Guild Wars 2

Sarrs.4831:

wow

it’s almost

almost like latency is more dependent on the server and other external factors than your own computer specs, particularly regarding components which have nothing to do with data I/O

who would have thought

Exactly, which is annoying when people say “Get a better computer dude.” I’m preeeetty sure it’s not a problem on my own end.

Tyrantis.8640:

Then how come I never get ‘game crippling’ lag? I run an i7 with only a nVidia GTX 460 with 8 gigs of ram. Nothing super awesome… but better than most friends.

I play on Tarnished Coast (the most populated server) and do dragon runs Friday and Saturday nights (the most populated nights) and I am never unable to move due to end user lag. I have experienced server lag 2 times since beta.

I would say I play around 20-40 hours a week so you know I am not a newbie just blabbing about things.

Is it possible that you are being dramatic? Every event can’t lag THAT much for you if I have yet to experience it at all on my mid-high machine.

You want to post videos? It’s not that I don’t believe you, but I have an i7, 680, 16 GB ram, with a 50 Mbps. I play on CD, and the server lag is so bad that during Jormag, my heal skills go off like 5 seconds after I press it.

Though in principle I agree with Robert, agony resist is something that won’t affect pets in the open-world but is really needed for Fractals. It seems a no-brainer to me, and I’m sure it’ll come down eventually.

Psynch.4087:

I mostly agree with OP on this topic. However, I don’t necessarily mind the probability of getting rares from the big bosses.

Instead, I have a problem with just how embarrassingly mindless the fights are. There is literally no strategy involved. The zergs have no problem spamming 1 and easily downing dragons. That seems so insanely wrong to me. I was truly surprised when the new patch didn’t include some counters to the ‘sweet spots’ for the dragons (where a mass of players stand in one location that doesn’t get hit by attacks).

I don’t just want loot from the bosses, I want the sense of accomplishment; I want to feel as though people strategically worked together to defeat the most powerful beings in the world. Then I’ll gladly take the rare.

Agree with this. Something I suggested in another topic is for Anet to develop some kind of crowd-detecting algorithm that allows the dragons to detect large clumps of players. Then make the bosses drop AoE/mobs onto these locations. It will encourage movement, at the very least, and that is good.

Another suggestion is to make the mechanics like the siege in Shatterer/Mega Laser in Teq/Pact Golem/Bombs in Jormag much more important and the focal point, instead of players autoattacking away. Place them in multiple locations too, so you don’t get players focused on just one spot. If all these siege/lasers/etc. fall, you can acually FAIL the mission. This gives an incentive to actually carry out objectives instead of autoattacking the boss.

I feel the Temple events are already a pretty good template. Just apply some of the similar philosophies to the Dragon fights/low level bosses, and I think we’ll be good.

Flamenco.3894:

This game is doomed with all this excess of loot.

I hope you succeeded in getting that refund.

Tiger Ashante.1792:

I honestly can’t believe people on this forum. I mean all I’ve read here in the past few months is complaint after complaint about lack of loot, or at least decent loot. Now the loot has been improved, the complaints of ‘too much’ loot are starting to appear. Geez! Is there no pleasing u people!

This line of thinking is really annoying me. Has it occurred to you that people are individuals, and hold differing opinions? That “u people” don’t all share the same thoughts?

Look through my post history please, and tell me when I complained about the lack of loot.

Also people seem to be misunderstanding that I don’t like more loot. No, I love more loot. However, I do not like the symptoms of more loot. Barring technical solutions (which tends to be very difficult. Look at how long it’s taken them to fix culling) I propose the solutions listed.

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

Ursan.7846:

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

Hawkian.6580:

These exist, by the way. At least one weapon and piece of jewelry per boss.

I’m working on a spreadsheet of them, but it’s currently very incomplete.

Did you get “Sentinel’s Bane” from the Shatterer? I got that the other night.

The Shatterer also drops a jewelery named “Kralltorik’s(sp?) Breathe.” I’ve seen people link that.

At this point I’m now going to want to see this list when it reaches a deeper level of completion.

Also, bosses need to get more interesting scaling methods. Like, evolving to get new attacks if a crowd is there versus one group.

Completely and utterly agreed with this. They did say they’re introducing some kind of new event-scaling system that introduces new creatures at higher populations.

But this is a mechanic I’d like to suggest. The boss should have an algorithm to detect large clumps of players and proceed to drop AoE/creatures on top of it. They should have the metrics to develop this algorithm. They have a player activity heat map that they showed us, so I’m sure it’s within their capabilities. Right now one of the biggest problems contributing to the “lazy” feel of these boss fights is the large clumps of people who sit in one spot and autoattack. Dropping AoEs and creatures on big concentration of players will encourage movement and make the fight generally more exciting.

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

Hawkian.6580:

These exist, by the way. At least one weapon and piece of jewelry per boss.

I’m working on a spreadsheet of them, but it’s currently very incomplete.

Did you get “Sentinel’s Bane” from the Shatterer? I got that the other night.

The Shatterer also drops a jewelery named “Kralltorik’s(sp?) Breathe.” I’ve seen people link that.

Destroyer.1306:

But all those things take time.

The low-level events of Fire Elemental, Maw, and Behemoth takes no time at all.

The biggest culprits are Maw and Fire Elemental, since they have like a 30-minute respawn timer. Which makes it incredibly easy to find a server to guest to where those events are about to happen.

As can be seen from the ecto price crash, numbers of rares in the economy have DEFINITELY increased.

Minos.5168:

Ursan.7846:

Uh? Where did you hear they bolstered the servers?

Are you sure it’s just not just the players all flocking to the world events?

Well, I guess it could just be that there aren’t as many people playing anymore.

But that wouldn’t be good news at all, would it?

It’s a serious question. Do you have a source?

Uh? Where did you hear they bolstered the servers?

Are you sure it’s just not just the players all flocking to the world events?

Verrah.3027:

I believe the loot should stay as it is with the world bosses. However, the difficulty/length of these world bosses should be improved. Once you start getting the massive groups of players seen now, the bosses should become almost as difficult as some of the temple events in Orr.

Completely agreed with this. I think the Orr temple events are a really good template. It has players doing events in a pretty spread out area. And the bosses themselves aren’t a complete pushover either. Rewards for events like that? Totally deserving.

Rewards like that for events like Maw/Behemoth/Fire Elemental? Hell no.

Syeria.4812:

Pretty much every currency in the game can be converted to gold.

Karma can be spent on Orrian Jewelry Boxes to make vendor trash items and lodestones. It can also be spent on items that can be put in the mystic forge, which results in items that can be sold on TP or to a vendor.

Dungeon tokens can purchase items that can be put in the forge.

Laurels can purchase crafting materials, unid dyes, or gear boxes.

Gems can be directly sold for gold.

Skill points can be used to promote crafting materials to more valuable ones which can be sold on the TP.

Guild commendations can (combined with 10s) purchase gear boxes, whose contents can be sold on the TP for more than the gold cost.

The only currencies that can’t be converted to gold are the guild bound ones (Merits and Influence, although gold can be converted to influence) and Glory which is exclusive to sPvP and is the sole currency for that part of the game.

You can think the exchange rate isn’t satisfactory to you, but you can’t claim that the currencies cannot be converted.

Well yes, but I’d like to point out that many of these currencies can’t be converted back from gold.

Again, multiple currencies are simply a symptom of Anet wanting you to vary your playstyle a bit. For all their talk of “play the way you want,” they do believe in strongly encouraging you to try and do many parts of their game.

What the kitten is so wrong with being able to buy ascended accessories with karma?

Because it wouldn’t give you a reason to do Guild Missions, Dailies, and Fractals. It makes obtaining them incredibly easy, which is something Anet does not want.

lisamee.2408:

The world events that are now giving a reward worth playing that event take time and group effort.

Currently, events like The Maw, Behemoth, and Fire Elemental take no time and group effort at all. People realize this, which is why they’re flocking to these events in huge numbers.

lisamee.2408:

If the reward is nerfed again, then why do the event?

Both extremes are bad. You can’t overnerf it, but you can’t overbuff it either (which is what they did.). As I said, they should reduce loot rate of rares for the low-level events to like 25%. That is still higher than the drop rate than previously, but still not so high as to make doing these events a no brainer.

Hellkaiser.6025:

3: If you consider “EA games” as a successful company, you have some strange ideals of what makes a successful company, Riot Games does things VASTLY different to the likes of EA and is FAR more successful, what does that tell you about the actions of EA?

Also their dante’s inferno advertising fiasco set the gaming industry back SEVERAL YEARS in public opinion. You ursan clearly have NO IDEA what you’re talking about. And I’ll take the infraction to tell you that with a grain of salt.

A company’s ultimate purpose is to make money for its shareholders. EA is a pretty crummy company that does a lot of things I do not like. But they are financially quite successful. A quick look at their stock shows that it has increased in value over the last year. They must be doing something right, despite the crap they get.

Whenever you want. It is completely up to you to get that refund. Put a question in the accounts subforums.

However, you won’t gain much sympathy from the General subforums.

Reaver.9256:

You can call it an exploit all you want but it isn’t.

It’s not technically an exploit, but it’s still pretty dang annoying.

People guest to world events because of the timers.

If Behemoth in my world is 2 more hours, while teh Behemoth in Blackgate was 20 more minutes, I’ll guest over there to do it.

How do I know this? Because my guildies and I all do it. We hop around to minimize the time we spend waiting on the timer.

Another thing is you can tell from the guilds. Guilds I know for a fact which are based on other servers from WvW, I see their tags pretty frequently in CD.

While whether this is the main culprit, we don’t know. However, it does exist.

laokoko.7403:

ya my server is one of the most populated server so I dont think that help.

Only time I have any technical problem is when I got 50-100 people standing at a way point waiting for bounty to start, and there’s problem with culling.

But other then that, I dont’ think I have any “technical” problem, or anything major before.

So what exactly is your problem? “the lag”? “fps?”, “culling”?

I really never have any lag or fps due to too much people around. culling maybe but never lag or fps.

Lag. Major major lag. To the point where I can’t play effectively.

I play on CD, and guested on Devona’s Rest and Blackgate so far, and all 3 of them are bad or worse.

But I mean, other people have already highlighted the problem. There’s several threads talking about the lag/overflow issues that people have been experiencing.

laokoko.7403:

I’m sorry to hear. But I don’t have any problem. So if that’s not a computer spec or latency problem. I don’t know why I don’t have problem and you do.

What server are you on? Perhaps I can try your server.

YPC.6349:

CoF path 1 is just the “most stupid” of them, not the only one. There are plenty of dungeons that are waaaaay more “stupid” than maw, hotw p1 etc. In fact, if you want to nerf “stupid” farm and make it fair, you pretty much have to revamp most of the dungeons. Anet are just bring half of the “stupidity” out of dungeon. If I farm, I still farm dungeons. If you just want to complain lag, as the above post said, move or guest to a server with population you feel happy with or wait until anet fix the performance issue.

HotW path 1 actually takes like 20 minutes to do at least. When I say “stupid” I mean the time required. And Maw, especially in a big zerg, lasts no more than 5 minutes. And you also have absolutely no risk of dying at all.

lisamee.2408:

The lag problem can be fixed without decreasing the Fun (rewards). The problem as a whole with GW2, is that there are not enough variety of rewards (items in the game). So the few places that have the few items people want are going to always be crowded.

Look at the game as a whole, before deciding to nerf the few reward items available.

You’re simplifying the problem. The reason why the WOrld Events are crowded to the point of hitting the limits of the game because they’re incredible rewarding for how easy they are. While Orr/Dungeons were profitable before, they were also arguably difficult.

You have to bring the reward/effort ratio to be the same. To do that you have to either.

1. Lower World Event loot
2. Make Lower World Event more challenging
3. Increase loot everywhere else
4. Lower difficulty of events everywhere else.

I don’t see 2/4 happening, and I don’t see 3 happening either because they’ll make rares almost masterwork-level (i.e drops like candy) and I’m sure Anet does not want rares to be that common.

YPC.6349:

COF 1
end of discussion

CoF path 1 is also pretty stupid. It’s existence doesn’t mean this is stupid also, however.

laokoko.7403:

ya I mean if you find that a problem, you can always “guest” to the lower population server.

Get a better computer?

transfer to a lower population server?

I actually tried. I guested to Devona’s Rest to do Jormag, but the lag was terrible there. And I think it’s one of the lower-populated servers.

I also assure you, my computer’s specs are the least of my worries. But even then, getting better computers to compensate for Anet’s mistakes is not a good solution.

arjeidi.2690:

“People are playing in a way that I don’t, by choice, and are getting rewards. I think new systems need to be implemented to restrict their freedoms and choice and reduce the amount of rewards they can earn.”

Awesome. Please be sure to add “in my opinion” to your thread title.

When I disagree with something, of course it’s my opinion. I simply posted what I thought of the matter and proposed solutions.

But I think you’re misunderstanding me a bit. I do love the loot. More loot is always good. If there were none of this lag/culling/overflow issues, I wouldn’t mind at all. But there is. And fixing engine-level issues is a very complex task (Which I don’t even know if it’s possible. Look at how long it’s been taking them to fix culling.), as opposed to just changing loot tables. Which is why I propose these solutions.

PS. Didn’t you lecture critickitten in his thread about how his dissatisfaction with recent events is simply because ANet’s decisions aren’t in his best interests specifically, but they may still be in the best interest of the playerbase as a whole?

This is actually a great example of something the player base really wants (Better loot) actually impacting the game negatively (lag/overflow issues.)

Don’t get me wrong, I love getting good loot. But I also still want to have fun while doing these events, while still getting decent loot. This is why I think making the chests per account/dropping it to maybe 25% would discourage the horde a little bit, and yet still make it pretty rewarding (as compared to previously anyways).

Kilrain Daggerspine.6843:

it is however a good reason to improve server power, lower performance requirements etc, stuff that could be bloody useful in general.

While those are the best solutions, it’s also probably the hardest technically. You don’t just snap your finger and increase performance/server bandwith. Expecting those as solution is to be unrealistic and ignoring technical limitations.

Reaver.9256:

Once per account is a very very big limitation for me. Why should I be punished for using alts? I’m sorry if some people only use one character, but that’s there choice.

It is, and it’s Anet’s fault for giving you that choice. It’s only natural that people like you will do these events repeatedly with alts. Not your fault at all, Anet just made a system that’s greatly encourages everyone to go there.

Anet needs to lower the incentive a little bit.

Kilrain Daggerspine.6843:

Even with this decent rare chance, it is still far more profitable to simply farm something else

Tell me where else in the game where I can get a rare for 2 minutes of spamming 1?

There isn’t. Which is why you see these hordes of people descending on the World Events. It’s not their fault, it’s the system’s fault. Make loot this easy to achieve. Of course people will focus on these spots. Look at all the threads popping up complaining about lag and overflow issues. They are proof of the massive influx of players these Events have seen.

The biggest problem are Behemoth, Maw, and Fire Elemental. They are just waaay too easy. But even the Dragons, while taking a bit more time, is still pretty much braindead as it is. Events this easy shouldn’t have loot this good, or EVERYONE will do them, straining the system.

SupahSpankeh.8452:

it’s a complex thing building an MMO.

This.

You can’t even begin to imagine the dependencies you have to worry about when changing anything.

Also, many things that work perfectly fine when tested in-house simply does not when you implement live. Stuff like the BLT and the Join Party in overflow system worked flawless in in BWE. Did not when the game launched.

There’s bugs, but there will be always bugs in MMOs. Such is the nature of the beast.

(And no, PTR is not the answer to these issues).

I posted this before, but several posters quickly derailed the thread with personal insults and such. Lets keep it civil this time.

With the World Events guaranteeing rares, it has become everyone’s favorite farming spot. Because they have timers, people are guesting to other servers in an attempt to find a server where events are about to occur.

And why wouldn’t you, when hitting the Maw shaman for 20 seconds net you a yellow, with a high chance of exotics?

This has caused huge lag/overflow problems at the events themselves. The events themselves are no longer fun to do because of the large amount of people.

There’s obviously technical limitations to the engine and bandwith that is hard to get around. So I’m going to assume that fixing lag/culling/overflow issue is a engine-level problem, something difficult to solve.

So I propose the following solutions.

1. Decrease rare/exotic drop rate from 90% or whatever to 25%. Still quite high, but not nearly guaranteed like it is right now.

OR

2. Limit chest to one account per character.

I propose these solutions because I think they’re well within the realm of possibility of you guys. You changed loot tables, so obviously that shouldn’t be too hard, and you have character/account based rewards, so that too shouldn’t be too bad.

If not, then the problems with lag and people getting kicked out to overflow will continue. Now while I’d love for you guys to fix that, or make rewards home-server-character-specific, but I imagine that takes a lot more effort to do. If you can do it though, great! But if not, at lease please consider the mentioned solutions.

TL;DR Loot rate for World Events too high for the minimum effort they require, causing World Events to be not fun. Barring technical solutions (Which I understand is hard) should nerf loot rates, because I honestly don’t mind less loot if the events themselves are much more fun to do.

The currencies are good. They are the result of a design decision made by the game designers to award specific rewards for specific content.

Now that the Devs decided that they want to give you specific rewards for specific gameplay, in order to reduce the RNG factor they introduce currency. After you do certain activities for a while, you’re guaranteed a reward. This is good. It’s less RNG. Imagine if dungeon armor was a random drop, instead of the token system right now.

So currencies is simply the symptom of a design decision they made. To specific things to specific activities. Now you may disagree with this decision, but to some length it is really needed to give players reasons to do these said specific activities which would be ignored otherwise. If there was a single currency with which you can obtain everything, no one will do difficult content, because they can earn the currency easier elsewhere. So in order to enforce rarity, Devs have to rely on RNG, etc….

TL;DR Multiple currency is good. It encourages players to vary their playstyle and reduces the RNG element in rewards.

OP do you mind mailing me your gold?

Mungrul.9358:

Could this be ArenaNet repeating the mistakes of old?
In the first game, when you got your armour ascended, they didn’t take into account your pet.
They eventually fixed this.
Unbelievable that they would make the same mistake twice. I guess it really IS a completely different team.

It’s also a completely different game engine.

But Robert, I main a Ranger also and pets dying to agony is unavoidable. There’s many cases in which no amount of micro will keep the pet alive (Dredge Suit boss, Cliffside boss just off the top of my head.) This is the single biggest problem Rangers have in fractals, IMO.

SpyderArachnid.5619:

Ursan.7846:

I don’t see Anet saying you required agony resistance for high level fractals either. They’re not. You can step into a 40 fractal with 0 agony resist you know.

Actually, they did say that.

Players who wish to delve deep into the Fractals will find that Agony makes progress increasingly difficult, until they reach the point where some defense against this condition is a must.

https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/linsey-murdock-unveils-new-high-end-ascended-gear/

You tricked me there, kudos to you.

It’s a moot point still. You can still walk into fractals without any agony resistance, if you want to take the definition of “requirement” literally.

SpyderArachnid.5619:

So you are skipping content to avoid having to use Ascended items? So you are still saying that you need Agony Resistance, which requires Ascended items, to defeat Jade Maw then right? Otherwise, you have to skip him which means skipping content because you don’t have the required gear for it. So again, Ascended items are required to do Fractals.

No, you can do Maw at difficulties 1-20. The agony won’t kill you, even without agony resistance.

Maw at difficulties 20+ is the EXACT same as 1-20. The only difference is his agony hurts more.

So yes, the only “content” you’re missing out in high level fractals is the Maw hurting more.

SpyderArachnid.5619:

And it is perfectly possible to do DoA and all the HM Dungeons without PvE skills. I don’t see anywhere saying that it is required that I bring them do you? Did Anet make a statement saying that in order to do those dungeons, I am required to bring PvE skills? No, they did not. They are not required for anything.

Oh. Well if you want to take that definition (Like, literally required).

I don’t see Anet saying you required agony resistance for high level fractals either. They’re not. You can step into a 40 fractal with 0 agony resist you know.

The point is doing so makes completing it incredibly difficult. Possible? of course, with perfect skill, you will be able to dodge all the agony attacks (And they are all dodge-able.).

Same thing. PvE skills makes things a lot easier. You can probably do it without them, sure, but it’ll be incredibly difficult.

SpyderArachnid.5619:

Which is wrong cause you can’t do high level Fractals without having Ascended gear. And when the full set of Ascended gear is released, you can bet that it is going to make a big enough impact that you’ll need it to survive in WvWvW as well.

I’d like to see you doing Mallyx, or heck the entire DoA, with rank 0 Lightbringer. Or doing Hardmode Dungeons without any of the PvE skills (SY/TNtF).

By the way, high level fractals are still do-able without agony resistance. Most agony attacks can be dodged. Jade Maw is the only attack that you can’t dodge. And even that can be avoided if you do odd numbered fractals. It’s obviously stupid to do, because agony resistance makes it much easier. But it’s the same exact thing with GW1.

EDIT: Also, Fractals is gated difficulty, not gated content. You can play through all 9 fractals. Slight difference.

SpyderArachnid.5619:

And if you want to go title route, you can play GW1 all the way through without using a single title skill.

You can also play GW2 all the way through without a single Ascended item.

SpyderArachnid.5619:

So sorry, but no. There was no vertical progression there either.

No, there is. Just because it’s optional doesn’t mean it doesn’t exist. It’s there.

If you do want to define “Vertical progression” as something that is completely mandatory, then it doesn’t exist in GW2 either. Heck you don’t even need Exotics to clear content.

Halandir.3609:

Ursan.7846:

titles? And how grinding out titles made you do more damage?

Pv frigging E damage!!! on 6 out of 60/70 titles

Titles that you could max doing a multitude of activities… Please… Accept the difference here!

What’s the difference? You can get more PvE damage by getting Ascended gear, which you can get from a multitude of activities (via laurels.).

Obviously certain methods are going to be more efficient. (Speedrunning faction/running fractals vs doing ABs/Jade Quarry/doing dailies/monthlies). But it’s still the same.

Kaputsid.5169:

Armors, Insignias and runes. That’s it. All the rest is pve related and was solely designed for scripts farmers.

So 40k bill at worst, sell zKeys/amber/jadeite = 10 hrs of pvp if you were bad like me

Pvped with same gears in all instances until gw2 came out.

No vertical progression there, sorry.

Just because you chose not to partake in the game’s PvE, doesn’t mean it didn’t exist. It does. And vertical progression existed in it.

SpyderArachnid.5619:

You’re comparing armor to insignias. Which is right away, completely wrong.

If anything, you should be comparing insignias to runes in GW2, cause that is what they are. Armor wise, GW1 didn’t go the vertical progression route. The armor is the same. Adding insignias is not comparable to vertical progression in GW2.

Vertical progression in GW2 is based on higher stat armor. No runes/gems/infusions and such. Just adding higher stats to armor. They didn’t do that in GW1. All armor was horizontal in GW1, cause they never added a higher stat armor to the game. GW1 has insignias to make your gear stronger, just like GW2 has runes/gems/infusions to make your gear stronger as well.

You’re trying to compare apples to oranges and it just doesn’t work.

Higher stats = higher stats, whether it comes from a new tier of armor or armor upgrades. This is ignoring the fact that for certain builds, certain upgrades were REQUIRED (55 monk? perma SR sin?) whereas more numbers from a ascneded isn’t really required.

Regardless, if you really don’t like comparing the armor upgrades, what about the titles? And how grinding out titles made you do more damage?

Raire.7983:

Let’s not pretend everyone supported the silly power/grind-creep that developed in GW1. PvE skills were highly contentious, and debated as heatedly as similar issues now.

Oh no I don’t pretend that everyone likes it at all. But too frequently do I see people justify their dislike of a power creep by saying “GW2 has vertical progression, GW1 didn’t.” Which is not true.

Halandir.3609:

Ursan.7846:

I call BS.

Kurzick/Luxon takes 10,000,000 faction total to achieve.

Good call I guess – Yet the last two tiers of kurz/lux faction have absolutely ZERO relevance to skills/PvE performance.

(All tiers have zero relevance to PvP for those who never played GW)

You’re right. But regardless, you’re still forced to do a very specific thing in order to gain a slight increase in numbers. Which is something GW1 definitely had, and people seem to forget when they decry the vertical progression present in GW2.

Rising Dusk.2408:

John most definitely will not respond with an answer to your liking. If he did, it would shock the Crystalline Dust market. Regardless, I do wish these things dropped more often.

He will…SHOCK the world! He is none other then…the SHOCKMASTER.

Ilithis Mithilander.3265:

Luck/Treasure Hunter/Luck I wouldn’t count, with the weekend events; SS/LB, books for the 4 EotN ones, and speedclears for Kurzick OR Luxon were not that bad. I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt though and say 3 weeks because I forgot about the 4 EotN titles.

I call BS.

Kurzick/Luxon takes 10,000,000 faction total to achieve. The best speedruns get you about 50,000 faction/hour (Assuming perfect skill/experience).

Source: http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Faction_farm

That is 200 hours. Of doing nothing but speed running. 2 weeks is 14 days. That is 14 hours a day you’re doing nothing but Kurzick speed runs.

Lets not forget the Sunspear/Lightbringer/EoTN stuff.

If you seriously did everything in 3 weeks, then congrats to you, but I highly doubt most people have that much time to dedicate to this game.

Conner.4702:

Except the title tracks were not mandatory. Only elitists demanded high rank titles. The content was just as accessible without the PvE only skills.

The exact same thing can be said for Ascended gear, with the exception of high level fractals. (Which is difficulty gating, not content gating.)

By the way, on a slightly off-topic note, I really really really miss lockpicks. And the luck/unlucky title tracks =(.

gimmethegepgun.1284:

The difference is that GW1 never added more powerful equipment post-launch.
There were some runes added, but most of them were crap (like those majors that reduced condition duration), and Vitae/Attunements which were mainly just filler for slots you didn’t have a rune in, but none that were inarguably stronger.
Vertical progression beyond what it had at launch being added to the game is what people have a problem with.

I really can’t argue with this. But I will point out GW2 before Ascended had a ton less vertical progression (max effectiveness very easily with exotics) than GW1 (Good luck maxing out all those titles.). After it though, it’s now pretty similar.

Ilithis Mithilander.3265:

Getting max gear in GW1 took two weeks at most, even with title grinding.

Correct me if I’m wrong, but you’re saying you were able to achieve max titles in 2 weeks?

Sunspear/Lightbringer/Kurzick(Luxon)/Ebon Vanguard/Deldrimor/Asura/Norn/Wisdom/Treasure Hunter/Luck?

That stuff took a LONG time to max.

CassieGold.7460:

1) Alternate Gameplay could get you any item in GW1. Nothing was locked between a time gate or a specific instance, you could buy / trade for anything you could reach. One could argue that the act of forging FoW armor required you to go to FoW and complete one quest to access the forge itself, but that is shallow compared to the requisite to run Fractals repeatedly or any of the other gates.

You seem to have missed my title track portion of the post. I was pretty much forced to run ABs/Jade Quarry to increase my effectiveness of Save Yourselves. Gear wasn’t the only way to increase your character’s effectiveness.

CassieGold.7460:

All GW1 heros had max level armor when your character was at max level. In addition, hero armor functioned as infused without having to make an ‘infusion run.’

Yes, but you could make them even more effective through insignias and runes. That is the definition of vertical progression. GW1 had it.

As a former GW1 player, I’m always slightly puzzled when people decry the vertical progression in GW2 by saying “GW1 did not have vertical progression!”

That isn’t true at all. It most DEFINITELY had vertical progression, and grind associated with said progression.

Yes, you could get max armor very easily, but to reach true max stats, you had to get Insignias and Runes for your armor. Some of the best Insignias/Runes were quite pricy (Superior Vigor was like what, 30 plat?). And on top of that you had your heroes, who all could be equipped with Insignias/Runes. Fully upgrading all your hero’s armor took AGES.

Then you had the title tracks. As a Paragon, I had to grind to max out my Sunspear and Kurzick titles to achieve maximum effectiveness. There were also many other title tracks like Lightbringer, Ebon Vanguard, etc. that increased damage of certain skills. Those are vertical progression. Of titles, not gear.

GW2 and GW1 has very similar philosophies in terms of vertical progression. You can get near-max stats relatively easily (Max level armor in GW1, Exotics in GW2) but after that, it’s a grind to get very minimal gains (4 ranks of Kurzick for one extra second on Save Yourselves, 10 fractal runs just for one Ascended ring).

Now, you can still disagree on whether the game should have vertical progression or not. That is your opinion, and I respect it. Just please don’t bring up GW1 as an example of a “purely horizontal progression” game. Because it isn’t.

TL;DR GW1 had vertical progression. Don’t pretend like it didn’t.

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

They also draw people to keep coming back to a game where there’s no subscription fee to guilt them into being active. Lest it be forgotten, daily quests showed up the last two . . . two? . . . years of GW1 as a means of “something to do to get people to go to older content and not just a few spots”.

I do remember being incredibly happy when a daily Zaishen mission was on a Mission that I have not done before. Very very happy.

When people complain about being “forced” to do things…Well yes, Anet is encouraging you to do different things, but many of these things are ultimately good for the game as a whole (Daily Dodger, anyone?) and serves to funnel players into the lesser populated areas of the game. Which is good!

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

Read closer. I’m not talking about the gear, especially when you can buy it from players if you have enough coin on hand. If anything that game had such a simplistic approach to gear it was almost a negligible concern for 90% of the time you were playing. It’s the titles which had it.

And before you tell me they don’t count because you could ignore them, stop and think long and hard on if you want to pull that exact line which gets people blasted on these forums concerning Fractals.

I actually was being sarcastic. I apologize if it didn’t come across well. I worked my kitten off for 3 years in GW to get everything I mentioned, plus the Lucky/Salvage titles, and I still don’t have GWAMM.