Guild Wars 2

Daulnay.4971:

To the people defending the grind; Anet promised and sold GW2 as no-grind, no gating. That was what made GW2 special, better, and a pleasure to play. There are lots of games that play like HoT, and the old-school games are grindier. Except for GW1, which was less grindy than HoT.

So those of us who backed GW2, and enjoyed its different take on MMOs feel betrayed by HoT. What I’d like to see is the firing or forced resignation of the manager(s) responsible for this betrayal. I’m sure many of the developers opposed how this was structured, and some probably even got forced out or quit — HoT is a betrayal of the original company ethos.

There have been personnel changes in recent months. The CDIS exist only as memories.

This is not the same ArenaNet, I think, that originated the game.

I’d love to see them prove me wrong.

Sylent.3165:

The issue is to many people complained it’s not hard enough even though in any mmo open world pve isn’t supposed to be this insane.

Anet really messed up here. Raids and high level fractals were brought in to please these people. But the new maps feel like a giant raid with no one around.

If they decrease the difficulty these elite people with there 24 packs of mountain dew and hot pockets will complain like crazy instead of just staying in raids and fractals where they belong. Or in ff14 or wow

Yes, but they want the esport, MtnDew crowd. I think that’s ANet’s intended audience. A lot of companies are going that way.

Those of us looking for a fun relaxing diversion are SOL.

psizone.8437:

Sytherek.7689:

I’m taking time away, since the game is more frustrating than fun. The meta critic score is only 5.6 out of 10 at the moment, so I don’t think ANET needs more downvoting. If they don’t have an idea of how badly HoT has been received, they’re willfully ignorant.

I’m expecting more silence until they’ve had meetings and set a plan to fix this mess.

If we don’t hear anything from them by early in the week, it’s time to find a new game.

But I’m pretty sure they know a lot of people are unhappy.

Down to 4.8 now, I don’t think it’s justified and I’m surprised no-one has come into this thread to do some damage control just to reiterate your point that they need to discuss the issue before posting something definitive.

It is possible GW2 is meant to be a grindfest now. It is possible they no longer care about casual players.

Time will tell.

Divine Flavor.2016:

Osu.6307:

Test.8734:

Go to the metacritic site and give HoT a low score

No reason to get nasty. Hero points are really the only thing that I think is screwed up. I’m going stick with lobbying for now. Let’s hope anet fixes this almost as fast as they fixed perma-quickness rangers.

I disagree – it’s first and foremost a product, and we’re first and foremost consumers. The idea that we’re a community of equals or that deliberating something will ‘force’ or ‘encourage’ change is naive.

The only way to vote in this situation is with our feet. In this case, a bad metacritic score is reasonable. If only I could, metacritic appears to be down. Is it because of a swarm of angry users?

I’m taking time away, since the game is more frustrating than fun. The meta critic score is only 5.6 out of 10 at the moment, so I don’t think ANET needs more downvoting. If they don’t have an idea of how badly HoT has been received, they’re willfully ignorant.

I’m expecting more silence until they’ve had meetings and set a plan to fix this mess.

If we don’t hear anything from them by early in the week, it’s time to find a new game.

But I’m pretty sure they know a lot of people are unhappy.

Wolfric.9380:

I am not so shure anymore if its so hard to get the hero points. Shure not fast but i ran an hour WvW roamin learning the new maps a bit. I got about 10 coins for buying random hero quests. This will lead to something about 40h playtime for an elite spec.
If that pace keeps up, then its OK. I don´t know for shure now but will see. If not is stays ridicolous.

One last comment — I had a similar WvW experience last night, gaining 10 coins in an hour. It was boring, repetitive, and in a strange way, fun. But I can’t see spending 40 hours running WvW just to unlock something I paid for that’s a fundamental aspect of my character. Heck, I could level a traditional 80 in the same and same way. A new spec shouldn’t take that much work.

I’m taking time away from GW2, like several friends of mine.

Suggestions:

Lower the cost of elite specializations dramatically.

Compensate those who’ve ground the poor design of elites, perhaps with gems.

Refocus your company on real content, not artificial grind meant to make weak content feel longer.

Make a commitment to what brought many of us to GW2 — fun. GrInd is not fun, playing a new spec I paid for is.

Don’t make future specs equal in strength to existing specs and then charge 10x as much effort. If the new elite specs were super powered, the effort wouldn’t feel so bad, but that would wreck the game. Make effort commensurate with value.

I’m out a here. Other people treat me better for the money I spend.

Allisa Wonderland.8192:

Keep it as it is. These kids no not of the joys of challenge.

I’m 54 years old, and my earlier message in this thread shows that I like challenges. GrInd is not challenge, it is boring make-work created to artificially prolong weak content.

leftyboy.9358:

tullrn.7902:

Feel like it will remain the way it is, it’s been to long into to the expansion for a change.
Now it would make the people that grindinded like crazy feel like they did it for nothing if they change it.

The group of people you speak of don’t care to compromise and relax on this one issue. That group of people have been calling us whiners, criers and babies from the get go. So sorry but I don’t feel bad when anet finally relaxes the hero point grind. If they get their feelers hurt so be it.

I’m angry that ANET isn’t closing down and infraction the rude, insulting posters who make childish attacks on the many who are unhappy with elite spec unlocks. I don’t mind being disagreed with, even strongly, but personal attacks being allowed do not make ANET look good.

Kalan.9705:

Gating core play mechanics like character trait lines behind massive massive MASSIVE grind (with enforced repetition again and again and again across EVERY character) makes me totally distrust the Anet devs. These devs appear to be building a korean grindfest mmo.

What happened to the devs who promised “Arenanet don’t make grindy games?”

ANET doesn’t care about those who were mislead about elite specs.

Guild Wars was a great game for people who have a life. WAS.

redcomyn.4651:

It looks to me that over time, Anet has shifted their target audience. They have moved away from the casuals and more to the hard core type of player. Perhaps this is a sound business decision, and if so, I can’t blame them. Unfortunately, they are leaving me out in the cold.

I think it is time for me to take an extended break from this game. Maybe things will get better sometime in the future.

The move away from casuals is a mistake. ANET wants the hyperactive no-lifers, not working people who see gaming as a pleasurable diversion.

Until they fix the Elite spec grind, I’m not spending money in the TP, or buying any products from ANet. I know at least six others personally who are doing the same. I am not upgrading two other family accounts as neither player wants to in the game’s current state. All tolled, the people no longer paying for GW2 have put a lot of money into the game and TP.

A 5 of 10. Fun story and places ruined by artifical grind to enjoy them.

EdgarMTanaka.7291:

Sytherek.7689:

BaconofPigs.1683:

It’s only been 3 days. If you haven’t unlocked all the masteries it’s not the end the world. Just play the game guys. You can finish it in a couple of months and that’s the idea. And yes some people have finished unlocked all core masteries and most of HoT masteries.

Thank you ANet for not making contents that can be done in one day (for the vast majority of the players).

It’s a game.

I’m plenty kitten ed tough. I survived a tornado that half-destroyed a town I lived in, and walked two miles on a broken leg once. I game with only one working hand. I run my own successful business for challenge. I raised three kids.

I play games for FUN. HoT is not fun.

A sad story indeed, but every game can not be fun for everyone no matter how much endavors you have been put through.

It’s not a sad story. How in hell is having raised successful daughters “sad”?

This game is currently an unpleasant pain in the kitten , not a challenge.

BaconofPigs.1683:

It’s only been 3 days. If you haven’t unlocked all the masteries it’s not the end the world. Just play the game guys. You can finish it in a couple of months and that’s the idea. And yes some people have finished unlocked all core masteries and most of HoT masteries.

Thank you ANet for not making contents that can be done in one day (for the vast majority of the players).

It’s a game.

I’m plenty kitten ed tough. I survived a tornado that half-destroyed a town I lived in, and walked two miles on a broken leg once. I game with only one working hand. I run my own successful business for challenge. I raised three kids.

I play games for FUN. HoT is not fun.

If you have an opinion, pro or con, make it known on other venues (Twitter, Facebook, reddit, etc.). Talking here is preaching to the choir…

If you do or don’t want change, make your voice heard!

Lishtenbird.2814:

As a player with 15 characters (a double for almost every class), I find the current situation disappointing and frustrating. Solutions:

1. Halve the SP cost (to 200). If one has full map completion, that means he’s played enough to master a new spec. Really, after 3 years the last thing one wants is to play his old class instead of a new one.

1.1. Move decorative reward to end of line. I can live without the new pretty exo shield, thanks. Really, that’s how this game always worked: functionality from day one, cosmetics – after a variable grind.

2. Make each class elite spec unlock account-bound. My main is a mesmer and I finish all LS on it; I also made a mesmer themed for a chronomancer; do you really expect I will enjoy grinding the same 400 points in the same content just to have characters with different skins? No thanks; I should better think of asking for the char slot refund for all my duplicates in that case.

This. Exactly my opinion. Unlocked much of the first new big map on my Mesmer. My Ranger is working on the main world materies.

I’ve played quite a bit of HoT since it landed. The new hero challenges are annoying in both implementation and location. I do not find them fun. Which means that fun new elite specs are locked behind unfun work.

On the other hand, the new zone has its interesting aspects, and gliding is very possible for a one-handed man.

I still dislike the artificial grind behind elite specs, and will not be spending money in the TP or upgrading the two other household account (they hate grind more than I do), or recommending the game to others in it’s current state.

Implement suggestions like those quoted, and I’ll change my attitude. I may still play a bit, but nowhere near as much as I used to.

Spambot.3625:

Ansau.7326:

This hero point system is just absurd.
First, each elite specialization needs too much points to be unlocked, really 60 to just unlock it and 400 to get everything?
Second, it’s not account bound… What the heck were you thinking?
Third, to get hero points you just need to grind, yes grind map completions, grind EOTM zerg…

I’ve calculated that to unlock an entire elite specialization per character requires about 100 WvW levels and 2000 badges.

For people who has alts it’s just a suicide mission.

Anet and devs, you really need to tone down A LOT the hero points required.

no its actually good, you shouldnt be able to progress your character instantly but rather have to put work into it

what gw2 was lacking was character progression, this is one step into forward by anet, loving it

Some of us played GW2 BECAUSE IT DIDN’T have character progression / treadmill.

Some of us were here for gameplay.

My three main characters have 214/141/122 available hero points, and I have no time before HoT to farm more on the latter two, who are the ones I want the elite spec for.

Daddar.5971:

I’ve decided that the anger I feel is not productive. I will play as and when I see fit, and that will certainly be less now. If I’m having fun and progressing, I’ll play a lot. If only one of those, I’ll play a little. If neither, I’ll leave completely. Raging (as I and many others have done) is probably futile. The almighty bottom line is all that matters to A-Net in the end, so I won’t be buying gems again until I’m happy.

Well, in ANet’s defense, the bottom-line is all that matters in a capitalist society. I certain think that way when I charge my customers: Will what I do bring in more or less business?

Clearly, casual, limited play-time customers are no longer ANet’s focus, no matter how much we spend in the Trading Post (I just checked, over $500 on my part since release.) That’s ANet’s choice made based on where they expect to get revenue. Nothing wrong with that. If the game moves too far in a direction I dislike, I’ll post my opinion, and leave if/when the game is no longer appealing.

I don’t expect ANet to cater to me. But they shouldn’t expect me to spend more money on GW2 if it’s no longer fun for me and my family.

DeceiverX.8361:

Lazy? BS. How many hours a week do you work? I bought this game because it could still be fun with a packed schedule and not leave me in the dust as a consequence for my life taking priority and requiring most of my time and effort.

Exactly my view. GW2 is ceasing to be a casual-friendly, grind-optional MMO, and moving toward an e-sport, full-time-commitment model. Perhaps profitable, but not my cup of tea.

Canis.7451:

Right now, I’m kind of on the fence. When I originally read that we’d need 400 HP to unlock the elite specialization (presumably per character as well, since why wouldn’t it be? It’s still a specialization), I wasn’t happy. I’m still not happy, but after sleeping on it I’ve decided that at this point I’d like to see how it’ll play out.

You summed up my current feelings. I am unhappy with the way “elite” (in effort, not capability) specs are being handled. I’ll try HoT out, and see if other aspects make up for the annoyance.

My three main characters have 214/141/122 available hero points, and I have no time before HoT to farm more on the latter two, who are the ones I want the elite spec for.

We’ll see how easy/hard/impossible-for-a-one-handed man the HoT hero points are. If skins are part of lower tiers, or the HP are a major pain, I’m not going to be happy. And there’s no reason to play a GAME if it isn’t fun.

But I’ll give it a chance.

I’d buy it.

Really.

Coulter.2315:

You didn’t pay for the specs you paid for HoT and HoT includes a way to get specs – so now you need to go do that.

You don’t get to define what you paid for, imagine I wrote “I paid for the new legendaries, I don’t want to grind for them.” <- you can see how stupid it is.

If I pre-purchase an electric car, and the manufacturer sends me a gas vehicle, I think I have a right to be annoyed.

Had ANet told me I’d have to grind for the new specs, I wouldnt have bought the expansion. Which explains why they said nothing about the grind until 3 days before release.

A legendary is not required to fully play my characters. To me, a spec is a fundamental part of a character that affects how it plays. A legendary is cosmetic having no affect on gameplay.

I wonder what this all means for the gem store?

Again, I will never pre-purchase a product from ANET again.

Sully.9453:

Oh no. I bought this game called guild wars and my new character started at level 1 instead of 80.

Really guys. You’ve paid for the expansion of a game to get even more of a great game. If you think that having to play the game to get content unlocked is unfair i read that they deva have bucket to collect your tears.

Core mechanics are not content. Content is places to explore and adventures to have, not artificial grinding.

SpyderArachnid.5619:

You pre-purchased a product that was “Subject to Change”. You knew full well when ordering the product before it was ready, that things could change during production.

This is a well known fact. The law won’t help you here. You made an investment into an unfinished product, that you knew was subject to change. Every product that is a WIP undergoes changes during production. You knew this when you purchased HoT, knowing that we wouldn’t get all the info up front and instead, it would be given over time as progress developed.

There was no misleading or false advertising. If you are unhappy with your purchase, get a refund. But don’t try to claim they are breaking the law, because they aren’t.

ANET did not break the law.
I admit I was stupid to pre-purchase HoT. Thank fate I only bought it on my single account, and didn’t waste money on two others in the family. So I was only 1/3 stupid.

Daddar.5971:

Does A-Net realize that the karma train in EotM is gonna be a HUGE thing? That’s the most efficient way for a WvW player to earn the hero points. I HATE EotM, but it’s better than PvE… so I’m gonna spend several MONTHS running in a karma train (to get the elite on all 19 toons) rather than fighting in WvW as I’d rather be doing.

Any estimate on how long it’ll take to earn the necessary hero points for a single character’s elite spec? I haven’t run EotM in ages.

Nausicca.6038:

Since raising the level cap in GW2 wouldn’t make any sense like in other MMOs xpacs, Anet have decided to add new specs that we will be able to unlock ( level up) with HP.

Just consider HP as the new XP and elite spec the new level cap.

Some of us bought this game because it lacked treadmills.

Boy, were we wrong.

Consider this…

ANET has listed several “features” that won’t be ready at launch.
They sprang this busy work on us at the last moment.

I’ll leave it to others to draw conclusions.

I, too, bought the expansion for the Elite specs. I, too, am feeling misled. Kinda like in the early days, when ANET made a manifesto they then abandoned without a word.

Never again will I trust ANet. I likely will never buy any product in advance from them again. I’m looking for another game — not a rage quit, a disappointment quit.

Daddar.5971:

^ THIS. So much this. I’m simply amazed at how utterly hypocritical this unlock structure is given the original manifesto.

ANET could at least be honest and clearly state that the manifesto is not guiding their work. I really hate it when companies aren’t direct with customers.

The design of HoT is not guided by the manifesto.

PopeUrban.2578:

Sytherek.7689:

PopeUrban.2578:

Sytherek.7689:

Menadena.7482:

fireflyry.7023:

I’m on the fence with this one but Anet does itself no favors with it’s BWE’s and using this as a selling point for pre-purchase. To me this is the catalyst of much of this complaint and I’m still of the opinion beta testing should be done by beta testers, not used as a sales pitch to customers.

I’ve played a fair few games where at the starting level your a fully kitted out uber-beast of death slaying everything in sight in some huge awe-inspiring battle with all skills unlocked and all weapons blazing full bore. Wahoo this game is friggin amazing!!!

end flashback/dream sequence

You wake up at level one naked holding a wet noodle realizing it will be a LONG time before you feel that way again.

From what I can garner this is exactly what has happened here with giving players everything for nothing to play with, then taking it away. Sure might work ok in an offline RPG but in this genre it just seems to kitten a lot of people off.

It is the same reason (although partly in reverse) of why I skipped most of the BWE content. I wanted to be surprised by the new stuff and I knew I would be getting a good chunk of it after paying $100 for the kittening thing. Not only would I be seeing all the content, but it would be ready for prime time. Now I wish I had done as much of the beta events as I could because I will not see the things I had a taste of for a VERY long time. Especially on all my characters. Oh well, at least I get to play with the revenant specs.

Like someone else said earlier, there is not a match between what new specs I was looking forward to the most with what existing specs I like. In fact, the new spec I like the most is on a spec I loathe and hoped it would reinvigorate the profession. What is the point of my first HOT experience being with a profession I can not stand? I would think they would want people to have as good an impression of the jungle as possible.

Exactly. For me, the new Reaper spec looks fun for my languishing necro. I was looking forward to playing her again with the Reaper’s skills and traits.

But because I wasn’t happy with her existing specs, I never did world completion on her, and she has few hero points. So I’m forced to play her thru HoT with a spec I don’t like to get what I was looking forward to. Where’s the fun in that?

Now, on my mesmer, I like her current spec, like Chronomancer, and have 133 hero points. She might be fun in HoT as I earn hero points.

Funny thing about my Ranger main — she is my only character with World completion, and I have no interest in Druid. I’ll spend the points because they’re there, maybe get a skin.

My other characters are so far behind, I probably won’t play them. My poor engineer has almost no hero points, and like my necro, I was hoping to jump right into the Elite spec.

So I think I’ll be playing my mesmer, if I play at all. At this point, I’m actively looking for a new game.

That’s unfortunate, but the whole point of the system is to add depth and options to characters people, presumably, already like rather than replace characters they hate.

The addition of the revnant is the intended “replacement character”

Like, I see what you’re getting at, but it’s a bit like complaining that characters suck at level 1 and are more fun to play at 80.

If you don’t like the game, that’s a valid opinion, but the whole idea was to add progression similar to new secondary classes and skill trainers in GW1. Obviously if you don’t like necro, and like the reaper, it may be a pain, but it’s highly unlikely you’d be a fan of anything post-reaper as you don’t actually like the class as a class, right?

No, I love the pre-HoT necromancer concept and design. I don’t like how weak it is in so many ways. Reaper fixes that problem. I like the class as it’s being updated.

Consider this… I love my Ranger main, and have 0 interest in the druid. So the 214 hero points I have sitting on her is a waste.

Now, If ANET gave me a way to transfer hero points between characters, I’d be happie r. I did the work, just on the wrong character (years ago).

Not really a waste, think of it as a bank. Knowing you don’t want druid means you have those points in the bank for the next e-spec, right? Maybe a petless ranger spec if we’re lucky!

The next expansion will likely need 4000 points to get its specialization, if ANET follows its current model.

Would ANET consider letting me transfer hero points between level 80s?

I earned them. Let me use them on the characters I’m most interest in their elite specs.

PopeUrban.2578:

Sytherek.7689:

Menadena.7482:

fireflyry.7023:

I’m on the fence with this one but Anet does itself no favors with it’s BWE’s and using this as a selling point for pre-purchase. To me this is the catalyst of much of this complaint and I’m still of the opinion beta testing should be done by beta testers, not used as a sales pitch to customers.

I’ve played a fair few games where at the starting level your a fully kitted out uber-beast of death slaying everything in sight in some huge awe-inspiring battle with all skills unlocked and all weapons blazing full bore. Wahoo this game is friggin amazing!!!

end flashback/dream sequence

You wake up at level one naked holding a wet noodle realizing it will be a LONG time before you feel that way again.

From what I can garner this is exactly what has happened here with giving players everything for nothing to play with, then taking it away. Sure might work ok in an offline RPG but in this genre it just seems to kitten a lot of people off.

It is the same reason (although partly in reverse) of why I skipped most of the BWE content. I wanted to be surprised by the new stuff and I knew I would be getting a good chunk of it after paying $100 for the kittening thing. Not only would I be seeing all the content, but it would be ready for prime time. Now I wish I had done as much of the beta events as I could because I will not see the things I had a taste of for a VERY long time. Especially on all my characters. Oh well, at least I get to play with the revenant specs.

Like someone else said earlier, there is not a match between what new specs I was looking forward to the most with what existing specs I like. In fact, the new spec I like the most is on a spec I loathe and hoped it would reinvigorate the profession. What is the point of my first HOT experience being with a profession I can not stand? I would think they would want people to have as good an impression of the jungle as possible.

Exactly. For me, the new Reaper spec looks fun for my languishing necro. I was looking forward to playing her again with the Reaper’s skills and traits.

But because I wasn’t happy with her existing specs, I never did world completion on her, and she has few hero points. So I’m forced to play her thru HoT with a spec I don’t like to get what I was looking forward to. Where’s the fun in that?

Now, on my mesmer, I like her current spec, like Chronomancer, and have 133 hero points. She might be fun in HoT as I earn hero points.

Funny thing about my Ranger main — she is my only character with World completion, and I have no interest in Druid. I’ll spend the points because they’re there, maybe get a skin.

My other characters are so far behind, I probably won’t play them. My poor engineer has almost no hero points, and like my necro, I was hoping to jump right into the Elite spec.

So I think I’ll be playing my mesmer, if I play at all. At this point, I’m actively looking for a new game.

That’s unfortunate, but the whole point of the system is to add depth and options to characters people, presumably, already like rather than replace characters they hate.

The addition of the revnant is the intended “replacement character”

Like, I see what you’re getting at, but it’s a bit like complaining that characters suck at level 1 and are more fun to play at 80.

If you don’t like the game, that’s a valid opinion, but the whole idea was to add progression similar to new secondary classes and skill trainers in GW1. Obviously if you don’t like necro, and like the reaper, it may be a pain, but it’s highly unlikely you’d be a fan of anything post-reaper as you don’t actually like the class as a class, right?

No, I love the pre-HoT necromancer concept and design. I don’t like how weak it is in so many ways. Reaper fixes that problem. I like the class as it’s being updated.

Consider this… I love my Ranger main, and have 0 interest in the druid. So the 214 hero points I have sitting on her is a waste.

Now, If ANET gave me a way to transfer hero points between characters, I’d be happie r. I did the work, just on the wrong character (years ago).

Menadena.7482:

fireflyry.7023:

I’m on the fence with this one but Anet does itself no favors with it’s BWE’s and using this as a selling point for pre-purchase. To me this is the catalyst of much of this complaint and I’m still of the opinion beta testing should be done by beta testers, not used as a sales pitch to customers.

I’ve played a fair few games where at the starting level your a fully kitted out uber-beast of death slaying everything in sight in some huge awe-inspiring battle with all skills unlocked and all weapons blazing full bore. Wahoo this game is friggin amazing!!!

end flashback/dream sequence

You wake up at level one naked holding a wet noodle realizing it will be a LONG time before you feel that way again.

From what I can garner this is exactly what has happened here with giving players everything for nothing to play with, then taking it away. Sure might work ok in an offline RPG but in this genre it just seems to kitten a lot of people off.

It is the same reason (although partly in reverse) of why I skipped most of the BWE content. I wanted to be surprised by the new stuff and I knew I would be getting a good chunk of it after paying $100 for the kittening thing. Not only would I be seeing all the content, but it would be ready for prime time. Now I wish I had done as much of the beta events as I could because I will not see the things I had a taste of for a VERY long time. Especially on all my characters. Oh well, at least I get to play with the revenant specs.

Like someone else said earlier, there is not a match between what new specs I was looking forward to the most with what existing specs I like. In fact, the new spec I like the most is on a spec I loathe and hoped it would reinvigorate the profession. What is the point of my first HOT experience being with a profession I can not stand? I would think they would want people to have as good an impression of the jungle as possible.

Exactly. For me, the new Reaper spec looks fun for my languishing necro. I was looking forward to playing her again with the Reaper’s skills and traits.

But because I wasn’t happy with her existing specs, I never did world completion on her, and she has few hero points. So I’m forced to play her thru HoT with a spec I don’t like to get what I was looking forward to. Where’s the fun in that?

Now, on my mesmer, I like her current spec, like Chronomancer, and have 133 hero points. She might be fun in HoT as I earn hero points.

Funny thing about my Ranger main — she is my only character with World completion, and I have no interest in Druid. I’ll spend the points because they’re there, maybe get a skin.

My other characters are so far behind, I probably won’t play them. My poor engineer has almost no hero points, and like my necro, I was hoping to jump right into the Elite spec.

So I think I’ll be playing my mesmer, if I play at all. At this point, I’m actively looking for a new game.

Hexalot.8194:

Dhampyr.2813:

Hexalot.8194:

Menadena.7482:

Morfedel.4165:

Menadena.7482:

Yargesh.4965:

Menadena.7482:

Morfedel.4165:

I am trying to recall a single MMORPG where an expansion handed out everything you expected to get with it up front, rather than making you earn it. I can’t think of a single one, and this sense of entitlement just truly baffles me.

Entitlement?

We were told what to expect. People planned for that and did the work asked of them. Whether you liked it or not we knew the upper boundary.

Then they changed it. Not us.

What? They did not change anything since they have not until now given a number.

They stated world completion was the max. Until the datamine of 170 most people were assuming 100 HPs would be a good number to guess at. When we saw the 170 (which again many did not believe) and the progression for a typical profession I realized I could not get everything right away but about 120 would give me a good starting build.

Can you source that? Because i don’t think they said that, I think assumptions were made. That being the case, if they DID change that, because I won’t swear they didn’t, I have the following thoughts on that:

1. It IS uncool to change the info this late in the game. So if they said different before now, then yeah, I agree it’s uncool.

2. However, sometimes changes have to be made, for whatever reason: health of the game, technical issues, other stuff. It’s highly unlikely they are changing things just to make things a pain in the rear for us.

Wanna know something? I kinda thought we would have our elites unlocked if we had done all the hps in the core world, and I would have preferred it that way, so I could use my elites fully at the very beginning of HoT. That being the case, though, I don’t consider this a bad thing.

My problem is the massive rage we are seeing here. The sheer levels of it is ridiculous. If someone said “I’m not happy with this,” I could understand, but people are just burn-the-building-down angry, and it’s flat out unreasonable.

I do not recall the URL offhand but anet specifically said we could run the new content with elites if we had world completion.

Yes that’s correct. But… that was also around the time they stated you needed an additional 65 HPs to unlock the new core spec system. So basically anybody with World Completion were home free when they eventually release the Elite specs. But when they changed it so that just leveling to 80 would give you enough Hero Points to unlock core traits & utilities with no need for the additional 65 points, the whole “World Completion will unlock everything including elite specs” statement went out the window.

Thought they said that doing world completion would go along way to unlocking all of your elite spec. When did it change to unlocks everything? Ether way I’m glade I get to play the game in a way that lets my character grow, In a way that lets me slowly become a Reaper. I honestly dont want “hay look a jungle” and then “think I’m just going to pick up this great sword now and swing it at things”

Well you’re out of luck. It will literally only take 60 HPs for any Necro to “pick up that Great Sword and start swinging”. Sure, you don’t get all the traits to really make the Great Sword shine right off the bat. But the Great Sword’s 5 skills will still be unlocked for you to have fun with.

I don’t care about shield on my mesmer as I do about new utilities. See, the spec is a package of traits/skills/weap9ns, not just a weapon.

Inculpatus cedo.9234:

I have to say I don’t understand the forums.

Previously: Everything is too easy! We have nothing to do! Give us something, anything to do!

Now: OMG! You want us to do stuff??? This is uncalled for! Way too much to do!

Poor Devs.

I have never, even once, complained about “nothing to do.” Ever.

I do not like grinding for core mechanics. Grind may be “something to do”, but it is not fun. Fun is exploring and adventuring.

Make skill points like masteries, account-wide. I’ll work for them once, then enjoy various aspects of different classes without senseless grind.

arkealia.2713:

So you want elite spec unlocked right away? With all skins unlocked as well including all new legendaries? billions of each mats in the bank? All maps unlocked with an instant teleport to wherever you want option? Dev Menu? OHKO button? Cheat mode?

I don’t even remember anyone crying at GW2 release because they didn’t have all their skills and weapons unlocked right away.

Are you sure you really want to play and enjoy the game?

I consider new content to be adventure and exploration, not grinding. If I had only 1-2 characters, it wouldn’t be so bad, but by the third time thru the “content”, it’s grind. Hell, even the second time is boring.

I want content, not grind. Since masteries are account-wide, so should be skill points.

Mechanics are not content.

Places to see, adventures to have, that is content.

We are not asking for any freebies.

We are asking that, if we’ve done the world completion effort, that we be able to play the expansion content with expansion skills and traits.

No freebies, just recognition of our efforts. Don’t devalue the main game into nothing more than newbies and level grinding.

Menadena.7482:

Lunacy Solacio.6514:

The one to Rule.2593:

You aren’t obligated to get elite specs, you choose to do so voluntarily. No ones holding a gun to your head.

No instead they have people heaping derision on what was a big selling point for a number of people, that instead of it being a core part of HoT, it’s essentially ‘a reward’ for playing HoT. Quite a big difference.

Exactly. These specs have been hyped since day 1. Most of the news articles and points of interest streams were all about various elites. It was not like they were all-powerful either: while some fixed things others were just a flat-out ‘no’. It was clear they were aiming for a rough balance with existing professions.

Everyone expected to use them from day 1 (albeit with an unknown number of HPs, but we were assured it would be less that world completion would give us). I bought HOT for the new mechanics, I planned on looking at the new regions later at my own pace. There have been plenty of threads that took day-1 elites for granted ….. plenty of chances for someone at anet to say something.

Exactly my attitude as well. I pre-purchased the expansion in large part because the new specs looked fun for my mesmer and necro. I worked on gathering skill points so I could play those specs. I intended to take the new zones slowly.

That’s not what I’m getting. The new elite specs will, at best, be weak and incomplete, so to do the new content I’ll need to use the old traits/skills. I won’t be playing the new specs until after I’ve already worn out the expansion. I don’t get to use the new toys until after the fun is done.

But it’s just a game, and very optional. I’m already hunting a new place to waste time.

radioAspen.6829:

Can we stop calling people who went out and did entire world completion on their alts just to prepare for this “casual/lazy/want everything handed to them/whatever.”

I think the disparity here is what’s really awkward and shocking. It’s like, what’s the point of doing normal hero challenges now when one challenge in the jungle gives you more points than entire non-Orr maps in central Tyria

Anet is deliberately making the real world into a free-to-play realm, minimizng it’s value to veterans.

Which is a silly thing to do with 90% of available content.

Their goal is to make the old world unattractive so veterans buy the expansion. Levelling alts, however, can only be done in the old world. Perhaps they dislike altitis?

Walhalla.5473:

Sytherek.7689:

TJgalon.5012:

so, if I understand this right, the people are upset because they are not handed everything right out the gate?

No, I’m upset because ANet said we could unlock the elite spec with the extra effort of core world completion, and 3-days before release, they say we can’t.

Uhhm you can unlock the Elite Spec with extra Effort of World Completion. You “just” need the full 400 to get everything done which includes Skins and I think that the Skin(s) is the really expensive one there for the Elite Spec

IF core world completion earns me ALL elite traits and skills, I’ll be fine with that.

Cosmetic stuff? That I’ll grind for if I want it.

TJgalon.5012:

so, if I understand this right, the people are upset because they are not handed everything right out the gate?

No, I’m upset because ANet said we could unlock the elite spec with the extra effort of core world completion, and 3-days before release, they say we can’t.

Vavume.8065:

So let me break this down for the casual players that think you were just going to login on day one of HoT release and be able to access the new elite specs in all their glory, why would that have ever been the case? this is an expansion, this is new content, obtaining the elite specs should require you to work for it, I’m sorry I don’t know what games you have been playing where you don’t have to do anything to get the things you want, but I’m happy that its not this game.

I don’t consider doing 100% world completion + other stuff to be “casual”.

ANet has been bragging on the coolness of the new specs. I’ve spent $100s in the gem store supporting this game.

I already worked for the spec by accumulating 214 skillpoints beyond what was needed for the core game. I already did the grind. Why else let us get that many extra skill points? Wasn’t that so they were worth something?

Sytherek.7689:

ColinJohanson.2394:

Unlocking your elite spec is a training line in your training panel that costs hero points. You do need to have trained all the existing training lines before you’re allowed to put hero points into your elite spec.

If you’ve got all the hero points in the existing game you’ll have enough to train about half the elite specialization training line on launch day. The rest you’ll need to earn in the jungle or via the new system Tyler outlined yesterday from WvW. The number of points to fully train your elite spec is higher than other training lines – but hero challenges in the jungle are worth 10 points each, so it’s not actually as big as it appears.

Terribly, awfully, grindy, Colin.

I have a main with 100% everything (accomplished under the old must-do-WvW system), have had for a while. Locking her elite spec behing monumental grind is not good or fun.

I have 2 other characters at about 75% world completion. I’m not about to grind them, and my main, through thousands of hours of repetitive content just to get an elite spec I PAID FOR.

I have a life. Guild Wars 2 is recreation, not my life.

We will not be buying the expansion for two other (wife, daughter) accounts in this house.

I regret buying the expansion for myself.

Nice playing your game while it was fun. Now that it’s “grind wars”, we’re off to brighter pastures. Not a rage quit, a simple anti-grind viewpoint.

If I can get all the skills / traits with old world completion, my grouchiness might abate SLIGHTLY. I play for gameplay, not shinies, so if I need to grind only for pretties, I can accept that.

But I’m not about to grind for basic gameplay like skills and traits.

ColinJohanson.2394:

Unlocking your elite spec is a training line in your training panel that costs hero points. You do need to have trained all the existing training lines before you’re allowed to put hero points into your elite spec.

If you’ve got all the hero points in the existing game you’ll have enough to train about half the elite specialization training line on launch day. The rest you’ll need to earn in the jungle or via the new system Tyler outlined yesterday from WvW. The number of points to fully train your elite spec is higher than other training lines – but hero challenges in the jungle are worth 10 points each, so it’s not actually as big as it appears.

Terribly, awfully, grindy, Colin.

I have a main with 100% everything (accomplished under the old must-do-WvW system), have had for a while. Locking her elite spec behing monumental grind is not good or fun.

I have 2 other characters at about 75% world completion. I’m not about to grind them, and my main, through thousands of hours of repetitive content just to get an elite spec I PAID FOR.

I have a life. Guild Wars 2 is recreation, not my life.

We will not be buying the expansion for two other (wife, daughter) accounts in this house.

I regret buying the expansion for myself.

Nice playing your game while it was fun. Now that it’s “grind wars”, we’re off to brighter pastures. Not a rage quit, a simple anti-grind viewpoint.

Regina Buenaobra.6193:

There will be no POI next week because the team will all be at TwitchCon… where we will talk about the final profession spec, as well as more cool stuff on our TwitchCon stream.

Now let’s all calm down and tune into Points of Interest today at noon.

My hope is that ANet is saving the “best” for last, and wants to really make publicity at TwitchCon with a momentous and thrilling reveal of the Ranger Druid. Better pet AI, a really cool elite spec, maybe some really sexy staves…

Please don’t disappoint me.

Thanks for the candor and update, Gaile. This is what I expect from professional customer service.

Many of us HAVE posted direct solutions and suggestions. Perhaps addressing those would alleviate much of the frustration, and put proof to your assertion that ANet is listening.

Boring enemies, terrible-paltry rewards for time invested…

- Needs a progression / final event like Scarlet invasions.
- Mobs should drop loot.
- Boring, repetitive, nothing but frantic running about. Boring.
- Very weak rewards. Very, very weak. Lousy, actually.
- Give credit only to people who actually participate in an event instead of rewarding those who just tag-and-run.
- The DC issue is getting worse on some systems. It is not always our internet connections.

If ANet wants GW2 to appeal to selfish farmers, they’ve done a great job.
Please fix this.

Even after the patch, this is the worst “event” ever in terms of reward, challenge, and interest. Boring enemies, terrible-paltry rewards for time invested… really, truly, poorly presented for newbies, if this event had occurred before I bought the expansion, I would not have laid down money for hot.

1. - Needs a progression / final event like scarlet invasions.
2. - Mobs should drop loot.
3. - Credit only given to people who actually participate in an event instead of tagging-and-running.

And what’s worse? No communication from ANet addressing the concerns above, even though a lot of people have raised them.

If ANet wants GW2 to appeal to selfish farmers, they’ve done a great job.

Please fix this.

Boring zergfest with crappy rewards for time invested. Did it once, 32 events done, 25 rewards, not worth it for 30 minutes of work.

Alec B.8905:

Please explain

When you log into the game, all traits are reset to zero, no trait points were refunded, they are gone, and you can’t use any trait points you have still available to set your traits.

BADLY broken.

It’d be a great update if my character’s traits weren’t reset to 0 and the game won’t let me set them.

Very annoying.

What gives?