Mace/shield GS build = Overpowered

Mace/shield GS build = Overpowered

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Posted by: Sil.4560

Sil.4560

I have absolutely no sympathy for any thief crying about this build. None. Zero. Thief has got to be the most ridiculous noob class this game has to offer and people who manage to die as one against a class with such obvious tells when they have that much access to teleporting and total invisibility are losing exactly like horrible players should.

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Posted by: Setun.4368

Setun.4368

For all the insults being thrown at us “whiners”, you have failed to provide any evidence at a proper counter to this build, or provide any justification why a single build can provide superior DPS, sustain, mobility, CC and immunity to conditions AT THE SAME TIME.

The argument I keep hearing is ‘lulz you suck nub thief, use stun breakers". Well, that’s awesome and all except for the fact that my stun breaker is on a 60 sec cooldown while the stun comes every 7.5 sec, excluding the shield bash and the bulls rush, which both can be followed by a 100b.

Some of you are more open minded at least and admit lemongrass soup and/or healing sig are broken. But its the same as agreeing with my claim, u are just trying to sugarcoat it

I also keep seeing the “L 2 Dodge” argument. Well that’s nice and all except for the fact that skull crack is a poorly telegraphed special attack, has a very short activation and difficult to tell from a normal attack, and that’s assuming the warrior is not an asuran…

Here’s a few counters: stay at range, blind, steal the warrior spin, drop a smoke field of any kind and spin to win on it to not only damage but to reapply blind consistently. L2P, use daze shot if you sense skull crack coming, dodge….I don’t play thief and I know all this.

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Posted by: Senjun.8149

Senjun.8149

I feel bad for thieves trying to kill this build of warrior. All good thieves go for high damage which means lower sustain. I’ve seen quite a few die, if that stun touches you and that war gets to 100b you, you are dead. Lol I keep seeing it. Even if he doesn’t hit you with the stun the first 20 times he gets to use it in a fight, more than likely you don’t have the damage output to kill the war within 2 minutes who’s sustain is somehow much higher than yours aswell as damage.

There is something seriously wrong with this build of warrior. Anet has gone mad.

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Posted by: Hunter.4783

Hunter.4783

For all the insults being thrown at us “whiners”, you have failed to provide any evidence at a proper counter to this build, or provide any justification why a single build can provide superior DPS, sustain, mobility, CC and immunity to conditions AT THE SAME TIME.

The argument I keep hearing is ‘lulz you suck nub thief, use stun breakers". Well, that’s awesome and all except for the fact that my stun breaker is on a 60 sec cooldown while the stun comes every 7.5 sec, excluding the shield bash and the bulls rush, which both can be followed by a 100b.

Some of you are more open minded at least and admit lemongrass soup and/or healing sig are broken. But its the same as agreeing with my claim, u are just trying to sugarcoat it

I also keep seeing the “L 2 Dodge” argument. Well that’s nice and all except for the fact that skull crack is a poorly telegraphed special attack, has a very short activation and difficult to tell from a normal attack, and that’s assuming the warrior is not an asuran…

Here’s a few counters: stay at range, blind, steal the warrior spin, drop a smoke field of any kind and spin to win on it to not only damage but to reapply blind consistently. L2P, use daze shot if you sense skull crack coming, dodge….I don’t play thief and I know all this.

I was never talking from a thief’s perspective, How would a ranger or D/D ele deal with it? oh right, still stay at range and try to CC an un-CCable build, gotcha.

Stop trying to come up with excuses, you know the build is OP. And at this point no one has commented on why a single build has high DPS, high sustain, high mobility, CC immunity, condition immunity and 50% stun uptime potential AT THE SAME TIME

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Posted by: Senjun.8149

Senjun.8149

For all the insults being thrown at us “whiners”, you have failed to provide any evidence at a proper counter to this build, or provide any justification why a single build can provide superior DPS, sustain, mobility, CC and immunity to conditions AT THE SAME TIME.

The argument I keep hearing is ‘lulz you suck nub thief, use stun breakers". Well, that’s awesome and all except for the fact that my stun breaker is on a 60 sec cooldown while the stun comes every 7.5 sec, excluding the shield bash and the bulls rush, which both can be followed by a 100b.

Some of you are more open minded at least and admit lemongrass soup and/or healing sig are broken. But its the same as agreeing with my claim, u are just trying to sugarcoat it

I also keep seeing the “L 2 Dodge” argument. Well that’s nice and all except for the fact that skull crack is a poorly telegraphed special attack, has a very short activation and difficult to tell from a normal attack, and that’s assuming the warrior is not an asuran…

Here’s a few counters: stay at range, blind, steal the warrior spin, drop a smoke field of any kind and spin to win on it to not only damage but to reapply blind consistently. L2P, use daze shot if you sense skull crack coming, dodge….I don’t play thief and I know all this.

I was never talking from a thief’s perspective, How would a ranger or D/D ele deal with it? oh right, still stay at range and try to CC an un-CCable build, gotcha.

Stop trying to come up with excuses, you know the build is OP. And at this point no one has commented on why a single build has high DPS, high sustain, high mobility, CC immunity, condition immunity and 50% stun uptime potential AT THE SAME TIME

Agreed and the reason no body will stand against that argument is because atm wars are an all in one package and nobody else is. There really isn’t a good counter to this build of warrior in the hands of a skilled player who is choosing to play a build that a brain dead monkey could kill people with. All they need to give this build of war now is a stealth and the ability to spawn clones. And all other professions become completely obsolete.

(edited by Senjun.8149)

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Posted by: Setun.4368

Setun.4368

For all the insults being thrown at us “whiners”, you have failed to provide any evidence at a proper counter to this build, or provide any justification why a single build can provide superior DPS, sustain, mobility, CC and immunity to conditions AT THE SAME TIME.

The argument I keep hearing is ‘lulz you suck nub thief, use stun breakers". Well, that’s awesome and all except for the fact that my stun breaker is on a 60 sec cooldown while the stun comes every 7.5 sec, excluding the shield bash and the bulls rush, which both can be followed by a 100b.

Some of you are more open minded at least and admit lemongrass soup and/or healing sig are broken. But its the same as agreeing with my claim, u are just trying to sugarcoat it

I also keep seeing the “L 2 Dodge” argument. Well that’s nice and all except for the fact that skull crack is a poorly telegraphed special attack, has a very short activation and difficult to tell from a normal attack, and that’s assuming the warrior is not an asuran…

Here’s a few counters: stay at range, blind, steal the warrior spin, drop a smoke field of any kind and spin to win on it to not only damage but to reapply blind consistently. L2P, use daze shot if you sense skull crack coming, dodge….I don’t play thief and I know all this.

I was never talking from a thief’s perspective, How would a ranger or D/D ele deal with it? oh right, still stay at range and try to CC an un-CCable build, gotcha.

Stop trying to come up with excuses, you know the build is OP. And at this point no one has commented on why a single build has high DPS, high sustain, high mobility, CC immunity, condition immunity and 50% stun uptime potential AT THE SAME TIME

Some of the options that are easily available to both of those classes: soft cc like snares, chill, immobilize and blinds are not affected by stability. All of these hinder the ability to reliably stay close enough to get off the various stun skills reliably, or will make a character miss by either misjudging distance to you, or missing entirely. It kinda sounds like you’re the one making excuses here. If you see a warrior rushing you with a greatsword or using whirlwind attack to get close, you can almost always expect them to swap to mace. In which case you can plan accordingly to do what you need to do. I use GS / axe/axe (sometimes LB as well) on my ranger and haven’t had any issues with this build when I come across it. If you need someone to hold your hand on how to counter this build then it kinda sounds like a personal problem.

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Posted by: Holdyir.2918

Holdyir.2918

I was never talking from a thief’s perspective, How would a ranger or D/D ele deal with it? oh right, still stay at range and try to CC an un-CCable build, gotcha.

Is this a joke? Rangers and ele’s have plenty of access to stability, which mixed with stun breakers completely counters the skull crack build. Both also have far better sustain than a warrior and both have access to protection.

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Posted by: Fenrir.5493

Fenrir.5493

COUNTERS: … if you cant use a stun break, a teleport a blind or anything that makes you invulnerable, then that is totally your fault and deserve to suffer the 100b damage, if you can manage to get rid of the stun or negate it by any of those many counters then you will have a really good amount of time to destroy the warrior completely because he has nothing, read, NOTHING to do, this build relies on other people stupidity, to land a full 100b, its their main source of damage, in the meanwhile they do nothing to you, and guess what?, in order to this build do good damage he needs to be using a berserker amulet that would hurt but if you manage to counter the stun it will die so fast that he will not have a chance to land another skull crack.

If the warrior is tanky, then the damage of the 100b will be a lot more forgiving and will not get a lot of your hp, unless you are a glass canon and then HOW IS THAT A WARRIOR PROBLEM in the first place, that is YOUR CHOICE.

I have been using this build to some extent and good players use teleports, stun breaks, chill,cripple to stay away, mesmers shatter to make themselves invulnerable or daze to interrupt, thieves spam blinds and makes you fail docens of skull cracks, elementalist use a lot of stability and of course stun breaks, necros and rangers put fear on you, i one time met a thief that put fear on me (idk how he managed to do that really), other warriors use stability or endure pain, guardians have aegis and a lot of blocks actually, the fact is that all classes have stun breaks, evasions, teleports something to make this build suffer a lot, you just need to exploit them.

Like i said, this build relys on other people mistakes, if the warrior is wining then for sure he is outplaying you and thats it, you need to learn to loose, and learn how to use better your class and abuse it.

“We also realize that we can make mistakes but we dont care because I HAVE THE POWAAA!!”

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Posted by: Fenrir.5493

Fenrir.5493

Funny thing is the other day i was in tpvp and a thief just land a backstab on my char taking away 80% of my health in a single hit and then use another skill wich i suppouse was Heart Seeker, and i was downed, he did this 2 times, and i didnt have the chance to land a single skull crack on him.

This cheese mechanics are known from a long time now and the devs didnt nerf them, and i guess they ar not going to do it. But actually this is OP because these has nearly 0 counters it depends totally on luck because you cant see this coming, even if you block we all know what happens when you block an attack that comes from stealth… yes NOTHING.

“We also realize that we can make mistakes but we dont care because I HAVE THE POWAAA!!”

(edited by Fenrir.5493)

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Posted by: Turamarth.3248

Turamarth.3248

I was never talking from a thief’s perspective, How would a ranger or D/D ele deal with it? oh right, still stay at range and try to CC an un-CCable build, gotcha.

Stop trying to come up with excuses, you know the build is OP. And at this point no one has commented on why a single build has high DPS, high sustain, high mobility, CC immunity, condition immunity and 50% stun uptime potential AT THE SAME TIME

Regarding rangers:

I’m sure you’re talking about those unrootable and uncrippable Skull Crack Warriors that 100B kill you in a stun… in that case, play extremely aggresive at first and force their stability and condition cleanses as soon as you can. Remember, he has more burst but you have more sustain. Always break only his Mace stun, ignore his shield and other sources of control. If you manage to waste their stability soon, try to kite him or control him while applying pressure. If you run out of stunbreakers and he’s still alive, try to predict his next Skull Crack and do a wolf fear or precast Troll’s Unguent, you can actually survive a Skull Crack+100B combo that way. You have a 15 second window when TU is down, which you can cover by using your own stability or control/kiting skills. You know a SC is coming if you see he’s staying long enough on Mace/Shield or is chaining Mace daze+shield stun to make you waste stability or a stun braker soon.

Some clever Warriors will try to disengage from you with Greatsword when you used your stun breakers, and will come back for a second round while your CDs are down… don’t let him do that, you have as much mobility as him, always keep appying pressure on him, don’t let him catch you on that position with a Bow (or low mobility weapon) on you and your weapon swap on CD.

Basically, if you manage your CDs better and force his soon enough, you should have the advantage.

Honestly, as a trap Ranger, Beastmaster Bunker ranger, spirit Bunker ranger or even Signet power Ranger, you shouldn’t have problems with other kinds of Warriors.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/ranger/How-do-rangers-kill-warriors

There are also advices for several classes how to deal with this build in this thread or in
this one .

Brandar – Kodash [DE]
[SPQR]

(edited by Turamarth.3248)

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Posted by: Ajaxx.3157

Ajaxx.3157

Hodor Hodor Hodor

Ajaxx – Warrior – [JuG] – Desolation [eu]

http://www.twitch.tv/irajaxx

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Posted by: Opynn.2936

Opynn.2936

Mace is only warrior melee weapon with zero mobilty, and zero cripple/ imobilize. See warrior using mace? Kite him, cripple him, chill him, run. See warrior using gs to chatch you? For 4 second he cant switch to mace to stun. See him swap weapon to mace? Block, blind, dodge, evade with weapon, blink, use stabilty, invunrabilty becasue he is going for a stun. You want to fight warrior in mele? You need to be prepared for this 4 sec stun. Warrior is master of melee combat. No one should be able to just stande there in melee range and dance.

Opyrr[GoT] Warrior

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Posted by: Turbo Whale.1738

Turbo Whale.1738

Funny thing is the other day i was in tpvp and a thief just land a backstab on my char taking away 80% of my health in a single hit and then use another skill wich i suppouse was Heart Seeker, and i was downed, he did this 2 times, and i didnt have the chance to land a single skull crack on him.

This cheese mechanics are known from a long time now and the devs didnt nerf them, and i guess they ar not going to do it. But actually this is OP because these has nearly 0 counters it depends totally on luck because you cant see this coming, even if you block we all know what happens when you block an attack that comes from stealth… yes NOTHING.

Stop perpetuating unjustified thief hate in order to justify the unbalanced “under dog warrior” build.

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Posted by: Cogbyrn.7283

Cogbyrn.7283

We’ve inundated this thread with counters. Saying we haven’t means you either can’t read, or simply haven’t read and are uselessly trolling.

And something doesn’t need to be telegraphed to know when you should dodge it (see: Backstab).

Alduin Nightsong, 80 Human Necro
“He’s like a man with a fork in a world of soup.”

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Posted by: oZii.2864

oZii.2864

Thank you.

I have a lot of respect for unbiased warriors who can realize the OPness of the build.

Just like I’m not afraid to admit that D/P perma-stealth thief is cheap and I would never defend it because I see it may be possibly OP.

The build I’m using now though…I’m sure it is definately not OP. Actually it’s quite kitten for roaming.

30/30/5/5/0 SD + shortbow

30 in deadly arts, 30 in critical strikes, 5 in shadow arts, 5 in acrobatics. Any seasoned thief knows this skill build is suitable for PvE but not PvP because it lacks blind on stealth, remove condi on going into stealth, regen health in stealth (or the initiative regen or vigor to spam dodges or FS/LS afforded with 30 in acrobatics/trickery. In fact you can’t spam anything with this build, you don’t have the necessary vigor/initiative to do it). I use it because I don’t like how dependent on stealth we are as a thief.

Some people say well you probably just spam 333333 right? Actually no because people are getting good at dodging larcenous strike now. Spamming it is a quick way to end yourself vs anyone good.

This is straight glass no sustain! S/D shortbow with only 5 in SA and 5 in Acro. This build will kill people that panic, are noobs and panic, underleveled or over aggressive people.

I’m going to be reasonable I’m guessing your build is to pick at someone one with the bow auto attack wear them down a bit then burst them with S/D.

So if you get caught with your SB out against any class with decent damage you are dead if shadow step isn’t up. You probably run withdraw instead of HIS so you can keep distance and keep tagging with the SB.

Your build in a 1v1 scenario is totally predicated on someone being over aggressive so you can auto with SB and cripple with 4.

The 4 isn’t going to do anything to a Warrior with lemongrass and dogged march. SB auto isn’t going to do enough damage while they heal up from signet as long as they don’t get tunnel vision and get in 900 range.

Even then they can pop endure pain to rush you and force you to blow ini on SB 5 and 4.

I won’t call your build bad but it really needs a extremely aggressive person so you can get the HP low with SB 1 then control and secure the kill with S/D. I am not saying all your fights are like this but in a 1v1 scenario they probably go something like that most of the time against a warrior because you know you don’t want a warrior next to you.

The mace thrives on the same thing a over aggressive opponent that wants to be close to a warrior for damage(don’t know why). The only class that can afford to be close to a warrior for a long period of time is a guardian thats how it should be.

If that is truly your build I will just say it won’t counter any warrior that isn’t over aggressive regardless if he has a mace/shield or not.

[Good Fights]Sinndicate{Ele}Sinactic{Engineer}
Sinnastor{Warrior}Sinnacle{Mesmer}Sintacs
{Thief}

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Posted by: Gaag.6538

Gaag.6538

For all the insults being thrown at us “whiners”, you have failed to provide any evidence at a proper counter to this build, or provide any justification why a single build can provide superior DPS, sustain, mobility, CC and immunity to conditions AT THE SAME TIME.

The argument I keep hearing is ‘lulz you suck nub thief, use stun breakers". Well, that’s awesome and all except for the fact that my stun breaker is on a 60 sec cooldown while the stun comes every 7.5 sec, excluding the shield bash and the bulls rush, which both can be followed by a 100b.

Some of you are more open minded at least and admit lemongrass soup and/or healing sig are broken. But its the same as agreeing with my claim, u are just trying to sugarcoat it

I also keep seeing the “L 2 Dodge” argument. Well that’s nice and all except for the fact that skull crack is a poorly telegraphed special attack, has a very short activation and difficult to tell from a normal attack, and that’s assuming the warrior is not an asuran…

Here’s a few counters: stay at range, blind, steal the warrior spin, drop a smoke field of any kind and spin to win on it to not only damage but to reapply blind consistently. L2P, use daze shot if you sense skull crack coming, dodge….I don’t play thief and I know all this.

I was never talking from a thief’s perspective, How would a ranger or D/D ele deal with it? oh right, still stay at range and try to CC an un-CCable build, gotcha.

Stop trying to come up with excuses, you know the build is OP. And at this point no one has commented on why a single build has high DPS, high sustain, high mobility, CC immunity, condition immunity and 50% stun uptime potential AT THE SAME TIME

-why dont u guys start a thread asking for the right players to provide counters against this war build? it would be far more constructive than arguing whether the build is OP or not (this thread wasnt going anywhere useful Hunter should have know better than this) or questioning the wisdom of th developers who…well …lets face it, they know the game better than anybody who actually plays the game , doesnt matter how many hours u have invested in this game the only thing u can actually contribute to the developers in terms of gameplay is just a point of view, like walking by the nazca lines all u going to see is a lousy dusty brickroad. the developers would have the eagle view in this case and they get to see what the whole thing is about.

if the developers see that your whining has any actual merits, they will certainly do something about it, if that.

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Posted by: redslion.9675

redslion.9675

Wait, thieves QQing.

The ones who always post on their forums “kitten and L2P” threads about them.

Can’t you see a pattern?

You will never be able to know what an engineer is going to do next…

because he doesn’t know it himself

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Posted by: Sil.4560

Sil.4560

I see a pattern and I love it. Hey thieves!

QQ

L2P

Hahahahaha.

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Posted by: LastK.6158

LastK.6158

Lets just make it that when warriors missed a burst, the adrenaline is still used so everyone is happy

This way, the mace f1 spammers will think more clearly before using their burst, and the others can effectively clean the conditions

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Posted by: Bogy.2953

Bogy.2953

At this point the only thing this thread has shown is that Excalibur is the definition of a scrub. Apparently he picked a class whos primary strength is stealth and refuses to use it and complains he cant beat another class head on without adjusting his start therefore that class is op. Guess we should all play by his imaginary rules lol

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Posted by: dooger.2640

dooger.2640

For all the insults being thrown at us “whiners”, you have failed to provide any evidence at a proper counter to this build, or provide any justification why a single build can provide superior DPS, sustain, mobility, CC and immunity to conditions AT THE SAME TIME.

Garbage build, kite mace and obvious skull crack, simply step back from 100 durps.

Its only danger is if you were already fighting someone and the warrior is an add to the fight.

At that point any burst damage class is a huge problem, even the most garbage thief in the world can literally close his eyes and press 2 and burst you faster.

you should try god mode thief dagger pistol

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Posted by: Daecollo.9578

Daecollo.9578

25 Signet 500b new meta!

Hero {} Roleplayer {} Friend {} Professional Princess Saver
https://twitter.com/TalathionEQ2

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Posted by: redslion.9675

redslion.9675

For all the insults being thrown at us “whiners”, you have failed to provide any evidence at a proper counter to this build, or provide any justification why a single build can provide superior DPS, sustain, mobility, CC and immunity to conditions AT THE SAME TIME.

We gave ways to counter, you ignored them.

Well, the DPS of this build kinda sucks, at least compared to what warriors can do. It seems high because you get it in 3 seconds. Sustained damage is mostly very low (unless the build uses lower sustain and higher damage, but still sustained dps is meh).

Warrior’s mobility is mostly good for covering long distances or running away. It has a very low maneuvrability. And doesn’t come directly with cc. If I close a gap, switch weapons and stun, I won’t be able to 100b you.

CC is like your stealth: annoying, but it’s our class’ main mechanic.

Immunity to movement conditions only, obtained in great part with runes and food. Outside of Berserker’s Stance.

However, why we can have a good trade of all of these? Because we don’t have tricks:

We don’t have AI

We don’t have Stealth

We don’t have Teleports

We don’t have protection.

Let’s put it like this: Warrior is becoming the “no cover, all man class”.XD

We make up for the lack of these mechanics by having higher stats/higher regen/a bit higher damage

As people learned to work around stealth, you have to learn how not to die to our burst even if we hit you (example: find easy ways to apply protection, weakness or blind, use low cd teleports, use AI cc and so on)

You will never be able to know what an engineer is going to do next…

because he doesn’t know it himself

(edited by redslion.9675)

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Posted by: Velron.3729

Velron.3729

Lets just make it that when warriors missed a burst, the adrenaline is still used so everyone is happy

This way, the mace f1 spammers will think more clearly before using their burst, and the others can effectively clean the conditions

Lots of us want this change anyway bc then Cleansing Ire would work better with melee weapons.

However, at the same time as this change – they need to fix Thieves being able to just spam their Stealth opener attack and not get revealed even when you block it, etc. They just spam it against your block until the block wears off and the attack hits, like Warriors missing their burst and retaining adrenaline but 10x worse.

Fragg – Engineer | Lil Zek – Warrior PVP R43
[DA] Decisive Actions – Jade Quarry

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Posted by: runeblade.7514

runeblade.7514

Lets just make it that when warriors missed a burst, the adrenaline is still used so everyone is happy

This way, the mace f1 spammers will think more clearly before using their burst, and the others can effectively clean the conditions

There is already a downside for missing the burst.

It goes into a full cooldown.

5x Warrior, 5x Ranger, 4x Elementalist, 4x Engineer,
4x Necromancer, 3x Mesmer, 4x Guardian, 4x Thief, 4 Revenant

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Posted by: killahmayne.9518

killahmayne.9518

you come into this thread calling this build OP, overexaggerating things and ask people to be objective. When you and other people clearly refuse to listen when they actually give you advice on how to counter it. Of course people are going to troll you, especially since Warriors are still NOT viable in pvp tournaments and have been at the bottom of the dumps for a year.

And maybe if you had listened instead of complaining, you would know that this is the easiest and most effective counter to this build for newbies who consistently take skull cracks to the face.

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Bowl_of_Roasted_Lotus_Root

Mace/Greatsword Video (Sept Patch)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MoAjKtD6MLY

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Posted by: redslion.9675

redslion.9675

Lets just make it that when warriors missed a burst, the adrenaline is still used so everyone is happy

This way, the mace f1 spammers will think more clearly before using their burst, and the others can effectively clean the conditions

There is already a downside for missing the burst.

It goes into a full cooldown.

They’d probably wouldn’t be a problem for most builds: Adrenaline is mostly refilled in that time span.

You will never be able to know what an engineer is going to do next…

because he doesn’t know it himself

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Posted by: CreativeAnarchy.6324

CreativeAnarchy.6324

COUNTERS: … if you cant use a stun break, a teleport a blind or anything that makes you invulnerable, then that is totally your fault and deserve to suffer the 100b damage, if you can manage to get rid of the stun or negate it by any of those many counters then you will have a really good amount of time to destroy the warrior completely because he has nothing, read, NOTHING to do, this build relies on other people stupidity, to land a full 100b, its their main source of damage, in the meanwhile they do nothing to you, and guess what?, in order to this build do good damage he needs to be using a berserker amulet that would hurt but if you manage to counter the stun it will die so fast that he will not have a chance to land another skull crack.

If the warrior is tanky, then the damage of the 100b will be a lot more forgiving and will not get a lot of your hp, unless you are a glass canon and then HOW IS THAT A WARRIOR PROBLEM in the first place, that is YOUR CHOICE.

I have been using this build to some extent and good players use teleports, stun breaks, chill,cripple to stay away, mesmers shatter to make themselves invulnerable or daze to interrupt, thieves spam blinds and makes you fail docens of skull cracks, elementalist use a lot of stability and of course stun breaks, necros and rangers put fear on you, i one time met a thief that put fear on me (idk how he managed to do that really), other warriors use stability or endure pain, guardians have aegis and a lot of blocks actually, the fact is that all classes have stun breaks, evasions, teleports something to make this build suffer a lot, you just need to exploit them.

Like i said, this build relys on other people mistakes, if the warrior is wining then for sure he is outplaying you and thats it, you need to learn to loose, and learn how to use better your class and abuse it.

Just to anser how that thief put fear on you, they mugged a necro and held on to it. Thieves get something specific from the class they mug. They get whirling axe from warriors.
——————————————————————-
——————————————————————-
——————————————————————-
For the OP,

My opinion on this build, bring stun breakers, watch out for what the warrior is going to do. It should’t be difficult to deal with. As far as other classes that don’t have stability, so what, warriors don’t have stealth like the thief, blind like a necro, aoe like a ele…in other words, some classes will handle this much easier if set up correctly others may have a little harder time but I wouldn’t worry too much unless you are a really bad player. The weapon attacks are very well telegraphed for this build and you have to be totally ignorant to the game to not be able to handle this build.

Just like I tell people complaining about thieves, learn to play.

I speak for my self and no one else. Only fools believe they speak for a majority.

(edited by CreativeAnarchy.6324)

Mace/shield GS build = Overpowered

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Posted by: TheGuy.3568

TheGuy.3568

You are wrong, TheGuy. You are just another one of the few that have been spamming our forums for the last few days.

Guess you must be new around here. Like I said took a month to not talk about it until I played it heavily. Some of my post are long but I am detailed. I also call it like I see it I don’t just scream kitten is OP for the love of it. The build is a strong stun lock build with high sustained healing, strong burst damage, 2 cc that chain into each other and a CC skill with a very short animation that is not telegraphed other than the fact that the person got into melee range. The build also has superior mobility to the vast majority of builds it faces while roaming and has very little counter play. Unlike hammer which has its CC strongly telegraphed allowing for strong counter play using dodge his build has less animation time making the skull crack hard to spot. Also due to the fact that there are 2 ranged blocks on the Mace/Shield weapon set it makes the keeping ranged DPs up hard to sustain. Due to the fact that you can build so tanky due to the 50% crit chance and that our stats allow for this while still slotting skills like balanced stance melandru ruins dogged march plus food its hard for conditions to keep up and even if they did once the gap is closed it is game over.

Now it my be hard for you to understand this but I am not in the business after playing so many classes for such a long time to rush to a conclusion and just say it is OP. This build is clearly Op and the reasons are obvious. For most builds with a an extremely strong trait like this you are looking at either master or grand master level investment. On that same note considering that stun is such a strong for of CC and usually very short duration on long CD this build has a unproportionate amount of it compared to other classes. That is you can not lock down the warrior but the warrior can lock you down. A build that doesn’t require you to build glass but still hits hard is synonymous with the class that has been kittened about for months thief.

I get disgusted when people like you assume your right simply because you feel you have a fighting chance now. I never needed kittenty tactics like this. I play my lyssa warrior like usual and use my knowledge of other classes to procure my wins. A build where i find myself winning simply because i am too tanky to down and getting in melee range of me means certain defeat for my enemy is disgusting. Its not skill but OP mechanics at work and I rather have no part of it.

I do not care what other classes say. As a warrior class player I am telling you this is OP.

Your’e hypocrites if you could sit here for months and talk about how skilled you were on the weakest class and now feel all is right as you win every fight. You are all more disgusting that the thief community as you know what is like to be kitten on and ignored by the devs as other classes step all over you. So finally you have your OP build. And what do you say,“Ohh no this is imba please fix it.” or maybe ," I think this is a little too much." now you go with the tried and true, “L2P newbs”. All playing the same OP build with the same OP traits abandoning the builds you crafted that actually required you to work for win in favor of a, “Haha you got stunned 100b now you lose build,” and that is all it really is. Recognize that. While you kitten on the thief you act just like they do. It really is funny. Months on these forums thinking this was the best community in the game with the best players. However, a little taste of power and, “kitten all that I rather get easy wins.”

Speech over act like the hypocrites you are as it is a great example of how human nature never really changes.

Kor The Cold Heart War
Wrekkes-Engineer Kore Rok Thief-Asraithe-Ele

(edited by TheGuy.3568)

Mace/shield GS build = Overpowered

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Posted by: CreativeAnarchy.6324

CreativeAnarchy.6324

I get disgusted when people like you assume your right simply because you feel you have a fighting chance now. I never needed kittenty tactics like this. I play my lyssa warrior like usual and use my knowledge of other classes to procure my wins. A build where i find myself winning simply because i am too tanky to down and getting in melee range of me means certain defeat for my enemy is disgusting. Its not skill but OP mechanics at work and I rather have no part of it.

I get disgusted when people like you assume your right simply because it is what you feel, not real facts.

I speak for my self and no one else. Only fools believe they speak for a majority.

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Posted by: TheGuy.3568

TheGuy.3568

I get disgusted when people like you assume your right simply because you feel you have a fighting chance now. I never needed kittenty tactics like this. I play my lyssa warrior like usual and use my knowledge of other classes to procure my wins. A build where i find myself winning simply because i am too tanky to down and getting in melee range of me means certain defeat for my enemy is disgusting. Its not skill but OP mechanics at work and I rather have no part of it.

I get disgusted when people like you assume your right simply because it is what you feel, not real facts.

Fact were above seems you missed it or the detailed post I made yesterday that no one countered because I am…..right. I am not your punching bag thief so I want to hear how balanced it is. I have already posted on how to counter it but I did the same with DD ele S/D thief and D/P thief over my time here. Doesn’t mean it is balanced.

Kor The Cold Heart War
Wrekkes-Engineer Kore Rok Thief-Asraithe-Ele

(edited by TheGuy.3568)

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Posted by: redslion.9675

redslion.9675

Your’e hypocrites if you could sit here for months and talk about how skilled you were on the weakest class and now feel all is right as you win every fight. You are all more disgusting that the thief community as you know what is like to be kitten on and ignored by the devs as other classes step all over you. So finally you have your OP build. And what do you say,“Ohh no this is imba please fix it.” or maybe ," I think this is a little too much." now you go with the tried and true, “L2P newbs”. All playing the same OP build with the same OP traits abandoning the builds you crafted that actually required you to work for win in favor of a, “Haha you got stunned 100b now you lose build,” and that is all it really is. Recognize that. While you kitten on the thief you act just like they do. It really is funny. Months on these forums thinking this was the best community in the game with the best players. However, a little taste of power and, “kitten all that I rather get easy wins.”

Speech over act like the hypocrites you are as it is a great example of how human nature never really changes.

Hard to tell you this my friend, but do you know what was the build I crafted?

A STUNLOCK build, just with hammer instead of mace. And nobody had a problem with it. Damage and survivability was almost equal. But the CC was much, MUCH stronger.

You will never be able to know what an engineer is going to do next…

because he doesn’t know it himself

(edited by redslion.9675)

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Posted by: TheGuy.3568

TheGuy.3568

Your’e hypocrites if you could sit here for months and talk about how skilled you were on the weakest class and now feel all is right as you win every fight. You are all more disgusting that the thief community as you know what is like to be kitten on and ignored by the devs as other classes step all over you. So finally you have your OP build. And what do you say,“Ohh no this is imba please fix it.” or maybe ," I think this is a little too much." now you go with the tried and true, “L2P newbs”. All playing the same OP build with the same OP traits abandoning the builds you crafted that actually required you to work for win in favor of a, “Haha you got stunned 100b now you lose build,” and that is all it really is. Recognize that. While you kitten on the thief you act just like they do. It really is funny. Months on these forums thinking this was the best community in the game with the best players. However, a little taste of power and, “kitten all that I rather get easy wins.”

Speech over act like the hypocrites you are as it is a great example of how human nature never really changes.

Hard to tell you this my friend, but do you know what was the build I crafted?

A STUNLOCK build, just with hammer instead of mace. And nobody had a problem with it.

Read above. I will provide an excerpt of what you skipped

“Unlike hammer which has its CC strongly telegraphed allowing for strong counter play using dodge his build has less animation time making the skull crack hard to spot. Also due to the fact that there are 2 ranged blocks on the Mace/Shield weapon set it makes the keeping ranged DPs up hard to sustain.”

I am not one of these thieves who came here to kitten. I did not just pick up this class. One warrior to another it is OP. Please please please do not assume I do not play the class know the builds or know the skills.

Kor The Cold Heart War
Wrekkes-Engineer Kore Rok Thief-Asraithe-Ele

(edited by TheGuy.3568)

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Posted by: redslion.9675

redslion.9675

“Unlike hammer which has its CC strongly telegraphed allowing for strong counter play using dodge his build has less animation time making the skull crack hard to spot. Also due to the fact that there are 2 ranged blocks on the Mace/Shield weapon set it makes the keeping ranged DPs up hard to sustain.”

My offset is Mace/Shield. And I use it to set up hammer cc. And it does even more damage, actually.

And even if I thought some abilities from other classes might have been cheesy (but mostly outside of tournaments) I never asked for a nerf. I tried my best to learn to play and to fight. Now is someone else’s turn.

You will never be able to know what an engineer is going to do next…

because he doesn’t know it himself

(edited by redslion.9675)

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Posted by: TheGuy.3568

TheGuy.3568

“Unlike hammer which has its CC strongly telegraphed allowing for strong counter play using dodge his build has less animation time making the skull crack hard to spot. Also due to the fact that there are 2 ranged blocks on the Mace/Shield weapon set it makes the keeping ranged DPs up hard to sustain.”

My offset is Mace/Shield. And I use it to set up hammer cc.

Which means what? You sound like the guy that sys ohh I do not use this build for DPS. And what difference does that make the traits are OP. its not like the guy who was using DD ele as a glass cannon got his say when they nerfed RtL.

Kor The Cold Heart War
Wrekkes-Engineer Kore Rok Thief-Asraithe-Ele

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Posted by: redslion.9675

redslion.9675

“Unlike hammer which has its CC strongly telegraphed allowing for strong counter play using dodge his build has less animation time making the skull crack hard to spot. Also due to the fact that there are 2 ranged blocks on the Mace/Shield weapon set it makes the keeping ranged DPs up hard to sustain.”

My offset is Mace/Shield. And I use it to set up hammer cc.

Which means what?

That if the problem about Mace/shield + GS build is being unreadable because of mace, that is also my problem.

You will never be able to know what an engineer is going to do next…

because he doesn’t know it himself

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Posted by: TheGuy.3568

TheGuy.3568

“Unlike hammer which has its CC strongly telegraphed allowing for strong counter play using dodge his build has less animation time making the skull crack hard to spot. Also due to the fact that there are 2 ranged blocks on the Mace/Shield weapon set it makes the keeping ranged DPs up hard to sustain.”

My offset is Mace/Shield. And I use it to set up hammer cc.

Which means what?

That if the problem about Mace/shield + GS build is being unreadable because of mace, that is also my problem.

You can get the same CC out of hammer the issue is hammer animation are slow and punish those not paying attention. This makes sense. The problem is mace shield has quick animations and some of the hardest to spot in the game. What compounds this issue is recent healing changes the capability to block something hammer inherently does not have. So countering hammer while simple can still challenging. Ranged DPS is a flat out counter so are blinds and evade. If you get caught it is your fault and its all over. Mace shield on the other hand is defensive enough to mitigate much of the damage in pursuit of the target and still pack out CC quicker on a single target. There is very little counter play because the animations are so fast.

There is more to this but I outlined it yesterday and before that and have no need to again. Factually in terms of access to blocks CC mobility and the traits being too good for adept the build is factually OP.

Kor The Cold Heart War
Wrekkes-Engineer Kore Rok Thief-Asraithe-Ele

(edited by TheGuy.3568)

Mace/shield GS build = Overpowered

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Posted by: Ashanor.5319

Ashanor.5319

“Unlike hammer which has its CC strongly telegraphed allowing for strong counter play using dodge his build has less animation time making the skull crack hard to spot. Also due to the fact that there are 2 ranged blocks on the Mace/Shield weapon set it makes the keeping ranged DPs up hard to sustain.”

My offset is Mace/Shield. And I use it to set up hammer cc.

Which means what?

That if the problem about Mace/shield + GS build is being unreadable because of mace, that is also my problem.

A little common sense is all it takes to read the mace stun is inc. I’m not going to respond to TheGuy. Seems he just loads his posts up full of rambling and nonsense and if anyone doesn’t feel like wading through the drivel and pointing out everything that is wrong, he automatically assumes he is right.

This build is fine, if it was so powerful top tPvP players would be using it and there would be at least one warrior on every team. This build is decent at 1v1 (not the best, that’s for sure) and pretty decent at assisting someone to take down a target in a 2v1. The more players are around the weaker the build gets, and if you were in a 2v1 situation and got killed, that is what is supposed to happen. This build has some serious issues fighting BM rangers, blind and evade thieves, and especially mesmers. This build can also be beat by engies who know what they are doing and minion necros (since we obviously aren’t talking about tPvP balance – if we were this conversation wouldn’t even exist). It is mostly a 1v1 or duelist build, and many classes have those. This build is still at a disadvantage against good players and you want to call it overpowered? Ridiculous.

Mace/shield GS build = Overpowered

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Posted by: Turamarth.3248

Turamarth.3248

That if the problem about Mace/shield + GS build is being unreadable because of mace, that is also my problem.

You can get the same CC out of hammer the issue is hammer animation are slow and punish those not paying attention. This makes sense. The problem is mace shield has quick animations and some of the hardest to spot in the game. What compounds this issue is recent healing changes the capability to block something hammer inherently does not have. So countering hammer while simple can still challenging. Ranged DPS is a flat out counter so are blinds and evade. If you get caught it is your fault and its all over. Mace shield on the other hand is defensive enough to mitigate much of the damage in pursuit of the target and still pack out CC quicker on a single target. There is very little counter play because the animations are so fast.

There is more to this but I outlined it yesterday and before that and have no need to again. Factually in terms of access to blocks CC mobility and the traits being too good for adept the build is factually OP.

I believe you misunderstood him. He uses M/S + H.
M/S for the stun and the hammer for dps.
With this he has the ranged block, the quick animations and apparently the same dps as with the GS build.

Brandar – Kodash [DE]
[SPQR]

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Posted by: Velron.3729

Velron.3729

you come into this thread calling this build OP, overexaggerating things and ask people to be objective. When you and other people clearly refuse to listen when they actually give you advice on how to counter it. Of course people are going to troll you, especially since Warriors are still NOT viable in pvp tournaments and have been at the bottom of the dumps for a year.

And maybe if you had listened instead of complaining, you would know that this is the easiest and most effective counter to this build for newbies who consistently take skull cracks to the face.

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Bowl_of_Roasted_Lotus_Root

No kitten right?! I’m getting pretty annoyed at these threads and everyone screaming about it when the counter is easily available if you choose.

I run this food on my Engineer since Engis are weak to CC due to lack of stability and not many stun breaks if you want to run kits.

Hell even some of the people have said kitten like ‘The build isn’t OP in PVP, but it is in WvW".

1 – WvW was never meant to be balanced.
2 – WvW has the counter available in the form of a simple food.
3 – People want to just keep crying about it being OP rather than trying to counter. I run Melandru runes, Cleansing Ire trait, Sig of Stamina and Berserker stance all to counter conditions. Crying nubs, how much counter stun do you run?

Fragg – Engineer | Lil Zek – Warrior PVP R43
[DA] Decisive Actions – Jade Quarry

Mace/shield GS build = Overpowered

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Posted by: Fenrir.5493

Fenrir.5493

I find funny how this loosers are ignoring all the constructive post we made to suggest counters and put the facts on the table that this build has counters, then prefer to still crying and not having a mature discussion just claiming things like “its OP” , “thief must be better than a warrior” and a lot of more BS claims, but when the facts are put on the table and try to get a mature discussion this guys just ignore them and keep spaming their BS.

“We also realize that we can make mistakes but we dont care because I HAVE THE POWAAA!!”

Mace/shield GS build = Overpowered

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Posted by: Ashanor.5319

Ashanor.5319

I find funny how this loosers are ignoring all the constructive post we made to suggest counters and put the facts on the table that this build has counters, then prefer to still crying and not having a mature discussion just claiming things like “its OP” , “thief must be better than a warrior” and a lot of more BS claims, but when the facts are put on the table and try to get a mature discussion this guys just ignore them and keep spaming their BS.

Exactly. They are just spamming that stuff and ignoring the truth because they are hoping their biased arguments fall on the developers ears and they can drown us out. It is the same old nerf tactic that is always used, except worse in this game because they think they can actually get the developers to listen and do a knee-jerk reaction nerf. It’s like the same small group of people in every one of these anti warriors threads by the way.

I will lose all confidence in Anet if they listen to these people and that will probably lead to me and many others quitting this game. Nerfing based on forum complaints is never a good idea. Look at your internal data and see the truth Anet.

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Posted by: Cogbyrn.7283

Cogbyrn.7283

Sigh. Even if someone picked TheGuy apart, he wouldn’t listen until we stopped, then he’d step back up and say he’s right.

When you include WvW food in your analysis of a build’s balance, you destroy your own credibility instantly. When you talk about how disgusted you are that people don’t agree with you (which is all that soapbox garbage boiled down to), you make yourself look disgusting. No one wants to discuss points because you aren’t worth discussing them with.

There’s no objectivity in the analysis. None. It’s all designed to make the build look OP, without even trying to bring in arguments to the contrary in order to defeat them. It’s more ranting about how there’s “no counterplay”, as though there has to be some 1 second animation to constitute counterplay. As if having a Mace+Shield out doesn’t broadcast to the world that everything you’re doing is looking to set up Skull Crack or block incoming damage.

If one person who thinks the build is OP could try to consider any of the counters in their analysis, that would be just swell. Just saying that Skull Crack doesn’t have a blatantly obvious and fairly slow animation doesn’t mean it has no counter-play. If it DOES mean that, then what does that say about all the other dueling builds for every other class in the game?

The best way to prove it’s actually OP would be to start thinking about how it might not be. Debate all of the counters to it. Analyze them thoroughly, and objectively.

“I don’t just jump to conclusions, I put a lot of time in, so trust me, it’s OP. Here are a bunch of my opinions about it. You disgusting hypocrites should accept that it’s OP because I say it is.”

Just… ugh.

Alduin Nightsong, 80 Human Necro
“He’s like a man with a fork in a world of soup.”

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Posted by: Senjun.8149

Senjun.8149

There are way to many players finding this build of war OP ingame and accross the forums, this is equivalent to the number of players who complained about DD bunker eles. It will be seeing a nerf, it’s not the end of the world. At best it gets a longer cooldown or a shorter stun duration which it much requires. Not game breaking for warriors.

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Posted by: Cogbyrn.7283

Cogbyrn.7283

Yeah, Mace+Shield is roughly as good as a D/D Ele was. Right guys? Comparable?

Guys?

Alduin Nightsong, 80 Human Necro
“He’s like a man with a fork in a world of soup.”

Mace/shield GS build = Overpowered

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Posted by: Fenrir.5493

Fenrir.5493

There are way to many players finding this build of war OP ingame and accross the forums, this is equivalent to the number of players who complained about DD bunker eles. It will be seeing a nerf, it’s not the end of the world. At best it gets a longer cooldown or a shorter stun duration which it much requires. Not game breaking for warriors.

Say to me, why are you ignoring all the facts and evidence that proves that this isnt OP.

Im going to tell you why, because all of you are kids that play the tactic of scream things and at the same time put your hands on your ears so you can not listen to the truth, while you continue with your tantrums.

“We also realize that we can make mistakes but we dont care because I HAVE THE POWAAA!!”

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Posted by: Kjeldoran.3849

Kjeldoran.3849

Say to me, why are you ignoring all the facts and evidence that proves that this isnt OP.

Im going to tell you why, because all of you are kids that play the tactic of scream things and at the same time put your hands on your ears so you can not listen to the truth, while you continue with your tantrums.

Guys! what the hell are you doing! why warrior thread is full of posts like “warrior is OP” and “nerf warrior”!!!! TELL ME WHY! do you really think that Arena Net is here to listen to every your assumption? do you really think anet will really nerf a class only because a bouch of players say “they are op!” ??? Tha’ts ridicolous…

Now if you still have a modicum of intelligence you will stop that no-sense thread spamming (and waste of time for you) because, i have to admit, warrior is actually the easier class to use (especially with skull cracker build) and the one which gives you great results with no skill… but isn’t to waste hours and hours and hours … and hours here that you will solve the problem!

As you can see (from videos) Arena Net team not only program the game but also play and test the game also after the patch release so if there is really someting of wrong with the class don’t worry… they will do all the necessary to fix it as soon as possible!
NOW STOP THAT KITTEN! this is a forum … where player help player not where player insult and/or ask for nerfs… don’t be kids!

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Posted by: Xsorus.2507

Xsorus.2507

I was never talking from a thief’s perspective, How would a ranger or D/D ele deal with it? oh right, still stay at range and try to CC an un-CCable build, gotcha.

Is this a joke? Rangers and ele’s have plenty of access to stability, which mixed with stun breakers completely counters the skull crack build. Both also have far better sustain than a warrior and both have access to protection.

Ranger’s have access to 2 Stability buffs

1. Is Signet of the Wild, which requires 30 points in Marksman to get the Grandmaster Trait to get.

2. The other is Rampage as one, a 120 Second Elite.

That is it..

http://www.youtube.com/user/Xsorus/videos?view=0
Natures Ninja and Pain Inverter – Ranger PvP movies
http://www.twitch.tv/xsorovos

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Posted by: Assassin.7890

Assassin.7890

lets share some candies and talk about politics and religion. Seems more peacefull then Skull crack to me!

;)

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Posted by: Xsorus.2507

Xsorus.2507

Going to chime in on this as well real quick, If your first answer to someone saying your build is overpowered is to point to another class that is considered vastly overpowered and say “Well they’re overpowered” then guess what, You’re overpowered.

This isn’t about Warriors no longer being free kills as you say, But maybe just maybe, Anet overbuffed certain aspects of your class recently in regards to how powerful it is, Just like the Necro..Which if you think about it, Is quite hilarious since they said themselves it wouldn’t take much to overpower both of those classes….Yet they still managed to do it.

Coming from someone primarily who plays a Ranger..Trust me when I say you mine as well just admit to being OPed and take the lumps, because the nerfs you’ll have coming to you will end up completely decimating your builds.

I’ve had my builds eat it constantly for the past few months…and i’m pretty much expecting to eat it some more next patch.

http://www.youtube.com/user/Xsorus/videos?view=0
Natures Ninja and Pain Inverter – Ranger PvP movies
http://www.twitch.tv/xsorovos