Depends what stats you are after and your build.
If price is a factor then crests are usually the most bang for your gold.
How important is crit to you in your build?
Do you use a bleed on crit sigil?
More info on your build would help make the decision easier.
Char look the coolest….opinion though
because part of “mastering DS” is counting your Mississippi’s kitten
yeah all in all that was a pretty ignorant post Druitt
the necro has come a long long way since release because of the “dedicated whiners” youre talking about
you’ve been bashing on posters who have explained in articulate detail their points, as well as provided helpful information on using the Necro to succeed.
Please stop insulting other players who work hard to provide advice or beneficial information.
Or.. just leave. thanks!
actually I have been responding to ignorant posters like you and kirin who are spreading misinformation about the necro class.
take off your rose colored glasses before you post here, oh and actually know what you’re talking about for once.
example: this thread -> kirin thinking target the weak’s damage bonus applied for every condition in a stack. We only find this out after post upon post of his “hard work, advice and beneficial information”
Life/Plague Blast- Allow the land version to also transfer one condition to the enemy. This spell would also greatly benefit from being a shorter cast time. Adjust damage to balance, if necessary.
Life Transfer/Gathering Plague- I am a proponent of having BOTH of these abilities in both land and sea forms of DS, putting one as the 4th skill, and adding the other for a 5th skill.
I really like this first one, it makes total sense considering we cannot see conditions in DS, I think something along the lines of 20%-50% chance to transfer or 100% to remove a condition in DS
(edited by Dredlord.8076)
yeah all in all that was a pretty ignorant post Druitt
the necro has come a long long way since release because of the “dedicated whiners” youre talking about
get a clue buddy, reread the whole thread so all those reasons are fresh in your mind and move on.
It was pretty cool how you didn’t actually address what I said.
that’s because it has already been said in this thread, were you too lazy to scroll up? or are you just trolling now?
reread my quote here, this time try not to be butthurt, take the advice and be learner for once…
I did. You were wrong about the axe before, you’re still wrong about it now. With this trait and vulnerability and bleed generation with a reasonable crit rate, you’ll exceed the effectiveness of the warrior trait within 2 auto-attacks in the worst case. It’s not exactly the grim scenario you insist on painting where every player has a condition curing fairy floating after them.
This is not “difficult.” This is not “hard.” This is not “good luck waiting for 6 more conditions.” This is trivial, the matter of 1.5-2.25 seconds.
And that’s just one way of many. For a power spec.
kirindave it doesnt matter how many stacks of bleed or vulnerability you have you only get 2% per unique condition on the target, you could auto attack with your axe till it was dead and still only get 4% damage.
and gluttony try to be a little less arrogant, our discussion is just as relevant to the thread as anything you have posted.
get a clue buddy, reread the whole thread so all those reasons are fresh in your mind and move on.
It was pretty cool how you didn’t actually address what I said.
that’s because it has already been said in this thread, were you too lazy to scroll up? or are you just trolling now?
reread my quote here, this time try not to be butthurt, take the advice and be learner for once…
Kirin Dave it looks like you are the only one having trouble understanding it.
why don’t you tell us again how the Zerg isn’t a team scenario before you completely embarrass yourself lol
better yet, win the argument by using "genetic fallacy’ and “ad hominem” !
everyone else in the thread believes it’s an underwhelming trait for many reasons
get a clue buddy, reread the whole thread so all those reasons are fresh in your mind and move on.
he’s fighting a mega losing battle here
and once you post a reply to him you can’t get away from him….
no you just arent paying attention most likely, even running with a zerg in WvW i rarely see more than 6 conditions on anything for more than a second.
things like fear or blind are gone the next second
Running with a zerg is hardly the alpha or omega of WvW. There is no such thing as a significant contribution for you when you’re running with 40+ people in a pack; everything except another zerg or being utterly outplayed can stop you. You are there to provide 1/40th of the damage output of the zerg and no one cares how much that number is.
The very opposite situation is the case when defending a fort from a zerg, or choke points, or when you get into that fun situation where a coordinated group tries to stall or disperse a zerg.
yeahhhhh…….I think I’ll just take the 10% for one bleed if I had the choice
I actually think they’re about even.
no no and no they are not even close to about even
thank you for proving my point by “explaining zergs” to me, it is the example of where you will see the most conditions in the shortest time, where you will see more damage bonus quicker…..and you are right it won’t make a difference because the zerg killed it anyways.
bleed is the most common condition so if something is bleeding you get 10% damage
that means when switching targets to assist a friendly chances are its bleeding and you get the 10% bonus.
what are the chances your target will have 6+ conditions on them?
next you’ll be telling us you only switch targets after epidemic….
your very first attack = bleed you get the 10% bonus necro gets 2%
someone just cleansed all their conditions? no prob they gonna be bleeding again in a second or 2 = 10%. necro? have fun building up 6+ conditions again
these 2 abilities are so far apart its stupid
the only time its going to be better is on a long boss fight and the only builds that are speccing up that high are condition builds looking for cond dur on the GM trait making the extra damage that applies to direct damage only pretty underwhelming.
Well by “group situations” I was referring to group PvE, not PvP/WvW. That’s what I’m using 25 Curses for.
oh PVE….
yeah I would still take the 10% for one bleed
why would it have a lower cooldown and longer duration than our other aoe fear?
why would it have a lower cooldown than our elite pets knockdown/back?
its a neat idea though and would make some condition builds very powerful with all the CC and tankiness they could have
Fiery Greatsword is a niche at best. It has a cooldown, a time limit, a charge limit, and it replaces your 20 weapon skills (counting attunements) while active.
Holy kitten cat katface!!!
you guys get 20 weapon skills????
surely to get to use the extra 10 you lose access to your heals and utility skills as that is double what most other classes get for weapon skills?
I mean at the very least while using all these extra weapon skills your UI is mostly removed right? one shouldn’t get that many weapon skills and still be able to see things like endurance and buff and conditions, amiright?
We get one weapon — no swapping as all other professions except Engineers get — and with that one weapon we get the standard 5 skills which change depending on which of 4 attunements (air, fire, water, earth) we switch to. So we end up with 20 weapon skills versus most professions’ 10. Engineers, however, could equip four kits and thus end up with 29 weapon (plus toolbelt) skills.
We only get five weapon skills at one instant, just like other classes, so the UI is just like other classes and weapon swaps. The Fiery Greatsword, however, replaces our weapon and doesn’t change based on attunement, so we go from 20 weapon skills (with attunement changes) to 5. If we drop the Fiery Greatsword, it disappears and we can’t swap back until the cooldown is up and we can resummon it.
(OK, technically, when we summon it, we get one in our hand and one falls on the ground and can be picked up by anyone. If no one else picks it up, we could use that one if the first one is dropped or uses up its charges. It’s still subject to the time limit and will disappear after the allotted time, even if it has never been picked up.)
if you were wondering what just flew over your head…
it was death shroud.
its all good though man most necros don’t know what it is either
Did I mention I run epidemic? I can keep bleeds, vulnerabilities and chills up on most enemies at most times, so 6% by myself, not including all the times I damage targets while they’re weakened, crippled, immobilized, feared, blinded (this is quite often). Then throw on all the other times targets are confused, burning or poisoned along with any other classes who apply the same conditions I do. I’d imagine it’s considerably higher than the 2% you seem to think. Or maybe I’m playing my class wrong.
no you just arent paying attention most likely, even running with a zerg in WvW i rarely see more than 6 conditions on anything for more than a second.
things like fear or blind are gone the next second
the 2% is the amount more than the 10% that warriors get with just a bleed which would be 6 different conditions on a target. This was to make a point that obviously went right over your head.
in most 5 man groups I see 4-5 conditions maintained usually depending on the group make up.
In wvw most targets are dead before they have 6 conditions on them. lets say i got one of my highest ever crit lifeblasts (4.7k) off just after achieving 6 conditions that would be a whopping 94 damage for that extra 2%
yeahhhhh…….I think I’ll just take the 10% for one bleed if I had the choice
If target the weak works with other’s conditions, then in group situations you can get it a lot higher than 10% a lot of the time.
and when He says a lot…….what he means is 2% usually.
Fiery Greatsword is a niche at best. It has a cooldown, a time limit, a charge limit, and it replaces your 20 weapon skills (counting attunements) while active.
Holy kitten cat katface!!!
you guys get 20 weapon skills????
surely to get to use the extra 10 you lose access to your heals and utility skills as that is double what most other classes get for weapon skills?
I mean at the very least while using all these extra weapon skills your UI is mostly removed right? one shouldn’t get that many weapon skills and still be able to see things like endurance and buff and conditions, amiright?
I absolutely understand you, iceflame. As a 450+ hour Necro player, it was time to put the foot down on relatively new players shunning the class. it’s the jack-of-all-trades that can also be the master of a couple things.
keep working on it! you’ll figure out the strengths.
morsel of advice, endgame gear should either be Power/tough/vit for powermancer or cond/tough/precision for conditionmancer.
nah. I’ll stick with my berserker gear for now =)
Add a 5th skill that is determined by your main-hand weapon.
this is the best idea of the bunch!
sorry but pacts just seem really lame, too generic, been done in too many other games with other names.
if you mained a necro vicarious you wouldnt come storm in here and proclaim bullkitten.
again, glad you provided a good example of what it is im saying thats incorrect then why that is.
cause to me it seems a lot of you are crying just to cry. i like my necro and i think the skills offered to a necro are good and yes, BALANCED, with most the other classes.
in PvE my staff/wells build works perfectly fine if not above par, and in PvP i can beat most people 1v1 with my power dagger build.
sorry some of you suck too bad to make full use of this slightly more complex class.
this one just isn’t a learner is he…
as said before it’s not our job to educate you when you don’t know what you are talking about.
but,
tell us again how the warrior needs to be in melee range to apply bleeds
tell us again how the necro applies bleeds faster than a warrior
tell us again how the warrior can only apply one condition
now tell us again how we should know what we are talking about before we post here…
how bout just putting a pet attack command on an F key so we can all stop kittenin and whining about pets for a while (a short while)
listen to thresher hes on the right track with kitty form
my first necro was asura, once i geared him up I found I was using lich form less and less (power build) as my DS nuke was hitting just as hard.
rerolled a norn and have hardly died since in wvw.
having stealth and massive mobility (make sure you are holding the button down for the full distance of the charge) on a class that doesnt get it otherwise actually makes a run and gun playstyle viable on a necro.
the amount of one sided bias with no experience in the specs of the other classes youre complaining about is ridiculous…..
like for example, saw someone say that warriors getting 50% more bleed time compared to necros 20% more bleed is unfair? ok first off think of how it is applied, necro can do at range and faster while also applying poison, the warrior swings slower then a scepter, must stay on target in melee, and thats the only condition they can apply.
so yeah thats fair, stop whining.
then ofc the misunderstanding of the necro skill itself! reapers mark, if someone triggers it while youre rezzing then EVERYONE gets feared in the area, the other two are shields that stop ranged attacks, cause you stomp at range all the time…..
you should actually know what skills youre whining about before actually posting it on the forums ya know.
if you’re gonna call someone out for not knowing about a class you better kittening know it yourself…
warrior can apply bleeds much faster than a necro on demand and at range if they so desire.
now tuck your tail between your legs and head back to the warrior forum and learn about your class
DS has 2 good abilities for any spec fear and siphon
DS2 is situational for most specs but very useful for condition specs depending on your opponent – use your noodle you can figure it out.
DS1 is only good for power builds but that doesnt negate the fact DS is very useful for condition specs
why not add a GM trait that adds a condition to the DS1 nuke but reduces the direct damage a bit?
major problem with power builds is scaling damage from amount of lifeforce:
another class can burst away your burst before you can get off your first or second nuke in DS by taking you from 100% lifeforce to below 50% lifeforce in a hit or 2
this really sounds boring compared to DS
and why get rid of DS to have “kill 5 things for big pet”, you can do that through a utility or elite or even adding it through F2 – F4.
are you having a hard time mastering DS?
downed state is great the way it is.
stop trying to dumb down the game because you are having a hard time spiking people
tooltip corrected to Fear on Death
working as intended…
Siv Nhorngineer
I’ll probably start using it on my elementalist, since I run with a pretty high +condition damage build. Unfortunately, my necro is a norn. Hooray for the bleed owl….
norn is the best necro for roaming pvp, I rerolled my 80 asura in almost full exotics to a norn for the racial
snow leopard gives the roaming necro stealth and MASSIVE mobility when you need it and that is exactly what the necro is lacking for that type of gameplay
This “rediciliously strong” spec claim is about as trustworthy as if someone claimed they had an Risen Moose fighting for them.
Omg that would be awesome, or no a spectral moose…it runs away for you
No wait, it picks up the enemy’s loot bag and runs away after you get stomped.
Now that is a skill fit for a GW2 necro
Dude, while we, the necro community feel your pain, ANET does not. I do not think they care, especially if we are questioning their wisdom on the necro. We shall see, but its an MMO, and most MMOs don’t really care about the community’s thoughs when it comes to questioning their mechanics.
I watched videos of GW1 necro before during and after release of gw2. They rammed the gw2 necro right in the KITTEN hole
Actually they KITTENED him in the CAT hole, to be precise.
please DO NOT change the animation it is awesome!
the sound needs to go though…
I looked at a few forum posts talking about it. glancing crit cant happen but there was talk that a glance overrides the crit
maybe a warrior with high crit (signet build) could test if roughly half his hits glance when he is weakened if so it most likely overrides the crits
I have wondered if a glance could crit too
or rather a crit could glance?
maybe you shoulda posted for me since you know what I mean?
weakening shroud is a great talent when using DS defensively
any melee or ranged that is close enough gets hit with weakness
50% glancing blows reduces their damage by quite a bit and endurance regen nerf doesn’t hurt either
works really well if you get CC’ed and have to go into DS to eat some damage
if half of the enemy’s burst combo glances you probably saved yourself a nice chunk of damage
I’ve heard both of those so far actually.
Of course you have, people use sarcasm all the time…
Difficult times editing posts!
So here’s the deal on that one: Dark Path is intentionally slow because it tracks the target and allows you to start using other skills before it connects. One of the ways that I love using it is launching it at an enemy that’s at near (but not at) max range, fearing them, exiting DS, then starting Dark Pact. As soon as the Path projectile hits them, you shadowstep and immediately immobilize them from the short-range Pact, then pound on them with dagger skills and wells. When Dark Path is faster, it’s harder to use it to effectively combo other skills.
For in-deathshroud abilities, I tend to use Life Blast until my bar’s about 50% depleted, then Dark Path+Life Transfer for maximum damage and chasing power.
yeah those are some nice combos, I use them myself depending on the situation.
The real problem is that dark path isnt effective on fleeing opponents, it just wont reach them if they are running away as any movement ability will get them enough distance to outrun the projectile.
A couple possible solutions could be:
- increase the range
- have it track the opponent as long as it was finished casting in range (some classes could drag you into nasty locations and stop though)
- have the projectile speed up till it hits
/signed and stuff for the char limit
comments like that just make you look like you have no idea what youre doing in pvp technobug
portal and time warp are far from gimmicky in WvW, they are arguably 2 of the best skills in the game.
because you get more mileage out of them in a group is just a scrub reason not to use them to your advantage when you are by yourself.
darkness fields also combo for life leech
Not even worth noting….
Except when you include another 30% from trait points and then you can pretty much keep fury or retaliation up full time with the right talents.
my thoughts are that DS should still allow access to your utility spells, then this tactic would still be possible
the +1% boon duration per point spent in the death magic line is not applying to the death shroud fury buff talent Furious Demise that is found at 15 points in Curses.
will test further but +boon duration may not be working on any DS activated boons
(edited by Dredlord.8076)
Judging from Jon Peters’ replies AN might hate the Necromancer as much as Blizzard hates the Druid.
If you haven’t invested too much time or gold in your Necromancer, rerolling is likely a good decision.
I couldn’t agree more.
how a class could make it this far with SO many glaring bugs along with getting brutally marginalized after BW2 or 3 is mind boggling.
to not see a single bug fix for the necro over the last patches while other classes with no performance issues are constantly getting attention. necro is the red headed stepchild of GW2 (and every MMO has one) and it wont change anytime soon.
expect to be able to play a “fixed” necro when the first expansion comes out. thats just how it goes with mmo’s there is always a class at the bottom of the heap and DS is as good a reason as any to keep the necro there.
arena net has done such a great job with everything else I find it hard to believe they didnt kitteny cat this up on purpose, the scope of the BW nerfs and broken class mechanics are so huge.
oh the kitties…..
I am done with necro for now too, on to a guardian for me.
the worst thing about this is that this just makes the problem worse as anet most likely fixes things based on tickets and when there is a mass exodus from a kitten class then the amount of tickets coming in about the problems goes way down and the necro sinks way down the priority list.
result being if you stick with your necro you will be waiting to be unkittened for a long time.
if you need a shoulder to cry on then Mystical Manther is there for you….