Guild Wars 2

Leeto.1570:

In my videos you can see some 1vX but its complete joke to what i can do on thief or elementalist.

this has been my experience too.

The single biggest thing you can do to win more 1vX is:

I took a siphon minion build out tonight to check it out.

Fleshy AI is still terrible, entire fights with veterans and he stood idle multiple times. Sometimes he stood there right next to us sometimes he stood 100 distance away.

using his knockdown didnt help, he didnt even make it back to us before the vet was killed.

He would attack sometimes using staff AA sometimes not with dagger AA and never using life blast.

When they did attack the healing was great and damage was good too.

thanks Kravik well said, I just don’t have the patience to argue with the fanboi’s when they can’t even get their facts strait.

Softspoken.2410:

Dredlord.8076:

Bhawb.7408:

The reason for trait spread is due to the fact that traits were originally not tiered. Then when they were tiered, they ended up getting put in weird places sometimes.

I hear similar reasons for alot of necro stuff being the way it is.

Usually something like…

“well ability A was like this and because of that, ability B could not be that powerful. Then we had to nerf ability A but we forgot about ability B because we were too busy trying to figure out how to make mesmer GS AA into a piercing attack.”

Of all the ways to end that sentence, you picked spatial surge?

Do you have any advice for how to make a 1vMany build for the Necromancer?

yeah because I found it totally kittenin ridiculous they were working on something like this rather than virtually anything else with nearly any other class. It just shows how disconnected the devs are with their game.

Bhawb.7408:

The reason for trait spread is due to the fact that traits were originally not tiered. Then when they were tiered, they ended up getting put in weird places sometimes.

I hear similar reasons for alot of necro stuff being the way it is.

Usually something like…

“well ability A was like this and because of that, ability B could not be that powerful. Then we had to nerf ability A but we forgot about ability B because we were too busy trying to figure out how to make mesmer GS AA into a piercing attack.”

Kravick.4906:

My problem with the necromancer retaliation builds is they require a very specific set of traits that are spread out all over the kitten place, so it becomes very hard to do any kind of specialization with it. I’m sure it works in some situations, but because of the trait placement, you’re never doing anything remotely close to burst or tank. Its another niche build in the ocean of niche builds that is necromancer trait builds.

We need more specialist builds, but we can’t do that because of how spread out everything is. Wells run into the same problem. If you want to specialize in wells, you’re forced to take 20 points into curses, 10 into death magic and 30 points into blood for the juiciest well traits, and blood is regarded as our worst tree for the obvious reasons. You’re also left with no ability to get any of the weapon support traits like greater marks/staff cool down other than dagger, which are also extremely lackluster. You get no synergy with your wells by taking 30 points into blood other than the traits themselves as well so there is an issue with that if you also want to use the Spite tree to boost well power output.

Its a huge clusterkitten.

It’s true the devs have done a masterful job of scattering complementary traits over 2-3 trait lines. So much so that I believe they are suffering from a bad case of FOBO (FEAR of Being Overpowered) that has paralyzed their ability to take the class in a meaningful direction or even listen to feedback from the player base.

Kravick.4906:

Necromancers are just not a solo roaming class. You simply have to give up to much to achieve any kind of survivability beyond what other classes can achieve, but they still put out more damage than us when doing so.

this is the truth unfortunately.

Bas.7406:

Ah, the trolls are strong in this one. I opened it up expected complaints was met with it, when Andele attempts to help, the Dredlord raises his sarcastic head from the grave to help his minions :P.

Sorry.

I was not aware the spirit had entered me again.

Bhawb.7408:

you could never cast anything with an actual cast time, you’d just sit there eating damage until you gave up and logged out.

a couple of good ele’s can make you feel this way too though

Andele.1306:

Sorry im kinda hazy and just typed a different thing from what i thought. http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Putrid_Curse

most call it clueless but I am fine with you using the word hazy…

Andele.1306:

Also there is minion death aoe and using the actual staff 1 trough cpc or chillblains (both also applying poison).

we are talking about the scepter AA try and push past the haze.

Andele.1306:

Every build that does conditions has to take duration, the fact that necros and engies didnt was fixed in beta events.

Yeah I mentioned that in my post, did you miss that? hazy? bigons.

Andele.1306:

Please learn what efficiency means since we are the very definition of it in GW2,

you just went so deep in the haze here I don’t even know what game you are playing. If we were any where close to efficient there would not be 3-4 classes that do attrition better than us. They do attrition better because they are MORE efficient than the necro “attrition master of GW2”

Andele.1306:

the fact that you want to ultra specialize just means you are playing the wrong class for your playstyle.

I know, I know, hazy right? The whole point was that we shouldn’t have to ultra specialize. I don’t ultra specialize and you have no clue what my play style is do you?

you are so clueless hazey dood.

Bull Zooker.1672:

I guess you mean scepter andele?

that would be my guess as well.

but he is still wrong, just Scepter AA chain won’t keep poison up till the end of the next chain. It falls off before you can get another AA chain finished with no plus cond. duration.

This is just another example of where we fall just a tiny bit short.

Sure, you’re thinking what cond build doesn’t have at least some plus duration? The point is we shouldn’t have to invest in plus duration to just be able to maintain poison on a target while only using AA.

Investing in plus duration should allow you to easily maintain poison with AA and throw in a scepter #2 or #3 or both without poison dropping off and if you decided to go all in on duration with runes food and talent points your target should be sopping in poison from just AA spam.

It seems like a common theme with the necro, we just get less for the same investment in a spec than most other professions.

Daecollo.9578:

Dredlord.8076:

Daecollo.9578:

Kardiamond.6952:

I don’t think necromancer are supose to have burning as a condition directly.

And I’m not sure power necro would love this change.

Why is a power necro using a Staff?

because it’s our all around best weapon.

Not really, I could argue that axe is the best weapon.

you can argue whatever the kitten you want but kittening about the necro staff just makes you look like you picked up the necro yesterday after watching a “bursting video”.

Daecollo.9578:

Kardiamond.6952:

I don’t think necromancer are supose to have burning as a condition directly.

And I’m not sure power necro would love this change.

Why is a power necro using a Staff?

because it’s our all around best weapon.

The biggest reason our fear is so short is epidemic.

I would prefer if they just made epidemic not effect fear and give us a reasonable duration on it.

I would also prefer if condition duration didn’t effect it either and every necro got a 2 second fear on the mark and 3 on the DS fear

It’s ridiculous having to devote so much (runes, traits, food) to get our fear to last a bit more than 2 seconds.

Bhawb.7408:

Actually, necromancers can easily keep 100% ret up time, which in your example would indeed be ridiculous :P

easy in what way?

I don’t find it easy to give up better traits, gear and food to get it.

kpu.7839:

Ok. So it seems my confusion is associated with a poorly worded tool tip. “Reflect incoming damage back to its source” implies exactly that. It will “bounce” off me back to the attacker. “Reflect a portion of incoming damage…” would be a somewhat better description, but still not accurate. The formula ignores the specific damage of the skill, and reflects a fixed amount regardless of the damage taken. In fact, the skill doesn’t actually reflect anything (in my opinion “reflect” implies a damage reduction). It simply adds a passive attack.

yeah the tooltip is poorly worded, did the warrior take any damage at all from attacking you?

Talentless.5708:

Furthermore enemy tags should display their names in WvW too.

I completely agree! my name in game is almost the same, Dred Lord. Can you stop cryin about names in sigs now, and how awesome you are because you put yours there.

or the one that is oiled up and well fed, clones don’t eat.

oh and turn off auto target, you won’t lose a lock on em unless they use an invis ability.

Talentless.5708:

Dredlord.8076:

Talentless.5708:

Dredlord.8076:

Talentless.5708:

Dredlord.8076:

Disturbed.9305:

Good build for what exactly?

I think we have several good builds.

WvW, what builds are on par with the top Ele, mesmer, thief and now engi builds?

Read the forums… and not the posts made by scrubs who complain rather than learn.

read em, tried em, not up to par.

neither of you will be specific because you know there is nothing that will hold up…

btw have you gotten any better since we grouped last talentless or are you still underperforming?

Dont find myself under-performing, nor do I find myself knowing who you are… I rarely, if ever, pug out spots. Perhaps you are mistaken.

Is Talentless Necro your characters name?

Some of us arent afraid of their opinions being linked to their ign. Hence a signature.

It was a rhetorical question regarding your “perhaps you are mistaken”

I should have known you wouldn’t miss a chance to beat your chest and act superior, hence your last post…

and yes when I grouped with you in wvw that night I thought it was an appropriate name although you weren’t terrible, unless you have gotten better you shouldn’t be telling people to L2P.

Talentless.5708:

Dredlord.8076:

Talentless.5708:

Dredlord.8076:

Disturbed.9305:

Good build for what exactly?

I think we have several good builds.

WvW, what builds are on par with the top Ele, mesmer, thief and now engi builds?

Read the forums… and not the posts made by scrubs who complain rather than learn.

read em, tried em, not up to par.

neither of you will be specific because you know there is nothing that will hold up…

btw have you gotten any better since we grouped last talentless or are you still underperforming?

Dont find myself under-performing, nor do I find myself knowing who you are… I rarely, if ever, pug out spots. Perhaps you are mistaken.

Is Talentless Necro your characters name?

Bas.7406:

My guess is you run a staff build in dungeons? If you are going to work with staffs, I would figure you would want to go 20 in Spite to pick up increased damage on marks.

probably because it’s not a very good trait.

Disturbed.9305:

Why would you want every class to have one great solo build?

Then everyone would be the same. It would be like playing World of Warcraft.

Why don’t we just make all characters exactly the same. then.

now you are just being ridiculous.

That is one huge leap from “at least one competitive build per class”

to

everyone is the SAME!!!

It’s wow now!!!!

Bas.7406:

The ability to disagree with someone without insulting them is a dying art I know, but you should try it sometime.

Well that would require me to have at least a little respect for that person. Good luck with all a that Bas…

Bas.7406:

Dredlord.8076:

Bas.7406:

Not being great at something doesn’t mean I can’t have a firm grasp of where the class is currently

No, but it is still a very good indicator.

My mom is an average driver, she would never notice the differences in performance and handling between an ’82 RX7 and an ’82 civic. She may even say she thought the cars were very comparable.

Any good driver would notice HUGE differences in what you could do in those cars.

You are an average player with an opinion based on your limited ability.

No I am an average player with an opinion formed by conversations with extremely talented players.

Sometimes it’s better to learn from others :P. If you haven’t listened to a single minute of the podcast than you can’t really say what I know. I talk to the guys who know more than me, and learn from them, and then try to get them to share it with others. There is a reason why people want to hear from Talentless, Khalifa, Zombify, Nemesis, Chips and not you, they are very talented players who take the time to talk to someone positively, and think the class is extremely strong.

Than there is the guy driving the Porsche 911 and sees the guy driving a Civic, and can’t stand that the Civic has better gas mileage, cost less, and boy it sure is more comfortable on a long road trip. A good driver would say screw the civic I will take the porsche even if it does have a few things that arent’ perfect. (If you missed it you are the guy complaining that your porsche doesn’t have the Civic’s gas mileage or cost or comfort level).

No, I’m the guy who knows either car would be a bad choice to take my family on a road trip. Your analogy is pretty fail.

Disturbed.9305:

Sounds to me like you just want an easy “Iwin” button.

WvW isn’t something I’ll ever base a build or skill around.

congratulations, you are in the minority.

The vast majority of the playerbase prefers wvw over ?pvp and they base there builds off where they play, WvW.

Dredlord.8076:

You are an average player with an opinion based on your limited ability.

actually your opinion is more based off Bawb’s opinion, now that I think about it you’re more like bawb’s mouthpiece.

Bas.7406:

Not being great at something doesn’t mean I can’t have a firm grasp of where the class is currently

No, but it is still a very good indicator.

My mom is an average driver, she would never notice the differences in performance and handling between an ’82 RX7 and an ’82 civic. She may even say she thought the cars were very comparable.

Any good driver would notice HUGE differences in what you could do in those cars.

You are an average player with an opinion based on your limited ability.

Talentless.5708:

Dredlord.8076:

Disturbed.9305:

Good build for what exactly?

I think we have several good builds.

WvW, what builds are on par with the top Ele, mesmer, thief and now engi builds?

Read the forums… and not the posts made by scrubs who complain rather than learn.

read em, tried em, not up to par.

neither of you will be specific because you know there is nothing that will hold up…

btw have you gotten any better since we grouped last talentless or are you still underperforming?

Disturbed.9305:

Good build for what exactly?

I think we have several good builds.

WvW, what builds are on par with the top Ele, mesmer, thief and now engi builds?

Disturbed.9305:

I’m so glad the developers don’t agree with you on the one good build thing.

No way would I want to play a class like that.

shouldnt all the classes have a good build at the very least before they start working on build diversity?

Bas.7406:

Dredlord.8076:

Bhawb.7408:

Kravick.4906:

Yeah, you’re right. Warrior utilities (especially signets) are actually useful and have half the cooldown of necromancer utilities.

Fun fact: on average Necromancer utilities have 4.5s less CD than Warrior utilities.

Fun Fact: on average Necromancer utilities have double (100% longer) the cast times as Warrior utilities.

Fun Fact: on average Necromancer utility signets have 57.5s longer cooldowns than warrior.

Anyone ever wonder what class dreadlord actually plays? I think he only comes on here out of his undying love for bhawb and myself.

I have two 80 Necros fully geared, most of my playtime is on a necro. I find it the most fun to play usually. I have been working on a mesmer on and off. He’s 53 and in kittenty blue damage gear and he outperforms the necro in nearly every way.

All I want is for the necro to get the improvements it needs.

I would love to join you guys in some WvW and see how you play. My prediction is you are both very marginal players in terms of wvw/pvp and you have lowered expectations about this class.

Having lots of average builds is no consolation when none of them compete with the best builds of more than half the other classes. I would much rather be pigeon holed into one good build.

TheMightyAltroll.3485:

Who’s saying you have to run with all of your signets up? What is wrong with you people? Why would anyone save Elementalist run with all Signets. I’m saying utilities in general are better for Warrior, including most signets. Signet of Rage is utterly broken tier for how fast it recharges and how much buff it gives for how long. It practically has a cooldown of 12 seconds when the boons run out. Nonsense.

yeah if that signet was on the necro the cooldown would start when the buffs ran out, because DS…

Disturbed.9305:

Dredlord.8076:

Bhawb.7408:

Kravick.4906:

Yeah, you’re right. Warrior utilities (especially signets) are actually useful and have half the cooldown of necromancer utilities.

Fun fact: on average Necromancer utilities have 4.5s less CD than Warrior utilities.

Fun Fact: on average Necromancer utilities have double (100% longer) the cast times as Warrior utilities.

Fun Fact: on average Necromancer utility signets have 57.5s longer cooldowns than warrior.

Warrior signets are horrible after about 60 due to scaling.

Any warrior at 80 who runs with all their signets up is just gimping themselves.

Necro signets are horrible.

Any necro at 80 who runs with all their signets up is just gimping themselves.

see what I did there…

Bhawb.7408:

Kravick.4906:

Yeah, you’re right. Warrior utilities (especially signets) are actually useful and have half the cooldown of necromancer utilities.

Fun fact: on average Necromancer utilities have 4.5s less CD than Warrior utilities.

Fun Fact: on average Necromancer utilities have double (100% longer) the cast times as Warrior utilities.

Fun Fact: on average Necromancer utility signets have 57.5s longer cooldowns than warrior.

Talentless.5708:

Dredlord.8076:

Skyro.3108:

@Bas

I was directing my post to you because to you painting an unrealistic scenario.

I think many bad players here are sick of you blowing rainbows and sunshine up our kitten holes with tales of realistic necro situations and your “lists of abilities” (not builds) that correctly portray an “everything is fine” necro.

Fixed your grammar. L2P.

I remember grouping with you a month or 2 back, 3 of us, warrior and 2 necros.
We took some camps and killed some players.
You must have gotten way better since then if you are telling people to L2P now.

CHIPS.6018:

The “big” wvw update is coming in 2 days. Let’s see how that goes before concluding. ^^

ok

CHIPS.6018:

As expected this patch didn’t help us much. But hopefully Anet is reading our feedbacks and working on fixes. ^^

yeah…….lets hope more though this time?

Bas.7406:

@skyro

The problem here is we are having two different conversations. You are discussing optimal usage of DS which I agree with, and in the strictest sense you are correct. If you use DS to swap in and out then there is no danger of it becoming OP.

Your scenario of the heal situation actually made me laugh because of how often it actually happens, and has happened numerous times in Dungeons with myself and others trying to drop a heal or shout to bring me up a bit.

However, there is a bit of a disconnect where you and I are talking. (Disclaimer: all numbers are subjective because I have no desire to go check the actual numbers so I am rounding)Let’s say I am in a fight and I get hit for 14k, because I forgot to use DS to absorb or didn’t have enough LF to absorb it.

So I use Staff 2 to pop regen healing me for 300 per tick , I picked up siphon on hit which is 33 per hit, than I pick up Life Transfer which is around 2400 for the channel. I also pick up wells siphon 150 per tick (I have heard reports of higher, but I haven’t seen it).

I am sitting at 14k health now, and with most classes (ele’s not included) this is half the battle, you can drop the rest of their health pretty rapidly with another burst knockdown even guardians at 14k have to use their healing ability.

If we could heal at full healing power which is what some of you want. I could realistically drop my wells, hit the marks 2 to regen, than pop into DS keep healing while taking no damage and hit life transfer realistically healing my life most of the way back up without using my actual heal. You don’t see how this could make us incredibly difficult to kill? Not to mention anyone could do this every 10 seconds or every 5 seconds. Let’s not even add that Well of Blood is amazingly powerful. This would make us a less mobile version of the Elementalist that saw a serious nerf to it’s 30 arcana, yet is still called op and ridiculous by most players.

If our healing saw a significant reduction say 50 percent minimum to our heals while in DS than that would at least be worth of discussion.

as I said before…

When a simple knockback/pull (that almost every other class has access to)can both knock you out of your well and interupt your lifesiphon and negate almost all of that healing then the cat falls right out of your argument and unless you are fighting terrible opponents you are getting up with no life force left either.

Bas.7406:

Not to mention anyone could do this every 10 seconds or every 5 seconds.

How did you get your wells and Life siphon cooldown this low?

Skyro.3108:

@Bas

I was directing my post to you because to you painting an unrealistic scenario.

I think many people here are sick of you blowing rainbows and sunshine up our kitten holes with tales of unrealistic necro situations and your “lists of abilities” (not builds) that try and portray an “everything is fine” necro.

Bas.7406:

@dreadlord – when you have a valid point that doesn’t come with a personal attack, we can talk. Just to help you out Please see Kraag’s post below mine where he pointed out exactly how to do it with relative ease. Thanks for your input though.

perhaps you should read it too.

nothing he posts conflicts with what I said

take off your fanboi glasses and read both posts again

Bas.7406:

Example: I drop well of blood, hit ds and sit in it while you hit me. I recoup all of my health, while dealing damage to you. To top it off, I come out hit you with staff 2, Focus 4, and then transfer condtions to you, 5 seconds are up, back into Death shroud. Now I have Regen ticking, I picked up Life Transfer heals, siphon on hit, and another siphon ability. Now I am hammering you with fear, then the amount of damage you did on me is healing back up and I just life transfered for another 2k before my health is gone.

It is now obvious the terribads you play against.

What really would happen…

you drop well of blood and get knocked out of it immediately because you were too stupid to take stability on DS
Now you have no healing from the well and have done no damage to the enemy and your LF is all gone from damage.
To top it off, you try to hit with staff 2, Focus 4, and then transfer condtions, 5 seconds are up, back into Death shroud for only a second because you have only built up 6%-21% LF in that 5 seconds. You die shortly after (you feared them for a couple seconds) because for once you are fighting a decent player/team.

Bas your theory crafting is so fail you shouldn’t be misleading the necro community with your garbage.

Bas.7406:

That wasn’t what they fixed ;p. They never claimed to fix reapers touch being broken. They fixed the fact that the buff they gave to Spinal Shivers didn’t work when you took Spiteful Talisman.

I think you maxed out your fanboyism with this post coming to the defence of a broken trait that only got half fixed. Give your head a shake would ya?

Makade.8042:

This just in – OP exclusively plays overpowered classes, tries underpowered class and is now concerned about future ability to mindlessly faceroll other classes.

first post here in weeks to make me lol

so good!

Kravick.4906:

Bhawb.7408:

Congrats, you gave the enemy team 10 extra seconds worth of points, plus the time you wasted in the first fight, and however long it takes you to actually finally kill them. If you count wasting a minute to take a single point that is going to be recapped pretty easily, a win, then I think we have different views of how to accomplish objectives.

No one is talking about sPvP. There is a reason very few people play sPvP any more.

yeah its sad the devs can’t see this and devote more time to areas where the players spend most of their time like WvW.

Apparently the devs egos are too big to admit spvp failed hard in this incarnation of GW and move on to improving WvW and class balance/bugs.

TheAgedGnome.7520:

While running around, I decided to take on a Champion Risen Giant, which I knew would end badly. But soon after I engaged it, another MM came along and between the two of us and our minions we took it down. Felt pretty good.

cool story bro

but even an average mesmer/thief/ele would 2v1 you both with ease.

Softspoken.2410:

Oh hey cool a thread about Oscar Pistorius. It’s always amazing to see how people can overcome perceived limitations. It takes support and determination, but he’s accomplished so much. That business about his girlfriend is such a tragedy though.

here lemme fix that for you…

It takes high tech prosthetics that have now been banned from the olympics due to the unfair advantage it gives over those who don’t use them, but he’s accomplished so much.

Bhawb.7408:

And even without legs he runs faster than 99% of people alive today.

here is an example of Bhawb trying his best to miss the point completely.

Bhawb.7408:

Kravick.4906:

Keep in mind though, the number of people who say its not up to par outweigh the people who say its fine. There is a reason why necromancer is the second least played class in the game.

Yes, everyone knows that if the majority of people say something, why, it must be true.

yet again Bhawb only sees black and white, grey doesn’t exist.

let me try too

If at least one person says necros are fine then they must be and the rest of us need to L2P because that guy must have figured it all out…

Bhawb.7408:

So remember that post I made in the beginning where I said: “We aren’t bad at all, but you are going to be flooded with posts here about how we are broken.”? That is what is happening here.

well here is a perfect example of Bhawb’s lack of comprehension. “Aren’t bad” and “broken” are not mutually exclusive.

Example:
Oscar Pistorius’s body is “broken” and yet at the same time he is “not bad” at sprinting. Will he ever win a medal at the Olympics? hasn’t got a chance in hell…..

How many of you necro’s would give up your legs to compete at the olympics knowing you couldn’t win?

Here’s some advice Bawb, keep your legs….

wiazabi.2549:

Whats wrong with necro is the whole class design, way to many things dont mix together.

No healing in Death Shroud = no lifeleech, no regen , no friendly heals, tjeck out the trait lines and see how many we got for healing.

We have no access to skills such as Block , immunity, leap, cleave, projectile reflect, endurance regen, short cd stunbreaker. <- funny how Death shroud somehow makes up for all that.

minions except golem dont regen out of combat meaning 1% hp after fight = instant death next = cd starts at the minions death.
Minion ai ( ranged minions tend to work fine ).
Minions dont scale with any stat.

2 of our elites desummon our minions <- brilliant design choices right there.

No combofield/finisher on 3 of our 4 weaponsets.

scepter and condition / hybrid spec works ok but condition dmg in general still suffers from some major issues and in most/all? dungeons power is prefered over condtion .

But if you like a Slowcasting bad mobility no teamsupport but high hp including abnormal class mechanic then necro is for you.

THIS…….so much this and more

love to tatoo this on the devs kittenin foreheads

take away all this great stuff and give us DS which fails so hard at all the things these succeed at.

Then make all of our conditions including fear ridiculously low duration without +duration items/spec and still low duration with it because we have epidemic.

While other classes have great synergy in their abilities and traits the necro has brilliantly been denied almost all synergy in abilities and traits because of DS and epidemic.

yet what are the devs working on? putting a kittening pierce on mesmer GS AA…….

I was blown away how little professionalism the devs showed in the SotG interview.

seraphenslaved.6235:

Besides a few broken skills/traits, I don’t see anything wrong with us.

yep that’s right only 3 things left to fix on the necro. Then they are perfect!!!!!!

it’s funny to see people post their builds here and see so many using broken, bugged or completely worthless traits.