Guild Wars 2

Recruitment is open again.

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Dodge_Instructor

just tank and problem solved

well i’ve made more money from 2 weeks of SAB drops not selling than i made from raids. But for the time it actually takes to clear it after reset its good g/h ;D

Breakbars in general are ok not perfect but ok, the fact that they at least in dungeons are only at a strength of 600 (6s worth of CC)and give you 50% damage boost is just ridiculous especialy since the removal of unshakeable (vulnerability duration reduced by 50%). This 2 things is what most people call powercreep even tho they think its the elite specs

you know that you can spend your shards? at least thats what im doing and im at 84/84 insights and i barely have shards

Astralporing.1957:

perry.9645:

Old 50 mosman would be one hell of a challenge today because the lack of cripple and chill, for reference old mosman used to oneshot elementalists with something as simple as an autoattack . Guardians rotating through blocks to “tank” mosman was something skilled to do while now well what is there to avoid if everything hits like a wet towel thrown by a toddler.

There was that one video with old mossman getting facetanked by a nomad warrior, remember?

new mossman can be facetanked by berserker warrior your argument?

Nightstormer.8526:

In the most reductionist sense…

Old moss: Line up skills correctly and get fast kill or die.

New moss: Go afk for 10 minutes and come back to clear your inventory from autoloot.

Old moss was executionally demanded in setup, though for optimal kills on new moss there’s more of an incentive to play well longer. Longer play motivates shifts toward playing the same way longer but that isn’t necessarily a bad thing.

I’ll maintain that with the shift toward longer fights in raids new moss does provide something of value as a target dummy setup to practice rotations daily, but the elegance and beauty of burst kills is certainly lost.

There’s something to be said for sustained rotation excellence though, and it yields rewards through efficiency in a similar way that burst kills did, if it does so less dramatically.

I absolutely have no problem with the fight being longer as long as it stays a challenge at higher levels but it simply doesn’t :/

Old 50 mosman would be one hell of a challenge today because the lack of cripple and chill, for reference old mosman used to oneshot elementalists with something as simple as an autoattack . Guardians rotating through blocks to “tank” mosman was something skilled to do while now well what is there to avoid if everything hits like a wet towel thrown by a toddler.

Rednik.3809:

perry.9645:

The same thing applies to fractals just that they also somehow decided to completely nerf any sort of threat the enemies were, Mossman on lvl 50 used to oneshot elementalists easily now he barely hits them below scholar.

Mossman on lvl 50 used to be dead in 10 seconds with double icebow and a competent thief. For some reason you forgot this.

yes but this required coordination and one kittenup could easily get you killed also 10s suure when even the record runs had 20s kills

I don’t play dungeons anymore because of the stupidity that is pve balance and the breakbar, doing dungeons when you had to work for might and vuln as well as coordinating CC was fun now its just plain stupid and boring.

It all started to die when they introduced Phalanx Strength and continued when they decided to nerf LH ele. The breakbar and removal of unshakeable was just the final nail in the coffin to me.

An upcoming buff to rewards however high it will be will not bring me or people I frequently play with back to dungeons because rewards were only a minor thing to most of em.

The same thing applies to fractals just that they also somehow decided to completely nerf any sort of threat the enemies were, Mossman on lvl 50 used to oneshot elementalists easily now he barely hits them below scholar.

I cant agree more to what nike said a over 90% failure rate for trials speaks for itself i would say. Dungeons were a great place for playerskill to develop and improve they require lots of actions in short time and unlike raids cooldown management out of combat movement and many more mechanical skills players nowadays seem to miss.

its fractal collection all over again, the achievement is out of sync with the wardrobe

Keksmuffin.1450:

I don’t know what’s more impressive. Weth commiting to his troll post that much or people actually falling for it.

nonono he’s 100% serious

You don’t need marauders to survive the missed greens protection is enough to survive it with 1k health left. Go for the most toughness in your group (preferably as least as possible) and this is how it can look like https://youtu.be/x_NMqxVQLFs

If your team has a lot of downs and your healer isn’t at the boss you can easily self sustain this is making thief a really save choice for tanking.

meanwhile people get kicked for having to many insights because they think its fake -.-

eldrin.6471:

The real problem here is that providing exclusive content for a fraction of your paying customers is economic suicide.

ok lets compare what “pro” players got and what casual players got

Casuals:
4 massive open world maps with tons of events
Story
tons of achievements and collections
still the same old tyria world and events

“pro”:
raids once a week
dungeons -66% of the reward
fractals -50+% of the playtime

so yeah they definitely provide exclusive content for “pros”

ok i give up ranger is apparently a full healer even tho everybody i know plays berserker/viper and we clear the raid every week with that.

Heibi.4251:

Specifically RANGERS as an entire class. You can’t say the other classes are shunned entirely. Rangers can only join if they run Druid. The other classes don’t have to really change what they actually do – DAMAGE. The ranger MUST change and become a healer only class. Get off your elitist bandwagon and stop mincing words.

Druid isnt a healer only class https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Eg9foRX6Svg full zerker only switching to staff when extra heal is needed and that cant be supplied by just CA and glyphs

Heibi.4251:

I beg to differ. RANGER is left out. The meta wont allow them and neither will the elitists. They are kicked immediately unless they run druid.

Same goes for warrior not taking tactics or ele not taking air i dont see your point. Its like saying i cant play how i want cause people want me to bring the best spec i can bring, its a teamgame you wont get far with egoism.

Blaeys.3102:

perry.9645:

@blaeys, People have been running double ranger/druid there is nothing thats bad about that also the difference between ranger and warrior is way way way smaller than between warrior and ele

My point is that, yes, some professions will always do more damage than others, but currently, those differences are way too disparate, which leads to exclusionary behavior.

A (arguably, THE) primary component of raiding is “kill fast.” Players proficient at professions that cannot “kill fast” are at a severe disadvantage and, thus, have fewer opportunities to raid. From a raid leader perspective, this means potentially leaving people (friends) out, even if they are really good at playing their profession.

The timers are so generous that no class is left out if played properly. There has been 10 guardian kills 10 necro kills and 10 tempest kills. Yes druid damage isnt high but the buffs they offer are well worth taking more than one also they aren’t forced to be healer, all encounters can be done without a dedicated healer. If you would go by the Kill Fast you would never take anything else than 2 mesmers for VG or 6 staff eles for gorse. People that want to go for the complete 100% optimal teamcomp while not wanting to set a speed record are just lacking mechanical skill to finish the encounter and want to compensate elsewhere.

@blaeys, People have been running double ranger/druid there is nothing thats bad about that also the difference between ranger and warrior is way way way smaller than between warrior and ele

This is gonna be interesting (i hope)

why do you guys wanna buy a glider that obviously should be a raid drop

Called it 2 months ago and was flamed for it :’) https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/Raid-Rewards/first#post5816623

This is a great idea and to some extend already exists in PvP post match screen, some additional things that should be included:

Damage taken
Breakbar damage dealt
(Self healing)
Revives/downs

I dont see any Problem this is how it works in every other mmo as well, once people know what to do they optimize for cleartime.

I dont understand whats the problem? I did no updraft without burnzerker before the daredevil buff on daredevil and without slow cc cheese. /shrug

Its funny how everybody complains about “OP” classes meanwhile there is Ele still doing more damage than everything else :’)

But i totally agree that thief should be more than just AA spam + dodge on staff to achieve highest dps, even with pre nerf CnD staff would still be stronger and more reliable but buffing the other skills would completely destroy everything in pvp. Thief is a hard to balance class especially with no split between pvp and pve (even tho pistolwhip and revealed is still split :P)

When each player in a raid enters combat, their boon prioritization will be locked in based on the composition of the subgroup they are currently in. That prioritization will not change until the player has left combat, even if their subgroup composition changes while they are in combat.

this nerfs mesmer and revenant at the same time

30 insights
-6minis (one double)
-no ascended
-no skins
-no infusion

Cloack and Dagger:
Unnerf the damage from the pvp pve merge to the old pve level
Increase initative cost to 7 but restore 2 initative on successful hit
Increase stealth duration to 4s from 3s
Blind nearby foes on cast (this will remove aegis before the hit connects)
Increased range to 200 from 130

This will make D/D a strong offensive set with high risk/reward, missing CnD might end up being fatal but hitting it becomes a bit easier.

ZudetGambeous.9573:

Anet is probably losing a ton of money on this item, which is why they waited so long to release it. The price is dirt cheap if you actually think about it.

Just take 2 useful items: Coper-fed, Unlimited mining pick

Previously if you wanted to have these 2 items on 3 different characters it would have cost you:

3x copper = 2400 gems
3x pick = 3000 gems

total = 5400 gems.

Many, many people have done this. Now however you can do

2x shared slot = 1400 gems
1x copper fed = 800 gems
1x pick = 1000 gems

total = 3200 gems

Just for 3 characters and 2 items you are saving over 2000 gems. Now imagine you have 20 characters and 5 items… Anet is potentially losing thousands of dollars from those players.

yes this is true but its still unfair for long term players that have these items and not offering refunds like they did for other changes is just beyond my understanding.

edit: also refunding wont cost them anything as they already have the money from said people, but what costs them something is reviewing every case separately instead of refunding.

Week 9 and I got a grand total of 0 ascended drops 0 infusions anybody else having terrible rng?

spoj.9672:

Id say the main reason for no motivation is because people are only focused on raids now. And maybe fractals will make a comeback when we get some new ones.

soon™ people will be doing the raids once a week and dungeon records might see a comeback tbh, personaly im kinda bored by raids and theorycrafting new dungeon records might be something to keep me busy.

When you look at other Games that get speedrun (Zelda comes to mind) they are the same for decades already and People still find new strategies with way less possibilities than we have in GW2.

What I also could see coming is Wingclear records one go no relog no defeat even tho strategies might be way more linear than dungeons (Portals<3) this could also be a competitive format where 2 guilds can directly compete against each other.

But yeah until this will happen its gonna take a while for people to get bored enough like it was with dungeons :P

Thaddeus.4891:

savacli.8172:

perry.9645:

Thaddeus.4891:

fishball.7204:

The raid loot kinda sucks. My friend 22 insights no mini, no asc and no ghostly infusions. I think he just uninstalled after raiding at raid reset last nite. gg

Add all the reward you get from raid dude. You can get around 20-30 gold per hours with a decent group. Not counting any huge drop like an infusions.

Wow 20-30g once a week :O meanwhile you can do the wintersday jumppuzzle for about the same reward endlessly

Even better, give me a pickaxe and a sickle so I can harvest nodes to continue that gold/hour rate once Wintersday ends.

So your point is that Raid reward isn’t worth a kitten if it’s not what like 30+gold per week?? Wtf.

ftfy

Thaddeus.4891:

fishball.7204:

The raid loot kinda sucks. My friend 22 insights no mini, no asc and no ghostly infusions. I think he just uninstalled after raiding at raid reset last nite. gg

Add all the reward you get from raid dude. You can get around 20-30 gold per hours with a decent group. Not counting any huge drop like an infusions.

Wow 20-30g once a week :O meanwhile you can do the wintersday jumppuzzle for about the same reward endlessly

they would need a new bucket for all the tears from people that can only make the dps check of gorseval cause they stack burnzerkers

you cant attune pre fractured rings its a known bug

new content is always harder than content that is 3 years old, it just takes practice

just had a match where one of my mates dced and reconnected we won basically 4v5 and got no pip on top of that we had to wait for his debuff to go away to reQ

A little Comparison to show the Reward balance.

Gathering tour
Time spent: 40minutes
Effort required: Waypointing running Pressing F
Cost: 40s waypoint costs gathering tools
Reward: 17g50s89c
Persons required: 1
Repeatable: as often as you want for similar Reward

Raid
Time spent: 50minutes
Effort required: 10 good Players playing in a organised group with voice communication
Costs: 2-3g worth of Food, Ascended gear and Teamspeak
Reward: 3g for all Events 4g per Boss + Exotic gear and a small RNG chance as well as Tokens
Persons required: 10
Repeatable: once a Week

This is with the Call of the Mists buff that doubles the current rewards. If you would do one Raid a Day and one Gathering Tour a Day, Gathering would net you ~122g a week while Raiding would get you ~33g at the cost of 14g worth of Food with the Risk of Failure or People being late/lagging.

Of course this wont be much of a Problem anymore with future Raids giving us more to do and more Chances to get good Drops (RNG yay) and even this Drops can be completely useless for the Player that gets em while other Players desperately need em for their Builds (Vipers accessories back pieces etc).

icewyrm.5038:

In your initial post, you say that raids are “on farm”. In your most recent post, you go on to say that additional liquid gold rewards wont do much to the economy because “only a minority of the Playerbase will be able to even complete the Content”.

I was a bit unclear on this I guess, but yeah i meant to say that for the Guilds that Cleared the Raids its pretty much on “farm” status even tho there is nothing to farm more than once a Week and even then its mostly RNG.

icewyrm.5038:

So which is it – are raids too easy or not? The impression I get from your various combined statements overall suggests to me that you want to be able to continuously farm raids for gold and other material rewards, so you don’t have to spend time earning your gold in other parts of the game like everyone else (who doesn’t have raids “on farm” as it were).

Raid Difficulty is definitely on a good Spot for the first Raid of the game and my Suggestion was more of a Future change as lots of Players eventually will be in the same Situation, if i really want to Farm Gold i wouldn’t even do Raids. But I do them multiple times a week to help others get their Loot while not receiving any.

icewyrm.5038:

Next you suggest that materials required for legendary crafting should drop from raids. Completing the raids is already a requirement for various legendary collection pieces. You seem to be suggesting that raids should act as a replacement for other in game activities such as material gathering and crafting, is this your intention?

The Materials shouldn’t only drop from Raids ofc (with the exception of Legendary Armor rewards) but there has to be some incentive to do a Raid more than once a Week when the Initial Hype around them is over. Raids shouldn’t be a replacement but a alternative to materials as Leyline Sparks, Airship Oil, Auric Dust and Crystalline Ore as we can already earn things like Obsidian Shards in Fractals.

icewyrm.5038:

On your final point, you suggest that token rewards should be changed so that clearing a boss gives you a daily token reward and their should be a cap on shards from failed attempts.

While I agree that boss clears should reward more tokens than they do currently (whether this is a once a day or a once a week reward), capping shards earned from failures is a terrible idea. There is already a weekly cap on shards. There’s no reason to punish people who do their best to clear the boss but are simply unable to for whatever reason. They are losing money via consumables the whole time and aren’t even getting a chance at the weekly RNG drops, after all. I’m fairly certain the entire point of the shards is a consolation prize for those who lost out on drops in the first place.

The Token reward is indeed in a weird place right now, but awarding Failing more than succeeding isn’t the way to get Players feel rewarded when they after finally defeating a Boss get less rewards than Failing it (Talking pure guaranteed rewards here not RNG).

icewyrm.5038:

I appeal to your sense of empathy, and urge you to see it from the perspective of all players (including those who do not have the raids “on farm” as you said earlier) when putting forward these types of suggestions in future.

I try to see it in a general perspective the Reward discussion will come up again once more Players consider Raids on “farm” and even more when the next Wing releases. I just bring it up now because Raids are still new and maybe Suggestions can be implemented easier than further down the line. Rewards are a very difficult thing to balance and discuss as everybody feels rewarded differently and we don’t really have a clue how it affects the Economy without any Insight or Statistics.

JoshuaRAWR.4653:

Raids are most definitely not “on farm” by most people lmao, what are you smoking?

Did I ever mention them beeing on “farm” by most people? I’m not smoking anything but thanks for asking.

I’m just gonna ignore assumptions made against my and other peoples play style as this isn’t part of the Discussion, even tho “supposed basement dwellers” sounds more funny than insulting.

Rewards don’t have to be just gold, what about Rewarding Boss kills with Ascended Crafting Materials that are otherwise just found in Content no Raider wants to do but has to do to get Legendary Gear.
A bit of liquid Gold wont do much to the Economy as only a minority of the Playerbase will be able to even complete the Content unlike it was for Dungeons.
Also the Token Reward needs to be changed as its currently more efficient to wipe to Bosses to get Tokens and a Full clear will not even get your Tokens halfway to the Cap. How about Caping the Tokens for Wipes and Fails but add a Daily Token Reward for Boss kills.

tluv.5821:

perry.9645:

Raids are pretty much on Farm right now

What? That’s hilarious. Perhaps for your group who raids multiple times a week for several hours and have a perfect comp and competent people. This is perhaps the most ridiculous QQ post about raids I’ve read on these forums. Raids are VERY far from Farm status.

Farm status means a group can go in. Any random group, and do it without communication nearly every time.

Your definition is different from mine then, still point remains Rewards are not what they should be for the hardest content available.

dominik.9721:

Yes you really don’t get it.
You are all complaining about raids being a joke and then think some nice rewards would fix this.
If you won’t do the raids again because you enjoy the content but would do it if you get some sweet nice rewards, you defintly should keep farming your chests in silverwastes or swap to some asian grinder like I said before.

And pls before you are typing your answer in the chatbox try to read and comprehend
Allthough, I’m out anyways not interested to waste my time with this shiaat.

Why are we not allowed to get rewards for something we find fun? Raids are fun but the rewards are gated, Silverwaste is boring but the Rewards are endless. This is not something i would call balanced Rewards for the hardest Content if you can just go and run circles for more and endless Rewards while you have to wait 1 week for the challenge to give you Rewards again.

Rewarding good players for beeing good is bad now? Ok i go back to Silverwastes and press F while running circles and get more gold for that without any weekly/daily lockout.
Don’t get me wrong Raids are fun and challenging but once people seen eough of it in a few months nobody will do them because the rewards are to low

After 3 weeks of raiding and multiple Clears I got 1 Minipet + a bit of Gold same goes for a lot of People I play with. Maybe Loot or at least the Gold should be daily with the option to reset your Progression manually.
Raids are pretty much on Farm right now but there is 0 incentive to do them more than once a Week, you cant even do them more than once except you got someone else to open it for you. Once the initial Hype around Raids is over the Rewards look really bad.

Scandi.5693:

They add all of these new stat sets to the game, then not only force people to use zerker for raids because of the timer, but also force certain classes as well. So you are a zerk dps or condi engineer, other than that bugger off…Remove the timer and let people form groups with whom they wish. The mechanics are fun and challenging enough without timer. At the very least make the time limit doable for more class-build combos.

Full zerker/viper Teams beat Bosses with multiple minutes left on the Timer, you are nowhere near forced to bring certain Professions/Gear and even then the enrage isn’t even a hard enrage (except gorseval).

how to tank as thief: Invigorating precision

/thread

The rewards are good if the gold would be daily, because after one clear you end up with only 60+ Shards and basically a Week without Rewards other than Shards.
Helping others gives you nothing but costs for Food and that’s not how it should be, to re-clear with some gold rewards should be at least be a option.