Guild Wars 2

NevirSayDie.6235:

Mrbig.8019:

Other classes simply do not have the required tools to escape from them.

I do it regularly. I’m not claiming that I can get away every single time, but all it really takes is dropping smoke bomb, then landing overcharged shot on the thief, then jumpshotting away from the point. You have swiftness, so the necro will stay on the point and the thief will catch up to you eventually if he decides to chase. By that time you’re full health and can either drag him to a teamfight, or to their close point and neutralize it/stalemate him.

Condition immunity below 25% helps because it will help you avoid a crushing chill/cripple/immobilize right before stealthing out. It won’t really keep you alive in a 2v1.

By doing what you did, you will just have the thief back in less than 1 sec: getting gaps is no use as long as Inf strike is left like this.

That immobilize is long enough to have the necro chain fearing you again, and you as an engi, do not have access to multiple stunbreakers.

25% condi immunity won’t save you since thief deals strong damage, and it’s the reason why thief-necro pair is so deadly ( they complete each other) and the reason why they’re defining the meta ( altough necro is the worse culprit).

The only way to escape would be to go in stealth via smoke bomb but if you can’t even endure a 2vs1 as a bunker we have a problem.

Yolo is top 100 in both solo and team queue, he’s not a newbie: the point is that in this meta, counterplay is not really possible.

NevirSayDie.6235:

yolosmurf.8052:

@ Nevir say die – i actually play full bunkerengi on 2 other accounts but a strong necro + thief combo takes me out in a few seconds even when my cooldowns are ready

Ah, I thought we were talking about a build that could easily deal with each of them individually. It’s true, any bunker will go down in a 2v1 to two massive dps builds (condi & dd) like necro and thief. Make sure you’re playing rifle not pistol/shield (p/s is a good bunker build but you can’t block marks, necros will flip your conditions, you need the short cooldown cc of rifle). Supply drop is good for extending 2v1 vs. a necro and thief combo.

You’ll want elixir gun for the cleanse/heal/stunbreak/escape/weakness and maybe bombs, toolkit, or elixir c, depending on what gives you the most trouble. Make sure you’re using sigil of energy or perma vigor traits because you’ll need to spam dodges while the necro is using marks. Condi immunity below 25% can help sometimes. You certainly can’t expect to survive indefinitely, but you can make it an interesting fight and maybe even escape afterward if you use smoke bomb+jump shot. In solo queue, it’s probably not worth it to die on the point—just get out.

It would just not work.

There’s no way to escape from focus fire from these classes, necro-thief is probably the most deadly pair: wars are just the cheese on the cake.

The only way to escape is :

OP survivability ( war)
OP escapes ( thief)
OP counterpressure ( necro, altough even necros falls when they are pressured by wars + any of the other 2)
OP bunker ( guard)

Other classes simply do not have the required tools to escape from them.

Think about it for a moment.

Warriors are actually better bunkers than guardian.

Guardian is better simply thanks to its amazing support via shouts.

Close point bunker war ?

A good build will be able to heal 1k per sec, with good stability, good condi removal, super CCs, good blocks, ridicolous toughness ( + dolyak signet)

AND EVEN GOOD MOBILITY thanks to banners.

Next gen bunker ?

Arheundel.6451:

1)Now that I think about it, the warrior as profession has only seen buffs since the end of Beta Weekend 2, sometimes they were small buffs that nobody paid attention to..but buffs nevertheless, a constant line of buffs that seems to never end.

2)This profession just keeps getting stronger and stronger, we’ve reached a point that this profession has absolutely zero counter, during the last SOTG the devs said that it was fine for mesmers to have conditions as a direct counter to their profession..but wasn’t condition supposed to be counter to warriors also?

Still that counter now has been effectively eliminated..only for the warrior while it remain for mesmer..interesting.

3)Despite having the larger number of weapon sets across all professions, the warrior is also the profession with the highest number of viable weapon, if we take a look at the current viable builds for warrior we can see that no weapon is left untouched and same can be said for the utilities

Apparently at Anet there is no need for “extensive testing” to buff the warrior , they get buffed every 3 weeks, in other profession cases we need over one year to see a single change.

Some skills on warrior get buffed without the need to create multiple threads, again the Devs don’t need “positive feedback” to buff the warrior…in some profession cases ( ele) you create over 20 “positive feedback” threads and you still get completely ignored.

Only thing I wonder now is…if there is anything left to buff on warriors

Shouts

BurrTheKing.8571:

So….I got merged with the reason “same issue.”

Not sure I understand.

I couldn’t even rage back to mods

BurrTheKing.8571:

Defektive is taking a break from the game so I’m posting a new version of his tier list thread. Same structure as before for consistency:

Tier List Key:
S = Superior (Highest Tier)
A = Average (All classes should strive to be here)
B = Below Average
C =

The – (Negative) sign denotes that the class may fall into a lower Tier.
The + (Positive) sign denotes that the class may get bumped to a higher Tier.
The = (Equal) sign denotes that the class is equivalent to other classes with = in the Tier.

Feel free to justify your reasoning, but let’s try and keep things constructive and civil!

it would be cool if you could just bring data from Defektive OP and pull it in yours, in order to see how the meta shifts ( this was Defektive aim anyway, other than having the Tier list accurate)

As far as it goes for me:

S tier

= Necro
= Warrior

A tier

= Guardian
= S/D Thief
- Spirit Ranger

B tier

+ Engi ( mostly due to bad stunbreakers, otherwise A tier)
= S/F burst Ele
= Non Shatter Mesmer

natsos.3692:

Mrbig.8019:

This guy nailed it.

Got it OP ? L2P.

After all every class have incredible blinds-stunbreakers-ranged CCs-condi resistance.

Not every buddy, it is pretty simple.
If you get spiked and your team doesn’t spike also, it is a team issue.
If you don’t have a stunbreaker on you, and your team has no CC , it is a L2P issue.

It is a team scenario, if your team can’t counter the combo of the other team, change your team.

Back to my other post, if you complain about dying on a 3v1 on any proffesion, it is an L2P issue(don’t engage if you are greatly outnumbered!!!).

He is obviously talking as one who is not thief-necro-war.

Mesmer-ele-engi-ranger has no way to endure focus fire of those classes ( especially first 3) and guardian is a different case.

I think there’re no more classes in this game.

too late, it got moved

@Amaterasu & Ensoriki

Shadow refuge stealth lasts way too long.

Stealth has no counterplay and it wouldn’t really be a problem if there were not so much access to stealth for so long time.

Giving counterplays to stealth ( as aNet has clearly stated) will just weaken D/P thieves which are already not in a good place, the same to P/D thieves which are a joke, and it’s all due to shadow refuge being too strong.

It has always been a must have in all thief bars for a reason, and will always be like this because stealthing the whole team will always trascend the meta, no matters what the meta is.

Stealth ambushes are not fun, neither rewarding “tactic wise” because the enemy can’t simply do a thing about it: entering “counters” will just force pick teams to choose those counters, and is not good for the health of the game.

We all know shadow refuge is too strong, why are we even arguing about it is beyond me: let’s give the thief more ways to support your teammates or let’s just force choices ( D/P thieves + blast finishers+ blinding powder) instead of giving everything to the best thief build according to the meta ( S/D in this case).

regarding Inf Strike

It’s not skillful. You can chase your opponents in z-axis by simply pressing a button, this skill alone is removing Mesmer and Eles from the meta, why can’t you understand.

Currently it’s not balanced, especially when there’re skills like Shadow shot ( best example) which make you waste initiative if your opponent simply dodges.

Inf strike can also be used with no target, without range requires, just to set your port then teleporting miles away from your opponent if you screw up, with no requirments.

It should just be like shadow shot, at least regarding range needings: if you are Out of Range, it should miss.

Spammable gap closers/maker with no range requirments is out of balance.

Larcenous strike is just a good skill, but what is making S/D so strong is its mobility, with no real skill required.

At least reward those good thieves who know how to keep range, instead of spamming abilities like brainless monkeys.

regarding S/P

S/P is bad due to not having a good damage dealing ability.

Pistol whip is slow, countered by reta, countered by stability: even with none of this, you can simply walk away from it while you dealth nothing more than 2-3k damage, time meanwhile you’re also vulnerable.

If Pistol whip was faster, dealt a little more damage and could be used on the move, i really doubt we would ever see any S/D thief in sPvP, due to OH pistol being 100 TIMES better than OH dagger.

Larcenous strike is not the culprit: you could remove the Boon stripping and the evade and putting in place a SINGLE SKILL dealing the same damage and people would still use S/D instead of S/P for the single reason that this skill could be used more reliably to do damage instead of a self-rooting, slow, bad damage dealing skill like Pistol Whip.

Again, they should shave what is OP ( in this case, Inf Strike and Shadow refuge) instead of nerfing the whole profession down, like they did with OH dagger ( in order to nerf D/D burst thieves, when OH dagger was never a problem to begin with).

Just think at it for a second.

Then let’s talk again.

Sidenote:

The “inf strike” hate was never needed before, simply because those sets ( S/D and S/P) never really worked properly: S/D was kept up by dazelocking ( which i don’t they ever intended to keep, altough it was a lot more skillful than current S/D) and S/P was kept up by Haste-pistol whipping.

If you have a working set like S/D currently is, the you start seeing the problem.

I see tons of complains about the thief, and i can say most of them are accurate, some others totally irrilevant and wrong.

Due to “next” patch entering stealth counters when stealth itself is extremely weak, i would like to give some advices ( maybe if other good thieves could help me it would be cool) to aNet in order to balance it.

Stealth

Altough stealth has no counterplay, it’s a very weak resource for the thief in sPvP.
You cannot cap points, and as a far point assaulter the other team just needs to leave there a good proff to proficiently fight the thief 1vs1 without losing too fast ( while points tickle for them).

Giving how bad stealth thieves are, i would go straight to the source of all problems:

SHADOW REFUGE

Nerf it or totally remove it, don’t hamper the whole profession mechanic due to team stealth stacking and stealth ambushes ( which is the only real problem).

It is also frustrating for WvWers and in PvE it has no real use if not to jump content by avoiding mobs and stacking it with blinding powder ( for double ress).

Do it.

Just do it.

Next problem: S/D thieves

Don’t listen to people crying about Larcenous strike, it has never been a problem.

The problem is Infiltrator Strike and the ridicolous mobility it gives.

You can basically jump from a target to another in a second, disangage at will, and focus the nect one without losing too much damage ( give the high amount of sustain S/D thieves have).

A good change ( in primis) would be to make inf strike teleport to go only in orizontal axis , because it is actually ridicolous when a mesmer/ele/necro goes on a roof and you go through walls and still catch him.

Another good change would be to have shadow return available ( this is a very HARSH nerf) only if you hit your target/in range of the target to be hit ( or rather 600 range) instead of putting shadow returns everywhere in the map.

If you’re not in target range Inf strike will port you NOWHERE and you’ll stay in place

Currently this skill is brainless, just use it and port everywhere.

Let’s start to make this set skillful.

After that, buff the freaking thief and balance it decently ( like S/P or OH dagger being horrible, and condi builds LOLOLOLOL) because we’ve been gimmicky from the start and work only with gimmicks.

Just like rangers, but without the brainless AI.

Ok, thanks.

@mods

Don’t move this thread outside PvP forum, this is specifically relevant to sPvP.

Thanks.

selan.8354:

Mrbig.8019:

selan.8354:

fugazi.5139:

selan.8354:

fugazi.5139:

Ok. NObody good ever complained about stealth. ONly noname kittenters.

that is not true at all. i can destroy thieves, if they attack me i am already a step ahead with my scepter 2 block and give the little thief 5 stacks of torment! i do complain about permastealth though as 1 thief can easily troll an entire group in a keep. thief players have to stop assuming everyone that hates stealth in this game, are bad players. if u wer a good player u wouldnt rely on stealth only. best thieves i fought wee the ones not permainvis.

Oh, when I said nobody good. I meant, Nobody relevant competitively. Noob.

dude.who the hell do u think u are. calling me a noob. only because i dont have a rank in kitten spvp doesnt give u the right to lash out like that. come to wvw and lets see who laughs in the end. ive been playing this game since headstart and thieves are with all the foodbuffs way stronger in wvw than spvp. so i do have the right to talk here. i dont care what your spvp rank is. a rank doesnt make u anything u could be the crappiest player in the world and simply choose a new meta build to rank up.
so get down from your wannabe high horse here!

WvW forum is that way -> https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/wuv/wuv

and wvw balance happens here :-)

That’s not our fault.

WvW balance influences sPvP the same way, and since they’re totally different games, with totally different strategies, builds and stats, it makes no sense to cry about WvW here in the sPvP forums.

Regarding the topic, stealth has no counterplay and that is true, but still stealth thieves are weak, VERY weak, and the only good build thieves have ( giving how strong condies, war, rangers, and all the stuff in the meta is) is S/D thief, which doesn’t rely on stealth for a reason.

A thief in stealth cannot contest a point, this is vital in sPvP. Maybe cruuk build is able to beat anyone, but takes too much time in doing so, and points slowly tick.

A permastealth thief at far is easily counterable by any class capable to 1vs1 him without losing too fast ( longbow-hammer warrior is a good example, spirit ranger another good one) and you just need to rearrange your team accordingly ( just send your home defender at far and leave your 1vs1 against the thief when the point is yours so he won’t be able to decap it).

I don’t see why people complain about stealth in sPvP: altough not having any counterplay, it’s weak and never EVER gave any problem at the top if not for stealth ambushes ( where THE WHOLE TEAM was stealthed).

Giving counters to stealth will just make D/P thieves weaker than they actually are and send all people to acrobatic thieves.

/balance

selan.8354:

fugazi.5139:

selan.8354:

fugazi.5139:

Ok. NObody good ever complained about stealth. ONly noname kittenters.

that is not true at all. i can destroy thieves, if they attack me i am already a step ahead with my scepter 2 block and give the little thief 5 stacks of torment! i do complain about permastealth though as 1 thief can easily troll an entire group in a keep. thief players have to stop assuming everyone that hates stealth in this game, are bad players. if u wer a good player u wouldnt rely on stealth only. best thieves i fought wee the ones not permainvis.

Oh, when I said nobody good. I meant, Nobody relevant competitively. Noob.

dude.who the hell do u think u are. calling me a noob. only because i dont have a rank in kitten spvp doesnt give u the right to lash out like that. come to wvw and lets see who laughs in the end. ive been playing this game since headstart and thieves are with all the foodbuffs way stronger in wvw than spvp. so i do have the right to talk here. i dont care what your spvp rank is. a rank doesnt make u anything u could be the crappiest player in the world and simply choose a new meta build to rank up.
so get down from your wannabe high horse here!

WvW forum is that way -> https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/wuv/wuv

natsos.3692:

Don’t let them focus you in the first place.
Place AoE on the focused player, CC the necro since he has no stability whatsoever and keep blinding and/or making the warrior’s life harder by chill, cripple, bleeds. Pretty much anything.

All of the above will work, unless you are getting focused when you are alone which is an L2P senario.

This guy nailed it.

Got it OP ? L2P.

After all every class have incredible blinds-stunbreakers-ranged CCs-condi resistance.

Leuca.5732:

Depends on what makes the build less than optimal for most styles of play. I’m assuming you know that’s kind of a given. It’s easy to get beaten up by a niche build that you’ve never seen before if you have no idea what to expect, but that doesn’t make the build particularly great for much by default. It just means the person caught you off guard, was a better player, etc.

There’re tons of optimal builds. Even DPS guard can be viable in high level of play, it’s just more difficult to make it work.

In a meta where spirit rangers are not present, other professions can shine

Leuca.5732:

Wars were weak by comparison. Now they’re OP by comparison. Your build back then wasn’t going to touch a prenerf ele who knew what they were doing.

Also, many of us are quite aware that Anet’s policy for balance often goes astray..

I’m not talking to pre-nerf eles time.

I’m talking about when they buffed Hammer animations and Mace stuns and added zerk stance ( 2 months ago IIRC).

I used to run with Healing surge and Fury signet/dolyak ( same build with less sustain but more spike) and i was able to demolish anybody.

Super surely is not the first one running that build ( or similar builds), we have been running with similar stuff for months.

Yet most of the time nobody would give credit to wars. When in TS with my guildies, when i said that any more buff to wars would have made them ridicolously OP, they would laugh at me.

Now look at them.

I’m sure the same will happen to Eles and Mesmers ( surely those 2) as soon as people get used changing their builds and adapting: Interrupt mesmer, Countless’ build, S/F burst are extremely strong, people is seriously underrating them.

Just few tweaks and they will be ridicolously strong

Leuca.5732:

No, what is stopping people from using those builds is a lack of global efficiency. S/F burst for example is an extremely niche build with only one skill for innate survivability. The set lacks any consistent sustain after blowing its first round of heals and has no mobility whatsoever. Anything with a bit of durability and/or well-timed dodges will completely wreck this kind of ele because it can’t keep up if its damage fails to kill in the first round, and its offhand lacks any significant pressure skills to keep an attacker at bay after dealing its primary damage. Which could bring me to the point of how eles are actually in a terrible state outside of a meta balance perspective, but I’d highly encourage you to take a look at some of the less-whiny threads on the related forum, which discuss design flaws with the class.

I also don’t understand how you can think your bolded statement is true. There is so much in this game that is below what basic operating level has come to be known as e.g. myriad traits/entire traitlines, as well as entire weapon sets for some, and a vast number of utility skills. None of these categories are in any way limited to the professions/specialties you mentioned.

I disagree.

S/F eles, when built correctly, have tons of survivability.

You can build for double arcane shield ( it’s not really needed anyway), you have magnetic shield which is almost a global condi removal every 25 secs + a projectile reflection.

Also obsidian flesh.

Also swirling winds.

Ether renewal grants you very consinstent healing and condi removal, so you can not care about points in water and go glass

Fresh air gives you good sustained damage and great burst.

Go figure the build out by yourself.

If you don’t, i’ll give you some advice: 20-30-0-0-20 or 0-30-20-0-20 are good examples, you would also grant AoE stability every 10 secs, you know.

solution ?

Reroll to necro-war-thief.

Easy.

Excalibur.9748:

I hate it. I use #4 a lot in the S/D kit, and I know other thieves who use #5 a lot in the S/D kit.

It’s not about using it or not, it’s about efficiency.

If you use Dancing Dagger in a situation that isn’t slowing people down while backapping, you’re wasting initiative.

C&D is suboptimal at best, melee range, 6 ini: one of the few skills in the set requiring skill, yet not used due to being suboptimal ( tactical strike being so bad doesn’t help, either).

Yet OP suggested changes will just help condi specs, terribad at best.

Anyway, it will be moved to thief forum so who cares

Leuca.5732:

NevirSayDie.6235:

Leuca.5732:

What build haven’t you seen?

I have seen it now The point of the thread isn’t to post new/interesting builds, it’s to say that new and interesting builds are possible.

It’s not particularly difficult to explain what killed you now, is it?

Example: This S/F ele bursted me down with what I think was a Fresh Air build.

Chances are the build you died to is not really that new; it’s just uncommonly seen for one reason or another.

What exactly are those reasons ?

When i used to play hammer-longbow ( note, basically the same build people bash for being OP with the only difference being signet of fury instead of dolyak) ANYONE would ask me to go back to my thief.

I used to say wars were strong and didn’t need any serious buff. They laughed at me.

Look at wars now, just look at them.

What is stopping people from using those builds is tunnel vision.

Rupt mesmer, S/F burst eles, power ranger and similars are all viable and strong, and needs very little to be on par with common OP builds.

As soon as they shave OP builds ( S/D thief, necros and wars among all) they will be godlike like they should ( being mostly builds with high skill cap) .

Power ranger-guard-necro are the only one that should be looked at for buffs (AIMED ONES, not ridicolous stuff such burning was for necros) because if you do give too much to builds already in a decent spot ( such DPS guards) they will become OP like necros and wars.

Mesmer and eles especially are in a very good state, it’s S/D thief ( which holds them back) which should be nerfed ( again , AIMED nerfs).

ResJudicator.7916:

Mrbig.8019:

I mean, c’mon people just try it out.

But you haven’t even tried it out yourself… Whereas many of us have.

at least in solo queue, i’ve seen tons of eles ( top eles) running S/F builds.

team queue was already dead when i left, so who really knows lol.

I’m just saying that people love to cry and QQ about this and that, but, at least regarding mesmer and eles, there’re tons of unused super strong builds. ( just like when i used to play hammer warrior and they said " reroll, we don’t want to lose" LOLOLOL)

They may not be as strong ( in the meta) as their counterparts were ( shatter in burst meta or S/D eles pre-condi horror), but they have very high potentialities ( Car Crash shown it by demolishing almost every team with an ele on theirs, when team queue was not as dead as it is (?) currently).

Altough i can understand their frustration when spam classes like thief, ranger and necro demolish you by simply facerolling, but this also happens because they don’t like to adapt.

Do you think a well played glass S/F ele or a strong interrupt mesmer would lose to any of them ? i don’t think so.

There’re people who can make the class work, maybe with a different build ( like eurantien in NA): if you’re not able to do it, i would rather take a look at your room for improving instead of bashing the whole profession.

This doesn’t mean that stuff doesn’t need to be looked at ( Focus fire attunement is a clear example, along with power ranger in general and mesmer traits) but there’re still way to overcome these issues.

And in some cases, results can be astounishing.

ensoriki.5789:

Phaeton.9582:

Lave axe glass cannon Eles

= 25 might stacking nuke trains

4 conjure Meta is here.

“/F is by far stronger than /D ( if you don’t account fire attu) and only lacks mobility.”
Yes and No. Fire attunement is a flop. Focus itself lacks damage, only what 3 skills do any noteable damage? S/F hinges itself on air attunement because there frankly isn’t much else outside of that including DT and phoenix.

Good condi removal and strong invuln in earth.
Good AoE CC in water
Gale and FREAKING SWIRLING WIND.

Imho they should change freezing gust, reduce significantly Gale CD ( to something like 30-35 secs) and just make fire attunement more proactive ( stuff like damage+burning instead of just burning and flame shield being as terribad as it is).

/F is better than /D for a glass cannon build because it gives you the survivability you need ( good condi removal, invulnerability and such).

Imho you could also go 20-30-20-0-0 and take both rock solid ( huge with ether renewal) and stone splinters, for ridicolous damage, or 20-30-10-0-10 for stone splinters alone.

You’re not the best roamer for sure, but S/F burst ele could be the highest damage dealer in the team, you just need a good mate to peel for you ( stun warrior ? maybe thief)

I mean, c’mon people just try it out.

Lachanche.6859:

out of curiosity, do you play EU ?

yep.

Eles used to start running it as long as i was still playing, and since i cannot play i’m theorycrafting.

Potentially S/F eles have the capabilities to endure focusing for a while ( even more if they bring double arcane shield) and those with a 20-30-0-0-20 build could be really powerful.

Again, they just lack mobility, but if you have a good ally peeling for you, the damage is insane.

I believe that, along with Interrupt mesmer, they’re (will be) the biggest source of damage in game.

Also, fiery greatsword LOL.

ensoriki.5789:

Sure once they improve fire attunement.
I legit don’t understand how Focus fire attunement got past beta.

It sincerely makes sense if you start building up damage stacking traits in fire.

That 5-10% more damage if your target is burning really helps.

I cannot really play currently, but the only issue i see with S/F burst eles is mobility, and they still have signet of air after all ( altough not having direct mobility skills).

I cannot currently play ( and won’t be able for a while) but i really believe S/F eles are going to explode in the meta.

/F is by far stronger than /D ( if you don’t account fire attu) and only lacks mobility.

Just waiting for them to rule the world.

Just sayin

zencow.3651:

Amaterasu.6280:

You guys make it seem like backstab thieves are what’s causing this horrible meta -_- backstab thieves are the least of your concerns right now. Even s/d thieves are way more threatening.

If you play a thief you should know how to counter one.

Amir.1570:

@zencow

Do you know how biased you sound? You did NOT include being able to have indefinite evade frames and you also did not include being able to use more than one stun break as brainless mechanics.

Rethink your topic please and include these. Don’t include these and all your thread does is a cry for nerfs on classes you don’t even play.

It’s brainless but it’s punishable.

S/D thieves aren’t as OP as people cry. The evade frame is only Flanking Strike, after which the thief is vulnerable to a stun/fear/whatever before he lands Larcenous Strike. Larcenous Strike is also pretty easy to dodge.

It takes abit more skill to use S/D properly without getting destroyed compared to D/P blind spam.

I’ll rethink about adding them to my OP but as it stands it’s not brainlessly effective enough and I can’t think of any solutions that would turn them from overpowered to useless instantly.

O_o

S/D thief brings:

High sustain damage
Good 1vs1 capabilities
Strong disangage even without CDs
Ridicolous Mobility
Great condi cleansing
Decent Burst
AoE cleave

D/P offers
High burst
Good disangage when CDs are there
Decent sustained damage
Decent mobility
Mediocre 1vs1 capabilities
Decent condi cleansing
Blinds

And you talk about D/P being OP ?

I play S/D and i would really BEG to have S/D to be skillful like it was before, or like D/P actually is ( and always have been, but it’s still a boring set)

Now you can EFFECTIVELY spam 3 and be a lot more effective than you should.

This without accounting how ridicolously OP Inf Strike is.

S/D thief is too forgiving, the whole sword set is too forgiving: if you play bad, you simply port away, cleanse/heal then come back 4-5 secs later.

I want my class to be good and to require skill, yet the misinformation and bad feedback is astounishing, and this is clearly an example of it.

waka.9826:

Mrbig.8019:

Chopps.5047:

Mrbig.8019:

if patch notes are true, rangers are doomed.

Just sayin

How so?

take a look at healing spring nerf and vigor renewal.

Bye bye rangers.

Because those 2 things are what kept rangers in the game, right.

ahahah this is a ridicolous nerf.

5 seconds less of AoE blast finishers and leap combos for the ranger to heal.

No more AoE perma vigor just from the healing skill.

Rangers already took a huge hit with last patch’s spirits nerf ( they may say as much as you want " it was a buff for team fights!!!" but it actually is a nerf to ranger overall meta role as a point defender), with this they lose SOOOOOOOOOOO much utility.

Every ranger and their mother run Healing spring just for vigorous renewal, now that it (finally) works properly i can see rangers going back to troll unguent just to get interrupted again and again.

As a ranger hater, i’m happy.

Chopps.5047:

Mrbig.8019:

if patch notes are true, rangers are doomed.

Just sayin

How so?

take a look at healing spring nerf and vigor renewal.

Bye bye rangers.

if patch notes are true, rangers are doomed.

Just sayin

jportell.2197:

Darnis.4056:

I’ve tried all the amulets with this build also all weapons.

There’s very good reason why you play rampagers for 60% crit and fury; you want the 7-8 bleed stacks from the duelist.

No reason to shatter when my condition damage does my work.
In fact shattering is counter intuitive to the build, as sha(t)ter does not trigger clone death abilities.

The reason for sword/pistol is because sword is the only melee weapon mesmer has; i.e you want melee clones to go in and get killed and you can position the staff clones.
You also want the Invulnerability, and the extra CC x2
Scepter/torch does not hold a candle to it. I know having ran multiple versions multiple days to test which would work best.

Scepter torch is great… But in support builds not condition builds, Scepter torch is also more of a confusion set and just due to perplexity runes and condition duration buffs in WvW confusion is actually somewhat decent there. In PvP confusion is just “wat?” It But scepter is amazing for condition if you are fighting non-AI based classes because the torment when properly built can tick for as long as the cooldown is on the scepter.

Confusion is not “wat” in PvP.

After trying Count’s build focused on AoE confusion stacking i could say that if confusion dealt more damage than it does, it would have been RIDICOLOUSLY OP.

Again, a simple Cry of Frustration with Count’s build, with 33% confusion duration and 20% condi duration, stacks ( with 3 clones) NINE AOE CONFUSION STACKS lasting stuff like 6-7 secs.

9 stacks means that if you try to do anything, you’ll receive more than 1k damage each time: just autoattacking could mean death.

It’s basically a “remove it or die”, just like it was with good old hexes.

I believe you still have to discover what that build can do: try playing it with carrion and scepter torch, with that build even the terribad IMage seems decent.

As soon as i’ll be able to play again, i’ll try the same build with scepter/pistol and fury on phantasm instead of desperete decoy, altough stealth is really needed against strong condi classes ( since i could run with portal instead of null field due to heavy stealth uptime, giving my team more utility).

Darnis.4056:

I’ve tried all the amulets with this build also all weapons.

There’s very good reason why you play rampagers for 60% crit and fury; you want the 7-8 bleed stacks from the duelist.

No reason to shatter when my condition damage does my work.
In fact shattering is counter intuitive to the build, as sha(t)ter does not trigger clone death abilities.

The reason for sword/pistol is because sword is the only melee weapon mesmer has; i.e you want melee clones to go in and get killed and you can position the staff clones.
You also want the Invulnerability, and the extra CC x2
Scepter/torch does not hold a candle to it. I know having ran multiple versions multiple days to test which would work best.

When you shatter you cause 2 AoE confusion stacks PER SHATTER.
3 with Cry of frustration.

It’s not hard to go beyond 10 stacks of confusion, AoE, if you start shattering.

And with carrion your shatters deal very good damage too.

I guess we’re playing 2 totally different builds ( same build, but totally different playstyle).

Till i stopped playing, only S/D thieves could give me hard times: that build was pure terror, if you start shattering in the mid of a teamfight people would start killing themselves, and if clones get killed meanwhile, they still kill themselves with “on death” clone effects.

Darnis.4056:

Halting strike mesmer is really my favorite build out of all the mesmer builds, the idea of it anyway.. but as far as I can tell through massive testing…
It’s not as strong as Countless clone spam build..

I’ve tried a couple of builds mostly those listed in this thread and also my own varients.. and I can say that I don’t enjoy playing it as much nor do I feel as strong as I do in my variation of count’s build.
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fgAQNAW8alwzqpXUzgGbNJipCBHaGXn3RqQpVmBudhA-ToAg1CnIKSVkrITRyisFtQY/B

Regarding Count’s build, i would suggest you to play it with Carrion instead of Rampager.

With 25 in in Duel + Lyssa runes you still have 30% crit chance ( fairly high) and you also have more power and condi damage ( i was s_hattering for more than 1.5 k damage per shatter on glass cannons, and shatter is not even that important if not to stack confusion if you bring the trait in illusions, just sayin).

When i was still playing, i used it with Scepter/torch instead of Sword/pistol and it was ridicolously strong.

Really, really REALLY strong.

wut is dis i dun even….

Killthehealersffs.8940:

I can tell u 10.000$ reasons that ppl didnt bother to create teams , but rather enjoy just to play PvP :P
If those 10.000$ pinuts didnt light ppls interest to create teams , i dont expect a punny <<number>. leaderboard to create miracle and sparkle their interest for competitive lvl PvP :P
Ppl love to have fun , rather that get competitive :P

Edit: But ppl love to face skillful players .

Give people incentives to play with a team and taste the competitive side of the game.

Give the competitive side of the game incentives to keep playing the game while keeping the game satisfying, enjoying and skillful.

Then you’ll see people coming into PvP in masses.

Till now, aNet gave us the exact opposite ( bad rewards, no incentives, you keep your ranking by not playing so you’re even ACTULLY REWARDED for not playing and all the stuff), that’s the reason why good players LEAVE PvP instead of staying.

What is saving this game is the combat mechanic, nothing more.

Nuka Cola.8520:

Mrbig.8019:

Dirame.8521:

Nuka Cola.8520:

Dirame.8521:

Nuka Cola.8520:

Dirame.8521:

Nuka Cola.8520:

Dirame.8521:

Daishi.6027:

When we get cast bars maybe.

Blindly interupt spam on point isn’t a viable enough reason for me to run it, And every other situation I’d rather just take the strait up 20%

That being said I don’t think it’s a bad trait

I play it without cast bars and it’s way more skill based that way. Spamming blindly will see you lose. I’ve gotten quite good at watching animations to the point where, when cast bars are added, I’ll be really sad.

there’s nothing skillfull spamming rups and deal damage from HS when it counts even on autos… just sayin. The skill isn’t bad but there’s much better options.

You go ahead and interrupt auto attacks. I’ll just interrupt the things that actually matter.

yes, because gw2 has a lot of skills with significantly different cast animations and long casting time worth using a rupt on. I know you said this to sound ‘smart’ but c’mon now, its gw2 we’re talking about… an mmo with no cast bars lmao

I’m the one who has played the build. I do know what I’m talking about.

Really, the only argument you have has already been made by a different person who said; with all the effects noise, the effectiveness of the build drops, which is true. When it comes to animations though, I can tell what abilities to interrupt. Sometimes I spam and in those cases, I find that I’m less effective. In fact I had a fight with a mesmer and in a different situation, a thief, that made that fact quite apparent to me.

So yea, you may believe that GW2 has animation issues (which in some cases, it does) but that hasn’t affected my effectiveness with this build.

okay and what animations are you looking for to interrupt? I mean if all animations were as obvious as the Mass Invis one i’d agree but its far from being the case. No cast bars, same hard to read animations on everyone and not being able to load your skill bar with a lot more rupts than what’s available (you know, to actually make HS truly useful?) is the reason i will never consider HS or run a rupt build for that matter. Its just not effective as its once was in gw1 and will never be like that in gw2 cuz its streamlined to dem casuals.

Do you want me to list every skill I interrupt? To narrow it down, I usually interrupt skills that have cast times longer than a half a second or if I see a distinct animation. The hardest things to interrupt for me are the Engineer turret and Ranger Healing spring heal skills because those are half a second cast times. I catch those sometimes, usually by guessing the percentage people usually decide to heal at but I don’t always get it right.
Yes this isn’t GW1 where you can just stack your bar full of interrupts and laugh your way to the bank but it’s still pretty good and I enjoy playing it. Especially against Necros.

When cast bars are implemented it will make things easier but I’ll enjoy interrupting heals like a pro for now.

After a while you get used to animations, and you can also foretell when your opponent will use something.

Imho we shouldn’t have casting bars, because ( i know it may sound silly) but IRL, if you practice martial arts, you don’t have “cast bars” on your opponent heads saying “HEY BUD, LOW KICK INCOMING !!!” and this “animation based” game is very rewarding if played correctly.

The point is there are tons of undistingued animations (necro for istance), super fast animations with strong effects on low CDs ( withdraw, heal turret, skull crack etc) making absolutely no sense.

Yet interrupts can still be used, and mesmer is by far the best in doing so.

With and interrupt build with Mantra of Distraction, you just deal about 10 k damage on a medium toughness char by simply using MoD and interrupting anything you see has a cast time: you have so many ranged interrupts you’re basically able to completely shut down a dangerous characther ( a necro, for example) while also dealing massive damage with GS ranged shatters.

I think it’s about time to make GW 1 mesmer to come back.

yes please!!!! but it won’t happen. i love the mechanic of illusions and its good enough to annoy people but its light years behind spamming migraine, PB, echo diversion, Shame and the other good stuff

Interrupt mesmer is still possible.

No other class can come close to mesmer, no other class gain so much from interrupting.

A good interrupt build will be mesmer next meta and i can assure you this: shatter is too vulnerable currently, even with triple “selfish” U-skills ( by itself a good reason to never bring it again in a team) it will just go down to thieves, necros and even eles in teamfights.

Med.6150:

What this means is that the top players now are sitting at a way lower rating than when he stopped playing. His decay kicked in, which seems to be more of a hibernation state than a strong decay function, and thus dropped to 131st.

It’s obvious for one who stopped playing, if his ranking doesn’t decay, to be above those who play, because those who play get their rank deteriorated by losses, even if there are few of them.

Obviously this system promotes sitting on a good spot and stop playing, of course this kills competition because it’s hard if not impossible to go up if you get matched with full unranked people, gaining very little from winning ( 6-7 spots in top 200-300 if your opponents are all unranked, like it happened to me) and losing A LOT ( even 100 positions if not more) if you lose even a single match, like it happened to me.

Obviously the system is ridicolously broken.

I’ll write it again till i have no fingers, this broken leaderboard is N.1 REASON why there’s no people taking PvP seriously, with REWARDS following right after

Dirame.8521:

Nuka Cola.8520:

Dirame.8521:

Nuka Cola.8520:

Dirame.8521:

Nuka Cola.8520:

Dirame.8521:

Daishi.6027:

When we get cast bars maybe.

Blindly interupt spam on point isn’t a viable enough reason for me to run it, And every other situation I’d rather just take the strait up 20%

That being said I don’t think it’s a bad trait

I play it without cast bars and it’s way more skill based that way. Spamming blindly will see you lose. I’ve gotten quite good at watching animations to the point where, when cast bars are added, I’ll be really sad.

there’s nothing skillfull spamming rups and deal damage from HS when it counts even on autos… just sayin. The skill isn’t bad but there’s much better options.

You go ahead and interrupt auto attacks. I’ll just interrupt the things that actually matter.

yes, because gw2 has a lot of skills with significantly different cast animations and long casting time worth using a rupt on. I know you said this to sound ‘smart’ but c’mon now, its gw2 we’re talking about… an mmo with no cast bars lmao

I’m the one who has played the build. I do know what I’m talking about.

Really, the only argument you have has already been made by a different person who said; with all the effects noise, the effectiveness of the build drops, which is true. When it comes to animations though, I can tell what abilities to interrupt. Sometimes I spam and in those cases, I find that I’m less effective. In fact I had a fight with a mesmer and in a different situation, a thief, that made that fact quite apparent to me.

So yea, you may believe that GW2 has animation issues (which in some cases, it does) but that hasn’t affected my effectiveness with this build.

okay and what animations are you looking for to interrupt? I mean if all animations were as obvious as the Mass Invis one i’d agree but its far from being the case. No cast bars, same hard to read animations on everyone and not being able to load your skill bar with a lot more rupts than what’s available (you know, to actually make HS truly useful?) is the reason i will never consider HS or run a rupt build for that matter. Its just not effective as its once was in gw1 and will never be like that in gw2 cuz its streamlined to dem casuals.

Do you want me to list every skill I interrupt? To narrow it down, I usually interrupt skills that have cast times longer than a half a second or if I see a distinct animation. The hardest things to interrupt for me are the Engineer turret and Ranger Healing spring heal skills because those are half a second cast times. I catch those sometimes, usually by guessing the percentage people usually decide to heal at but I don’t always get it right.
Yes this isn’t GW1 where you can just stack your bar full of interrupts and laugh your way to the bank but it’s still pretty good and I enjoy playing it. Especially against Necros.

When cast bars are implemented it will make things easier but I’ll enjoy interrupting heals like a pro for now.

After a while you get used to animations, and you can also foretell when your opponent will use something.

Imho we shouldn’t have casting bars, because ( i know it may sound silly) but IRL, if you practice martial arts, you don’t have “cast bars” on your opponent heads saying “HEY BUD, LOW KICK INCOMING !!!” and this “animation based” game is very rewarding if played correctly.

The point is there are tons of undistingued animations (necro for istance), super fast animations with strong effects on low CDs ( withdraw, heal turret, skull crack etc) making absolutely no sense.

Yet interrupts can still be used, and mesmer is by far the best in doing so.

With and interrupt build with Mantra of Distraction, you just deal about 10 k damage on a medium toughness char by simply using MoD and interrupting anything you see has a cast time: you have so many ranged interrupts you’re basically able to completely shut down a dangerous characther ( a necro, for example) while also dealing massive damage with GS ranged shatters.

I think it’s about time to make GW 1 mesmer to come back.

Med.6150:

Archaon.6245:

I think he knows thief enough man…just saying, anyway best thing is to try out and see how it does..

I am not exactly sure what you are “just saying”. Him knowing thief “enough” or not is pretty much irrelevant to my argument.

I rarely see anybody pre-casting basilisk with lyssa runes, because it is a waste. Lyssa is used for a counter-offensive almost exclusively nowadays (you get condi-bombed, clear it, then you pressure your target, since you have stability, aegis and generally more survivability for the 6.5 seconds).

You’re forced to use it defensively only if you don’t pay attention.

Imho it’s a waste to do the opposite.

Basilisk can be pre-casted, and you rarely engage a fight in less than 30 seconds.

This means you’ll have basilisk available AGAIN in 15-20 seconds after you’ve engaged, and you will already engage with basilisk on.

You just need to pay attention to condi bursts inbetween ( again, it’s 15-20 seconds).

Port back, evade, there’re tons of ways to avoid condi bursts inbetween those 15-20 seconds, and the reward will be more pressure and your enemy forced to use stunbreaks/defensive skills/fears on you at the start.

S/D is not a burst build.

Med.6150:

Mrbig.8019:

Bountiful interruption is a very strong trait, but thieves still will train you very hard in teamfights.

I know for sure that, in a teamfight, i would destroy any mesmer without Mirror of anguish in less than 5 seconds as soon as i get my basilisk combo off.

Since you go for 30 in chaos, i would take MoA instead of Staff reduction, at least to avoid insta-death by S/D thieves.

My build can also be played with 30 in chaos instead of domination and be similar to your one, but mantra of distraction really gives you and edge in 1vs1 against any class.

Alright, you keep repeating this, and I can’t help but point out that there’s a huge flaw in your concept that Mirror of Anguish will protect you from Basilisk and it’s the fact that 90% of the thieves running S/D will have stability up from Lyssa runes when they hit you with Basilisk (which will nullify MoA and/or any Halting Strikes).

That said, I have always thought MoA to be a good defensive trait and it is very useful in many situations for the simple reason that nobody can keep track of its CD. I also think the build you posted is good (albeit I would optimize it a little for my playstyle).

Nah, it has not to be ALWAYS like this.

Most o the time you have basilisk pre-casted on you simply to start the fight with a Basilisk just to have it again 15- 20 seconds later.

In that case MoA will protect you and give you the edge agains the thief ( that will already be stunned, with 4 k damage dealth by Halting strike and forced to start with defensive mode on) and you will already have an Izerker out and ready to pull the first shatter combo.

Mantra of distraction will allow you to interrupt Larcenous so, if you play perfectly, will take damage just from Inf strike.

If MoA goes off on the first attack, you’re already in a good position to win the fight, even if it you’re in a teamfight.

I believe the build is solid, there’re many variants ( like sensotix one) and mesmers should really stop the tunnel vision on Shatter being the only possible build.

Shatter was viable simply because mesmer was OP in that meta, able to provide 2 of the strongest group utilities+ strongest elite in game simply because the meta allowed it.

Future metas will NEVER allow it again ( CC wars, Condi cleave proffs and similars) so it’s time to shift builds too.

I play mesmer just for the lulz and i got it, i dunno why other mesmers who play it competitively want to keep their tunnel vision.

I’ll say mine.

Thief

Finally someone who understands the problem is Inf strike and not the rest.

Z-axis inf strike is ridicolous, you pass beyond walls, you can train mesmers and eles like if there’s no tomorrow, positioning is not important, and as soon as an S/D thief goes to treb, you pretty much know you can leave it because it will be destroyed and you will be able to do NOTHING in order to stop him.

Making it horizontal only would not solve this issue, since you would just lose the “no positioning” issue, and it’s not like mesmer and eles have tons of re-positioning tools ( blink + lightning flash, that is all).

We would fix thieves going through walls and z-axis ( treb included), but the meta will be unchanged, mesmers and eles will still have a hard time against thieves in teamfights.

Imho inf strke should be changed: too much mobility for a single skill, it’s a cool skill but it’s obvious that is not balanced, while other skills ( OH dagger and even Pistol whip) are bad and lackluster.

A redesigning is needed.

Guardian

Guardians are OP, and they’ve been from beta: nobody complains about them simply because they don’t kill anything.

Unreplaceble bunker, no other class can even go near its utility, and when it’s like this, we have a balance issue.

Ranger

Ranger should be worked on.

This prof is too passive, too much relying on AI of any sort ( both pets and spirits) and due to this it will always be OP or UP.

Spirit ranger will soon be no more viable ( they’re already on the edge) and the only builds for ranger that actually require skills is Power or Trapper ( both non viable).

Indeed there’s something wrong with their design.

Necro

OP and meta ruling.

Torment is fine, let burning go.

If not, let necro “huge damage” come from torment, burning has no place with the necro.

They should also reduce weakness uptime.

Warrior

The problem here resides in Merciless Hammer being on the “cleansing ire” traitline ( a defensive one).

That trait alone allows you to outdamage GS by a long shot as soon as you get your enemy stunned ( you can basically stunlock him to death if you pull your Earthshacker off, or even worse if you also play with Mace and land your skullcrack).

Maybe they should just tone down stun duration for the mace, but mace is already not the best, so i really dunno ( even mace/shield-GS is outshined by Hammer-longbow).

I have no problems in wars being strong, they’ve been UP for too much and currently they’re not that OP.

Maybe they should just tone down stun duration and healing, and problem is solved.

Damage is fine.

Mesmer, ele, engi

They’re all fine. They should just change the way how air burst works, no animation burst is ILLOGICAL and gives you no counterplay at all.

Sensotix.4106:

try this build its based on interrupts:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ahon_4l8ixY

Bountiful interruption is a very strong trait, but thieves still will train you very hard in teamfights.

I know for sure that, in a teamfight, i would destroy any mesmer without Mirror of anguish in less than 5 seconds as soon as i get my basilisk combo off.

Since you go for 30 in chaos, i would take MoA instead of Staff reduction, at least to avoid insta-death by S/D thieves.

My build can also be played with 30 in chaos instead of domination and be similar to your one, but mantra of distraction really gives you and edge in 1vs1 against any class.

Also, IMHO, GS is a must have for teamfights, otherwise you really lose impact.

Lol devs even admitted GS damage is over the top and that they should nerf it if the meta shifts away from condies.

Darnis.4056:

LoL that build is …unrefined,
why not pick up bountiful interruption if you’re going 20 into chaos…
in an interrupt build..

Why greatsword and not Sword/pistol?..
Why Harmonios mantras if you’re only using 1 mantra? :/

Looks like you just put random traits in from my perspective

bountiful interruption is a good alternative to mirror of anguish, but you need to understand that you need to take care of thieves training on you.

Mirror will save you from basilisk at least ( while also interrupting and dealing a good chunk of damage: my main is a thief and i know i’ll ALWAYS land a combo with basilisk,mirror of anguish will prevent it and interrupt the thief, but it’s also good against wars landing their skull crack ).

Harmonius mantra simply because of triple distraction, other mantras suck balls, are selfish and not even that strong ( you still need a group utility and a stunbreaker).

Greatsword because it has more DPS than Sword/pistol, more range, AoE and 1200 range shatter combo ( so you don’t even need 30 in illusion), in EU i’m surely not the first running with GS/staff ( Helseth docet).

The build is solid, i see no reason to not play it and i see it as a very powerful AoE dealer, and no, i don’t think it will suffer against necros due to double condi cleanse + ridicolous damage and CCs, and neither agaainst warriors since you can kite them easily ( blink on a 24 secs CD, strong CCs and phase retreat, range while having good DPS with GS).

The only class you could struggle against are, again, thieves, but you’re still covere even there thanks to anti-basilisk mirror of anguish.

Try it instead of discrediting, we’ll talk again after that

Nuka Cola.8520:

simply because boon stripping/20% more mind wrack damage is more important (in a shatter build that is). The other reason i don’t like it much is because mesmers aren’t what they once were in gw1. you can’t load rups and go ham on people. here we have rups on very long CD and not enough we have access to.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fgAQJAWRlwzipnRTqGb9IiJFEHFS6RrZarWJFz2FC-TgAg0CnIKSVkrITRyisFB

Try this, just do it.

If i could play right now, i would indeed.

Rups on very long CD ?

3 power locks, diversion, AoE costant interrupt via Chaos storm and Illusionary wave.

You have so many interrupts on low CDs its ridicolous, and halting strike deals so much damage is insane, on top of GS ridicolous DPS.

Added with AoE stealth and Null field, you also have decent support.

I mean c’mon, stop running shatter, there are better options right now and altough i miss old good portal plays, mesmer is still strong.

And let’s not forget countless’ build.

Shatter mes 2.0

Blimm.5028:

People run halting strike… In their shatter builds instead of 20%MWdamage.

And that’s silly since you can’t gain the most from it, and lose a huge chunk of burst ( 20% less basically means you’re wasting illusionary persona).

Just let those traits in Illusions go and build your mesmer differently, interrupt mesmer is basically the biggest damage profession in game, a SINGLE Chaos Storm put in the middle of the point can deal up to 10k damage (if not more) , it’s ridicolous

Mouby.7096:

Maybe they want us to stop playing tpvp, so they can finally delete pvp from the game. Rewards for not playing or beeing bad? You’ll be rank 1.

Lmao.

This is going to be esports. /ironie

ESPAAAAAAAAAAATH

WHY NOBODY RUNS IT FOR THE SAKE OF GOD

Just wondering why they still want to play silly shatter.

Lordrosicky.5813:

Lady Sara Goldheart.2764:

A really nice read there.
Some things reflect on the state of my frustration, e.g. unauthentic leader-boards and simpler and more satisfying rewards.
I think there should be a gradually higher decay on leader-boards the longer your inactivity is. And you should not get your initial rating back but stay in an area around your rating if you play again.
A league system which has been mentioned on the forums before will help much more though, I think. MMR, for example, is much better as you only play in your own league. Additionally, TeamQ needs an overhaul too, cause there are no teams but single players on it.
The rewards right now are just not as satisfying as when a PvE-/WvW-Player comes into sPvP, they can easily get their daily and monthly done to have more benefits for their own types. If we step out of sPvP, we have a char presumably at level 2, some laurels maybe and very few gold if at all. Dyes are just a gamble and it isn’t fun to click on a lot of stuff just for a chance on a few gold. So gem rewards or a glory -> gem conversion would be darn nice.
Regarding dishonor, the punishment is very forgiving. It should be much less time if somebody is afk to kick and punish. (It will benefit rated and unrated SoloQ the most)

Oh and we get a LFG-Tool soon.

I agree. I would suggest the leaderboards reset monthly with champions being declared and that not playing for more than 72 hours should lead to decay which is slow at first but quickly speeds up to the point that after a week you are dropping a ton every hour

As long as you can play 1 match per day and stay ranked, we have a problem.

The system should be dynamic, and reward the more you play.

Playing in solo queue is right now just a risk, you’re basically putting on a random slot if your rank will decrease HUGELY or increase SLIGHTLY.

Obviously nobody plays.

i’m happy threads like this are popping out everywhere.

This game gives no clue about how new players should play, Hotojoin is terrible and doesn’t give you the necessary informations and capabilities to be good in ranked matches.

They should re-do the system and give players some kind of tutorials, like in LoL.

Tyler Chapman.1832:

Kwll.1468:

So basically nothing important just secondary fluff. More we know these things are problems and we are working on them but we don’t know when they will be ready. New Amulets and map fixes whoopee. How about making your leaderboards and game enjoyment worth something by fixing match making and decay. You put in your first pass at a decay months ago and its been a fail for months. Your game punishes people for playing. Your matchmaking system frequently has people ranked in the top 500 versus people not in the top 1,000. These things should be your priorities!

They are on our priority list we just are not allowed to talk about it when we don’t have a designated release date

Powerr, the leaderboard issue is the N.1 REASON killing competition right now.

It should be fixed ASAP, saying “it’s on the priority list” after so much time leaderboards have been out is MINDBLOGGING.

What about talking about this ?

I mean, how can this seriously be buried by all the useless stuff people say in this forum ?

Leaderboard not working is what is actually killing PvP the most.

I’ve been posting it tons of times, losing 100 + ranks for a loss simply because you’re matched with full unranked randoms ( 9/10 unranked and ONLY YOU ranked as a 100-300 in leaderboard) is totally unrewarding and frustrating.

In the little time i had to play solo Q ( team queue has been dead for a long time, especially after meeting , as a pug group, altough all ranked around 500, top teams like NN )my experience has been terrible.

Totally broken matchmaking, mostly due to the fact that people above me had no reason to play ( and in fact, they were not playing) and i was matched with players not even in the leaderboard.

Rewards are horrible, there’s no incentive to play since you keep your ranking by not playing.

Competition is dead, and this is N.1 reason.

Volrath.1473:

Imo there are few players playing tournaments atm that if they don’t match the few ppl queuing with each other and wait for more ppl on the same “level” queues will never pop.

sPvP is so good atm that even top teams are “taking a break” or even quitting the game…

you should wonder about the reason why there are only few players ding tournaments.

Because you’re rewarded for NOT PLAYING.

The only real incentive for good players to play is the leaderboard ( since other rewards suck balls) and once in the leaderboard, you’re rewarded for not playing ( I MEAN , WTF LOL).

No wonders why people don’t play.

This is killing the game even more than the terribad meta, and not even devs but EVEN PLAYERS can’t understand it.

lol i had a chat with you about the issue someday ago while soloqueing.

The point is that higher tiered players don’t play, because they’ve no incentives.

They’re sitting at their 14-0 score and keep their top 50 status.

If they try to play there’s a chance they could lose, so they sync.

If they don’t sync, they don’t play at all.

It’s frustrating to come down from 300+ to 500 with a couple of losses simply because you get matched with totally unranked players ( because, you know, high tier players just don’t have any reason to play and lose rank).

This is THE MAIN reason why this game has no competition.

And i kinda feel good now that i’m Austria and can’t play: at least when i’ll be back i can hope for devs to have done something meanwhile ( hoping everyone won’t quit in this time, and i’m not THAT SURE it won’t happen).