Guild Wars 2

Mrbig.8019:

Seragi.5910:

Ultima.8673:

Seragi.5910:

thief just arent viable for paids, sorry… paids is all about team fights and winning. yeah the burst is nice but there useless for everything else. they cant stomp for kitten and they die in 2 shots flat. its a waste of a slot when another class has same amount of burst but much more functionality.

I’m not trolling, I main thief and I love it. but seriously thieves are useless in paids

lol eu top Teams all run 1 thief in their group
right atm thief is the carry and fastest roamer with highest burst….

actually thats wrong, they use the thief to sight the field… top roamer is mes and mes burst puts thief into the ground considering mes is aoe and thief is single target. and the only reason they run thief is because 9/10 there facing newb teams in first 2 matchs where there other 4 players wreck the team so thief can back cap.

when the 2 good teams finally meet in last round they usually do the least amount of pts because they cant back cap, its harder to snipe because kjylo is a thiefs nightmare… every fight is literally starting uphill.

good teams wont just sit by and let a thief shadow refuge and res… its like a big red target screaming dps here and get 2 free kills.

sadly overall thief is not that viable in paids.

ive faced and played with PZ the leading NA guild and most matchs i didnt die to thief once, I always died to the mes

Back cap ? ROFL

Thief role is to spam sustained AoE in mid and go back fast to side point to help the side defender when he’s outnumbered.

Thieves whose don’t count for enemy stunbreakers, do not communicate well and don’t call target adequately are useless, yes, but as long as you do what mentioned above, they’re are death machines.

You are making NA thieves a bad reputation with posts like this.

sustained aoe LAWL you obviously have no idea what our talking about… and no one in there right mind is going to let a thief spam shorbow shots. he will get 2-3 shots tops and wont hit with at least 1 of them.

Ultima.8673:

Seragi.5910:

thief just arent viable for paids, sorry… paids is all about team fights and winning. yeah the burst is nice but there useless for everything else. they cant stomp for kitten and they die in 2 shots flat. its a waste of a slot when another class has same amount of burst but much more functionality.

I’m not trolling, I main thief and I love it. but seriously thieves are useless in paids

lol eu top Teams all run 1 thief in their group
right atm thief is the carry and fastest roamer with highest burst….

actually thats wrong, they use the thief to sight the field… top roamer is mes and mes burst puts thief into the ground considering mes is aoe and thief is single target. and the only reason they run thief is because 9/10 there facing newb teams in first 2 matchs where there other 4 players wreck the team so thief can back cap.

when the 2 good teams finally meet in last round they usually do the least amount of pts because they cant back cap, its harder to snipe because kjylo is a thiefs nightmare… every fight is literally starting uphill.

good teams wont just sit by and let a thief shadow refuge and res… its like a big red target screaming dps here and get 2 free kills.

sadly overall thief is not that viable in paids.

ive faced and played with PZ the leading NA guild and most matchs i didnt die to thief once, I always died to the mes

Killthehealersffs.8940:

<<If they lower their clone damage , the class will be destroyed
They are worthless as tanks and the only job there is for them is as a glass cannon
Their main attacks are really pitiful
Ppl should L2P , instead of whining on the forums
Ppl should look how to counter them and look on the pros on Twitch videos
The class is already worthless and if nerf their damage all the ppl will quit>>

Replace the <<Mesmer>> with an other class here :P
After all this time , i want to troll a bit too :P

thats what we as thiefs said when they cut all of skill dmg by 50%… stop crying newb mes… every skill we have got a 50% dmg nerf and were still doing fine… mes needs to be nerfd into the ground end of story

thief just arent viable for paids, sorry… paids is all about team fights and winning. yeah the burst is nice but there useless for everything else. they cant stomp for kitten and they die in 2 shots flat. its a waste of a slot when another class has same amount of burst but much more functionality.

I’m not trolling, I main thief and I love it. but seriously thieves are useless in paids

KirinDave.6451:

Seragi.5910:

oh man im sorry, my thief build has 13k hp and 900 toughness… please enlighten me on how your ele build is less hp and less armor???

Elementalists have less armor. Period. You seldom see true GC elementalists because unlike thieves they lack the best proactive defense in the game: stealth, so they go down almost instantly. True, they can crit for 20k with a setup, but that’s hardly worth it unless you have stealth.

Seragi.5910:

Also please tell me how my 1 heal skill matchs your 2 wep skill heals with combo AoE heals on top of your normal functioning heal??? End of story Stop QQ cause your bad at your class

It is as wrong to say this as it is wrong to say, “Thieves are immune to conditions because of Hide in Shadows.” Why would you say it? Elementalist heal bunker builds exist, but they are very difficult to balance with good attack power and they still lack the amazing proactive defense of stealth.

what delusional world do these people live in?? Stealth is not this all powerful defensive skill. you still take condi dmg you still get hit by channeled attacks and you can still be hit by aoe dmg…. stealth doesnt do anything at all except disrupt focus for 3 seconds. thats it nothing more nothing less…. also ele have stone armor which reduces incoming dmg by 33% ele also have several CC abilities such as knockdowns chills and blowouts… thiefs have none of this. the only cc thieves have are utilities. I’m sorry if you dont know how to counter a thief with you classes potential. Fact of the matter is that any competent ele would never lose to a thief period

Otaur.9268:

Seragi.5910:

ok so what this guy is asking for is that the lowest hp and lowest armor class in the game should be easier to catch! gotcha… So lets take the fish out of the river and put him in a barrel so that you have an even easier chance to kill him =) sounds like an amazing idea

Thieves have medium armor =/= to lowest armor in game. That would be the Elementalist good sir. Lowest armor and Lowest HP.

oh man im sorry, my thief build has 13k hp and 900 toughness… please enlighten me on how your ele build is less hp and less armor? Also please tell me how my 1 heal skill matchs your 2 wep skill heals with combo AoE heals on top of your normal functioning heal? End of story Stop QQ cause your bad at your class

TheGuy.3568:

Syeria.4812:

TheGuy.3568:

You didn’t but i can sum it up thief is the only class that has a skill like that on the left had side on short cd (more like no cd) that’s all. Everybody else has to take a utility for it.

As was pointed out, both guardian and mesmer also have them “on the left.” Ranger (when traited, but everyone has this trait) also has quickness stomp “on the left.” Necro and Ele have a blind stomp (although it’s a single shot blind) “on the left.” It seems only engineer and warrior lack an option there (although necro and ele’s option is rather poor). Actually, can a focus wielding ele stomp through Obsidian Flesh? Probably not I’m assuming. It seems that the classes who don’t have that option are more rare than those who do.

But I assume for thief you’re referencing CnD, using that would require the thief to still have 6 initiative (if they used HS spam, that’s just not going to happen). Using Steal burns a skill with 45 second CD and depending on the fight length, could still be on CD from being used as a fight opener.

I am disregarding the first part of the first paragraph as you cleverly forgot I said short cd (hint: all those skills have long cds). You also toss in traits that are completely meant for defense in nature and application that can’t be used for stomp consistently. Engis are special case see smoke vent (http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Smoke_Vent)

Sigh… initiative regens naturally at 1 point per 1.33 second the max cd on a skill like CnD is 8 seconds (that’s completely untraited). That’s a very short cd.

considering most glass cannon thieves die in 2 shots 8s is a lifetime

maybe adding a feature that gives you 1 pt per second while standing on a node you own. might make people actually want to defend rather then zerg for kill/node take overs… only for 8v8 of course. would be way to hard to counter for tpvp

I play a glass cannon thief and I get hit with this all the time, unless my reflexes are up to par for the day I will die 100% of the time…. that being said, this skill does not need to be changed in anyway shape or form. you have to pop haste for this skill to do any dmg on top of this you have to blow some utility or wep skill to get the person to stand still long enough not to be able to dodge roll. So he is now down 1-2 major cd’s and is now taking 50% more dmg for the next 4 seconds!!! I’ll take my chances at a dodge roll to do 50% more dmg anyday

Arken.3725:

You’re right, sorry I misread. But the difference is that even with stability you can be damaged and have it removed. While invul, you’re good to go regardless of the situation.

this is very true but you have to look at it this way.. they just blew there biggest survival cooldown to stomp someone… if I see this happen I immediately switch to dps this target down cause I know he is now defenseless

you build needs work… it should be closer to 25/30/0/15/0. u shouldn’t need that much acrobatics if you are going hardcore class cannon

I cant count the amount of times I try to go for boss steal on first round of tourney only to accidentally steal right into bosses knockdown… sitting duck for boss and 2-3 players to wail on my face

ok seriously if you trying to win a 2v1, against 2 warriors you doubt… there is something wrong with your head… not trying to be mean but warriors are like anti thieves. Huge swinging weapons with big range to hit stealth, more armor, more hp, not to mention a second life at down state. If any thief in the entire game could pull off killing 2 war in a 2v1 its a BS thief and thats only because he “gibbed” one so hard the guy died IRL behind his monitor

ok so what this guy is asking for is that the lowest hp and lowest armor class in the game should be easier to catch! gotcha… So lets take the fish out of the river and put him in a barrel so that you have an even easier chance to kill him =) sounds like an amazing idea

Please Please Please fix the hasted downing for thief…. there is a very harsh 1-2 second delay in the animation and the actual downing… the animation is of a hasted down but the time for the down to actually go of is the same as regular down… I will stomp someone wait a full second after it goes off then try to run away and it will say interrupted. It needs to be fixed to be more in line with the other classes hasted down such as warrior and ranger

Bulldozer.5973:

Revelstoke.8924:

With each rank rising in experience needed, and most matches producing anywhere between a paltry 100-150 glory, I believe someone in my guild calculated it out at near a half million games played to reach max rank (which isnt even a goal I care about). At 15minutes a match, of the same maps thats…insanity.

If this is true than it would require approx 1,875,000 hours or 78,000 days or 214 years of game time to achieve level 50.

max level is 80 not 50, considering the fact that the hardcore gaming guild alreayd havce players rank 50+ this is not true at all =) then again those people play 8+ hours a day rolling face at newb teams

Ill make a team with you apollo, I play main thief but since double thief teams arent exactly the best i can play warrior engi and necro as well

Fynd.4890:

Seragi.5910:

Fynd.4890:

Seragi.5910:

Lets talk about staff ele and staff necros shall we? am I the only one who hasnt forgetten both of these classes absolutly destroy people standing on a node? your entire skill line up is aoe that cover the entire node!!! Stop crying about thief cause they have 1 AOE you nubs dont know how to counter

Once again comparing apples to oranges. Weapon skills to offensive AoE trait procs on dodge roll.

If you’re going to compare Uncatchable to anything, let it be Mark of Evasion and Evasive Powder Keg .

Im sorry you dont know the thief skill but the dodge roll you are refering to is a fumble and 2 stacks of bleeds…. the “OP” skill your thinking of is a Utility on a 30s cd. learn to play the class b4 you make ignorant accusation about the trait… at best specc’d right a thief can dodge 4 times in a short period thats only 8 bleeds… and OMG 1 skill poof all 8 are gone GG

It hurt my brain to read this post, but I’m going to do my best to stay constructive and reply to the points you attempted to make.

I know what Caltrops is, and I know what Uncatchable is, if you look at my post, I said Uncatchable.

You mention Uncatchable being a fumble(I assume you mean Weakness) and a bleed that ticks only twice. This is false, the conditions it applies is the same as caltrops – a bleed and a cripple – which should tick 4-5 times, as it(Uncatchable’s AoE) lasts 4 seconds. Some AoE’s tick once on creation, then once for each second of the duration.

Caltrops’ tooltip does not state that the bleeds stack twice per tick – Uncatchable’s bleeds stack once per tick, but compound.

So by your logic, with Uncatchable alone, assuming you were able to get 4 dodges off before the first Uncatchable’s 4 seconds duration fades, bleeds would stack 4x per second, for a grand total of 16-20 bleeds on crippled opponents in 4-6 seconds. If the Caltrops utility is thrown in the mix, you’d simply hit bleed cap(25) on all targets. The cripple component is being played down here, but should not be overlooked.

Realistically, you’d get 3 Uncatchables off simultaneously with Caltrops, then just keep maintaining 2-3 Uncatchables infinitely with Vigor and Feline Grace . You’re aware that this is offense output while immune to abilities (Dodging), then stealthing and getting Vigor if you run low on endurance, however some builds will use Signet of Malice instead of Hide in Shadows.

the caltrops that drop from dodge roll trigger once then disappear they dont stay on the ground like you r assuming…. doesnt matter how many you lay or how often you do it… you get 2 stacks and 1 fumble/cripple form 1 dodge roll end of story

the dodge roll caltrops do not stay on the ground like the aoe elite skill thats what im trying to tell you

guard, mes, and ele all have teleport already lol

my suggestion is to use a grund AoE or some kind of CC. Knockdowns absolutly destroy these kinds of thieves. and if you get some kind of dot on them you can see it ticking while they are in stealth

im just a little curious as to what people mean by adding a LFG system… isnt that what is already in place… you solo queue(LFG) and matched up with other people(LFG) then your off and tourny starts. Im not sure there is anyway to improve that system.

maybe you guys dont understand how squishy thiefs are?! They already nerfd there dmg into the ground… even though it desperately needed it. You take away half of there means of escape(stealth being the other) and the class is non existent anymore…. no other class dies as fast as thiefs, no other class takes more strategy and planning then thieves do… we cant just run into a fight and hold our own. We carefully have to pick our fights, get it do some heavy burst, then G T F O of dodge or we die. end of story… no nerf needed

you guys must not read patchs xD…. they just fixed this issue. They moved guards around so they ahve to be agroed and buffed them a bit I believe

Ember.4326:

So now you aren’t doing it in paids? Well, I actively seek 1v2-3-4s on my thief in hotjoins too, I don’t pretend to be supermegagosu for it though.

You mean you once killed 3 people in a free tournament? Well I guess I still want that autograph! You can have mine and we’re like pub stomp buddy buddies.

Coz you know, I thought we were talking about 1v3ing people who know what they are doing, not stomping new players in hot joins. But I guess I’m too noob to meet you in the shark point where you evaded for 30seconds while sharks killed 3 people, right?

I really enjoy these forums, it amuses me how ignorant people can be and how cluelessly they flaunt it

never said anything about top teams or even paids in the first place but yes it is possible, just long enough for a roamer to help finish the downs

Fynd.4890:

Seragi.5910:

Lets talk about staff ele and staff necros shall we? am I the only one who hasnt forgetten both of these classes absolutly destroy people standing on a node? your entire skill line up is aoe that cover the entire node!!! Stop crying about thief cause they have 1 AOE you nubs dont know how to counter

Once again comparing apples to oranges. Weapon skills to offensive AoE trait procs on dodge roll.

If you’re going to compare Uncatchable to anything, let it be Mark of Evasion and Evasive Powder Keg .

Im sorry you dont know the thief skill but the dodge roll you are refering to is a fumble and 2 stacks of bleeds…. the “OP” skill your thinking of is a Utility on a 30s cd. learn to play the class b4 you make ignorant accusation about the trait… at best specc’d right a thief can dodge 4 times in a short period thats only 8 bleeds… and OMG 1 skill poof all 8 are gone GG

evilapprentice.6379:

Seragi.5910:

Im not sure about you but I can 2v1 even 3v1 people at a point on my thief without going stealth a single time…. so yeah if you know how to play the class thief can be one of the best node defenders

I’d love to see the video of you doing that, while holding the point, in a Paid tourney match against a halfway decent team. Actually, I’d be astounded, because I’d put money on the fact that it doesn’t exist.

I would love to prove you wrong, but I’m not about to post my skills/spec all over the internet for every nub to see so it can be hot patched in 2 days sry 8(

hopefully we will meet in a paid and I would be happy to destroy your team solo

Lets talk about staff ele and staff necros shall we? am I the only one who hasnt forgetten both of these classes absolutly destroy people standing on a node? your entire skill line up is aoe that cover the entire node!!! Stop crying about thief cause they have 1 AOE you nubs dont know how to counter

Im not sure about you but I can 2v1 even 3v1 people at a point on my thief without going stealth a single time…. so yeah if you know how to play the class thief can be one of the best node defenders

I might be wrong about this but I think there are 2 kinds of blinds… one where the next attack a person does misses and the next attack on you misses…. the one where the next attack on you misses, I believe says obstructed for the other player when they miss. its happened a couple times to me as well. I think it might just be a mis named event happening

Xom.9264:

3 round system is not a rated systems its a farm based system.

No matter how much you played WoW arenas if you were not better then 1800 ratings you could play 24/7 and never pass that mark.

It might be too hardcore for the pretend pvpers because it all came down to winning against the people at your same rating… win a move up lose and go down only the best of the best made it to high ratings.

Right now faster or slower is pointless its a farm based system that = play more get higher qualifying points. No serious pvper that has played a rated pvp game is going to respect a system like that. GW1 not that I played it alot but I do know the GvG fights were rated so you knew who was the best guilds and it was not based on farming.

lol what a freakin joke… so you saying joe smo with no experiece or talent at all puts in 10-12 hours a day will have mroe qualifying points then someone with skill?? im sorry but your dead wrong my friend… the only peopel who get qual points are the poeple who make it to round 3… only people who make it to round 3 are the best in the world… if your to dumb to see that then your never going to realise that you havent had a single valid arguing point yet

challenge anyone who has qual points to a 1v1 and I will bet real $ that you lose every single time 100% of the time

sorry but there is no data collection what so ever, all that info is based on biased kids who only contribute what they see

are you thick in the head?? thats the entire point of a 3 round system, only the good teams progress… meaning its only the best vs the best in the end. Sorry you cant make it past round 1… if it wasnt then you would see a larger list of people who have qualifying points. but instead its a list of 50 people tops from each region out of millions of people who play this game

I wasnt speaking as much to the mes portal thing because arena net already said they were nerfing that if they havent already.. im not sure I dont play mes. I just dont like the treb so much in round 3… just frustrating I guess when you pugging and you lack the communication required for that map

Are you even on the list for qualifying points? then be quite you dont play thief better and it shows cause you obviously dont know how to counter them… I know for a fact you dont play at the top level because BS spec thief in paid tourny are non existant, none, zero… peopel dont use them because they are not viable

Xom.9264:

Seragi.5910:

If you can survive the initial burst and the thief has to fall back and blow defensive cd to stay alive thats a win. I’m not saying thief lose if there burst fails, trust me I play main thief . I know all the tricks to stay alive and how to reattack after initial burst if player isnt already dead. I’m simply trying to help the players who are having trouble with thiefs.

You call that a win? Just living against a class is a win…..

Man did I call that one or did I call it.

Thief players logic is outstanding…….
So a person uses a stun break on a 40+ second timer and lives.

Super skilled ninja thief /s “OMG my burst failed !!(#!#!#@ now I have to leave for a few seconds and comeback to kill him QQ”

Few seconds later “man Im a super skilled ninja that other guy was a noob he did not even break my stun LOL”

Im sorry your a bad player but thats what it comes down to. Go talk to the people who do paid tourny competitively. Ask them how to deal with a BS spec thief, they will laugh in your face. The reality of it is thiefs are one of the weakest classes in the game. if you cant kill someone who has 14k health with 900 armor then you sir need to log off and delete your account. Thiefs get hit harder then any other class in the game often times die to stray AoE damage… the reason they hit so hard is because thier survivability is so low. If you dont know how to counter a 3s stealth then you need to stop playing. All stealth last 3s spec’d up to 4s besides shadow refuge which has an outline showing where thay are… not to mention after attacking form stealth they get globaled for 4s.

Xom.9264:

Schwahrheit.4203:

@OP

Go back to PvE then. I don’t know why a Necro is complaining about PvP when the class itself is legitimately more broken than Thieves at full potential.

I probably play your faceroll main better then you do.

With no healers game needs to be balanced based off 1v1s because that really all combat comes down to.

Trying to balance a game off of 1v1 situations is the reason this game is going downhill… its pvp your not suppose to have 1v1 situations. If you are runnign into an abundance of 1v1’s one of two things are true, You have a kitteny team who doesnt support or you are a bad player running around looking for 1v1 for an easy kill.

there are no character imbalances only mindset and skillset gaps…. its the reason they added combo fields into the game. This game require team work communication and skill to win… its cry baby people like you who are used to EZ mode games who destroy a game that has nothing wrong with it… I hope arena net doesnt cater to softcore nubs who cry to make the game easier

ok you can stop replying now, cause your completely missing the point. If you can survive the initial burst and the thief has to fall back and blow defensive cd to stay alive thats a win. I’m not saying thief lose if there burst fails, trust me I play main thief . I know all the tricks to stay alive and how to reattack after initial burst if player isnt already dead. I’m simply trying to help the players who are having trouble with thiefs.

I havent bothered, I dont put in enough time nor do I have a team dedicated enough to attempt paid tourny. I can assume the gameplay is light years different then free tourny

you completely misread my post. I have no problems on my thief lol. Also I have never lost to a thief on any other class, and if I did die the thief didnt get away alive either. The people crying about thiefs just need to take more time and learn how to counter them better.

that exactly my point, shouldnt have to manage whether or not to man treb… whether or not to attack treb. you leave a guy at treb to long u lose out on nodes but if u dont handle the treb you get owned at the nodes as well

easy fix, killing treb = 25 pts. repair kit on cd like svanir/chieftan respawn. simple but not completely devastating change

I think what he is trying to say is that the treb mechanic in general is a game changing advantage…. i dont want to have to man/ send 1-2 people to kill the treb. This map is suppose to be who can cap the point better… not who can defend thier treb better

I think that would make it worse lol

I agree there is a huge issue with players who leave early cause they dont like the setup or just sit there till its over…. if you didnt want to join and get a bad comp then dont join the stupid tourny solo

this post needs to be closed, to many cry babies who dont play the class and dont understand how hard it actually is to play a thief the right way. Everyone is QQ cause they play a spec that doesnt have enough defense to take a hit. I main thief cause its fun… I also have 1 of every single class. I don’t have any issues what so ever with BS spec’ed thief in any class. I take the time to learn the class I have the most problems with and know how to counter it. I’m sorry if u guys are bad and don’t want to take the time to learn how to play the right way. All of thief burst is in the first 2-3s, you survive that you win the fight 100% the time end of discussion

I think its funny that the original post is a glass cannon complaining about glass cannon thief… no kitten ur gunna get hit hard u got no survivability.

arena net has nerfd thieves so far into the ground its not even funny. there is no such thing as a competative thief anymore…. you will never see any in paid tourny because they have 0 use. With the rediculous nerf to downed state every single spec of thief is now useless in tourny.

congrats arena net you have lost a customer… keep it up and u will drive this game into the ground

a few things I would like to mention,

poison charges being consumed when attacking out of range or auto attacking… im sorry but if i miss a swing my poison should magically disapear. the stacks shoudl only be consumed on actual “hits/blocks”

traps being visible to enemy players, this completely defeats the purpose of having traps… ive set them down in strategic places so that people will hit them only to watch them just run around them because they can see them

staying in combat almost twice as long as other classes, I have noticed that thieves stay in combat after a fight way to long… i watched as i was downed almost split second after the enemy player started to regen, of course being a 1v1 fight no one else was around. but when the reverse happens I down someone in a 1v1 fight i stay in combat and dont regen almost 7-8 seconds then someone else runs up and im stuck at half health.

I love all the people who complain about elementalist downed abilities, omg were free kill waiting to happen… thiefs and mesmers have awseme downed abilities. It also doesnt take an army of 3+ people to kill a thief or a mesmer. I could only immagine a bunker healing spec ele having even 1 good downed ability giving a teamate time to res them only to have them use a “weapon ability” to bring them back to full health.

How about we make a trade u can have my thiefs stealth on downed and you give me ur 5k heal on 20s cd i think thats fair,

increasing the dmg of conditions is a terrible idea… mine only hit for 101 dmg and i can get 25 stacks literally in like 3 seconds. and if the character doesnt have any kind of condition removal i use shadowrefuge and watch them bleed to death. 101 dmg per tick at 25 stacks roughly equates to 26-27k dmg. the increase of condition dmg would be way OP