Guild Wars 2

Please note the poor edit choice by the mod. This was not the original title.

If I had any idea how to record my screen, I would do a video showing you what it’s like when a latency pro like myself tries. You think you are good at randomly dying due to glitches? Pffffftttt, you got a lot to learn, son.

For this who didn’t get the sarcasm, this mechanic is unplayable for me and I’m not sure ill be able to participate.

I’m not entirely confident that ANet is:

A. Aware they’re making a game that requires an online connection.

B. understanding the limitations of thier game engine.

I tried this event last night and it is unplayable. The mechanics of these are too dependent on connection speed. We’ve seen this before. The “jump pads” in the SAB and AR suffer from this same issue.

Unfortunately, I’m not sure what my options are. Unless ANet can do something about this, I can’t see how I can participate in any of content that requires these mechanics.

I really have to give ANet kudos for trying new things, but unless they start taking into consideration the limitations of the environment they’re working in, I fear many players will simply find themselves unable to play.

Do to lag screwing up 90%+ of the new mechanics.

Nothing works, I can’t make jumps and I end up rubber banding with the speed boost.

I’m not sure what I can do. shrugs

Anyone else having these issues?

NOTE: THE ORIGINAL TITLE OF THIS POST WAS – No Achievement and I couldn’t care less. – A MOD HAS DECIDED TO CHANGE IT, THINKING THEY KNOW WHAT I WNAT TO SAY BETTER THAN I DO. ON THE CONTRARY I REALLY CARE ABOUT THE LIVING WORLD. THIS EDIT OF MY POST IN NO WAY REPRESENTS WHAT I FEEL, NOR DOES IT MAKE THIS TOPIC MORE CLEAR

Please disregard this stupid edit choice by the mod, and continue to discuss based in my original title, which was to show my frustration at not being able to get the achievement due to the limited nature of the content, and how I finally realized that I was putting too much care into them for what I was getting out of it.

thanks for your understanding. And to the mod that changed this, smarten up.

GW2 finally beat me.

Despite having 100% completion of all Living Story achievements, I was finally faced with so many obstacles that I have no choice but to give up.

Here is the recipie that finally did it. It’s kinda like making cookies, but nowhere near as delicious.

Preheat GPU to 65 degrees

Mix in the following into a large bowl.

10 -20 seconds of pure lag (add during lasers, and multiple times during Mai)
Multiple group wipes due to difficult mechanics
Players rage quitting, and or leaving after missing achievements.
A boss fight that relies on seeing AoE circles, but don’t display them.
A challenging, and time consuming dungeon

Now, once fully mixed, add in 3 cups of temporary content, stirring slowly until well blended.

Repeat dungeon multiple times, and serve cold.

As many have said, I don’t care if the dungeon is mother hardest dungeon ever, but don’t make it temporary. I sat down at 10pm last night with the intention of getting the last achievement. It is now 5:13 am, and I am still missing it.

Think about that. I just about put in a full days work just trying to get one achievement. I missed an entire night of sleep because in less than twelve hours I will never again have the chance to get the achievement. I looked for a group for over 45 minutes, and eventually standing there in LA thinking, I don’t care.

This is a game…why am I making my life worse for a game?

So, I’ve decided from now on, that I will not be putting in effort into the Living Story. It’s just too annoying to be forced to finish content and achievements in such a short timeframe.

Anyway. Rant over….the point. Make content difficult and permanent, or make it easier and temporary…but don’t make it hard, and temporary, that is just annoying.

Thanks to all of you so far for the advice (except perhaps those who for some reason feel the need to talk down to me like I’m an idiot).

I have questions for many of you, but to start, I wanted to ask…

Excalibur.9748:

You need some better gear it will make you a lot more tankier.

Here’s my gear and I’m not using any ascended pieces at all.

I can facetank a lot of stuff with S/D in dungeons. Like Faux I usually don’t go under half health. I use shadow return when it’s hot and heal and go back in.

What gear would you recommend? I’ve made/purchased some of the best gear I could afford/find/wear.

Where should I get better gear?

I’ve attached some images above.

This is really staring to bother me. My level 80 thief does quite well in PvE, but whenever I enter a dungeon, I find myself downed, dead, and insta-wiped a frustrating amount of times.

Just today, I spent almost the entire time dead trying to do the final boss fight of the Living Story. I’ve tried everything from food, to weapon combos, to runes, to builds, but I find myself unable to be effective.

I find its worse when enemies do large amounts of condition damage because I can’t remove enough of them fast enough, or long enough.

Anyway, if anyone can give me some advice of a few things I can adjust, I would greatly appreciate it.

Here are some screens of my stats.

Well, the question is a bit misleading.

What I want, is for the release schedule, and the amount of time required to complete the Living Story and it’s achievements to be at a pace that allows the largest percentage of players the chance to experience it.

As well, I would like the content to not overwhelm the rest of the game, so players can still continue to experience the rest of Tyria without feeling like they constantly have to choose.

So, if they choose to release new content every two weeks, but make the time required to experience it and/or get the achievements to be within reason, cool.

If the content and/or achievements remain time consuming, then they need to make sure the content remains in the game long enough to allow everyone the maximum chance to experience it.

That’s all I would like.

…is apparently the argument some people have, when someone voices concern over the quick-fire release schedule of the Living Story.

I’m sorry, but this is a terrible argument.

Of course I’m not required to play the Living Story. Of course missing a story or two will not result in the game becoming unplayable. Of course all the achievements are optional.

However, you’re missing the point completely.

We WANT to play the game. We log into GW2 because it’s entertainment, and it’s fun. We log in because we like experiencing the game with our partners, friends, and family. We get achievements, gear, and such because we feel like we are accomplishing something that matters to us.

If the Living Story content is released at a pace where most casual players are unable to keep up, I’m afraid it will result in many of them (myself included), slowly finding themselves frustrated and lost.

For many of us, one of the reasons we chose GW2 over other MMO’s is because there was no pressure to play. We could log in and tackle the game, with whomever we choose, at a pace that worked for us.

Sure, there is nothing wrong with the occasional event, or limited time content. I think most of us will agree that stuff is pretty cool, and have no problem budgeting time for them.

The issue is when we have one Living Story right after another (and many times overlapping), in addition to all the other things we WANT to do in the game. Many of us simply don’t have the luxury to sit down for hours every week and complete dailies, monthlies, Living Story, WvW, PvP, Personal Story, Events, World Completion, Legendaries, Random Achievements, Boss Fights, Dungeons, Jumping Puzzles, Alt Characters, Role Playing, Crafting, Mystic Forge, Exploring, and so on.

If the Living Story is going to continue at the pace they are suggesting, then something has to give. Either the achievements, and the time needed to get them need to be drastically reduced, the content needs to be easy enough that it doesn’t require hours and hours to learn and/or complete, or they need to make the content last long enough to let everyone the chance to experience them.

I applaud ANet for taking on such an ambitious goal. I truly hope that in practice it results in a game that is constantly fresh and exciting. I just hope they can find the right balance that will allow as many players as possible to experience the content without feeling a constant pressure to do so.

So, if you’re one of those people that keeps using the argument, “Playing the Living Story isn’t required.” then please take a step back and try to understand that we understand this, we’re just trying to voice or concerns to ANet so they understand that making new content is a huge waste of time, if a bunch of the players can’t keep up fast enough to enjoy any of it.

bribrim.9710:

1. Stealing what? Anet would like to know… Going AFK doesn’t prevent or promote any achievements that I know of… Griefing – well sure, isn’t that a pain in all MMOs?

Stealing kills/loot

GW2 has implemented a system where players are required to kill X number of enemies, which drop RNG boxes (Holograms, SAB, etc.). Because players are credited with the kill/loot if they do a certain amount of damage, they often attempt to beat other players to these, and kill the enemies before others can.

Akitten

the Dragon Ball game, players were required to play 20 games for an achievement. Because players were not kicked for being AFK, they realized they could do this, and still get the achievement.

Also Jormag to some extent. Players can AFK through the first stage of the fight, get a few hits in the second, and still receive the rewards.

Griefing

Adding an achievement into the WvW jumping puzzle means that players not well versed in WvW are thrown into a situation in which they are easy targets for guilds that work together (I’m looking at you kitten ).

bribrim.9710:

2. It has been stated by Colin Johanson that the new content will be “relatively self contained”. Missing story – non issue.

Well, if that is the direction, then at least it’s a start. It does suck for players with limited time to miss large portions of the story, especially if the story is a continuation over many, many months, and overlap.

bribrim.9710:

3. and 5. They are the same. You are essentially talking about grinding. What MMO doesn’t have grinding. They all do AND they all will… Also, RNG has no place in discussion of Living Story.

I’m talking about large amounts of grind, with limited time, and other tasks to complete. RNG is fine, but I feel that not giving players the option to earn, or buy items and only offering items through RNG is bad. Think of the thousands of Coffers people have had to earn, and open to get tickets. A casual player is forced to buy RNG boxes, or accept the will probably not get a ticket.

bribrim.9710:

4. What kind of achievements do you want?? Some encourage participation in a group while others are solo … You have me confuzzled on that one…

Achievements IMO should be geared so the largest percentage of players can achieve them, regardless of playing style.

For example, dungeons should have path difficulty options, and/or scale to suit the level, and number of players entering. Requiring a player to go solo, or with a group, without the option makes many players cranky.

lordkrall.7241:

And back during flame and frost people complained about it being too spaced out and not happening fast enough.

They really can’t win, can they?

So what does that tell you? Perhaps there is a happy medium between months, and one to two weeks?

Can you think of any other solutions? (This is going to be your new goal for every post you make. You have to think of at least one solution that isn’t extreme.)

signahead.7281:

I think we’re talking past each other here. I agree that the story is optional, in the sense that there is still a lot to do in the game even if you don’t complete this particular story.

But if your goal is to keep a group of players, like a guild or a group of friends, interested in the game then I think the story is necessary. That’s doubly true for Dragon Bash and the Sky Pirates.

In a general sense, the story is necessary because many people play the game for the stories. A lot of them (but not all of them) aren’t particularly interested in dungeons. They may even actively avoid them. Putting the story into a dungeon, especially one this difficult, cuts them off from the part of the game that they enjoy. And if they don’t enjoy the game, then they go somewhere else.

I think this is especially true in GW2 because ArenNet has been pushing the story so heavily. In a lot of games, the story-oriented players who completed the personal story would have moved on by now. But they’ve stuck around because ArenaNet keeps giving them stories. If they don’t think those stories are accessible, then they go somewhere else.

That brings us to the Dragon Bash/Sky Pirates event. Aside from the story, this event has been especially grindy. To me, and to a lot the people I play with, grindy events are really, REALLY boring. So there was a lot riding on this particular story. For a lot of people I know, that story ended very badly, with a long attempt at a dungeon that mostly ended in failure.

We’re currently doing catch-up runs, to help every guildy who wants to complete the story do so. But there are people who went away pretty angry. I doubt that many will ragequit right now, but they don’t like the game as much today as they did before they visited the Aetherblade Pirates.

To a person who relies on ArenaNet to keep the game enjoyable for all of my friends, this story was a problem. It put a big, irritating obstacle between my friends and their fun. And now we’re struggling to overcome it. That’s very frustrating.

This is pretty much exactly how I feel.

While I don’t think the Living Story is the most amazing story telling I’ve ever seen, it sure is a lot more interesting than running around the game grinding out slayer achievements.

Not only that, but ANet has encouraged me to participate in every aspect of the story until the dungeon. I witnessed a murder, helped people to safety, tracked down the killer, defeated pirates, and got an email asking me to hunt down Mai.

The email never said, “Thanks for your help, but we will take it from here…” It said, come…capture the bad guy!

I’m now at what I’m assuming is the climax of the story, and I’m unable to progress. Sure, given enough time, I might try different builds, or even level a different character. I might try running it with a few different groups as well. If I had the time I would also run it a few more times for the achievements, and perhaps the chance at a monocle, so I can fight like a sir.

Unfortunately, I can’t. ANet is taking away the dungeon soon, and so as much as I would like to potentially spend hours, “manning up” I simply can’t afford the time right now.

So, in the end, I will be unable to see this story completed, I will miss achievements, and it has already made me think twice about how much effort I feel like dedicating to future Living Story content.

signahead.7281:

Wallace MacBix.2089:

Once again, there is no story in this dungeon. If there is can someone say what it is because like I said there were only ~2 lines that Kiel said at the end of the dungeon. Everything is “don’t leave me behind I’m useful”. If you just want story (and assuming that the dungeon does not need to be completed to see the final instance of her in jail) then ignore this dungeon and move on.

SPOILER ALERT

I’m not sure if you remember this, but Mai Trin is one of the main villains of the Dragon Bash/Sky Pirates story. Just as the players are about to arrest her, she escapes with help from the Aetherblade Pirates and hides out in their hidden lair. The expedition to track her down and capture her is a vital part of her story. It may even be the climax.

END SPOILERS

Missing that is like missing the last chapter of a book…the one where all the exciting stuff happens and the story resolves.

And this is why I’m so cranky about the limited time, combined with the difficulty. I was interested to see where this was going to go. Missing this part of the story sounds pretty key in my opinion.

Why is there no story mode…man, ANet!

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Guild Wars 2 combat is built on adaptive game play. If you want to rush forward and tank hundreds of enemies at a time, there are other games I could recommend.

Is that what I was doing?

Crovax.7854:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Moral of my story? 1) Mechanics: Learn them, understand them, and use them. 2) Learn from your mistakes: If you fail, remember how to failed, and try not to do it again.

That’s the real problem! You are asking too much of many people here.

No, that would actually be quite a reasonable suggestion…IF it wasn’t available for only a short time. Like all the other dungeons, I would try them at my own pace until I passed them. The problem here is thakittens part of the story, and I have only a limited time to dedicate to it, and all the other parts of the story.

Again, difficult is fine…but difficult, with a time limit is frustrating. Why is it not reasonable to ask for a “Story Mode” for those who are interested in playing, seeing the story, but not spending hours and hours learning and perfecting the dungeon?

lordkrall.7241:

And yet that is a EXTREMELY small part of the playerbase and not even close to half of the active forum-userbase that seem to have issues with it. So clearly it is doable by the majority of players.

Ok, you’re right.

lordkrall.7241:

Crazylegsmurphy.6430:

Really? Can you quote where I said I should be able to stand there and spam “1”, never move and always win?

Do you ever respond without exaggerating or making Straw Man arguments?

I never said you have said that, I said you SEEM to be thinking that, since quite clearly loads of people is fully able to complete the dungeon you are clearly doing something very wrong. And based on the dungeon itself that scenario is more or less the only plausible one.

I’m sorry, but the only one who seems to be thinking that….is you. And quite clearly…you are wrong about the second part as well.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/livingworld/skypirates/Aether-dungeon-needs-radical-nerfing/page/5#post2323279

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/livingworld/skypirates/AR-is-HARD-Thank-you-Anet/first

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/livingworld/skypirates/Aetherblade-Retreat-Feedback-Improvements/first#post2321139

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/livingworld/skypirates/Time-Limited-Chevos-in-AR

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/livingworld/skypirates/AR-dungeon-on-a-low-level

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/livingworld/skypirates/Should-I-even-try-this-dungeon

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/livingworld/skypirates/why-is-the-new-dungeon-so-hard-at-the-end

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/livingworld/skypirates/Finally-finished-Aesther-Blade-dungeon

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/livingworld/skypirates/Can-someone-help-me-with-AR

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/livingworld/skypirates/AR-dungeon-complaints

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/livingworld/skypirates/Laser-Room-is-Way-to-Hard

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/livingworld/skypirates/Why-does-the-hardest-dungeon-have-2-weeks

Would you like more links to threads by players that are having issues?

Look, I’m not saying it’s not doable. You need to start listening, and stop trying to turn everything into a Straw Man argument. Honestly!

lordkrall.7241:

Crazylegsmurphy.6430:

What exactly is my approach to fights? Perhaps you can enlighten me since you seem to know why I struggled so much more in this dungeon than almost any others.

Well, you do seem to be under the impression that you will survive multiple hits without healing and/or moving, which might work in the other dungeons, but quite clearly won’t work here.

Really? Can you quote where I said I should be able to stand there and spam “1”, never move and always win?

Do you ever respond without exaggerating or making Straw Man arguments?

Michelangelo.1742:

The Goemm’s Lab JP was not glitchy for me and it is a fun and well designed jumping puzzle! The only problem I had with it is when you fall off it does not teleport you back to the beginning.

Uhhh…that’s the glitch.

That glitch can kill you as well, requiring you to start from scratch. That glitch caused a few accounts to be wrongly suspended. That glitch, which has been known for months, should have been fixed before adding an achievement in there.

lordkrall.7241:

Of course, but the damage they do is not really an issue. The issue people seem to have is that they are unable to avoid it. Lets face it, the skills in question don’t really do much damage, the issue is that people are assuming that they can stand and take the hits instead of avoiding them (which is possible in 99% of the cases).

Indeed, but the thing is the dungeon IS properly done, you simply can’t accept the fact that you are unable to do it without changing your approach to the fights.

What exactly is my approach to fights? Perhaps you can enlighten me since you seem to know why I struggled so much more in this dungeon than almost any others.

lordkrall.7241:

Indeed, but that is just the thing. People are overall NOT complaining about the mobs, but rather the mechanics of the fights. And that isn’t something that is “stored in columns in a database”. It would require more or less completely rebuilding the whole fights which would require quite a bit of work.

The amount of damage they deal certainly is.

Players with certain builds (that work great for them otherwise), and those who aren’t yet strong enough (armour, weapons, etc), probably find that the mechanics/damage is simply too much for them to handle.

I don’t want to get into a, “What build is best” debate because in the end it doesn’t matter. Living Story dungeons need to have options for different player levels.

As to how much time it would take, this is an irrelevant argument. If it takes too much time to properly make a dungeon, then reevaluate the release schedule. Don’t just pump out content for the sake of content. I would rather the Living Story be pushed back a week, than to have content that I try doing for hours and hours, only to give up in frustration.

Flameseeker.1563:

They should have split the dungeon into story/explorable.
The difference could be in the number of monsters, skills they use and their damage so it would be easy/hard mode kind of thing.

For example in story there would be less silver mobs, golems at frizz wouldn’t have pull, mai would deal less damage, have less stacks of the buff and barrage phases would be shorter.

In terms of achievements the “beat the boss” would be awarded in story (normal mode) while the skill challenge ones could be gotten from explorable (hard mode).
This way people that want story wouldn’t be left out while the rest of the community had their challenge.

Is this that unreasonable to foresee?

Sounds completely reasonable to me. Thanks for your input.

Danikat.8537:

I see 2 problems with the ideas suggested so far:

1. They already have got different rewards for different levels of time/ability, and people aren’t happy because they want all of them regardless of where they personally fall in that scale.

You can just go out and kill 1 Aetherblade in each area and get the first tier of the achievements, or do the dungeon and get just the basic achievement for finishing it – being rewarded for participating.

But very few people seem to be happy with that. They don’t get those first few achievements and then conclude they’ve reached the limit of their time and/or ability and go away happy with what they’ve got (or accept that they’re the exceptional outlier who won’t be able to get any). They try for the others (or assume they can’t get them) and then complain that it’s too hard and demand that ALL the content be brought down to their level. But if Anet did that someone else would ask for it to be lowered again, and again, until we get to the people who come on the forum after each Living Story chapter to say “Oh, I didn’t bother to log in or read anything about it online because I assumed it would be boring, can I have the achievements added to my account now since I missed it?”

To be fair, I think there may be some confusion as to how the achievements work. I’m sure that many believe that the only way to get credit for the entire event, is to fill the bar to full.

Either way, the problem is that when you combine factors (time, tasks, skill, reward expectations), you create a situation in which a wide range of people potentially feel like they’re not being treated “fairly” or with “respect.”

That said, in terms of things like dungeons, or more specifically this current dungeon, we have a limited availability, with one path only. If that path is beyond the ability of a certain range of players, then it’s unfair. The reason it’s unfair isn’t because it’s hard, it’s because every player has the right to follow the story though.

Players are able to progress up until the dungeon, at which time they’re denied the ability to progress.

Danikat.8537:

2. A lot of the people who want all the achievements and have the skill to get them (the ones the harder content is aimed at) will still choose the easiest path because it’s quicker and/or easier and then complain about the poor rewards. So even the people this harder content is aimed at won’t be happy.

Look at the Super Adventure Box for example. This was totally optional content that had absolutely nothing to do with anything else in game and didn’t reward anything except some achievements, a title and potentially some cosmetic weapon skins. They also included an easy mode that removed most of the jumping and enemies, but also limited which achievements you could get.

And what happened? Did people come here to say “Well, the normal mode was too hard for me, but I was rewarded for the level of time and effort I did put in so I’m happy with it and happy for the people who enjoyed the harder challenge and got the other rewards”? Of course not. They either demanded that all the achievements should be rewarded in easy mode and ideally in 1-2 runs, or long essays detailing exactly how each part should be changed to match their personal play style and skill level. Meanwhile people who could (and did) finish it on normal mode then began doing endless runs on easy mode to farm the reward chest and complained that the rewards weren’t good enough because you didn’t get the additional bauble that you did get in normal mode.

Lets be clear here. The attempt should be to give the widest range of players the ability to play the game. That should be the ultimate goal here. To deny any of the players on the scale the consideration they deserve will not make for a very successful game.

The only way I can see to do that is to give players options. If they choose to run easy mode, then that is what they choose. If they want to challenge themselves, they have that option.

A one-size-fits-all solution will never work with a game that has such a wide range of players. This doesn’t work in sports, it doesn’t work in school, it doesn’t work in computer games.

ANet needs to spend time making sure the experience is amazing for as many players as they can. If that means delaying the Living Story by a few weeks, then so be it. Blasting out content, and hoping they hit that magical sweet spot, while still changing up the mechanics is a next to impossible task.

lordkrall.7241:

Crazylegsmurphy.6430:

I’m sorry, but your arguments are so far beyond ridiculous that it won’t do either of us any good to continue. If its all the same, I’ll wait for other responses.

How are they beyond ridiculous? Please explain that to me?
I answered your arguments in a nice manner, why can’t you just do the same? This is a forum after all, if you are going to assume everyone will agree with you, you might find it hard to frequent a forum.

Tell you what. If you spend the next hour learning what logical fallacies are, and point out at least two in your responses, I’ll respond with a very well thought out response to your posts. Deal?

Bloodstealer.5978:

@Crazylegsmurphy.6430

Your correct, all players are not equal, that’s exactly how it should be… I hated the Mad King Clock Tower cos it was just not suiting my play style.. but I worked at it until I adapted. This dungeon requires players to do the same.. maybe change your build a little maybe change your tactics.. either way its not a gimmee and should not be considered so. If you miss parts of the story then so be it, you simply are not up to it, no disrespect but that is not ANETs fault.

Sorry but it is you who is missing the point .. no content or achievement should be a gimmee.. you want that go find some P2W game that offers it.Why should something be dumbed down to accommodate you when many others have taken the time to learn it and adapt to it and overcome it.

I couldn’t disagree with you more.

GW2, and the Living Story are not for the elite. No one says it has to be a “gimme” but if they’re going to advertise this to everyone, it has to be accessible to everyone. It doesn’t need to be dumbed down, it needs to have options.

We all payed for this game, and we all support it. No one should be denied access to the story because ANet feels they have to cater to the top players. As pixelpumpkin said so well above, this needs to accommodate the majority of players.

My solution above also provides options for all levels.

Also…here is a quick, and simple solution.

First. The facts.

- This Living Story is, and should be accessible to all.

- This content is only available for a limited time.

- All players should be able to reasonably finish the story, without resorting to days of frustration, or steep learning curve.

So, what is the solution?

Simple, allow players/groups to choose difficultly level, and scale rewards accordingly.

This allows for maximum flexibility, and is most fair. If you’re a solo player, and want to complete it by yourself, choose your difficulty.

Are you a new group? Choose easy, see story, but get less rewards.

Are you a hardcore player? Choose hard, get a challenge, and be rewarded for your efforts.

Are you casual, and don’t have time to dedicate? Choose easy, and get the story done.

lordkrall.7241:

And yet nothing in these Living Story releases have required “large amounts of time”.
Effigy could be done in about 2 hours (and 2 hours during the course of a month is very little), the pinatas could be completed around that amount of time as well. And the candy eating could be done in 2 minutes more or less.

How is it incorrect?
Would the real world feel living if everything was put on hold for two weeks because you hadn’t experienced it yet?
How about WW2? Should we remake that so that you can participate in it, since you missed it?

I’m sorry, but your arguments are so far beyond ridiculous that it won’t do either of us any good to continue. If its all the same, I’ll wait for other responses.

Bloodstealer.5978:

Crazylegsmurphy.6430:

lordkrall.7241:

Crazylegsmurphy.6430:

Sorry, but this group is amazing because of our ability to have fun, and work together. We have had no issues with any other dungeons. We figure out the mechanics, and work quite well at solving them.

This however was beyond our abilities. We all knew what to do, but simply couldn’t do it. After hours of trying we got sick of trying and gave up. We knew the mechanics, we knew what the solution was, but we couldn’t make it happen.

While I appreciate your feedback, to generalize and assume that we’re just “not good enough” to complete the dungeon is a tad insulting.

And yet it is fully possible to complete the dungeon with a pug-group, even for a average player as myself.

Which part is it that is currently the issue?

If you knew what was happening and what to do but yet couldn’t doing there were clearly something done wrong somewhere.

The part that is the issue is that ANet’s solution to difficulty is to up the damage and things than damage, to the point where players spend more time getting knocked down, than actually playing.

For example. When fighting Mai, I am running around avoiding getting bombed because the bombs can knock off a bunch of my damage, making me unable to effectively fight Mai (when shields are down). The problem is, that if I stray too far, she will shadow lunge at me, and insta-kill me.

So, while I understand what to do…I am unable to complete the task because despite doing what is needed, the mechanics have been designed so unless I am of a specific build, level, or whatever….I run the risk of instantly dying.

Then, the problem is that my group, who is trying their best to not die as well, are tasked with trying to get me back up. The problem is that the fight has almost no pauses, so they risk getting killed trying to get me up.

Then, even if they get me up. I’m so low on HP, that trying to recover, while avoiding another insta-kill from Mai, long enough to get to the cannon fire….which insta-kills me.

So, while you may argue that suddenly my build sucks (even though I’ve been able to get through almost all the other content), the fact is that the mechanics are too unforgiving for me to be able to complete the dungeon. I’m not sure what I could do beyond being forced to create another class.

There is your first issue.. Mai should not be able to 1 hit you.. yes she hits hard but this spells one thing only to me.. your build isn’t specced right for it, not the mechanics of the fight being bad.

Secondly if your group is running round like headless chickens avoiding cannon fire then expect the floor to become covered.. if you could relatively grouped and running the same direction you might find it more evadable.. you say your a decent group that work well together, so this should not of been to harder task to work out.

Thirdly if someone is unfortunate to run out of evades or find they have one hit stats during cannon fire.. don’t try ressing them while its still happening.. keep yourself alive and wait it out… then res the fallen but even then you should by now be aware that Mai will target you while ressing so be ready to evade or just keep ressing then running then repeat… A guardian tanking here for a bit is more than enough to get the dead raised. Its only more difficult when there is only one of you alive and trying to ress everyone… but that comes back to other things mentioned previously.

Honestly this is the first dungeon they have brought in that isn’t just a faceroll exercise to suit the zerker brigade it does require some tactic, some group behaviour and yes some luck and patience… nothing wrong with that in my eyes especially when PUGS’s are more than capable of completing it so easily.

Key requirements I found for this pretty early on… decent stats, know when to use your evades, group buffs/heals and make sure you have some stability and / or condition removal .. forewarned is forearmed. And please don’t tell me your class or classes cant have all these things… my little necro has failed it only twice and one of those was in the first 15mins, the second was actually last night, late and the group were too tired to try Mai a second time…. but no biggy, having things easily face rolled over and over gets old very quickly.. THIS GAME NEEDS MORE DIFFICULTY NOT LESS!

I appreciate the strategy, but it misses my point completely.

1. Not all players are equal

2. Not everyone has unlimited time to dedicate to one specific part of the game.

3. If I can’t complete the dungeon, I miss parts of the story.

lordkrall.7241:

Crazylegsmurphy.6430:

Why do your arguments always consist of totally absurd twisting of my words?

Perhaps take a moment and consider what I’m saying. Instead of twisting it around, try to think of some solutions.

But isn’t that more or less what you are saying?
You talk about not tying achievements to “hard” stuff, because everyone should be able to get them. With that logic they would need to give people achievements by simply logging in, since all people can’t spend more than 10 minutes per day playing, and that is not nearly enough time to achieve anything really.

Now its only 10min per day?

Here is a potential, and one of the best solutions I’ve seen.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/suggestions/3-Step-Solution-to-ALL-our-woes/

I’m saying that ANet shouldn’t just toss level 80 content in the game that requires a lot of time and dedication to learn and/or complete (in addition to everything else), then put a very short time limit on it.

There are a lot of different options they could consider here, and they have the game mechanics to do it.

I wish more people would get involved in this.

My suggestion is to create a post in the Living Story section and keep updating it each time you release a new poll. That way its easier to find for all.

lordkrall.7241:

So, you basically want people to get access to every achievement and thing in the game by simply logging in?

Because that is what would be required for some people to access everything.
They can’t really create the game around people that only have 1 hours playtime each day, when clearly a rather big part of the playerbase have quite a few hours.

Why do your arguments always consist of totally absurd twisting of my words?

Perhaps take a moment and consider what I’m saying. Instead of twisting it around, try to think of some solutions.

lordkrall.7241:

So, you basically want to go back to the old model with a bit new content every 6 months or so?

People don’t NEED to do the achievements. The rewards you get for doing them are cosmetic and isn’t required to play the game.

The Living story is trying to make the world seem alive, and for it to seem alive stuff must keep happening at a rather rapid pace, otherwise it would just feel weird.

Are you so sure it has to be an all, or nothing solution?

I don’t NEED to play the game at all. I WANT to play the game. However, of the tasks I’m being presented with are consistently requiring large amounts of time to complete, yet are only available for a limited time, it becomes futile.

Your last argument is incorrect. There is a difference between a flashy, car salesman approach, and a personal, well considered, well paced story.

I’m not sure you guys are getting it here.

This isn’t about how difficult it is, it’s about how accessible it is for all players, given the short amount of time it’s available.

I don’t have 8 hours to dedicate to a single dungeon in addition to finding stashes, killing pirates, doing monthlies/dailies, completing Dragon Bash, and/or anything else I want to do in game.

You can’t take this dungeon out of context of the rest of the game. I’m glad it’s a challenge for some of you, but for many players, the time requirements are beyond what is reasonable, which means they (myself included) will miss out on parts of the story.

You can continue telling me how much you think my group and I suck at GW2, but unless ANet is willing to allow us weeks/months to learn/level up, we have a problem.

It is my personal belief that if Guild Wars 2 continues to release Living Story content akittens current pace, and with its current issues, it will ultimately result in the failure of the game.

I am willing to expand on any of these if people are interested.

Here is why:

1. Achievements vs. Time

Having multiple achievements, attached to rewards, available for a limited time, is a recipe for disaster.

It encourages players to resort to selfish behavior (stealing, AFK, griefing), and find ways to circumvent the intended mechanics (camping, guesting).

It discourages players who enjoy achievements, yet don’t have the time to dedicate to repetitive, or skill based tasks that require time.

2. Story vs. Time

Due to the quick pace at which the Living Story is progressing, players run the risk of missing huge chunks of content.

Players who continuously find themselves unable to dedicate the required time to keep up with the story, will more than likely lose the desire to continue playing.

Story that is tied to content inaccessible to all levels is discouraging for all players. Simply being “leveled up” is not an appropriate or realistic solution.

3. Time vs. Reward

Players need to feel that the time and money they’re spending in game, is providing them with a fair, and reasonable rewards. If a task takes too much time, or requires too much money to complete, players will become discouraged (100,000 candies, RNG).

If the rewards for completing a task are not flexible, players may find little incentive to continue playing.

4. Social vs. Solo

Forcing players to participate with, or without the option to partner up (Effigy Lighting, Molten Facility), leaves many feeling frustrated.

Achievements/tasks that encourage competition, or don’t require anyone else to complete can lead many players to feel unwanted pressure, and/or loneliness.

5. Fun vs. Time

Killing ten rats is not fun. Nor is lighting 50 effigies, hitting 250 things, gathering 100,000 items, or any other form of grind. When players are given a limited window to complete tasks, it can be frustrating if the tasks require large amounts of time.

I could probably go on, but for me, I have finally hit a point where the Living Story has demanded so much of me in such a short time, that my frustration level has peaked. What was once a fun experience has become a desperate attempt to keep up.

As I mentioned in another post, this current story arch will more than likely be the first time I don’t complete the achievements or story. This realization has actually tweaked something in my brain, which has caused me to question whether I even care.

Video games are supposed to be fun. They aren’t supposed to be chores that we become addicted to, and enduce feelings of disappointment and guilt when they can’t be played.

The Living Story, while a good idea is trying to be everything to everyone, and as a result being frustrating to almost everyone. If anyone is interested, I’ll outline my ideas for how to salvage this game. I fear that if something isn’t done soon, the frustration levels will force most players to abandon the Living Story, and/or the game.

Mortifer.2946:

Finally, something hard and challenging. Not for noobs who still dont know how to move around and dodge, For this Arena Net, I love you, I really do

For all those who cry about nerfing it: you suck

Gonna reword this to what I think it’s actually saying.

Finally, content that I consider hard and challenging. I don’t care if anyone else has fun, or how frustrating it is for low level or new players. For only considering one portion of the player base I love you Arena Net, I really do.

For all those who have legitimate criticism about it, and would like ANet to consider alternatives for future releases, not only does your opinion not matter to me, but I’m also going to insult you for not living up to my standards.

P.S. Please don’t reference my post later when I’m complaining that the world is empty and there are no new players entering the game.

Esplen.3940:

Yes, I agree the first 8 hours of me inside the dungeon were painful, but once I started to get the hang of it, it became more and more FUN and EASY. And no, those 8 hours weren’t just 8 hours of me wiping constantly, I finished it 3 times in those 8 hours, which is slow, but it was great practice.

I think this statement says more about my point than I ever could.

I’m sincerely sorry to all the players that got banned due to the bug in this JP. I consider it my fault since I probably should have reported this bug a few more times in addition to the 10+ times I already had prior to this Living Story update.

I’m so sorry.

trickfred.4097:

Shemsu.8721:

Molten facility was fun and epic but not hard

That’s exactly what temporary content should be: fun and epic, but not excessively hard.

Let this dungeon be hard when it becomes a fractal (as they have been hinting it will become). While it’s temporary, it should be doable by an average group with any class composition. Think of it as advertisement for the future fractal.

I couldn’t agree more.

lordkrall.7241:

Crazylegsmurphy.6430:

Sorry, but this group is amazing because of our ability to have fun, and work together. We have had no issues with any other dungeons. We figure out the mechanics, and work quite well at solving them.

This however was beyond our abilities. We all knew what to do, but simply couldn’t do it. After hours of trying we got sick of trying and gave up. We knew the mechanics, we knew what the solution was, but we couldn’t make it happen.

While I appreciate your feedback, to generalize and assume that we’re just “not good enough” to complete the dungeon is a tad insulting.

And yet it is fully possible to complete the dungeon with a pug-group, even for a average player as myself.

Which part is it that is currently the issue?

If you knew what was happening and what to do but yet couldn’t doing there were clearly something done wrong somewhere.

The part that is the issue is that ANet’s solution to difficulty is to up the damage and things than damage, to the point where players spend more time getting knocked down, than actually playing.

For example. When fighting Mai, I am running around avoiding getting bombed because the bombs can knock off a bunch of my damage, making me unable to effectively fight Mai (when shields are down). The problem is, that if I stray too far, she will shadow lunge at me, and insta-kill me.

So, while I understand what to do…I am unable to complete the task because despite doing what is needed, the mechanics have been designed so unless I am of a specific build, level, or whatever….I run the risk of instantly dying.

Then, the problem is that my group, who is trying their best to not die as well, are tasked with trying to get me back up. The problem is that the fight has almost no pauses, so they risk getting killed trying to get me up.

Then, even if they get me up. I’m so low on HP, that trying to recover, while avoiding another insta-kill from Mai, long enough to get to the cannon fire….which insta-kills me.

So, while you may argue that suddenly my build sucks (even though I’ve been able to get through almost all the other content), the fact is that the mechanics are too unforgiving for me to be able to complete the dungeon. I’m not sure what I could do beyond being forced to create another class.

lordkrall.7241:

Pixelpumpkin.4608:

That’s great for you that that worked out for you, but please refrain from making this a general statement. Maybe “It’s not that hard” for you – but I just gave up after over three hours (with my established dungeon group of players) because we ran out of time.

And this might very well be the reason why people are having a hard time.
They go towards the dungeon thinking it is the same as all other dungeons where simply zerk it down is the way to go.
That is clearly not the way to do this dungeon so even “established groups” might have issues if they don’t adapt to the situation.

Sorry, but this group is amazing because of our ability to have fun, and work together. We have had no issues with any other dungeons. We figure out the mechanics, and work quite well at solving them.

This however was beyond our abilities. We all knew what to do, but simply couldn’t do it. After hours of trying we got sick of trying and gave up. We knew the mechanics, we knew what the solution was, but we couldn’t make it happen.

EDIT: Look at it this way. Say the solution to a boss fight is to avoid the fire. Yet, the fire covers the entire floor at points in the fight. That’s all fine, unless the fire kills the player so fast they don’t have time to avoid it, and when downed, are killed.

So unless you’re extremely lucky, or very good…l knowing what to do makes little difference. Factor in the time it take to restart and redo the entire fight, and it becomes more frustrating than it’s worth.

While I appreciate your feedback, to generalize and assume that we’re just “not good enough” to complete the dungeon is a tad insulting.

lordkrall.7241:

Another thing to keep in mind is the fact that the living story does NOT end with the dungeon, but rather with another step that is not yet released (and probably won’t require completion of the dungeon first, but time will tell)

Perhaps not, but not being able to complete it is kinda like walking out in the middle of a movie because that taco you ate a few hours earlier has come back with a vengeance. Sure, I may be able to see the end, but with a giant chunk missing.

This JP has been bugged since day one. It’s known, yet ANet decided to put an achievement in it. This is a terrible decision.

So after spending a week on vacation, my girlfriend and I had a chance to check out the new Living Story. After a day of playing, I am fairly convinced this will be the first time in this game when I am unable to complete all the Living Story achievements.

What’s worse, is this will probably be the first time I don’t get to actually see the end of the story.

Firstly. Despite the repeated bug reports to ANet regarding the glitch in Goemm’s Lab, they have decided to add an achievement at the end of this JP. I was able to get my way though, but only after repeated attempts and restarts. This took way too much time, not due to difficulty, but due to glitchy, unfixed bugs.

Second. Putting any achievement for a Living Story in the Eternal Battlegrounds JP is asinine. This JP is hard enough at the best of times let alone requiring more players to be in there. If the intention is to get players into WvW, this is not going to be a very good first impression.

I’m not sure I can even stand to try that JP again.

Finally. The dungeon is ridiculous. I go from doing pretty well in PvE, to being insta-killed in this dungeon. I just spent three…yes, three hours with a group that has had little issues in the past doing dungeons, and we never did beat Mai.

The amount of insta-killing mechanics in this dungeon means that not only can I not finish it to see the story, but even considering the achievements…..forget it.

I realize some are going to agree with me, and some are not. I understand that some are going to call me a noob, or whatever, but the simple fact is that I’m getting very tired of the inconsistency and expectations of these Living Story updates.

ANet seems to be in reactive mode, rather than pro-active mode. They release content, people voice criticism, and ANet responds by overcompensating. They just can’t seem to find a balance for all players. It’s either too hard, too easy, too long, too short, etc.

Either way. As much as I would like to see the end of this story, I think I may have to resort to checking it out on YouTube.

I am happy to say that I didn’t buy a single RNG box from the Gem Store during Dragon Bash, and won’t be buying any in the future unless something drastically changes.

I still think that pixelpumpkin’s solution is the best (https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/suggestions/3-Step-Solution-to-ALL-our-woes/first#post2253344 ) moving forward, but until people stop pouring money into these lotto tickets, ANet won’t have much incentive to change.

I personally feel you are justified in feeling ripped off. RNG boxes are a ripoff no matter how you look at it. I think most players feel that they have a reasonable chance at getting a high-value item, because why would ANet choose to screw over its players?

The problem is that ANet is so determined to make money off its players, that it will risk upsetting, and ultimately turning away players. They know that in the end there will be a core group of player that will spend huge amounts of money in an attempt to get the rare items.

Most of us will catch on early and stop spending money on these. In the future, I suggest both supporting pixelpumpkin’s thread, and only buying items from the gem store that aren’t RNG. As soon as we all do that, ANet will have to choose whether they want to make money legitimately, or by taking advantage of people.

AntiGw.9367:

Crazylegsmurphy.6430:

If you hate RNG, you may want to support and discuss posts like the one pixelpumpkin made.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/suggestions/3-Step-Solution-to-ALL-our-woes/

Or, perhaps mine.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/RNG-A-Soultion-For-All/

I feel for the OP. I think that playing the game should reward you. Having everything random does level the playing field, but it also causes resentment for those who dedicate a lot of time and money to GW2 and are still at the mercy of RNG.

We should all have the option to work towards the things we want.

Or perhaps we should all stop making new topics about something that isn’t a problem and already has a billion topics.

Care to expand and back up the claims thakittens not a problem?

Feremist.6935:

Crazylegsmurphy.6430:

TheOneNOnlyGeneralBama.9586:

Crazylegsmurphy.6430:

Torpian.9142:

Are you male or female?

Why in the world would that matter?

I think you and I both know why , lets just say his intentions are to creep.

Perhaps, but I wouldn’t want to jump to conclusions. Being specific doesn’t automatically make you a creep, however I still can’t understand why a persons gender in game would matter.

As long as they’re fun, it shouldn’t matter wrap parts they have on the other end.

I’m male and for whatever reason you want my gender I don’t know but hopefully not to creep…

You may want to take another look at what I posted. I don’t care what gender you are. I’m just saying, I’m not sure why it would matter to you either.

TheOneNOnlyGeneralBama.9586:

Crazylegsmurphy.6430:

Torpian.9142:

Are you male or female?

Why in the world would that matter?

I think you and I both know why , lets just say his intentions are to creep.

Perhaps, but I wouldn’t want to jump to conclusions. Being specific doesn’t automatically make you a creep, however I still can’t understand why a persons gender in game would matter.

As long as they’re fun, it shouldn’t matter wrap parts they have on the other end.

I get up and open RNG boxes to see what clothes I’m going to wear for the day. I often leave the house in velvet track suits.

In the morning I sit up and extend a glowing hand, hoping someone will revive me, but…I often say, “urgh” and lay back down.