Guild Wars 2

Ridiculous setup? It only requires you to press one button before a fight -_-
To date I have only seen very few people actually kill my wurm. It does happen in sPvP (mostly from other Necros), from time to time, but not that often… which is weird since the skill managed to climb its way into the meta for a lil while and you’d expect more people to know what it does… Anyway… even people from Abjurned seem to be walking right past the wurm in their stream.
And if you do notice someone killing your wurms then you can easily place it farther away… or if it’s something like a thief you can port to the wurm and kitten them up :P
Or Chilblains —> Wurm port = weakness, 6 poison stacks, chill.

I dunno how it is in hardcore 5v5s but in most normal sPvP (which is what most people play anyway) it’s not a huge issue. I guess they could up its health even more, or give it more toughness to make it a bigger nuisance to kill.

Either way with Reaper just around the corner, gone will be the days of perma-root and mobility which needs brains.

Brujeria.7536:

The thing is if the trait would reliably heal me whenever i get a condition and when one of my condition gets removed i get an incredible synergy here, i get healed trough the condis my corruptions apply to my enemies, the condis they apply to myself, then i could transfer the condis of myself to get the heal when one of your condis get removed of a target, and then i get some healing again if i did transfer the condis to my enemy.

I think it could also be really interesting if the trait siphoned life from people who apply condis to you and maybe you siphon life from people who cleanse your condis or you siphon life from people you apply condis to. Or if instead the 10% healing is 10% life siphoning…

Brujeria.7536:

They could even split it up like one part of the trait gives lifeforce instead of health to fix the lifeforce problems as condimancer without forcing you into SR.

I think that could be awesome. “Get lifeforce each time you apply a condition to an enemy.” Of course it could have an internal cooldown, but the synergy with something like Locust Swarm, or Plague, or CPC, or wells would be pretty amazing. I think the trait has a lot of potential and a lot of ways they could go with it cuz the way it is now.. it’s good.. but there’s obvious loop hols in it.

nearlight.3064:

Oh I wurm first, then Life Transfer. DS cooldowns and no utilities in shroud would prevent the method you described.

Ah… yeah.. forgot about that.

The other option is to increase its range a bunch, effectively giving necros an auto disengage like portal, but single person.

I think increased range is pretty reasonable. Mesmers got their Blink as a 1200 range now as baseline (before it was 900) so increasing Wurm range to something like 1500 would be pretty nice. It would make teleports more reliable as well (sometimes when you put it on a ledge and you’re outside of the 1200 range and you tele, your character teleports to the base of the ledge instead of on top of the ledge because you were too far). Mesmers get their whole class buffed and their Blink as well.. and with Revenant around the corner…

@Jelzouki maybe it wasn’t you, but I saw a warrior named Jelzouki several times and I checked the username and it was also Jelzouki. Coulda been someone with a similar username.

@gin maybe xD would need to see your character ;D

nearlight.3064:

Wurm lets you disengage from a 1v2 situation more reliably than with anything else. You can also do pure wonders with it and Transfusion, which can sometimes make people accuse you of hacking.

Do you start Life Transfer and then quickly wurm away and the guy goes still teleports to you? If that works… that’s genius.
So that could work with SWalk + Wurm… to tele your downed friend over 2000 units xD
(if the stars aligned :P )

Jelzouki.4128:

MethaneGas.8357:

Jelzouki.4128:

nearlight.3064:

Flesh wurm is perfectly viable, you just have to use your brain and know a good spot to set it up before a fight.

If you have a free spot on a build and the point of your build isn’t to stall and die on a point with Unholy Sanctuary to keep it from being decapped, then wurm should always be considered.

Please don’t be condescending i.e telling others to “use their brain”

Back to the topic, wurm is never considered in any of my builds because of how unreliable it is. Maybe if I’m on battle of khylo thats about it. I would much rather have spectral armor, walk, well of power or plague signet to keep me alive in order to win the fight and support my team better. The only reason it is not considered is because it can be destroyed and its as simple as that.

Up until the big patch, wurm was actually the meta for condi Necro in sPvP. BUT… to date, I have fought maybe 5 Necros who actually used the Wurm well… and by that I mean I was left there thinking “Woah… where’d the Necro go” and then I realized they wurmed away. In other words, most people don’t know how to use it. A lot of my friends who want to try Necro don’t want to take wurm because they aren’t comfortable with having to pre-cast it – which is what you have to do… pre-cast.

I play sPvP at generally high MMR and have almost no trouble with using Wurm. This might be different in team vs. team environments (I don’t know, I don’t do those, but I think if you placed it far away it’d be fine. The enemy team probably isn’t going to walk a 2000 range just to kill your wurm when there’s a teamfight going on). So in other words, Wurm is viable. Wurm and SWalk are still viable, and condi Necro is realllyyy strong but with all the free condi clears running around it can be irritating to play because your whole burst is just washed away with a push of a button or a random trait proc (-cough – ele -cough-). That was a tangent tho..

With that being said, I wouldn’t mind wurm being changed to something like a Spectral skill which functions like Chronomancer’s F5, where you’d place a glowing green portal, and then the next time you push it you just teleport in its direction.. and it can’t be destroyed.

But I personally think the skills’ fine as is. It also has a 32 sec recharge now, down from 40. Just sayin’

The argument that only 5 necromancers use wurm correctly displays that it is good is a very weak one at that. I also play at a high MMR rank, I’ve got over 5k games under my belt and 3k being on necro. I live and breathe necromancer, and cannot find any situation to use it effectively.

I almost always see you on Warrior though..

And by “I only saw 5 Necros use it” means most Necro’s DON’T know how to use it effectively. When a Necro uses it well, it will leave you confused for a sec and they’ll probably port somewhere out of lie of sight. I’ve seen very few Necros use it to that effect. Most Necros either put the wurm too close to the fight or in a highly visible spot. Or they wait too long before porting.

I dunno, maybe it’s a weird skill to use for most people. I’m not opposed to any improvements (and it COULD use some – like the blast occurring where you use it, not where you port to, or maybe a 3/4 cast time as Bhawd said), but personally, I think it’s ok.

Jelzouki.4128:

nearlight.3064:

Flesh wurm is perfectly viable, you just have to use your brain and know a good spot to set it up before a fight.

If you have a free spot on a build and the point of your build isn’t to stall and die on a point with Unholy Sanctuary to keep it from being decapped, then wurm should always be considered.

Please don’t be condescending i.e telling others to “use their brain”

Back to the topic, wurm is never considered in any of my builds because of how unreliable it is. Maybe if I’m on battle of khylo thats about it. I would much rather have spectral armor, walk, well of power or plague signet to keep me alive in order to win the fight and support my team better. The only reason it is not considered is because it can be destroyed and its as simple as that.

Up until the big patch, wurm was actually the meta for condi Necro in sPvP. BUT… to date, I have fought maybe 5 Necros who actually used the Wurm well… and by that I mean I was left there thinking “Woah… where’d the Necro go” and then I realized they wurmed away. In other words, most people don’t know how to use it. A lot of my friends who want to try Necro don’t want to take wurm because they aren’t comfortable with having to pre-cast it – which is what you have to do… pre-cast.

I play sPvP at generally high MMR and have almost no trouble with using Wurm. This might be different in team vs. team environments (I don’t know, I don’t do those, but I think if you placed it far away it’d be fine. The enemy team probably isn’t going to walk a 2000 range just to kill your wurm when there’s a teamfight going on). So in other words, Wurm is viable. Wurm and SWalk are still viable, and condi Necro is realllyyy strong but with all the free condi clears running around it can be irritating to play because your whole burst is just washed away with a push of a button or a random trait proc (-cough – ele -cough-). That was a tangent tho..

With that being said, I wouldn’t mind wurm being changed to something like a Spectral skill which functions like Chronomancer’s F5, where you’d place a glowing green portal, and then the next time you push it you just teleport in its direction.. and it can’t be destroyed.

But I personally think the skills’ fine as is. It also has a 32 sec recharge now, down from 40. Just sayin’

Agreed with making it work in DS. I think the trait is decent in WvW when you don’t have a support with you… but it would be much, much better if it worked in DS imo because a Necro keeps going in and out of DS cuz… that’s just how the class works. If you’re in DS 40% of the time… the trait is 40% weaker because the condis still tick but you literally get nothing out of them.
So if you look at it like that, it’s not even “10%” healing.. more like 6%.

I often drop a condi bomb on a group in WvW and then pop DS with Locust Swarm to ride out the storm and it would be pretty nice to get heals from all the condis while in DS.

As for sPvP… I think Weakening Shroud is king :P weakness is another form of defense.
Even if Parasitic Contagion worked in DS, I doubt it would be better than Weakening Shroud there. With all the insane condi clears going all over the place, you need all the condis you can get. At least that’s my opinion

I do like the idea of it being a punishment for condi clears. That function on top of the 10% heals could work well.. but I think others already said that the 1st issue is it not working in DS.

In my experience, most people who complain about condis are inexperienced.

As a condi player, fighting the following classes can be a complete pain in the kitten because of such high spammable condi removal that playing condi can be really irritating at times:
-Fire-specced ele – a disgusting amount of cleanses. Good luck making your condis stick.
-Mantra Mesmer – crazy amount of cleanses – good luck with making your condis stick.
-Shout Warrior – AoE cleanse.
-Shout Guardian – AoE cleanse
-Shadow Arts thief – go into stealth and all of the sudden all your damaging condis fall right off
-Signet Necros transfer it all back to you

People hate condis because they slowly kill you… but I’m sorry, if you’re not bringing any condi cleanse on your team, that’s just the way it’s going to be. Imo unless you’re a condi Mesmer and maybe burn guard, playing condi in sPvP is not faceroll at all. In WvW it may be, but in sPvP it’s not, especially at “higher tier” fights.

@meow one twenty I’ve seen a lot of Necros in ranked sPvP use Lich… Not saying if the skill is good or bad (I dislike it… and I think it should also be able to stomp like Rampage can) but people still use it.

Spectral Mastery can be very good, but imo you need two spectral skills to make it worth it. If I take Spectral Wall and Spectral Walk, and Spectral Attunement, I’d say I have a lot more survivalbility than if I took Corrupt Boon, Spectral Walk and Vital Persistence … but you’d have less damage with the former.

Too bad there aren’t really any offensive spectrals (besides lich)… but maybe that will change with Reaper. Fear —> chill —> damage. Spectral Wall will do fear+chill —> damage.

So basically…

Now if we use Path of Corruption… we can easiillyyy target someone and every 5 secs corrupt 2 boons off of them? Oh my…
No Terror, you say? Well… “Deathly Chill: Doubled damage values.” Say harro to the new terror :p Fear inflicts chill, after all

Very excited for the changes

The changes to staff were brilliant… also… the evadessssssssssssssssssssss <333333

Can we haz play Revenant nao?

Was it “invulnerable” or “immune”?

If it was immune, it could be a certain trait they have. I think it transfers a CC onto their pet so your fear may have been transferred onto the pet.

Critiques:
-Lack of condi weapons – The lack of condi weapons forces you to be a hybrid, in a way. No other weapons besides mace and axe have damaging conditions on them, so you basically have to go hybrid (which includes carrion) to be able to deal at least SOME damage with your other weaponset (staff/hammer/swords – which are power). I think damaging conditions could easily be added into the other weapon sets (perhaps to staff #2? and/or staff #4?). However, I found that the power damage was decent with carrion and the conditions while using staff were sort of O.K. if you used Mallyx… but staff was still used almost (almost) exclusively for defense.

Lack of Swiftness
I noticed that Revenant had almost no access to swiftness so I had to use Traveler Runes. I think if Revenant is to be able to use other runes… it NEEDS to have swiftness from somewhere. Be it swiftness from traits, passive in-combat 25% movement speed from traits, or swiftness from certain skills or utilities. Either way, it needs it. Having to use Traveler Runs makes 95% of the other Runes inaccessible, imo.

Lack of stun breaks
I realize that using Invocation gives you access to 2 stun breaks (your legend swap) but come on.. you swap legends because you want the utilities, not because you want to have a stun break. It’s very cool (like Necro’s Foot in the Grave trait) but it’s not REALLY a stun break when you can’t use it whenever you want to (like normal stun breaks). The only stun breaks I had were legend swaps and Shiro’s Riposting Shadows. I also had stability on dodge. If I’m being completely honest, I sometimes felt like a ping-pong ball, and I think it was probably a l2p issue, but there does seem to be a lack of stun breaks. I’m not sure how this could be addressed though, because if every Legend had a stun break, then a Revenant would have the capability to have way too much resistance to CC (stability on dodge, stun break on legend swap, + a stun break from an utility on each legend. That would be 4 stun breaks + stability on dodge).

This is just the feedback on what I’ve tried (sPvP with celestial/carrion mace/axe + staff Revenant with Mallyx/Shiro). I had several people troll/bash me for “playing a trash class” but it felt far from trash. I had a complete blast playing it, and although there was MUCH to learn, it felt decently competitive even in ranked sPvP.

Weapon Skills:
Staff:
-Staff felt quite strong on celestial amulet, as well as carrion. It was mostly used as a defensive weapon with the #3 block and could be used to protect allies/deal damage with #5.
-Skill #2 (Punishing Sweep) felt useless to me. It had too long of a cast time if you do the whole chain for just a bit of weakness. I may be wrong, but on carrion/celestial amulets I did not even use this skill at all.
-Skill #3 (Warding Rift) was really good. The block is amazing, and so are the blinds. This skill does need a whirl finished, imo. If this was a small whirl, you could combo it with some other fields that the revenant can create (fire field from mace, dark field from Mallyx, air field from Jalis).
-Skill #4 (Renewing Wave) was quite nice as a heal. It has a long cast time and feels slightly clunky but it’s still quite nice. It is very powerful when used with Shiro’s quickness (Impossible Odds).
-Skill #5 ( Surge of the Mists) was really strong. Not only does it leap you forward but the CC is very good. The damage is also good. This skill also needs a leap finisher or a whirl finisher. Revenant has some nice fields that it could utilize. For example if staff #3 was a whirl, you could use Mace #2, then swap to staff to shoot out fire bolts, then use staff #5 and leap through it for a fire aura —> more condis for a condi build.

Mace and Axe
-I really like the fast attack speed on the auto attack. The auto attack feels satisfying and strong.
-Skill #2 (Searing Fissure) is a really nice fire field and if people stand on it (you can make them stand on it if you use axe #5 to pull them, then #2 to rain fire on them. They’ll be CCed and will take most/full burns from #2. ) If people are mobile, though, it can be hard to lock them down with this skill. Perhaps it would be stronger if it applied something like 2 stacks of burning on initial hit, and then 1 stack per pulse?
-Skill #3 (Echoing Eruption) was very cool looking and really powerful imo. The addition of torment was brilliant. Also great to combo with axe #5. Also great to combo with #2 for might stacks. If you do axe #5 to pull everyone in, then #2 for burns as described above, then #3 for additional torment and might, the damage is real.
-Axe #4 (Frigid Blitz) - REALLY cool and fun skill. Allows you to stick to a target and just be super annoying and hard to escape. Definitively very fun to use and very useful.
- Axe #5 Temporal Rift - VERY cool/good skill, can be used defensively (to disrupt people who chase you, or disrupt enemy stomps). It can also be used to combo with many skills as described above. It can also be used to set up a nice combo with staff #5. Pull everyone in, then spin to win with staff #5 for some nice damage and extra CC. Also… torment <3

Overall, I felt condition Revenant damage was very nice in sPvP. It felt very strong in its ability (Mallyx+Shiro) to chase thieves and others across the map. It was extremely fun… but there are also some critiques.

Just want to say I’ve spent most of Sunday playing Revenant in sPvP and it was a complete blast. I don’t think I want to play GW anymore because Revenant isn’t there haha. I can’t remember the last time I’ve had that much fun on a profession.. maybe cuz it’s new, but it felt really good.

It’s a little weird to get used to it because it basically has two weapon swaps (legend + normal weapon) and you only get energy back when you swap legends, not weapons.. which makes things tricky (e.g. you wanna swap to staff to block but have no energy). I ran mace/axe + staff and ran celestial at first. It was quite effective, but after swapping to Carrion I don’t think I’ll ever look back xD Carrion mace/axe + staff felt really competitive even in higher ranked sPvP. It is definitively a high skill cap class and one that will for sure be my main. I felt bad for thinking this because I main a Necro, but I couldn’t help but to say to myself “this is what I wanted Necro to be like.”

On Legends:
Shiro felt really good. I usually dislike assasin/thief – type classes but Shiro was a complete blast.
-The heal skill was a little odd at first because it’s not really a burst heal but requires you to hit your target and also has an internal cooldown. I do actually like its design, as it can also be used to deal really nice dmg.
-Riposting Shadows is also a nice skill, ofc… especially since it’s a stun break.
-My favorite is Phase Traversal. This skill gives the unblockable buff which imo (I may be wrong) isn’t a huge huge deal, but the teleport is just amazing and I think that was one of the most fun parts of playing reve (teleporting after thieves etc. and being un-escapable). I really, really liked this skill. Cool sound effects, cool visual effects. Awesome
-Impossible Odds was also really, really fun. It could be used to travel quickly through the map or finish someone, or res, or even use quickness + staff #4 for some quick heals. This was another of of my favorites (I know, I have many). The quickness was really good for escaping, since Revenant doesn’t really have any good leaps to run away. I really liked the fact that if you upkeep this skill for a while and then swap over to another legend for 50 energy, the quickness will spill over for a split second, allowing you to execute your next skill 50% faster, which is VERY cool if you swap over to a legend with a long cast-time elite skill, and then use that elite skill very quickly cuz of the quickness.
-The elite is also very strong, but expensive to use. Personally, I don’t have much to say here.

I liked Mallyx a lot as well, especially the healing skill and all the resistance boon associated with this legend. Mallyx had very cool voice acting and effects.
-The favourite thing about Mallyx (imo) was the elite skill. That thing just wrecks other condi users and is amazing in team fights. It’s very powerful and also expensive to use because it literally drains you from your energy but it feels like a freight train.
-Pain Absorption is a really good skill. It’s a little expensive to use and I found myself not utilizing it (probably a l2p issue). The general theme with Mallyx was that if you swap into it, you really don’t get to spam many of your utilities because as soon as you use one of the utilities, you don’t really have too much room to use anything else, unless you wait. Anyway, this skill is strong, but I find that its strength lies in giving you resistance and preparing you to use your other utilities (drawing condis makes other utility skill and elite skill stronger, and even heal skill). However, as mentioned before, everything is so expensive that you don’t really get to do this as much as you’d want (probably my l2p issue, but it may not be). Perhaps a longer cooldown but smaller energy cost?
- Banish Enchantment - very good skill, especially against boon heavy classes. I feel like most people in sPvP aren’t really used to confusion because it usually comes in such short supply. If this skill is used well, you can easily stack 8 – 12 confusion on someone, which can shut them down (GW1’s Spiteful Spirit anyone?). This skill has low cost and overall, no complaints.
-Unyielding Anguish - I love this skill for its defensiveness. If you’re chased by a thief or something else that’s melee and annoying, this can effectively shut them down. I wouldn’t really call this that OP because other classes have similar skills (guardian rings), un-passable walls, etc. The only weird thing about it the randomness of where the enemy is teleported. The area might be a bit too large as well, or duration. I found the skill fine, and it does deserve a high cost because it is quite strong (<3 the torment).

Fine changes.
Chilling Darkness isn’t as good as before but if you used plague and maximized your chill duration with no icd… you could cap the chill duration on someone 100x over. With this change you’ll still be able to chill nicely in AoE with Plague.
Not as good as before.. but not completely terrible either, imo.

and Necros kick butt in sPvP. The only issue I’ve come across are mantra cleanse mesmers (but then found out the mantras had no cooldown so they could have perma cleanse with insane burst too) and Fire-specced eles. All other stuff (warriors, engis, rangers, guardians) dont have an easy time vs. A Necro.

The change you propose seems interesting, although with added Retal it’d be stronger because with Rabid I still get about 180 retal ticks or so… so that + confusion would be very nice.

This trait as is actually works wonderfully with a condi build. If you’re not in the signet craze, the trait is aweeeesome for a condi build. When you enter DS and have weakening shroud too, thats instant 4 condis on our enemy, which is crazy. I personally think that in many cases a bunch of cover condis beats a single damaging condi. I’m not sure why no one else sees the potential in this trait.

…although I’m all for interesting changes/buffs

Ah I see… so base toughness is like 1000 or something… and with plague it brings it to 4000. So no matter how much extra toughness from armor and runes, it will still go up by 3000 only.
Either way though… Runes of Undead and food don’t scale with the toughness gained. :/
And even the vitality. The food doesnt work with vitality gained and I’m assuming Scavanger Runes and other runes that scale off of vit probably don’t work. I wonder if that new death magic trait works (% toughness into power).

I will test those when I get home. If none of them work… that would be very not-nice.

The first screen shot show the amount of toughness I had without Plague: 2091
The second screenshot shows how much how much I had after Plague: 5391
Which is a 3300 gain in toughness, apparently.

Going off of those alone, the condi damage increase should be 429.

Without Corrupter’s Fervor, I have 2090 toughness. With Corrupter’s Fervor I have 2390 toughness.
When Plaguing without Fervor I have 5090 toughness. When Plaguing with Fervor I have 5391 toughness. That’s still only a 3300 gain in toughness, which doesn’t make sense.
-If Plague takes what toughness you have now, then quadruples it, the 300 toughness gain from Corrupter’s Fervor should end up being a 1200 gain in toughness, not just a flat “300”. If scaled with Plague, you’d gain an extra 117 condition damage.

If we factor in vitality as well: 1592 in first pic and 3592 in the second.

Increase of 2000 vitality, which is 80 condi damage.

So the net gain in condition damage should be 509, which is still really high. If Plague scaled properly with Corrupter’s Fervor, the gain would be an additional 117 condition damage, which should be 626 condition damage increase in total.

Conditions would deal 18% more damage if you were Plague.
If it scaled with Corrupter’s Fervor, it would be about 22% increase in DPS.

It may not be as strong as Lich-wells or meteor shower-Tornado, but it would still be really strong. You can easily maintain about 4 torment stacks, 3-6 poison stacks and 10 bleed stacks so the damage would be pretty nice.

But nope… no scaling.

Ah, that kinda sucks… the bubble has burst.
Ah well, ty for the answer

Hello all,

I don’t know if this is a bug or not, or if it’s intended…
So you know how Undead Runes give you 7% more damage scaling off of your toughness? And you also have tuning crystals which give you condi dmg as a % of your toughness and vit?
Plague also quadruples your toughness. So a nice idea would be to use something like Corrupter’s Fervor (gives 300 toughness) with Undead Runes and Tuning Crystals, then use Plague. Your toughness would skyrocket (as would your vitality) because of Plague, and since you have things which give you condi damage scaling from your toughness… your condi damage could go through the roof. So the idea would be, if you are able to unload a bunch of condis, then pop Plague and all those condis scale from your new (high-as-hell) condi damage, you’d pack a hell of a punch and would sort of be like the old drop-wells-use-Lich or meteorshower-tornado combo…

But alas… the toughness gain from Plague does not scale with Undead Runes or Tuning Crystals… which doesn’t make sense. I just checked this in WvW and my bleeds didn’t get any higher, and my condi dmg didn’t get any higher while I had over 5k toughness (while in Plague).
Is this intended or is it a bug?

I almost never see anyone defending anything o.o ….
95% is doom and gloom and “we aren’t good at x y z.”

By top tier do people mean the 1% of people who do tourneys or the much larger chunk of players who just have a high MMR?

And thieves have become more glassy. Shadow Arts and Acrobatics (which used to be the traitlines that made you survivable) aren’t what they used to be, so they don’t give you as much survivalbility as they once did. Combine that with the overall increase in damage from all sources out there (everyone got buffed) and you got a squishier thief.
Seems almost like Mesmers took a thief’s place.

People complain cuz they can’t adapt.
Just need few more good recording clips and we’ll see if “omg condi Necro is dead” holds true

P.s. Necros are super popular in sPvP atm and I’ll admit some of the tank builds are cray-zee..

He’s talking about it working with Plague which can bring your armor up to 6k+.
Or at least that’s how high I got it to go with Rabid…

It’s a very good trait, but I don’t know how it’d be in sPvP… for a condi build anyway, unless you’re going bunker.
…in WvW it’s sexy tho.

Condi Necro seems to be very strong right now. I only had a chance to play about 100 sPvP matches since the patch and so far, I dont think I’ve had one game where it felt useless.

Plague stomping is a little trick but it isn’t like Rampage where you can stomp whenever you wish.
DS always interrupted stomps and resses if you entered it while channeling the stomp/res. You were able to do a trick where you start a res/stomp as you enter DS and it would allow you to finish your action but now we can res/stomp while in DS, so the trick isn’t needed.
The thing that sucks is not bring able to continue your action when you start it while in normal form, and THEN enter DS and stability doesn’t last long enough so…
I usually try to start a stomp, then when I see the enemy do the push back or knock down from downstate, I quickly enter DS and start channeling again and finish em. It’s annoying, but it works… and it annoys your enemy.. which is always nice

Also: to my knowledge mist form cant interact with thing when you are already mist.

Eh… the nerf about chills / cripples not slowing down movement skills wasn’t the best but keep in mind people used to be able to travel 33% farther when they had swiftness (or 50% farther with super speed)… so it was a nerf from both sides.

Chilling Darkness was probably nerfed because of Reaper. If you had something like Parasitic Contagion and your Plague hit 5 people… you would be unstoppable. You’d get so much HP it would be insane (or even Bitter Chill + Chilling Darkness + Deathly Chill). On the other hand, with the movement skill change, people could easily just leap away or teleport away from the Plague even if it could perma-chill so there’s that too.

Plague is far from a useless elite and it’s very nice that it got only 1 bleed now as opposed to a poop-ton. If you use Plague Sending it’s very likely that the bleed will be transferred and plague will be as it once was.

I agree that a 5-sec internal cooldown is a bit much, but if you used Grenth Runes you could still bring the chill pretty high but it wouldn’t be AoE anymore… and it basically loses almost all synergy with Plague which kinda sucks. I thought all the signet Necros used Plague Sending anyway..

I use this trait and combined with Bitter Chill and Weakening Shroud you have insane cover-condis. Enter DS and you cause bleeds, cripple, 1 boon convert (which is a free condi for you) and weakness. If you use Dark Path, that’s an added chill and vuln…. which is a total of 6 different conditions. I think the trait is pretty amazing, personally

Edit: still have to do more testing with Path of Corruption instead of Terror… but that would be 2 more boon conversions… add in Chill of Death… mmm mm mmmm.

I never agreed with people saying Necros are bad or sub-par. The one thing which made Necro a little different in the past was that you had to use much more of your brainpower and energy to hit that “effectiveness spot” whereas you could roll Mesmer or Ele and use half your brain and still perform well. This doesn’t mean the class wasn’t good overall, imo. It was good, but it wasn’t that easy and you couldn’t relax too much while playing it (competitively – one mistake dead). I also realized this after this patch. It used to sometimes feel like you gave so much energy in an sPvP match and no matter what you did, it just didn’t hold up in certain matches…. whereas now…. finally… it feels like I can use half a brain and steamroll through matches like with other classes.

Why I play Necro? A debuff class is 10000000x better than a simple DPS class
….and….. cuz GW1..

This is true:
https://youtu.be/QxQnFYBFuTw

Hello Dear Necros,

I’m not sure if anyone else posted this but I haven’t heard anyone talking about it…
Corrupt Boon (haven’t tested other boon conversions) does not convert Stability into a Fear. It happened many times on Guardians, Warriors, Mesmers, Necros…
Here is a clip:

https://youtu.be/QxQnFYBFuTw

Enjoy

Still using Consume Conditions..
If I’m being honest…. I felt no impact from Consume Conditions nerf…
I only played WvW once with Necro thus far but it felt the best the Necro has felt in a long, long time (back when Spectrals had no internal cooldown)… but I still didn’t test it there for long enough.
But in sPvP… I just did about 20 sPvP matches… and I dunno if my MMR dropped down to the gutter or more people are trying out sPvP… but Necro felt the best it has felt in so….. long. Didn’t feel the increased cooldown from Consume Conditions at all and people literally melted to condis with easy 140 bleed ticks per second which is crazy… cuz bleeds used to tick that high only in WvW.

Kinda funny how people say “they only balance for sPvP” and yet the only place where you could (potentially) make Plague manageable is WvW (altho I had no time to test anything yet, personally). They MUST have had WvW in mind for the balance for this skill otherwise it makes 0 sense in sPvP… there’s no way you’ll be able to outsustain that in sPvP. And why does it pulse bleeds? Sure…. Plague is a pulsing ability but so it Corrosive Poison cloud and IT doesn’t constantly debuff you. Plague should honestly do an x amount of stacks for x number of secs with only one pulse when you first use the skill. That way it’s manageable with generosity sigil or that curses Plague Signet trait.

Sagat.3285:

Bhawb.7408:

I think he’s talking about the inevitable buffs we’ll have to receive after this crapshow.

On a side note Power Necro might be okay.

Band-aids! The warrior treatment! Nah for a second I forgot revenant is a thing.

Lmao yes… how to buff Necro? Create a Revenant.
Just kidding :P I had to.

Bhawb.7408:

I think he’s talking about the inevitable buffs we’ll have to receive after this crapshow.

After reading a bit of the forums the past several days,
I’ll just sit here and embrace the incoming buffs <3

Very interesting stuff is being brought up.

FoeFaller,
Have you used any condi duration in your calculations?
Also, when you dodge in Plague, you would trigger the Mark of Blood from the minor trait… which would give you regen and reduce the damage taken by a bit too.
Annndd… Plague apparently (wiki said so lulz) quadruples your toughness……. so if that’s true…. that would synergize with Corrupter’s Fervor very…very…..nicely… at least from a toughness standpoint.

Annnnddd… Parasitic Contagion works with self applied bleeds? If so, that’s a pleasant surprise

Additional things which could reduce the damage even further : Rune of Sunless or Antitoxin. They both reduce the duration of incoming conditions and if one uses -condi duration runes + Corrupter’s Fervor, the damage would be reduced by quite a bit. I don’t know if I’d use any of those runes though but just an idea

The only thing that slightly bothers me is that many of the traits were meant to give you sustain (and they will, for sure, outside of plague) but when using Plague, all that sustain/healing drops. I can see the reason being that the healing could potentially be monstrous in Plague without the self-inflicted bleed (especially if you consider Reaper and chill doing damage) but then again… since cripples etc. won’t slow down leaps, then leaping out of Plague won’t be an issue, even if Plague chills the enemy… so if the bleeds were put there to counterbalance the sustain we could “potentially” get… it’s a little silly. Nevertheless, I just want Tuesday to come already… need to hands-on test drive these changes :P

Kamara.4187:

LOL I think its the other way around if you got taken down by a ranger.

Who said anywhere that anyone was taken out by a Ranger?
It’s the mere fact that you can do as much burst as any other burst class, but from miles away.
And your statement makes zero sense. Killing things from 1500+ ranger with 1 button isn’t called skill, but when you say something like that Rangers cry and retaliate. Simple as that.
/shrug

After 3-4 busy days of being gone from a computer.. this thread is still going on.
That silly people are still defending Rangers against all reason is baffling.

On a more serious note… defending rangers is fine because it’s not really defending Rangers per se, it’s defending one’s self self esteem. "To think I’m playing something that takes little skill, oh my! It cannot be… it… it cannot be! No. They are wrong. Pushing 1 and sometimes 2 from Jupiter takes skill. It takes aim! (no scope). "
#thread

Well…. kitten … all this time I understood and wrote stuff as if Corrupter’s Fervor reduced incoming damage by 20% and no one told me! :P …
That changes a lot….

Either way I think it’s still a really nice trait… 300 toughness can be pretty significant (especially on top of the 180 toughness while in shroud. That can be +480 more toughness!) and 20% reduced condition damage taken is really nice too.
So basically burning/poison/torment/bleeding/confusion and what not will deal 20% less damage… so if you were taking like.. 3000 condi damage per sec…. you’d only be taking 2400 damage per second so it’s almost like an indirect heal. I think it would be a bit better if it was 20% less physical damage… but 20% condi dmg is nice too, especially since you’ll have the full stacks almost permanently.
Combined with the new Shrouded Removal I think Necros should be pretty good vs. condis, especially if you’re something like a power Necro who traits into Death (no dagger off-hand). Or a Condi Necro with Plague Sending from Curses :o

I’m also a fan of Beyond the Veil.. It’s free protection… and if you’re bursted out of DS, the protection will reduce the incoming damage you’d take… combined with a reduced DS cooldown it could be really nice, if only we didn’t lose Soul Marks to get DS cooldown…

Puck.9612:

But what class isn’t easier in a zerg? Especially when you outnumber the opponents. Heck the majority of guardians are just running around wearing out the 1 button to make sure they hit everything with their loot stick. The average warrior rotation is 1,2,3,4,5. Of course none of that is optimal play in a zerg but neither is being a longbow ranger.

The discrepancy when +1ning someone or a group, is that a Ranger can just spam 1, and occasionally 2 and be just as effective as a meditation guard, glass thief, s/f ele, glass engi (which takes coordination, setup and often close range), and all a Ranger has to do is press a button.

Are you going to argue that it’s harder for a thief to +1 and down someone that is already at 50% health than it is for a ranger?

While a thief has to steal, cloak and dagger, backstab, that will put them in melee range, and often you can see them coming and if you dodge their steal, the whole burst is null and the thief is in Melee range.
Guardian has to use meditations, come into melee range and use several skills and often it’s a well-known rotation (you see the focus shield, be ready to dodge) which can be dodgeable.
Scepter Focus eles have to come fairly close to you and have to use an insane number of skills, etc.
A ranger can achieve the same from 1500+ range and with a button or 2 and can disable a whole survival mechanic 6 seconds (stealth).
Sure, there’s ways to deal with a Ranger, and I personally don’t find Rangers unbearable because I don’t main stealth classes, but I find it a little too rewarding.

This is my last post for tonight… au revoir frans

Puck.9612:

No the entire game promotes bad game play. Nothing you just said is strictly a ranger problem. There are far more bad players in this game than there are good players. For example, look at the people in this very thread complaining about how OP longbow rangers are.

No, but currently in WvW, Ranger is the epitome of it. It’s natural to flock to what’s easy and effective. It’s completely understandable and happened many times before with different classes. You can embrace it all you want, I’ll rather play something skillful and more fun than pressing a button or two once in a while.
But seriously… I’m not saying there aren’t skilled rangers – I’ve seen a few in WvW and lots in sPvP, and they know how to kite, survive, keep a distance, etc., but bad Rangers are being rewarded for doing almost nothing.

Crapgame.6519:

I am honestly going to enjoy your posts post patch and your salty alligator tears raining from the sky like skittles.

First of all…. how did you know I’m an alligator…?
Second of all, enjoy your skittles, you seem to like them (I do too <3 ).

Crapgame.6519:

My only regret is that our servers won’t face one another so you personally won’t feel my rangers arrows. But hey, maybe I’ll transfer for a week and we can dance.

Tango

coglin.1867:

Perhaps your attitude is the problematic one? I mean, when 12 posters out of the millions of players who bought this game (which is precisely how many are complaining here, with multiple, repeated post each) assume anyone who can handle what they are incapable of handling, think too highly of themselves, well it says a lot to me, about the few complainers.

Oh bother.
People flock to what’s OP, it’s human nature. When you call it easy to play they get mad because they think you’re saying they’re playing an easy class, which would imply they aren’t skilled… how can someone’s ego ever handle that? Well.. better start arguing.

coglin.1867:

What profession do you play mainly? I run as a large guild and map commander on a T1 server, so I specifically get focus fired by 5 ranger groups. I lead in celestial, ascended gear. So it is not like I am pure tank. I use my shield block and shield reflect, s well kitten calling for reflection walls from my guardians.

Ah.. so as you, and the previous posters have pointed out… we should grab a reflect. Hmm… sounds reasonable. Let me make an anti-ranger build.. then comes along something non-ranger and you get rekt. B-but… reflects!
Sense? None.

Crapgame.6519:

Do you fish by any chance? Since when does 1,500 in game clicks equate to miles? You are seriously telling a tall tale.

“Oh god, that person must be 500 years old!”
Ever heard of exaggeration?

Crapgame.6519:

Create a ranger, enter a custom / private sPvP game with some friends.

I happen to do a bit of sPvP and rangers there are almost, but not quite, obnoxious. Sure, at high end sPvP (which is only a fraction of the sPvP community) it isn’t optimal, but at lower-end and average sPvP, sitting on hills and destroying people is actually quite common – and it works.

1,500 range is nothing to any class that is aware of their surroundings. We have beat that horse to death by dodge, LOS, charge, hide behind friends, etc.

Saying 1500 range is nothing is actually delusional, especially when the range is even higher than that in-game. Especially when the ranger has a wall of friends between you and that lovely little 1500+ range. If you ever played WvW, you’ll see lots of open areas right? Right. So where would you like me to line of sight exactly? Should I summon some kind of wall? Should I only stick to trees and rocks? Should I run to rocks/trees? Ah, ok, I’ll run to them when I see a ranger… oh wait… I got hit by Rapid Fire from Saturn. Maybe I’ll stealth… oh wait… I can’t.

Crapgame.6519:

You just stated that we had miles and miles between us. Care to explain how any of the other stuff comes into play say like entangle?

I’m closing the 1500+ range gap and the pet runs towards the target… the explanation is simple.

Honestly, you don’t have to dodge anything. You do have to decide when to dodge though. Just like I do.

When everything hits for 500k, that’s good advice.

Oh, and you can increase your dodge / endurance but I’m sure you forgot about that…or do those rules only apply to Rangers?

Most things rely on hitting the target to gain endurance. Necros have 0 Vigor, aside from grabbing Energy sigils. So I should run towards the Ranger, dodge all the important stuff (or nothing at all, as per your advice), hit the guy to get vigor, then dodge some more? All the while I’m getting pummeled by the other guys? Sounds reasonable.

Crapgame.6519:

Again, you will not die or get insta-gib’d by a Ranger unless you are asleep at the wheel, afk, or upscaled. Like I said, I don’t get killed by a single rapid fire volley on my Guardian who in DPS/Zerk has a base health pool just a tick over 14k

It’s nice to play that card, but Guardians have armor, protection, and guard stacks will give place your health above 14k. The Rapid Fire will still do around half your health, and likely more, from huge distance, as was mentioned a million times before. When a ranger +1s a fight, the single button, the rapid fire (or hell, the auto attack) will melt you. So no, a single Rapid Fire won’t necessarily bring you completely from 100 – 0, but that’s really irrelevant.

I’m really confused now because you make it sound like I have every skill on my bar. Is this something new and unique to the ranger?

Since when are 2 skills “every skill on my bar”. It’s only 2 standard skills.

Crapgame.6519:

We might even share an adult beverage if you are of age.

No thanks, I’m 12.

Crapgame.6519:

Point is, which many have already said, Rangers have to make choices in order to DPS at max range.

Yes… pressing 1 and sometimes 2 is a very hard choice indeed.

Crapgame.6519:

Sometimes we just get beat by a better player – that doesn’t mean you come to the forums and complain.

Ah… auto attacking from Mars makes people a better player…

TakeCare.3182:

Puck.9612:

I’m confused. You think I’m a zergling because I main a ranger? What the hell sense does that make?

Sorry, bae. You said it yourself.

Puck.9612:

Any pug commander that tries to say any profession is worthless in a pug zerg has no idea what he is talking about… I personally love running ranger in a zerg.

Nice no scope kill, Methane.

Puck.9612:

MethaneGas.8357:

Puck.9612:

I figured out why you’re having problems with rangers, it’s right in your signature.

“Beastly Besties [OHai]
Devona’s Rest”

I figured out why you’d play something so safe/broken and no-skill. It’s right in your signature

“Puck Marshrunner- Ranger (& every other profession)
[LGN]”

Oh I play everything. Never had a problem with longbow rangers on any of my characters. Considering 90% of the roamers on your server are condi thieves and PU mesmers you probably shouldn’t be saying anything about what takes skill.

And yet Ranger is your main. Is playing other professions giving you too much trouble? We’ve moved to NSP a month ago, and since when does one player account for a whole server?
Zerglings don’t have problems with Rangers.

Puck.9612:

I figured out why you’re having problems with rangers, it’s right in your signature.

“Beastly Besties [OHai]
Devona’s Rest”

I figured out why you’d play something so safe/broken and no-skill. It’s right in your signature

“Puck Marshrunner- Ranger (& every other profession)
[LGN]”

Crapgame.6519:

Seriously, stop it already. There is effort. There is risk. I can’t help it if the person I’m using Rapid Fire doesn’t have good situation awareness. If my target had any sense at all they would:

Dodge
LoS
Hide behind a tree (except Dolly Parton)
Hide behind ambient creatures, dead yaks, guards, NPCs, etc
Jump into a lower part of terrain / use height
Charge ranger
Reflect
Retaliation

Effort in pressing a button and watching things die from miles away? Honestly… any other zerk class has to try 10 times harder to deal high damage and they are all 10 times more risky than a ranger.

Ok so you can dodge one auto attack, another auto attack, sure… then comes Rapid Fire… you gotta dodge that, or there comes the knock back, you gotta dodge that too because if you don’t you’ll eat Rapid Fire… then there’s entangle, the pet fear or immob… all the while the auto attacks are wrecking you. So how many dodges are we supposed to have? Especially when you’re already fighting someone else. Last time I checked, I had about 2.

Crapgame.6519:

Lastly, if you leave the ranger alone behind the line you reap what you sow. You have a team and there are members of that team designed to counter that. I’ll put it this way. The problem isn’t the Ranger or the range. It is the design of the game in that everyone looks at the bags of skittles on the ground, aka loot, rather than playing as a team and doing a job.

Ah so while I’m running from a group, kiting I’m just gonna somehow make the newly arrived ranger disappear? Maybe I’ll tell my thief friend to go after him! Oh wait… they’re immune to damage for 5 seconds… oh wait… they’ve got Sic’ Em. Oh wait… they’re 1500 units away from the actual fight… Oh wait… there’s 2 of them, and now you’re Entangled.