Guild Wars 2

JETWING.2759:

Every sugestion are welcome
- Worse than it is, can’t will be
Banner are the worst summon in this game, just a waste of slot (in my opinion).

- Banners are so bad, that Anet safe that guy (http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Champion_Chief_Otyugh) of needs come back to banner position to pick up his banner His banner comes magically to his hand with slap of finger.

I just think to carry that thing in my back can disturb future back skins (wings, lights, or other things for example), and leave my char with shark appearance

I still think 3 things:
- Teleport to banner location (this skill replaces summon banner, and have 10s CD).
- Increase range (1200 – 1500) and efficiency.
- Rework skills.

if you’re talking about PvP or WvW, sure i guess Banners are bad (i don’t play either mode).

but in PvE, Banners (of Strength and Discipline) are the best utilities are Warrior can bring to a group. ginormous DPS buffs that everyone will get because bosses rarely move.

i pugged Arah P4 for DM a few days ago (with 3 guys who have never done it before and one who never got passed Simin) and got done in about an hour and a half. most of the time (and two wipes) came at the Melandru boss, before we all agreed to just range DPS him and ignore trees.

of course, this was also a pug run with 3 DPS spec’d Warriors, a Guardian, and a Mesmer. it was truly a miracle of the universe to see so much pug competence rolled into one group.

you’re using Sigil of Accuracy when you have a mathematical crit chance that is at or over 100%. you’re missing out on the flat 10% damage boost that Smoldering Sigil gives. there it is. they could also be running Signet of Might for more power.

if this is a PvE situation, Warrior should be running either 30/25/0/10/5 (STR: IX, XII; Arms: V, X, Tactics: II) with GS or 30/0/0/10/30 (STR: V, IX/X, XII; Tactics: II, Disc: XII) while swapping between Axe/Mace + GS (always want to be on GS when 100B is off CD).

currently, Str XII and Disc XII are bugged to give old pre-patch values, as well (eg, losing out on 3% Damage and 6% crit).

I do not know a Ranger’s best DPS trait set up, but I do know that it will be with a Sword + OH and LB or /OH swap.

bubblyball.7591:

As I realized they messed up some of the trait lines at the previous patch (June 25th) and now GS warrior builds are not as viable as they were. I’m looking for some option to play GS again (for quick dungeon runs, PVE in general) but since there are only 70 trait points available I don’t see it happen. Let’s review.
I want to put 30 point on Strength tree, because of XI. Berserker’s Power. This would give me 15%+ power. I would need to put 20 points to Arms to be able to choose X. Forceful Greatsword. Now I only have 20 points left to put on Discipline therefore i cannot choose XII. Heightened Focus for 15%+ crit. chance
This really bothers me and I’m ‘forced’ to play with Axe x Axe… ofc I know nobody is actually forcing me this is just a figure of speech but still… with the new skins coming very very soon I would love to be able to play GS again. Anybody got a fix for this?

you realize that going into Precision almost makes up for crit chance that you lose by forgoing Heightened Focus (and as a side note, Heightened Focus is currently bugged to give pre-patch values, not 5/10/15)?

pure GS is roughly equal to an Axe MH build if you can guarantee 100B landing every 6.5~ seconds (not too tough but it can be dicey sometimes). if the enemy is against a wall or you’re in Quickness, WWA will push GS over the top in damage (but that’s rare).

ANet did a decent job of balancing the two weapon types. now, if only they’d do something about Sword for PVE.

Deathspike.1870:

Help me out here if you have good suggestions to improve the build; mash-up time; I dropped 15 points from Arms and putting 10 into Power for Berserker’s Power and added 5 points to Defense for Sundering Mace. This gives me 7% less critical chance with a little more Power, meaning that my survivability has been hampered. I have easier access to Vulnerability (permanently 8%) but normal attacks don’t give Vulnerability, nor do I have a semi-permanent Vigor (Whirlwind Attack) and have lost a lot of Might. Overall I feel much weaker and less durable, what can be improved?

Adrenal Health is 120 HP per second, which is almost nothing compared to the Warrior’s total HP pool and Signet of Healing passive. it is not a “must” have trait and should only be gotten for defensive Mace/Hammer builds that have to go down the Defense line.

a simple 10/10/0/30/20 build is extremely popular and extremely effective: Shout heals or Banner heals (which are far and away more effective than Adrenal Health), Berserker Power + Heightened Focus, 100% uptime on Fury. this build contributes extremely high damage, survivability with frequent Omnom procs (i don’t know what you’re talking about, but the Axe AA hits much more frequently than any non 100b GS attacks do…again, have you ever even tried using an Axe?), and party utility with Banners/Shouts + Vuln and Knockdown. additionally, in dungeons where you know you won’t need ranged (CoF or AC, for example), you can weapon swap to an Axe offhand, which will further increase your survivability with the Axe 5 + Omnom.

additionally, check this:

http://i.imgur.com/94CHX.png

quick and dirty testing to show that Axe/Mace DPS > GS DPS. of course, the GS has benefits and shouldn’t be dismissed…but the notion that the GS is the #1 damaging weapon for a Warrior has to stop.

Deathspike.1870:

The trait configuration required to make an Axe/Mace an effective weapon combination is not team orientated at all. You will sacrifice team utility and your own survivability to make it have a better damage compared to a GS. That is great for player-versus-player combat where you can burn through utilities and do as much damage as possible to kill your enemy, but (higher level) dungeons have longer fights and much harder hitting enemies that require a team that has synergies with one another. Is this build better than MH Axe? For dungeons, absolutely.

this doesn’t make any sense at all. the only traits you need to make Axe effective is 10 in Power (which all Warrior builds take anyway). that’s the beauty of the weapon! it does incredible damage with no specialization needed. on the other hand, a GS user without 20 in Arms is worthless. he’s the one that has to sacrifice build diversity to get the desired results!

furthermore, your point is invalid on examination anyway. Axe MH (plus Mace OH) provides 8-12% Vulnerability for the whole party to exploit at any given time. it also has a nice AoE knockdown. what does the GS do for support? Cripple (which Axe 3 does) and Vuln (which Axe 2 and Mace 4 do). the only other related party support a Warrior brings are Shouts and Banners, both of which are specialized in the Tactics line, which both build types (Axe MH and GS) can (and most frequently do) use.

i highly suggest you actually use (smart) Axe builds before you criticize about them.

Blacksarevok.8104:

Axe mh is good and can compete with GS on paper at least, problem is (as said above) is that GS traits are better and require less investment.

What we need is another 2-hander (Greataxe, anyone?) to be put on the table. Personally I think 1-handers should be more utility-oriented, and 2-handers should be more damage-oriented.

quite the contrary. an Axe MH build requires very little investment outside of Berserker Power (which you’d get with a GS build anyway). all the points can be funneled into Tactics or Discipline or however you please.

meanwhile, a GS user NEEDS at least 20 in Arms or the GS is worthless. of course, Arms is a good trait line to begin with…but an Axe MH user requires much less investment to get very good DPS.

GS is only good because of the Forceful Greatsword trait (X in Arms line), which means you need to be at least level 40 to see how powerful it really is.

even then, it performs better only in PERFECT circumstances (you can connect with 100b) over an Axe MH build.

in open world PVE, hammer is a good and fun weapon. not as much DPS as Axe or GS but good enough to work and just fun to use.

however, in high level PVE play (dungeon running and FOTM), hammer is in a tough spot. the area in which it shines (Control) is near useless against boss level enemies and dubious to use against trash mobs, where a better weapon (GS, Axe + OH) would kill much faster.

dukefx.9730:

People tend to rely too heavily on theory and never testing anything. I retraited twice to favor the desired weapon and the results are: ~1.3k (axe) damage on auto attack vs ~2.5-3k+ (GS with 4-5 might stacks and 3-4 stacks of vulnerability that come purely from auto attacks) is far from axe>>>GS even if the axe hits a bit faster. If I tried it on higher toughness targets or hit multiple mobs the results would favor the GS even more (higher weapon strength and more might). AOE capabilities discussed already. The only situation where the axe is the winner is when you press that dusty F1 and spec for burst damage but that would hardly do you any good in dungeons (since this is no PvP thread) unless you use a hammer or maybe a bow for the combo field. Constant high damage > burst

PS: I never said I’m not using 100 blades but it’s simply far from the best skill on the set.

1.3k crits with an Axe? what, were you using a level 1 Axe against 80 enemies? with FGJ and SoR, any warrior can sustain 8-11 Might stacks for the duration of the fight.

http://www.guildwars2guru.com/topic/78181-warrior-dps-test-gs-vs-axe-vs-sword/

this is a nice thread to illustrate my point. they have similar TTK…but that’s only when the GS user can land 100b.

Deathspike.1870:

I’m loving the discussions. It shows that different people have different preferences and different configurations work for their preferred playing style. There are some things to consider when switching to a different primary weapon:

Traits: Using an axe as your primary weapon would cause your Arms trait line to have to be redistributed. Forceful Greatsword and all the critical chance you get from the Arms line, including 10% additional damage, would have to be sacrificed for investments into the Power line to make it all worth while. This, however, reduces your total critical chance and thus your survivability. I’d like to see a mash up on an effective re-trait for Axe and critical life steal and give it a whirl before I conclude it is not so great. On paper, it doesn’t look that good.

20 in Strength is all you need (for Axe Mastery or Dual Wielding). 30 is optional (pick the one you didn’t choose). i haven’t run the numbers to know which one is optimal but Axe Mastery allows the use of Shield or Warhorn, so…

traiting into Tactics and Discipline means you’ll be able to have 100% uptime on Fury (with FGJ and SoR on 80% CD) and 8-11 stacks of Might on your own (more if you use LB offhand for Fire field + Burst). Discpline gives you % boost to Crit Damage, too. using a Sigil of Perception, Accuracy, and Omnom Pies/Ghosts will boost the crit rate to 80+% (provided you have Knight or Berserker or any type of gear that gives +Prec on).

a build like this:

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fIIQNAnZTjkOJvNPaPMxBAjiiCS9wu2iLpoM0A

is a good example of maximizing Axe MH and doing tons of damage with it. you can go 30 into Tactics or Discipline, depending on what you need (support or more damage).

i use a 20/30/0/0/20 build when doing dungeons. in the easy dungeons (AC, CoF), Axe + GS swapping is easily the best way to go to maximize DPS. this is not optimal in FOTM, however, as i almost never use a GS (but i can’t be bothered to retrait every single time i want to do a different dungeon).

dukefx.9730:

People tend to rely too heavily on theory and never testing anything. I retraited twice to favor the desired weapon and the results are: ~1.3k (axe) damage on auto attack vs ~2.5-3k+ (GS with 4-5 might stacks and 3-4 stacks of vulnerability that come purely from auto attacks) is far from axe>>>GS even if the axe hits a bit faster. If I tried it on higher toughness targets or hit multiple mobs the results would favor the GS even more (higher weapon strength and more might). AOE capabilities discussed already. The only situation where the axe is the winner is when you press that dusty F1 and spec for burst damage but that would hardly do you any good in dungeons (since this is no PvP thread) unless you use a hammer or maybe a bow for the combo field. Constant high damage > burst

PS: I never said I’m not using 100 blades but it’s simply far from the best skill on the set.

1.3k crits with an Axe? what, were you using a level 1 Axe against 80 enemies? with FGJ and SoR, any warrior can sustain 8-11 Might stacks for the duration of the fight.

http://www.guildwars2guru.com/topic/78181-warrior-dps-test-gs-vs-axe-vs-sword/

this is a nice thread to illustrate my point. note what would happen if the GS user couldn’t pull off 100b.

again, spoiler alert, but Axe >>> GS when it comes to single target damage. you’re doing so little damage with a GS with Blade Toss and WW and not using 100b compared to the Axe AA (not to mention loss of OH).

a GS without using 100b or attacking enemies pinned against a wall is less damage than a LB/Rifle swap. may as well use that if it’s too dangerous to melee.

in very easy dungeons (CoF, AC, etc), GS + Axe is pretty much the best choice for the above reason.

20+ stacks of might for GS > swap to Axe > Axe 2 > Eviscerate. the damage you can deal this way is silly. in higher level Fractals, you’d be hardpressed to be able to do the same.

the mobility of the GS helps in some Fractals (Cliffside comes to mind and dealing with the adds in Volcanic). but i’d take Axe + OH in most situations (should i be packing ranged secondary).

no AoE capabilities for Axe? the first 3 attacks of Axe AA are incredibly fast and hit everything 180 degrees in front of you. Cyclone Axe hits 360.

@Ed

i was referring to the Rending Strikes Major Trait in the Arms line (V, 33% chance to inflict Vuln on crit). that plus Axe 2 (and Mace 4 if you use in OH) allows you to stack even more Vulnerability than the GS can with its AA.

@Ensign

i agree with you in any non FOTM dungeon, that Rifle/LB should only be equipped in certain fights conducive to range. however, in higher levels of FOTM, you’re going to find yourself taking more damage than you would like more frequently. even against regular mobs and normally easy bosses (Svanir Shaman, Archdiviner, et cetera), having a ranged alternative to fall back on while you reap Omnom healing is very helpful (at least for me). while we agree in the abstract, the most important point here is that you should trait as if you’re not going to be 100% melee (even the LB’s Stronger Bowstrings is helpful, as is having both Forceful Greatsword and Cracked Shot) in FOTM.

Warrior ranged DPS may not match its melee DPS but your DPS falls to 0 and hurts your group when you’re always in need of rezzing.

you’ve never done high level FOTM, have you?

try meleeing the Ice Elemental/Dredge Suit/Grawl Shaman/Ashym. try running into a pack of Veteran Ascalonians. report back with your results. range weapons aren’t a “niche” once everything can 2hko you. they are a necessity for even standard mobs.

the Axe AA outdamages any non 100b attack the GS has, excluding WWA against a wall. and it’s much, much faster than the GS AA and can be traited the same way in the Arms line for the Vulnerability traits (additionally, an extra sigil can be used for that effect too!).

also 100b is not hard to land in FOTM because of enemies evading, its hard to land because enemies do way too much damage to root yourself in place for 3.5 seconds. the skill becomes incredibly hard to use for its full length in any level higher than 15. compare that to the Axe AA and the Eviscerate, which deal comparable damage in much shorter bursts.

little reason to discuss the GS? gee, another one of these topics. maybe if you’re mindlessly running CoF all day.

one of the primary reasons to use GS, 100b, is almost impossible to land without the proper setup in high level FOTM play. without 100b, DPS goes down considerably to the point where a Axe AA rivals damage output. additionally, all other skills of the GS lack party use — Blade Toss, Rush, WWA are all single character utility. meanwhile, an Axe/Mace Warrior can apply Vulnerability, Knockdown, and Cripple constantly while keeping up with great damage from the Axe AA. given also that an Axe MH also gives you the freedom of an OH weapon and another rune, i think considerable discussion should be had of whether or not the GS is the proper weapon.

in straight environment PvE, the GS works great. i prefer Axe/Axe because of how easy it is to tag mobs but GS is certainly more powerful due to ease of landing 100b. but to say that the GS warrants no discussion in high level Dungeon play? c’mon.

also, the Longbow certainly works well with a Power/Precision build. LB 3 is a burst finisher, short cooldown, and does incredible damage. LB also has a Cripple and an Immobilize and all of its AoE attacks work great with Omnomberry Pies (hit more enemies with a higher crit rate, get more health back). Rifle is the weapon to use in single target DPS but Longbow has its uses and is not niche.

^bit tough to understand but if i’m interpreting correctly, both you and Neandramathal have proved beyond reasonable doubt that Triple Chop hits 3 times for marginally more damage than Chop does but takes roughly 4x the amount of time to complete the attack (counting frames).

so that brings us full circle: the Axe AA is more effective if stopped at TC rather than continuing it to completion. that, to me, is a problem.

As per the Dec 14 update notes, in case the devs didn’t know, we weren’t canceling Triple Chop accidentally, we were doing it because Triple Chop is much worse DPS than Chop or Double Chop and it is better to cancel it to reset the chain.

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Chop : 252 dmg over 0.25 seconds = 1008 dps

http://wiki.guildwar...iki/Triple_Chop : 858 dmg over 1.5 seconds = 572 dps

so if you cancel TC to get to Chop, you are increasing your DPS (and also getting to Double Chop faster, which is a better skill than both). is there any other weapon AA chain for any class that punishes the user for finishing the combo? this makes no sense to me, someone please clarify why the final attack in an AA chain is significantly worse than the other 2 and is better off being canceled?

or could I be completely wrong?

thanks!

is great until you realize just how bad TC is compared to the other attacks in the chain.

it should really be addressed – why do you lose DPS (a fair amount at that) by letting your AA complete? it makes no sense!

Triple Chop can still be canceled by other skills though, including Throw Axe and Cyclone Axe…I was doing it last night while playing.

anyways, the point is that Triple Chop sucks compared to Chop and Double Chop. Is there any other chain attack in the game where you lose DPS by letting it complete?

Uhhh, Triple Chop can still be cancelled by any other skill that you have…except Chop.

and that is the problem with the change: it’s actually a nerf for Axes, as canceling Triple Chop to get back into Chop>Double Chop is more damage.

Triple Chop is 858 damage / 1.5 seconds = 574 DPS, Chop is 252 DPS over .25 seconds = 1008 DPS.

so Triple Chop no longer being cancellable seems like a bit of a nerf to Axe MH, as it does significantly less DPS compared to Chop/Double Chop.

shame. do they want every Warrior to use GS in PvE?