Guild Wars 2

Kakeru.2873:

Fuz.5621:

Snowy.9580:

wildcode.5403:

The lack of the holy trinity(healer/dps/tank) in GW2 means we must change the playing style that we’ve grown lazy with by relying on the trinity in other games. GW2 is not “just” another MMO, GW2 redefines how we play MMOs and if we don’t change the lazy playing style that we have grown accustomed to, then we are left feeling like we don’t have a place in the game.

Because the tactics of “Die & run back” is sooo much fun, and only second to that all time favourite “Help! All 3 trash mobs are on me & I’ve no energy left to roll about like a Jedi with!”.

Yup, the game is fine without any kitten trinity or anything else… like fun!

Tactical tip of the day: “Ok, all drop combo fields and hope no one dies!”

I don’t “die and run back”. Not after my first runs on the dungeons.
Learn and adapt.
You just suck at this game and you’re blaming the game itself for your lack of skill.

It’s funny you say that, because there is a path in CoF which you MUST use the “die, revive and run back” tactic otherwise it is virtually impossible. And don’t even try to argue that, this is due to a players skill or build because it’s clearly bad game design.

White knights like you are going to be the downfall of this game, it’s the reason SWTOR just fell apart, it’s blind fanboy fanbase who don’t know the meaning of constructive critisim and think their game is perfect in every single way, then wonder why the game ends up dead within a year.

Don’t make me laugh, man. “Constructive criticism” you say.

More than half of this so-called “constructive criticisms” I read around here are just beautified rants dressed-up in some kind of pseudo-analytic arguments that, if all things fail, ultimately spirals down into one form of condescending sarcasm or another.

Sure, we can all do this – pretend we are all right in our own ways, and better and smarter than some random other person because we have the safety of anonymity, right? You’re so smart you can even predict the fate of this game one year down the road. Hmm, maybe you’re right.

But don’t think for one second that our intelligence are so low we can’t tell what is going on around here, really. A rant is a rant.

Snowy.9580:

Lymain.6723:

Mackdose.6504:

The roles aren’t designed to be structured, and it’s painfully obvious that you can’t get your head out of the “this is my job, and it’s the only one I have” mindset.

Right, the roles in this game are more subtle and nuanced than the trinity system. The issue is that players have very little incentive to learn how they work outside of tPvP and high-level Fractals. You can run through AC or zerg in WvW/hotjoins without hardly coordinating at all, which leads people to believe that there is nothing to coordinate. It’s like running super easy/outleveled zones in trinity games with just DPS because you don’t need a tank or healer.

^^This!^^

Add to the fact that it has made grouping less fun for some too. How so? Well, no one has to care or give a kitten about antone else, so if your in trouble… tough kitten, die & run back!
Yes, waiting for an hour for a tank or healer wasn’t fun. But only if you were the dpser, every ones I’ve ever met only cared about themselves & their damage meters, so it hardly mattered. Had they joined guilds (another unselfish act) they would have had groups!

So, I’m starting to see it more clearly now.

What you seem to hate is actually not the game, but the players’ culture that you believe is a result of the game mechanics. You and others who feel this way may be right, but its like saying I put a razor in the toy box – whatever you do with that razor is up to you.

Dealing with people sucks, trinity or otherwise. I don’t understand why anybody would expect differently from this game. But don’t blame it for human nature.

Hawkmoon.5849:

It’s amusing how many people are clearly satisfied with the mindless dim-witted combat in this game.

Vasham was right; Lot’s points only further emphasize it.

I would elaborate further, but it’s clear after 4 pages that there are too many sheep who are buying everything that ANet is selling… even this level of mediocrity.

This “level of mediocrity” is what we paid 60 dollars for.

So you’re a wolf. And that gives you what, exactly? Your 60 dollars back? The chance of deciding for Anet on how to change their game?

No, I’m actually curious, please enlighten me. What do you all gain from this? Some kind of satisfaction that you can talk down on some stranger on the net?

lacrimstein.5603:

The first problem is that none of the roles except DPS are defined well. There is no pure healing role. There is no pure tanking role. There is no pure support role. It would be nice if I as a player could mix my roles (ex. I want to be mostly a healer, but be able to buff my allies as well). Right now I can only be DPS with a tiny bit of healing or support. It would be great if the old trinity system was there, but any class had access to all the roles and could switch between them with ease.

The second problem is that roles are not forced by the encounter. Sure, you can create a complex strategy, fine-tune your team’s skills, traits, etc. for a particular encounter… Or, you can just rush in. Same end result, which makes the strategic approach look overdone and unnecessary, kind of like a Rube Goldberg machine. Bosses need more complex mechanics instead of hard-hitting mega-health-bars they are right now. This is something that the best trinity MMOs (WoW, Rift, LotRO) get right and GW2 doesnt.

In theory, providing the option between trinity roles and dual/triple/no-roles may seem like a noble and workable idea. In reality, peer pressure will most likely drive people towards trinity roles anyway.

If there is an option to specialize in any one role and be very good at that role – in a team play, it is logically better that there are 3 specialized roles that can augment each other and still do their jobs exceptionally, than having 3 multi-roles that are limited as a drawback of their versatility. Therefore, people will generally favor still choosing a trinity role. One because it is simpler to specialize, and two because there is no more need for versatility.

Now -and this is important- it doesn’t mean that the trinity system is therefore better than the no-role system. It just means that you cannot offer both options; doing so is like saying you are having trinity system anyway. The main characterizing quality and advantage of the no-role system is exactly just that: the absence of the capability to specialize in any role. This is both the restriction that is given and the good thing about it.

I agree with your second point.

Other things to do.

Lots of running around.

Tolmos.8395:

projectcedric.6951:

My opinion:

What is it about WoW that makes you NOT play it but play GW2 instead?

Please think about it for a moment. Have you figured it out? If so, I think it would be a much effective way if you suggest that on the WoW forums instead of the other way around here.

It seems that what you are looking for is “WoW on steriods”. It is much easier to turn WoW into “WoW on steriods”, than GW2 into “WoW on steroids”.

It WAS easier. Since Nov 15th they’ve been working diligently to do just that. We really just need the trinity (which would only require a few threat buffs on a couple of warrior skills) and raids the game will be set. Endgame already revolves around instance grinding now.

If the only thing between them and this suggestion is how difficult it would be for this game to emulate WoW, they have alleviated much of that difficulty in the past 2 months.

You may be right about the last two months. But I disagree with you on the seeming simpleness of re-designing the current battle system into this so-called trinity roles.

I’m sure you are not completely unfamiliar with game development. Almost always the case, if there is combat involved, the combat system is one of the very first to be designed. Almost everything else is designed after and around the combat system.

It’s not just a matter of changing the skills to specialize. Technically, they can do that. But if the change is as drastic as from the current to trinity, the whole game is off. 100% sure. I estimate another 6-10 months of re-balancing, maybe more. It wont be surprising if crafting, dungeons, wvw and pvp systems all have to be redesigned too.

My opinion:

What is it about WoW that makes you NOT play it but play GW2 instead?

Please think about it for a moment. Have you figured it out? If so, I think it would be a much effective way if you suggest that on the WoW forums instead of the other way around here.

It seems that what you are looking for is “WoW on steriods”. It is much easier to turn WoW into “WoW on steriods”, than GW2 into “WoW on steroids”.

Luggernaut.6785:

I like how everyone on these forums “works out 7 days a week and goes white water rafting, hiking fishing and skydiving.” Be real….when would you have the time if you play this game for even 8 hours a day?

Yeah, man. That and marathon-watching five seasons of breaking bad, its a tough life. Tsk. First-world problems.

Grundle.7302:

Nayru.4537:

Grundle.7302:

Aberrant.6749:

I salvage massive numbers of items. I blow through stacks of mystic salvage kits at an alarming rate. I get about 1 ecto per item on average with them. There are streaks where i get none for a while, but that’s later made up by getting 2’s and 3’s.

Theplayboy.6417:

Your statement would be the true if ANet was flipping coins or Rolling Dice but the reality is that there is nothing Random about a Computer Random Number Generator. Computers do not spit out random numbers. The output only appears random. Computers have to operate within a specific set of guidelines.

You can get a computer to spit out random numbers… Random.org does it by using atmospheric noise to produce the numbers instead of just a formula.

I’m sure this game doesn’t do that though… :P

The RNG in this game isn’t at all bad at being random from what I can tell. What I think the problem is that most people expect far fewer streaks than what will happen in a random situation.

People expect 4 upgrades when they do 20 flushes of the mystic toilet, every set of 20 rares salvaged to produce a total of 20 ectos, etc… because that’s the average. But that’s just not how it works. The sample sizes are just too small. Within a small sample you can have all sorts of results which… don’t really mean anything.

Manipulation of the chances… is a totally different beast…

I agree with people that don’t like the randomness in their game… I would prefer a set 1 ecto per rare and for the mystic toilet to just require a set # of the same quality item to produce an upgrade. But oh well : /

Thank you. After reading this post I did another couple hundred rares, and got 10 in a row that didn’t give me any ectos. But if you look at my spreadsheet at the end of the mystic salvage kit I received 0.89 ectos per rare which is well within the standard deviation of the originally reported .90 drop rate from around release.

If you increase your sample size you will increase your chances of breaking away from RNG and pushing yourself closer to the intended drop rate. The guy with the explanation of standard deviation nailed it.

And guy with the “computers can’t generate random numbers”: your argument is irrelevant. Of course nothing can systematically generate something completely random and this isn’t a secret, but the flaws in any computer’s RNG aren’t what is giving you kitten loot. ANET’s DR is what is giving you kitten loot.

Do you realise in this thread you have said you have salvaged over 1000 rares just to check the ecto rate?

Guess what, I just salvaged 2000 rares and got no ecto. Proof that it has been nerfed.

Where did I say that I salvaged the rares JUST TO CHECK THE ECTO RATE? I believe I stated I salvaged the rares, which anyone should have been able to pick up was probably not for an experiment. I found a market where I can make about 25% ROI on salvaging some rares. Because of this, I salvage a lot of rares. The way this market works is on calculated odds of dropped materials from each item and because of this I keep records on each run of salvages I do. If I didn’t I could lose a couple hundred gold before I noticed the downswing.

Didn’t think that needed to be explained but lowest common denominator and all, I guess.

Tsk. You just got trolled, man. But thanks for the info

In any case, I don’t know whats so improbable about salvaging a thousand rares. It’s not like there are any other use for them.

Define longevity.

If its covering every content available currently, and disregarding all those Legendary farming, its pretty short. At this point, there are still a few things to do, but rl might get in the way. And tv shows.That’s the thing. It’s easy to think that gamers are typically yknow, 1/2 rl and 1/2 gaming life, so after a couple of months of chain-playing a game, you finish it and you move on? But there’s a lot of other things too.

Snowy.9580:

projectcedric.6951:

Snowy.9580:

And to those shouting about how much they like having no roles, you really do want to play BF3 or Mario…

..or GW2?

It’s basically what is said there. On the box. Did I miss something?

Yeah, you left out the “RPG” part that is meant to be in it too.

Hey now, you’re insulting my int, man.

I know what the “role” in RPG stands for. And it is NOT the same “role” in combat roles.

Don’t go down this road, man. Just don’t.

Snowy.9580:

And to those shouting about how much they like having no roles, you really do want to play BF3 or Mario…

..or GW2?

It’s basically what is said there. On the box. Did I miss something?

Kakeru.2873:

projectcedric.6951:

Not sure. Too many factors and too early to tell. I heard they are making a Skyrim mmorpg.

Yes! not Skyrim tho, TESO looking really good i’m excited! it’s going to have a similar wvwvw with 3 factions haha

That’s good. I hope its all of the continents together.

Nayru.4537:

projectcedric.6951:

Nayru.4537:

Except GW1 got abandoned by devs months ago. No more updates and exodus of players.

Hmm.. wonder why.

Hmm.. wonder why.After all, you say its a superior game in every way.

To make a less successful sequel and try to kill wow? lol

Lol indeed. Its so amusingly laughable…

..how anybody would play a game with that kind of mindset.

Nayru.4537:

Except GW1 got abandoned by devs months ago. No more updates and exodus of players.

Hmm..wonder why.

After all, you say its a superior game in every way.

Rhysati.4932:

City of Heroes/Villains was wildly successful. They had a tank archetype, but you didn’t need them to tank for you. They had a support archetype, but you didn’t need them to heal for you. You had all the roles, you just didn’t HAVE to have them in any setup to make things work.

Idk, man, but doesn’t that seem like more fail to you than any of the other two systems talked about here?

Its like they’re saying “Hey, we designed some archetypal character roles for you -which by right we intend for you to play in a certain way- but you can pretty much play however you want with them”

And I would be like “So… um… which one is it really? Defined roles or not? You seem like you cant make up your mind.”

Karate do or karate dont. No karate middle.

Not sure. Too many factors and too early to tell. I heard they are making a Skyrim mmorpg.

Chakashio.1285:

And just one question people, as I read only
“NO I HATE TRINITY, IT SUCKS” and “YES I LOVE TRINITY, I WANT IT!”…
Are you against the Trinity because you think that you will be “pressed” into a role that you can’t really change anymore?
Because I think that ArenaNet would simply have to give us more options to individualize.

I’m only speaking for myself, but I don’t hate trinity nor I love it.

In fact, before this, there wouldn’t even be a question. Mmorpg? Trinity. Just choose your class already. It comes as naturally as fighting games have health bars. Except for some few mmorpgs, like Runescape (which..is weird in its own way).

I think this whole meta-awareness that there is a trinity-system is founded on the fundamental question that I believe GW2 -intentionally or not- explores:

WHY do we need a trinity system?

The problem that is making all this noise around, you see, is that some people liked the way Anet did it, some people don’t. I mean, nobody goes around admitting this, but strip things down and basically it is it (just dont argue with me on this one).

And you can read every single thread that has been made since time immemorial about this dichotomy, and you’ll realize there is absolutely no reason at all why one combat system is objectively better than the other EXCEPT PREFERENCE.

That being said, my point is this: I’ts not like I can’t play any other mmorpgs if I choose to play GW2. If I want a dungeon-based game at any moment, I’ll play another game that specializes in dungeon runs. If I want a trinity-based, I’ll play one.

So it just so happens that there is a game that is NOT trinity and I bought it for that reason -regardless of how people think it is a fail or win- and I enjoy playing that game, why in F’s name would I want it to become like the other trinity games?

Przemek.6835:

projectcedric.6951:

Przemek.6835:

projectcedric.6951:

Przemek.6835:

I am playing more or less frequently because the game is enjoyable for me which doesn’t mean it is perfect.

Why not?

It’s a video game. You say you enjoy it. What else is missing in the equation?

You misunderstood me. I enjoy a part of it wnich is exploring, crafting etc. Aka doing stuff that for me always worked as a sort of “addition” to pve and pvp wnich in this game makes me alt f4 after 5 minutes of it. Boring. Skillless. Repetetive. Etc Etc Etc. I can write an essay of trakittenalk about the problem but why would I if you don’t get simple statement. I draw you an illustration to help u understand what I mean

TERRIBLE—-NOT BAD—-GW2—-GREAT——————————-PERFECT

On the contrary, I think what you’re saying here is simple.

You bought a game with a set expectations of what you consider a “perfect” game, and found out that more than half of the game didn’t meet your expectations. While there are some aspects which do and still keep you playing ‘enjoyably’.

And now you are…“suggesting”… that they change the game according to what you want, so that it will become the image of the “perfect” game you had in mind.

So what do we say that?

Boohoo.

Soz for double post, this is going to be my last one. Gonna play some LoL. Neither your opinion or my does matter. There are 2 opposite directions that this game can take. Maybe more. What matters is wnich direction more players will like. We dont matter.

Good you realized.

Przemek.6835:

On a side, in WoW after every encounter I knew I could have played better. I messed spell priority a bit, or I popped my cds a while too fast. I don’t have that feeling in gw2 there is no self improvement.

What a load of bull, man.

Let’s cut the crap, ok? Don’t insult our intelligence. I can practically do this in ANY game. This so-called “self-improvement”. I can do this in Pacman or Mafia Wars. I’ll just think “next time I’ll eat the dots faster” or “time my clicking one second better so I maximize my energy refill”.

What you have here, as much as I do and everybody else in this forum.. is bias. PURE BIAS!

Truth is, you can come around here, pretend like you’re so smart better than every body else and throw in your arguments till New Year’s Eve, and there will always be people like me meeting you head on, but the fact is, it doesn’t come down to what is right or wrong, logical or not, fail or not fail. It just comes down to what YOU like and don’t like about the game.

Don’t give us all these argumentative stuffs like you have the answer to every problem -when you just want the ideal you had in your head- because for every one reason you put up there, I have another one just the same.

Przemek.6835:

projectcedric.6951:

Przemek.6835:

Sylv.5324:

I don’t remember who it was who said that gamers have a habit of buying a game that is stated to be one way, in the hopes that it will change. When this change doesn’t happen, they get upset and rage that this is why the game fails, etc etc.

People bought this game knowing there would be no trinity. That’s been said right from the start.

Why are people raging now? Claiming that’s why it fails etc, etc— you knew what kind of game this was! Why do you feel the need to sneer at five years worth of dev time, up-front statements during all that time, beta testimonials, etc, that this was not a trinity game?

Why are you disappointed that it’s not a trinity game? You knew what you were buying!

Buy the game as it is, so you won’t be upset when the devs don’t about face on one of the core principles of the entire game’s design.

Fail argument. Again. People like you fail to understand that someone bought the game because he thought that no trinity will be ok. ATM it is not, either bring trinity back, or fix the no-trinity system or however you fanboy call it so it will involve some skill and strategy that will keep players …playing.

It is like ordering a pizza that you never tried before. You order it because you think it might be good, when you try it, its not THAT good so because you are kind you suggest the chef what to change to make it great no? Because you don’t say that you knew what were you buying and you have no rights no complain or criticize? Cause if you do… well than good luck irl.

People like you fail to understand the difference between complaining and demanding.

You can complain. And move on. But you do NOT demand that they change something according to what you think is right, especially when obviously more than half of the people at least in the forums -who also paid for the game, btw- thinks and feels otherwise, despite of how reasonable you build your arguments.

How can you assume ANY numbers. Like… to you it is obvious that MORE THAN HALF (at least the half that is using the forums, wnich is not half, not even a quarter but nvm) think otherwise. That being said I am wrong, because the majority enjoys the game and the forums are just full of “thank-you” letters to ANet for creating the best game ever with absolutely no flaws. AmIright?

In case THIS isn’t obvious (it should be but w/e). Only a little little little % of people are using the forums. And from reading it I see that not everyone is happy with the way that the game is now. About the demand/criticize. I do criticize, I don’t demand, as every player because demanding something isn’t my thing. If I will get bored of the game I will quit and so will everyone whether he likes the game or not. Boredom = quit. Criticizing something is like saying “hey, this is bad, and gets me bored if u think I am not the only one, fix it”

Yup, you’re right. Only a small percentage of the playerbase ever visits the forums.

The majority, I feel —and I dont have backing evidence here, but yeah, w/e too-- is playing inside the game. Because you know, its actually more efficient if they complain about their dissatisfaction in-game. In fact, I think those people are just about to quit because they feel like Anet is not giving a kitten about their complaints. So they are in-game because they are so unhappy about this whole failure of game.

Criticism: “hey, this is bad, and gets me bored”

Demand: “if u think I am not the only one, fix it”

Przemek.6835:

projectcedric.6951:

Przemek.6835:

I am playing more or less frequently because the game is enjoyable for me which doesn’t mean it is perfect.

Why not?

It’s a video game. You say you enjoy it. What else is missing in the equation?

You misunderstood me. I enjoy a part of it wnich is exploring, crafting etc. Aka doing stuff that for me always worked as a sort of “addition” to pve and pvp wnich in this game makes me alt f4 after 5 minutes of it. Boring. Skillless. Repetetive. Etc Etc Etc. I can write an essay of trakittenalk about the problem but why would I if you don’t get simple statement. I draw you an illustration to help u understand what I mean

TERRIBLE—-NOT BAD—-GW2—-GREAT——————————-PERFECT

On the contrary, I think what you’re saying here is simple.

You bought a game with a set expectations of what you consider a “perfect” game, and found out that more than half of the game didn’t meet your expectations. While there are some aspects which do and still keep you playing ‘enjoyably’.

And now you are…“suggesting”… that they change the game according to what you want, so that it will become the image of the “perfect” game you had in mind.

So what do we say that?

Boohoo.

Przemek.6835:

Sylv.5324:

I don’t remember who it was who said that gamers have a habit of buying a game that is stated to be one way, in the hopes that it will change. When this change doesn’t happen, they get upset and rage that this is why the game fails, etc etc.

People bought this game knowing there would be no trinity. That’s been said right from the start.

Why are people raging now? Claiming that’s why it fails etc, etc— you knew what kind of game this was! Why do you feel the need to sneer at five years worth of dev time, up-front statements during all that time, beta testimonials, etc, that this was not a trinity game?

Why are you disappointed that it’s not a trinity game? You knew what you were buying!

Buy the game as it is, so you won’t be upset when the devs don’t about face on one of the core principles of the entire game’s design.

Fail argument. Again. People like you fail to understand that someone bought the game because he thought that no trinity will be ok. ATM it is not, either bring trinity back, or fix the no-trinity system or however you fanboy call it so it will involve some skill and strategy that will keep players …playing.

It is like ordering a pizza that you never tried before. You order it because you think it might be good, when you try it, its not THAT good so because you are kind you suggest the chef what to change to make it great no? Because you don’t say that you knew what were you buying and you have no rights no complain or criticize? Cause if you do… well than good luck irl.

People like you fail to understand the difference between complaining and demanding.

You can complain. And move on. But you do NOT demand that they change something according to what you think is right, especially when obviously more than half of the people at least in the forums -who also paid for the game, btw- thinks and feels otherwise, despite of how reasonable you build your arguments.

Przemek.6835:

I am playing more or less frequently because the game is enjoyable for me which doesn’t mean it is perfect.

Why not?

It’s a video game. You say you enjoy it. What else is missing in the equation?

1350 hours.

Legendary effort for a legendary item.

Zeldain.5710:

Notice we haven’t heard a peep out of Mike O’Brien since all of the boasting interviews about how GW2 will be #1 and beat World of Warcraft?

GW2 beat WoW on sales? Oh come on, its never gonna happen. GW2 market is a niche.

Justin Bieber sells much more albums than Erykah Badu. You think one of them is better than the other?

Nayru.4537:

Because it hasn’t gone past 2m sales. Also, no trinity is why millions of people didn’t buy this game.

What kind of reasoning is this, man?

He says glass half-full, you say glass half-empty. Both are correct, but why do we need to be concerned about the people who did NOT buy this game for one reason or another?

Will it benefit the people who have bought (and are playing) the game for what it was advertised and what it is if the game was changed to accommodate those who didn’t buy the game?

Mahaedros.7085:

you said yourself that you did 500 and you said " 7 tries isn’t enough to build any prediction on it." so how much is enough and WHY?

It’s nice to hear what you have to say about sample sizes but why are you saying what you say about the size of the sample and why that is relevant?

“I salvaged close to 500 in much less time than 48 hours so I hardly understand what you 2 others are saying about this. What’s the big deal? :W”

it’s great that you posted this in the thread and all but what is the significance- according to you- between a sample size of 500 or 900 or 7?

Are you able to explain your reasoning or back up anything you say?

If not, then thanks for your opinion and have a nice day

edit: spelling

It’s a general rule in statistics. There is a deviation when you are counting probabilities. The explanation is so long winded, but just take it that when you are trying to determine the probability of an event through statistics, the bigger your sample size, the more accurate is your probability.

And the difference between 500 and 7 is very big.

You can think about it like this:

Just now, you are trying to determine what really is the chance of getting an ecto from a rare or exotic. BY RIGHT it should be 25% or 50% depending on which kit you use. But if you make a conclusion based on your 7 sample size (in which you didn’t get any), that means that the chance is completely 0%. Not even 1%! So it’s not accurate at all.

If you do 500 tries, BY RIGHT you should get 125 or 250 ectos, but this will not be the case. For Master Kit, it will probably be in a range of 90-300, idk, something like that – instead of 125. So the difference is called deviation.

So the bigger the sample size, the smaller this range and deviation is and the closer to the exact value that the probability will determine.

What is the ideal sample size? A few hundred thousands. A million. Infinity.

There is one or two tracks I keep hearing many times regardless of where I go, so I’m doubting if the music is area specific. I don’t like the music overall, though. They sound cheesy.

The visuals, yes!

Gehenna.3625:

I do not see trinity as a solution for GW2, but the game as a whole is just too simplistic because any complexity that does exist is really of little or no consequence.

You’re right. The question now is – what is the alternative here?

Trinity, in all its flaws, is already by far the most elegant, most refined manifestation of role-defined combat systems. No one designer came up with this concept that there must be three distinct roles that augment each other. Its a product of decades of vernacular game design and user input.

And then people were saying “we are getting sick of it; same thing over and over”. So Anet did something specifically to go against this restricted system – for better or worse – and did it all the way to the other end of the extreme if you’d ask me.

This is the point where we say.. this is one of those things that effectively should be considered as black-and-white. If not this system, then what? It can only be Trinity.

SneakyErvin.3056:

The dynamic combat we have in this game reflect combat much better than any trinity can.

Example: Moria sequence in the LotR movie. How many of the heroes stand still and face tank the troll? How many of the heroes use the sorroundings to their advantage and try to dodge the troll?

Do you seriously think a hit from a 500 Ton dragon would just be something to shake off when in a plate armor? No you would probably more look like the empty coke can that got run over by the buss.

The system with dodging just makes more sense and gives the game more of a live feeling. Sure blocking a swipe here and there from the dragon is ok, but standing there and taking a beating face to face while getting healed. That logic leads me to think healers could actually get ground meat back on its feet.

I like this too.

Never really thought about it that way. And counter argument will always go along the line of “mechanics is more important than realism/lore/theme”. And it’s true. The culture of game design over the decades has always emphasized this.

But I like this thought.

Gehenna.3625:

What ticks me off most is that people respond more to what they think I said, instead of what I actually said. On the one hand it’s easy to misinterpret but on the other hand people just want me to mean something because it suits them better.

Boy you must be disappointed a lot in life.

Naoko.7096:

A mmorpg where no players feel like a hero.
People appreciate something they lack.

If they have everything, they won’t appreciate anything.
No system is perfect.
This is how the game is designed and I doubt they would bring it back.

Is this a poem?

I like it!

Zantetsuken.9051:

The good news is, the game isn’t brilliant, so walking away isn’t that hard. Staying away will be harder though, due to no sub fees

Well said.

Maybe that’s the point of it all.

Zantetsuken.9051:

ArenaNet can push the prices up past the point that you can afford them just from farming gold. And the amount of gold you can farm ties in to how much time you spend playing per day. Some play more, some much less.

Also, once you make that first purchase in the cash shop, it becomes easier and easier to do it again, unless you have a lot of patience, or no cash to spare. Don’t expect to be getting anything easily in this game. If they can make you grind for it, they will, to encourage you to take the ‘easy’ option of buying gold.

How about “Im not paying extra money for a game I already paid a one-time payment for just to get an aesthetic weapon that has statistically no advantage over something I can also get for less trouble in-game”?

Kyosji.8961:

projectcedric.6951:

Kyosji.8961:

Has anyone seen any posts from ANet about how MF works? I was disgruntled all weekend about this issue.I played all day saturday with my MF gear on and again I had low drop rates, and on top of that not a single rare and very few greens compared to whites and blues. Sunday I spent the day with my normal gear, easily killed twice as much, and had 3 rares, a very good amount of greens and blues, and tons of crafting mats.

This is obviously busted.

Isiah Cartwright on magic find:

http://kotaku.com/5960951/?post=54336345

Also, GW2 wiki acknowledges that there is currently a fault on mf that makes it reverse on certain cases. Dunno what.

Yes, but I can never trust a wiki to give me correct answers since anyone can edit anything

Or you can think about it this way: it is the most accurate representation of a collective observation. Because, just like you said, anyone can edit it, and had I not agreed with it, I would have changed it.

I don’t know what’s the point of driving people to buy lodestones from the TP as well.

Even if they hadn’t expected many people to be acquiring Legendaries this early in the release, there are more efficient ways of controlling this progression than reducing the drop rates of lodestones.

What it does is just to increase the price of lodestones. So if I have a lodestone that I don’t need for the Legendary that I am working for, I might as well just sell it on the TP for a hefty sum, because I will need the gold to acquire the lodestones that I need -through the TP also.

But gold is not a problem either. Because just as you can farm lodestones, you can farm gold too. So this move, if there’s a move at all, achieves nothing.

Kyosji.8961:

Has anyone seen any posts from ANet about how MF works? I was disgruntled all weekend about this issue.I played all day saturday with my MF gear on and again I had low drop rates, and on top of that not a single rare and very few greens compared to whites and blues. Sunday I spent the day with my normal gear, easily killed twice as much, and had 3 rares, a very good amount of greens and blues, and tons of crafting mats.

This is obviously busted.

Isiah Cartwright on magic find:

http://kotaku.com/5960951/?post=54336345

Also, GW2 wiki acknowledges that there is currently a fault on mf that makes it reverse on certain cases. Dunno what.

Ath.2531:

find the probability of getting no rare after 7 consecutive times.

Assume its 40%

This is the chance it will happen: 0.0016384
1.6 in a thousand

You’ve just been unlucky.

Not very. The way I understand it, according to info:

If using master or mystic kits, failure chance is 75%. So probability of getting no rare after 7 consecutive tries (or for 8 consecutive tries) = 0.10011291503 or 10%

If using BL, 50% chance of failure per try. Probability of getting no rare for 8 tries = 0.00390625 or 0.39%

Given these figures, it would be more accurate to say that either a.) it was actually our luck in getting rares in salvaging up to this point that was the one broken or b.) the info written in the kits’ tool tips were wrong. If it was, in fact, nerfed, maybe it’s just to make it right. Idk.

Vasham.2408:

I know they won’t do it. Arenanet has proven they’re not good at admitting mistakes. Loot DR, Trahearne, Zhaitan being a “spam 2 to win” fight, Ree’s horrible writing, poor rewards from meta events. All things they did wrong but would never admit to, let alone correct.

Still, I won’t be the one out of a job over it.

And…again….SO??

You admit you’re not affected in any way. And as far as anybody can tell they didn’t technically cheat you because they never said they would admit their mistakes or change things if people say the game was bad.

Why are you so sour-grape over this? It’s like you’re bitter about a bad breakup that you can’t let go of for months on end, or something.

Just move on, dude.

Vasham.2408:

Sounds like the SWTOR forums. We all saw how well that game did with fanboys touting this kind of attitude.

Sure. Game is going down. You seem to be much smarter than us “fanboys” and can predict it happening. So what are you waiting for, man? Jump off the boat.

Why are you still here with us while we play a game that is apparently destined to fail?

Thought you were genius,

As far as I know, people are already expressing -with reasons- how much a single-player of an mmorpg this game feels like.

I don’t know how that would even come close to a definition of an e-sport.

Vasham.2408:

As for the cost of redesign? That’s not my problem. Arenanet is the one that needs to add some structure to their PVE or face the consequences of a declining playerbase.

Give me a break, dude.

You think they gonna do it? They’re not gonna do it. Even if you were right, who’s crazy enough to go change all the skills, class balances and battle system at this point – especially when it basically means redesigning the WHOLE kitten game.

Now two things may happen. It may go like you say, and game closes within a couple of months. OR. People like it and they still be playing.

Either way, you can’t control it, man. What the hell is the point of all of this?

Korrigan.4837:

My feelings is that they have to rush in “fluff” activities other MMOs have too – fishing, housing, mounts, etc… – the game for now is almost only centered on combat. ANet must not underestimate how much those “fluff” non combat activities keep players busy – and housing or mounts, for instance, are very good opportunities to sell some juicy wanted stuff in the gem store too for the game’s income.

What I want is that when I log into GW2, I ask myself “what the hell am I going to do? I have so many choices, and all are viable and fun!”.

And I hope ANet will give up wanting to become another tiered gear game, and that ascended gear will become widely available without having to farm the same single dungeon.

The ball is in your camp now, developers. Good luck, and a happy new year to you all.

I like this.

I hope they can come up with as many things as one can do in Runescape.

What do you mean ‘needs to come back’?

Its not like you bought it knowing it has a trinity system, and then they changed it. This game never had a trinity system as far as I know.

Do you know what is the cost of redesigning the classes to become a trinity system (assuming you are right that trinity is better)? Might as well make a new game.

That being said, I still don’t understand why would you force yourself on GW2 if you liked the trinity system and you know that this game doesn’t have it.

I don’t know why a thief cannot wear a hood.

I don’t know. Can’t tell unless its implemented and tried.

One thing’s for sure the elite skills won’t be all equal across all weapons and classes.

There is actually a thief system that is quite close to the ideal, where a thief can use his characteristic cheat-y ways and deal damage, and stealth is based on player skill rather than a character skill that makes him invisible and cannot be targeted by single-target attacks.

In Skyrim, there is a field of vision and detection system where if you stay within that field of vision, stealth-related stuffs (backstab, triple-damage, cannot be noticed) will not work and mobs will aggro you. Footsteps can also be muffled to reduce detection. As a consequence, you actually have to sneak around, go behind where people are facing, find hiding spots and ambush enemies.

In GW2, the npc mobs can turn 180 degrees even if you sneak up behind them. There are no true hiding spots when it comes to player vs player because names are shown even if a player is hiding behind a tree, a rock, underwater, etc. The only way to really hide and sneak around is to become invisible.

And complete invisibility, in WHATEVER context, games or not – is an OP skill. No amount of dps and survivability nerfing will ever be able to mitigate this fact.

Never cared in the first place.

Had I wanted a PvP game, I wouldn’t have bought and played GW2.

Conncept.7638:

projectcedric.6951:

You all obviously tl:dr.

He SAID he’s not leaving the game. Nor is he complaining or saying that nothing is wrong so long as people can do what they wish and still have fun.

That being said.. what’s the point of this thread again?

Pretty much to just tell guardian players that there are players that feel this way, that this build of nothing but counters, walls, blocks, and control effects ruins peoples time other people spend in the game. That it may be allowed but it is discourteous and in poor sportsmanship, to the point that some of us, among which I am included, would rather leave them to play by themselves than put up with it anymore.

And above all, to let any guardians that are wondering why they can’t seem to find an even-handed match anymore, that they themselves may be the reason.

Ok.

I don’t think anything will change though. If people can do it to win, they will do it, no matter how lame it might be. Rule of the universe.

To actually answer the OP…

Yes, there is a dungeon, a sPvP, and WvW you have not seem to discover yet.

In fact, one of the main reasons that you probably feel like this is a single-player game in the open world (as we all did) is because currently more than 70% of the population I would say is grinding it out in dungeons.