Guild Wars 2

When I use greatsword in pvp I like to mind stab the gate when the start timer hits zero.

I avoid killing rabbits – I like rabbits.

I like to jump dodge over a cliff before hitting the glider.

Leon de Damasco.8105:

Gun Kata! Courtesy of my beloved Equilibrium.

lol, I would play this.

skcamow.3527:

Really surprised I haven’t seen anything specific for MH pistol, used to be the big thing it seemed most mesmers wanted most.

EDIT: I see apharma’s there, gunslinger could be cool.

MH Focus > MH Pistol.

Justine.6351:

Whatever the mechanics, needs to have mace mainhand !

Hmm, tough choice between Moot or Astralaria tbh – I wouldn’t mind Axe mainhand.

(Or mainhand Focus!)

Depends where the expansion is set.

If we go to Crystal Desert then I’d like a “Mirage” themed spec with the focus being on illusions dealing damage (maybe shatter skills get replaced for illusion enhancements so burst damage is much less, but sustained damage is boosted significantly) and themed around being elusive.

Excessive condi spam combo:
1) Phase Retreat + iWarlock
2) F5 (+ Blink) + F3 + Mirror Images + F2 + F1 (+ Chaos Storm)
3) F5 + Mirror Images (+ run/dodge towards) + F3
4) Swap weapon + iMage + iLeap/Swap + BF + F2 + F1

Of course this is on a long cooldown so can’t be used frequently, but when you absolutely want to unload your entire skill bar to nuke someone this is pretty deadly. And of course it leaves you with barely any follow up damage so the goal is to nuke someone to downed like the GS burst combo.

Step 4 depends on timing – if you just want instant burst then omit the iMage summon and maybe forget ileap/swap.
Also could take the time to slap down Chaos Storm before exiting F5.

Blink depends on distance. You could initially swap weapon after spawning both staff illusions and use Prestige to stealth and close the distance before unloading the full F5 combo without the need of Blink. Of course it is also not a good idea to blow Blink a second time with Mirror Images on the follow up after F5 (unless also having Decoy for the safety net stun break), but if necessary it can be done for maximising the burst.

ZudetGambeous.9573:

This thread is just false equivalency after false equivalency.

1. I can’t dodge/block/invuln after power attacks have already damaged me either. This is exactly the same between power and condition. The difference being that power damage is faster and irreversible while conditions can be cleansed after application.

2. I can’t block/dodge/invuln every AA or weapon skill from power attacks either. If there are individual skills you think do too much condition damage in one hit then please list them so we can determine if they are actually a problem. necro scepter 1 applies a 10s bleed for 150 dmg a tick for a total of 1500 damage. It can’t crit and can be cleansed at any time. A ranger LB attack does 1000 per hit and can crit for 3000 damage. It is instant and can not be cleansed.

3. You can apply too many conditions at once. Weapon swap air sigil + instant attack + AA can do 20k damage in a single hit. Power damage skills can crit for 10k with no chance to cleanse. I’m not seeing the difference, I guess once has more visible icons, takes 1 full second to apply the damage and can be removed to deal 0 damage before that 1s while the other is instant with no icon and no way to stop it.

I agree with this.

Kasteros.9847:

Curunen.8729:

Kasteros.9847:

ZudetGambeous.9573:

Shiyo.3578:

Wolfric.9380:

Shiyo.3578:

Condi’s should be weaker than power builds in PVP because they require almost zero thought or brain power to deal damage with them.

While power builds have to time their damage between blocks, invuls, dodges, and what have you, condition builds can just press their buttons whenever they want and eventually randomly kill you.

Oh, also, the worst thing of all is that conditions burst almost as hard as power builds. That’s not ok.

Most teams I fight in ranked have 2-3 condi players on them, sometimes 4.

Please bring conditions back in line, anet.

While i agree some condi “Bursts” are not good, 2-3 condi classes would mean the game is balaced between condi/power. And in reality we see about 1/3 condi builds average. I know its a bad feeling that condis are out and can kill you but it dosen´t seem to be to much….
I know i die to most mesmers but this doesn´t mean i loose a match … I avoid dueling them and eiter win the teamfight or a duel against a class i can beat…
And the rising condi warriors. I had a hard time bating good power warriors. The new condi ones don´t kill me, the fight becomes a stalemate now. So not all is about meta builds and the picture is over a lot of classes …

2-3 on the enemy TEAM, sometimes 4. Rarely 5.
6-8 per match, sometimes upwards of 9.

The fact that condi warriors burst me harder than any power based class is completely absurd. Being bursted by CONDITIONS faster and harder than any POWER based build is not ok. Mesmers and necros can burst pretty hard too.

If I don’t have focus earth 4/5 up as ele and a warrior attacks me I’m going to do 9 times out of 10.

Why exactly?

I know games like WoW have conditions set up as slow long term damage. Is there some law that says it has to be like this? Is there any reason conditions shouldn’t be the main form of burst?

I also don’t understand why people keep saying that block/invuln/dodge doesn’t work on conditions… i’ve blocked, dodged and invulned many conditions. If you find conditions are somehow going through these effects please make sure to report them as exploiting or bugs because conditions are not applied through these effects (barring unblockable attacks and physical only invuln).

Then you should report bug, cos condis dmg you even when you dodge or block You can block/dodge attack applying it, but not a condi that is already on you. I agree with invul, but not with dodges or blocks, let’s be realists. While all those effects work against power builds, the only thing against condis are resistsance and invul. The longest invul is like 3 secs, while the longest resistance for warrior is 9 sec, unless you pick everything that gives you resistance, then it is about 30 secs, but then… you are kitten and can’t do a thing cos you lack stabillity, survi and dmg and in result you die from direct damage

The idea is to dodge/block/invuln big condi application in the first place rather than mitigating it after being inflicted. Cleanse is a safety net.

I will only accept that yes skill animations should be moderated so that both big condi application and big direct damage skills have suitable animations, tells, or some way of anticipating an incoming burst so as being able to prevent the direct damage or conditions from being applied.

Tell me how to dodge every single scepter 1? CB? Every shroud skill? Every of em are big condi application skilsl and you can’t even dodge/block some od them! Not to mention that a lot of skills apply condis due to traits so you have to dodge a lot of em… And as you mentioned, a lot of animations look similar when we take reaper into account, expecially in shroud… Or invisible mesmer. Also when warrior stun you, you can’t dodge / block his big condi application skills… And as I wrote almost all skills apply a lot of condis with all this trait / runes nonsense… ><

And there I agree that some condi application skills should be looked at and made more accessible to counter.

Where condi mesmer is concerned, despite shatters being instant hit it requires multiple chain shatters to build significant burst (unlike power mesmer which requires a single shatter and/or combo to nuke a huge chunk of hp) – a significant amount of which can be evaded/blocked (or illusions killed). Any residual application from the odd lone shatter is usually a minor threat to hit points and can be allowed to tick.

However when players panic if say a less than 5 stacks of a damaging condition are on them, either popping cleanses thinking it will kill them otherwise then there is a problem.

That other suggestion frequently popping up in this forum of greying out HP bars to indicate max damage of currently incurred conditions would go a long way to make it clear for players when to worry and when not to worry.

Kasteros.9847:

ZudetGambeous.9573:

Shiyo.3578:

Wolfric.9380:

Shiyo.3578:

Condi’s should be weaker than power builds in PVP because they require almost zero thought or brain power to deal damage with them.

While power builds have to time their damage between blocks, invuls, dodges, and what have you, condition builds can just press their buttons whenever they want and eventually randomly kill you.

Oh, also, the worst thing of all is that conditions burst almost as hard as power builds. That’s not ok.

Most teams I fight in ranked have 2-3 condi players on them, sometimes 4.

Please bring conditions back in line, anet.

While i agree some condi “Bursts” are not good, 2-3 condi classes would mean the game is balaced between condi/power. And in reality we see about 1/3 condi builds average. I know its a bad feeling that condis are out and can kill you but it dosen´t seem to be to much….
I know i die to most mesmers but this doesn´t mean i loose a match … I avoid dueling them and eiter win the teamfight or a duel against a class i can beat…
And the rising condi warriors. I had a hard time bating good power warriors. The new condi ones don´t kill me, the fight becomes a stalemate now. So not all is about meta builds and the picture is over a lot of classes …

2-3 on the enemy TEAM, sometimes 4. Rarely 5.
6-8 per match, sometimes upwards of 9.

The fact that condi warriors burst me harder than any power based class is completely absurd. Being bursted by CONDITIONS faster and harder than any POWER based build is not ok. Mesmers and necros can burst pretty hard too.

If I don’t have focus earth 4/5 up as ele and a warrior attacks me I’m going to do 9 times out of 10.

Why exactly?

I know games like WoW have conditions set up as slow long term damage. Is there some law that says it has to be like this? Is there any reason conditions shouldn’t be the main form of burst?

I also don’t understand why people keep saying that block/invuln/dodge doesn’t work on conditions… i’ve blocked, dodged and invulned many conditions. If you find conditions are somehow going through these effects please make sure to report them as exploiting or bugs because conditions are not applied through these effects (barring unblockable attacks and physical only invuln).

Then you should report bug, cos condis dmg you even when you dodge or block You can block/dodge attack applying it, but not a condi that is already on you. I agree with invul, but not with dodges or blocks, let’s be realists. While all those effects work against power builds, the only thing against condis are resistsance and invul. The longest invul is like 3 secs, while the longest resistance for warrior is 9 sec, unless you pick everything that gives you resistance, then it is about 30 secs, but then… you are kitten and can’t do a thing cos you lack stabillity, survi and dmg and in result you die from direct damage

The idea is to dodge/block/invuln big condi application in the first place rather than mitigating it after being inflicted. Cleanse is a safety net.

I will only accept that yes skill animations should be moderated so that both big condi application and big direct damage skills have suitable animations, tells, or some way of anticipating an incoming burst so as being able to prevent the direct damage or conditions from being applied.

hell yes, please make this happen. I hate minor sigils/runes accumulating in the inventory.

Adonisis.9736:

Soothsayer.9206:

Chrono condi/shatter build:

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vhAQNAW7flknhG1YbawUNQtGLNH1ZCUABA6F0PTW9huoPKA-TJRBABAcRAArMQzPBA/3fAA

Core condi/shatter variant:

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vhAQNAW7flknhG1YbawUNQtGLEHkZASwCP3wFmAaKeYpB-TJRBAB+t/QzPBAAuIAgVGAA

I haven’t played this game in a while, but why is no one taking Deceptive Evasion anymore?

Sigil of Energy nerf, vigour nerf and superior Chrono illusion traits.

Shiyo.3578:

Condi’s should be weaker than power builds in PVP because they require almost zero thought or brain power to deal damage with them.

While power builds have to time their damage between blocks, invuls, dodges, and what have you, condition builds can just press their buttons whenever they want and eventually randomly kill you.

Oh, also, the worst thing of all is that conditions burst almost as hard as power builds. That’s not ok.

Most teams I fight in ranked have 2-3 condi players on them, sometimes 4.

Please bring conditions back in line, anet.

You also need to time condition application between blocks, evades, invulns and so on.

Conditions may tick passively once applied, but are actively applied in the same way as dealing direct damage.

The only difference is in some animations – some seemingly insignificant animation might load you with half a dozen stacks of bleeding whereas you can see something like Maul as it is activating.

However some direct damage animations are also small compared to their effect and some condition applications very obvious (ie, Confusing Images).

Kitten yeah. +1

One day maybe…

lol, good – at least the vitriol of the mob will be directed elsewhere.

Greasy.7609:

Torches are great at removing conditions if you spec the pledege

Yeah but The Pledge is also in Illusions which along with Inspiration and Chrono is “meta” anyway.

If Domination, Duelling and Chaos had even tiny condi cleanse/tramsmutation/transfer options, it would help spread out build options.

I personally don’t like huge and “in your face” backpieces, and I’d usually hide the skin anyway – so the skin doesn’t appeal to me.

As stat swap is the only other benefit it depends what stat(s) you might want in your wvw or pve build(s) as to the convenience of swapping. I think a few ascended backpieces covering the more common stats are all you really need so this feature of the legendary backpiece is also not a big deal for me either.

I agree that the two things that need to be spread more evenly across trait lines are:
- Illusion generation
- Condition cleanse

The second applies to all classes, not just mesmer, and would help builds not be pigeonholed into lines like Inspiration. They don’t need to be as powerful given there is a tradeoff between more offensive traits and the full sustain of Inspiration, but simple things like transfer a condition on crit (ie in Duelling, like sigil of generosity) or transmute incoming condition into a boon (ie in Chaos) or siphon a condition to a nearby clone (in Illusions)…

It’s just as bad as when we were glued to Duelling for DE, except now we’re glued to Inspiration for cleanse/sustain and Chrono for illusion generation. That leaves only one free trait line and it’s more accessible to go condi with Illusions in a single line than play anything else which would require more than one other line (ie Domination and Duelling). It’s silly.

The only reason I play GW2 is because Mesmer exists.

I’m sticking with Carrion + Scavenging.

It’s funny – the mercenary amulet removal is kind of a buff because it’s easier to kill players who were using merc in builds and have now switched to glassier amulets.

And you don’t lose much with Carrion – damage is just as good (condi damage is better), and with our active defences the loss in toughness isn’t a big deal.

This increase to 30s on its own doesn’t make sense – at least also increase the cooldown of the utility skill to be consistent.

And then decrease the cast time of the utility skill and give it an active effect (same for iDisenchanter).

Just seems weird.

Knoptix.5712:

stop crying, echo of memory really needed a nerf and it was bound to happen.

This thread is about Persistence of Memory, not Echo of Memory.

I’m happy about the Shield 4 nerf – it was necessary.

Mental Defence and Persistence of Memory nerfs just reinforce the supremacy of elite specs over core only builds.

I hope not too many players flock back to torch. I kind of liked being in the minority of players using torch since HoT while most used shield.

Shield nerf is very good and justified, I like that.

Mental Defence is a weird nerf, but not a big deal – I haven’t logged in to check but assuming the utility skill cool down has also been raised to 30s?

Persistence of Memory again assumes and reinforces the mandatory use of elite spec with Shield 4, Chronophantasma and alacrity. But this is no big deal since I already accept core only builds are a thing of the past and as more elite lines are released they will become necessities.

But overall the changes don’t bother me at all.

This further supports the point of view that elite trait lines will be mandatory from now into the future, because this change is solely based around Shield 4 and Chronophantasma.

Same with the Mental Defence nerf – and leaving the utility skill cooldown alone? Doesn’t make sense and again assumes Chronophantasma and Persistence of Memory are being used.

But I don’t care because I neither use Shield or use Persistence of Memory. Actually I’m happy because I’ll have an easier time fighting mesmers who use Shield. :}

I like some of the adventures and I think it is easy enough to get enough mastery points without needing gold in some of the more annoying ones (ie Tendril Torchers…). /shrug

I’m 7 mastery points away from the total and have plenty of Tangled Depths event achievements to unlock these left over. And I haven’t done most of the story achievements (only completed act 3 because that is the easy one) or a number of adventures to silver or gold (Tendrils, Flying Circus, Bugs, Fallen Masks, Fungus, etc…).

Haha, awesome!

lol

(but the other thread with a serious suggestion of splitting condi types is better)

Loads of people vouch for Sword /Torch. I certainly do.

Scepter/Pistol is kind of an old school choice now, but if it works for you then enjoy it.

babazhook.6805:

What exactly is Condition spam?

In order for a condition build to work, the player in question has to keep applying conditions. If they can not apply conditions on an ongoing basis than they will be unable to inflict enough damage to prevail in a given matchup.It then becomes a contest of that enemy player trying to remove or avoid those condition applications as they themselves inflict their own damage.

Now in my power build thief I can use mug and steal to an opponent for 2K plus damage. I can cloak and dagger for an additional 4 to 5k damage, then immediately backstab for 6 to 8 k damage. This is followed up by an AA chain to get some 8k more damage.

Why is this not considered “Power spam”? Why is it ok to have multiple attacks that apply damage via power used in a row and it not ok to have the same with conditions being applied?

I do not believe “condition spamming” out of hand. I believe there certain skills in very specific builds that are overtuned. I believe perplexity runes are overtuned. I believe this can all by addressed via tweaks rather than wholesale do over.

I also believe that when words like “cheese” and “spam” tossed around in order to denigrate a build or game style, it more an example of that persons personal bias towards a style of combat than it is one about balance.

Good post.

Yeah this is a good way to go.

There ought to be a distinction between damage dealing conditions and debuffs, both in application and cleansing.

Dawdler.8521:

Seems reasonable. Translation of the fantasy themed degrees to normal celsius is appreciated as well.

I loled. xD

PierPiero.9142:

using precision with sigils no ?

The point is most of the time in condi or even hybrid, double Doom is useful, bursting, energy or geomancy even.

I can’t think many of the on crit sigils being so important over other sigils in these builds as to invest so many stat points in precision, so I think it is a waste.

That’s the problem with both Rabid and Wanderer’s – because who uses Duelling anymore (no Sharper Images) given how we’re pushed to take Inspiration for cleanse, and Chrono offers more benefits than Duelling.

I can’t accept a wasted stat like precision if not having traits make use of it. Unless your build uses on crit sigils or something.

Too many rabbits on the brain.

(I say as I sip tea from a cup with pictures of rabbits adorning the outside xD)

I’ve been testing Viper and it’s just too kitten glassy.

As others have said, you don’t have the “time” in the “DoT” because every hit, every auto attack is a serious threat. Better off going full Zerker and going for one shot kills with power builds than trying to use Viper for hybrid.

I agree hopefully it will become clearer as we get more elite specs.

I definitely think the model of having mandatory elite spec choice will be pushed once this happens and the current seeming lack of build diversity will become less of an issue.

pico.6402:

Ok so for now the best option for condie mes in my opinion is sage amu. Same power and condi as merc, buff to vit and almost useless healing but it give U enough damage.
But now theres no chance to take down two thiefs like with merc, and even one thief or war can wreck me down in seconds.

My question is between Sage and Carrion – which is more useful?

Sure, 4 stat amulets have more stat points, but given how negligable healing power is does Sage offer much benefit beyond slightly higher direct damage (and lower condi damage)?

Both these need active components (along with every other phantasm skill) and reduced cast times.

I hope that means a buff to GS is incoming and gives people more reasons for full power play.

I was using carrion + scavenging runes before merc anyway so I’ll probably just switch back to that.

Part of me wants to run viper, but everytime I experiment with it I don’t like being extreme glass.

Invictorum.7643:

Run into a bansh- err… Daredevil? Detonate your tech, wait, Chaos armor.

lol, someone remembers tech armour for everything. xD

Back to carrion + scavenging then.

The problems that come with boons – such as stealing/transfer/stripping/corruption and duration increases would be a nightmare to balance I’d imagine.

I think it’s fine as it is.

That actually sounds awesome – detonating your Chaos Armour to damage or apply conditions to enemies and grant boons to allies.

Reminds me of Annihilation Field, Barrier or Tech Armour in Mass Effect 3 multiplayer.

I really like it.

I like Winds of Chaos as it is. They only need to buff its damage and or burn duration very slightly, and of course projectile speed. In any case I’m finding it really shines in hybrid damage, which the ideal stats can only be achieved in pve/wvw because of gear flexibility.

Chaos armour (Staff 4) can have reduced cooldown, proc aoe Chaos armour and maybe some other boons or effect right off the bat – like a 1/2s evade or something.

iWarlock is what needs help in terms of projectile reliability and giving the phantasm skill (same with all phantasm skills that aren’t Shield 4) an active effect.

I personally don’t want to see staff pushed either way towards Condi or Power – I would rather it be buffed as a hybrid damage dealer while maintaining itself as a defensive/kiting weapon compared with Scepter or Greatsword.

Regarding mesmer I’m in favour of the following (in order of preference from most to least):
1 – Mainhand Axe
2 – Mainhand Focus
3 – Spear (land)
4 – Hammer
5- Longbow
6 – Rifle
7 – Shortbow
8 – Mainhand Pistol

No, as said the cast is too long, the projectile is too unreliable, the condi/boon rip too transient due to shatters and the phantasm not good in a moving or large fights (ie not around a conquest point).

I think both utility skills (and every phantasm weapon skill) should have an immediate active effect like Shield 4, which I know has been suggested by several people in here before.

So if the utility skill stripped 2 boons and removed 2 conditions while casting the pDisenchanter it might be more useful. Similarly the pDefender utility could also grant aoe protection on cast.

I keep trying to get rid of them.

Riku.4821:

Buying one off the trading post: Fast and instant gratification.
Crafting one through collections: Slow guaranteed way to get the one you wanted.
Drop table: Roughly free but long RNG way to get one.

It was never said, crafting would be cheaper, faster, or better. Nothing beats buying something off the trading post. But for those who don’t have 1200* gold to buy Dusk or something similar, right off the bat. Crafting seems more possible as its 1100-1400* gold in a sustained amount.

• prices don’t reflect actual price, just simply numbers for example sake.

The only valid reasons I can think of for players not to buy straight from the TP are:
- not enough self restraint to save gold
- enjoying the precursor quests

Fair enough if a player enjoys the quests involved in crafting the precursor.

But earning gold is sustained. If a player can’t handle seeing gold numbers in their wallet of 3 figures or more then they can even invest that gold into mats or something.

Saving gold is slow and guaranteed, and a lot easier than going through a checklist of tasks to do and things to craft.

JP daily is much better.

But the difficulty can vary wildly – ie Scavenger’s Chasm which is tedious and I absolutely hate and then Spelunker’s Delve which is laughably easy and relaxing to do.

But in any case if you play all three game modes there are always at least 3 easy enough dailies.

I would buy a permanent Skritt transform tonic that left all class abilities intact.