Guild Wars 2

SchmendrickTheMagician.8247:

Archon.6480:

Just so we are all on the same page: DD Elementalist

The issue has little to do with ring of fire. I am more annoyed with the amount of fire that can be dealt out with things like Cleansing Fire and the fact that you will be blinded every 5s. Mesmer counters DD great, I know, but other classes have difficulty, even with generosity and hydromancy sigils.

Signet Necro counters dd ele just as much if not better than Mesmer.

Yeah, I hear that said a lot. I admit it could be a learn to spec sort of thing. I can tell ya melle builds seem pretty weak, but I haven’t been actively changing spec to counter them.

Just so we are all on the same page: DD Elementalist

The issue has little to do with ring of fire. I am more annoyed with the amount of fire that can be dealt out with things like Cleansing Fire and the fact that you will be blinded every 5s. Mesmer counters DD great, I know, but other classes have difficulty, even with generosity and hydromancy sigils.

No not dumb at all. I use crusader amulet with a very similar setup in PvP. My strongest build. I use taunt and sw/a instead of LB. Path of scars hits hard. Try swapping might sigils for life stealing when you get a chance.

Last time ANet gave a report, ranger was most played class. So much fun, and you are never alone with your fluffy little buttercup drake following you around.

Cognitive dissonance from getting stomped in PvP and WvW. One of the natural responses is denial (read: lashing out in ad-hominem).

Ranger is hard to play and takes quite a bit of practice to get really good with. The other classes have a shallower learning curve so players from those get used to slaughtering Rangers which leads to a somewhat inflated ego. The problem occurs when said individuals run into a skilled ranger and get slaughtered. It causes contempt. How did that happen? Rangers are sucky and I just got rolled… You must be cheating. Nice cheese ranger!!!

GS is fantastic in many PvE scenarios, especially those that are difficult. 50 fractals, and aetherblade dungeon. You can pair it with sw/a, sw/t, a/t, and LB. Lovely weapon.

Simply removing Elems access to stability would solve all the problems… That and give other classes more interrupts so we can stop the skill spam!

No, elementalist is too strong.

They have too much access to too many skills that are mostly too strong. Have fun fighting two at once. The song “ring of fire” comes to mind. My complaint is they are not punished for repeated mistakes. The WTS is going to be hilarious when we get to see two of these at once behind the hands of highly skilled players.

I would concede d/d Elems are fine, if other classes would be given more access to interrupts. About the only way I see to effectively kill these. Also, get rid of their access to stability so we can punish them for stupid positioning and mindless skill spam.

While I firmly believe pure condi builds are a little weak in that they can be hard countered to easily by current meta, I think Hybrid builds are in a great spot. Either Carrion or Celestial. I find both to be excellent, and work well against skilled opponents.

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

LughLongArm.5460:

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

LughLongArm.5460:

I always thought is due to torch/dagger smaller radius and range, I expect to c more condi rangers now.

Yeah, especially with Quick Draw. As a point holder, it should be pretty good. We have so much reapplication that it should still do good damage as well as being able to be tanky and have a DPS pet.

Once there is PvE condi meta in full swing, PvP condi ranger will make a big comeback imo.

Amen to that, I also dont think the diamond ele is a hard counter to condi ranger. DPS pers with BM and some might will get the ele under 90% .

Aye, AA then F2 from Owl will take the ele below 90% and then chill them to boot.

Agreed, but if you were to use melee and high damage you can almost /sleep and faceroll them.

Edit: ok maybe not faceroll, but it’s faster than trying to kill with conditions, right?

…banned skills? What?

Rygg.6237:

Apolo.5942:

Write down the bullkitten builds you hate to loose against which have no counterplay.

1- DD ele.
2- Insta invi burst down mesmer.
3- double endure pain rampage warrior.
4- invi burst down thief.
5- 5k crit litch necro.

1) DD Ele gets shots down by: Mantra Mesmer, Marauder Warrior with Rampage, Elixir X Engi with Rampage, anything with high physical damage output given their protection wears off, don’ts tep in an out of ring of fire, it’ll proc blinding ashes and also stack more burning on you, or just ingore it and help your team elsewhere then plus 1 the Ele, play smart.
2) Get away from the clones and anticipate the shatter, you shouldn’t really engage with a Mesmer if you can’t counter pressure or don’t have stunbreaks availeable, also target the mesmer as fast as possible instad of the clones.
3) Wait for the stances to get on CD, then burst it, learn to dodge hammer KD’s, if it goes in rampage kite and juke for 15 seconds, use blinds and weakness to get some damage off, or just Moa the warrior for extra giggles.
4) if you see the backstab or mug hit you just wait until it uses 2-3 skills, if it’s happy trigger or doesn’t wait long enough it’ll run out of energy and be easier to catch, just don’t pop out all your active defenses pointlessly.
5) use LoS, use blind and weakness… pretty much the same counterplay as rampage but easier since it can’t hit if you LoS it, don’t step on the marks, pop swiftness and peel, engage again once the skill goes in CD .

The fact that you don’t know how to counterplay a build doesn’t mean it can’t be done, if you don’t have enough skill to win against x or y build then do the smart thing and go help on teamfights, always try to outnumber your oponents, if you’re standing alone somewhere and are not fighting while your team is wiping 5v4 is a bad call, if the cap you’re fighting in isn’t of your team or worse you’re fighting offpoint and can’t down the enemy player it’s a bad call, try to make things go in your favor even if the situation isn’t so much with you.

If you want to learn how to fight against certain builds then 1v1 a lot, there’s private arneas for that, also keep in mind most of the builds you’re referring to are meta builds which means they’re the best bang for your buck at the intented role, don’t expect to win against them with every build you use, you just won’t and that applies for this or any other game out there it’s nothing surprising or new.

+1 Excellent advice. All of what you said works well. Also, get used to peeling off fights that seem hopeless. This is a very good skill to use, and any class can do it

I ended up cursing a quitter the other day, I got so angry. He typed “gg” after loosing mid in first encounter in foefire. We lost it because a hero decided to solo far and die, 3v4 on mid… You get the picture. After getting beat by the—clearly low MMR—opposing team, the next several matches were unbalanced in my favor; by quite a bit it seemed. I think the huge hit to MMR when you score less than 200 against a team you were supposed to beat puts you on faceroll path.

Just roll with it and don’t get angry. It’s a game. Supposed to be fun. I still can’t believe I ended up cursing him must of had a long day at work…

Condi builds are extremely weak against builds with active condition removal or transfer. They don’t really hit any harder than a Zerker spike either.

This seems like a really nice change, why so many upset?

I love condition builds (mostly the fiery kind), but the reason I use crusader instead?

Two words: Diamond Skin

….And, the endless supply of them (in PvP)

How about we leave Crusaders and add the zealot-like equivalent? More options == better, right? I like it the way it is because it competes with Celestial for those who want to take the risk of only having a few devastating attacks while maintaining high defense. You use crusaders with intelligence sigils on builds who stack their damage into a small number of hard hitting attacks. It’s perfect for those (me) who don’t want to spam skills all day to win.

Please don’t advocate changing this. This amulet really adds skill to gameplay. I can mop the floor with button spammers using this amulet where, otherwise, it becomes a celestial like button mashing contest for the most part.

Most of the rampaging warriors, d/d elementalists, and Mesmers you run into nowadays are button mashers, mindlessly rotating through skills. Crusaders allows you to watch them and strike like a cobra when they foolishly spam themselves into a bad position. I can’t think of an Amulet that punishes button spamming more all the while rewarding timed strikes.

Hey, I just wanted to opine that Crusaders amulet works wonderfully well on Remorseless Ranger. It works fantastic, to be honest. Ranger gains opening strike over and over so hits very hard and has great defense. Not to mention, the skill/reward cap is higher than most builds we have, at the moment. Win win for seasoned Rangers that don’t want to pew pew all the time.

Redemer.2601:

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

Archon.6480:

…Aragorn never used a bow!…

Off topic, but yeah, better read that book again mate…

+1+1 I never even read the books and even I know the answer to that hint hint xD

Um, what? You guys put too much faith in Hollywood. There is no reference to Aragorn using a bow in the books. He only carried a broken sword called Narsil (that eventually gets fixed). Hollywood added the bow.

All joking aside, there are currently too many good counters to bows, so I earnestly believe we are better off sticking mostly with the other weapons, for the time being. I have been experimenting with LB as an alternative in some compositions on Hyrbid builds, when Ranged control is important—as a secondary weapon. It seems to work well like this. The high damage Bow builds have been pretty much squashed by this meta.

Bow Rangers are always free kills, horribly outmatched by the current Meta, easily squashed. Flesh golems puts up better fight. I have never had trouble with dispatching them. They have no counter to stability and gap closers so are useless. Bow ranger = free win.

LB ranger is a free kill for anyone prepared for it. Put the bow down, and pick up a sword and torch. Aragorn never used a bow! I think flesh golems put up a better fight.

You guys are funny. You seem really obsessed with SoS. I don’t know of any builds that revolve around that, though it has some nice uses. I quite enjoy SotW myself. Regardless, good luck with your builds and have fun in PvP. See you in the arena.

Hi Shadelang, excellent post. I run both mesmer and ranger, though I main ranger. I’ve found the combination of carrion amulet, and scavenger runes to be very effective on ranger against both mesmers and necros in conquest. Doubling up on hydro and geomancy sigils helps a lot as well. You can use any weapons you like, though I am finding swords and torch to work really well.

Don’t think you have to kill the mesmer right away. They can’t decap or hold a point at all. If you end up contesting a point against one just stay on it long enough to decap. Afterwards, feel free to swoop/leap around all you want when they go invisible. They are slow and like it when you stand in place on the point. If you can see their spike coming weapon swap fast and hit 3 (serpent strike) or 4 (GS block). With the two sigils you’ll escape unscathed most of the time.

It’s not an easy fight against a good one but you can certainly stalemate and decap them without too much difficulty. I think they are the bigger looser if you can stalemate them.

5/10 – less than15 chars

constructive feedback pls

Oh, sorry, I was responding to the title to rate your build. You’ve done well to max DPS, and this will work well against AI. Unfortunately, the current META is centered around four of the following four classes:

1. Mesmer – Shatter o’death from perma invisibility with stunnerama to boot
2. Warrior – Perma Stability o’smash da face to ground baby
3. Guardian – Insta port to AoE burn ya to death
4. Elementalist – Depleted Uranium Diamond Armour of Perma Heal

All of which have excellent gap closers, fantastic stability up time, and endless access to reflect. Your build receives a 5/10 because it has no counter play to enemy stability, invulnerability, and reflect. They only need to avoid your damage for a few seconds to mince you. Then they can +1 your allies while your corpse pushes daisies.

PS: Also, how would you counter a Zerker thief or dual sword shout/signet ranger wielding Rampage as One?

^^ This, and you will have difficulty surviving focus.

5/10 – less than15 chars

I agree, but decided to revise your post to be more, um… succinct. What do you think?

Fluffball.8307:

I’d rather see spirits removed entirely and replaced with something active (without nerfing the PvE contributions). I doubt Anet takes such a drastic step though, but now we’re stuck with a relatively absolutely, completely, utterly unequivocal useless trait and utility line.

Kyosji.8961:

I think some people need to make a A/T + SB condition ranger. I’ve always ALWAYS killed faster then nearly any other player doing 1v1 and group mobs. Even in Orr, where I am not fully speced, I can kill faster than most people I’ve seen. The GS +LB power build for Ranger is underwhelming compared to a good Con build.

http://intothemists.com/calc/?build=-J;5Fky-t2cDF-0;9-6;2Z_b;0257146056;4a-17T;1jxqQjxqQdxk8TbnP;38999A9B9C9DeGB1YF8JX6TsW6Tg

Roughly what I use, and it works great in PvE. I rarely get hit, and even when I do, it’s not something life threatening. Pet takes most of the hits, gathers all agro, and also, I can tangle if necessary. Traps are a godsend as well. Things just melt far faster then other players around me.

I must say, I never considered using Brown Bear and traiting Natural Regeneration…

+1 I’ve been using mesmer to see what life is like on the other side. Same experience.

Nature’s Vengeance changes everything. This is an elite that really flips the tide of battle! One third of one stack of might per second is just, wow. Pop this sucker and your opponents will have to turn and run or stay and smash your face into the ground.

I secretly keep hoping there is some unorthodox combination of skills, traits, and utilities that we are missing—which the devs know about—that will result in a powerhouse Ranger build. I found a few moderately strong builds, and am still looking.

Sad to loose Healing Spring and tried a few variations of Nature Magic spirit builds. Oh my gosh. I feel bad trying this in Ranked… Horribly weak does not begin to describe the result. That being said, I feel one Spirit traited or untraited may be the way to go.

I too would love to have interrupt style play on the Ranger. I always saw Ranger as the anti-spellcaster class.

Phineas Poe.3018:

I just had taunt interrupt my Gear Shield, forcing me out of it.

I really don’t understand why they felt this was necessary.

All joking aside, I think Taunt is a new mechanic that is still being worked out. Ranger does not have too much in the way of Control Effects to strategically alter the flow of battle, so this does seem like a nice addition. There are several QQ threads about standard ranger gameplay involving standing on a ledge pressing 1 repeatedly. This gives us a skill that can change the flow of battle, when used correctly, but does not do much when mindlessly spammed.

As it stands, Taunt is a Control Effect that can cancel blocks, invisibility and other defensive countermeasures like evasion spam. I don’t mind this, but still wish Ranger had more Control Effects, in the form of interrupts and stuns. Skills that require thought make the game interesting. Taunt is one of these. Other classes will be getting it in HoT, I am fairly certain.

philheat.3956:

Zetsumei.4975:

philheat.3956:

There are other weird things with taunt, we are discussing them on this topic too:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/pvp/Taunt-doesn-t-let-you-target/page/3#post5282411

Do you mean it changes your target to the source and doesn’t let you change until taunt is over? Yeah already was aware of that happening but cant remember if it was because a dev said it was intended or if it was just brought up on a stream somewhere by a player.

Nono, i mean the discussion moved on and now there is an interesting issue if Taunt is a Control Effect or a condition, because on wiki is listed like CE but condi removal affects it (like fear)

Imho it should be like a Fear (so a condition + CE) but wiki says only CE but at the same time it seems condi removal works on it.

Icon is red but there is no track about for exampe a boon-condi convertion about Taunt.

It’s not really clear.

It was supposed to be a Control Effect, but allowing rangers to have one of these offsets the balance of the game, so it must have been changed back to a mere condition that can be cleansed by accident—in most cases. #RangersSuck

jcbroe.4329:

@Mohagi;

It’s pretty indisputable that most of of could probably design better overall traits and a better trait system.
I blame the design devs more than the balance devs though. Coming from my long history of playing GW1, ranger for me in GW2 is dumbed down, lacks most of its original nuance and playstyle customization, and is unrecognizable in the worst kind of way.

I simply had to accept that GW2 at this point is probaby the only suitable game in its genre/sub-genre, and that this ANet team is better at marketing than designing fun, intuitive, and meaningful gameplay.

I just wish my main class wasn’t a shadow of its former self, and as you highlighted, that that people working on the class were more competent at comprehending how the class plays, or even the concept of what a good trait is.

@Puck;

You’re right, I mean, all I can do is speculate. I just prefer to think of it as the industry standards of higher up business decision red tape nonsense dictating patch release periods and how much the dev team is actually allowed to change (aka the balance team could probably make the game entirely different within a single week given free reign) over the assumption that the team is lazy/incompetent/dragging their heels for no reason.

I personally am a CompSci major and prospective hire in the programming industry, but am already jaded by situations like what this one potentially is where you could be the hardest working, most devoted, passionate dev and have massive amounts of changes you could easily make right at your fingertips that would improve the player experience a ton, but your boss tells you that you can’t make any of them because “it doesn’t fit with the current vision of the game to make those changes” or “we aren’t ready to see things like that be changed in the game just yet” or etc.

BUT, because you are the dev and not the shot caller, not only are you thrown into limbo with all of your ideas, but you have to take the blunt force of a community of players calling you lazy and incompetent, and even though you agree with them and want to make those changes, you literally have no way to.

Rambling aside and ultimate point being; I totally agree that someone or some people somewhere are being inefficient and incompetent and the game is suffering lol. I just personally don’t want to place blame on who it is. My general opinion of most programmers I come across and including myself is that left to our own devices, we would probably over-do the amount of things we touch and program because its a love/addiction that carries with it “just one more thing” driving feeling, so I don’t generally throw them under the bus first lol.

LOL, this made my day. In real life they are called stakeholders, and they make you do strange things from time to time. Stick with the compsci major, though. The work is MUCH more enjoyable than school and if you are hardworking and dedicated it is a wonderful field to be in. Always changing and always interesting.

Ha, ha, my excellence is only surpassed by my humility! I’d say the proof of the pudding is in the cake on who the real elitists are.

People have Guns in NA… And lots of them!

blitzkrieg.2451:

Photinous.4628:

Eurantien.4632:

You will regret picking ranger.

This.

This

This, just think Danger when you think Ranger. As in you will be in grave Danger! :-)

Ranger dedicated condi is semi-viable to not viable at mid to high tiers. Viable if enemy incorrectly guesses you are power pew pew and specs for that. Inviable if they know you are running conditions up front.

Stronghold may have attracted a bunch of WvW players, which have varying skill levels across a wide range. Some being incredibly good, while others being standard zerg fodder. The matchmaker will have no way to determine the difference off the bat. This should settle down later on. And, does Stronghold have its own MMR, separate from conquest? I would be surprised if it does not…

Because they need a villain class for all the heroes to beat on?

All joking aside, the new specialization looks pretty cool.

Yeah, Ranger is great on defense. Lot of AoE binds and pet to help you slaughter Small rats while dealing with big rats.

…it could be that people are beta testing it against skilled opponents… Na, that can’t be it.

Yeah, you really need to switch out of healing spring into troll ungent or we heal as one, if you use beastmastery. Lightning reflexes is hard to live without, so I would keep it, but it is kinda buggy at times. Have you ever gotten CC’d in the rollback part?

I’ve resorted to using Both LR and zepher’s speed to accommodate. That’s been working pretty well. Stun and immobilize are our biggest killers anyway so it makes sense.

I understand your sentiment, but ANet does not allow petitions (with good reason).

Seraphim Storm hit the nail on the head about our number one drawback. We can’t survive/escape focus attacks as well as other classes. Our skills are well enough to output decent damage, but it is not quite enough. The Meta is still settling (maybe there is none atm) but we seem to still be lacking what matters.

A few things for sure:

1. Healing Spring was trashed
2. Signets and traps were weakened (cooldown too long now)
3. Enemy stability uptime is too high, squashing our CC.
4. Nerf to vigor hits us hardest because we primarily dodge to survive focus attacks. We don’t have fancy teleports, invisibility, and low cooldown blocks like other classes.

We will need to work to see if there are other effective builds. Or switch to another class, for a while, while things get fixed. It is kind of sad when you outplay a d/d elem or warrior and end up having them mash keys and kill you.

After a while you can see the button mashers…. And it just is kind of sad to loose to one.

You forgot BASH, POW and RAAMPAGE!!

Advice: Run like Forest Gump!

This weekend is a Beta test weekend, so maybe don’t worry about Revenant in ranked. People are testing it, and they want to test it against competent opponents. I ran it a few times. My conclusion is that the skill activation times are too slow in this meta. By the time you use a skill you are toast against current meta. Only took a few matches to see that.

I’ve been wondering what it does, as well. Pleease clarify!

DaShi.1368:

You haven’t convinced me.

What if I told you I main Ranger and use Mesmer as a secondary in PvP when I need a change of pace. Would that work?

Anyhow… Back on topic. This match was fun to watch. So much to learn.

Thanks to all participants on both teams!

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

Sube Dai.8496:

Well to be useful in this high damage meta i think it would have to offer a large, one off heal that could save your team.

A weak/moderate team heal is just completely useless now. So either it saves everyone, or you don’t need it.

To that end maybe have it pulse aegis with nv, and aqua surge heals for 7500+.

I have suggested it should be lifesteal, not just heal for say 100 per hit, no ICD and Pulse Resistance with NV. Aqua Surge would need to heal for at least that amount imo.

Needs to be OP by design so that you can create a strategic play with them, also, if it were lifesteal, it would be good to add into FrostSpotter as it would be a unique source of damage and healing.

Wow, great idea! Pulsing life steal would be fantastic. This would be interesting.

DaShi.1368:

My statement remains true.

No, no it doesn’t. I don’t recall asking for anything to be nerfed. I am a bit astounded that Rangers were weakened considerably in the last patch. Most of us are scratching our heads wondering what’s up. We really don’t mind Rampage, shatter burst, thief backstab, etc, etc, as long as we can counter it, We Rangers are OK with it.