Guild Wars 2

Just shrug it off, and move on. Just a game man. It’s what I did

Haven’t yet tried it but

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Renewed_Justice
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Virtue_of_Retribution

Fire spear, for like 6 seconds of retal, kill a target, Justice is off cooldown, throw a spear, repeat. What I don’t like is it kills off Justice’s passive, but I think I can stretch it out with stand your ground to get burn time in there.

may just scrap it all together, though.

Mickey Frogeater.1470:

Aidal.4901:

There was very weak specific build up, Balthazar is the god of war and fire. On his reveal as Lazzydazzy he purged everyone specifically with fire, helped defend Aurene with fire, fire, fire fire!

’cept the real Lazerus the dire was a necromancer that also used lightning/air

https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Lazarus_the_Dire

So if we see a Air Elementalist Necromancer Mursaat then we’ll know we got the real Lazarus(who doesn’t need all of the Artifacts to resurrect).

Considering travelers in the Maguuma Jungle sense something Unseen I would assume players will eventually be hearing of dead rising and people getting electrocuted by mysterious Lightning out of nowhere during Living Story season 4 or 5. Most likely Lazarus will surface in Tangle Root(which hasn’t appeared yet in GW2).

Yeah sure that’ll work.

Late For Tea.1846:

Cyninja.2954:

Zephic.3075:

Balthazar is by far the worst possible choice of a reveal. A proper build-up was definitely needed and not just a mention last episode that Lazarus wasn’t real. Last episode was appropriate epic, but this episode’s story was a downer.

The buildup was there, maybe more subtle than expected. The gods were gone, no one knows where they went and/or what they actually were. It not having been tied in to the story episodes so far does not mean it wasn’t there.

How is this even a build-up? The Six Gods have never been brought up in GW2, so the simple fact that they are “missing” is hardly enough reason to call it build-up. You can say the same about plenty of other characters. It could just as well have been Palawa Joko, who wants to expand his reign to the west. And in the next chapter we will have his undead popping up all over the place.
It could have been a Titan, Dhuum, Vizier Khilbron, Koss&Melonni’s descendant, Livia, a random surviving dwarf, Kuunavang. All of them are missing, in an unknown location, or we don’t have direct sight of, therefore they could all take Balthazar’s place without any story adjustments needed. Heck, it could even be the real Lazarus disguising himself as a fake Lazarus to confuse everyone.
Yes, non of them have any reason to disguise themselves as Lazarus, but neither did Balthazar until now. There was no build-up.

There was very weak specific build up, Balthazar is the god of war and fire. On his reveal as Lazzydazzy he purged everyone specifically with fire, helped defend Aurene with fire, fire, fire fire!

’cept the real Lazerus the dire was a necromancer that also used lightning/air

https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Lazarus_the_Dire

Did I know it would be Balthazar on the reveal? No, but once I figured it out it did sort of snap together for me, did I think it was well played? Not specifically, but it also wasn’t as much a reach as some people thought. More importantly it did leave me curious to why the god of war is stomping around.

I’m thinking there’s an internal god conflict going on, which would also explain their inactivity, can’t help the mortal ones much if you’re busy bashing divine face. For all we know Balthazar lost his eternal war with his brother and the mists are about to be over-run. Or maybe he won, wanted more war, and started picking fights leading to some sort of banishment or de-powering.

But I’m just trying to be optimistic.

Djinn.9245:

I haven’t tried this boss fight yet, but if it is anything like the others I just can’t wait!

/sarcasm

Bring AoE, dunk the dogs, fly up, use double whammy orb on dogs, repeat x3.

you win.

DarcShriek.5829:

How involved are the other gods? Lyssa let him use her mirror, and melandru allowed him to take shelter in her first garden. Why would Kormir allow him to destroy Tyria?

I already argued that due to his nature, he may have just bullied said things from the gods. In addition to that, the gods may be actively fighting each other. I highly doubt Melandru allowed him to take shelter and then allowed her guardian spirits to aid you in evicting him. And for all we know, he jacked the mirror off Lyssa.

Am I the only one who had a ridiculously easy time getting this map down? after TD there’s not much they can do to confuse me unless they start making maps out of MC Esher pictures.

Doric and Ember are ranked high due to easy to obtain currency.

Bitterfrost is ranked lower, due to the sheer number of currency required.

Bloodstone Fen is just.. no, its pretty to look at, but impractical. Unless I’m RPing in it I don’t waste my time.

Moonyeti.3296:

Aidal.4901:

SlippyCheeze.5483:

Eirian Direstorm.9748:

His plan was foiled for now, but since he just disappeared into the mists, who knows what he might do next.

We never saw the body. Also, we know that Lyssa is also in on this, from the mirror sequence. So … it’s not impossible he just waypointed out, instead of death, IMO, and even if we did pop him off, we got five other gods with at least one “involved” in the situation actively…

Just providing alternative, but assuming Lyssa is in on it just because of a mirror might be preemptive. Balth’s says something along the lines of “They laughed at me” or something which implies that there may be some sort of god vs god conflict going on. For all we could know, Balth picked a fight with Lyssa, pillaged the mirror and left on this quest to get more power.

He passive-aggressively steals his girlfriend’s mirror when she dumps him then leaves the country. The god of war has fallen on hard times, indeed.

It’s Balthazar man, he aggressively stole it and probably took a dump on her carpet before leaving.

armaduras.8972:

I had just played GW1’s story through again two weeks ago. From Prophecies to Nightfall at least. I read a bunch of the side lore as I was doing it. It has a better-constructed story, with a solid base that never contradicts itself.

Season 1 was beautiful, as it was changing the world and the content was interactive and progressive— not just for the player but the entire continent of Tyria. The direction of the game Pre-HoT was great and the story was very well written.

Now the game is so full of fluff that when something serious does happen, it doesn’t even feel like it should matter. Eir died? Who cares!? Did you see that new Quaggan Backpack on the Gemstore? You were probably wearing it when Eir died. Yep, kneeling over a corpse on your barely dressed female character, outfit died pink with a pink quggan on your back. Oh so serious.

Cosmetic choices =/= bad story telling dude, that’s weak. You can’t blame the devs for giving people options to wear whatever. In addition to that, pre-HoT story telling probably requires significantly longer programming time.

Guild wars 2 has the pacing of the story is a bit faster, which bothers me a tad. But the differences are not as yuuuge as you’re making it out to be, that’s just fan-talk. The focus of guild wars 1 seemed very “off of you” as in you’re a secondary character, a best, at worse you’re an extra in the LOTR fight scene.

I enjoy the fact that my character is more centralized now. Trehearne’s death was legitimately the best thing that happened in this game.

SlippyCheeze.5483:

Eirian Direstorm.9748:

His plan was foiled for now, but since he just disappeared into the mists, who knows what he might do next.

We never saw the body. Also, we know that Lyssa is also in on this, from the mirror sequence. So … it’s not impossible he just waypointed out, instead of death, IMO, and even if we did pop him off, we got five other gods with at least one “involved” in the situation actively…

Just providing alternative, but assuming Lyssa is in on it just because of a mirror might be preemptive. Balth’s says something along the lines of “They laughed at me” or something which implies that there may be some sort of god vs god conflict going on. For all we could know, Balth picked a fight with Lyssa, pillaged the mirror and left on this quest to get more power.

MrSilver.5269:

Thanks for the reply. It was vicious, and I just don’t see a way to counter it because I didn’t have enough condi clear (and I’m speced for condi clear).

Running away helps, as a ghost thief, all my crap is on CD for at least 15s. If you can’t book it by then you kinda deserve it.

medusashadow.3567:

Here how counter it go buy Stealth distributor at the the trap guy build it with 10 supply and stand on and wait for them come for you.

I usually send my thieves guild after people who I think are standing on traps, triggers any traps they have.

TBH I’d prefer a new spec being a rifle and the ranger being more of a frontiers man feel.

I always thought PBS was a defensive shot used to keep enemies away from you.

Probably why it’s not 1,500, because if you knocked someone back at that range you can’t hit them.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vRAQJAWRnMbCt0g10AebC0biFvBb6iFASAxJwHYGkqDECmAA-TBBXgAAK/6V/JUXwjSQA-e

I’ve been rolling that, I don’t even use my healing skill, Nightfall + reaper 4 or well+ reaper 4, or just wells in general tend to heal me entirely. If Rise catches 5 targets then it recharges about 1 second after the minions finally kick it, so I have the leech from them. As far as using the healing skill goes, I can get it down to 15s if I hit five targets. But again, I rarely need to use it, I just rotate my leeching around.

I even use it for a condition heavy build, though it has a bit of a lesser degree of usefulness, as it has poor condition sync.

In the volcano with the Dom boss fight there’s an invisible block just kinda there.

It poses no real harm, save for how I found it, which was mid free fall. But just reporting it

Perma invis thief is only rough if you can’t reveal, but if you can’t reveal, don’t fight perma invis..? it’s literally a crap build dude, it has horrible damage output and mediocre pursuit ability. My engi and rev chew them up like a lawnmower to grass.

ITT: Bad player complains about build he either can’t counter or lacks the ability to.

Besides the obvious engi/rev counters etc. This build is really, really bad. It has like two traps that can do really anything and then a CC trap.

You can literally walk away from this build with nearly any escape. It doesn’t need a nerf.

Yeah, he’s Euro, no idea how but it happened. Thanks, we’re working on a solution now

He should be NA, is there a way to end up on a EU server even though you’re NA?

Just as the title says, We’re in a party, I right click portrait and no option to “join in X”

The friend is f2p level 11 if that makes any difference, vs me being purchased and level 80.

I’m kind of against this, but I’m also against the whole “Lets choke team chat”.

I joke around in Team chat a lot, but I also provide information for recon. I’m also sarcastic. I don’t get paid to do this, I don’t get paid to inform people about enemy movement, so when I joke, let me joke, if I’m doing my job then knock it off.

apparently however some FA guild through their panties in a tiff and promptly wished me to off myself because I was “wasting team chat and spewing useless information”.

Expanding team chat to cross map is just going to annoy a lot of people due to the information overflow, there should be a separate chat for such a thing, Call it WvW chat, make it so you need a 10-15 second cool down between messages in it so keep that stuff under control, and leave team chat alone.

Dawdler.8521:

Havent noticed any difference at all when roaming on borders.

This, plus EB.

I also have a pretty nice connection speed though, I don’t think this is an issue on their end, either that or my speed is able to plow through it.

Aidal.4901:

Reduce over all ppt values, and improve kill value. Similar to the wxp mechanic for players, players who have accomplished more in wvw would be worth more on kill.

The idea needs tweaking, but I feel like it would be a good start. I dunno if the idea was stated prior, I got it from metal gear online.

Kind of still playing on this, the current wvw awards inactivity just as much as activity (to an extent) even if overall PPT values were lowered, there would still be a bit of a problem with night capping, I won’t mess with that though, not yet.

Open to changes, my idea is simply take the wxp mechanic, where players increase in wxp value as they “do things” and apply it toward the point system. If someone has been going around flipping camps and tearing up other players, his value would increase applying a sort of bounty that would be given to the team that brings him down

On the flipside someone fresh out of spawn (or respawn) would be worth little to nothing, but still worth applying pressure to to avoid potential ppt gain, this would come at the cost of increasing your own bounty, again its just an idea, but I figured giving more incentive for activity might be a good start.

Reduce over all ppt values, and improve kill value. Similar to the wxp mechanic for players, players who have accomplished more in wvw would be worth more on kill.

The idea needs tweaking, but I feel like it would be a good start. I dunno if the idea was stated prior, I got it from metal gear online.

That’s a fair point, I’ll admit thief lacks ranged options for PvE, but doing so would break WvW/PvP

When I roll P/D thief I can play keep away forever against melee targets, but that’s in wvw, it’s why I even brought this topic up. My range capability for my main playing feels heavily sufficient, things I try to kill have a hard time killing me, and cloak lets me get easy stomps.

The other thing to keep in mind though is that the thief really isn’t a thief, it has one skill “steal” for theft, and thief themed traits. But it’s really just an assassin class, and assassin classes tend to shine in PvP over PvE, the exception being against a single target with a small group, then the caster and the assassin are usually your big DPS.

PvE wise I’m not much effected by it, during Jormag I hunt the champs and then contribute DPS on the push.

Kicker.8203:

Aidal.4901:

Thief doesn’t belong in group support and buffs. We’re straight up assassins, name an mmo where the assassin dolled out buffs like he’s a paladin/priest type.

That’s bullkitten. People didn’t ask for AoE heals on thief but some kind of support like granting endurance to nearby allies via traits or simply granting 150power/ferocity AoE or something which every other profession has one of. Vulnerability would be also nice for pve if it wasn’t capped at max all the time.

And there are also multiple traitline to choose from. Not all of them are about assassination.

If you’re traveling in a group then you should be rolling TotC, which grants 10s of might/fury/swiftness to everyone near by.

If you’re not traveling with a group you should be rolling TotC because 20% extra crit is nothing to scoff at.

Also, we have what every other profession doesn’t, supreme single target burst. Yes all classes have a burst but the thief is one of the most effective, and has a monopoly on coverage to boot. With access to at least one, up to five shadow steps at any time, cloak on demand, and high powered fast attacks, wanting us to output buffs is just silly. It’s simply not our job. We fit the description of an assassin, our class is even based off the assassin from GW1.

I feel like the main issue forum goers have with thief is that its called “thief”, if it was called assassin it probably wouldn’t raise such a stink.

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Dancing_Dagger Ranged attack, it might be puny, but it’s ranged.

If you want false technicality there you go. But when it comes to meta the ranged aspect of the pistol offhand is completely overlooked by its usage as in utility. And Meta is the only thing that does/should matter since it revolves around choosing the superior choice.

But I’ll bow out man.You win, I won’t argue. We done, and I won’t visit this thread again.

Sir Vincent III.1286:

Aidal.4901:

@Vincent

I’m proving D/D needs to be reworked, because as it stands D/P is outright better, but adjusting the 4 and 5 would literally shatter a lot of the meta. OP needs to get her priorities straight.

That’s the point all along — D/P is so much better, nobody is arguing that it isn’t, so I’m not so sure what you’re arguing against…you need to make sense.

OP’s major beef as that D/P isn’t a melee class soley because of D/P 3. Completely ignoring everything else about D/P.

I was calling OP out for being poorly informed, and even educating them on how to structure an argument.

You can go back to whatever you were doin’ man. My pet peeve is when people just don’t argue right, debates and things should be fun and factual.

http://metabattle.com/wiki/Build:Thief_-_D/P_Roamer

Rolling a variant on that. I know what I’m about.

Jana.6831:

Look up the skills: SS does more damage.
Usual D/D combo: CnD + steal, BS
Usual D/P combo: SS + steal, BS

Edit: ² In case of D/P I would imagine making traits that give them some of the utility they have now back – so probably the blind, unblockable or the damage SS does. They’d have to sacrifice some of their traitslots to either get back the utility they have now or chose different traits = they have less utility on their weaponset.

Almost every thief I know rolls Mug, making steal break cloak not provide it. So the chain of SS>Steal>BS does not work.

Usual thief openings I see are black powder, HS+Steal, this does about the same damage CnD+Steal would do.

Shadow shot is often canceled if a thief is in cloak because it’s a two part attack, the actual “attack” would interrupt backstab, the shot itself does nothing.

@Vincent

I’m proving D/D needs to be reworked, because as it stands D/P is outright better, but adjusting the 4 and 5 would literally shatter a lot of the meta. OP needs to get her priorities straight.

Jana.6831:

Look up the skills: SS does more damage.
Usual D/D combo: CnD + steal, BS
Usual D/P combo: SS + steal, BS

Edit: ² In case of D/P I would imagine making traits that give them some of the utility they have now back – so probably the blind, unblockable or the damage SS does. They’d have to sacrifice some of their traitslots to either get back the utility they have now or chose different traits = they have less utility on their weaponset.

Almost every thief I know rolls Mug, making steal break cloak not provide it. So the chain of SS>Steal>BS does not work.

Usual thief openings I see are black powder, HS+Steal, this does about the same damage CnD+Steal would do.

Shadow shot is often canceled if a thief is in cloak because it’s a two part attack, the actual “attack” would interrupt backstab, the shot itself does nothing.

@Vincent

I’m proving D/D needs to be reworked, because as it stands D/P is outright better, but adjusting the 4 and 5 would literally shatter a lot of the meta. OP needs to get her priorities straight.

Jana.6831:

Aidal.4901:

You could form your argument a bit better?

Sure I can: If you have no idea how to use that weaponset then why are you even trying to tell me that I’m wrong?!

Literally highlighted strengths and weaknesses and you say that.

lemme be blunt, D/D lacks utility, so its horrible. Even if 3 was removed entirely, D/P still has a stun and cloak on demand answer these two with a yes or no, nothing more.

Does D/D have a stun?

Does D/D have cloak on demand?

Jana.6831:

Then I can’t help you.

You could form your argument a bit better? That might help me. From the D/D standpoint, the reason I turned away from it is because of the utility options specifically.

one: CnD requires a target, this makes it an okay opener, but horrible utility as I cannot cloak when required to disengage from opponents or simply relieve myself of some pressure.

two: With Impacting Disruption, head shot has the potential to be a rather nice spike in addition to an interrupt, on that topic, the lack of interrupt or disruption abilities D/D has.

Those two facts alone tell me that D/P edges out, but no, your argument seems to be entirely based around Shadow shot being some sort of game swaying move, at least thus far.

Jana.6831:

D/P isn’t melee – try D/D for a bit and realize that the gap closer 3 offers you a completely different playstyle which isn’t melee.

I’m confused, the source of my damage is a melee attack. Specifically, with this patch it’s dagger AA.

Two: I don’t even use shadow shot. The pistol is literally in my offhand for the cloak accessibility, Shadow shot doesn’t merit enough damage to be useful to me, if I want blind I have blinding powder for that.

But lets look at that statement, specifically “gap closer” is traditionally used by melee primaries to get close enough to deliver melee damage. Guardian’s have it in Leap of faith and Judges intervention, Warriors have Rush, Eviscerate, Savage Leap, elementalists have ride the lightning and Lightning flash, etc.. etc.

Thieves have Shadow step, steal, Infiltrator’s Signet, Infiltrator’s Strike, and shadow shot.

So your complaint is that the pistol offers a more readily available melee attacks. Removing shadow shot won’t affect the overall advantage D/P has though, You’re fighting over the wrong thing.

Varezenem.2813:

Well assuming his info is right and you are doing 10-11k damage on heavy armored without any other damage reduction you would be hitting 4~4.2k on him.

Crit wise, yes, my AA chain did that. But those numbers aren’t from a single attack.

Low balling my opener, it’s 200 damage for BP, which doesnt always connect

1.2k steal damage, 870ish HS. (Exposed weakness for 10% more damage)

I’ve got might/fury at this point, 80% crit for the next 10 seconds, backstabs are easy to get, it’s about 6-7k on the backstab after Exposed weakness/crit damage bonus.

At this point I would HS’d again and then rode the rest out with AA to reapply poison and enjoy the damage jumps of Exposed weakness and Executioner together, occasionally HSing with increased damage.

All of that fits within the range of about 2-2 1/2 seconds, and it is/was my traditional opener. The new AA buff removed HS from being dropped as often, leaving more initiative open to me.

So I probably missed a lot, because I only read the first page. But OP is saying that D/P isn’t melee?

Traditional D/P opener is 5>2f1 to lock into melee range, then just beat the tar out of the target with whatever comes to mind, Shadow shot is only used to catch a target, not as any form of real DPS, that is usually AA spam and HS.

Also OP says “nerf D/P” but doesn’t provide any further information? As it stands right now the main DPS for D/P is about the same for D/D, both use AA and Heart seeker as the primary output.

This topic seems poorly conceived thus far, and until it gets some sort of set track needs to chill.

Manimarco Devil.1790:

Aidal.4901:

Necros have had unblockable marks for a while so that’s eh.

My guardian/dh revolved around shelling out burn, burn wasn’t changed, so I’m fine.. Only boon I have at any time is fury. Adapt man.

Yes they have had unblockable marks for a while but necros usually skill spam things for no reason, a good necro can make shelter never work. Furthermore its the fact that they make f3 active useless and chill became stronger that I dislike them.

I am surprised you still even use burn guard. It only applies one condition and if anything HoT brought even more cleanses to every class. How do you plan on beating a druid, engi, mesmer, tempest (even with new DS), necro plague signet etc? Granted it is somewhat readily re-applicable but they should kill you if they know what is going on.

It applies one very powerful condition, and rapidly (every three hits, plus AoE burn so his friends can get in on this action.) nine times out of ten Judges intervention with WW and ToF (No cast time so it can be dropped anytime, and its unblockable CC(traited) so it can jar them out of defenses) takes down near everything a few pegs. I’ve actively oneshot thieves with it even after the buff they got.

Problem is people see burn as one condition. But it’s the only condition I know that I can actively drop 1-3k+ per tick on with relative ease, and guardi pumps it out far faster than a single class can cleanse it

Fair enough, but name an escape the ranger has for that situation. Point blank shot will likely trip an auto-break passive, hunters shot is just a poor mans cloak that the thief readily has access too.

Lightning reflexes? Thief has Roll for initiative and Withdraw, entangle? The Ranger forums are already saying Entangle is too easy to counter in this meta.

I’m not saying the ranger does not have options, mind you. But it has a more limited window, with even less effective uses. A PP thief can pulse blind to mitigate some damage, has access to up to three escapes(withdraw, RFI, Shadow step). Plus steadfast refusal to weapon swap when in melee range would get any class killed

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

Aidal.4901:

…Also any 2v1 scenario is going to be death if it’s against half skilled thieves.

It wasn’t before.

My initial spike of damage is unchanged, and I’m moderate at best.

Light armor: 11-14k opener.
Medium armor: 11-13k opener.
Heavy armor: 10-11k opener.

If two thieves are attacking in rough tandem and applying pressure as they should, only necro/warrior would survive the initial burst. I dunno what thieves you were fighting against, but if they got greedy to stick around to be counter burst they probably weren’t very good.

Doggie.3184:

It’s not about keeping up with melee, it’s about it actually being useful/possible. Although our Ranged weapons are designed to be in Melee range to be effective anyways so with that logic maybe they should be on par. But that’s just it~ why? Why are SB and Pistol/Dagger close ranged ranged weapons? P/P is the only thing pure range and the AA is awful and forces #3 spam. It also has no AoE (anymore) and limited to 900 distance (again) because they deleted all it’s traits and made nothing baseline.

Yeah, but all ranged AA’s are awful when you look at the other options. Again I feel like your opinion here is facing a single target, and then just standing there pressing 1. That’s just not an effective way to face anything.

If you shake things up with the cloak though, sneak attack has damage comparable to rapid fire and more on demand than it (revealed for like 3s? vs ranger 8s cool down if traited, you have access to 2-3 cloaks on demand, overtaking Rapid fire within the timeframe)

And as covered for PvE, most rangers worth their salt for damage fire one rapid fire, then switch to GS for superior AA damage.

As far as why they’re such close ranged weapons is likely due to balance the coverage I pointed out earlier. A thief can close 3,100 units of range in three keystrokes without actually moving, and then retreat 1,200 units to prevent retaliation. If you give a thief higher range than what it has currently, all you’re doing is increasing its coverage without giving it a draw back. And if I can deliver two, (four-five if you use your cloaks for sneak attack) salvos of a rapid fire-esque attack, then literally dodge backward once to avoid all retaliation, or even just use shadow step completely out of range, I have the advantage of both burst output and placement, you’d literally be the supreme ranged attacker.

And burst damage wise I think the thief is right now, the supreme attacker even in range.

Yeah the aa is weak, but as me and Dahkeus highlighted, that’s the system not just the thief, nearly all ranged attack aa’s are less than stellar. Thief makes up for that department through its rotations and skills, just like every other class.

If you want your ranged buff then you have to be fair to the other classes to. Ranger longbow is probably the worst ranged aa I’ve seen in the game. PvE wise it has no redeeming quality and pvp unless you’re floating about 900-1000 range it’s stupidly easy to avoid. And any closer you may as well use the great sword

I stopped using longbow on my ranger in favor of axe/horn with gs. Better dps and in pve I can almost instantly build up to 25 might through strength of the pack/heal as one

I guess what I’m getting at is the ranged system as a whole needs an overhaul before it makes sense to boost thieves range. Either that or thief has to lose some manuvering, it wouldn’t be fair to give rapid escapes and high damage

I feel it’s important to add that I’m not attacking or belittling anyone, but it just feels like a lot of players are ignoring the bigger picture of things.

I think it’s because grenades overlay more often in close combat then they do at distance for engie. Ele is the only class with a decent ranged attack (staff fire is one of if not the highest dps) and base necro gets most of its damage from traits/wells.

Strictly speaking for pve then, most rangers I know say the same thing, rapid fire then switch to gs, putting the ranger in the same situation as the thief, so strictly speaking for pve the system is not thief range is weak so much as all ranged attack systems are weak.

Not debating your point just clarifying it further

Yeah sorry, insomnia, haven’t slept in 24 hrs.

Right now as someone in the wvw forums said, the meta is Pirate shipping, lighter classes, ranged attacks, Aoe spam, literally what the thief is excellent at countering.

I was getting semi creamed by thief ambushes on every class but my Dh/burn guard. Mainly because I use test of faith defensively, I’m traited to drop a second one on stun (as well as stun break) both of these traps inflict daze, so it disrupts them, once that’s done I just go defensive, my traps have similar cd to the basi-venom, so if it’s a fight reset they want they’ll get it.

Yeah, thief is strong right now, yes the buff contributed, but also the current meta has as well.

Also any 2v1 scenario is going to be death if it’s against half skilled thieves.

as it stands right now, though. The thief sort of “jack of all trades” it’s ranged combat, buffing it would put it in danger of overtaking other classes that are primarily focused around ranged combat.

A thief can cover up to 3,100 range, (sensibly, shadow step, agility signet, steal for the point blank) and retreat 1,200 in an instant. The field of movement gives it an advantage no class has. Technically speaking I can cloak, venom, ambush a ranger with a stealth attack, drop barrage and step away and cloak again with almost 0 retaliation.

And that’s p/p, with not even full zerk that’s about 10k damage overall, rapid fire can’t do that, and it’s on the ranger class.

Everyone is going to play thieves for a while. Also backstabbing is still very in, it’s the face stab that’s rendered obsolete. I dunno anyone stupid enough to lose an up to 11k damage strike in favor of 6-7k interruptible chain.

Is thief easy mode? No, just everyone thinks it is, a full zerk thief will literally melt to any class that can get a decent stare at it, even with Bali-venom.

Rukia.9860:

Aidal.4901:

Thief doesn’t belong in group support and buffs. We’re straight up assassins, name an mmo where the assassin dolled out buffs like he’s a paladin/priest type.

It’s like people don’t know how to place a character archetype.

Rift.

You can play any roll as Rogue, from assassin to a bard to a ranger to a healer. Also tank.

Rift is the closest game I could find to Guild Wars 1 where you can literally play anything as basically 1 class and has a ton of build diversity.

http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Guide_to_playing_as_an_assassin

Also i briefly looked over the meta battle and most every build is basically some form of dagger spam.

Edit: Also after looking it over, rift (all of five minutes) looks like it tried to be Ragnarok. Thing is once you’re a bard, you lack on damage, and rift seems to have a different debuff/buff system. You listed an mmo, fair enough. Now go play it.

Basically, at least to me, damage dealing has been about risk vs reward. Melee tends to have higher damage because you get in the face of the opponent. It’s easier for them to counter and punish you, traps tend to be threatening in melee, etc etc.

So why should ranged combat keep up with melee? I admit it’s lacking, but with the thief I can play melee keep away so easily that even if I had half my damage I’d still met a kill or two through sheer attrition.

Main competition for ranged damage is the ranger and now DH. In a battle of auto attack yeah, we get wrecked, but barrage is basically rapid fire with 0 cool down, I’ve never had a class outside of necro and warrior survive two consecutive barrages without some sort of defense, and thats usually due to passives.

I guess what I’m asking is why does range need a buff when it performs comparatively well with a bit of tricky use, which is if I recall what the thief is about. And why are thieves trying to dip into the side of the pool where there is a class literally made for it?