Guild Wars 2

kyro.8162:

Ruin.3461:

Based on your post, isn’t your post itself running the same “no true scotsman” fallacy as mine?

You keep using that phrase. I do not think it means what you think it means.

The fallacy itself is called the no true scotsman fallacy, which is part of a informal fallacy.

Yes, and it doesn’t apply to his post.

Based on your post, isn’t your post itself running the same “no true scotsman” fallacy as mine?

You keep using that phrase. I do not think it means what you think it means.

Inverted.7439:

So… i’m quite new in T1 but i was just wondering. Does everyone dance/laugh on your corpse or is it just most people?

I play a thief so I never have this problem.

Valin.4527:

So they based their combat on positioning, evasion, dodging, etc….and now creating a condition that penalizes that?

F’n epic.

They also based combat on attacking stuff, and whenever people called for nerfs on conditions that penalized that, people cried about it.
“Uh, you could try just standing still” (Note that I don’t really agree that this condition is a good thing for the game either).

Torment would make Dancing Dagger not total garbage, so that would be nice.

Israel.7056:

If Anet has a problem with players using multi-monitors or whatever else to gain an advantage over other players then they should do something about it. It’s not the playerbase’s responsibility to deal with these sorts of things.

You’re right, it isn’t. Which is why ANet should patch it out of the game. Our little argument was not over whether it was player’s faults for abusing this, but rather whether it should exist in the game at all.

LetoII.3782:

And… Resorts to crass insults.
That’s a point for me, good day sir!

So you were serious? Is it then a point for me that you failed to respond to any of my points and continually repeated that people who spend more money are entitled to advantages?

LetoII.3782:

Ruin.3461:

LetoII.3782:

You insist on referring to better equipment than your own as “abusing”
Yet, for people resenting us and our fancy double digit framerates it’s a too bad.

How does one hand not wash the other?

If you had actually read my post, you would have realized that I stated that the framerate issues are also a problem, just one that isn’t as easily solveable. Issues like these are not the fault of the playerbase for buying the game and using the equipment they have; it’s design flaws that allow external factors to give players an advantage in the first place. Ideally, player performance should be wholly encompassed within the game space. This obviously isn’t feasible given hardware needs for large wvw battles, because ANet’s engine can’t keep up with their game mode – one or both are at fault here. The multi-monitor issues are easily fixable, however, and they don’t really have any excuses for allowing them to persist.

Aha! You have activated my trap card.

I wanted to believe you were trolling this whole time, but I honestly thought you were that stupid, my apologies.

LetoII.3782:

You insist on referring to better equipment than your own as “abusing”
Yet, for people resenting us and our fancy double digit framerates it’s a too bad.

How does one hand not wash the other?

If you had actually read my post, you would have realized that I stated that the framerate issues are also a problem, just one that isn’t as easily solveable. Issues like these are not the fault of the playerbase for buying the game and using the equipment they have; it’s design flaws that allow external factors to give players an advantage in the first place. Ideally, player performance should be wholly encompassed within the game space. This obviously isn’t feasible given hardware needs for large wvw battles, because ANet’s engine can’t keep up with their game mode – one or both are at fault here. The multi-monitor issues are easily fixable, however, and they don’t really have any excuses for allowing them to persist.

LetoII.3782:

Ruin.3461:

LetoII.3782:

Ruin.3461:

LetoII.3782:

Ruin.3461:

LetoII.3782:

mallas.9836:

Wasn’t the superbox bug with zooming removed or said to be an exploit, yet a program is allowed to exploit (as what Kyro said)to use graphics bug (or something that is not suppose to be, the gap in the door) in conjuction with a program to kill people?

Leto, that also is a extremely unsmart comment. Computer or lack of a good system is one thing. Using a outside program to gain an advantage when a in game bug gave the same effect, but was consider an exploit, is so much different.

The point is its one guild’s commander. Whether or not its all of SoR or just 1 person. I assume that guild isn’t a tiny guild and this is a commander which is 2 huge things. Also you guys/girls coming in and defending that person for using, at best, shady tactics after all the we just want good fights talk from SoR, is pretty hilarious.

Like hell.
I have a late model system and a razer naga. You trying to tell me some poor schlub chugging along in a zerg fight at 4 fps and skill clicking has a chance against me? You saying thats fair? He has no chance, I’ll run circles around the poor guy. I see it all the time, usually a ranged toon trying to tab a target he can hit with no clue I’m standing at his knees about to burst him..

It’s no different than someone buying a triple monitor setup, I wont cuz I like the view my wife and I have of our backyard between our monitors. Heck, I don’t even have arrowcart mastery. But thats not the point, the point I’m making here is the ones that DO have this equipment deserve to use it. And the people complaining about it are basically setting the bar juuuuust above their own price range. This is the unpolishable kitten of the whole argument.

What you’re describing is called Pay-to-win, and it’s widely regarded as terrible design, both when intentionally implemented, and unintentionally implemented. Would you be fine with statistical buffs granted to players that purchase gems with real money? What if these buffs stacked the more you bought? Spending more money on a game is not a license for in-game advantages.

What you’re arguing for is your own equipment being the best acceptable.

Not at all. I’m arguing that external factors should be removed to the greatest degree possible in any competitive format in any game. This is always the goal of competition. Do you think it should be subverted because this is an mmo and we shouldn’t have standards here? What you’re arguing for is advantages that have nothing to do with your actual gameplay.

There IS in fact an upper limit to this pay curve, it’s the best tech available. I don’t have it, you don’t have it, some do. But to disallow better equipment than your own, yet not make mention of inferior systems no doubt many players of lesser means are making do with is quite ironic. Would your argument be that we should all be handicapped to the minimum specifications for the game, would that not actually be the level playing field?

Increased specifications ideally allow for increased graphical fidelity with no framerate drops or stuttering. The game should be playable, at low settings, with minimal framerate drops and stuttering on the minimum specifications. That’s why they’re minimum specifications, the game is playable on those specifications. Better hardware should not confer any competitive advantages.

Minimum specifications are usable in PvE and sPvP.
I in fact spent the first month of the game with a pc quite close the those requirements. With 20 people in the area, friend and foe combined, everything bottomed out, 2-4 fps. That machine was late model in Warhammer Online days, junk for this. That is the truth of the situation in WvW, a lot of people playing are essentially victims in waiting. Like I said, that feces is indeed unpolishable

Yes, that’s because ANet kittened up. But it’s a difficult task to make a large scale fight in an mmo (important part here) run well on lower end machines. It’s incredibly easy to stop people from abusing multi-monitor setups.

kyro.8162:

Ruin.3461:

LetoII.3782:

Ruin.3461:

LetoII.3782:

mallas.9836:

Wasn’t the superbox bug with zooming removed or said to be an exploit, yet a program is allowed to exploit (as what Kyro said)to use graphics bug (or something that is not suppose to be, the gap in the door) in conjuction with a program to kill people?

Leto, that also is a extremely unsmart comment. Computer or lack of a good system is one thing. Using a outside program to gain an advantage when a in game bug gave the same effect, but was consider an exploit, is so much different.

The point is its one guild’s commander. Whether or not its all of SoR or just 1 person. I assume that guild isn’t a tiny guild and this is a commander which is 2 huge things. Also you guys/girls coming in and defending that person for using, at best, shady tactics after all the we just want good fights talk from SoR, is pretty hilarious.

Like hell.
I have a late model system and a razer naga. You trying to tell me some poor schlub chugging along in a zerg fight at 4 fps and skill clicking has a chance against me? You saying thats fair? He has no chance, I’ll run circles around the poor guy. I see it all the time, usually a ranged toon trying to tab a target he can hit with no clue I’m standing at his knees about to burst him..

It’s no different than someone buying a triple monitor setup, I wont cuz I like the view my wife and I have of our backyard between our monitors. Heck, I don’t even have arrowcart mastery. But thats not the point, the point I’m making here is the ones that DO have this equipment deserve to use it. And the people complaining about it are basically setting the bar juuuuust above their own price range. This is the unpolishable kitten of the whole argument.

What you’re describing is called Pay-to-win, and it’s widely regarded as terrible design, both when intentionally implemented, and unintentionally implemented. Would you be fine with statistical buffs granted to players that purchase gems with real money? What if these buffs stacked the more you bought? Spending more money on a game is not a license for in-game advantages.

What you’re arguing for is your own equipment being the best acceptable.

Not at all. I’m arguing that external factors should be removed to the greatest degree possible in any competitive format in any game. This is always the goal of competition. Do you think it should be subverted because this is an mmo and we shouldn’t have standards here? What you’re arguing for is advantages that have nothing to do with your actual gameplay.

So basically you’re saying we should all get a Xbox one or ps4 then? Because there are TONS of different types of rigs with thousands if not millions of possibilities to build upon. With many mice, different keyboards, bigger monitors, multiple monitors, dual video cards, making the PC have a huge external factor. And you are saying they should be removed to the greatest degree. Xbox one, Steam box, HERE WE COME!

Real Time Strategy games have been doing this just fine for decades.

LetoII.3782:

Ruin.3461:

LetoII.3782:

Ruin.3461:

LetoII.3782:

mallas.9836:

Wasn’t the superbox bug with zooming removed or said to be an exploit, yet a program is allowed to exploit (as what Kyro said)to use graphics bug (or something that is not suppose to be, the gap in the door) in conjuction with a program to kill people?

Leto, that also is a extremely unsmart comment. Computer or lack of a good system is one thing. Using a outside program to gain an advantage when a in game bug gave the same effect, but was consider an exploit, is so much different.

The point is its one guild’s commander. Whether or not its all of SoR or just 1 person. I assume that guild isn’t a tiny guild and this is a commander which is 2 huge things. Also you guys/girls coming in and defending that person for using, at best, shady tactics after all the we just want good fights talk from SoR, is pretty hilarious.

Like hell.
I have a late model system and a razer naga. You trying to tell me some poor schlub chugging along in a zerg fight at 4 fps and skill clicking has a chance against me? You saying thats fair? He has no chance, I’ll run circles around the poor guy. I see it all the time, usually a ranged toon trying to tab a target he can hit with no clue I’m standing at his knees about to burst him..

It’s no different than someone buying a triple monitor setup, I wont cuz I like the view my wife and I have of our backyard between our monitors. Heck, I don’t even have arrowcart mastery. But thats not the point, the point I’m making here is the ones that DO have this equipment deserve to use it. And the people complaining about it are basically setting the bar juuuuust above their own price range. This is the unpolishable kitten of the whole argument.

What you’re describing is called Pay-to-win, and it’s widely regarded as terrible design, both when intentionally implemented, and unintentionally implemented. Would you be fine with statistical buffs granted to players that purchase gems with real money? What if these buffs stacked the more you bought? Spending more money on a game is not a license for in-game advantages.

What you’re arguing for is your own equipment being the best acceptable.

Not at all. I’m arguing that external factors should be removed to the greatest degree possible in any competitive format in any game. This is always the goal of competition. Do you think it should be subverted because this is an mmo and we shouldn’t have standards here? What you’re arguing for is advantages that have nothing to do with your actual gameplay.

There IS in fact an upper limit to this pay curve, it’s the best tech available. I don’t have it, you don’t have it, some do. But to disallow better equipment than your own, yet not make mention of inferior systems no doubt many players of lesser means are making do with is quite ironic. Would your argument be that we should all be handicapped to the minimum specifications for the game, would that not actually be the level playing field?

Increased specifications ideally allow for increased graphical fidelity with no framerate drops or stuttering. The game should be playable, at low settings, with minimal framerate drops and stuttering on the minimum specifications. That’s why they’re minimum specifications, the game is playable on those specifications. Better hardware should not confer any competitive advantages.

LetoII.3782:

Ruin.3461:

LetoII.3782:

mallas.9836:

Wasn’t the superbox bug with zooming removed or said to be an exploit, yet a program is allowed to exploit (as what Kyro said)to use graphics bug (or something that is not suppose to be, the gap in the door) in conjuction with a program to kill people?

Leto, that also is a extremely unsmart comment. Computer or lack of a good system is one thing. Using a outside program to gain an advantage when a in game bug gave the same effect, but was consider an exploit, is so much different.

The point is its one guild’s commander. Whether or not its all of SoR or just 1 person. I assume that guild isn’t a tiny guild and this is a commander which is 2 huge things. Also you guys/girls coming in and defending that person for using, at best, shady tactics after all the we just want good fights talk from SoR, is pretty hilarious.

Like hell.
I have a late model system and a razer naga. You trying to tell me some poor schlub chugging along in a zerg fight at 4 fps and skill clicking has a chance against me? You saying thats fair? He has no chance, I’ll run circles around the poor guy. I see it all the time, usually a ranged toon trying to tab a target he can hit with no clue I’m standing at his knees about to burst him..

It’s no different than someone buying a triple monitor setup, I wont cuz I like the view my wife and I have of our backyard between our monitors. Heck, I don’t even have arrowcart mastery. But thats not the point, the point I’m making here is the ones that DO have this equipment deserve to use it. And the people complaining about it are basically setting the bar juuuuust above their own price range. This is the unpolishable kitten of the whole argument.

What you’re describing is called Pay-to-win, and it’s widely regarded as terrible design, both when intentionally implemented, and unintentionally implemented. Would you be fine with statistical buffs granted to players that purchase gems with real money? What if these buffs stacked the more you bought? Spending more money on a game is not a license for in-game advantages.

What you’re arguing for is your own equipment being the best acceptable.

Not at all. I’m arguing that external factors should be removed to the greatest degree possible in any competitive format in any game. This is always the goal of competition. Do you think it should be subverted because this is an mmo and we shouldn’t have standards here? What you’re arguing for is advantages that have nothing to do with your actual gameplay.

LetoII.3782:

mallas.9836:

Wasn’t the superbox bug with zooming removed or said to be an exploit, yet a program is allowed to exploit (as what Kyro said)to use graphics bug (or something that is not suppose to be, the gap in the door) in conjuction with a program to kill people?

Leto, that also is a extremely unsmart comment. Computer or lack of a good system is one thing. Using a outside program to gain an advantage when a in game bug gave the same effect, but was consider an exploit, is so much different.

The point is its one guild’s commander. Whether or not its all of SoR or just 1 person. I assume that guild isn’t a tiny guild and this is a commander which is 2 huge things. Also you guys/girls coming in and defending that person for using, at best, shady tactics after all the we just want good fights talk from SoR, is pretty hilarious.

Like hell.
I have a late model system and a razer naga. You trying to tell me some poor schlub chugging along in a zerg fight at 4 fps and skill clicking has a chance against me? You saying thats fair? He has no chance, I’ll run circles around the poor guy. I see it all the time, usually a ranged toon trying to tab a target he can hit with no clue I’m standing at his knees about to burst him..

It’s no different than someone buying a triple monitor setup, I wont cuz I like the view my wife and I have of our backyard between our monitors. Heck, I don’t even have arrowcart mastery. But thats not the point, the point I’m making here is the ones that DO have this equipment deserve to use it. And the people complaining about it are basically setting the bar juuuuust above their own price range. This is the unpolishable kitten of the whole argument.

What you’re describing is called Pay-to-win, and it’s widely regarded as terrible design, both when intentionally implemented, and unintentionally implemented. Would you be fine with statistical buffs granted to players that purchase gems with real money? What if these buffs stacked the more you bought? Spending more money on a game is not a license for in-game advantages.

morrolan.9608:

Ruin.3461:

Hate to break it to you, but the whole point of competitive gametypes (which wvw supposedly is) is to even the playing field as much as possible between all parties. This means each party has the same capabilities, with hardware affording ease of use, better visuals, etc., but not affording capabilities that is not accessible to other parties.

WvW is an unbalanced game type and will always be so due to the players at a variety of levels and the differing coverage.

All situations that arise through internal game mechanics.

I’m not judging the server at all, I’m just saying you’re wrong. No, you shouldn’t be allowed to see more, because that harms the game. That will always harm the game, regardless of whether it allows you to shoot places you otherwise couldn’t or just see and gather information that you should not be able to. If the intention was to allow players to have increased field of view, anet would allow players to zoom out as far as they wanted. You haven’t even denied that this gives an advantage to people who use it, which, regardless of whether or not they “deserve” this advantage (they don’t) is still garnered from a controllable external influence. ANet can’t upgrade your hardware for you, but they can sure as hell prevent you from abusing third party software to gain an advantage in their game.

kyro.8162:

Ruin.3461:

kyro.8162:

Ruin.3461:

LetoII.3782:

Ruin.3461:

kyro.8162:

Kaimick.5109:

Not really even if this is the case ( which it isn’t as I have it and can’t shot over a wall like that) lets humour the fact it is. This creates a un fair advatage to the people that do not have this ability, then again I have eyefinity and it still doesn’t alow me to do that. Although like I said nothign you can do about it, cause A Net will not punish them as the Dev’s supposedly play on that server so what have you. Way to go Arena Net

They are shooting through the gap on the door via Eyefinity. The whole unfair advantage thing this gives is bogus. People who can afford a larger field of view should play with a larger field of view. Nothing unfair about that. That is like saying people with the most up to date gaming rig has an unfair advantage over those with a toaster from 2001 due to lag/latency issues. Or those with a razer naga/g600 has a unfair advantage due to the readily available key binds.

Hate to break it to you, but the whole point of competitive gametypes (which wvw supposedly is) is to even the playing field as much as possible between all parties. This means each party has the same capabilities, with hardware affording ease of use, better visuals, etc., but not affording capabilities that is not accessible to other parties.

Right! everybody downgrade to Windows XP and a Pentium 4.

(I’m sure somebody is still using one and would appreciate a level playing field)

Apparently you misunderstood my point. Lower end hardware does not prevent you from performing actions that other players are capable of, though it may make it difficult. Without altered screen dimensions, it does not matter how kitten your processor and graphics card are, you will never be able to do this. Additionally, game developers try to cater to the lowest reasonable hardware specifications both to gain the largest market possible, and to prevent problems like this from arising for the vast majority of their playerbase. Why ANet allows zoom-unlocking in wvw is mind-boggling.

This is where you are wrong. A lower end hardware can prevent you from performing actions that other players are capable of. Some lower end hardware won’t even allow you to play the game!!! I mean what is this nonsense! I should be able to play the game with specs like these.
CPU: Motorola 68040 @ 25MHz
RAM: 2MB – 18MB onboard
Display: 256 colors at 1280 × 400
256,000 colors in HAM-8 mode
Ports: parallel, serial, floppy
RGB video, audio
Storage: 1.76M 3.5-inch floppy
120MB IDE HD
OS: AmigaDOS 3.1
“Workbench” GUI
If I can’t this is totally unfair.

“lowest reasonable hardware specifications”

It’s pretty obvious that developers don’t have control over the hardware setups that their customers are running. This has always been a problem with PC gaming, and is one of the things that consoles were designed to fix. Despite this, developers always work to give an even playing field to those who meet the minimum specifications or above.

What developers can control is what software is used to interact with their game, and typically ban everything that could give players an unfair advantage for using (see: every other competitive game).

I don’t know why you’re trying to defend this point. If I download a zoom or speed hack, is this legal within the game space because “anyone else can just download that hack too”?

No as those are hacks as even you admit to. The guy with the larger screen should be able to see more, no? The problem is not being able to see more. The problem lies in the acs themselves. Besides, A-net provided support for eyefinity, which by the way, allows those with a bigger screen to see more.

A hack is just a third party program that interfaces with the game. The problem does lie with being able to see more, because only select individuals have this capability. You can run the game without three monitors, you can’t run the game on a toaster. If ANet provided support for this, I doubt this was their intended use, considering it’s contrary to their entire design philosophy (allow everyone a level playing field with easy to access, homogeneous top tier equipment). The guy with the larger screen should not be able to see more, the guy with the larger screen should be able to see the same thing at a greater resolution, which is how almost every other game functions.

kyro.8162:

Ruin.3461:

LetoII.3782:

Ruin.3461:

kyro.8162:

Kaimick.5109:

Not really even if this is the case ( which it isn’t as I have it and can’t shot over a wall like that) lets humour the fact it is. This creates a un fair advatage to the people that do not have this ability, then again I have eyefinity and it still doesn’t alow me to do that. Although like I said nothign you can do about it, cause A Net will not punish them as the Dev’s supposedly play on that server so what have you. Way to go Arena Net

They are shooting through the gap on the door via Eyefinity. The whole unfair advantage thing this gives is bogus. People who can afford a larger field of view should play with a larger field of view. Nothing unfair about that. That is like saying people with the most up to date gaming rig has an unfair advantage over those with a toaster from 2001 due to lag/latency issues. Or those with a razer naga/g600 has a unfair advantage due to the readily available key binds.

Hate to break it to you, but the whole point of competitive gametypes (which wvw supposedly is) is to even the playing field as much as possible between all parties. This means each party has the same capabilities, with hardware affording ease of use, better visuals, etc., but not affording capabilities that is not accessible to other parties.

Right! everybody downgrade to Windows XP and a Pentium 4.

(I’m sure somebody is still using one and would appreciate a level playing field)

Apparently you misunderstood my point. Lower end hardware does not prevent you from performing actions that other players are capable of, though it may make it difficult. Without altered screen dimensions, it does not matter how kitten your processor and graphics card are, you will never be able to do this. Additionally, game developers try to cater to the lowest reasonable hardware specifications both to gain the largest market possible, and to prevent problems like this from arising for the vast majority of their playerbase. Why ANet allows zoom-unlocking in wvw is mind-boggling.

This is where you are wrong. A lower end hardware can prevent you from performing actions that other players are capable of. Some lower end hardware won’t even allow you to play the game!!! I mean what is this nonsense! I should be able to play the game with specs like these.
CPU: Motorola 68040 @ 25MHz
RAM: 2MB – 18MB onboard
Display: 256 colors at 1280 × 400
256,000 colors in HAM-8 mode
Ports: parallel, serial, floppy
RGB video, audio
Storage: 1.76M 3.5-inch floppy
120MB IDE HD
OS: AmigaDOS 3.1
“Workbench” GUI
If I can’t this is totally unfair.

“lowest reasonable hardware specifications”

It’s pretty obvious that developers don’t have control over the hardware setups that their customers are running. This has always been a problem with PC gaming, and is one of the things that consoles were designed to fix. Despite this, developers always work to give an even playing field to those who meet the minimum specifications or above.

What developers can control is what software is used to interact with their game, and typically ban everything that could give players an unfair advantage for using (see: every other competitive game).

I don’t know why you’re trying to defend this point. If I download a zoom or speed hack, is this legal within the game space because “anyone else can just download that hack too”?

kyro.8162:

Ruin.3461:

kyro.8162:

Kaimick.5109:

Not really even if this is the case ( which it isn’t as I have it and can’t shot over a wall like that) lets humour the fact it is. This creates a un fair advatage to the people that do not have this ability, then again I have eyefinity and it still doesn’t alow me to do that. Although like I said nothign you can do about it, cause A Net will not punish them as the Dev’s supposedly play on that server so what have you. Way to go Arena Net

They are shooting through the gap on the door via Eyefinity. The whole unfair advantage thing this gives is bogus. People who can afford a larger field of view should play with a larger field of view. Nothing unfair about that. That is like saying people with the most up to date gaming rig has an unfair advantage over those with a toaster from 2001 due to lag/latency issues. Or those with a razer naga/g600 has a unfair advantage due to the readily available key binds.

Hate to break it to you, but the whole point of competitive gametypes (which wvw supposedly is) is to even the playing field as much as possible between all parties. This means each party has the same capabilities, with hardware affording ease of use, better visuals, etc., but not affording capabilities that is not accessible to other parties.

Eyefinity is accessible to other/any parties if they are willing to get 3 or so monitors. So these capabilities are accessible to all. Like I said, it isn’t as different as having a 17 button mouse which gives the user additional capabilities compared to other users without one.

A multi-button mouse doesn’t afford any capabilities not granted by a basic hardware setup. It does not allow you to do things other players cannot, it can only make these actions easier to perform. Buying additional monitors is something external to the gamespace, which is in direct opposition to creating a competitive gametype. All advantages must be gained through interactions with the gamespace itself and the moving parts contained within.

LetoII.3782:

Ruin.3461:

kyro.8162:

Kaimick.5109:

Not really even if this is the case ( which it isn’t as I have it and can’t shot over a wall like that) lets humour the fact it is. This creates a un fair advatage to the people that do not have this ability, then again I have eyefinity and it still doesn’t alow me to do that. Although like I said nothign you can do about it, cause A Net will not punish them as the Dev’s supposedly play on that server so what have you. Way to go Arena Net

They are shooting through the gap on the door via Eyefinity. The whole unfair advantage thing this gives is bogus. People who can afford a larger field of view should play with a larger field of view. Nothing unfair about that. That is like saying people with the most up to date gaming rig has an unfair advantage over those with a toaster from 2001 due to lag/latency issues. Or those with a razer naga/g600 has a unfair advantage due to the readily available key binds.

Hate to break it to you, but the whole point of competitive gametypes (which wvw supposedly is) is to even the playing field as much as possible between all parties. This means each party has the same capabilities, with hardware affording ease of use, better visuals, etc., but not affording capabilities that is not accessible to other parties.

Right! everybody downgrade to Windows XP and a Pentium 4.

(I’m sure somebody is still using one and would appreciate a level playing field)

Apparently you misunderstood my point. Lower end hardware does not prevent you from performing actions that other players are capable of, though it may make it difficult. Without altered screen dimensions, it does not matter how kitten your processor and graphics card are, you will never be able to do this. Additionally, game developers try to cater to the lowest reasonable hardware specifications both to gain the largest market possible, and to prevent problems like this from arising for the vast majority of their playerbase. Why ANet allows zoom-unlocking in wvw is mind-boggling.

kyro.8162:

Kaimick.5109:

Not really even if this is the case ( which it isn’t as I have it and can’t shot over a wall like that) lets humour the fact it is. This creates a un fair advatage to the people that do not have this ability, then again I have eyefinity and it still doesn’t alow me to do that. Although like I said nothign you can do about it, cause A Net will not punish them as the Dev’s supposedly play on that server so what have you. Way to go Arena Net

They are shooting through the gap on the door via Eyefinity. The whole unfair advantage thing this gives is bogus. People who can afford a larger field of view should play with a larger field of view. Nothing unfair about that. That is like saying people with the most up to date gaming rig has an unfair advantage over those with a toaster from 2001 due to lag/latency issues. Or those with a razer naga/g600 has a unfair advantage due to the readily available key binds.

Hate to break it to you, but the whole point of competitive gametypes (which wvw supposedly is) is to even the playing field as much as possible between all parties. This means each party has the same capabilities, with hardware affording ease of use, better visuals, etc., but not affording capabilities that is not accessible to other parties.

Lydell.8713:

Burl.9567:

Kyo.7369:

Lol everyone is mad.

I’m mad. I was on my way to the zerblob on SoR BL and I was 2v1’d between a raptor and a BG. I have never been more humiliated and angry before this. It’s all ok though as I’m not angry at all about it because 2v1 happens. I’m so angry though. L2P

Did I do it right?

Nope, you fail, you should have convinced the raptor to 2v1 the BG dude with you. Shame on you, l2p noob.

I’m sure he tried, but the raptor refused his admittedly rather generous offers. Raptors are fickle beasts, and not to be trusted.

Everyone wins because of coverage.

Let me get this straight: you want to hinder the ability of larger servers to actually siege and make tactical plays – you know, those servers with more people to zerg with. But hey, I guess PvDoor is fun too right?

0/0/30/25/15
S/D, SB

Thief is pretty good at small scale engagements, and at harassing yaks and supply camps. If you run shortbow secondary you can be sort of effective in zergs (aoe to tag people, blast finishers on demand).

You’ll be able to survive in WvW once you’re 80 with better gear, a tighter build, and a better grasp of the play style. I can usually go hours without dying (unless my internet dies).

I haven’t claimed that thief is broken, nor have I said anything negative towards thief so you either have problems and need a psychologist or have misunderstood my thread.
It was created because I wanted to gain knowledge about how glass cannon thief works.

As your title certainly suggests.

I kept all my utilities the same, but moved f1-4 onto z-v (this is also helpful for elementalist) because I’m on a laptop and my f keys aren’t very useful.
I have dodge on mouse, as well as jump (for convenience).

Changing your utilities is probably a good idea, but I don’t have a problem with it because I’m used to RTS games.

You could try guardian.

Omnitek.3876:

We lost garrison, PvDoor.
We took garrison, epic fight.

When you win, it is skill. When you lose it is coverage. I do enjoy the thread. Always a good read on a slow work day. I would ask for an score , but there really isn’t a point (cwhatididthere)

This was sor for 11 weeks in T2. Not saying that people in this thread on BG and JQ aren’t doing it, but how quickly we forget our own foibles.

Fixeon.5076:

oxide.8324:

When people say things like this

GvG’s are the ultimate test of skill in my opinion.

it really makes me laugh. There is very little skill involved in GvG and WvW. As fights become larger in scale, skill becomes less important and coordination becomes more important, simply because the impact that a single player has on a fight becomes less significant. Following a really good commander in a pack, like a herd of sheep, doing what he says, when he says, and winning fights as a result doesn’t mean you’re skilled, it means you’re coordinated.

I don’t know I think you are wrong here. 1 person can make a huge impact on the outcome of a large battle. A key stun, water field, banner, or even fear can be the difference between a win or a loss. Hell even a quick stomp can change the outcome of a battle if it means a rally for several downed allies. Player skill has a huge impact on the field of battle. A commander can ask for things, but it is up to the people following him to know how, when and where to place for maximum impact.

Simple math dictates that as the amount of players involved increases the amount of control each player can exert over the battle decreases. You may argue that if one player is extraordinarily skilled, they may exert more control than other players, but put 25 players who are all extraordinarily skilled against themselves, and they can do no more than 25 people who are completely new to the game. GvG, and indeed any large scale format, will almost never yield results that directly correlate with individual skill, provided you have players that are at least fairly close to each other.

Had a blast running with BT. Hope you guys are enjoying your stay on Blackgate!

Cover Girl.2580:

sostronk.8167:

Israel.7056:

Either way this is a great match right now.

If you say so. I personally think its pretty skritthouse. Being outmanned on 3 maps almost 24 hours a day is fine for a while, then it just gets old. Trying to run havoc and every yak I come across has anywhere between 5-15 SOR players standing right near the yak, I try to flip a camp but I have to kill 10 mesmers first and then there guild mates who come running in for backup after Ive killed a couple of them. Sure, there are some fun fights, nothing like killing six players whilst running solo, but at the end of the day I think its pretty skritt.

HI remember us? We are SBI, we are SOR, we are SOS. We’ve all been there.. What defines you is how you react. Do you fight till there’s no hope left or give up immediately?

Sorry, we only play for the fights and don’t care about PPT.

The best part of Golem Wars 2 for me was definitely our March of the Ents from spawn in SoRBL all the way to cliffside to ninja the tower. Was fun to see more Golem use for a change.

We’re all the monsters. All Arrow Carts wanted was your love, and look at them now? GONE. We’ve killed them, all of us. I hope you’re all happy thinking about the poor arrow carts crying themselves to sleep tonight, cold, alone, and not raining glorious death down on their enemies.

Kryyg.8576:

Genocide.4506:

Hmmm… pretty sure that’s a double team in progress…. oh well

After all the nonsense you guys pulled the past 2 days, you deserved it. We are coming for you BG, get ready. You’re only 14k ahead of us, get ready to get 3rd 2 weeks in a row.

You heard it here guys, JQ’s given up, and playing for second.

It’s hilarious how all the forum warriors from every server seem to think “No, my server is different! We’re the only dedicated server and you other servers just don’t try hard enough! Our guilds are super skilled [at zerging] which is why you always run from us.” Wake up. WvW is a numbers game, and it always has been. Your server is not special; your guild is not special. Just relax and enjoy the game.

You can’t beat SoR on the forums. When they win the match, it’s because they’re better players and have higher morale. When they lose the match, it’s because they’re “taking a break” or “just in it for the fights”. No sense when they’re going to redefine the win condition and expect you to go along with it. “We play for fun”; everyone plays for fun, some of us just don’t make excuses when the match doesn’t go in our favor.

That being said, really enjoying seeing SoR and JQ’s Yak coverage. Having a great time ducking in and attempting to pick off heavily guarded dolyaks. You Yak-guarders are certainly tenacious, keep it up.

No one in this game has enough control over their “units”, or enough agency over the state of the battlefield and coordination with fellow commanders to enact any deep strategic maneuvers. This is of course assuming they even think about them. If you’re looking for strategy, I’d suggest a different game (maybe Age of Empires II: Forgotten Empires), because you won’t find it here.

UnrepentantProcrastinator.7420:

Zee.1294:

What are u?…..Nostradamus ?
Can u predict that no one gives crap what u think?

These posts always make me chuckle.

Don’t you see? Don’t you see?!

LetoII.3782:

I think all this pve content is proof Anet plays on BG and wants JQ to lose.

Hey, that stuffs easier than I thought!

We do have GM’s who play WvW, but haven’t seen one in a long time.

As for the weather… I need to be in front of a fan or AC or I start crying. kitten you global warming!

Well, at least finding an AC shouldn’t be too hard these days!

Kryyg.8576:

…along with a lot of overplaying on your part. I mean from the SS’s your oceanic crew is still on. That’s just silly, it’s coming close to a 18 hour day for some BG.

Your entire asian crew is still on as well. We are well into Euro, almost to NA in a couple hours.

It’s a sad day when putting in the effort to try to win is derided as cheap tactics.

A couple of silver really influences your decisions that much?

Or you could drop siege.

Renny.6571:

The world map should be forced open on death imo. It’d still allow you to see allies’ dots, but unable to see enemy activity.

DeWolfe.2174:

Devon, and I mean this nicely, how remedial are you going to make WvW? We need MORE tactics and capacity to create them, not less. Please stop removing abilities, skills, and tactics. This isn’t sPvP nor do we want it to be, “In Zerg We Trust.”

Dead scouting isn’t a tactic.

Sure it is. Whether or not it should be allowed in the future is debatable, but the fact of the matter is that it exists in the game right now. I see no reason for players to refrain from using every tool in their arsenal. If ANet doesn’t like it, they can remove it.

I’m not sure if naked enemies are even rendered separately for me anymore.

Renny.6571:

Ruin.3461:

Disregarding whether or not confusion is/was OP, it was bad design regardless. The stylistic decisions of this game are designed around forcing players to take action – even auto attacks are spells. A skill that punishes players for doing so, and does so without reactionary direction, is is against the style they promote with their other design decisions.

I disagree. I think it promoted higher skilled gameplay and build/team synergy. Unlike bleed/burning that pulses damage automagically, confusion is damage on skill use. The receiver has full control over the damage they take from it. You could yell over to a buddy to drop a light field and have him spin around in it; that’s higher level gameplay. What it did punish though, like other people have said, are the l0l222spammers and people who have poor awareness/zerker build without condition cleanses. It’s sad that anet chose to listen to these types of people. :\

Only in optimal conditions do they have full control over it. There are many circumstances in wvw where players have no where near full control, whether because of server-side issues, frame rate drops, or other conditions stacked on top of it. I don’t know about you, but server issues are common as dirt when I play.

Disregarding whether or not confusion is/was OP, it was bad design regardless. The stylistic decisions of this game are designed around forcing players to take action – even auto attacks are spells. A skill that punishes players for doing so, and does so without reactionary direction, is is against the style they promote with their other design decisions.

pot.6805:

Mesmer is a faceroll class that has so many ways to avoid damage. I cannot respect such for getting away since it is very easy to do on a Mesmer. I almost feel like I have a god mode cheat on when I play my Mesmer.

>faceroll class
>mmo

okay

TeamBattleAxe.3901:

I’m a thief who doesn’t use stealth, so obviously I wasn’t affected. Haven’t really noticed a drop-off in the number of other thief players, but I did notice a pretty big increase in confusion mesmers all of a sudden.

Confusion is the new flavor of the month (probably because it’s ridiculous).

vanzan.1250:

oldephartte.4369:

Simple solution. Put a cap on the number of non-NA players allowed on any one NA server based on a +/- percentage of the total number of non-NA players on NA servers with the objective of fairly balancing the the population of non-NA players across all the NA servers to make game play more competitive 7/24.

News Just In: Developers have taken on this suggestion but have decided to cap NA instead.

What? Don’t like being marginalised? But the world revolves around NA!

Don’t like it, well don’t do it. Everyone has a right to play without restrictions.

I agree that the original post is dumb, but these are NA servers…