Guild Wars 2

Ashen.2907:

STIHL.2489:

Ok. Here is the problem.

Is a Legendary Weapon/Item, a sign of prestige, or is it a functional advantage?

If it’s a sign of prestige, it does not need any changes, It’s already got a huge larger then life graphic, and feet effects that scream “look at me”

If it’s functional, it needs to be made a heck of a lot less grind, to make it accessible for the population, who will need this stupid item to stay competitive.

Solid points IMO.

If only everything that had any sort of functional advantage was easily accessible to the population. I’m looking at you Permanent Bank Access Contract, Permanent black lion merchant contract, and permanent trading post express contract. However, the above isn’t really my point.

I agree with the OP mainly because there has been so much work put into the game to try to increase build diversity without taking rune/sigil/stat swapping into consideration. They added viper stats, commander stats, changed how conditions work etc. Before it was just berserker. Now for chrono you need some commanders for raids, some assassins for fractals, and a different set for WvW. Thats 3 different sets of ascended armor if you want to be optimal for one class. Then if you want to play ele you have to use scholar runes instead of chrono runes and for Necro you need Viper armor with Thorn runes. Before, it was never like this. Times have changed. If an encounter requires different stats, then people will expect you to have them by switching armor sets. This will happen regardless of weather or not legendary armor or weapons has sigil/rune switching. To me, the ability to swap runes/sigils so I don’t have to carry multiple sets of armor alone would be a nice little perk for spending so much money on skins that are now even starting to look phased out by many of the black lion skins.

Silverkey.2078:

Do you remember the time when all traitlines were viable? We had many very viable variants, like dom+duel + chaos (PU power shatter or interrupt), dom + duel + insp (mantra power shatter), dom+duel+illusion (another power shatter variant), duel + chaos + illusion (PU condi shatter), duel + insp + illusion (mantra condi shatter). At this time, our main diversity problem was our reliance on Dueling, this line you now consider “our weak line” , and inspiration was actually one of the least used one? We were even complaining on the forum that the line is weak (which I still think it is, mostly because I feel that it is too focused on survivability and not enough on support while being our main support line). Fun how things change!

Apparently, running with no cleanse or with only a utility cleanse was enough.

Since you like to compare us with elementalist, let me remind you how mesmer has much stronger damage avoidance and that we often build with the idea to simply avoid all damage and simply disengage in stealth if things turn bad.

So what does that say about the balance of our different lines? Well I believe it means our core traitline balance is fairly good and that currently, the only problem we have is power creep. I know I sound repetitive and I complain about this over and over again, but this is a fact. Conditions have now become more prevalent than before, not one condi like burn guard, but a whole pile of them. And the main problem in our build diversity is not inspiration but chronomancer. We run inspiration because we are facing a condi-heavy meta. This is not a build diversity problem, this is reactivity to the meta which is a healthy thing in the game. If you are facing a team with low condi pressure (which definitely happens in solo q) you can remove inspiration and play with other things. On the other hand, REGARDLESS of the enemy team, chronomancy is the best line to slot, and THIS is an unhealthy thing.

This is just a curiosity thing. Do you think build diversity would be fine if all current elite spec lines remained the same, but we got 2 other potential elites specs to choose from instead of just the one line? Do you think people will still tend take the inspiration trait line? I know this is really theoretical. The only reason I say this is because I don’t necessarily think this is just “the meta”. I think condis are pretty much here to stay with the new amulets, condi rework, and new ways that you can apply condis. I don’t necessarily think the prevalence of condis will ever go back to the way it was pre HoT. I am also not saying messiah is necessarily right. I just think it might be nice to say, reduce power cleans from 2 to 1 conditions and give another trait line (besides chronomancer or illusions) a weak way to remove condis, not necessarily messiah’s ideas, just something.

STIHL.2489:

Astralporing.1957:

STIHL.2489:

You end up with being 12 short of 150 AR, if you use +5 AR Infusions as opposed to the +7’s in your accessories slots.

You’re counting only accessory slots. Do not forget about armor and weapons – those bring the difference up to 28 points.

Oh they made that kind of mistake huh? then I would suggest an Infusion Extraction Device , which costs 24 silver, pull the Infusions, and replace with +7’s.

The 70 Extra Ability points, that gets split 2 to 3 different ways, can’t be that game breaking to your build.

You’re completely missing the point. At current prices, versatile mighty infusions cost around 324 gold to make each, or around 1,944 gold for enough to fill out your armor alone. People have made these before HoT so that they could do fractals and get the +5 stats at the same time. Imagine spending that much gold only to find out that they are completely useless and to get a reply just to change them out with +7 infusions.

Messiah, I absolutely love some of your suggestions. In fact, the same thing should be done with other classes as well. Many of them have a specfic trait thats really powerful in condi removal when the ability to remove condies should be spread out more. Personally, I think all trait lines for all classes should have at least one trait that removes a condition except for the elite specialization trait lines. This will at least help pull the elites closer to the base while at the same time making it so specific trait lines that specialize in condi removal are not necessary, therefore increasing build diversity.

I would also like to see a bounce added to gs 2
A very slight power damage buff to phantasms across the board (don’t think toning down burst is necessary)
Shattered Concentration changed to remove two boons on shatter instead of just one
I think the gs AA is fine the way it is IMO.

However, perhaps I am out in my little own world dreaming about many of these changes.

What do you think will happen when all the elder dragons are killed? Can we prevent it?

Theories

1. The same thing that happened at the Thaumanova Reactor, only on a much, much larger scale. The different forms of magic released from the elder dragons will combine to tear a big rip in the fabric of reality.

2. The large amount of magic released will once again attract the human gods to Tyria, much like how they were attracted to Orr.

3. Tyria will tip and everything will fall of.

4. It won’t happen. The last elder dragon will absorb too much magic and become too powerful to defeat. Long live Bubbles the Indestructible!

Prevention

1. Use bloodstone like structures to mimic the function of elder dragons.

2. Don’t kill any more elder dragons.

-_- I quite reading fairly early on after I got to your suggestions for mesmer, which I would consider my main. You do realize that diversion is the class mechanic that dazes enemies. I know you are trying to help. However, I don’t necessarily think its a good idea for someone to offer suggestions about a class who doesn’t know it very well.

Nice Rifle skills Ross! Even with the gun flame nerf

In the end it is rng just like anything else, like precursors. I would say that I did a lot of Silverwastes before HoT. At my peek I had over 5,000 bandit crests. I also have the Bioluminescent collection completed. I got down two of the bosses relatively quickly (have actually now killed both of them multiple times). Since then, I have camped and camped and camped for days for the Tormentor. Never seen it once. I have had my friends seen it and called me over before though, but alas I did not make it in time. Since then I have given up. If its not happening in 5k + bandit crests worth of silver wastes than its just not happening. As you can tell, its kinda a sore subject for me.

Donari.5237:

Ragnarox.9601:

- Balancing – not mentioned
- WvW updates – not mentioned
- LS3 – not mentioned
- legendary armor and backpiece – not mentioned
- dungeons – not mentioned
….

So what do we get, wall of text, with nothing interesting or even needed. Typical.

WvW updates got a whole paragraph, what do you mean they weren’t mentioned?

-Balance – It is going to always happen after a pvp season. So, I would just expect it from now on.

-WvW – was mentioned

-LS3 – I believe they said it was coming out after the first raid is finished. Therefore, you have to wait for the last raid wing to come out first. Perhaps LS3 plays off of it a little? idk

- legendary armor and back piece – I would have liked to see the back piece mentioned. However, there is probably no use in talking about legendary armor until the last raid wing comes out, which won’t be during this update.

- dungeons – I agree, I would have liked to see dungeons mentioned as well. I am still hoping they deal with dungeons in this spring update.

Ellieanna.5027:

So when I read about HoT, I don’t remember it saying that it would include all legendary weapons on release, but it would have some. Does anyone have a link to the legendary promises? I don’t want a paraphrase, but I wanted to see what it said.

Here is the first link. You need to scroll down to the legendary weapons part
https://heartofthorns.guildwars2.com/game/maguuma

And here is another link
https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/hot-new-legendary-weapons/

Both talk about adding 16 new legendary weapons to the game.

Apologies, you are correct. There is only around a 14% difference in precision between the two armor sets. Also the actual numerical difference between these sets is not worth the difference. I was in a tired state last night and accidentally confused the commanders precision stats with ferocity. However, with the ferocity of assassin’s you are producing 21% more damage due to critical damage. I am going to leave time warp out of it since if you are not weapon swapping when you place time warp then you are doing something wrong as well. Also, with feedback present, you are probably taking out well of recall and leaving well of action and signet of inspiration.

In the paragraph below, I’m not arguing anything. I’m just posting an open question that I don’t know the answer to yet and I have to get to work pretty soon.

When placing well of action and and SoI, you are producing 6 seconds of quickness without any concentration and 6.828 seconds with the concentration from commanders. If you use chrono runes this is going to change to 10 sec and 11.38 seconds. So, the question is, if for whatever reason a situation pops up where you don’t have 100% boon duration, is it worth providing 1.38 seconds of quickness to 4 other people, in a non tank scenario, if you are going to give up 21% of your damage? This is also assuming that you are not maintaining 100% quickness duration without that 1.38 seconds.

And what is a good stat if you want to deal with reflects . . . . . precision. You are taking out a good deal of precision stats with Commanders

Ah, when have you ran more than 2 wells in a raid wing? If anything, I am seeing that you don’t need to bunker like the first wing, meaning amor with more damage stats becomes more important. If you can get to 100% boon duration without commanders then why sacrifice damage?

Updated the original paragraph. We still need either a Druid or Herald to raid with us on Sundays at 10pm CT.

+1 I literally typed basically the same thing while you were typing. Just use portal and blink up the rafters to portal your whole team. Important/useful traits for stealth, if needed, are PU, master of manipulation, improved alacrity, and the pledge. However, the only situation where I have ever found such stealth duration useful is in the silverwastes maze.

Any Druids out there, feel free to message me. Still looking

Still looking for a druid!

We may also raid Sundays instead of Tuesdays at the same time if it fits everyones schedules better.

Hi Guys!

We are currently looking for one more dedicated individual to participate in raids with us at 10 pm CT on Sunday. We need either a herald or a druid.
If you are interested in joining this raid group, feel free to contact me in game by mail, or by pm on the forums. We are frequently on at around 10 pm central time and would love to talk to you.
Hope to raid with you soon!

I can’t believe I came back today to see changes like this. Not what I was expecting. What a utter disappointment. It looks like more people are going to leave pvp and gw2. Great job balance team.

1. I’m for fixing water content as well. I would like some water content and one new dungeon. I hate the idea that it looks like they are just trying to sweep these under the rug. Especially when they have so much potential, particularly underwater exploration. Water content just needs some fine touches. They don’t need to focus everything on water content. However, at least don’t pretend like it doesn’t exist. Similarly, with dungeons, there was nothing really bad with them. Sure, there was some stacking issues. However, this issue isn’t really that hard to fix and really isn’t that bad. They almost make it seam like dungeons were a disaster, but hell they are one of my favorite aspects of the game, especially the parts that focus more on puzzle problem solving than fighting. This game needs more of that.

2. Quests: I really miss the quests of runescape. It would be nice to have lots of little gw2 story activities that are different than the one long major gw2 story. They don’t need to be as complicated as the major gw2 story. However, they need to be much more complicated than those little heart things they had with the original gw2. Basically, I would like to see more lore in the gw2 universe. You can even tie crafting and masteries into these quests.

3. If mounts are added, I think they should mostly be added for looks. Perhaps you can add a little speed bonus to them. However, you need to make sure swiftness still has a use. You also need to make sure people continue to use gliders cause they are awesome in every way.

3 Spots left, looking for 2 condi and 1 ps warrior. Feel free to message.

Ruby Carbuncle’s Revenge, a small, close nit, and friendly guild is currently looking at expanding its ranks for Raids. If you are looking at joining a smaller group, want to make an impact every time you play, want strong support from experienced players, and want to play in a laid back atmosphere, this guild could be for you.

About the Guild

Ruby Carbuncle’s Revenge is a small guild initiated by a close group of friends over two years ago. Currently the guide consists of five dedicated players who frequently play fractals, dungeons, meta events, etc. throughout the week. However, with the release of raids, and future raid content coming in soon, we would really like to get the ball rolling and recruit five more dedicated players who would like to participate in raids with us, ~ 2 times a week ~10 pm CT. The time and days of the week may vary as we recruit to try to fit the raid content into the group’s schedule. No Repping is required. However, understandably, we would like everyone to participate during the scheduled raid times. This guild consists of a small group of friends who have known each other for many years. Therefore, we would like to continue the tradition by recruiting players who are dedicated to the game, fun to hang out with, and looking to become part of a close group looking to take on any type of content Anet may throw at us. We are also looking to maintain the small guild atmosphere. We believe in quality over quantity.

Entry Requirements

-Teamspeak and microphone

-Ascended Trinkets: All the guild members currently have full ascended/legendary armor, trinkets, and weapons. We realize that ascended armor takes a lot of time and does not contribute as much to dps as ascended trinkets and weapons. Therefore, ascended armor, at this point, is not required. We also will not require ascended weapons at this time. However, we do want members to make a strong effort obtain ascended weapons before we start the first raid. We would like to see ascended trinkets at recruitment because of their impact and the potential time gating involved in obtaining them. At recruitment you must at least have exotic weapons and armor.

-Participation During Raid Times: We understand if you have something important going on. However, we do not want people who consistently miss raid times, especially without letting us know.

-No Raging: We do not tolerate raging or inappropriate behavior, especially if it is intentionally directed towards other players. We are looking to have a fun environment.

-Know your Class: We would like you to know the traits, weapons, and skills available to your class before we start raids, as well as having experience playing your class.

-Desire to Improve: We are looking for people who consistently have the desire of improving as players. We are always willing to help with this. The same could be said about equipment. If you do not have ascended armor or weapons, we hope you have the intention of working towards them.

-Have Fun

What We’re Hoping For

-Repping is not required. I believe that who you are as a person and player is much more important than as simple of a notion as representing a particular guild. However, if you do, it is a plus.

-Willing to participate in other events: If any recruits are ever willing to participate with the rest of the guild in fractals, meta events, etc. this is also a plus. Participating in other events, besides just raids, also helps enforce a closer guild and raid group. However, it is not required.

-Willing to communicate: It would be nice if you are willing to communicate through methods other than in game chat and team speak. For example, we may use a method such as LINE to communicate with each other if everyone has smartphones. Currently, we frequently text each other when we decide to do events or are online. However, we could still use another method of communication that does not involve giving out personal information.

-Classes: Classes we are most concerned with recruiting are Druids/ranger, Eles/temp, Necros/reaper, Engi/scrapper and Warriors/zerker. The players in our guild currently main Dragon Hunter, Herald, Chronomancer, Berserker, and Daredevil. We would like to have the potential of having every class available for a raid so that we are prepared, not just for the current content, but also for any future raids and events. You never know what class you will need. All current guild members also have multiple classes they are willing to play if the situation calls for it. The same is not required for recruits. However, it is nice to know if you are skilled at playing multiple classes.

Contact

If you are interested in joining this raid group, feel free to contact me in game by mail, or by pm on the forums. We are frequently on at around 10 pm central time and would love to talk to you.
Hope to raid with you soon!

Yashuoa.9527:

Xstein.2187:

Yashuoa.9527:

What is false about the statements?

1. I specifically asked about ALL Mesmer builds.
I disliked bunkerchrono too (both playing vs it as playing it).
But there are other Mesmer builds besides that build and those werent considered good enough with 66% alacrity.
So aparently it may not have been to strong for all Mesmer builds.
Also it was a question so it cant be false.

2. I specifically said with chrono slotted.
Meaning the cooldowns when using chrono, that were used to 66% alacrity when it was up, now have 33% when it is up.
Meaning you reduce them less=cooldowns are higher now.
Its simple fact or evidence if you will.

Maybe you misunderstood/misread yourself.

1. The first one wasn’t false, I was just pointing out that alacrity was nerfed for reasons pertaining both to pve and pvp. I was answering your question. I also realize that the alacrity nerf hurt other builds as well. However, there are other ways to improve those builds besides buffing alacrity all the way up to 66% again. In fact, I do think self alacrity should perhaps be buffed, just not all the way up to 66%. That is way to high. It didn’t work for multiple reasons.

2. Ya, of course your cool downs get lower cool downs relative to the 66% alacrity. However, I did not say this statement was wrong.

“your abilities were based on having 66%”

This is the statement I am saying is false. Most, and perhaps all, of your abilities were Not balanced around the assumption that you have so much of 66% alacrity on yourself.

It looked as if you only quoted the things you considered false, as you said
‘’The rest of your statements sound legit. I am just concerned with the stuff that appears to be false.’’

How are at least some abilities as chrono, not balanced around having 66% alacrity from time to time on yourself?

They designed the chrono spec.
They introduce alacrity.
They choose the 66% number.
They even add stuff like a trait that increases the duration of it on yourself by 50%.
They add alacrity duration numbers to wells and other spells.

I would hope that they balance the chrono build and its abilities around having some alacrity uptime on yourself.
If its not balanced on having alacrity (not constantly, but here and there from spells),
than it means the alacrity numbers and traits are just picked without any balance in mind, which I hope is false.

Why do you think they choose the alacrity number of 66%, and alacrity duration on spells and traits? According to you, not with keeping balance of the spells in the build in mind. So for what reason are those numbers chosen?

Look, I think they tried to balance the overall class with alacrity. However, they just did not balance many of the individual cool downs around alacrity. Ya, they did everything you said

They designed the chrono spec.
They introduce alacrity.
They choose the 66% number.
They even add stuff like a trait that increases the duration of it on yourself by 50%.
They add alacrity duration numbers to wells and other spells.

And guess what, when they did all of this, you would think the class would be somewhat balanced, since they chose all the numbers. However, it wasn’t. It was OP.

“If its not balanced on having alacrity (not constantly, but here and there from spells),
than it means the alacrity numbers and traits are just picked without any balance in mind, which I hope is false.”

This is not necessarily the case. For example, they could have initially used the cool downs of similar skills in other classes as “guidelines” for what to make the cool downs of the chronos skills. They could have then proceeded to balance the class as a Whole around alacrity. For example, if they saw the class wasn’t doing enough damage, they could have boosted alacrity. Therefore, they could have tried to balance the class without properly considering all the effects of all the skill cool downs. Echo of memory originally gave 4.5 seconds of protection every 30 seconds without alacrity, or .15 sec of protection/sec. Crystal Hibernation gives 3 seconds of protection every 25 seconds, or .12 sec protection/sec. These are somewhat similar. However, with 66% alacrity, the chrono got 4.5 sec of protection every 18 seconds, or .25 sec of protection every sec. Do you think they balanced the shield expecting chronos to get this much protection in pvp? If they did, they probably wouldn’t have had to dramatically decreased the length of protection on the shield and then later dramatically nerf alacrity.

“Why do you think they choose the alacrity number of 66%, and alacrity duration on spells and traits? According to you, not with keeping balance of the spells in the build in mind. So for what reason are those numbers chosen? "

Thats a good question. I don’t know. Why did they decrease it to 33%. Why not have it at 33% originally? I don’t know, but obviously the class as a whole turned out differently then they expected. If they were originally correct about their reasons for choosing 66% on alacrity then they would have never nerfed it.

Xyonon.3987:

You mustn’t perma swap weapons, since you need to keep your shield 5 on CD in order to be able to cast it 4 times per rotation. Same goes for the phantasm – you want to replace all your “1 life” phantasms before the new CS. And most imporant – while staying on shield you’ll be able to have your focus pull ready when you need it, not when you “are on focus by coincidence”. This has a major impact against Sabetha where you need to pull the thugs and arsonists the moment they want to attack / kick. You can also time this with the CD of Tides of Time, wich you can’t if you swap all the time.

It’s not a playstyle question – it’s a skill level question. Try improving by not using it and focus on more important things, on your envoirment and how to use your offhand skills with utmost efficiency and with the best outcome / passive dps gain.

Greez!

but you don’t need to swap all the time, you just need to swap when you cast your wells.

Yashuoa.9527:

What is false about the statements?

1. I specifically asked about ALL Mesmer builds.
I disliked bunkerchrono too (both playing vs it as playing it).
But there are other Mesmer builds besides that build and those werent considered good enough with 66% alacrity.
So aparently it may not have been to strong for all Mesmer builds.
Also it was a question so it cant be false.

2. I specifically said with chrono slotted.
Meaning the cooldowns when using chrono, that were used to 66% alacrity when it was up, now have 33% when it is up.
Meaning you reduce them less=cooldowns are higher now.
Its simple fact or evidence if you will.

Maybe you misunderstood/misread yourself.

1. The first one wasn’t false, I was just pointing out that alacrity was nerfed for reasons pertaining both to pve and pvp. I was answering your question. I also realize that the alacrity nerf hurt other builds as well. However, there are other ways to improve those builds besides buffing alacrity all the way up to 66% again. In fact, I do think self alacrity should perhaps be buffed, just not all the way up to 66%. That is way to high. It didn’t work for multiple reasons.

2. Ya, of course your cool downs get lower cool downs relative to the 66% alacrity. However, I did not say this statement was wrong.

“your abilities were based on having 66%”

This is the statement I am saying is false. Most, and perhaps all, of your abilities were Not balanced around the assumption that you have so much of 66% alacrity on yourself.

Yashuoa.9527:

Silverkey.2078:

66% alacrity was too strong for team mates in PvE. It was also to strong for self in PvP.

To strong on all Mesmer builds in pvp?

Maybe they could reduce duration of some cooldowns as said to compensate for the 33% alacrity nerf? Or you consider it right for all mesmer builds to receive the nerf to 33%?

My mesmer is an alt I am trying more lately, so maybe I dont see it right but
a 33% nerf in alactrity seems quite large as your abilities were based on having 66%.
Meaning every single mesmer cooldown with Chrono slotted, is nerfed bigtime in duration now with this change.

So I thought longer duration for the Mesmer personaly, would maybe be fair and/or a few cooldowns lower.
It wouldnt change the duration of alacrity that it can give to teammates.

Uncle Dalty.8327:

yes… but they won’t. just go back to playing core mes. No matter what you play, taking a core line will be better than taking chrono…. unless you want to play a mindless utility bot.

I rather play dps power/condi, than a no dmg dealing utility build.

I love mesmer and think it needs an update, but it bothers me when there is misunderstanding going through the community.

“To strong on all Mesmer builds in pvp?”
Yes, it was too strong for pvp. Even after the shield changes, many teams were still bringing multiple bunker chronos. Having a class that can survive that long while targeted is not healthy for the game.

“My mesmer is an alt I am trying more lately, so maybe I dont see it right but
a 33% nerf in alactrity seems quite large as your abilities were based on having 66%. Meaning every single mesmer cooldown with Chrono slotted, is nerfed bigtime in duration now with this change.”

No, this is not true. Where is your evidence for this statement. I have seen this statement going around a lot. However, just because a lot of people have said it, doesn’t make it true. The original mesmer skills and weapons retained their initial cool downs. Therefore, you at least know that these were not balanced around alacrity. Most of the skills were not balanced around alacrity. That is why alacrity turned out to be a lot more powerful in pvp and pve than they were expecting. For example, the chrono shield has a cool down time that is similar to that of other classes based on the duration of perfection. However, when a chrono has permanent alacrity at 66%, the cool down becomes ridiculously low compared to that of other classes.

The rest of your statements sound legit. I am just concerned with the stuff that appears to be false.

Kitten, I envy all who enjoy playing a class other than mes in gw2.

Eh, I don’t think they were necessarily reduced to this. Before they were only brought for time warp, portal, and reflects. Now, its pretty much the same, except we have alacrity as an extra buff. Also, portal and reflects aren’t as useful because the “focus” (haha, ya sorry couldn’t help it) has been shifted towards raids and not many reflects have been implemented in the new content.

Its not just about pve, its also about all aspects of the game. In order to give a class powerful effects like alacrity and quickness, of course their dps has to be much lower than the other classes. However, you still need to find a way to make sure they have a variety of viable builds for other aspects of the game, like pvp. This is where other aspects matter.

Azoqu.8917:

sirsquishy.8531:

Here is what I do not get, Quickness affects everyone and has a 50% buff to it, alacrity affects everyone and had a 66% buff to everyone then got it dropped to 33%.

If its such a balance issue why didnt we see a quickness nerf too since they basically do the same thing (affect the speed of which we can activate skills with, which also enhance our ability to spam skills that are on a shorter cooldown).

All things aside, that is what i want to know most.

In case you didn’t know, quickness has been nerfed from 100% to 50% in the past (the same change that alacrity got).

Ya this was the case, but I don’t think that matters, right now a person who has alacrity and quickness that is only using auto attacks with no cool downs gets a 50% boost from quickness and no boost from alacrity. Like wise, a person who is using cool down skills with no activation time get a 33% boost from alacrity and no boost from quickness. Meanwhile, not all classes benefit equally from alacrity, like thieves, and alacrity can’t be given out as sufficient of a way like signet of inspiration (you actually have to catch the wells to get the benefits) I think he is just mainly saying “Why aren’t they balanced equally?” You could say that cool down skills may be more powerful. However, that doesn’t cover than downfalls of alacrity mentioned as well.

Andraus.3874:

Please don’t attack Gaile by saying things like she “promised” us something. She is our most valuable advocate. I agree I would appreciate a status update such as the dev’s thought these skills are in a good place or some type of feedback. But calling her out like this is a contributing factor to why communication can lack, as the devs feel safer saying nothing.

This right here. It was obviously not a balance patch and I don’t think it should be a quick fix. So don’t sweat it. Just calm down and see what happens when a balance patch hits. I also don’t think decreasing the cool downs on wells is the solution. Chronos can put out roughly the same amount of alacrity they could before. What changed was how powerful alacrity was. Yes, you can say the 66 to 33% alacrity indirectly brought down how much alacrity you could push out a little. But not really, not with illusionary avenger. It was also obviously clear that they had no attention on changing how much alacrity you could pump out. They only cared about how powerful it was. Hopefully they bump alacrity to 50% and do a bunch of more balancing with chrono. This is also a quality of life change, as it makes quickness and alacrity somewhat similar. Quickness for auto attacks and Alacrity for cool down attacks. However, more balance is needed than this. I hope they do more than just make two main changes, to alacrity and well of precog, like they did before. After all, as hinted at before, many classes can put out roughly 3X more dps than a chrono. This severely put them at a disadvantage in WvW and PvP, weather its just finding a competitive build or having a large selections of builds available to play around with.

Xyonon.3987:

And that’s where you’re wrong too – the filler skills are either other skills with CD -> alacrity makes them stronger, or they are auto attacks / attacks without CD -> quickness makes them 50% stronger. It doesn’t matter what you use, overall every single profession gets boosted by 33-50% due alacrity AND quickness of the mesmer.

About your lava font calcs:
“Each lava front does 1,292 damage per second for 4 seconds, or 4 × 1,292 damage each = 5,168 dmg for each lava front.”
Hehe, no that’s not how tooltips work! xP You think a lava font deals 15-times the damage of your auto? ^^‘’ It’s not 4x 1’292 damage per second for 4 seconds. It’s 4 tics over 4 seconds that deal those 1’292 damage all together. ;3

Greez!
- Ziggy

Ok, so if thats the case, like you said, than the ele would be doing
585.25 dps without alacrity and 641.15 dps with alacrity.
So, your percent increase in damage due to alacrity would actually be only 9.53% since your skill that relies on cool down makes up a smaller percent of your damage.

I’m not really wrong with the part your mentioning though. If I wanted to figure in quickness, I could. The only thing I am posting about is alacrity, since people have said its a straight up 33% increase to your dps. I never even mentioned quickness in my posts. My MAIN point that I am trying to show is that you Cant just say its a 33% increase in dps. You have to actually go into the game to test it. I was never responding just to you. I was responding to the title of this thread "Inspired by – “66% dps increase”.
With other skills, there is also a activation time involved with cool down skills. For example, since leap of faith has a .5 sec activation time, the overall dps increase with alacrity is not 33% but 31.17%. And yes, the percent increase in dps a ele can do is not just 9.53%. As I have mentioned, an ele has many damage skills with cool downs. What will happen is that the dps increase will slowly approach 33% as you get to a x class that only uses skills with cool downs and no activation times.

For example,
Thieves may see the least benefit from alacrity
this list may gradually go up with classes
Dragon hunters with hammers may use slightly more auto attacks than say an engi.
Therefore, an engi may see much closer to the theoretical 33% increase than the dragon hunter.
etc.
However, no class will have a 33% increase in dps unless they ONLY use skills with cool downs and no activation times. Yes, I also realize that the no activation part makes little difference. However, the auto attacks do, and ultimately, it all adds up to mean your raid group is not doing 33% more dps either.

p.s. in the leap of faith skill, if you have both alacrity and quickness you are doing about 35.25% more dps. Quickness is similar except it approaches 50% more dps as you get to a class that only uses auto attacks. I think this distinction is important to, not just for alacrity and quickness, but because it means you can’t balance the overall class with the assumption that quickness increases your dps by 50%, you can’t balance the overall class with the assumption that alacrity increases your dps by 33%, and you certainly can’t make the assumption that therefore both of these together increase your dps by 83%. With both alacrity and quickness together, it becomes obvious that these don’t increase your dps by 83%. However, the reason this is ultimately comes from the fact that A. quickness doesn’t simply increase your dps by 50% and B. Alacrity doesn’t simply increase your dps by 33%. There is more to it than just that.

Xyonon.3987:

So how do you get your 20’992 damage in 16s then? With those numbers you’d be dealing 9’364 dmage in 16s = 585.25 dps.

Anyway, what we are saying is that alacrity increases the damage of skills WITH cd by 33%.
If lava font deals 1292 damage every 6s, this means 215 dps for this skill.
With alacrity it’s 1292 damage every kitten , this means 287 dps for THIS skill.
That’s an increase of exactly 33% (1/215*287=1.33).

Now the attacks between are ofc affected by quickness wich makes them deal 50% more often their damage wich equals 50% more damage in general.

TL;DR:
Skills with cd get an 33% boost by alacrity and by quickness (for their cast time).
Skills without cd get an 50% boost by quickness.
The mesmer boosts the squad by 33-50%, not more and not less.

“So how do you get your 20’992 damage in 16s then? With those numbers you’d be dealing 9’364 dmage in 16s = 585.25 dps.”

You have 16 fire balls at one per second and three lava fronts. Each lava front does 1,292 damage per second for 4 seconds, or 4 × 1,292 damage each = 5,168 dmg for each lava front. Ya, I see the problem you made. Its with the lava front. Each one doesn’t do 1,292 dmg. In the table I have it as 4×1,292 or 5,168

(16×343)+(3×5,168)=20,992 dmg.

“Anyway, what we are saying is that alacrity increases the damage of skills WITH cd by 33%.
If lava font deals 1292 damage every 6s, this means 215 dps for this skill.
With alacrity it’s 1292 damage every kitten , this means 287 dps for THIS skill.
That’s an increase of exactly 33% (1/215*287=1.33).?

Lava front does 5,168 dmg every 6 sec, or 861.333333 dps.
With alacrity, you are doing 5,168 dmg every 4.5 seconds (at 33% perma alacrity means a 25% decrease in the skills cool down), or 5,168/4.5 = 1,148.44444 dps

(861.33333333x)+861.333333 = 1,148.4444444, x=.333333
So, ya, you are right, with alacrity, your skills with cool downs are doing 33% more dps.
(p.s. found out I did something wrong in the first paragraph though. What I calculated is that you do roughly 14% less dps without alacrity. Just like your cool down skills do 25% less dps without alacrity. However, I changed it to % more damage, which is a 17.04% increase in dps with alacrity for a ele who is using fire ball and lava front. So ya, your cool down skills are doing 33% more dps, but you need to take into account your filler skills as well. When you actually look at a more realistic situation, you are not coming up with a 33% increase in dps because you are using more that just skills with cool downs.

Xyonon.3987:

Xstein.2187:

343 +4x1,292, 5 sec x 343, 343 +4x1,292, 5 sec x 343, 343 + 4 x1,292, 3sec x 343

343 + 4×1,292, 3 sec x 343, 343 + 4×1,292, 4 sec x 343, 343 + 4×1,292, 3sec x 343

wat? ö.ö

Yaa, sorry, I tried to crunch it down to save as much room as possible. However, those are really tables. The first one looks like this (don’t know the best way to present tables in these forums)

Time (sec)………………..Dmg………………..skills
1 sec………………..343 + 4×1,292………………..fire ball and lava front
2 sec………………..343………………..fire ball
3 sec………………..343………………..fire ball
4 etc…………………343………………..etc.
5………………..343
6………………..343
7 ……………….. 343 + 4×1,292
8 ……………….. 343
9 ……………….. 343
10 ……………….. 343
11 ……………….. 343
12 ……………….. 343
13 ……………….. 343 + 4×1,292
14 ……………….. 343
15 ……………….. 343
16 ……………….. 343

Note: the damage in the table is not the accumulative damage at that point in time. Those just represent the damage that the skill you cast at the beginning of that second does at that point in time. So, you start by simultaneously casting a lava front and fire ball. lava front doesn’t have any cast time and goes on cool down right away. Fire ball takes 1 sec to cast and has no cool down. The cool down of lava front without alacrity is 6 sec. So, after 6 sec, you can cast another lava front (depicted in the table). At the end of the table, since lava front last for 4 seconds, I have the person cast 4 fireballs during that 4 seconds so that the end time is technically when lava front ends. You just need to add up all the damage to find out how much you did in that 16 sec. For the table with alacrity, it is the same way except the cool down on lava front is 4.5 sec with the 25% decrease. However, as I mentioned earlier, the reality is that you have many skills that get reduced cool downs from alacrity (not just lava front) and each class is different. Thus, it is best to just perform tests with each class based on their rotations for max dps.

I think you guys are way off and simplifying things waaay too much. Right now, you guys are assuming that someone is using ONE skill and they are not attacking between cool downs. In reality though, a class is constantly using skills. The situation of how much alacrity boosts dps is a lot more complicated question that ultimately deals with what class has the alacrity because what mainly matters with alacrity is the difference between the classes auto attack and cool down skills. However, it is actually even more complicated than that still. Thats why it is best just to test this in the actual field. However, if you really want to look at it theoretically, if we assume an elementalist only has the skills fireball and lava front, you are looking at roughly an 14.56% increase in dps. It is not 25% and not 33%. I can explain in the math below.
fireball takes 1 second to cast while lava front does not have any activation time. We are going to assume a robot is controlling the character and can play perfectly.

no alacrity (6 sec cool down on lava front)
343 +4x1,292, 5 sec x 343, 343 +4x1,292, 5 sec x 343, 343 + 4 x1,292, 3sec x 343
total time = 16 sec
total dmg = 20,992
20,992/16 = 1,312 dmg/sec

alacrity (4.5 sec cool down on lava front, note: I averaged this time by having one lava front cast in 4 seconds and one cast in 5 seconds see below)

343 + 4×1,292, 3 sec x 343, 343 + 4×1,292, 4 sec x 343, 343 + 4×1,292, 3sec x 343
total time = 13 sec
total dmg = 19,963
19,963/13 sec = 1,535.62 dmg/sec

(1,312x)+1,312=1,535.62
x = 17.04%

The most confusing part about this is that the cool down on lava front start right after you cast it and I am saying the robot is casting both skills at the same time. With other classes the results will be different. However, you definitely can’t straight out say its a 25% or 33% dps increase.

Not gonna lie, I’m glad to see for sure someone read that post. However, am I the only one slightly disappointed that she felt like there still needed to be evidence for why someone would say chrono was broken? When you read it, it almost felt like that was the first time she came across the subject. Maybe that was just me though.

Carighan.6758:

Xstein.2187:

However, chronos are only brought into raids to give alacrity and quickness to allies.

General question:
Do you enjoy that situation?

As in, would you rather not touch existent Alacrity/Quickness sharing options because “We’re in the raid for this”? Because independent of what I think about Chronomancer, I think we need more group support options. It stands to reason then that given that, the existent ones need to be balanced (or well, they just were :P ) so that they don’t stand out too much.

What we’re mostly lacking is a viable and not stupid (read: not on-mantra-charge) way to group heal. Every class should have that option, even if Revs and Druids and Eles win out.
Another could be group projectile defense, but this is going to be iffy with the old Mimic removed. Still, we could become the answer to projectiles.
And then maybe boon-stripping-with-side-effects. Plenty can boon-strip, what if we can do it just as well and we produce something with those stripped boons?

We’d have 4 total support options then (well, 3 and 1 from Chrono), and that seems more balanced to me.

Thats an Excellent question, with some very good points. This actually may take me awhile.

“Do you enjoy that situation?”
I enjoy playing in pve as the class that is best known for controlling time by dishing out alacrity and quickness to allies. Do I think this is what they should only be known for? Not necessarily. I’ll explain more below.

“As in, would you rather not touch existent Alacrity/Quickness sharing options because “We’re in the raid for this”?"
Short answer No. Long answer. I think that alacrity should be touched. I believe that it is slightly too powerful in raids and it is slightly too powerful with the previous bunker build. However, I do think they nerfed alacrity too hard. What I would do is buff it to 50% and change the cool downs of a few key skills to compensate. However, I also think it should be exceptionally powerful compared to the effects of other classes because mesmer do not have a competitive sustained dps, never will (mainly for pvp reasons), and I believe that this is the niche that chronos are suppose to fill.
You see, my ideal situation would be that every class has a special niche that they must fill because they are best at it and needed for that specific attribute. In fact, it would be awesome if not only classes followed this rule, but specialization vs base classes as well. However, this will never happen. Berserker should be known for might, Chrono should be known for alacrity and quickness, Reapers should be known for chill, Druids are known for healing, etc.
For me, the best situation for a raid would be that at the start, you need one of every class to fill their niche. This also means that no class should step on the toes of warrior, no class should step on the toes of Druid, etc. Having this type of diversity in your raid group should be optimal to the point where it is impossible to complete the raid if you have 5 engis or 5 dragon hunters etc. However, after the raid goes on for awhile. Lets say the monster flies up into the air. At this time, the raid group should have X amount of seconds to change their build and weapons before a new phase starts. If you don’t get your build changed in time, too bad. You need to know your traits better and what your class is capable of. For example, the first phase you may need to be a straight up support chrono, for the second phase the monster may throw out projectiles from many different location. Therefore, you may need to switch to a reflection build before the creature lands again. There is no doubt in my mind that chronos could be known for reflecting as well. However, the problem is that anet has never created a raid or new fractal that has really pushed chrono to need to do this. This class is capable of putting out 4 feedbacks, two temporal curtains, and 4 phantasmal wardens in a matter of seconds. Of course it could be known for reflects again. However, the problem is the content, not the class. Perhaps in phase 3 you will need to switch to a buncky build where you need to support allies with heals or stealth yourself through the encounter. Currently, I know that the mesmer’s ability to support allies with heals is not very strong compared to many other classes. However, I don’t know exactly how weak or strong it is compared to all the other classes. Therefore, it could perhaps be buffed. However, I don’t think it should be buffed to the point where it steps on the toes of druids or eles. It should only be needed during specific phases when one druid and one ele is not enough. I believe future dungeons and raids should be the same way. Except you are not restricted by a time limit to change your traits. This way, every class is capable and needs to do multiple roles. However, each class is also brought for a specific reason or niche that means you have to bring one of each class. Now the above circumstance is not realistic right now and a ton of changes and additions are needed before it is realistic, including the addition of new niches or abilities.

“Because independent of what I think about Chronomancer, I think we need more group support options. It stands to reason then that given that, the existent ones need to be balanced (or well, they just were :P ) so that they don’t stand out too much”.

Yes, I agree that there needs to be more support options, not just for chronomancer, but for other classes as well. However, I do not think this more support should necessarily be in the game already, could be something completely new. However, as for the current support option, mesmer/chrono also has the ability to put on a ton of vulnerability, remove boons, reflect, grant not only healing but invulnerability/distortion to allies as well (yes, this may be one of the reasons chronos healing on allies is not very high. With inspiring distortion and phantasmal defender, you can also protect allies indirectly), and stealth. As well as you are able to copy many “random” boons on you to allies." In fact there was one build many mesmers were taking about (either before or early in HoT release, can’t remember) where you did try to support allies with more of these other boons. However, I believe it was generally agreed on by the community that it wasn’t worth it just for the simple fact that many of those other boons are supported by other classes better. I don’t believe its because chrono sucks at support, its because many of those other boons are suppose to be the niches of other classes. So, I do not know if group healing should be buffed on mes. However, if it is buffed, I don’t think it should affect the devs decisions with alacrity because other classes not only are, but should be much better at group healing. Also, “so that they don’t stand out too much” is not a reason to buff or nerf anything. As I said, I think every class should have one thing or a couple of things that “stand out” and thats ok because thats what they should be known for. If they weren’t known for those features, they probably wouldn’t be in the meta.

“What we’re mostly lacking is a viable and not stupid (read: not on-mantra-charge) way to group heal. Every class should have that option, even if Revs and Druids and Eles win out.
Another could be group projectile defense, but this is going to be iffy with the old Mimic removed. Still, we could become the answer to projectiles.”

I explained this better above. Basically, my answer is that I don’t necessarily agree.

“And then maybe boon-stripping-with-side-effects. Plenty can boon-strip, what if we can do it just as well and we produce something with those stripped boons?”

I agree, we should be able to boon strip just as well as other classes, without the current huge nerf to alacrity.

The reality is that they will probably not buff chronomancer damage if they remove alacrity. Mesmer had the lowest dps before HoT and they only relied on quickness from time warp. It will basically just turn into the same thing. Your dps will remain the same. You also will have more access to quickness through well of action, etc. However, other classes have more access to quickness as well. Heightened Focus, Fatal Crazy, Applied Force, Instinctive Reaction, Feel my Wrath, etc. Why would you want it to return to this way? Making a class rely on one boon is risky. All they would have to do is nerf quickness from 50% to 25% and ouch.

Believe me, I am not comparing the dps of support chronomancer to the other classes. Even if the chronomancer has alacrity at 66% while the other classes don’t, brings oh sword, mantras, etc. creates the best dps build, it will still not compare to other classes in terms of dps. The dps of mesmer was trash compared to the other classes before HoT. It was only wanted in speed runs due to portal. Then, after HoT, there was a huge power creep made in terms of dps by the other classes. To compensate for the dps spike and large difference between the classes, anet allowed the chonomancer to give alacrity. The changes you suggested really don’t do much to increase the dps of a mesmer in a raid setting. They will already have furry, might, and ferocity from other classes. Without giving alacrity to allies, there would still have to be huge changes to bring chrono up to par that you don’t mention. And yes, I really think it is to the point where a chrono just bringing quickness is not going to cut it. Those other classes still have a huge dps without alacrity. It would be interesting actually what the comparisons are between a dps chrono with alacrity and other classes without alacrity. I currently believe the other classes would win. If the chrono could give up its support wells for mantras or other skills for more dps and be competitive with the other classes, then why didn’t we see such a build evolve out as an alternative to support?

Oh ok ya, I agree, your changes could work for a bunker pvp build. It also would help “glass cannon shatter builds” (both burst dmg and condi) with self alacrity at 66%. Now I think the main things we disagree on is pve. For that, lets be honest, we can only theory craft so much and its best to go out and test it and gather empirical evidence.
And sorry, ya, I see this thread could be used for suggestion besides alacrity. I actually do agree with many of the changes others have suggested for the weaker skills out in the mesmers kitten nal right now. The problem is, we just totally disagree on what is best for pve mes and those disagreements both take the class in a totally different direction. I am also not saying its impossible to do what you are saying. However, to do that you have to increase the dps of the mes by changing many other skills. Such as sword auto dmg, mantra dmg, etc. It would be possible. However, I don’t see it as something the devs would ever do, but maybe I’m wrong. I just, personally, think its more likely to cause more problems with the class. Just don’t want to go back to the portal bot days, you understand. But ya, at least we are discussing and both attempting to find some solution. Anything is better than doing nothing. Im sure the devs will find some solution.

p.s. ya the same could be said about phantasm builds. Phantasms are obviously used in all build types. Eh, as long as people generally have an idea of what type of build I am talking about when people say burst shatter, lockdown, condi, phantasm, etc. I don’t really care. We need some name for them. Lockdown is the same way. You can use “lockdown” skills or traits in other builds. However, the main thing is what the build is trying to specialize in. Wellll, just realized this was getting a little of topic though

Imagined burden is an old skill. In guild wars 1 it was a hex spell that made the target foe move 50% slower. I think they tried to copy this over into gw2 in the form of cripple (which decreases movement speed by 50%). Just a little trivia on its name in case you didn’t know. So I think the reason it is called imagined burden is because the trait makes it so all other gs skill inflict cripple.

FJSAMA.2867:

Cause perma quickness and more personal dmg is a bad thing in pve right? And cause gutting chrono/mesmer cause alacrity being an issue with other classes skills is fine right?
Cause improving mesmer solo pve experience rather than party buff bot is also bad, right?
Cause 4s alacrity when u cs ( or 6s traited) of better alacrity (66%) doenst mean actually 6 or 9s of current alacrity. And also because keep shattering + ressumoning phantasms to close or perma keep alacrity on self and refreshing chronophantasma is not also a pve thing…

Or are you like nab revenant players that camped facets and sword auto only? Do you also summon and keep 3 phantasms and utility bot only? Or do you even shatter+refresh them? You know shatter? Your class mechanic?

Obviously i didnt though about pve at all…

Oookkk, lets take this one step at a time.
“Cause perma quickness and more personal dmg is a bad thing in pve right?”
I never said this, and don’t know how your pulled this idea out of my post. Right now, you can get perma alacrity on allies with wells and phantasms. Therefore, the main issue the devs want to change is how potent alacrity is. Anyone can say perma alacrity is really powerful. However, if that perma alacrity only reduced cool downs by a low amount like 10%, then it will be nearly completely useless. You are giving up all your dps so that you can give a buff to allies that is worse than many skills they can trait for.

And cause gutting chrono/mesmer cause alacrity being an issue with other classes skills is fine right?
Once again, I did not say this, and I surely did not mean to imply it. You seem to think I want chrono gutted, which could not be further from the truth. I don’t want it gutted. The changes you suggest would ruin the class in pve. I want to play mesmer in both game types. If alacrity is an issue with only some specific classes, then those classes should at least be looked at. If alacrity is an issue when you give it to pretty much all other classes (except rev and thief), then the alacrity that is dished out to allies needs to be looked at. Therefore, yes, I do think this is the case. Alacrity dished to allies is too powerful. However, first, I think the power that a chrono can bring to allies has been way overestimated based on the current nerf and second, this means you just need to lower the effect of alacrity to allies. Having it so the chrono did not give any alacrity to allies would just ruin the class in pve because the chrono, even when specifically traited, has hardly any dps compared to the other classes like burnzerker. If you think removing alacrity given to allies with increase the build variety in pve, then I believe you are mistaken. You can still create a build that doesn’t give alacrity to allies if you want to. However, the problem is everyone finds those builds useless. It doesn’t matter if you remove alacrity to allies or not. Those builds will still remain worthless. On the other hand, I don’t know what you are thinking pvp wise either. A bunker chrono needs well of recall to lower the cool downs of its shield and other skills. This build would still remain dead with your changes. All you would do would increase the alacrity for shatter builds. Which, imo, there is a lot better way to balance shatter builds than butchering builds in other game modes as well.

Cause improving mesmer solo pve experience rather than party buff bot is also bad, right?
As I said before, you can play with your own solo pve experience however you want. However, it does not mean it will be useful to other players or that other players will want you to play with them. In order for chrono to remain viable without giving alacrity to allies would require a huge overhaul to the whole class.

Cause 4s alacrity when u cs ( or 6s traited) of better alacrity (66%) doenst mean actually 6 or 9s of current alacrity. And also because keep shattering + ressumoning phantasms to close or perma keep alacrity on self and refreshing chronophantasma is not also a pve thing…

I really don’t quite understand what you mean by this. If you want to explain it a little more in another comment though, Ill have another look at it and get back to you.

Or are you like nab revenant players that camped facets and sword auto only?

Ive payed revenant before. However, I currently do not have a revenant toon. It is deleted do to lack of character spaces.

Do you also summon and keep 3 phantasms and utility bot only? Or do you even shatter+refresh them? You know shatter? Your class mechanic?

lol, of course, if you don’t shatter, even in pve than you are playing the class wrong. What would make you think that I never shatter. Actually one of my favorite builds involves using dom/duel/illusion to put up a continuos shatter sequence with my great sword so that I can lower my cool downs as much as possible so that I can ultimately dish out as much alacrity to allies as possible while still putty up a little damage.

By the way, I apologize for sounding rude in my first comment. I shouldn’t have said it that way. However, I maintain my stance based on my reasoning behind it.

I also realize that you, silverkey, and many others want a wide arrange of viable builds to play by bringing all trait lines in line with each other. I want the same thing. However, I think this is only possible in pvp. I don’t think its possible in pve due to the nature of the class right now unless you changed almost everything. Additionally there is a difference between one or two viable builds and a bunch of equal builds that are not viable. I would rather have the former. Although, yes, I do think its possible in pvp, but I also think it can be done without removing the class from pve.

You can read my thoughts on this change here
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/mesmer/Mesmer-Balance-Changes/page/3#post5959050

Basically, I think the problem deals with both pve and pvp. It is not one game mode specific. With the old alacrity on you, you could get your shield recharge down to 18 seconds, which is ridiculously low compared to the other shield skills in the game. Also, I think the devs waaay overestimate how much the old alacrity helped in raids. However, non the less, it was still exceptionally powerful. My ideal change would be to increase the power of alacrity across the board (at least 50%), and then increase the cool downs of a few key skills that made bunker mesmer a huge problem. Reasoning for this change may be found in the link.

lol, you obviously don’t play pve at all. Thats all I’m bona say. Don’t get me wrong, I’m glad your posting ideas. However, chronos are only brought into raids to give alacrity and quickness to allies. Quickness is no longer mes specific. Many classes can now give themselves quickness and other classes can give quickness to allies as well. If chronos don’t dish out the alacrity to make up for their horrendous dps, then they won’t only not be desirable in raids, but they would probably be shunned as well.

Here are my suggestions. Feel free to butcher it to death if you don’t like the ideas. Just want to know what you think

Precog
Well of Precognition: Many people seem upset with the change to this skill. However, when I look at the other skills in the game, it was obviously overpowered. The reason it is overpowered is because they did not take alacrity into consideration when they decided on its initial cool down. I believe many mesmers would be happy if you made the skill grant blur and increased the cool down to 60 seconds. Ya, I know what a lot of you guys are thinking. A 33.33% increase to the cool down may seem pretty harsh still. However, when you look at the skills of the other classes, like endure pain, this would bring it more in line if the mesmer had alacrity.
endure pain = 4 sec invulnerability/60 sec = .06666666 sec invul/sec
.0666666 =3/x —> x = 3/.0666666 —> x = 45 seconds
See, before any changes were made, endure pain and precog both gave the same amount of invulnerability per second, and they both did not prevent point capture. They were balanced equally. However, the devs perhaps did not take alacrity into full consideration.
With alacrity (currently at 25% reduced cool downs with perma alacrity) the cool down should be:
.0666666 = 3/(x-(.25x)) —> .066666 = 3/.75x —> .066666(.75x) = 3 —> .04999999x = 3 -->
x = 3/.04999999 = 60 sec
Technically, if the chrono had perma alacrity, the well granted invulnerability, and the well did not prevent point capture, the wells would be equal in terms of invul/sec. Personally, I think blur is needed instead of invulnerability since chronos can have a better tank build. Basically, lets try to keep the skill between classes somewhat equal.
p.s. I believe prevent point capture is still up for debate with this skill.

Alacrity:
I don’t understand very much why some think that alacrity should be 66% on the chrono and 33% on everyone else. I believe people think this mainly because there is a rumor going around that mesmer skills are balanced around alacrity (which I only think is partially true). In fact, I think the problem with chrono is more that they did not take alacrity fully into consideration with some skills. One of the big problems with the previous 66% alacrity is that it could reduce the cool down of echo of memory to only 18 seconds. With the nerf to alacrity this number was increased to 22.5 seconds. To be honest, a 22.5 second cool down is much more in line with the other skills. However, it guts the whole class in the process because the chrono relies on alacrity for everything. 66% alacrity was also too high for pve. However (I don’t know if this is just a rumor or not), I heard that when the devs announced it, they said that the 66% alacrity increased the dps of a raid group by 66% ??? This couldn’t be further from the truth.
Alacrity only acts on 5 people, not ten
Even if alacrity can be permanent in theory, it usually not because people move out of your wells.
66% alacrity permanently on translates to 40% reduced cool downs
40% cool downs does not mean a 40% increase in dps
Additionally, a chronomancer is nearly giving up nearly all its dps to give as much alacrity as possible and anything left is so small compared to other classes that it is essentially nonexistant. What also must be taken into consideration is that other classes can provide more dps while at the same time buffing allies.

Summary
Therefore, my suggestion would be to give alacrity a value of 50% instead of 66% or 33% and then change the cool downs of well of precognition and eco of memory respectively
1. Make alacrity reduce cool downs by .5 seconds per second, 50% —>33.33% with perma alacrity.
2. Increase the cool down of well of precognition from 45 seconds to roughly 68 seconds (based on compensating for alacrity using the above equations). Make the well pulse blur. Allow point capture. All of these changes bring it it line with endure pain when taking alacrity into consideration.
3. Increase the cool down of eco of memory so that it gives a 25 second cool down with perma alacrity. This would make it so chronos would have the same amount of protection with the shield per second of cool down as the revenants Crystal Hibernation and Warriors shield stance.
25 sec = x-.333333x, 25 = .66666x, x = 25/.666666 = 37.5 second cool down. Lets just round it up to a 38 second cool down.

Sorry, turned out longer than I thought, summary points are at the bottom and reasoning is above

Precog
Well of Precognition: Many people seem upset with the change to this skill. However, when I look at the other skills in the game, it was obviously overpowered. The reason it is overpowered is because they did not take alacrity into consideration when they decided on its initial cool down. I believe many mesmers would be happy if you made the skill grant blur and increased the cool down to 60 seconds. Ya, I know what a lot of you guys are thinking. A 33.33% increase to the cool down may seem pretty harsh still. However, when you look at the skills of the other classes, like endure pain, this would bring it more in line if the mesmer had alacrity.

endure pain = 4 sec invulnerability/60 sec = .06666666 sec invul/sec
.0666666 =3/x —> x = 3/.0666666 --> x = 45 seconds
See, before any changes were made, endure pain and precog both gave the same amount of invulnerability per second, and they both did not prevent point capture. They were balanced equally. However, the devs perhaps did not take alacrity into full consideration.

With alacrity (currently at 25% reduced cool downs with perma alacrity) the cool down should be:
.0666666 = 3/(x-(.25x)) —> .06666 = 3/.75x --> .066666(.75x) = 3 —> .04999999x = 3 -->
x = 3/.04999999 = 60 sec

Technically, if the chrono had perma alacrity, the well granted invulnerability, and the well did not prevent point capture, the wells would be equal in terms of invul/sec. Personally, I think blur is needed instead of invulnerability since chronos can have a better tank build. Basically, lets try to keep the skill between classes somewhat equal.
p.s. I believe prevent point capture is still up for debate with this skill.

Alacrity:
I don’t understand very much why some think that alacrity should be 66% on the chrono and 33% on everyone else. I believe people think this mainly because there is a rumor going around that mesmer skills are balanced around alacrity (which I only think is partially true). In fact, I think the problem with chrono is more that they did not take alacrity fully into consideration with some skills. One of the big problems with the previous 66% alacrity is that it could reduce the cool down of echo of memory to only 18 seconds. With the nerf to alacrity this number was increased to 22.5 seconds. To be honest, a 22.5 second cool down is much more in line with the other skills. However, it guts the whole class in the process because the chrono relies on alacrity for everything. 66% alacrity was also too high for pve. However (I don’t know if this is just a rumor or not), I heard that when the devs announced it, they said that the 66% alacrity increased the dps of a raid group by 66% ??? This couldn’t be further from the truth.

Alacrity only acts on 5 people, not ten
Even if alacrity can be permanent in theory, it usually not because people move out of your wells.
66% alacrity permanently on translates to 40% reduced cool downs
40% cool downs does not mean a 40% increase in dps
Additionally, a chronomancer is nearly giving up nearly all its dps to give as much alacrity as possible and anything left is so small compared to other classes that it is essentially nonexistant. What also must be taken into consideration is that other classes can provide more dps while at the same time buffing allies.

Summary
Therefore, my suggestion would be to give alacrity a value of 50% instead of 66% or 33% and then change the cool downs of well of precognition and eco of memory respectively

1. Make alacrity reduce cool downs by .5 seconds per second, 50% —>33.33% with perma alacrity.
2. Increase the cool down of well of precognition from 45 seconds to roughly 68 seconds (based on compensating for alacrity using the above equations). Make the well pulse blur. Allow point capture. All of these changes bring it it line with endure pain when taking alacrity into consideration.

3. Increase the cool down of eco of memory so that it gives a 25 second cool down with perma alacrity. This would make it so chronos would have the same amount of protection with the shield per second of cool down as the revenants Crystal Hibernation and Warriors shield stance.

25 sec = x-.333333x, 25 = .66666x, x = 25/.666666 = 37.5 second cool down. Lets just round it up to a 38 second cool down.

eh, now that I look at it, might as well buff warrior shield while your at it to. I don’t understand why Crystal Hibernation is just a better version of shield stance. Add an extra effect, the shield seems outdated.

TheMagicFace.9854:

I feel that any and all classes aren’t useless, and the only people that say so are the l33tz0rs and metaplayers, players that had entire builds centered on the skills nerfed.
So of course they are raging all over the forums about it.
The chrono class only received two nerfs and they were big but the line itself is still very much so strong and viable. I find it especially useful as a sort of a secondary phantasm traitline, the ability to resummon phantasms and clones and give them superspeed on shatters is extremely useful.

Continuum split is what really makes this trait line worth taking. With continuum split in the trait line, I still think this trait line is required. Mes pretty much needs it as well to keep up with the other specializations. However, I would also like to point out that the chrono line received more than two nerfs.

1. alacrity nerfed 66% to 33% (actually not really a trait nerf, but it affects the whole line)
2. Flow of time nerf from 1 sec to 3/4 sec
3. illusionary reversion nerf to a requirement of two illusions
4. Lost time nerf to require 5 and then crit.

Still may not sound like very much, but there are really only 11 different traits in the line (I don’t really count time splitter as it just gives you access to the specialization).

There were also additional specialization nerfs that didn’t have to deal with the trait line These include the shield nerf, precog nerf, and gravity well nerf. I’m not saying some of these nerfs weren’t needed. However, you definitely made an understatement.

Many of you may know this already. However, I just thought I would mention here that Gaile Gray created a topic for patch feedback in the general gw2 section. Apparently she creates a weekly report. I just thought that I would suggest this as a great place for good, constructive feedback. This maaay help relieve some stress many of us have been having with the new patch. We at least know that it is not finalized yet, so there is at least a tinsy bit of hope. Gaile is a nice lady and I’m sure if you put in respectful feedback, she would report it forward for further consideration. I would also like to note that although many of us may feel discouraged based on many of the changes made to the mesmer class over the course of gw2’s history, I would suggest that none of us bail ship or switch mmos yet. Hopefully we can put in some realistic suggestions, not just for balancing this patch, but so we don’t have to deal with such far flung issues in future gw2 patches as well.

Stay strong young Butterflies, and may Lyssa watch over You

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/January-26th-Update-Your-feedback/first

I almost agree with you 100%. There is only one thing I would change:
Add one more kitten before the word ROLE.
There is currently no role for pvp mesmers now. Game over. I’m with you that bunker mes is boring. All we want is at least one COMPETITIVE build that is fast paced and lively. Now, all we can do is pray to Lyssa that some changes come soon. If they don’t, I’m sticking with pyro’s plan and calling it quits for this game, and honestly…its not just this patch. I’m kitten tired of careless nerfs made to the mesmer class just to appease the masses. Others don’t want mesmers to be a class in gw2? Then kitten it, I quit.

How long has mesmer been in the pvp meta compared to the rest of the classes?

Besides bunker mes (which many traditional mesmers do not like playing), how many times was it worth while to bring more than one mesmer into pvp? And yes, I’m looking at you eles. Is the mesmer going to be viable after these nerfs like the eles were previously?

How many times was the mesmer class nerfed Between balance patches? How many times has this happened to other classes? Do you really think they would ever buff mesmers between balance patches?

When has it been worth while to bring multiple mesmers into pve content? Why is it so bad that there can’t be more than one mesmer in a raid? How many god kitten berserkers and scrappers were brought into raids before? There are nine spots open in a raid. If one group brings two mesmers, it doesn’t mean you have to nerf the class into uselessness. If this was the case, we would have no Eles, warriors, engis, and revs.

Look at the history. How many mesmers have been in the first place teams for the world tournament series?
Beijing Dec 5, 2014: 2 eles, 2 engis, 1 thief, 0 mesmers
Boston Mar 7, 2015: 1 engi, 1 guardian, 1 warrior, 1 ele, 1 thief, 0 mesmers
Cologne Aug 8, 2015: 1 engi, 2 eles, 1 necro, 1 thief, 0 mesmers

Mesmers have had kitten in their pvp history. If this game was balanced than you would see a lot more variety.

How does sustained dps of a mes/chrono compare to the other classes? Notice I’m not just pointing out a couple classes, I’m talking about ALL the other classes.

The list could literally go on and on. Based on the history of this game, it looks like there is some biased kitten puppy going on here.

Whatever, I just don’t care anymore. You would have thought this “history” would have been fixed a long time ago. This is why I’m quitting for now unless changes are made. Holy smokes, I just can’t deal with this anymore. I really don’t think anyone could blame anyone here for quitting if they only play mes. Anet has just been mind kittening them the whole time.

The problem is that chronos are already pretty defined by cc. Especially with double gravity well. Therefore, I don’t think they are ever going to increase the cc of chronos. On the other hand, they are also buffing the cc ability of thieves with basi venom.