Guild Wars 2

The only honest answer to that question is:
“We don’t know, but [Insert speculation here].”

Here is the last piece of dialogue that Kormir had for us before the end of Guild Wars 1, as far as I am aware:

“Ahai, my friends. Life brings us many twists. My new station has not blinded me. My eyes have adjusted to the darkness between the stars. I sense celestial movement beyond comprehension…. Without you, none of this would be possible. You will forever be my chosen ones. If you have need of me, come to the Chantry of Secrets and kneel before my statue. I will always listen.”

Kormir sensed “celestial movement beyond comprehension.” What does that mean? We have no idea, but it could relate to the silence of the Gods in some way. We know from Arah explorable’s jotun path that the return of the Elder Dragons was foretold in the stars, so that could very well be it. Or maybe it was something else that caused the Gods to go silent? We really don’t know just yet, but we probably will later this month when Path of Fire is released.

draxynnic.3719:

What I find more interesting is that they specified that Kralkatorrik killed Glint’s Forgotten attendants. Said attendants weren’t present in Edge of Destiny, and having Forgotten still around as late as 1320AE has implications for some of the ingame lore.

The dialogue from A Study in Gold, you mean? That’s a rather good point and the dialogue does refer to the speaker as the “Last Forgotten” and the assumption up until now was that they left Tyria in one final exodus.

Leo G.4501:

In that circumstance, perhaps Springers aren’t domesticated? I haven’t seen how we get them in the game yet, but even if there are groups of Springers kept by humans, that doesn’t necessarily mean they have to go through the domestication process like our horses and cattle have. So your example of someone suggesting domesticating them hundreds of years ago might have play out more like.

“Where was that guy? He’s been missing from the village for weeks and now he comes back bouncing on that creature? Such a fool!”

“Yeah, but it jumps over trees. Looks like fun.”

Typically, this is what you get when humans try to ride wild animals that haven’t been properly domesticated to recognize humans as their masters.

It makes a great YouTube video for sure, but there’s a reason why you’ll never see Canadians riding moose around. Wild creatures don’t see humans as their masters so when a person jumps on their back they’ll react very much like how you would if some stranger jumped on your back out of nowhere.

Of course, there is also the point you brought up about whether rangers could tame wild animals en masse somehow to turn them into mounts without centuries of domestication. To that, I have no answer because we have no concrete limitations to prove that rangers can’t do what you’re suggesting.

It really is an odd series of events if you consider how far apart Orr is from Cantha (See Map). The only way I could wrap my head around it is if the gods leading humanity at the time met with some of the representatives from other elder races (mursaat, forgotten, dwarves, seers, jotun, etc.) and they told the gods that all of the lands to the north were occupied, then pointed at Cantha to the far south and said, “There’s some good land over there, go settle that.” Not wanting to risk open war immediately, the gods and their human followers complied, opening a portal straight to Cantha.

But since we’re on the topic of inconsistencies….

Year 0 BE: The New Age Begins With a Bang
[…]
Once Abaddon is imprisoned, the Forgotten—a mysterious race of advanced snakefolk who have allied with the gods—serve as Abaddon’s jailers to prevent him from doing any more damage.

Compare this to the timeline of the GW:N Manuscript, p.18

174 AE: Serpents (The Forgotten) leave the world of men, settling in the Crystal Desert.

I suppose we could work around this inconsistency by saying that in the year 0 BE, some of the Forgotten begin working as Abaddon’s jailers as part of their alliance with the gods but it isn’t until 174 AE that they “leave the world of men” en masse and settle in the Crystal Desert to join the ones who were already there guarding Abaddon’s prison.

Next point:

452 AE: There’s a Nasty Bug Going Around
[…]
Though the plague subsides in 456 AE, the suffering it causes ends the Primeval Dynasty, kicking off nearly 200 years of civil war, pretender kings, and lawlessness.

Again, compare this to the Nightfall manuscript:

452 AE: Scarab Plague sweeps through Elona, decimates the population, and wipes out the Royal House. Istan abandoned. End of the Primeval Kings.
456 AE: End of the Plague Years. Admun Kolos takes the throne, founding the Great Dynasty.
583 AE: Collapse of the Great Dynasty. Start of the Pretender Wars and the Shattered Dynasty Era.
640 AE: Last of the Shattered Dynasties collapse. Elona emerges as three allied provinces—Kourna, Istan, and Vabbi.

So really, it’s unfair to describe those 200 years of history as “nearly 200 years of civil war, pretender kings, and lawlessness.” There was Admun Kolos who started the Great Dynasty that ruled for 127 years. The Shattered Dynasties Era only lasted 57 years, so I think that it’s a gross oversimplication of Elonian history to lump them all together in that way. I’m sure Admun Kolos’s dynasty did a good job of holding the kingdom together for the most part if historians later referred to it as the “Great” dynasty.

Moving on, though.

640 AE: Regrouped, Restored, and Ready to Move Forward
After enduring two centuries of lesser kings and brutal warlords […]

Again, I don’t think it’s fair to reduce that 184 year period in history to “two centuries of lesser kings and brutal warlords.” Yes, you had the Shattered Dynasties Era that lasted 57 years, but you also had the Great Dynasty ruling for 127 years and many historians would probably consider Admun Kolos more than a “lesser king.”

That’s all the hair splitting that I need to do for now.

Konig Des Todes.2086:

-More Fairly Good Points-

I could see wild raptors hunting in packs, being the intelligent creatures they are, but what about raptors raised in captivity since birth?

From what we saw on Aksim’s farm, the raptors there are kept in stables like horses and fed meals of hunted crab and cave beast meat by farmhands. Yes, one could argue that they are taught to hunt by catching fireflies, but just think about what kind of chores Aksim has us doing.

“I could always use help gathering more food: crab meat, or meat from those filthy beasts in the tunnels.”

If the raptors are learning from a very young age that humans will provide for them then they will be much less adept at hunting than their wild counterparts. I agree entirely that teaching the raptors to hunt in packs would be a more efficient means of feeding them but that’s not how we’ve seen them treated in-game so far.

But if we were to theorize about how this process could work in reality, perhaps we could come up with a different solution? We know that Amnoon has devoted a great deal of land to agriculture. What kind of problems could the farmers have that raptors could solve? What if these farms attract colonies of pest species that produce rapidly, eat the same food that humans eat, and contain lots of nice, juicy meat? Every day, the cavaliers and raptor farmers could herd their raptors up and lead them over to the farms, making a tour of the region until they’ve hunted as many of these pest creatures as they can, culling their numbers and helping the agriculturalists in the process. This would help the humans because humans don’t want these pests to eat all of their hard work, but also the raptors who get their daily meal. A relationship like this could be beneficial to both parties in theory, and while it’s not nearly as good as a nice braized choya steak it might be enough to satisfy the raptors.

Aaron Ansari.1604:

If faced with a choice between a problematic mount and no mount at all… provided it is possible to feed the raptors- which, clearly, it is, or else they wouldn’t be around- I think they’re worth the trouble.

Perhaps you are right, but in which case, it would be imperative to find a better solution to feeding these creatures than the one we’ve seen in-game so far. I have faith that Amnoon will prevail in the end and find an efficient means of feeding their raptor mounted army.

Aaron Ansari.1604:

If I’m not mistaken, Seeker’s Village, the one we save in the first story instance, is entirely set aside for cultivating raptor food (and probably housing miners).

And considering we’re paying around a hundred million dollars for our military’s mounts, without an expansionist dictator parked on our borders with a much larger army? Sinking tax dollars into military equipment is a very rational thing to do.

Alright, I definitely agree with you on that point. Spending money to defend against a legitimate threat is a wise investment, but how much money exactly are we talking about? For that, I did a little research and prepared a thought experiment to help visualize how much meat an army of raptor cavaliers might need in order to maintain their military advantage.

Let’s suppose for a moment that the fictional city of Amnoon is supported by a network of raptor farms much like the one at Seeker’s Village. If each farm is run like the one up north then we can assume that the average raptor is fed a diet of hunted crab and cave beast meat along with the occasional large fish, perhaps even a chicken. In order for the cavalry division of Amnoon’s army to have any noticeable military impact against the armies that Palawa Joko can field, we can assume that they’ll need a few hundred of the beasts at least, say three hundred mounted cavaliers. This really isn’t that large, all things considered. Ancient armies were able to field thousands of cavalry units such as at the Battle of Qarqar where one side had a thousand riders on camels alone.

But alright, let’s say that Amnoon has a cavalry unit of 300 raptors. Raptors are obviously some kind of dinosaur, and our most updated understanding about dinosaurs is that they may have been warm-blooded (which is obviously up for debate, but this does affect how much they eat). Since we don’t have any living dinosaurs to study, I’m going to use the diet of an adult lion to estimate how much meat our raptors would have to consume which is around 10-25lbs/day—let’s say 20lbs/day since some of our raptors are active and out on patrol, carrying people around.

300 raptors x 20lbs/day = 6000lbs/day of pure meat, or 2721.55kg/day

In order to visualize this, let’s convert this arbitrary number into cows. A 1200lb steer can yield 490 lbs of boneless, trimmed beef. That’s 12 and a quarter cows per day just to feed the raptors alone. In a year’s time, you would have to find a way to get your hands on 4470 cows worth of meat per year… and that’s just to feed a small cavalry unit of 300 raptors, not even the infantry supporting them or the cavaliers riding them.

If a raptor could provide the military firepower of a Lockheed Martin F-35 Lightning II then that would be an absolutely amazing investment, but unfortunately, Amnoon engineers haven’t found a way to make their raptors fire anti-ballistic lasers or drop bombs from the sky (yet…).

In summary, I would suggest to the Amnoon city council that the tactical advantage of riding a large reptile with a spiky club tail is actually not worth it. Being able to field larger numbers of cavalry units is, and they would be able to equip more of their army with mounts if they were using well-tempered herbivores that are willing to eat food scraps, hay, and other unwanted fodder instead of meat, which is the most expensive food type.

I suppose it really depends on how the process of domestication works for Tyrians, but if they’re anything close to real world techniques then there are a few questions left unanswered.

In our world, there are certain factors behind why some animals can never be domesticated. The animal needs to be able to eat a lot of different things and be willing to live off the scraps of humans, which means that having numerous large, carnivorous predators (I.e. Raptors) is probably not in a tribe’s best interests unless they have access to a lot of unwanted meat.

Woulkitten oon’s city council be able to convince the population that their tax dollars are being put to good use feeding the city guard’s raptors, or would each cavalier be responsible for keeping their raptors fed by constantly hunting? Either way, it’s a lot more work than keeping mounts that are willing to eat whatever scraps are already being thrown away by Amnoon’s farms.

We haven’t seen the highlands map yet where the springers come from so it’s possible that the highlander way of life is somehow reliant on this ability to leap up cliffs quickly. In which case, I suppose it would make sense for them to keep the creatures around. It would have to be a very strong reason though since they’re sacrificing the ability to carry lots of heavy objects, which would be an important trait for merchants or farmers to have.

Dante.1763:

Athrenn.9468:

One might argue that horses were domesticated in the past but we have none today, but that seems rather unlikely. The way people speak about horses in the books suggests a living familiarity that can only be earned by living in a society where domesticating horses is as mundane as real world societies.

—Some Fairy Good Points—

I considered that as well, and maybe the narrator really is breaking the fourth wall for the reader’s sake, but that’s typically not how fantasy authors write in third person limited. They might come up with a phrase like “as shaggy as a Wintersday dolyak” to refer to someone who is extremely hairy and unkempt. However, what they don’t do is refer to things that don’t exist within that universe because third person limited is defined by the range of thoughts that the viewpoint character would be thinking.

If the viewpoint character compares someone’s appearance to that of a horse, I would personally take that as a sign that they’re familiar with them because their thoughts immediately go back to horses. Of course, you might be right and maybe these characters are familiar with museum images and stories of horses. I suppose it doesn’t really matter in the end, but I just like the idea that there are a lot more horses off screen than what we see in the game.

The asura gate thing is actually explained in the books where this particular gate was broken so its end point was fluctuating between random destinations that had no gate. It just deposited them through an unstable portal that collapsed almost immediately after, offering no return.

Dante.1763:

Athrenn.9468:

Or perhaps even… a horse?

I honestly think horses are extinct in the GW universe and have been for sometime now, its the only way i can fathom that we havent seen a single one in game…anywhere.

Perhaps not in game, but in the novels there are definitely indications that they exist.

“Hail, house of Stegalkin!” came a shout at the door. A norn warrior thrust his head in—long hair like a horse’s tail and a face like what might be beneath.

King, J. Robert. Guild Wars: Edge of Destiny (p. 8.). Pocket Books. Kindle Edition.

Logan and Caithe shielded their faces. Only as their eyes adjusted could they see what strobed within the archway. Visions. Beautiful visions . . . a grassy plain where wild horses ran . . .

King, J. Robert. Guild Wars: Edge of Destiny (p. 97). Pocket Books. Kindle Edition.

The arena welled with cheers as a centaur strode from one of the arena gates. The massive figure had shaggy hooves and a body like a plow horse. His upper torso was muscular and topped with a horned head like a ram’s.

King, J. Robert. Guild Wars: Edge of Destiny (p. 161). Pocket Books. Kindle Edition.

The centaur drew forth a quarterstaff fitted with a scythe, the grawl lifted a mace encrusted with obsidian shards, and the ettin raised a club the size of a horse’s leg.

King, J. Robert. Guild Wars: Edge of Destiny (p. 162). Pocket Books. Kindle Edition.

The ship tossed beneath him like a horse testing its reins, and the thick smell of smoke clogged his nostrils.

Soesbee, Ree. Guild Wars: Sea of Sorrows (p. 60). Pocket Books. Kindle Edition.

So horses obviously do exist in lore and characters don’t treat them as long dead, mythological creatures. There are even wild ones roaming the fields probably somewhere in Kryta according to what Logan and Caithe saw through the asura gate. Then we have references to plow horses and horses wearing reins which we couldn’t have unless people had domesticated horses.

One might argue that horses were domesticated in the past but we have none today, but that seems rather unlikely. The way people speak about horses in the books suggests a living familiarity that can only be earned by living in a society where domesticating horses is as mundane as real world societies.

I don’t think that the existence of the springer is nearly as strange as the fact that the local cultures would have chosen to domesticate them thousands of years ago in favour of sturdier looking beasts.

If you were to look at the origin of dromedary camel domestication for example, this is a process that would have began a very long time ago, probably since the first humans settled in the desert. At what point did our ancestors look at these strange kangaroo mouse mutants and think “Now that, brothers and sisters, would make for a glorious beast of burden!”

Personally, I suspect that this person would have been kicked out of the tribe to live with the wild kangaroo mice until one of them ate him.

In fact, I would think that the cultures of the region would look better riding something quadrupedal with a sturdier frame that can bear lots of weight for transporting goods. There’s a reason why real world cultures chose creatures that all look similar to each other: donkeys, oxen, horses, mules, camels, elephants. They have four legs and strong frames, and that is the perfect physical trait for a creature that would be bearing a lot of weight.

But alright, we’re in a fantasy world you might say so not all beasts of burden need to necessarily be mammals with four legs. That’s a perfectly valid argument and so I would suggest creating designs that mimic the same general traits that real world domesticated beasts of burden and mounts possess.

A giant quadrupedal lizard, for example.

Or devourers!

Or perhaps even… a horse?

It’s possible that game developers are worried about having their worlds appear too mundane by having their mounts look like ones from the real world, but I think that a setting with a plausible range of domesticated creatures looks a whole lot more consistent, and dare I add, straight up sexy just by making their world feel more alive where humans make intelligent decisions that real people would make.

Well, I would actually have to agree with something that you said two years ago:

Old, established lore are the pillars of a continuing story. A poor writer does retroactive continuities. A good writer works in a way to explain why old ‘facts’ became ‘lies’ and uses that to boost the story. A great writer puts in what they want while not destroying the established pillars of the story.

I don’t think that they actually intended to shift the date of the pivotal beginning of the Guild Wars so dramatically when they inserted that line of the Orrian History Scrolls into the game, but it would be very nice of them if they did take the time to address this discrepancy because it does rewrite the narrative significantly and changes the course of history.

@Konig, you’re absolutely right about the Schessler thing. Not only that, but Saul’s original last name was Botolf in the same story you’re referring to. My guess would be that Schessler sounded too much like a kitten German name and they wanted to distance themselves from real world comparisons between the White Mantle and kitten Germany. I don’t know if Saul’s name change from Botolf to D’Alessio is canon but I always thought it would be neat if he did give himself a new name to go along with his transformation, sort of like how some historical individuals were given “holy names” after becoming a king or a saint.

As for your and Hyrule’s argument that the war they were referring to was actually the third war? Hmm…. I might have been able to buy it if the error was isolated within one game manual, but I would find it really strange if the writing team didn’t catch it for three manuals in a row.

Prophecies:
“1013AE: Guild Wars begin.”

Factions:
“1013AE: The first Guild Wars begin.”

Nightfall:
“1013AE: The Guild Wars begin in Ascalon.”

If it were an isolated incident I might chalk it up to a coincidence/writing error, but three times in a row? I’d have to call that a pattern of some sort. It really does look like 1013AE was originally meant to be the start of the wars as a whole as far as the original game writers were concerned.

Of course, I don’t suppose there’s much else we can say about the matter until we get a dev response. We have sources within the lore that disagree with each other so one of them is obviously a writing error, but it’s really up to them which way they want the narrative to go.

I’m just going to side-step the whole Mazdak/Kryta’s founding discussion for one moment to bring up another quote that I missed when I was reading through the manuscripts the other day. It does seem to elucidate the original writing team’s perspective of the Guild Wars more than any other document.

Taken from pages 38-40 from the Prophecies game manual:

The Orrians were a peaceful people, hoping only to do their duty toward their gods and content to be rewarded in either this life or the next. When the guilds began feuding, Orr as a nation tried to stay out of the conflict. This was not the sort of struggle that entire kingdoms got involved in. But when the strife overflowed into armed conflict, and guilds from the other human nations began fighting in the streets of Arah, Orr rose to defend itself and the city of the gods. Soon after Orr mobilized its armies, Kryta and Ascalon did as well, and what had started as a dispute between localized groups became an all-out war. The Guild Wars raged for nearly fifty years. ((Highlighted for emphasis)) During that time, none of the three human empires [were] able to assert dominance over either of the other two.

[…]

At first, Orr was saved from much of the fighting. The guilds with allegiances to Ascalon and Kryta withdrew, heading back to defend their homes. Orr regrouped, granted a moment to prepare simply because they were farther south.

This does appear to be in line with what most of the Orrian History Scrolls tells us:

Records state that public opinion began to go against their leaders, believing the guilds to be stronger than their local governments. The nation of Orr, however, believed itself favored of the gods. The Orrians stayed neutral in the face of the larger war. But Ascalon and Kryta brought their war to the nation. Orr rose to defend itself, escalating the conflict and resulting in casualties that eclipsed those of the previous two Guild Wars combined.

Taking all of this into account, I would still have to say that the original concept of the Guild Wars, at least at the time of GW1’s writing was only intended to be a conflict that lasted approximately half a century.

Approximate timeline of events:
1.) Abaddon’s Mouth erupts; humans discover the shards and conflict begin between guilds “fueled by the desire for power and the influence of the Bloodstones” according to Lamount’s History of Tyria. I would argue that the first recorded signs of conflict begin in 1013AE.
2.) Before the year 1020AE, the Second Guild War has already ended with Ascalon believed to be victorious according to the Historical Monument of Surmia.
3.) There is a brief respite from the conflict until the guilds grew so bold that fighting broke out in the city of Arah. The Kingdom of Orr entered the war officially at this point and the whole nature of the conflict escalated from a “dispute between localized groups” into an “all-out war.” It was only at this point that all three nations of Orr, Ascalon, and Kryta officially entered the Guild Wars and the third series of conflicts began.

Now, I’m willing to acknowledge that the story is constantly evolving and subject to being rewritten by the writers of Guild Wars 2. However, I think it should at least be acknowledged that at the time of Guild Wars 1’s writing, the wars do seem to have been scheduled to begin as a whole in the year 1013AE according to all three manuscripts and last for approximately half a century. To me, it doesn’t sound like a conflict that spanned across centuries with hundreds of years in between.

I see what you’re saying, Aaron, and I think that it does have some merit.

The site that later became Lion’s Arch could have been the same location that Doric picked for his palace/summer estate/what-have-you at some point before the year of his death. A few hundred years later, Elona tries to expand across the sea and colonizes the site of Doric’s original settlement, claiming it as their own and naming it Lion’s Arch. News of Elona’s expansion into “Orrian” land reaches the city of Arah and the King of Orr launches a naval assault to reclaim it. This assault is led by the King’s own son, Mazdak who leads the war between Orr and “Kryta”, which was at this point a loosely held colony of Elona. The Elonian colonists bow down to Mazdak, accepting him as their new king.

Or for a condensed version of events:
1) Doric settles the southern coast of Kryta before his death
2) Elona tries to colonize Doric’s original settlements
3) Orr launches a fleet to reclaim lost land from Elona led by Mazdak
4) Orr is victorious and the Elonian colonists accept Mazdak as their king

What do you think, would this theory hold water and account for most of the established facts?

I would agree with Aaron that there does seem to be a discrepancy here, and the old Wiki page for King Doric still claims that:

During his lifetime, King Doric oversaw the expansion of humanity into Ascalon and the beginnings of Kryta, though the latter did not become an official settlement until 300 AE. He had a summer estate in Lion’s Arch.

Since we’re debating the veracity of some of these statements I wouldn’t take the Wiki’s claim at face value but I would still like to see the primary sources which the author must have based their claims on.

According to the author of this Wiki article, Doric began expanding into Kryta during his lifetime and had a summer estate in what would late become known as Lion’s Arch. However, they seem to believe that Kryta was not an “official settlement” (what does that even mean…?) until the year 300AE.

Does anyone know where in the lore this Wiki author is basing their claims on? I’d like to review the primary source of the claim that A.) Lion’s Arch was the site of Doric’s summer estate, and B.) Doric oversaw the expansion into Kryta, yet never “officially” colonized it.

I think we might be getting a little off-topic from the original post, but that’s my own fault so I don’t mind continuing on this tangent.

Assuming that you’re referring to the asura named Macha from the novel, I brought up the book on my Kindle app and did a quick word search to see if I could find exactly which line you were talking about. I could find no mention of King Doric at all or any reference to Lion’s Arch being founded by his son. What I did find was this quote on pages 92-93 saying:

With a bored noise, Macha yawned. “What the human’s not telling you, Centurion, is that the nations of Orr and Kryta were at war when Lion’s Arch was built. That’s why they put it behind the natural fortifications of those stone escarpments.

Soesbee, Ree. Guild Wars: Sea of Sorrows (pp. 92-93). Pocket Books. Kindle Edition.

Using the word search function on my e-book, I could find no use of the name “Doric” throughout the book at all, so is it possible that you’re remembering something from a different source that corroborates this alleged fact?

Based on the evidence that I’ve collected, I think it’s safe to assume that Lion’s Arch was indeed founded during a time period where Kryta and Orr were at war. However, whether Mazdak is Doric’s son is something that I’ve seen no source on. He has been called a “royal son of Orr” by the ghost of Captain Bragen in the sylvari personal story quest Dead of Winter. In this same quest he is also said to be the founder of Kryta.

This may sound like an awful lot of hair-splitting, but I think that it’s important for us to split hairs if we are to establish an honest timeline of events.

Was Mazdak actually Doric’s son, or the son of another king of Orr? He is certainly recognized by one of his captains as a “royal son” so unless Bragen’s dialogue is to be called into question as well (which I see no reason for, giving him the benefit of the doubt), we can at least be sure that Mazdak was a member of the Orrian royal family. This still doesn’t tell us his parentage though so unless I’m mistaken, we don’t actually know when Mazdak settled Kryta. All we really know is that he was a prince of Orr, so the son of an Orrian king somewhere down the line.

This would expand the range of dates that could be ascribed to Kryta’s founding significantly since we’re no longer looking at a direct son of King Doric himself but rather a son of some unnamed Orrian king.

I think you know that Mazdak’s account is inherently biased. It’s even listed as a recognized lore discrepancy on the GW2 Wiki:

Mazdak (during Dead of Winter) states that “When the human race was as young as [the Sylvari race], I conquered these lands and named them Kryta!” This conflicts with gw1:Timeline, which states “205 BE: Humans appear on the Tyrian continent.” and “786 BE: Humans appear in Cantha for the first time”.
The issue was recognized and addressed by Angel McCoy. Due to technical challenges of changing this being too expensive at this stage, the discrepancy is being chalked up to “Mazdak being really old and crusty, and rewriting history in his own mind”.

@Konig, I think that there is still one major piece of evidence that makes it even more unlikely that Kryta and Ascalon could have been at war with each other in the year 100AE, though admittedly I forgot to include it in my original post and only edited it in after yours. To quote myself:

“Kryta was only founded as a colony of Elona in the year 300AE and became an independent nation in 358. Ascalon itself was a fairly young nation, having only been founded in the year 100BE after the high-plains settlements East of the Shiverpeaks united under King Doric. I find it even more unlikely that Kryta and Ascalon could have been at war in the year 100AE when Kryta hadn’t even come into existence yet until 358.”

As the name implies, a “Guild War” would require guilds to exist, but if the nation of Kryta was not in existence yet then it would be impossible for there to be Krytan guilds until the year 358AE when the nation gained independence. Before then, the coast was settled by Elona and therefore any guilds (if the guild system was even in place back then) would have been operating under the legal jurisdiction of Elona.

So far, I haven’t found any evidence to suggest that Elona and Ascalon were ever embroiled in a major conflict so I could only assume that Kryta’s feud with Ascalon only began long after the nation gained its independence. It wouldn’t be hard to believe since the Shiverpeaks separated their nations and any wars between them would be plain foolish, especially for a young nation such as Kryta which had no reason to invade Ascalon over the mountains when they had plenty of land West of the Shiverpeaks to expand into.

@Konig, I think that you might be interpreting that article incorrectly and conflating two separate events.

On one hand you have the line: “Things were good for a time. No one race gained dominance over any other, and the world was once again at peace. Over the next hundred years, the human kingdoms prospered. Powerful groups grew up within each nation. These were known as guilds.” I would see this line as a reference to the founding of the guild system which occurred roughly one hundred years after the Exodus. This time period would be seen as a golden age for humanity, a time of peace and prosperity where guilds had time to grow and become powerful. After this, you have your second line: “As is ever the case with peace, it once again came to an end when the volcano erupted, spitting out the five stones and scattering them across Tyria.” This line is followed in the next paragraph by “The struggle for power commenced, and again war broke out.” To me, this would indicate that the Guild Wars began after the volcano erupted at some unknown date and not after the first hundred years after the Exodus.

Secondly, we have an important line from the very article you quoted that you left out: “The Guild Wars raged for decades, fueled by the desire for power and the influence of the Bloodstones.” If the Guild Wars had began one hundred years after the Exodus of the Gods then it would not have raged for “decades” but “centuries” since the first series of conflicts would have broken out over nine hundred years before the present date in Prophecies.

Finally, I find it unlikely that the Guild Wars could have gone on for over nine hundred years. This is merely an inductive argument based on my understanding of military history. If a series of conflicts had gone on for over nine hundred years then it would have been broken up by historians into multiple different wars rather than lump them together under one banner. I would find it more likely that the “decades” of war that Lamount references in his Histories of Tyria refers to the conflict that lasted between 1013-1070AE where the first two wars lasted somewhere between 1013-1020AE and the final war was the longest, stretching all the way out until 1070. This would be corroberated by the fact that the third war was said to be the worst of all three.

EDIT: Actually, I think that there is an even more persuasive piece of evidence that I forgot to include in my original post. Kryta was only founded as a colony of Elona in the year 300AE and became an independent nation in 358. Ascalon itself was a fairly young nation, having only been founded in the year 100BE after the high-plains settlements East of the Shiverpeaks united under King Doric. I find it even more unlikely that Kryta and Ascalon could have been at war in the year 100AE when Kryta hadn’t even come into existence yet until 358.

(You’ll note that I’m not even addressing Mazdak’s claim here since he’s been proven an unreliable source by the writers themselves. “Mazdak being really old and crusty, and rewriting history in his own mind.”)

In what year did the First Guild War begin?

This might sound like a simple question, but there are actually several discrepancies in the lore that make it difficult to pin an exact date down.

The Guild Wars Wiki Timeline states that “The Third Guild War begin in Tyria” in the year 1013AE, leaving no date for the beginning of the First and Second Guild Wars. This date was never given in the original game so I can only assume that the Wiki was updated based on the information given to us by the Orrian History Scrolls which claimed that “The third Guild War began in 1013 AE in Ascalon and Kryta.”

The Historical Monument of Surmia states that the Second Guild Wars ended in the year 1020AE with Ascalon as the victor. This date is irrelevant to my original question, but I thought that it was necessary to mention that we do have a date for the end of the Second Guild War that can be used to help narrow down an answer.

Now, this is where things get tricky. On page 34 of the original Guild Wars: Prophecies game manual, the timeline states that the “Guild Wars begin” in the year 1013AE. This is further corroborated by the Guild Wars: Nightfall game manual which states on page 28 that “The Guild Wars begin in Ascalon” in the year 1013 AE, and even furthermore in the Guild Wars: Factions manual which states quite clearly on page 24 that “The first Guild Wars begin” in the year 1013 AE.

All three of the listed game manuals can be downloaded right here from the original game’s official website for anyone who wants to check my primary sources.

In my opinion, this would appear to be a discrepancy in the game’s lore where the author of the Orrian History Scrolls made a slight error when writing the document. With so many pieces of text to manage I can certainly understand the difficulty in tracking down every small detail to make sure that there are no errors. If that is the case, then could we please have the document changed in-game so that we can edit the Wiki’s timeline accordingly?

Kitiara.2706:

Town Clothing; I would still like to see these turned into Outfits that people could wear. I still don’t get why even though they were all filled out with companion parts they got released as tonics. Even if they get locked behind crafting just as a taster for people to get started with outfits.

THIS!!!

Yeah, basically this.

maxwelgm.4315:

I guess that law explains a bit better (concerning me, personally) why the story felt rushed: I suppose I could go with the PC being a psychological Juggernaut, as long as I could “participate” in knowing a bit more about how PC turned the Dream itself against a dragon.

That is definitely one way that they could have written the ending, but I had another idea for it that might also have worked:

They could have had us try to use the Dream to kill Mordremoth, but then /fail/. It is perfectly acceptable for characters to try to use a vague and mystical magic system to overcome a conflict, but they must fail, and their failure must make things worse for our heroes. It’s only a Deux ex Machina if they succeed.

Since we’re on the topic, I had an idea for how they could have written the end of HoT differently, and it involves a very large drill, an airship, and a fair bit of foreshadowing.

The writers knew that they were going to renovate Lion’s Arch before the expansion’s release, so they could have took out the Breachmaker’s drill head without anyone paying much attention to it. Then, they bring it back for the grand finale of HoT after we fail to kill Mordremoth and give us a new mission: drill into the leyline hub that Mordremoth is sitting on, redirecting it like Scarlet did in LA, and starving the mouth. The reason this ending works is that Scarlet already proved in LS1 that redirecting ley energy is possible.

“But how would we stop him from destroying the Breachmaker 2.0 like he did the rest of the fleet” you ask? Well, the Pact could have used the chak to eat away at the dragon’s roots like termites so that the ship would have been safe from ground assaults. .

The end result would be different, but at least it would have felt to me like we earned our victory. Mordremoth wouldn’t be dead, but dying? Perhaps. At the very least, it’s a step in the right direction. Most importantly, this ending ties the loose threads of previous acts together since we would actually be using the chak as a weapon.

Also, the “all dragons have a weakness” reveal could have been replaced by one where we discover how to manipulate the chak so that it sets up the climax. Furthermore, this ending doesn’t detract from their plans to send a surge of ley energy to the egg in Tarir since the Breachmaker 2.0 accomplishes just that.

@The OP: If I understand you correctly, your concern is that the ending to Heart of Thorns wasn’t satisfying. The story culminated in a climax that didn’t click with you, and in the end it felt “rushed.”

I believe that you have every right to feel that way, and you are no doubt one of many players who felt that way about the ending. However, I argue that the reasons for why the ending failed has less to do with in-world believability than it has to do with story structure, and here is why.

Mordremoth was killed by a virtual Deux ex Machina. Throughout the PS and both seasons of the LS, throughout HoT, we have learned nothing about how the Dream of Dream really works. It is a mystical phenomenon that neither the Pale Tree nor any of the sylvari firstborn could satisfactorily explain. The reason the ending didn’t jive is that it felt too convenient.

Sanderson’s First Law of Magic is a writing trope that can be used to explain why the ending to HoT didn’t work. The law states that “An author’s ability to solve conflict with magic is DIRECTLY PROPORTIONAL to how well the reader understands said magic.” This is why in Lord of the Rings we didn’t just have Gandalf fly a giant magical bird into Mordor and drop the ring into the volcano. If a magical system is mystical and vague then you can’t use it to resolve your main conflict. When you do, the ending will feel like a let down no matter how “cool” it may be in theory.

The purpose of vague and mystical magic is for ambiance or to cause problems, not to give your protagonist a tidy ending to their conflict. Unfortunately, that is exactly what happened with Mordremoth.

http://brandonsanderson.com/sandersons-first-law/

draxynnic.3719:

On the one hand, I think one reason we’re having this discussion at all is that ArenaNet didn’t make it something whose importance is there to the typical player. [. . .] While some of this is stuff that can’t be avoided while doing the story, without doing that additional research the obvious conclusion would be that Mordremoth is the focus (rather than “just” the biggest current obstacle to the real focus).

That strikes me as a problem. To me, the point of writing a story is for it to be accessible to the average player. If only the most dedicated fans will appreciate it then you’re writing it wrong. At the end of the day, ArenaNet is a business. We pay them to deliver a compelling story, and many players were unsatisfied with the current one.

draxynnic.3719:

On the other hand, I think the PC’s portrayal is actually fairly realistic, even knowing that the egg is important (although at this point the PC mostly knows the egg is important because the Pale Tree and Ogden say it is without giving a clear explanation as to why – it’s not until we reach Tarir that we get straight answers). We hear about the egg in Verdant Brink, but all we know is that it’s somewhere in the area: the Commander’s priority is on tracking down and rescuing friends while the trail is still hot rather than going on a wild goose chase. It’s made pretty clear, though, that the Commander still places a high priority on tracking Caithe and the egg down… it’s just a teensy bit lower than the more immediate (at the time) question of rescuing Destiny’s Edge.

“Realistic” is a relative term in writing. Anything can be made to sound realistic if you create a logical sequence of events that lead a certain way. I strongly believe that by this point of the story, they needed to be dropping stronger hints that suggest a plot twist at the end.

draxynnic.3719:

When we meet Ruka and find out the egg is within reach, though, it immediately becomes top priority. We didn’t “stumble upon” Caithe – we followed Ruka because we knew the trail Ruka was following lead to Caithe.

Okay, I re-read the dialogue from Prized Possessions and I can see that now. We hear news from the Pact soldiers that Caithe is in the area and immediately go to help. Fair enough, but I still feel like our protagonist is far too reactive. We only go searching for Caithe because some NPC who we happened to be talking to conveniently saw her in the area recently. I really want to see evidence that my character’s priorities are changing. If the egg is becoming more important then we need to see that by having the protagonist take an active interest in it. By the end of the story, we need to see evidence that it is now, without a doubt, their top priority. Your idea of a denoument could have solved this.

draxynnic.3719:

My expectation would be that the first thing the PC would have done afterwards would be to return to Tarir and find out what is happening – cutting off HoT without a denouement right after killing Mordremoth, however, meant ArenaNet completely failed in taking up the opportunity to foreshadow season 3 with the denouement.

Agreed.

draxynnic.3719:

Regarding inner conflict… I think it’s an ‘out of the frying pan into the fire’ situation. I’m not sure how much the biconics and the PC are truly supposed to be aware of the bigger plot being woven by Glint’s followers and the Pale Tree, but it seems to be basically that at least some of the Elder Dragons have to be killed if the legacy is going to achieve it’s objective… and the Elder Dragon that presents the biggest risk to the legacy would of course be on the top of the priority list.

But see, we all know that killing Mordremoth could have dire consequences. It’s a very popular fan theory and blatantly obvious to us, the players, so it’s frustrating when our protagonist is absolutely clueless.

draxynnic.3719:

At the bottom line, though, I’m not saying that there isn’t a lot of flaws with the storytelling for HoT and the post-Zhaitan story in general (your observation earlier regarding Chekhov’s Gun is very pertinent – we were promised E’s identity in Season 2, and we’re still waiting…). However, I don’t consider the time spent on the egg to be one of them, as the egg is at least as important as Mordremoth, and probably more so.

Oh, I don’t consider it a waste of time either. The story itself isnt bad. I just want them to tell it better.

I appreciate your well thought out post, Drax. However, I’m unfortunately going to have to ignore most of it for the time being since it’s 4 am here and I want to skip straight to the discussion of HoT’s narrative as it stands before I forget what I was about to say.

draxynnic.3719:

Moving into Act 1 of Heart of Thorns, we regularly hear word of Caithe and the egg while we’re traversing Verdant Brink. Getting the Pact on a firmer footing and rescuing lost allies are also priorities, but the egg is still a priority, if not the priority for the time being.

We know this as the players, but try to see this from the perspective of the story’s protagonist: the Pact Commander. I believe that the writers failed to heed an important rule of writing: “Show, don’t tell.”

From the protagonist’s perspective, the main priority in Sct 1 is clearly rescuing Destiny’s Edge, not the egg. During our brief encounter with Ensign Wilton in the story step ‘In Their Footsteps’, the first question we ask him is “Marshal Trahearne and Destiny’s Edge were taken prisoner. I’m trying to track them down. Do you know anything?” It is only by accident that Wilton happened to see Caithe wandering nearby, which he tells us. Our response to this is… “Caithe’s here? When did you see her? Where did she go?” This makes it sound as if Caithe and the egg are an afterthought in our protagonist’s mind.

If the protagonist doesn’t see the egg as their #1 priority then neither will we as the audience. The protagonist is who we take our cues from. What is urgent to them becomes urgent to us, and they did not demonstrate a proactive interest in the egg. This is part of why it was such a forgettable plot point.

draxynnic.3719:

Act 2 is then all about the egg until it gets deposited in Tarir. After that, the main focus switches to Mordremoth – but one of the things to keep in mind is that the Mordrem assaults on Tarir make it very obvious that the egg is simply not going to be safe until Mordremoth is removed as a threat.

Actually, our protagonist is only passively interested in the egg at the beginning of Act 2. We weren’t even taking an active interest in Caithe or the egg at this point. The only reason we found either is because we were following an exalted named Ruka who allowed us to stumble upon Caithe where we witness the scuffle between her and Faolain. This is a huge problem because what we essentially have is a weak protagonist. The Pact Commander is a passive figure whom others are acting upon in this story arc. We do not seek out the egg; it seeks us.

Returning to my original point, the writers are telling us that the egg is important when they should be showing us that it is by having our protagonist take an active interest in its recovery. A protagonist [I]must[/I] by proactive, and their goals and desires heavy influence the story being told.

Mordremoth is the primary antagonist – but this time, the primary antagonist is not the main problem faced by the protagonists. The main problem is finding a way to keep magic balanced (if you pay attention to some of what’s revealed in Tarir, in fact, contrary to previous assumptions the elder dragons do not serve to keep magic balanced: the dragons would consume all of the magic if they could, which would result in the death of Tyria, and it’s only through the efforts of others such as the Seers that enough magic has been hidden from the elder dragons to prevent that from happening). Glint’s legacy appears to be the solution, or at least a necessary part of the solution. Mordremoth is the primary antagonist not because it is a threat to Tyria in his own right (he is, but so are the other dragons) but because Mordremoth is the biggest threat to Glint’s legacy.

We understand this as players. Our protagonist on the other hsnd seems to be blissfully unaware as they murder Mordremoth without a second thought.

By now I think I’ve made my point abundantly clear. The problem lies in the telling, not necessarily the story (though arguably, both are in dire need of improvement).

As the audience, our perspective is guided by the protagonist whose eyes we see through. If the writers want to communicate the significance of a plot point then they MUST show, not tell. We must see characters taking an active interest in the MscGuffin, not stumbling into situations where we are conveniently led by the hand to its doorstep. Secondly, our characters should express doubt that killing Mordremoth is the proper course or else it just looks like they are incompetent fools who can’t piece together the fact that killing dragons is potentially dangerous to the environment.

This stark absense of inner conflict, or even conflict between NPCs who are apprehensive about the dragon’s death, is why I say that they absolutely, without a doubt failed to foreshadow the upcoming plot of S3.

Aaron Ansari.1604:

Having slept on it, I think the main reason I object to the idea that the story has merely shifted conflicts is that it’s only done so on the player’s level. For our characters, the protagonists actually driving this story, the little hints scattered about don’t seem to have made an impact. We the players have taken them, decided they’re relevant, and built predictions and extrapolations on their framework- but for the characters, the Apostate’s was only one of many, many irrelevant books in the library. Ogden’s comment was something of an aside in an answer that was itself meant for a very general question, and even then he qualified it as one theory out of several. The character’s only articulated motivation to seek the egg was that the Pale Tree was desperate that they should, and that they’d rather have a dragon as a friend than an enemy. No sooner did they say as much than Caithe let sylvari players know that wasn’t the half of it, but that hasn’t been elaborated on. While we players may see the signs that a shift is coming, as far as the character is aware, Mordremoth is the only thing to worry about at this point. They emphasize that at every opportunity, with a variety of NPCs pitching in to agree.

That, I think, is why the conflict in the expansion feels so muddled. Our character had an urgent mission, missing friends, an elder dragon being treated no different then Zhaitan, but abruptly veered partway through for the sake of writing on the wall that we could see but they couldn’t. Instead of making the necessary move to bring the character in on why that was important, this supposed true conflict gets left behind after a mere two instances and never mentioned in the rest of the story. At this point they should have doubled down on the Mordremoth conflict, but the detours we engage in ostensibly to that end don’t contribute anything. After that drawn-out lull, things become a jumbled rush. We practically trip into the final boss battle, and the story cuts off abruptly as soon as it finishes. I agree that it looks like ArenaNet is shifting gears for their story down the road, but HoT didn’t feel like a transition. It felt like trying to set the stage for the next conflict by sweeping the existing one out of the way, as hastily as possible, and since they were setting the pieces in their new place why not drag the player’s eyes out to watch? For all the extra voice work our avatars got, HoT hit a low in treating them less like characters than a mouthpiece for plot convenience, and it blunted the impact of- well, just about everything.

TL;DR: Foreshadowing is well and good, but when there’s a schism between the conflict communicated to the player and the one communicated to the character, the character’s is supposed to take precedence. HoT got this backwards.

This is exactly how I feel. They foreshadowed an epic, indomitable foe, then we suddenly get handed a magic bullet last minute. It’s a very poor ending, and the two chapters leading up to it do nothing to heighten the tension.

draxynnic.3719:

From the start of Season 2, however, the main problem has not been any specific adversary. It’s been magic itself.

That is incorrect. It is blatantly obvious that Mordremoth was the primary antagonist of Season 2. From the very first chapter, the writers had been dropping clues that pointed straight to Mordremoth being a global threat. This threat was recognized by the ruling bodies of every nation in Tyria during the world summit which is why they all agreed to help the Pact fight Mordremoth.

The story tries to convince us that Mordremoth is somehow an immense threat to Tyria as a whole, and the very last moment of S2 was our fight against the dragon’s lieutenant which tried to take Glint’s egg, after which we saw a cinematic of Mordremoth annihilating the Pact fleet. All of this tries to establish Mordremoth as the Big Bad of the expansion.

I think youre confusing sex and gender. Sex is purely biological while gender transcends biology. For example, a male sylvari might not identify with the male gender and performatively be a woman. This is called transgender.

Most sylvari appear to be pansexual as far as I can tell. Most of them don’t have any hangups about the gender of their partners – they don’t even seem to care. I wouldn’t even call sylvari homosexual or heterosexual since most of them don’t appear to have a preference.

As for breeding them in Petrie dishes? Not likely. That would require advanced cloning technology, which hasn’t been acknowledged in canon.

Jaken.6801:

The ending is the best evidence, as they just made a cut. The whole storie had no conclusion and aside from the devs saying “Mordremoth is dead.”, the world doesnt know.
The world right now is standing still. We are still there, at the mouth of Mordremoth, while some are looking towards north in the raid.

Do I believe Season 3 will give us conclusions? Maybe. However not the one we might need.
Since S1 too many mysteries were left alone or added. I just hope, they are able to bring them to an end, before the game ends.

Yeah, this is definitely evidence of unfocused writing. There is a useful convention in storytelling called Chekhov’s Gun: “One must never place a loaded rifle on the stage if it isn’t going to go off. It’s wrong to make promises you don’t mean to keep.”

Good writing is about making promises to your viewership and then keeping them; foreshadowing events, then paying them off. An amateur mistake is to foreshadow random things in a desperate attempt to create mystery, intrigue or suspense. What this actually does is confuse the viewer, frustrate them or make them feel cheated.

Good writers ALWAYS pay off their foreshadowed events in a timely manner. If something is foreshadowed at the end of a book and left hanging, the payoff better be so epic that it feels worth the wait. If the payoff is weak, the viewers feel like they got their hopes up (and their wallets out) for nothing.

I’m surprised Omadd’s machine hasn’t come up yet in the discussion. The only danger it posed was Mordremoth’s presence, so maybe we’ll get a chance to play with that and get some eldritch reveals. It’s also connected to the leylines so who knows what this new flood of magic has done to it.

I’m personally not a fan of Plato’s metaphysics at all so I’m immediately biased against using “forms” and “essences” to explain magic. My opinion is that magic is the manifestation of a more fundamental force, in the same way that light is a manifestation of the electromagnetic force, which in turn is ‘made up’ of photons, the quanta (fundamental unit) of light.

Similarly, my hope is that magic has a fundamental quantum unit and can be explained by particle physics. I believe that a fifth fundamental force would be required. I’m calling this the psychothaumatic force for now since we have many hints in-game eluding to a deeper connection between mind and magic. My theory is that they are two aspects of the same force, just like electricity and magnetism.

I’m not sure yet how the bloodstone fits into all of this, or what its function even was in the first place so I’m holding off on trying to fit it into my theory just yet.

I’m also uncertain about how this force would interact with protomatter to (re)structure reality. This theory is still a work in progress so it’s not completely fleshed out yet.

Diovid.9506:

Konig Des Todes.2086:

Thanathos.2063:

Well, this may seem a bit like an artifical connection, but “Utopia” can be interpreted as “unseen” – possibly leading to mursaat? Kinda weak argument, of course.

Utopia refers to a paradise of some sort. Nothing ‘unseen’ about it.

Just a small correction there, Konig, there is some discussion about the meaning of the word ‘utopia’. It might be related to the greek ‘ou’ and ‘topos’ meaning ‘no place’ or to the greek ‘eu’ and ‘topos’ meaning ‘good place’. Possibly utopia is related to both, it meaning something like ‘a good place that does not exist’ or ‘a good place that most people don’t know exists’.

This was actually a theme of Thomas More’s political satire “Utopia” which played on the dual meaning of the word: “good place” and “no place”. However, it definitely does not mean " unseen place" as the OP is suggesting.

I’m loving the idea of a bow-wielding guardian. I know this might be too much of a ripoff, but I’d love to see the bow’s 5 skill be a gigantic arrow that flies across the battlefield ripping through everything its path and healing allies and then exploding at the end. Of course, it lacks some originality… (Yes, yes. Ashe and Ezreal both do this exact move. I get it), but still, just imagine seeing that arrow fly and the feeling you get when it gives you the killing blow with a satisfying thwack.

Adding to Shade’s comment, spirit weapons also benefit from aoe combo effects. Fire + blast = 3 might; light + blast = retaliation. I prefer retaliation because it’s easier to fit light fields into a build and it works with the spirit bow/shield whereas might doesn’t, but both are excellent choices. Also, the hammer 1’s symbol ensures that they have a nearly permanent supply of the protection boon.

Here’s my personal take on the new dailies as someone who started a month before the NPE.

As a casual gamer, I only do content that appeals to me. I won’t go out of my way to play content that brings me zero joy in doing just to get a few achievement points. What I liked about old dailies was the feeling that I could meet their requirements regardless of where I was in the world and get a little extra exp each day from completing them. What I distinctly dislike about the new dailies is that they target specific map content, even if I’m completely under leveled for that map. I was getting “daily Orr gatherer” when my highest character was level 40.

Ironically, my ‘new player experience’ was 4x better before the NPE. Again, this is just my 2 copper.

Yes please. I’d like to play my character through the PS before doing the LS and the expansion, but I don’t plan on doing the PS until it gets fixed.

Do the dragons interact though? For all we know, they may behave similar to solitary predator species like cats rather than like wolves who hunt in packs. It’s my theory that the Elder Dragons don’t coordinate with each other and instead compete with each other for natural resources (i.e. magic). Then, they hibernate after gorging themselves full and begin the process again millenia later.

Your mother’s IQ is so low, she thought that “Amini hylek” was a nickname for the school bully!

I went for Statics on my asura warrior.

Statics is all about taking tried and true inventions and perfecting them. I decided to take the angle of my warrior being an experimental armoursmith who’s working on improving standard plate armour by basically turning it into kinetic absorption power armour. In the end, my outfit will be complete with slickpack (“power pack”), aetherblade gloves, and gas mask.

In other words, he’s a steampunk soldier

—Galvar Bonespeaker shakes his head as the charr around him bicker senselessly about the treaty—

“Fool cubs. You Blood-brains and Iron-heads don’t know what it takes to win a war. This is why you should leave the thinking to us: Ash Legion.

Never forget who we are. We are charr, and we will have victory at any cost – even if that means allying with the humans. They may look like a bunch of runts, but they’ve got fight in ‘em. Together, we’ll crush the skulls of our enemies and drive those dragons back into the dirt where they belong.

Victory. For the Legions!"

—he drains his flask of firebrand whiskey in salute—

I like the name Geargrind, 8/10 for that.

Mine is Galvar Bonespeaker, an Ash Legion necromancer. BONE warband is a special investigations and forensics unit. They’re currently tasked with finding long term solutions to the ghost threat, which it fitting because forensic archaeology is what they’re generally good at. Galvar is their legionnaire who specializes in death magic rituals and uses the bones of the dead to peer into their memories. Hence the name “Bonespeaker”

Old post, so sorry for bumping, but i’m running through the personal story right now for my first time ever. I have to agree with everyone who posted before me, the new story arc is absolutely confusing. Please revert this change Anet because I really do not want to continue playing through the story until it has been set straight and once again makes sense.

This was a very sloppy change and it would be nice of you guys if we were allowed to choose to go back in time (I.e. reset our progress in our personal stories to before all the wacky changes take place) so that the story can be experienced as it should be.

My main (and only) character is a sylvari warrior and I’m loving it so far. One thing that I love about the class is its large selection of weapons. As a new player, it gives you the chance to get a feel for a few different fighting styles before settling on one or two that you enjoy and then sticking with them. My person favorite is hammer + sword/shield. Hammer for the staggering crowd control and sword/shield for the mobility, sustained bleed damage and 3s channeled block.

If you want a class with a versatile playstyle then you’ll love the warrior. You’ll be able to swap between a variety of styles on the fly and more often than any other class. Effective or not, it’s a fun class to play if that’s what you’re looking for.

Ever since the recent patch I’ve noticed that while playing with my laptop charger plugged in my FPS appears to drop drastically. From 15-20 fps unplugged, it drops to an unplayable 6-7 fps as soon as I plug my laptop charger in.

I am currently playing on an HP Pavilion 17 Notebook PC

Has anyone noticed a similar issue? Found a workaround? Anything would be helpful!

They don’t bleed either. I’m not actually sure how sylvari physiology works, but it sounds as if they’re basically animated plant-based golems.

Side note, the sylvari race reminds me of the warforged from D&D Eberron:
Living golems composed of organic materials
Gained sentience by accident
Struggling to find their place amongst the other races

Wanderer.3248:

Instead of typing all that you could have read half a dozen threads that pretty much say the same thing.

shrug I think the OP made the theory more accessible at least, this is the first I’ve heard about it.

Also, seems pretty solid to me. Jungle dragon? Plant minions? Yep.

I’m a bit of a lorenoob, but I’m pretty sure that the sylvari are indeed resistant to dragon corruption and are well-aware of this fact.

I remember doing the defence of Overlake sylvari/vigil mission and Brianthyn mentioned that sylvari can’t be reanimated as risen.

Leviathan.7459:

“All things have a right to grow; the blossom is the brother to the weed” – Everyone deserves a chance for a good future. Everyone on earth has the right to go to school like anyone else, get a job like anyone else, and do anything life anyone else. No matter what race/religion/beliefs/whatever.

I disagree with your interpretation of Ventari’s saying. To me, “all things have a right to grow” speaks to the importance of diversity and the possibility of there being many different cultural ways of being.

In the Sylvari character creation: “Diversity of opinion is good. Discussion is healthy. No one should be condemned simply for being different. I will stand up for the rights of all.”

Schooling, employment, and other modern “rights” are more about standardization than diversity in my opinion. Sure everyone has the right to go to school, but you’ll only succeed in school if you think, write, and act a certain way.

9/10, it sounds fitting for a Cycle of Dawn sylvari

Mine is Cledwen
From the welsh “caled” (arduous, austere, dry, hard, harsh severe) and “Gwen/gwyn” (white, fair, blessed)
His glow/pattern color is white and his demeanor as a soldier fits the rest.