Guild Wars 2

Cribbage.2056:

They added sigils to kits and nerfed Grenade damage by 30%. Find me a build where the sigil portion of the damage you are getting from kits is worth 30%.

For obvious reasons, the benchmark impact of sigils can be taken to be a 5% damage increase. That means that the portion of your damage coming from kits has been boosted by 5% (or equivalent cond/utility). How many viable tPvP specs use kits for a large amount of their damage?

Add in the HGH changes and you might want to say “WoW maybe I can play a jug build on my FT now.” To which I say, good luck – you’ll need it.

However, that is a discussion better left to the Engi forum.

Ok, we don’t really need to discuss it further after this , but I would just like to add one example since I don’t think 5% is a fair number to say is added by sigils.

The Sigil of Fire gives a 30% chance on critical to proc an AOE fire blast.

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Sigil_of_Fire

Imagine using this while spamming grenades, now that the poison and blinding grenades deal damage now, they also have a chance to proc this effect, in addition to the fact that you are throwing multiple grenades with each ability it is not unreasonable to say you will activating this sigil every time it is off cooldown (5 seconds). This creates the effect of an additional blast of AOE damage (it hits pretty hard too, I’m not sure of exact numbers with a grenade build, but I don’t play Engineer either).

If they kept the Grenade damage the same combos like this with sigils would be dealing too much AOE damage, and would probably make them OP.

Press CTRL+ALT+DELETE > Go to Task Manager > Click on the Performance Tab > Click on the Resource Manager at the bottom > Click on the Network Tab > Expand the TCP connections > Look for the Gw2.exe process, at the top, so you can filter which ones it shows, and then look under the Latency tab.

This is how you do it on Windows 7.

mickers.2715:

i think he is talking about the buff to pistol/pistol that nobody uses, or the trait that makes people move faster in stealth which again almost noone uses because the other traits are still more useful.

Just put chill on a thief and watch him squirm while you melt his face off.

The stealth trait they “improved” doesn’t even work right, you still move at 33%, not 50%. And I would agree with the pistol traits, they seemed interesting at first, but I would rather stick to playing with P/D and condition damage with venom share.

Cribbage.2056:

Thanks for your answers ppl. I reckon kitteno hit the nail on the head.

PvP balance got a bit worse. That might not sound too bad until you consider the massive lost opportunity. They could have used this patch to improve balance and didn’t.

As an engineer, I am particularly disappointed. They built this patch up like it was going to put us right there in the mainstream. But all they did was buff an ability that doesn’t fit into any realistic builds and nerf one of the WvW mainstays.

Are you kidding me? They added sigils effects to kits, that is a huge improvement when you think of the possibilities it could bring (I’m not an engineer so I’m not sure how the sigils function kits yet but I am very interested).

Aether McLoud.1975:

MindlessRuff.1948:

Aether McLoud.1975:

Dragons Tooth should drop fast enough that you can land it 100% with CC when they don’t use a stunbreaker.

As it is now earthquake is way to slow for it to land, and with updraft they can just spam their dodge button and will dodge before the tooth lands. /sigh

Staff needs way more damage (probably in the form of lower casttimes and faster projectiles) to be a viable 1v1 weapon – which it NEEDS to be because we cannot weaponswap like necros can.

My DTs land after Updraft 100% as long as I do not mess up the execution, even if they dodge right when it hits (even tested a number of times with a friend and told him to spam dodge and he still took the damage), so not sure what you are doing wrong.

I’ve never ever been hit by a tooth after an updraft. You can dodge it 100%. Maybe your friend has bad latency.

I am going to test this more tonight against some random people in pubs, I’ll come back with results when I get around to it. I do admit I rarely get hit with Dragons Tooth, but that is mainly since good S/D Eles are so damn rare and all the bad ones either are too slow at the combo or don’t even know how to do it consistently.

I found an extremely good way to counter the dead time actually, throw out a Shatterstone when you are ready to switch attunements and immediately switch to Air and cast your instant Lightning Strike and Blind. I also usually use at least 15 points in Air so that is 2 Lightning Strikes in a row.

I have found that duels don’t really mean much at all. If I go into a 1v1 with a more support/team oriented build with less damage utilities or traits, the fights become much harder. However if you switch up your traits to work against the opponent you face, suddenly things become like night and day.

One solution I found to make the game more enjoyable, is to find 1 buddy to follow around in tPvP queues or hotjoins and make a build which synergizes well with them and constantly top the charts (not like glory points matter) while having a blast at the same time.

Glass Cannon Power Engineers always terrify me if they are played well, it is nothing like thief burst, you would be fighting them thinking things are going well, then all of a sudden wonder where all your health went.

They can fill a wide variety of roles so don’t give up, my team has an engineer as a home point holder and he does quite well holding out until support arrives.

Aether McLoud.1975:

Dragons Tooth should drop fast enough that you can land it 100% with CC when they don’t use a stunbreaker.

As it is now earthquake is way to slow for it to land, and with updraft they can just spam their dodge button and will dodge before the tooth lands. /sigh

Staff needs way more damage (probably in the form of lower casttimes and faster projectiles) to be a viable 1v1 weapon – which it NEEDS to be because we cannot weaponswap like necros can.

My DTs land after Updraft 100% as long as I do not mess up the execution, even if they dodge right when it hits (even tested a number of times with a friend and told him to spam dodge and he still took the damage), so not sure what you are doing wrong.

Thieves aren’ t OP though, not sure what they added in the recent patch which made them stronger though, care to share?

Thrashbarg.9820:

Combined with lightning flash I often don’t end churn inside ring of fire (I’m mostly a WvW player, discount anything I say as far as PvE goes, mobs just stand in fire so of course you can just finish churn inside ring).

Also, good players know what churn looks like, and will usually avoid it anyway, so cancelling halfway in and hitting mag grasp-ring of earth-whatever can be a good way to land some damage instead of none, using the element of surprise. Adding 3 stacks of might to something that will hit would be better in some cases than firing off an aoe you know will be dodged or blocked (making you wait the full cooldown anyway, which reminds me, why do warriors get to keep full adrenaline and have a reduced CD on burst when blocked or missed and we have full cooldowns on all skills in the same situation?…..).

Back on topic…. EA blast on earth is still the best element to have as a blast if we only get one.

It still gives might as long as you START the channel in the ring of fire, I am 95% sure on this.

official.4658:

I know alot of the times even at night we look at the 1/8 and we dont que paids because of it. So i would think other teams do the same thing. so why not remove that from the equation and just have more ppl sitting in queues rather than not. I dont think tickets are the problem its just getting a pop. Even though i agree with you that tickets are a little much but still thats not the underlying problem its that people arent queuing when they do have the tickets for it.

I’m pretty sure the 1/8 only means the number of teams queued on YOUR server (Correct me if I am wrong), since I have gotten queue pops when it is much lower than 7/8.

Why wouldn’t you finish casting Churning Earth? It is quite a devastating AOE spell. Surely you wouldn’t waste the cool down on it for 3 stacks of might.

Zenyoga.6910:

Shukran.4851:

1 ok
2 please no
3 ok

With 2. why not? Are you afraid that this will create only straight out zerging? Because I don’t think that will be an issue, since having a point and its reward will still be equally usefull, just not that much more usefull where in the current system you have non-fighting tactics and player deaths to hold one in favor of winning battles or ninjaing another (favoring very mobile builds thus limiting other class build choices in Tpvp).

It would favor spawn camping heavily, much more so than it does now.

Digital Dragon.2697:

On utilities that say “gain x upon healing” does it only work when you cast the heal, or would it work on signet of malice, every time you’re healed? Thanks.

Only when you activate the skill.

naphack.9346:

Thrashbarg.9820:

@ above post:

It actually works quite well with earth attunement (offhand dagger). Swapping into earth and dodging into a field followed by earthquake>churn is 3 blast finishers in about 2-3 seconds. Other than a full banner warrior I don’t know any class that can blast that fast (thieves can more consistently, but not as rapidly) and even that warrior would have to blow all his utilities. If the blast came in any other attunement you’d have to swap into earth after dodging anyway to hit the other 2 blast finishers. Churning Earth blast triggers at the beginning of the animation along with the cripple effect, so it’s easy to get 3 blasts inside one field.

It was crazy powerful when every single roll was a blast finisher, but man I had a blast while it lasted.

and where does the quickness to pull off evade -> quake -> churn in 2 seconds come from?

It is actually quite possible to do this combo:
Dragons Tooth > Ring of Fire > Phoenix > Roll(While switching to earth) > Earthquake > Churning Earth

This gives 15 stacks of AOE might, and they will still be there for 10 seconds or so when you go back to fire, so it is possible to have 25 stacks, you can also make them more reliable with boon duration increase or might duration increase along with a sigil of Superior Battle.

Otaur.9268:

Ranger
Increased the velocity of arrows fired from Short Bow and Longbow skills by 30%.
Ranger melee pets now have improved melee attacks so they can hit moving targets more easily.

Now we would like to see
Ele
Increased the velocity of spells fired from Staff and Scepter skills by 30%.
Spells now have improved speed of attacks so they can hit moving targets more easily.

Just saying.

I do not want this at all, It wouldn’t even benefit half of the scepter spells, since Fire and Air auto attacks are not projectiles, and cannot have their velocity increased.

You could stop fighting if the stats mean that much to you, they aren’ t very important however, and don’ t indicate skill all of the time.

If you dodge at the right time though, you will only get knocked down and will not get pulled to them when they activate it.

thetreebranch.4831:

Yeah. Thiefs have a combo field and a blast finisher on shortbow (which is very spammable). Makes me sad we can’t have a blast on a dodge roll (if its on a 10 second CD, should be fine).

Having one on every attunement was over the top, and it was bugged to cause blasts even when the effect didn’t go off. Now instead of rolling every time you see a field, you have to setup a more intelligent combo to get the full effect, I like it.

hharry.1967:

Wow, thats terrible, seriously 45k? That’s kitten this is worse than ragnarok online korean endless farming. Where did the horizontal leveling go?

It gets better, at rank 49 it goes up to 75k and not sure what it is at 59 since I doubt anyone is even close to that level yet.

Kaede.9314:

Hi, I took a break from thief a while ago, but I’ve been wanting to try it again. Are there any half-decent D/P builds?

Yes, actually just last night I saw a thief going glass cannon, then using Pistol 5 followed by Heartseeker to achieve stealth, and immediately backstab the target. Sure you might need to blow initiative on the normal BS combo, but the blind is pretty good for fighting other thieves, and the headshot is a crucial interrupt that thieves often lack in burst builds.

Kaizer.7135:

Loading.4503:

Kaizer.7135:

Loading.4503:

My 10/30/30/0/0 berserker p/d makes any p/p cry

Berserker p/d? What do you use for damage?

well, if you played p/d before you already know the answer, sneak attack and autos, but when you have berserker gear, and ruby orbs, (I currently only have blues mostly and a couple greens) on other lvl 80s in wvw im auto attacking them for 700-1k and sneak attacks for 2500-3500, I don’t do tpvp, but in spvp hot joins, im usually doing 500-700 and 2-3k sneaks and CnDs are usually 2k.just think about how easy already it is to land a cnd sneak and autoattacking that much from range with all the stealth to help you evade

Ahhh ok, I thought p/d was more effective as a condition damage.

I prefer P/D style AS a condition damage build, since Sneak attack can stack a good number of bleeds alongside the auto attack, add in some Spider Venom, Devourer Venom, and Basilisk Venom combined with the Venomous Aura trait, you become very effective at shutting down a target with your team. (I play in sPvP though, and sometimes forego Devourer Venom for a stunbreak or stealth utility)

You are only level 17 and you think you level up slow? Just wait, each time you get to the next tier it gets even more FUN. (Currently at 45k glory per level at level 42, gone are the days when you could rank up in a day or 2 at the low levels)

The ONLY way to change hotjoins from the state they are currently in, is to remove the hotjoin part. The fact that people are able to jump in and out at will does not encourage playing for the win, rather it encourages trying to get as many points as possible so you can rank up and get more glory points.

If you want to play to win, the way hotjoins form needs to be restructured, or you could go join the free tPvP games available, you get plenty more points for winning those matches, as well as a reward chest if you pass at least 1 round.

Cosmic Teapot.9162:

Teabaker.9524:

Yes it works and it’s also pretty easy to do. 40+seconds of protection and 40+ of regeneration. Woho.

EDIT: How broken is that, seriously.

The fire field + magnetic grasp boon duration is bugged out like crazy now giving 26 base duration protection (instead of 3 seconds) and 45 seconds of swift+fury (instead of 5).

Yes that is quite broken, but it really doesn’t matter since as you said you can maintain permanent protection just like you were able to before the patch which bugged the leap finisher.

tOss.9024:

MindlessRuff.1948:

tOss.9024:

So wait…you’re arguing skill is actually not committing to a particular build and using it to maximum effectiveness, but is actually being able to change to the most optimal build for each situation facing minimum consequences at any given time?

You aren’t changing build mid game, you have never been able to respec in ANY PvP lobby, just swapping utilities which COMPLEMENT your build depending on the situation.

I’m using the word build here as your entire load out. Not only the traits you selected. You were able to change trait slots,(not entirely but what you spent points in) weapons, and utilities.

Yes I knew you could switch traits, I don’t think I did this once during a tPvP game, and that is not really my main concern.

tOss.9024:

So wait…you’re arguing skill is actually not committing to a particular build and using it to maximum effectiveness, but is actually being able to change to the most optimal build for each situation facing minimum consequences at any given time?

You aren’t changing build mid game, you have never been able to respec in ANY PvP lobby, just swapping utilities which COMPLEMENT your build depending on the situation.

Only now every thing will be countered MUCH harder as you cannot adapt to the situation and will lose if you have the wrong build that is weak in 25% of situations. There we go adding luck and taking away skill from tPvP.

The class locking thing I could agree with though.

Quick question to clarify, since I’m downloading the patch right now, are you able to swap armour sets during a tPvP game? They made no mention of this in the patch notes but I would assume it would be like this so you couldn’t abuse the 6 slot perks of rune sets in different ways (I never used this but was just wondering).

aydenunited.5729:

And for the love of god, will all you “pros” stop already with the “takes no skill” comments. It’s a crutch word… skill.

It’s the new gaming culture fad to blame anything that beats you as requiring no skill, to make yourself feel better, and this change is across the board, so it’s balanced… it affects everyone. Skill doesn’t come into play, as the majority of higher level players that didn’t gear swap or utility swap didn’t do it because of lack of skill, they didn’t do it because it was annoying to do. I was doing it on my Guardian forever before I finally said “f this, I’m just making a build that uses staff anyway”.

Blaming this change on casuals is equally ignorant.

It is balanced across the board sure, taking a huge part out of the game that was there since beta away from everyone. Also you say it was annoying to do, how does that even matter? It is a trick to learn to improve your play of course if you aren’ t used to it you won’ t like doing it but you don’ t remove key parts of a game to reduce annoyances.

Infinitus.3712:

MindlessRuff.1948:

aydenunited.5729:

MindlessRuff.1948:

Shukran.4851:

what about “learn to play”?
what about “theorycraft more and test more before starting a tourney”?

how can it be making the game more simple? forcing people to use their brain is so difficult?

Actually it is taking the thinking OUT of the game, I highly enjoy taking the right tools for the situation, why not lock runes, utilities, and trait selection when you load into the map too? Just make a build and be hard countered the whole game while being able to do nothing about it.

I disagree. It forces less thought, more fast clicking, because you can take EVERY tool into the game you need, rather than having to choose.

Exactly, instead of having all your tools available to your class, you are now severely limited, creating less diversity, which is the opposite of what Arena net said they want.

The diversity is there, it’s just that it means that you have to actually think about what you want to bring to the team, which in turn shows skill. Also do you think that the bunker or glass cannon meta as it is at the moment more diverse? I don’t think so if anything this should make people actually think about there build before entering a match.

I for one am please to see this change and it is good to see anet take a set in the right direction. Little by little we may actually see a well rounded game.

I guess they did this to eliminate things such as switching to rez signet while going to save a team mate, but I still don’ t like it, sure you have to think before the game, but i do that ALL the time, this just takes the thinking out during the game, and trying to find the new “OP” build which counters the majority of the builds in the meta. Sure you can say you now have to work better to have a more diverse team comp, but it makes individuals much weaker overall since it much easier to hard counter them.

aydenunited.5729:

MindlessRuff.1948:

aydenunited.5729:

MindlessRuff.1948:

Shukran.4851:

what about “learn to play”?
what about “theorycraft more and test more before starting a tourney”?

how can it be making the game more simple? forcing people to use their brain is so difficult?

Actually it is taking the thinking OUT of the game, I highly enjoy taking the right tools for the situation, why not lock runes, utilities, and trait selection when you load into the map too? Just make a build and be hard countered the whole game while being able to do nothing about it.

I disagree. It forces less thought, more fast clicking, because you can take EVERY tool into the game you need, rather than having to choose.

Exactly, instead of having all your tools available to your class, you are now severely limited, creating less diversity, which is the opposite of what Arena net said they want.

To me, it will create more build diversity, because now you have to decide if you really want that swiftness buff, or more damage, which means you will be running a more specific build for your team. If you’re the bunker guardian, you might have to give up the staff that gets you back to point quicker… if you’re a warrior, you can’t roll burst and then swap to a defensive set to help hold a point. Roles will be more defined, and players will have to learn to play within the confines of those roles and overall, you will see more builds develop and become viable.

On the negative side I do agree at higher level it will make it harder to counter some comps, but they will have to deal with the same issue as you. A good team can still overcome those differences, but the individual player will struggle to significantly more to do it on their own.

The weapon swapping is not the biggest deal since I don’ t need to switch weapons after the first 10 seconds anyway, but changing utilities and traits was the only thing that was giving me drive to try new things. I guess I will learn to get used to it after a while, but this is really the only change that has annoyed me this much.

aydenunited.5729:

MindlessRuff.1948:

Shukran.4851:

what about “learn to play”?
what about “theorycraft more and test more before starting a tourney”?

how can it be making the game more simple? forcing people to use their brain is so difficult?

Actually it is taking the thinking OUT of the game, I highly enjoy taking the right tools for the situation, why not lock runes, utilities, and trait selection when you load into the map too? Just make a build and be hard countered the whole game while being able to do nothing about it.

I disagree. It forces less thought, more fast clicking, because you can take EVERY tool into the game you need, rather than having to choose.

Exactly, instead of having all your tools available to your class, you are now severely limited, creating less diversity, which is the opposite of what Arena net said they want.

Shukran.4851:

what about “learn to play”?
what about “theorycraft more and test more before starting a tourney”?

how can it be making the game more simple? forcing people to use their brain is so difficult?

Actually it is taking the thinking OUT of the game, I highly enjoy taking the right tools for the situation, why not lock runes, utilities, and trait selection when you load into the map too? Just make a build and be hard countered the whole game while being able to do nothing about it.

Arheundel.6451:

Shananigans.8412:

Lost second round of Paid tounrney after i was stuck in staff and couldnt go back to daggers, plz reverse this.

If you go staff..do not enter situations where daggers are preferred and if you can’t use staff as good as daggers…don’t go staff in the first place.

All good eles use staff at the start to provide aoe swiftness to the team, I guess you can’ t support your team anymore for the first minute unless you want to go staff though, oh wait you can still do it with the useless lightning hammer!

I can see it now, no one loads into tpvp maps until the last second and weapons/builds are locked, might as well take out the 3 minute timer before hand, since the majority of the strategy is removed to try and counter play the enemy. The meta will turn into a stale and stagnant mess without any room to change things up and make things interesting.

I can handle nerfs and all that, but making the game simpler instead of more complex and deep is a no go.

Ok so i basically have to play staff ele in tourneys to take advantage of the aoe swiftness buff in the build? How in the world do people think this promotes skilled played and build diversity? If this was intended next they will probably be locking utilities and traits too. GG casuals.

Kazeshini.2306:

okay?well can you link me to the most effective current elementalist build?

Go to the elementalist forums, there are plenty of builds there with tons of information. I will tell you it won’t be as faceroll easy as you think it is, you will get crushed quite a bit as you first start out.

Screw that playstyle, sure I rolled a thief to backstab some people, but quickly moved on to the superior D/D condition build, got bored of that, changed to a venom share P/D build and haven’ t looked back since. It is quite satisfying to watch your foes get eaten away little by little from sneak attacks while you juke around and outplay them.

Yes, it’ s starting again after being perfectly fine for the longest time, expect it to get much worse when the patch comes.

Streaming live NOW: http://www.twitch.tv/ruff48

You won’ t be able to beat a good ele with conditions, they have many condition removals available. If you don’ t have enough burst damage you probably won’ t be able out damage their healing. If you pop thieves guild and lock them down you should stand a better chance of winning.

nerva.7940:

nah, d/d ele is faceroll. you have 50 boons up at all times, you come in, unload, get out, heal up, and repeat. it’s the dumbest spec, only second to d/d thief.

I despise this way of thinking. Just because necros are weak versus burst thieves and eles, does not mean they are OP or deserve to be nerfed just to serve your personal desires to be able to faceroll every class. There is NO one build or class which is effective in 100% or situation.

I have a friend who plays necro extensively and I love his mindset about the game. Sure he gets a little upset when he gets gibbed by backstab while engaged in a fight, or gets hit by 100blades on his blindspot, but he never whines about those builds being OP or his class being UP, since it is just not true.

Whenever I ask him why he doesn’ t complain, he simply states that if one build could beat any other 1v1, then it would need to get nerfed, as it would be too versitile to pass up for other weaker options. The wide variety of counters and builds in this game will continue to increase as the game progresses, and is the best part about it.

I respect that you took the time to do a detailed comparison like this, however I rock S/D in tPvP and love it way more than D/D.

Update: Currently streaming @ http://www.twitch.tv/ruff48

You don’t have to land two ccs to hit dragons tooth? You do know that dragons tooth will hit after updraft if you actually swap quickly enough to fire right? They cannot even dodge roll it, they have to use a stun breaker, I tested this in an empty lobby with a friend a while ago.

MrQuizzles.6823:

BlueprintLFE.2358:

Jasher.6580:

Navzar.2938:

As for the burst damage? Every class can burst, even necros and rangers.

But only Warriors, Elementalists and Thieves can one shot people.

I wouldn’t really even put eles in this category, as its not really feasible for an ele to build that way, in order for an ele to obtain that damage the have to go complete 10-13k health light armor glass and use all of their utilities to obtain that single burst. No condition removal and no defenses or utilities. Not too mention an ele has to pop all his utilities plus swap through a bunch of attunements plus the target has to be burning… A lot of pre reqs for ele burst and firegrab the skill that hits that hard is on 45 second cool down not counting utilities…

Indeed, which is why Churning Earth’s damage needs to be tripled, and the skill needs to apply 25 bleed. It is ostensibly much more difficult to use and hit with than Hundred Blades is. If people think that would be overpowered, then they just need to L2P. Who can’t dodge or interrupt or simply move out of a skill with a 3.25 second activation time? Seriously, every argument people are making for HB not being overpowered in this thread justifies my proposed changes to Churning Earth, so I’m guessing they’d all throw their undying support behind it.

I really hate when people try to compare Apples to Oranges, maybe you don’t realize it but it doesn’t make your argument very strong, even if you are trying to lay on the sarcasm. Hundred blades is not a huge AOE like Churning Earth, warriors don’t have a blink, there are a million reasons why the skills are different between classes you get the picture.

TheGuy.3568:

MindlessRuff.1948:

Seether.7285:

I think an even better question to ask would be, if players were playing a theoretically perfectly balanced, yet complex game, would they recognize that it was balanced or would there be just as many complaints about balance?

While my question is pretty much rhetorical, I would bet that there would still be a forum full of cries about balance, since the average players perspective on balance is based on what they experience which is influenced by their choice of class, their level of play and any biases they may have.

**I am not saying GW2 is a perfectly balanced game or anywhere close to it, but I think that many of the whine posts regarding balance on these forums are completely unjustified.

100% percent agree on this.

While this isn’t necessarily a bad question to ask completely eludes the question I asked so…..

Not really since hes saying that if theoretically the game has 100% perfect balance mechanically, it would not matter because the forum would still be flooded by people who perceived imbalance issues when in reality they have no grounds to complain and are only whining based on subjective feelings of balance instead of worrying about objective and logical “balance”.

XII.9401:

Recently.1043:

Dat pic is so dumb. wvw in a spvp forum, and that was clearly over 1 second since you lived with endure pain.

spvp yo. Bring a shield, swap to it to block the heartseeker spam, then smash him after he burns all his initiative. BS thief is the easiest theif for a warrior to fight. If you think that’s bad, a good condition thief will own you without getting hit once.

1.‘Dat’ pic is not so dumb. Up to activating endure pain it was under one second. Wish I could have activated it sooner but well..after thieves break out of stealth the rest of us can’t see them..true story.

2.The discussion is not about countering this..the discussion is why should a class deal this much damage in under one second out of stealth AND remain stealthed while doing so.

I agree about the condition thief. You can’t kill what you can’t see 50% of the time =).

The spvp amulet is almost equivalent to full exotic armor/weapons and jewlery so this situation is mirrored in spvp.

The only people who think thieves are fine and everyone has to L2P are thieves..I guess Anet disagrees as evident by the backstab and pistol whip nerfs. Let me guess..were you saying ‘Dat’ was balanced before Anet balanced it?

Having someone saying their class is fine when everyone else says it is not fine kinda borders on bias..

I play elementalist. Do I hate thieves? Yes. Do I think they are OP? Absolutely not.