Guild Wars 2

TheMightyAltroll.3485:

This build of yours doesn’t work. It’s a tank with no damage, and a bunker with no survivability. Vampire builds work much better than this, and that’s to say not at all.

Not to be mean, but this simply doesn’t work. The meta is based on Conditionmancery because that’s all anyone sees Necromancer as due to the overbuff. I’ve already tried shaking up the meta with builds that worked alot better than this one, you saw how that ended up.

A few hundred people liked my builds, and that was it. Certainly not enough to change the meta since all of the ‘pros’ that define the meta stuck with their crappy conditionmancers.

I hope you do change the meta, Xom. Though you won’t this way.

The proof is in the pudding.

Clearly it works as he explains.

VydoLL.8714:

Current condition necro spec = faceroll class.

so a spec is a class now?

it’s funny how people get stupid when they are angry…

lol, I had to check this was the necro forum when I saw this post at the top this morning.

yeah looks good against those builds, what sigils do you use?

hackks.3687:

Then you discovered that Engi’s are building to hard counter condis and more specifically Necros. I’m sure you saw more than a couple Warriors rocking Mace/Shield and Berserkers Stance since that’s virtually a 100% hard counter to Necros as well.

Thank you though for doing everyone a favor of playing some PvP and reporting back that Necro’s OPness is in fact not an L2P issue on the community’s part because as you clearly discovered people are in fact building deliberately to counter conditions and Necros and not simply holding on to their old builds. If multiple classes are deliberately building to counter a particular class and a particular form of damage, I don’t know what else there is to convince people that Necros are in fact OP… that is, until they run into one of the various hard counters.

The PvP meta is just borked right now. It’s not all Necros fault, but they were an instigating factor in it’s development, and as such some toning down on some aspects of its builds are in order. And just to be clear, I’m not looking to nerf Necros in to the ground, in fact it’s really nice to play him on the regular again. What I’m really looking for is PvP to be balanced and enjoyable. Currently it is the furthest thing from both.

P.S. it’s rather flattering you went so far as to look up the leader board rankings of not only me but other posters in this thread. Kind of scary, stalker-ish but still somewhat flattering. Next time just ask politely and I’ll tell you that my highest rank was top 200 when queuing regularly with a team, lowest rank was 50% after an epic losing streak yolo-queing for a weekend. Nobody cares about the leader boards though while balance is so fubar’d.

ok enough, time to get your story straight….

is the meta borked?

or are people able to make builds to counter the so called OP necro?

you dont even know what the point youre trying to make is while you fling buzz words like meta around to try and garner some credibility.

nemesis stalkerish???? lol

get a handle on things buddy, no one here wants to date you.

He went searching for some evidence you might know what youre talking about since it wasn’t what he experienced. Unfortunately it made you look bad.

Aevis.4632:

Dredlord.8076:

Aevis.4632:

1v1 is all I do in wvw mostly. Unless the groups need help. I mostly win all my 1v1 so I don’t know what you mean power necro is supposed to die 1v1.

Idk I guess I can go back to using d/d, staff. Also I use knights armor so my toughness isn’t super low. I’m not a tank but I’m not glass either. Tho I do have 81% crit dmg with 50% crit chance.

I know we have the same amount of fears but hers last like 2-3 sec. I guess that’s dude to master of terror and I guess condi duration runes and food.

Idk maybe ill try condi necro but I hate using builds everyone else uses. Seems like most necro these days are condi and its quite annoying lol.

post your build and gear so we know what you are working with, traits, weps and utils.

I go back and forth between a power build and condi build often so I can probably offer some tips that might help.

lately I have been using rare pizza on my power build too so my non damaging condis last long enough to take the pressure off a bit more and I have gotten used to the longer fears now from my condi build.

also did he 1v5 you guys or did he have help?

I find lately ALL fears get blamed on necros when many are coming from thieves who have alot more necros to steal from and warriors as well carrying fear me.

I use knights armor with ruby orbs. Zerker weapons. I have 3 ascended zerker trinkets and 2 exotic knights accessories but am aiming for ascended knights.

My traits are 30/10/0/0/30. The utilities I use are spectral armor, signet of the locust, and well of suffering. Consume conditions for heal.

When she killed 5 of us it was 1 after the other. Sometimes 2 v her. In total it was 5 but there wasn’t a big gap between the arrival of the next person.

several things to help

I am guessing you are using the 50% crit but using the stability will give you an easier time. it will protect your life transfer and he could waste a fear if hes not watching your buffs for stability. you can also enter DS if he starts a fear chain and his second fear wont carry on after the first wears out.

I find warhorn is a better match against condi necro. the daze is great for keeping them in a well bomb, 2-3 seconds they cant clear the root while you shred with dags, also great for interrupting heals,life siphon long casts etc.

In small fights swap out focused rituals if you are using that. You can set up well bombs much faster if you dont have to stop mouse looking to ground target and you should be right on top of him anyways with swarm going. swap focused rituals back in when you are at keeps or when you catch up with the zerg.

with warhorn switch locust for spec walk (extra stun break) and near full swiftness uptime between the 2 and more LF generation.

Save staff 4 for when he has you loaded up hard with condis try to save stakitten for right after so he cant just send them strait back at you then dps.

You should be hitting 5 k lifeblasts consistently on him, opening with this can put him on the defensive right away and make it a much easier fight or at least bait some dodges after the first 2-3 hit/crit. then you can set up a nice well bomb, LB,LB,LB,path>doom>root>wells>daze>shred.

oh and try to keep track of his ds cooldown.

Aevis.4632:

1v1 is all I do in wvw mostly. Unless the groups need help. I mostly win all my 1v1 so I don’t know what you mean power necro is supposed to die 1v1.

Idk I guess I can go back to using d/d, staff. Also I use knights armor so my toughness isn’t super low. I’m not a tank but I’m not glass either. Tho I do have 81% crit dmg with 50% crit chance.

I know we have the same amount of fears but hers last like 2-3 sec. I guess that’s dude to master of terror and I guess condi duration runes and food.

Idk maybe ill try condi necro but I hate using builds everyone else uses. Seems like most necro these days are condi and its quite annoying lol.

post your build and gear so we know what you are working with, traits, weps and utils.

I go back and forth between a power build and condi build often so I can probably offer some tips that might help.

lately I have been using rare pizza on my power build too so my non damaging condis last long enough to take the pressure off a bit more and I have gotten used to the longer fears now from my condi build.

also did he 1v5 you guys or did he have help?

I find lately ALL fears get blamed on necros when many are coming from thieves who have alot more necros to steal from and warriors as well carrying fear me.

Durante.7913:

It sounds like what you want is very similar to the build I currently play in WvW.

It’s a power/toughness wellomancer with axe/warhorn and staff. Utility skills are spectral walk, well of suffering and well of corruption. You get perma (or 98%) swiftness between spectral walk and locust swarm, and 4 ground-targeted marks and 2 fast wells for pretty good disruption.

Build sucks at 1v1 and single target DPS though. And as pointed out above, you really can’t disengage well with a Necro, regardless of build.

sounds like something similar to my build, I am blown away you think the single target damage sucks, are you not using axe 2 and lifeblast at all?

I rolled a norn for the extra mobility and the ease of getting into a keep already with a zerg parked at the door.

and then we never saw hackks again….

LastDay.3524:

In my opinion Anet should bring down our Condition damage builds.
Bring them down to the level of our Power ones.

it would seem like your opinion is a bit short sighted then.

I don’t feel like my power build performs at a lower level than the terror build at all.

They both excel at different things and both have great killing power and are both weak to cc and focused fire. Each build has it’s classes that are relatively easy to deal with and those which are much harder because they happen to counter that build better.

there really should be a sitting on the couch episode with a 3v3 to debate this ridiculous notion that necros (one build) are OP.

Hell I’ll even 1v3 pobcast the clowns claiming this, hows that for necro 1vX?

sas.6483:

Bhawb.7408:

Why do people find Necromancers OP? Because there is one spec right now that is.

We should have a slumber party. You can tell me a story about the OP necro that signet of spite-dhuumfire-epidemic-terror bombed a point with five berserker thieves circle jerking on it. Then we can go watch Phantaram’s video and cry a little about necro survivability. Maybe then we can eat some pizza or something, and watch a 1vX roaming thief video and gush about the true meaning of skill.

omg first good laugh in long time.

it’s no surprise it came at bawbs expense, hes been paroting the same terror dhum OP for weeks now

sas.6483:

Why do people complain about necro?

1) It is because they are clueless and haven’t actually played a necro, so they don’t actually know how non-faceroll the class is / how many ways there are to get stomped into the ground.
2) It is because of bullkitten e-sport class nerf politics youtube videos.
3) It is because they can’t do math, so they don’t realize that the “fear CC burst chain” does less damage than a couple of heartseekers.
4) It is because they are wearing berserker gear and don’t want to have to actually spec any condition clears / regen / vitality / l2p.

I think that pretty much sums it up.

true and true

spoj.9672:

No. You wont have the same uptime due to staying in DS and not having the trait. I doubt he calculated locust dps on either build.

I think you are overplaying it a bit there buddy, the difference would be very negligible with some practice timing DS and cooldowns.

spoj.9672:

It doesnt take into account locust swarm dps either.

are you trying to say you are not able to use locust swarm and then go into DS for the same dps it would give you with dagger?

Wraith.9426:

That said, a lot of people who were using these hacks actually have been banned. Anet has pretty good detection for teleports now, so you should all stop complaining. Sure, you might still see someone teleporting occasionally, but odds are that that is someone who just got the hack and is using it for the first time, and they will probably be banned within 30 minutes.

dont kid yourself buddy, I see repeat offenders in wvw day after day.

Bhawb.7408:

Of course I would be at school, OF COURSE

hey maybe you’ll even learn something

DevonCarver.5370:

We believe in WvW both as a game type and as a source of revenue. Perceived lack of resources devoted to WvW should be balanced against reasonable expectations of what can be achieved by any resources. It takes a lot less time to build new ability lines than it does to, say, build a new home map. We are working on some things that won’t see the light of day for a long time and we are also working on things that you will see very soon. Believe me, WvW is important to us as a company and we will continue to improve on it.

clearly resources have been taxed now that we know GW2 is the fastest selling MMO to hit 3 million.

I mean it all makes sense now….the WvW team must have been ridiculously busy burning 3 million cd’s and licking the stamps to get them mailed out to your customers so quickly.

And obviously accounting and HR were too busy counting all that revenue and patting themselves on the back to hire anyone new?

Johje Holan.4607:

Nope, it was the egg. I mean where’d the chicken come from without an egg?

no the chicken came first by way of non egg birth but with the genetic mutation that allowed that chicken to lay eggs.

or if you are a creationist…God made a chicken. lol

DevonCarver.5370:

We take allegations of cheating very seriously, but we also have a responsibility to our players to not take precipitous action. We are always working to improve our cheat-detection, but no system is perfect. Please continue to report any and all suspicious activity you see and we will do our utmost to chase down and verify what is happening.

then do something tangible that we can see you are committed to having a cheat free game.

at the very least have an option in the report menu.

make bans public, see this page for ideas http://www.unholybanhammer.com/BH/

how do you expect people to take this game seriously as an esport if you don’t even try to stop cheating.

if it’s so easy to find the hacks why can’t your company take a look at them and do something about it?

is someone at anet making and selling the hacks themselves?

its ok, I swap it in for keep defense when im not running ground target wells

for me it’s not worthy of a full time spot on my bar in any spec i run though

I find it changes often now since the servers get mixed up more now.

One week I will be fighting lots of stability and next week none, sometimes more condition cleansing or high toughness builds with lots of healing.

I have been changing my builds to counter what I am fighting more than ever before and having more fun with it as well.

I would recommend building a power set to go with your condi set and play around with builds on your own, even in the same night you may want to respec a couple times to suite the group/zerg you are running with and the people you are fighting.

themenaceofseventhdimension.2075:

but I dont have a high tech video camera and a youtube account.

troll evidence, exhibit A

these are some of the worst builds I have ever seen. you obviously haven’t even tested them.

stop wasting everyones time, you must have mistaken the necro forums for the seventh dimension…

Julie Yann.5379:

Warrior have change their game, people need to learn to change their counters, many are unwilling to do so and prefer crying about it on the forums.

pure unadulterated truth!!!

superbeast.9873:

Agreed.
You know what game has a real, balanced meta?

SWTOR.

Hate on it all you want, but everything that GW2 is lacking, SWTOR has.

this has got to be a joke…

yes, make immobilize actually immobilize.

first step, make all weapon skill evades and teleports not work when immobilized then move onto utilities if that’s still not enough.

Serdoc.7261:

Agree, the 5 things listed need to get nerfed.

BUT do not just nerf the OP stuff, buff the unused and looked over things as well. Look at weapon sets that see little use, or talent trees that just don’t cut the mustard.

the 5 things that you want nerfed were just buffed because they weren’t cutting the mustard previously.

make up your mind…

did the OP just cry about more than half the classes in the game?

it sounds like he just doesn’t want to respec to adapt to the new meta.

the only thing remotely OP is the evade thief and I wouldn’t nerf that just yet either.

Fenrir.5493:

Fenrir.5493:

People who complain about Conditions have no idea how patethic they look.

Now with that clear i will explain to you why this is not a warrior problem.

Conditions are broken right now, they have no stat or a boon that reduces their incoming damage, like power has toughness/armor and protection.

Condition damage is so easy to achieve because you only need one stat, and that is Condition damage, while power damage requires Power, Crit chance and Crit damage.

So you can wear a shamans amulet and have all you need to do great condi damage, have healing power and amazing toughness, the result is a tank that can do amazing condition damage.

This is a serious problem right now with the game ite clearly unbalanced towards condition damage because of this, but this is not a warrior problem its a general problem.

there I fixed that for you…

as for condition cleanses and runes of melandru, well you should look into that.

Rennoko.5731:

I can’t believe this was on my server and I missed it…. so sad

And to the above question of how to stop it…. just aoe. The minons drop fast and can’t rally.

now imagine every necro in that zerg running transfusion as well, I doubt you would kill even half the pets against an equal number zerg.

Asche.5362:

themenaceofseventhdimension.2075:

i would love to 1 vs 1 you in wvw where i will own u and your stupid goblin gimmicks. Bra you dont have to troll to a person who’s postin for the first time. I guess you have some really bad memories no doubt. Anyways keep the hatin bra cause I’m gonna make the best necro 1 vs X build no matter what. stay cool

Oh no, a tough guy! He will emerge the 7th-basement-dimension and be all menacing embarassing and stuff. Bra. Seriously? Bra?? Get outta here…

themenaceofseventhdimension.2075:

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fQEQNAnYWjMaF7tbib8bKAJFX/MUhejKcM1jyZ/cA-jkzAINioRqDG5BgAlIiAYyTZMHKoWxCblMIFzopuxUxw64hoazLiWtUAQsGA-w

Honestly: Your “build” has Axe/Dagger in it with Epidemic. What is this travesty? This is a trainwreck. What conditions are you going to spread with that? Two bleeds and one cripple? Because after burning your signet, you won’t be applying a lot of conditions for 48 seconds. And 48 seconds is a loooong time when all your cooldowns are wasted. Long 48 seconds in which you wont be doing any amount of damage at all. The smartest choice in your build are the swiftness related runes, because you will be running from battle a lot.

themenaceofseventhdimension.2075:

we cool??

Just…stop posting guides and builds. Leave that to other people until you spend some more time with your Necro and gain a better understanding of the class.
Also behaving like a wanna be Rap-idol makes you look like a 12-year old.

awesome post, very funny.

Here is a quicker check…

see if you have autotarget on in your options

if you do…then you aren’t pro…

if you don’t you still might not be pro but at least you aren’t a noob.

Afya.5842:

So the 60% “hot fix” is real? lol

did you hear a rumor this was going to happen?

Is anyone noticing anything that isn’t adding up with this patch?

so far it seems DS is taking more damage again.

Crit seems capped in DS even worse than before (5 out of 6 LB non crit with over 90% crit chance)

Anet has a solid track record of not putting nerfs in the patch notes for necro so this seems well within reason to me.

Is anyone else getting these results too?

HiSaZuL.2843:

Anyway thief class is broken in this game and it has nothing to do with damage.
NOBODY. EVER. Should be able to reset/undetectable invis with spamable capabilities. That is not stealth its bullkitten. No matter how fragile/weak against “insert anything here” that has no kittening place, ever in any mmo that claims to be at average level. In esport? While I couldn’t care less for that ego fest, even more true then normally.
And again has nothing to do with kittened damage.

this is truth.

the design of the thief is broken at a basic level

Merlin Dyfed Avalon.5046:

So an option with the 1 second lock would be a good idea?

no terrible idea, don’t be a key masher and you will be fine.

too many elements of of necro gameplay rely on instant in and out with all of the possible effects you can spec for DS.

Sentinel.5731:

Also as a side note, i would THROW MY MONEY AT ANET if they could give us purchasable skins for our minions, especially the flesh golem. All my money, they could have it.

this is major area I see ANET wasting huge opportunity in the gem store.

skins for armor weapons and pets could be raking in the gems.

I would be interested in playing a minion spec if my golem at least looked cool while he watches me kill things.

no thanks I will keep my pierce.

I can understand how a keyboard turner might have more trouble with it though.

Imperatora.7654:

“Whining” never gets things nerfed, math does.

I am sure your company has a perfect track record with regard to this…

But I have been playing MMO’s longer than you have been making them (most likely )and there is a mountain of evidence that whining in fact does get things nerfed. without any math to back it up.

BTW I do admire your idealism. I hope your game does well.

now I’m done =)

evilapprentice.6379:

The Boz.2038:

evilapprentice.6379:

Every post in this thread.

Wow, dude.
Wow.
Rarely do I see someone so consistently and persistently wrong.
Still waiting on that “the devs made it so with a reason” reference you mentioned earlier. I won’t hold my breath.

Unfortunately I could not find the article I was referring to. Oh well.

So, do you have any reason you disagree with me, or are you on the “Blind assertions are always right” bandwagon? Agree or disagree, I listed the reasons why I felt that way. If you want to assert that I’m wrong, you’re going to have to back it up.

oh I have to back it up but you don’t?

you realize you sound like a spoiled little child now don’t you?

evilapprentice.6379:

Sepreh.5924:

evilapprentice.6379:

google.3709:

Thief are immune to 2 conditions : )

1. Chill for stated reasons
2. Blind (barely noticible unless its on CnD)

Immune to chill? Do thieves not move at a reduced speed when they’re chilled? News to me.

Chill was specifically designed with initiative in mind – someone at Anet specifically used chill as an example to how thieves CD mechanics were different than the other classes, mentioning that the CD slowdown part of chill was specifically designed to not affect initiative.

Case closed.

Well that would be an easy answer. Do you have a link to this?

Looking for it now – the problem is looking up “chilled” and “initiative” mainly leads to the boards.

oh I see now, you read some other player say it so it must be true and then I guess you got busy “parroting” what you heard other thief fanboys say and it became gospel?

is this what happened?

you seem to be somewhat familiar with this scenario…

evilapprentice.6379:

Most of the posters on these boards are too busy just parroting “Thief rabble rabble my class is too hard to play and spec” to do so.

cmon tell me this isn’t what happened

evilapprentice.6379:

google.3709:

Thief are immune to 2 conditions : )

1. Chill for stated reasons
2. Blind (barely noticible unless its on CnD)

Immune to chill? Do thieves not move at a reduced speed when they’re chilled? News to me.

Chill was specifically designed with initiative in mind – someone at Anet specifically used chill as an example to how thieves CD mechanics were different than the other classes, mentioning that the CD slowdown part of chill was specifically designed to not affect initiative.

You’ll also note it still affects heals, utilities, the class skill, and elites, because those have CD timers.

Case closed.

btw we are still waiting for your reference, too busy pretending to be smart?

evilapprentice.6379:

Dredlord.8076:

evilapprentice.6379:

Dredlord.8076:

evilapprentice.6379:

shimmerless.4560:

chilled is strong enough against a class that needs constant movement to stay alive. i think this would be a very negative change/would make some classes even more powerful

Ah, there’s your problem shimmerless – you “thought”.

Most of the posters on these boards are too busy just parroting “Thief rabble rabble nerf” to do so.

and here you are too stupid to realize he’s on your side and still you bash him.

you need to read the posts before you respond kid.

I was bashing people like you by pointing out his position was too well thought out for anyone here to follow. Thank you So much for exemplifying exactly what I was saying so utterly perfectly. I mean, this couldn’t have gone any better. Thank you.

hahahaha nice backpedal, you look some clever now…

You’re in over your head intellectually here son, allow me to educate you.

“Ah, there’s your problem shimmerless – you “thought”.

Most of the posters on these boards are too busy just parroting “Thief rabble rabble nerf” to do so."

Read that second sentence – I’m disparaging (since I know you’re going to need it, http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/disparaging?s=t) those people.

I’ve specifically set shimmerless apart from that group by pointing out that he thinks.

Ergo (http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/ergo?s=ts), you should probably refrain from any “battle of wits” in the future. You’re clearly ill equipped.

if you are so smart why can’t you even get simple math right in your previous post?

and by all means include links in your excuse if it makes you feel smarter…

Jayce.5632:

Chill affecting initiative would essentially slow 4 weapon skills at once, instead of one skill at a time. I’m not a thief, but even I can see this would really hurt them. The real problem is the initiative system itself that enables thief’s to do what they do.

ok I can see how the auto attack spammers can relate to this argument because well nothing is on cooldown.

When I get hit by chill most of the time it is reducing the cooldown on more than 4 of my weapon skills.

I guess thieves don’t realize this because they have the luxury of staying in one weapon set all the time.

evilapprentice.6379:

Dredlord.8076:

evilapprentice.6379:

shimmerless.4560:

chilled is strong enough against a class that needs constant movement to stay alive. i think this would be a very negative change/would make some classes even more powerful

Ah, there’s your problem shimmerless – you “thought”.

Most of the posters on these boards are too busy just parroting “Thief rabble rabble nerf” to do so.

and here you are too stupid to realize he’s on your side and still you bash him.

you need to read the posts before you respond kid.

I was bashing people like you by pointing out his position was too well thought out for anyone here to follow. Thank you So much for exemplifying exactly what I was saying so utterly perfectly. I mean, this couldn’t have gone any better. Thank you.

hahahaha nice backpedal, you look some clever now…

evilapprentice.6379:

Andele.1306:

evilapprentice.6379:

Elementalists have the options to go tanky if they desire – thieves do not.

Everything after this quote is worthless since it defined your lack of build knowledge, Please tell me what else is a permastealth (and i dont mean BS poke) thief than a tanky evade kitten, you can be in a evasion movement for 4 of 5 seconds for 25~ seconds before popping a long cd utility…
.

… seriously? “Tanky”? Stealth doesn’t reduce the damage you take… it doesn’t grant stability.. it doesn’t regenerate health (without a grandmaster trait), you can’t hold/contest a point during it… it doesn’t let you block… and I’m the one with a lack of build knowledge? You seem to have trouble with an MMO’s basic definitions (“Tanky”,‘Dodgy", etc..), I’m not sure you’re qualified yet to understand builds.

You’ll also note, we’re specifically talking about chilled here, which seriously hampers evasive game play and stealth – if you can’t keep beating on a thief who stealthed moving at 33% movement speed, you probably should go play a game more suited to your skills, like tic-tac-toe or something (But be careful, X is OP and needs to be nerfed).

your whole argument seems to rely on us both pretending the thief doesn’t have any dodges, evades, no cooldown stunbreaks, teleports etc.

again if your build doesn’t take advantage of these things perhaps someone can help you with that.

evilapprentice.6379:

shimmerless.4560:

chilled is strong enough against a class that needs constant movement to stay alive. i think this would be a very negative change/would make some classes even more powerful

Ah, there’s your problem shimmerless – you “thought”.

Most of the posters on these boards are too busy just parroting “Thief rabble rabble nerf” to do so.

and here you are too stupid to realize he’s on your side and still you bash him.

you need to read the posts before you respond kid.

evilapprentice.6379:

Dredlord.8076:

Softspoken.2410:

It doesn’t, but realize exactly how crippling chill would be on a thief if it did: unlike other professions where it would slow down the recharge only of skills they’ve already used, it would slow down the ‘recharge’ of every weapon skill (besides 1) for a thief.

Plus it also has the movement speed reduction which is quite punishing for any mobility based thief, which is most of them.

no you are wrong.

if any other class doesn’t have any skills on cooldown it doesnt effect any recharges and in the same way if the thief has not used any skills then initiative recharge is also not effected because it is full.

having the benefit of using the same skills over and over but dependent on a resource pool is the reward, the risk is finite resources and the opportunity cost of using one skill over another. Thieves have flexibility that no other class has in this way. This flexibility sure as hell should NOT give them 50% immunity from a condition as well.

No, you’re wrong, and “50%” is a silly number you made up that doesn’t mean anything.

Initiative has both positive and negative aspects -
Positive – skills don’t go on cooldown, can be used repeatedly.
Negative – Instead of having 2 separate weaponsets with their own unique cooldowns, thieves get 1 pool of “actions” with all equipped weapons. A warrior can go nuts and blow every single GS skill as quickly as possible…then switch to Axe/Shield and have access to all 5 skills. If a thief blows all his initiative with D/P…He’s out of actions until init regens.

In addition, spammable abilities come with a cost – thieves are denied some effects on their weaponskills precisely because they are spammable. No KD/KB/Launch/Pull. Extremely short durations on Stun/Daze/Immobilize. No skills that grant any useable duration of a Boon. I’m not claiming this is unfair (its perfectly fair, the skills are spammable), but it’s something most don’t notice because they never bothered to play thief.

Now to clear up your made up numbers. Chill has 2 unique effects – a snare, and CD increase. so, 50/50. The chill fully affects a thief – the CD increase effects skills 6-10, which all have CD timers. The only thing unaffected is weaponskills – so a thief is immune to roughly 25% of chills effect. Seeing as how reliant thief is on mobility to remain alive, however (no prot/aegis/stability, poor regen, lowest base healthpool), that snare affects them more than most other classes.

yes I covered the prosand cons of initiative in my post, were you having trouble understanding it? or did you think repeating it would add validity to your argument?

I never have problems with initiative on my thief, try a different spec or stop mashing your keys if you are having trouble here…

Now to clear up your made up numbers…
If you are going to correct me on the “math” you might as well get it right.
You have 10 weapon skills not 5, did you forget you had another weapon set or were you too busy spamming heartseeker? Perhaps we can agree on 33% immunity to chill then.

Thieves have amazing mobility even when snared rooted or hard cc’ed on top of great condition cleansing, if you didn’t spoec that way thats your own fault and just shows you are too stuborn to respec when the meta changes.

There is no good reason chill shouldn’t effect initiative gain on some level.