Guild Wars 2

Synyster.5894:

Zephyrus.9680:

Synyster.5894:

From my Experience with Maguuma So Called Roamer’s is when its 1vs1 they start running for the hills or just run into they find guildies they turn on you right away once they out number you.

Nice screen. Did you learn tower hugging from JQ or is it just an innate skill in T1?

I don’t know you tell me should i initiate that 1vs10? I actually got chased from your tower side to this side by all 10 of these maguuma’s, If it was 1vs1 2vs1 i would gladly fight it. This is pretty much all i have ran into all week while roaming, Guilds running zerg like tactic’s

That’s true but I noticed exactly the same types of groups from BG in ruins, that’s probably the real reason they’re out there. It doesn’t seem a very solo-friendly place at this tier but I’ve found plenty of good fights and duels in the last few days roaming mainly between the camps. Mostly BG but also some SoR. I have to say this match is much better roaming than last week where literally every JQ would run from a 1v1 unless there were 2 or 3 more just out of sight… but maybe just anecdotes.

I think the real reason you haven’t found many Mag roamers is because there are so much more of you, while in NA primetime where mag shows up in force, it’s not to roam.

Synyster.5894:

From my Experience with Maguuma So Called Roamer’s is when its 1vs1 they start running for the hills or just run into they find guildies they turn on you right away once they out number you.

Nice screen. Did you learn tower hugging from JQ or is it just an innate skill in T1?

#T1problems. The most profound problems in GW2.

GrandmaFunk.3052:

there seems to be some confusion here.. escape and mobility are two different concepts.

escape is being able to remove yourself from a losing situation long enough to regain parity.

ex: Mistform, one of the best escape options, doesn’t affect mobility at all.

For roaming, escape means in-combat/burst mobility = leaps/charges/teleports. Either that or stealth (mesmer/theif). And the purpose is to have the option to either get out of combat or avoid combat in the first place. Because of course for a solo roamer, most encounters will be greater numbers than yourself. That’s why for example, necros (and guardians) are still not ideal solo roamers even with 1v1 builds.

It’s not a coincidence that the best roaming classes are the ones with the best escape/mobility options. The exception on my list at least, is engineer, since good engies are just monsters.

Also I believe mistform does give the max move speed cap which is about the same as out-of-combat with swiftness. It’s still not at all useful for roaming since it was nerfed to hell… like ele roaming in general.

IMO Bloodlust and ascended gear are both worse than guard leech and applied fortitude.

I would like to see buffs that reward higher population and more PvE addressed before buffs that reward veteran WvW players…

Um… if its a bot, why do you need a stealth trap?

Omnitek.3876:

When do the mags roam? Been in NA. Been OCX and SEA, nothing worth note.

Eating T1 zergs is so much more profitable than roaming vs groups of 5-10 that are RPing as solo roamers. Off hours you outnumber us probably 6 to 1 so good luck on your search.

Organize a fight club, announce on forums in advance, Mag will come.

I’ll usually just leave 1v1s alone when in doubt.

Israel.7056:

deathTouch.9706:

Right now though, we have to make a choice given Anet’s design decisions. Either face consistent, challenging outnumbered fights but lose the PPT fight every week, or join a zerg server and play for PPT but feel like we’re steamrolling over people through sheer numbers advantage. And there’s no question we’d rather have the former than the latter.

sw

I think that’s a false dichotomy. But it also seems like a manufactured psychological win-win. If you lose no one cares because no one expects you to win and if you win you get to gloat and feel superior because no one expects you to win. See what I mean? That’s the psychological advantage of being the underdog and I think why so many people like to see themselves cast in that role.

I can understand this. There’s a psychological pressure in being the top dog and the favorite to win. Every win is taken for granted, no one is ever surprised or impressed. Every loss is seen as being an indication of weakness or lack of skill. Losers deride winners with bitterness and resentment and winners are hardly ever popular. There are few things that humans enjoy more than seeing a winner disgraced. Misery loves company as they say.

I’d still rather be in a position to win. I’d rather know that my side has the strength to come out victorious. It’s nice to be the underdog but I feel that it’s more frustrating to feel that my efforts are ultimately going to be for nothing. If that frustration ever outweighs the self-satisfaction you get to feel from being the underdog I would advise that you consider a transfer.

I’ll just call that #t1logic because it’s incomprehensible to me. The matches where we outnumber the other servers are the WORST matches. I quit this game for months when mag had a series like that. You’re referring to PPT like it’s the sole reason to WvW while I don’t honestly understand how PPT could have any meaning to anyone unless there was a competition for the outcome.

Sorry but clean keeps and ‘kept keeps’ lower wxp/hour.

8v8 vs 20v20

4+4+4 vs 4+4+4 vs 80v80(v80)

4v4 vs 1+1+1+1+1 vs 1+1+1+1+1…

GW1 had small scale fights better. GW2 has better large scale fights.

naphack.9346:

[..]
Adding some stronger counterplay to group boons, which are not necessarily all that dangerous in duels/small fights is all that’s needed to introduce a paper to the game, which can beat the massed rock.

If by group boons you mean stability than I agree. Condition CC (freeze cripple immobilize) should be a stronger counter but warriors are almost immune to cc conditions which is what makes melee (warrior/guardian) frontline trains so hard to stop.

Who is SoR and why are they ded?

Class strengths
Zerg: ele, necro, warrior, guardian
Solo roam: thief, warrior, mesmer, engi
Small team: anything (team comp)

Well so far this match seems a lot more fun than last week. BG actually has a few roamers willing to 1v2 or even 1v1 without running and the zergs don’t try to avoid each other at all costs. SoR in particular has a lot of… persistence.

Terrahero.9358:

Zephyrus.9680:

Terrahero.9358:

As usual, its a balance made around sPvP. In 5v5 boon removal can keep up, and boonstacking doesnt have the same potential to run wild like in WvW. Its also a gamemode where you fight on limited size areas, so AoE boon removal is far more effective even if its pulse-based.
Either they lose a multitude of boons or they step of the capture point. Not so in WvW where zergs, especially melee trains, are constantly moving.

sPvP isn’t about boon removal (or stacking) at all… Boons are ubiquitous like dodge rolls. Everyone has access to some of them and they’re part of class’s combat mechanics. Or do you think eles and guardians are overpowered 1v1 because they have the most boons and uptime? If you think that, sorry, you’re bad. Boons are not something that can or need to be countered ‘in general’. First, they’re all different and unrelated, each with a separate context for use. So talking about boons ‘in general’ is meaningless.

The issue with melee trains being overpowered (if they actually are…) is their tankiness combined with anti-cc abilities like AoE condition removal as well as stability uptime that makes them hard to stop. A nerf to 1 or 2 of the skills that power the train would have a huge impact on the balance of this comp. Boons ‘in general’ have nothing to do with it.

Maybe you should actually bother to read what you quote.

I merely commented that arenanet balances around spvp, not wvw, and in spvp you dont have a ton of combofield+blast finishers or stacking of duration boons from several professions as you do in wvw, and fighting happens in considerably more confined areas.
As a result aoe boonstacking isnt as dominant, prevelant or hard to counter as it is in wvw.

At no point did i say boonstacking professions are overpowered, where you got that leap from is beyond me.

Yes. I did read, and not only do I think you’re wrong, I don’t even think you’re consistent. You’re saying boon stacking is OP, and boon stacking professions are not OP…

Over powered implies one side/comp/profession is getting an excessively large advantage. But you’re not talking about 1 or 2 boon where this might be true, you seem to be referring to ALL boons which all classes have at least some of. That’s why its a meaningless claim unless you’re saying certain boon-heavy classes are OP.

Or do you mean combo fields exclusively? Might and swiftness are the only significant combo field boons. Might has to be done just before a fight, meaning it’s a tactical commitment. Might stacking isn’t OP because it’s obvious and happens right in front of you. Both teams can do it the same, just the better team will take better advantage of the situation because might stacking makes the zerg vulnerable.

I don’t know about you but more often than not, I see might stacking zergs exploding from AoE dps + cc bombs. Their boon stacking was their weakness.

Boons ‘in general’ are not overpowered in WvW. The mechanics are not any different from a team of 5 working together, because the AoE limit is still 5 in WvW.

AoE stability might be a little overpowered but that’s 1 boon and from very limited skills. Therefore, it’s the skills, not the boon itself.

Terrahero.9358:

As usual, its a balance made around sPvP. In 5v5 boon removal can keep up, and boonstacking doesnt have the same potential to run wild like in WvW. Its also a gamemode where you fight on limited size areas, so AoE boon removal is far more effective even if its pulse-based.
Either they lose a multitude of boons or they step of the capture point. Not so in WvW where zergs, especially melee trains, are constantly moving.

sPvP isn’t about boon removal (or stacking) at all… Boons are ubiquitous like dodge rolls. Everyone has access to some of them and they’re part of class’s combat mechanics. Or do you think eles and guardians are overpowered 1v1 because they have the most boons and uptime? If you think that, sorry, you’re bad. Boons are not something that can or need to be countered ‘in general’. First, they’re all different and unrelated, each with a separate context for use. So talking about boons ‘in general’ is meaningless.

The issue with melee trains being overpowered (if they actually are…) is their tankiness combined with anti-cc abilities like AoE condition removal as well as stability uptime that makes them hard to stop. A nerf to 1 or 2 of the skills that power the train would have a huge impact on the balance of this comp. Boons ‘in general’ have nothing to do with it.

If the OP’s claim was true, everyone would be running boon duration runes.

aeroh.8930:

The question is, what is the counter to mass boons? […]

The counter to mass boons (stability being the one that really matters) is primarily necros, and they work quite well. Buff is not needed. If you’re asking for a skill that instantly strips all boons, that’s ridiculous and ironic. Because what would be the counter to that?

The fact that you’re claiming the blob with more boons wins just shows how little you understand about why you really lost. Because every group can and will use boons. If the enemy zerg is stacking might in front of you then how about:
a: take the opportunity to nuke their blob that they’ve so nicely stacked in one spot.
b: stack your own might.
c: be ready to kite back so their stacks wear off.

The fact that they used the right skills and combo fields at the right time and beat you, doesn’t mean you can legitimately claim boons (in general) are OP. It means they played better. Because the whole premise that more boons=win is false.

Thing is, it’s good that PvEers are coming to WvW. Some of them are learning and staying.

They’re already stated they’ll fix it sometime. So the technical answer is “soon”.

Adahilia.3678:

Zephyrus.9680:

Someone’s new to WvW. This is clearly how Anet intended the game to be played and it won’t change till they decide to fix it.

New or not he does have a point. While things are ever changing in world, the karma training that has become world during this league is promoting bad game play that during harder match ups we would not desire to have. When we are not consistent in what we do in world it confuses people, and they learn bad habits as a result.

Completely agree. However, the cause is from Anet’s broken reward (and PPT) system. Nothing will change ever until they decide to make upgraded objectives worth more for rewards and paper objectives worth less. Then the game would actually be more about defense, scouting, strategy, etc… And not just k-train for ppt, rewards, and everything else.

Someone’s new to WvW. This is clearly how Anet intended the game to be played and it won’t change till they decide to fix it.

Fuzzion.2504:

Zephyrus.9680:

dreztina.4820:

Fighting JQ necro and warrior 1v2, they run to the nearest tower where a third is waiting with a superior ballista, just to be safe. GG CNM, SF, and SOL. You guys are amply demonstrating why JQ has the lowest individual skill of any server I’ve fought.

Similar encounters from about an hour of roaming on ele[…]

Have you tried behind the windmill. Its the official fight club.

robocafaz.9017:

Zephyrus.9680:

So JQ’s FC participation consisted of a 30 zerg and a 2v1 that tried to stomp…

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G-N9IKbId94

#wannabeT3problems. I guess I can’t complain. This week got my guard killer maxed.

Gizmo.9178:

Zephyrus.9680:

DT is a poorly designed skill in general. Untargeted should DT directly on the ele. I don’t care either way about LoS but I would definitely like DT to be ground targeted. It would actually be useful as a blast finisher then.

That made me lol. I would like to see that.

This is usually how it’s used when targeted anyway. You want to DT in your fire field which you’re standing in, or DT and then fire field where it will impact, for the blast finisher. But untargeted now it randomly goes way ahead of your position which makes it useless to use that way.

Also… Necro thread still so relevant. Sad.

dreztina.4820:

Fighting JQ necro and warrior 1v2, they run to the nearest tower where a third is waiting with a superior ballista, just to be safe. GG CNM, SF, and SOL. You guys are amply demonstrating why JQ has the lowest individual skill of any server I’ve fought.

Similar encounters from about an hour of roaming on ele…

An impromptu duel between a JQ and Mag with 4 other Mag waiting in line…

3 separate ‘1v1s’ with either a JQ or TC running (and dying) without a single offensive skill being cast.

A 10v1 chase (ruins ‘roaming’ group).

A ~5v1 stomp by SF. Might have happened twice.

A condition engi running and hiding in a buffed camp…

A fun 1v1 vs warrior that turned into a 1v2 when I was close to downing him, and then a 1v3 at which point I ran.

Rambo into a 1v2 which immediately became a 1v3 and down.

BP and DR (during bandwagons) tied for the absolute worst skilled players in memory for me. I honestly don’t know about this match because an even fight just never happens. JQ doesn’t even show at FC. The only good individual players I’ve seen this whole week were GF and it was all mesmers. Oh and 1 HzH thief but that was last week.

+1 would like trait templates (such as on LoL). For example to quickly switch my ele between roaming and zerging weapon/trait sets. A while back, this was supposed to be on the table.

Now I see some completely useless item in the TP that has nothing to do with trait templates… Wut?

Blinds are incredibly weak in GW2. Essentially a nonfactor condition except for very limited 1v1 reflex shots. How could you possibly compare it to stuns? Sure stuns can do what blinds do (and better), but they can also do 100x more things. Stuns are primarily offense/shutdown. Blinds are pure defense and in a very limited way. There’s really no comparison.

And second, why does (allegedly) nerfing condition removal buff blinds? The condition removal for blind is 1 basic attack… Maybe if blinds could stop stomping it would actually be a significant condition in GW2.

I guarantee the nerf (if there is one) is all about moving past the hammer train meta so it’s 100% about CC conditions. Blind will remain purely a 1v1 condition with almost no value.

DT is a poorly designed skill in general. Untargeted should DT directly on the ele. I don’t care either way about LoS but I would definitely like DT to be ground targeted. It would actually be useful as a blast finisher then.

TL;DR:

also they will build acs that can hit everywhere

Tarkus.4109:

40 is not a blob[…]

40 in T1 is something like a mid-size roaming group. Definitely not a blob.

T1 groups of this size are usually suitable for a wide range of smaller scale activities including:
PVD on paper towers
Flipping camps
Taking Buttlust points (1 at a time)
Engaging solo roamers head on
Chasing down solo roamers
Grub
Tree grub

azizul.8469:

so basically the gold league should be the top 9 instead of the top 6……..

Basically not.

Platinum league should be BG, SoR, JQ. It’s nice to farm these servers but ppt-wise, any other match involving any of these ‘special’ servers is pointless.

Gold league should be TC, Mag, SoS, SBI, FA. TC doesn’t even quite fit anywhere but all the others are close to even matches.

I don’t know how the remaining servers should have been subdivided since I don’t have an idea of their power. Point is, it could have been done a lot better to make things semi-competitive at least.

Butter.3024:

Nuzt.7894:

Butter.3024:

Nuzt.7894:

Butter.3024:

Well I’m in SoR and most of us are still fighting hard in NA prime time

But between the 2v1, and knowing that tomorrow ZD just gonna flip all of our T3 and lose the PPT by another 10k, it’s very discouraging.

But still SoR still fight, if you want good fight come to SoR BL or EB BL and sometimes SoS BL, especially NA prime time

Its has been some fun fights, but lets not bring up 2v1, thats the last thing anyone from SoR should mention when in a matchup with SoS.

Uhh, I state facts, not opinions, so no. Need I to say both SoS and BG attack SoR keep in EB yesterday while BG wait at spawn stopping reinforcement? Need I to say Agg and CNB and JINX all attack hills and garri in SoR BL continuously for 4 hours? If not for the great leading of our commander and scouts we would have lost everything already

Do we really need to bring up the SoR/SBI/SoS matchup and remind you how karma works ?

I don’t think we should …

No you should, go ahead

I’m not on those servers but pretty sure there was some open double teaming going on (based on how SBI’s expected rating went way up later that week). SoR has a reputation for playing dirty. I guess payback is a kitten huh?

Cool story bro and welcome to coverage wars 2 (aka Stackwars 2). Leagues are not competitive at all. If you’re stuck in Anet’s idea that they’re supposed to be, you’re not going to have any fun in WvW. Forget PPT and play for the fights or else it’s not worth playing at all.

Everyone already knows leagues are a joke in terms of being competitive. Lots of good suggestions have already made in terms of balancing/scaling PPT and rewards to fix k-training and bring some actual strategy into WvW.

Fairweather trolls will always come to post that WvW isn’t supposed to be ‘fair’ (when the actual topic is about balance).

The real question is, whether Anet is interested in working on the foundations of WvW. Or will they just continue to plop new flawed features on flawed foundations and pretend it’s competitive/balanced while everyone just grinds the k-train for wxp/rewards without any incentive for real fights.

Maguuma already declared victory but 2nd place is still open for discussion.

Necro or guardian. There are other close 2nds but those are the best. I find staff ele more than sufficient. Thief can tag, yes, but has very little value in a zerg.

thenivekproject.4139:

Sol.8341:

I have seen non-stealth-able class disappearing too when alone but I thought it was due to this :

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Superior_Rune_of_Infiltration

There is a possibility for the guardian mentioned because he was in downstate but he only vanished after we saw him lie there for approx 1 sec.

The ele had approx 30% to 40% hp so it is highly not possible for that rune to have its effect then.

Then again if the rune itself is bugged then it’ll make both examples possible.

On the whole we’ve seen a lot of these stealthy players (not even gonna say classes) and its sad to see them only from 1 server. We fight them every week to the point even threads are brought up about it. And I respect the fight when it was clean. Now with this….on top of the ranger shooting from underground glitch….I gotta say I’ve lost alot of respect for them.

Guardian was certainly rune of infiltration. It’s very possible it would stealth him on the same hit that took him down. The rune isn’t bugged, I’ve used it before. It’s possible the ele hit 10% health from one hit which instantly stealthed him, Then he used RTL + teleport in stealth and healed up. I’ve never seen stealth hacks and tele hacks are a lot more obvious than what you described.

Dedelta.5018:

Frigid.6027:

i solo roam and can barely find people willing to fight without odds in their favor. It’s not just jq players who wont fight 1v1.

three [PiNK] thieves were in ruins on jqbl and if i managed to get one to wander off from from the other 2, he/she would cloak and dagger off an animal and run back to his buddies.

Don’t put your servers on some high pedestal because you think you fight unfair odds.

Please dont put your server on that same pedestal this is all I found when Roaming JQ BL during NA Prime time and Ocx times.

1st pic Ocx time
2nd pic NA time (I think Ganking Guild would fit better)

Cheers

Guilds that actually that I’ve seen so far is that [KoS] guy in the second pic and the Guild [Ark] guys I guess I will keep looking for all those other roamer guilds.

Have to agree. I was roaming on Mag on ele and saw the normal few JQ/TC that wouldn’t engage in a 1v1. Finally found a ranger to 1v1 at ruins which turned into a 1v2 and then a 1v3 which was too much for me. Then next I found a fun duel vs a p/d thief and things weren’t looking good for him but it was interrupted by a Mag guardian so he refuged and ran.

Same stories a couple more times so I just went to EB and to k-train/badge train between SM and blue keep. 1v1 just won’t happen in NA primetime and I guess this t1 1vx roaming has to be handed on thief or else in groups of 3-10… zzz

Could be #t1tactics but I’m guessing the ruins mini zergs of 10-15 are PvE guilds there for the meta achievement.

kaisez.4968:

Omg !! we losing our Bl to TC that pvd now .. we should drop off.. we going to lose the match … noooo
wtf TC if have some honor got Eb if you want fight .. running around for karma train in Monday is already !

Yea wtf TC… JQ BL is only for ppt! How could you attack their helpless borderland?!

So JQ’s FC participation consisted of a 30 zerg and a 2v1 that tried to stomp…

ParaldaWind.4523:

Video of our GvG with EP last night:

Frontline Destroyer Warrior PoV, with some comms:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A0MS-n8dsV8

Great fights!

Nice comeback. Interesting to see a warrior that doesn’t have a hammer for a change.

This thread might have made sense when the ranks were just introduced…

In general, WXP ranks are good.

Guard defense/killer lines are questionable. But considering that ascended weapons are also in WvW, it’s a good counter balance for those of us who don’t have this gear.

Victory.2879:

If i’m awake the only class i struggle against a solo thief on is my zerk built ranger[…]

The reason is because zerk and ranger. This is the main target GC thieves are strong vs.

Cynz.9437:

the problem with that toughness though is that thief scaling is horible; if you give same toughness to warrior for example they get way more out of each point

i ran full toughness/condi build on my thief before; it is pathetic how survivability is just slightly (something like 6% dmg redux) better than zerker

6% damage reduction would be like adding around 150 toughness…

Toughness ‘scales’ better at lower numbers (except that light armor/ranged classes don’t tend to get hit as much anyway). And of course ‘effective HP’ from toughness scales with max HP.

Reward should be based on level of upgrades

Kreen.3925:

deathTouch.9706:

SleepingDragon.1596:

Can Maguuma stop bringing out their 1-3 man crew to fight? I don’t like wasting too much time to complete my dailies and fighting small crews doesn’t cut it. Where’s the huge force that was there during reset???

You know what else helps in completing dailies? Not wiping to the small roaming groups.

I think his point was that he wanted more than 1-3 people to kill in a bite sized chunk given the daily I think he is referring to requires 10 kills. I guess he is just looking to save a bit of time and kill 10 in one go. Could you help him with that?

More #t1problems. Learn to roam, try SoS, or wait till NA primetime.

After being baited into a fake duel with 4 or 5 from ‘WvW’ guild, I finally found some good duels with an HzH thief in Mag ruins. Pulling S/D thief out after 6 months, I see I need practice.

Chris.3290:

Comprissent.3856:

rip JQ garri with almost no resistance

JQ confirmed for PvE server

To be fair, do they really gain a thing by holding it? Ratings don’t matter right now, they get 5 points if they win by 1 point or 400,000, and they have 2 more weeks after this one of the same PvD crap. Maguuma gets JQ for 3 weeks in a row.

Right now they just want to spend the next 3 weeks doing karma trains to clear their queues before they actually have to work for a win.

In other words, they wanted you to take it.

Obviously generalizing a server but look at the OP question and answer. That PPT chart is so important for T1.

Also the fact that yesterday we had their garri for 6+ hours till sleep time? (I wasn’t there the whole time). They might have liked to train it but I don’t think Mag is that interested in karma this match. Badges yes.

Rigel.3092:

Nothing, nothing new being given here, nothing.

Your server is all seasoned veterans with no PvErs visiting WvW? Pay for my transfer to your server plz.