i’m expecting a huge balance patch, God only knows where it will leave druid after, but prior to seasons returning in January(i think) they’re going to have to patch and tune a few things.
with all the pvp whine i’m expecting more nerfs for druid…
something like 80% of a condi engis damage comes from having that main stat condi on every piece
rabid/sinister/viper is better than carrion/dire until you have enough crit to consistently proc napalm specialist, then it doesnt really matter
that was his question guys, not “what is optimal”
just dont go rampager
mind if I ask why? at least with ramapager your still getting power as opposed to rabid where you get increased condi dmg but lose out on a bunk of power. I only ask because i just finished my viper gear and am working on the sinister trinkets now but i’ve been using rampager for the time being.
i’m just sharing this, all credit goes to DEKeyz2Chaos and DnT, it’s a good build guide for raid healing. on Vale Guardian i’d drop the second spirit for the knockback glyph.
Thank you very much.
I see that both builds have very high armour, don’t you have aggro problems?
Most people are using Magi gear and weapons and, if you can get them, magi accessories to reduce toughness as much as possible. the lowest toughness tank is the mesmer tank and he’s at around 1400 toughness, try to stay below that. If the tank goes down and you have the second highest toughness realize that you can still get aggro.
after considering it myself it comes down to a different question: staff or anything else?
without staff AF generation is slow so you can’t really be a reliable healer. With staff you can’t really apply many condi’s and if you’re healing then you should be primarily in CAF as often as possible.
I’d like to hear your opinions on going into a raid as a dps ranger, be it power or condi, and pick druid traitline over <that-other-traitline>, primarily to help boost your groups damage through grace of the land (CA #3 & #4 first of all) and glyph of empowerment and secondarily as a support healer, do you think you would sacrifice too much by not picking that other traitline you’d normally choose over druid? Also you get another blast finsiher that you may not normally have access to as a dps ranger (CA #3).
The easiest thing to drop out of either DPS build would be BM/NM. Power ranger is dependent on MM and Skirm, Condi ranger is dependent on Skirm and gains dps from WS.
without running staff you may not always have that blast finisher available and you’d be less able to buff your team with GoL. I’d rather take BM over druid in a dps setup and use the shout trait to spam regen. just my opinion.
Magi+Clerics with as many Magi pieces as possible seems to be the best way if you want to go full heals. The unfortunate drawback is that this gear is useless in anything other than raids.
I think i’d rather go in as viper/sinister condi DPS and sacrifice GoL. A lot of groups are calling for condi players and condi ranger was almost as good as sinister engi prepatch. I’m not sure how the numbers are since then but it should still be close.
The thing about magi stat, is that its so easy to get. And because this set its all about the healing power, exotic gear doing the same as ascended. Its a risk free low invesment gear set. Thats why I recommaned it as the first healer gear to try out.
Regarding condi builds – from what I understand, engi can stack in burnings what ranger can stack in bleeds , so the gap is quite huge. Not sure about that….
yea I know condi engi has gotten better but i didn’t think the gap had widened that much. I think it still puts us as second best condi class unless condi reaper/necro has gotten that much better as well. I know there was some improvement there as well.
I agree Magi works for a healing druid but most of the groups i’ve pugged with want you to ping your ascended gear, they don’t care that the difference isn’t much if your not running full ascended gear and weapons. that was why I was looking into an apothecary or nomad build, sacrifice damage for tanking and still be able to heal.
Thats annoying, go explain to pugs that having ~90 healing power difference at the level of 1200+ healing power menas nothing as you overheal by tons anyway while your strong heals are out of CD. And having exta 10 heal on your regen ticks, doesnt count for much. They also want you to get that healing sigil that costs like 50g on TP? It makes much more difference compared to exotic vs ascended.
your 100% right but there’s just no arguing with some people. The cost is what kept me from going glassy zealots, magi’s fairly cheap so just the cost of the sigil won’t be too bad.
Rev heals well and so does Ele but I think, even though we’re not as bursty as we could be, we provide more on-demand burst healing than any class. Also by not tying things to boons like regen we can heal in CAF and still provide regen to compliment that healing. I really think some synergy needs to be found with using regen and AF heals.
I was looking into it, but here are the reasons why I don’t think druid tank will work, part of it is from Brazil’s guilds Vale Guardian Kill and from my own.
1. druid dps doesn’t matter – it just doesn’t, you really only need 8 dps that actually know how to do their job to clear the entire raid. your job is to keep them all alive.
2. for condi to work well you need A/T and although you can generate AF from regen you won’t be able to enter CAF often enough to keep your group up. If the druid is going to tank you’d probably have to still bring a healer
3. Healing will always be needed in the raids, there are certain points where you take consistent unavoidable damage. It won’t be enough to down everyone but i’ve seen a few raid wipes just from people not hitting the circles twice because someone downed.
this is most likely how i’m going to gear my druid, I’ve been working on an engi for raiding and that was going to be my raid toon only. I think I may make my ranger my raid toon and craft exotics for PvE. it seems like everyone wants ppl in ascended for raiding.
Magi+Clerics with as many Magi pieces as possible seems to be the best way if you want to go full heals. The unfortunate drawback is that this gear is useless in anything other than raids.
I think i’d rather go in as viper/sinister condi DPS and sacrifice GoL. A lot of groups are calling for condi players and condi ranger was almost as good as sinister engi prepatch. I’m not sure how the numbers are since then but it should still be close.
The thing about magi stat, is that its so easy to get. And because this set its all about the healing power, exotic gear doing the same as ascended. Its a risk free low invesment gear set. Thats why I recommaned it as the first healer gear to try out.
Regarding condi builds – from what I understand, engi can stack in burnings what ranger can stack in bleeds , so the gap is quite huge. Not sure about that….
yea I know condi engi has gotten better but i didn’t think the gap had widened that much. I think it still puts us as second best condi class unless condi reaper/necro has gotten that much better as well. I know there was some improvement there as well.
I agree Magi works for a healing druid but most of the groups i’ve pugged with want you to ping your ascended gear, they don’t care that the difference isn’t much if your not running full ascended gear and weapons. that was why I was looking into an apothecary or nomad build, sacrifice damage for tanking and still be able to heal.
Magi+Clerics with as many Magi pieces as possible seems to be the best way if you want to go full heals. The unfortunate drawback is that this gear is useless in anything other than raids.
I think i’d rather go in as viper/sinister condi DPS and sacrifice GoL. A lot of groups are calling for condi players and condi ranger was almost as good as sinister engi prepatch. I’m not sure how the numbers are since then but it should still be close.
so i raided earlier today, first time in raid since the AF patch. AF generation is certainly slower although not gamebreaking in raids. zealots might be the best power gear but i really feel that with the staff our power dps is lacking. has anyone put together a viable condition based raid healer?
I was thinking Apothecary might be possible since then you could heal/tank or you could go viper/zealots maybe and sacrifice the strong healing for more dps. Thoughts?
I’m by no means an expert on this at all, but the setup I saw I liked the most was Brazil’s twitch kill of vale guardian. He had 9 DPSers and 1 full nomads druid. The druid worked as both tank and healer, which makes a ton of sense considering DPS specs typically cluster around a boss. Combined with sinister engis blasting waterfields on lightning circles, everything just made sense.
I have a baby fluffling due in like a day or so, so I’m not planning on getting good at raids for a very long time if ever due to obvious time constraints, but it’s fun to at least watch the progression. Can’t wait to see more people attempting the later bosses.
congrats on the baby! I’ve raised 2 and that’s enough lol
I watched that kill and i’m thinking I want to gear that way with exotics, i’d rather not craft a whole new set of ascended for raids.
Honestly at this point it looks like it really doesnt matter what gear we use, it all comes down to individual skill among all 10 and how they synergize their skills. If ur everyone is dodging/avoiding blue and orange circles with right gear, ur job as a druid is a breeze. I have no exp with bosses after vale tho, i just hope i didnt waste all that gold into zealots for nothing
Pretty much this, we’ve seen groups do it without a druid now, it all comes down to skill at the end of the day. Give it a couple of weeks and we will probably see more people opt for more DPS over a druid.
that’s whats concerning me now, hopefully the deeper raid wings require more than just slight healing because raids are being cleared with or without a druid now.
Yeah, I would be very surprised if the only thing that would count vs the raid bosses are maxed out dps. And I would be very disappointed if that was the case.
Well, if it goes back to DPS only the developers should consider that a failure. Raiding was supposed to bring into play a supporting role with healing in mind. If it turns out this isn’t the case one would have to ask why have a Druid at all.
We had a squad consisting of 2 condi eng, 2 heralds, 1 warri for aggro keep, 1 chrono, 1 thief, 1 reaper and 2 druids. The other druid ran clerics and I kinda experimented with the builds.
We didnt had any problems with the dps, entered his last phase with 2min+ on the timer pretty consistent but never cleared it.
First I ran the standart Spotter ranger build with zerker Marksmanship/Skirmishing/Beastmastery and bow+sword/axe but was told to switch to druid after 2 runs. 2 Clerics kinda overhealed it, so I went with Zerker Druid with bow/staff at the end.
For utility I used the glyph heal,frost spirit, pushback glyph for the red thingies, dps glyph and the elite glyph for mostly grace of the land stacking.
What did you guys used for runes? I put druids into my clerics but have a hard time telling if they’re optimal or not.
I ran Monk runes, i’d rather have the flat 10% buff to heals than an occasional spike to HP. I ran all spirits except for my heal, I ran the glyph heal, and that actually worked pretty well.
if you’re going in as dps then yes zerk would be meta, you might want to consider slotting in some vit gear though since there is a lot of aoe damage in raids.
if you’re planning on healing as druid i’d go cleric and add in as much zerk or zealot($$) as you feel comfortable with.
Would be great if people could share their experiences in the raid as healing druids. Please share gear and utility skills, and impressions.
Personally i had success with nesrly full zealot. It doest look like we need the extra vitality in the first boss as if someone misses the circle ur raid takes a hit % based on max hp and not a set damage number? Also, did u notice any difference with healing vs zerker druid, i hear some claim that healing can be done in zerk gear, to me that says the entire raid group didnt take to much dmg, how true is it?
I found sitting in staff being a thing also thanks to great AF regen from traited healing spring and signet of the wild (tho maybe filling a utility slot wit it is lazy play). Im unsure whst was better vs elite spirit and glyph, perhaps the elite glyph is better for burst healing if someone messes up, your thoughts on traited elite spirit?
I was pretty much ok with just using CA form skill 4 and 3, while at times i was using 1 when sitting at range in circle, your experiences here?
I ran a mix of clerics and zerk gear. with food I had about 1k healing power plus modifiers and the heals where good but not as high as they could have been. I think I may add on more healing power and keep the modifiers. we got the boss down to about 20% but kept hitting the enrage timer.
I think the heals are good enough at around 1k healing power but there’s no harm in overhealing and the group may be able to go more offensive if you’re able to keep them topped off.
Side note, to the poor fella struggling with Druids I came across a heck of a duo last night in WvW. DH/Druid pair. Pound for pound I would say they had a solid build and knew how to work together. Didn’t matter the number of players that engaged they either won, held their ground, or had the ability to escape and reset when overwhelming (Zerg) numbers engaged.
Do you think those of us who fought them came to the forums and cried foul? Or, do you think maybe we messages them, said kitten fine job, lick our wounds, and figure out how to deal with it the next time?
Maybe you just got beat, out played, by a better player? Did you ever consider that?
that would be a nasty duo to run into, power + condi traps and all that aoe on the ground….
if they where both running trapper runes and stealthing that would be even worse
it’s a tradeoff, a choice, use a glyph in one form and you don’t get to use it in the other. —--save glyph of unity for heals, the damage isn’t that great but the healing could keep the party up
—tides is better as a push than a pull, especially in this raid content.
—daze on equality, imo, is better than a group stunbreak in raids. we didn’t get stunned much at all
—you have to choose who needs the healing more with Rejuvenation, you or the party, if it’s the party wait to use it in CA form. I used the trait that gave an extra heal from me and pet when i used a heal skill so in either form it gave a good party heal.
—if you’re using empowerment it should always be used in ranger form for dps boost to the party. i could only see using it in CAF if you’re going to go for a coordinated mass heal with the party.
against stationary targets a/t vipers is better than zerker but it’s also dependent on food for condition duration.
zerker is better against moving targets or in content where you need to move around more, still deals good damage at range and isn’t as dependent on food.
Also the fact is that druid tanks super hard in pvp also and does good damage. Watch Helseths duels against druids for example and listen to his comments. You can’t deny those.
I ran clerics trinkets and zerk gear, the heals felt great. I was able to contribute something more than just some dps. I ran almost full spirits, everything but the heal, and all the boons where useful and helped the party.
im tempted to go nomads armor and cleric trinkets
that’s probably too tanky, DPS is still needed for sure
I ran clerics trinkets and zerk gear, the heals felt great. I was able to contribute something more than just some dps. I ran almost full spirits, everything but the heal, and all the boons where useful and helped the party.
…Has anyone been in yet on any profession? Any hints,tips,tricks you could mention or things we need to know. I work until early evening so I won’t get to play for at least 4-6 hours.
staff dps either needs to be increased or condis added to it to make condition druids more viable.
I think that’s my only complaint right now, CAF being so tied to Staff is fine as long as it’s a viable weapon for both condi and power builds. The quickdraw bonfire build would be a lot more useful with staff on swap if it could apply condi as well. This would also make it a better replacement for LB in a power build if it applied non damaging condis like vuln/cripple etc.
However, if you’re dancing in melee range with a zerk-heavy group, that may not be the same situation.
I do that to give my allies Glyph + Grace of the land and still don’t grab aggro.
One of the raid bosses is set up with different aggro mechanics, he particularly keys off the player with the highest toughness. Unless someone else in the group is running toughness gear you may pull aggro. I think this is what they are referring to when they mention toughness pulling aggro.
Eh, there’s no reason to go axe on a power build. Either you go longbow so that you can stay ranged or you go sword to go melee.
Axe’s damage is pretty weak and the might on attack is easily wasted in an organized group.
Additionally, longbow will give burst potential, which is particularly advantageous for something like a druid that will often be using staff to generate CAF.
Sure, you lose the blast and boons of warhorn, but other professions can keep up the boons more easily (revenant/PS war, for instance) and a blast isn’t important enough to outweigh other disadvantages of axe/warhorn.
I’ll most likely use Sword once raids starts so I can keep the blast on warhorn along with the blast on staff 3. As much as I love LB i’d rather not have 2 “ranged” weapons. My offhand set tends to swap based on the content anyway.
if your the only ranger you’re still going to need skirmishing and spotter, thats a pretty important buff. the bleed on crit trait adds a little dps and is a better choice than the trap trait in your original build. its a personal choice at this point between NM for party buffs or BM for dps.
I left the Pink Moa off because it almost never hits. I’m going to have to test and see if the pet taunt triggers perplexity runes, i haven’t paid that much attention tbh.
I know i can keep 3-5 stacks of confusion on a target almost permanently though
yes you can do 1k from you and 1k from your pet, adjusted higher based on healing power, anytime you use a heal skill. They do mean your healing skill so it only counts against that skill. I don’t know if it has an internal cooldown but WHaO traited at 16s pops it everytime.
I agree with Dresden on the pets, also I would slot Bountiful Hunter in NM rather than Instinctive Reaction. Your health should be lower than 50% and the % damage buff from BH is better than IR buff occasionally. I’d also slot Sun Spirit over GoA and Nature’s Vengeance to bring a few boons to help the party out. The healing from IB is nice but that’s what CAF is for.
+1, it would make CAF much more useful than it is now if you could actually plan out the use of glyphs/heals while in CAF rather than just mash buttons before time runs out.
the only thing that concerns me, and we’ll see proof on the 17th, is that if raids are structured like high end fractals (80+) then we’ll see most mobs having very high toughness making power builds and buffs to power very weak. In that case frost spirit and GoE would be less useful but make GoL much stronger. if people where more condi focused it would also make sun spirit and storm spirit better since vuln effects conditions now.
I don’t think that anyone will need to explicitly try to bring anything for the sake of vuln in raids. It’s a very commonplace condition and will likely be easily stacked to 25 with a party of 10 people without anyone trying.
As for Frost Spirit, does anyone know for sure if the 10% bonus damage is only for power-based damage? The wording makes it sound a bit more open to any type of damage.
However, even if it is only power damage, a straight damage boost to 5 people is worth taking even if toughness negated its advantage in half.
it’s definitely only for power damage, the same as GoE.
so, for the people who’ve been around a long time you’ll remember Xsorus’s technobabble and pain inverter builds. They where awesome in wvw. posting an updated version of the build i’ve been using in wvw roaming. you can swap LR with pain inverter and have an additional source of confusion.
bird taunts, GoE and technobabble are all interrupts that can proc the perplexity runes.
