix choro before its release

Show me

Chaotic Dampening AND The Pledge.
Actually i’ve been wondering for a while now but why are some phantasm have a cooldown of 25-30 sec? for example: phantasmal mage, a 6 sec burning ever 6 second really worth 30 sec of cd when we have shatter as the main mechanic?
Oh yeah, Consume Ectoplasm too, i mean wtf, 10 sec of every boon?

first go full glass, no question ask
use this build or something close to this:
http://metabattle.com/wiki/Build:Mesmer_-_Burst_Shatter
with at least blink in utility, bonus point for decoy and mirror image
first off, this is important, before starting the combo you MUST WAIT for your target to use some kind of skill with a long cast time because you need to interrrup him for damage
equip greatsowrd, starting off by using phantasmal berserker on your target, it will crit for magical reason
blink in, use mirror blade or use mirror blade and blink in if you fast enough, personally i find it easier to just blink in and use mirror blade just to make sure that mirror blade can bounce and it will crit for magical reason too which will activate your air/fire sigl!!!!
note: you need to be close to your target to have your illusion persona be effective
pop your diversion to active your power block, BIG DAMAGE around 1k-1.1k!!!!
use mind stab on your target for extra damage
now for the final part we have lots of option here, we can:
1. dodge to create a clone
2. use decoy to create a clone
3. use mirror image to create TWO CLONES
use one of these skill or better yet use all of them if you can but remember you can only have maximum of 3 clones
and for the finishing touch pop your mind wrack

now this might be hard to pull off but i assure you can pull this off when you use map chat to nicely asking for someone to stand still and use a long casting skill or caught some one while their pants are down but i find that it is easier to nicely ask someone to stand still so you can unload your burst

sure it might be harder than pulling a thief 10k heart seeker or or stealth engi nades or or buring guard with thier build in greatsword’s/sword’s gap closing but it works in theory

How do mesmer stack might while stealthed? i really want know this so i can counter instant engi nades of death

Toxsa.2701:

Ignorance Ignorance Ignorance.

Many Engi wants their OP bugged grenade barrage gone.
Many Ele wants their insane burning stack gone.
Many Guardians want their insane burning stack gone.
For thief idk, maybe not.

This video pretty much sums up what’s wrong with Mesmer and Guardian.

https://youtu.be/46hPricq-RQ

You can keep making excuses. You can keep acting blind. You can keep giving silly arguments. You can keep pretending that the spec is weak. You can keep bringing up unrelated stuffs to justify this.

You can keep defending this BS, but you’d quickly see a dying GW2 pvp community. (Not like it’s not dying already.)

engi forum
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/engineer
ele forum
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/elementalist
and guard forum
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/guardian

not many as “mesmer” as i’ve seen it

so another nerf? the old one(healing one) was garbage but the remove condition one was good
sad, ever patch since the 23rd patch is a nerf for mesmer

Just a question, ever seen Time Warp in pvp? i did once and the guy who brought it was me, i quickly found out that ppl just leave the area and force you to follow them and the cool down kinda kill it for me but it is ok in pve, the boss dont move but then again feel my wraith is better

Master of Manipulation doesn’t give the extra reflex while underwater, tested it with Mirror while underwater the cooldown still work

here is for engi
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9zOWZUywrrg&feature=youtu.be
obviously you have seen thief 10k
guardian have Feel My Wraith burst
ranger have Rapid Fire burst but not good as the other classes mine you but it got a range of 1500 and cd of 8 sec so it’s kinda event out
scepter ele

every class have their burst build too, well except necro, haven’t figure it out or seen it yet, don’t know why guys treat mesmer burst as the second coming

mesmer asking for mesmer nerf, only in mesmer forum
i don’t see any thief asking for their 10k heart seeker nerf or any other class

Mestmer trait

While under water, manipulation skills with master of manipulation trait doesn’t grant the extra reflect, i’ve test it with Mirror, not sure about other skill because i can’t test them

speaking of Blurred Inscriptions, could anet buff it to remove 2 conditions? i want to try some thing new other than mantra of resolve and since the meta is shifting toward conditions, removing one condition on signet cast just doesn’t cut it now

I notice that time warp has it type changes to glamour and the patch stated that all glamour have 20% reduce recharge, did they forgot about it?
Since they fix Maim the Disillusioned pretty quick, this should be address pretty quick too

Recasting time of 2 and 3/4 second, would be fine if it’s outside of combat but in combat and it’s like standing still for 2 and 3/4 second, can dodge but you will cancel the casting, by themselves they are pretty bad but it’s ok with multiple traits but=>

Mantra Mastery tier with Far-Reaching Manipulations and Blade Training
Protected Mantras tier with Deceptive Evasion
Empowering Mantras, grandmaster trait
Harmonious Mantras, again, grandmaster trait
Restorative Mantras, it’s in inspiration trait line

So, IMO, their should lower the recasting time to 1 and 3/4 (1 sec less) to make it more usable in combat, because we mesmer already have a lot of casting time for other skill ie all the phantasm and clones, or merge some of the trait together to make it more appearing because currently we have to sacrifice a lot to make mantra usable

BTW i am not against using mantra or anything, i even use mantra of resolve (best condition remover for mesmer), it’s just that they are not very pvp friendly

This would be very interesting because the base duration of mesmer confuse from clone and shatter is 3 sec, while engineer have 5, anet should neither buff confusion duration or change it to torment(or just my input, random condition of burn,bleed, or torment) so it can do some damage, currently mob in pve use confusion better that mesmer themselves

This “Test Your Mettle in the Second Player vs. Player Ladder Test Season”, dont you guys feel like anet just slap us in the face again? and i am not talking only for mesmer but i am talking for necro too.
After WTS i was expecting anet to make some adjustment because we can clearly see what need to be adjust, which class has distinctive advantage over other class but noooooo anet just make another ladder test season instead of skill update first.
Now i wonder if we will ever get another skill update before HoT came out or we will stuck with the current build and be the bottom of the food chain, finally when HoT came out mesmer will get “just as good” as Disruptor’s Sustainment again.

Necro get a greatsowrd
Guardian get a longbow
Ele get swords
Engi get a hammer and drones
Mesmer get… shield, off hand? and “just as good” compensation, man i don’t know about you guys but Furious Interruption and Disruptor’s Sustainment still scare the kitten out of me