Guild Wars 2

Zalman.8719:

I DEMAND capes! Yeah I know charr, and clipping and stuff…Capes clipped and sometimes behaved strange(looking at you assassin)in GW1, they will do that here too, I’m sure they could do it, it’s just matter of time and a little push from here.

To be fair, Assassin armors in Guild Wars 1 were also beyond terrible. Every other class at least had some kind of coherent sense of style. Assassins were just “I got in a fight with a knife store and lost.”

Farming Flats.5370:

Sincerely , i think cape in GW2 is a very bad idea. At least until they figure a way to transfer more workload to the GPU. Currently things like shadows , reflections are done by the CPU and the game already hit kitten the CPU.

Unfortunately the capes enter the Animations graphic option( controls model animations and simulations, such as cloth and water , low,mid,high) Introducing capes in the game will require even more CPU power. Imagine a WvW fight with everyone in capes ? The minis are hidden for a reason when there is too much players around.

Finally , how do you manage the capes + back piece + shield + engineer hobo sack ??

NO capes

Capes would constitute back pieces. So there is no managing of capes + back piece + shield + engineer hobo sack. We already have that technology.

Now, if the CPU workload of having cape back pieces in WvW is really so high, that only implies that the game needs a wider range of graphics customization. For WvW, there’s really no happy medium between attractive + graphics intensive and “looks like a load of crap,” and we could really benefit from more options here.

I would suggest more advanced graphics sliders to dictate everything that you wish to be disabled or diminished:
Max players viewed
Minis
Particle slider
Legendary particles
Advanced animations (such as cloth animations)
Etc.

Draknar.5748:

They could do what Destiny did. Level 20 gear is the highest level gear, but you can increase your actual level up to 30 with another stat called Light.

For GW2 it could work with infusions. To get to level 90, you need to get to 80, then get Exotic level 80 gear (I would say Ascended, but most people aren’t interested in Ascended, so it would be most fair to allow people to hit 90 with exotics as well), and then as you play you gather certain materials or do certain quests for items that you can use to upgrade your armor (for GW2 it would not increase your actual stats, but rather add an infusion of sorts that levels you from 80 to 81, if you infuse your boots, for example).

A level 80 and a level 90 would have the same exact stats, just the level 90 guys will have access to harder content. To keep things fair, and more in line with GW2, this would be a good opportunity to include Hard-mode. Same dungeons, but mobs are level 90. They hit harder, have more health, etc. Maybe additional conditions.

Maybe hitting level 90 gives a title and you glow faintly or something. Gives something for bored 80s to do, while not limiting content for those who choose not to pursue level 90.

That’s acceptable, but it has to be implemented better than the Destiny system.

Destiny (among many other issues) suffers from very restricted customization at endgame, and the Light system is a large part of that. Aesthetically, lower level gear and gear with low Light levels is unusable. On the high end, appealing stats and passives are worthless if they come with a poor Light stat.

Obviously, transmutation will make the aesthetic side of the issue meaningless here, but we can still hit quite a few ruts here. And what gear gives these bonus levels? I would assume that it would be exclusive to Ascended Gear. In which case, it’s basically what Agony Resistance already is.

So, in the end, is the suggestion really nothing more than restructuring Agony Resistance with a better UI feature that lets you estimate a player’s AR at a glance?

For male characters, I have to say that those heavy and medium sets are some of the best ones I’ve ever seen.

Vayne.8563:

I’m pretty sure they will raise the level cap with an expansion. And I don’t think it’ll be a huge deal….but yeah, there are definitely pros and cons associated with it.

Hopefully it won’t come with a new tier of gear though.

Then you aren’t thinking. A level cap raise is a huge deal.

We can assume that they will scale up legendaries. We can’t assume the same for Ascended, and it definitely won’t happen for Exotic gear, unless the new levels don’t come with higher level (not higher tier) gear to begin with. The mere idea of the dozens or even hundreds of hours spent gearing characters in Ascended going to waste is frightening, and, for many players, gamebreaking.

But let’s ignore gear for the moment. A new level cap would also add more trait points. That’s a big impact, as it would completely change the number of builds and the strength of these. The balance of the game would completely shift. That’s not necessarily a bad thinig – it might even be a positive – but it’s certainly a huge deal.

Now, if there is no effect gear and/or traits, then the new levels would be fundamentally pointless.

Kveldulf.7605:

An other way for embarrassing and pathetic cliping fails? especially for charr? Why not?

Clipping is only embarrassing and pathetic if a set clips with itself. Admittedly, this does happen quite a few times in GW2 – particularly when the character moves and especially for Charr.

It is not embarrassing when mix-and-match clips, because the developers can’t possibly account for every instance of mix-and-match. And mix-and-match is precisely what a back piece could be considered in every circumstance.

Gaile Gray.6029:

I liked the capes in Guild Wars, especially since the art and animation teams got such a fluid “flow” to the fabric. (Actually, other game designers asked how it was done, back in the day!)

I imagine there would be challenges in incorporating capes, and naturally a cape would cover some of the armor pieces, which is a drawback when you’ve worked hard to get the whole “look” going on. As mentioned, it was brought up in the CDI, so that’s good.

Paradox — I’m curious. Why do you say “no capes?”

Wouldn’t half-capes / shoulder capes (think Ezio from Assassin’s Creed) be a viable way to produce an attractive flowing fabric that doesn’t cover as many armor pieces?

It depends on the texture of the armor you’re going for. Medium armors tend to go into three categories: cloth-like, leather, and hard-leather/armored-leather.

The cloth-like (such as the crafted set “Leather Armor,” Duelist, Stalwart, or Inquest) hold up to just about any color scheme and function well with bold colors.

Standard leather is most of the set, and it tends to mostly function with more earthy colors. Oil Slick. Pitch. Charred. Cinders. Etc.

Armored leather (such as Falconer’s) goes by a lot of the same preferences as standard leather, but with added steel pieces that look really good with Cinders, Antique Gold, and other such colors.

It would be the day I quit. It’s one thing to add an absurdly overpriced stat-progression gear tier. It’s another thing entirely to make every set of said gear pointless by then raising the level cap – punishing altoholics even more.

Halvorn.9831:

On a side-note: I stopped playing GW1 when it came to Cantha, couldn’t convice myself to stay around Kaineng for very long, in my personal view the most awful maps I ever experienced anywhere. I am quite sure a lot of you disagree and that’s normal. All of this is about personal taste. So relax and don’t overestimate your importance.

The Kaineng maps were awful, but The Jade Sea and Echovald Forest are among the most beautiful and interesting map sets to hit the franchise. They solidified Factions as my favorite expansion, whereas, despite the high quality of Nightfall, much of Nightfall’s repetitive desert and repainted desert terrain turned me off.

Zoso.8279:

Personally like I said before raids or the lack of a raiding mode is what is hurting the game. They tried to fill that void with fractals but it just wasn’t enough. It was a good start but they need raids to be that hard mode type content ( but still accessible to casual players ) that will keep people focused while LS and more zones open up. Im fully expecting more zones in the map of Tyria to open up and more world bosses to be introduced to these zones.

If the Raid content is good/compelling and it is difficult enough (or has enough customizable difficulty) for the hardcore crowd, you would be right in saying that it would provide much of the substance that the game needs to hold focus while the LS and content updates occur.

It is not, however, the only necessary piece of this puzzle. Let’s ignore bug fixes and dungeon reworks for the time being. Those, like LS story updates and new maps, can be brought out over time while a Raid mode “distracts” the community. It is still important, however, that the game’s lacking skill pool be addressed in the shorter term. It isn’t simply that what we play has been stagnant; it’s also how we play, and there is very little evolution of how the game is played or can be played at any point in the leveling process. That’s been a pretty major and common criticism of the game since the beginning.

laokoko.7403:

Many people consider GW2 the best 30$ they ever spend on entertainment. People are able to play thousands of hours on GW2 without ever paying more.

Many people consider GW2 dont’ have an endgame. Which is controversial. Because many people are able to have thousands of hours of playtime. That being said, most people probably say that because other mmorpg provides better endgame either in terms of content or progression.

As a 2 year old game. Many people are complaining about the game getting stale. I rarely see that many people complain about the lack of content on a mmorpg forum this much. That being said, being B2P is probably one of the reason. In a subscription game, when the game gets stale, people usually just quit, so they stop complaining on the forum. As a game without monthly fee, players are more likely to drag along, and keep playing/complaining on the forums.

Well, you also have to keep in mind that this is the same company (in name) that practically INVENTED the buy-to-play MMO and demonstrated the merits of it as a system in the making of this game’s predecessor. Guild Wars 1’s buy-to-play worked out quite beautifully, as there was a constant drive for Anet to develop and add content, which fans, in turn, enthusiastically bought. There was a cash shop, but there wasn’t a huge push to use it, and the cash shop did not come across as dragging the game down in any way.

Here, we haven’t seen the content additions that one would expect from a subscription MMO, and we also haven’t seen anything on par with what was done expansion-wise for the first game. We haven’t even really seen anything on par with the free Sorrow’s Furnace, UW, and FoW updates.

So what’s changed? Well, Anet has lost quite a few of their original members to other studios, so that may be an influencing factor. The real issue is likely a publishing one. NCSoft is rather infamous – especially after the CoH shutdown, and Nexon recently acquired quite a lot of stock in NCSoft, compounding the awfulness of this arrangement.

Regardless, the state of updates has largely been short-term over long-term. Lots of living story chapters (of varying qualities) are getting the emphasis over needed bug fixes, content reworks, skills, traits, weapons, and expansion content. That’s where the stagnation is coming from. Living story – as good as it can be at times – comes across as a temporary band-aid for a game that needs some evolution and direction.

Vayne.8563:

cheshirefox.7026:

i understand why this game “feels” stagnant.. but i personally did not feel affected by this until the ‘sweeping’ changes made this year.. poor decision making is really beginning to bear its full weight on the community in its entirety

See and that’s the thing. People keep calling it stagnant and then also complain about sweeping changes. It’s hard for both to be true.

But yes the game doesn’t necessarily change as fast as other games. I’m pretty sure that a reasonable percentage of the playerbase sees that as a plus.

On the surface, that does seem to be a contradictory pair of statements. In practice, we’re in a situation that hits both.

We’ve seen sweeping changes (from the feature packs, primarily) that have not moved the game forward or changed the game substantially from a standard standpoint (that of the veteran). These changes have, however, earned complaints for drastically changing the game for a smaller (but still substantial) set of the community (new players and altoholics) in a way that does not add substance to their long-term play, but does create inconvenience for them in the shorter term.

Guild Wars 2 is essentially the same game that it was 2 years ago in many ways (save for a new, obnoxiously expensive gear tier). In that 2 years, the vast majority of changes we’ve seen have been to what I would call “secondary systems” (those that are major but do not have a direct impact on gameplay), such as the account wallet, trait unlocks, and other such renovations. We haven’t seen many improvements to what I might call “primary systems” (targeting, content design, the skill system, etc.), and the result is a game that has remained stagnant on a fundamental level.

IndigoSundown.5419:

SenorMoody.5908:

Cons: Large focus on Gem Store

This comment is very subjective. Do they make stuff to sell in the store? Of course they do, like any business. Despite that, I’ve never felt pressured to buy anything in the gem store, and there are plenty of things in the game for free that I have yet to “get.” I don’t see a “large focus” on the gem store at all.

I think that by this, they are referring to the lacking number of new, non-gemstore armor and weapon skins. Which is a valid point. No, they aren’t forcing you to buy anything from the store, but they also haven’t turned out much in the way of new visuals to be obtained through regular content either.

We’ve seen Ambrite Weapons, Champ Bag Weapons, Ascended Gear, Achievement Skins, some back items that no one cares about, and the new Glorious Set and…. that’s about it. That’s really not much for 2 years.

Vayne.8563:

Duke Blackrose.4981:

Vayne.8563:

cheshirefox.7026:

Vayne.8563:

It’s an MMO that removes a lot of the frustrations of MMOs before it. If you love traditional MMOs it’ll take some adjustment. If you’re frustrated by traditional MMOs, then this might be a good alternative for you.

valid, but arena net seems to excel at their side and viciously neglect the other.. in removing traditional frustrations they submit their own.. i’d really like to see them refine instead of cater to the zombie consumer crowd.. that is the only way i really see this franchise retaining its longevity

Sure there’s plenty of frustrations and Anet creates a lot of frustration in the way the handle communication. But that says a lot pertaining to the forum crowd and doesn’t say much about how everyone else enjoys the game.

Does anyone really believe most people stay in touch with stuff and read the forums…because I don’t. And a lot of the problems brought up here don’t really get noticed or affect much of the player base. That’s the thing.

We’re the hard core, invested demographic. We’ve pretty much got to be the minority. Half the stuff we argue about most players will never even know about.

That’s rather debatable. I see quite a lot of the same issues brought up and passionately discussed in routine LA map chats all the time – and comments tend to lean towards the negative, just like in the forums.

The forum community IS a minority, but their mindsets tend to be representative of the community at large – and you see samples of virtually every subset of the game’s community within the forum community.

At the same time, however, I would agree that the lack of constant forum replies from Anet is not a major issue in regards to communication. What IS an issue, however, is that there is very little indication as to the long-term plans of the developers. An expansion in the works? Who knows. How far do their Living Story plans go? Are the new skills and weapons that were promised a year ago even in the works? The list goes on, and there has been virtually no commentary on any of these for months on end.

How do you know the people who aren’t talking in routine map chats don’t post on reddit or the forums?

What percent of the playerbase do you really think takes place in “routine” map chats, even?

Irrelevant.

And a pretty large percent. You have to factor in not only those who start such chats (which may well be forumers), but also those who simply add their input and even those (impossible to account for players) who stay out of the conversation but take mental note of it and necessarily take a personal stance on it. There is a large percentage of idle players in LA at any given time. Sometimes these idle for short periods to craft or to handle other business. Sometimes they are the more disillusioned folks who would rather chat than play the game. Either way, it’s a large sub-community of the game as a whole, and it’s an interesting thing to look at and read.

Now, I also like how you glossed over the real meat of my statement (the final paragraph) to argue semantics as it suits you. Point is – the game has been relatively stagnant (even by MMO standards) for some time and there has been very little indication of it changing in a meaningful way, outside of the Raid and Guild Hall CDI’s. One does not have to be part of the forum or Reddit community to see that, recognize it, or discuss it, and you will often see it take place in the ingame chat box. Whether or not those people are also forumers or Redditors is truly irrelevant.

Vayne.8563:

cheshirefox.7026:

Vayne.8563:

It’s an MMO that removes a lot of the frustrations of MMOs before it. If you love traditional MMOs it’ll take some adjustment. If you’re frustrated by traditional MMOs, then this might be a good alternative for you.

valid, but arena net seems to excel at their side and viciously neglect the other.. in removing traditional frustrations they submit their own.. i’d really like to see them refine instead of cater to the zombie consumer crowd.. that is the only way i really see this franchise retaining its longevity

Sure there’s plenty of frustrations and Anet creates a lot of frustration in the way the handle communication. But that says a lot pertaining to the forum crowd and doesn’t say much about how everyone else enjoys the game.

Does anyone really believe most people stay in touch with stuff and read the forums…because I don’t. And a lot of the problems brought up here don’t really get noticed or affect much of the player base. That’s the thing.

We’re the hard core, invested demographic. We’ve pretty much got to be the minority. Half the stuff we argue about most players will never even know about.

That’s rather debatable. I see quite a lot of the same issues brought up and passionately discussed in routine LA map chats all the time – and comments tend to lean towards the negative, just like in the forums.

The forum community IS a minority, but their mindsets tend to be representative of the community at large – and you see samples of virtually every subset of the game’s community within the forum community.

At the same time, however, I would agree that the lack of constant forum replies from Anet is not a major issue in regards to communication. What IS an issue, however, is that there is very little indication as to the long-term plans of the developers. An expansion in the works? Who knows. How far do their Living Story plans go? Are the new skills and weapons that were promised a year ago even in the works? The list goes on, and there has been virtually no commentary on any of these for months on end.

Vayne.8563:

Gene Archer.8560:

I see nothing unfair about this thread.

You should get your glasses checked, Vayne.

Well if nothing else one person called the game pay to win and I know precious few people who agree with that. There’s more too, but since you all you actually want to do is start a fight with me, I won’t be replying to more of your posts in this thread.

In general, I would agree with you here. But the Armor and Damage Boosters have always left a somewhat bitter taste in my mouth in regards to P2W. If these could be used in sPvP/tPvP, where such a thing would actually matter, I’d have probably quit a long time ago – and I say that as someone who likes the game (within reason), has logged about 3k hours, and who has been with the series since GW: Factions.

My thoughts.

But really, I wouldn’t say anything. I’d just buy them the copy. It’s cheap enough now. And hell, I’ve bought full price copies for friends.

slamfunction.7462:

Great initial effort, leading to at least 3-6 months of fun and exciting gameplay. Quickly falls down into a cesspool of bad management decisions which affects the enjoyment of the gamplay, shortly there after.

Leaning more towards the 3. It was the November 2012 update (Ascended Tier + untested event) that really foreshadowed everything.

narwhalsbend.7059:

The prequel is better.

This sentence hits the nail on the head so quickly and accurately that it should be the box quote.

Guild Wars 2: The prequel is better.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fNAQNAV8PjEq2yiJLUtGwQoa3CvbVzKAcHvvwVD-TRgPAAw+DAA-e

Pretty basic Shortbow, Sword/Torch Survival character with 0/10/30/30/0 trait setup.

Would it be best to go with a full condition approach (Rabid, Dire, or some mix of these) or with a Hybrid approach (Carrion, Rampager, or a mix) to take advantage of the two grandmaster minors and the 10 points in Skirmishing?

Siobhan.3582:

Mesmer can be a rough road to level up now with all the changes Anet made to the game. Having to wait so long for solid traits makes it harder for them vs the warrior.

Now I have been around since beta, so I level my alt via crafting, b-day level books and EOTM.

but as a newer player, you really should enjoy leveling up through the various zones and doing the hearts and events.

Both are fun to me. Mesmer is more involved and by the time you are like 60 level you are rolling fine. Just getting there can be a little rough vs the warrior

Mesmers are highly trait reliant, so this tends to be the case, but you can still roll a condition build for leveling to make things a bit easier.

Now, leveling an Engineer is kind of like repeatedly stabbing yourself in the groin. It’s pure torture and always has been.

Short answer – roll both.

Long answer – it really comes down to what you want to be.

As a Warrior, your primary goal (in PvE) is dps. You are a train of damage and durability, but your support capabilities aren’t the best. Warriors have the highest weapon variety, though PvE meta tends to highlight only a few of these – and sword really isn’t one of them. As far as I’m aware, you’ll be a powerful force in most dungeons, but somewhat lacking in high end Fracs (I could be wrong there).

As a Mesmer, you serve a rather similar role to the Guardian (in dungeons). High dps coupled with reflects and/or stability and/or condition removal. Time Warp is an incredible elite skill for dungeons that turns bosses into paste. Trouble is, meta builds for the Mesmer are pretty one-dimensional in PvE (though they get a good bit more variety in PvP). Fortunately for you, their meta dungeon set is also Sword/Sword.

B and C.

As well as a bitter A – only in regards to achieving the max gear tier, and never really enjoying the process or the concept of having gear tiers at all.

Yelloweyedemon.2860:

Atherakhia.4086:

Guard’s only real use is to be used with Nature’s Voice, but even at that it’s kind of bad given the cast time and how dreadful the shout is base.

Protect Me probably should also be changed given the changes to Signets. Having both SoS and PM up could be a bit over the top and changing PM makes far more sense.

Protect Me: The Ranger, his pet, and up to 4 other targets receive protection for 4 seconds. 25 second cooldown. Instant Cast.

Guard changed to Intimidate: The Ranger, his pet, and up to 4 other targets receive Fury and Might. 25 second cooldown. Instant Cast.

Protect me has no reason to change. It is not useless, it can be used in pvp for more inv. time.

Also your suggestion to Guard would not make it worth slotting anyways. Plus we have that on warhorn skill.

That doesn’t mean that the skill does not warrant a change. It is still inferior to Signet of Stone in every way save for cooldown.

God no. No more immersion breakers, please.

Phoebe Ascension.8437:

Gw1 system has downsides too you know. Like low hp professions like ele, had a hard time using the -3 stat 75 hp sigil. But other professino like necro, (with minions who tank for him), could easely take 13 (max) +3 (minus hp but who cares, your minions tanks). He could even then use that buff masochism, +2 further in stats, making it a +18 whopping. Other profs had to rely on 122 or +13+2, wich was lot lower, and kinda punishing.

Gw1 has it’s strengths, but also weaknesses. The grass is always greener on other side. The thing you don’t have (gw1 atm, i’m sure most here aren’t playing it, so it feels like you don’t have it), feel more important, then the things you have, and others dont. To put things in perspective.

There were no low/high hp professions in Guild Wars 1. Health was normalized. Now, armor numbers were different. And how is this any different from the Guild Wars 2 system, where low health/armor professions have a more difficult time making use of berserker gear, while other professions (like the warrior or the high-safety Mesmer) have a much easier time? I’ll answer that for you – it’s much less extreme.

This isn’t a case of “the grass looks greener.” No, it actually was greener. Deep build customization was a thing. Adapting to entire areas/missions was a thing. Teamwork was a thing. Dungeon content that didn’t devolve into stacking was a thing. Zones that didn’t get zerged to death were a thing. Actually receiving expansions was gasp a thing.

And there is no home for the Guild Wars 1 player. They can’t just go back to Guild Wars 1 – it doesn’t have the population to hold up its PvP or its elite PvE content. Guild Wars 2 is a completely different, and in many ways inferior game. Other MMOs are a laughing stock of bad design. The Guild Wars 1 vet community is, simply put, homeless and angry – and rightfully so.

Castrin.8972:

Duke Blackrose.4981:

For those not familiar with it, Guild Wars 1 used a five-attribute system, with each profession having its own.

{snip}

In short

Guild Wars 1’s system was about doing your role(s) – defined by your skills – the way you wished in your own specific way. The Guild Wars 2 system is all about min-maxing to a role defined by your stats – and the game has suffered for it.

I disagree, the game has not suffered for it at all. In GW2 you have so much more you can tailor and it isn’t restricted to a rigid class system like GW1. Certainly in GW1 you could focus more on your set role but that’s why GW2 is better. There are no roles except those that you want to do in any class you care to play.

Min/Maxing is the staple of most good RPGs and GW2 follows that philosophy and creates a world where class is just how you do combat, and how well you do it is based on a more complex stat structure. In your example an Elementalist is not relegated to doing only their attunements and only able to pick one. Instead they do them all and tailor how they affect combat by manipulating the stats they have assigned.

I’ve played both GW1 and GW2 and of them both I think GW2 is the better system. Not perfect mind you but much more flexible and fun.

Peace.

There are two types of customization at play here. Active customization and passive customization, namely.

With 8 customizable skills on only two restrictions (one optional elite and the need to have all skills within your two class choices), Guild Wars 1 had the superior active customization. That is not up for debate. It’s objective. Guild Wars 2 allows you 6-7 points of active customization (weapon choice and slot skills), but all of these choices are restricted. Furthermore, most slot choices in Guild Wars 2 are effectively decided for the player in regards to the type of damage they wish to deal. A weapon is generally only utilized in its respective damage type (direct or condition), and will only rarely be utilized by the other, barring hybrid builds. The same can often be said of elites, and sometimes even utilities. At this point, most “choice” becomes the illusion of choice, and that’s without even mentioning that there is a restricting factor on every single skill slot and a low pool of skills and weapons to choose from in these. Simply put, the active customization of Guild Wars 2 is terrible.

Passive customization is where Guild Wars 2 may have an edge, but this is very much a matter of taste. So let’s simply sum up what each one does. Guild Wars 1’s passive customization was comprised of runes/insignias (more simplified), two different categories of sigils (weapon parts), and stat allocation. Guild Wars 2’s is runes, sigils, traits, and stat allocation. Each has their own respective strength here. Guild Wars 2 characters effectively have tons of passive strengths, whereas Guild Wars 1 characters have a greater degree of effectiveness distribution via their stat system.

With Guild Wars 2, we see a much greater degree of passive abilities via the trait tree, but are these meaningful in creating a playstyle? The answer to this is sometimes. The trait tree is primarily full of three categories of traits – numbers traits, playstyle traits, and useless traits. Of the useful traits, many of these (and many of the most effective traits) are numbers traits – those that tweak damage, cooldowns, hard stats, or other non-defining factors. These do not help a player to determine their playstyle in any meaningful way. It is only the minority of traits – those that do provide interesting effects (such as Evasive Arcana), that actually shape how a player plays. Unfortunately, stats once again serve as a rut in the system. By attaching stats to the trait tree, Anet effectively limited the number of viable trait builds that can be created by creating wasted stats when taking certain trees or requiring certain trait paths to min/max your desired role.=

Now, this had never even really been the question. The point of the thread is “which is better. System A (example: Fire Magic, Air Magic, Water Magic, Earth Magic, Energy Storage), or System B (Power, Precision, Toughness, Condition Damage, Prowess, Healing Power, Boon Duration, X attribute).” The better system in any game is the one that creates more variety. And System A undoubtedly does. Why? Because it allows for a layer of definition on top of the active customization that does not undermine it. Active customization is the rule of playstyle depth, and Guild Wars 1 understood this and built around it, rather than attempting to box it in through slot restrictions, restrictive stats, and content that explicitly forces certain choices out (via condition immunity, crit immunity, Defiant, and other bad mechanics).

Removing the precision and making the poison application even more unreliable means that your changes are an overall nerf. The only real positive here is that they no longer overaggro by evasive tunneling.

Arachnaas.2093:

On the plus side we could also get playable margonites, and dervishes.

Profoundly unlikely, but this would make me very happy.

TBH, Renown Hearts have always been a bad mechanic. They take away from the dynamism of the open world and put structure and direction where they really don’t belong.

Sarision.6347:

People complaining about about sword should advocate for more GS buffs, just sayin’.

No. They should be advocating for a main-hand dagger or other one-handed melee weapon. The big value of the MH sword – which GS will never be able to replace – is the power of Off-hand options available to it. Rangers have excellent Off-hand weapons, but must choose between a clunky (but good) MH Sword or a rather situational/lackluster ranged Axe to make use of these.

At the end of the day, more MH options would be much appreciated.

lordkrall.7241:

To be fair what you are talking about wouldn’t really be “pulling off amazing use of GW1 lore” but rather more or less completely changing GW1 lore, which people have been whining about them doing since before release of GW2.

Actually, it wouldn’t change a thing about GW1 lore. It would only explore an unexplored facet of Guild Wars 1 lore that does not in any way necessarily contradict any previously established knowledge.

Fact is, we don’t know Abaddon’s motivations. Hell, our Guild Wars 1 characters didn’t know the motivations of their human gods or even if they could be trusted – they simply did as they were told. Keep in mind that many of the major conflicts of Guild Wars 1 (including some that lead into Guild Wars 2) were mistakes made by the player characters that had disastrous consequences – all because they did not have the necessary information or had been misled. The rise of the Dredge from slavery – only for that same race to wage war on and enslave other races? That’s the fault of Guild Wars 1 characters. Palawa Joko’s return? Guild Wars 1 characters did it. The captives getting executed by the White Mantle instead of staying safely with the Shining Blade? We did that. The Lich getting the Scepter of Orr? That was us. The Lich getting past the Mursaat and unleashing an army of Titans on the world? Us again.

Misinformation, player-caused consequences, and non-obvious motivations are frequent aspects of the Guild Wars storyline.

SYPHA.9283:

Duke Blackrose.4981:

SYPHA.9283:

Harper.4173:

The GW1 system was designed for a completely different game with a completely different type of “average player” playing it.

This system we have now – both stat-wise and skill-wise is designed to be as “dummy proof” as possible so terribly bad people can still perform and don’t drop the game.

That’s the short answer.

Well that hasnt worked either. More and more people drop every day. Because it is soooo dumbed down.

There is no such thing as a game that appeals to everyone. By attempting to do so, you only make a mediocre game for everyone. Better to know your audience and appeal to them, as the first game did.

Never a truer statement. But, obviously they aren’t appealing to the masses, that’s apparent by the mass exodus and the crazy long queue times. Appealing to a select few “pro” players is going to be the games demise. Well, whats left of the community anyway.

Oh, no one said anything about appealing to pros. A good developer is simply one that knows what its audience is and attempts to make the best game possible for them. And that’s a vision that should be held from development all the way till the game’s life span runs its course.

SYPHA.9283:

Harper.4173:

The GW1 system was designed for a completely different game with a completely different type of “average player” playing it.

This system we have now – both stat-wise and skill-wise is designed to be as “dummy proof” as possible so terribly bad people can still perform and don’t drop the game.

That’s the short answer.

Well that hasnt worked either. More and more people drop every day. Because it is soooo dumbed down.

There is no such thing as a game that appeals to everyone. By attempting to do so, you only make a mediocre game for everyone. Better to know your audience and appeal to them, as the first game did.

Vayne.8563:

The big thing for me isn’t the stat system itself. It’s that none of those stats were tied to armor.

It’s all very nice to be able to change traits outside of combat, but carrying around 2, 3 sets of armor for different builds is just annoying (and I won’t do it).

And it got downright evil when ascended armor was added. Especially as a light armor class.

No class is as stat-flexible (and thus reliant on experimentation) as the Elementalist, and no class pays more for their armor pieces than the Elementalist, Mesmer, and Necromancer. Paying over 500g for a single set of best-in-stat gear is absurd.

Cuddy.6247:

Duke Blackrose.4981:

In Guild Wars 1, on the other hand, item nomenclature was irrelevant.

Not always. Earth eles weren’t that great and air got hit hard after the IL nerf, just to refer to your own examples. Fire ele was the best ele for damage dealing and E/Mo was your prot spec.

While I agree that the system in GW1 was better, I also enjoy the simplicity found in GW2 – they basically trimmed off all the unnecessary fat (although in the process trimmed off some wanted meat as well) that was in GW1. Also, item nomenclature made a huge difference. I kid you not, I’ve seen people use Windwalker insignias on their VoS dervishes in PvE…

Let’s not bring balance into the argument. Point is, an Air Elementalist is intended to be as good as an Earth, Water, or Fire Elementalist at their role while bringing their own unique skill pool with functionalities not available to the others. That’s what the game was all about, that is why the old system was superior, and that is why, barring borderline-incompetent balancing by Izzy, it was generally more successful at creating build variety.

As for insignias, that is not the GW1 equivalent of item nomenclature. Those are runes – plain and simple. Yes, they were the only real stat customization of the first game, but they served the same function as modern runes. If anything, I’d say that GW2’s runes are one of the only game systems to have improved from the first game’s equivalent, simply because of their variety of interesting passives.

I would argue that very little of the design in GW1 was “unnecessary fat.” It was mostly lean meat, even if it did have a little grizzle. GW2 cut the grizzle, cut away a vast chunk of the meat, and then stapled on the masses of fat that we know as ascended gear and stats attached to gear and trait lines.

Harper.4173:

The GW1 system was designed for a completely different game with a completely different type of “average player” playing it.

This system we have now – both stat-wise and skill-wise is designed to be as “dummy proof” as possible so terribly bad people can still perform and don’t drop the game.

That’s the short answer.

That’s an unfortunate statement, and it’s one that really cuts down to the bitter heart of the situation.

I was actually discussing MMO design with one of my friends, and when I brought up the possibility of an MMO structured around tanks that body-block and shield through position, he shot the idea down as being too difficult for the masses. “MMO players are idiots, and an MMO not designed for idiots will fail.”

I’m going to take a different stance on MMO communities however. My answer is this “MMO communities are idiotic because MMOs are designed for the idiotic.” When a developer assumes that their playerbase will be unintelligent, that is precisely what they will get. Have a little faith in your playerbase in game design, and you’ll get a more skilled one.

Thanks to some dye tweaks, Aetherion’s look is finally done.

His minions are known as the Schlerite (as the BL weapon set is named after them). Start from there.

Let’s keep it simple. Trait and quality of life changes meant to bring this cool, but bad, elite up to par. It may need more, but these are important foundational changes meant to shift it towards a workable baseline.

Mortar skills can now crit, unlike turrets.

Like turrets, Mortar gains a subskill that allows you to detonate it for AoE damage and a Blast Finisher.

Mortar benefits from all turret related traits.
Grants Aegis for 3 seconds, once every 10 seconds with Experimental Turrets.

Launch Elixir now constitutes a Water Field.

hybrid.5027:

runeblade.7514:

hybrid.5027:

runeblade.7514:

hybrid.5027:

runeblade.7514:

Proposal Overview
No stacking

Goal of Proposal
Dungeons content suffers from stacking. I am worried that raiding will simply be 20 people stacking together in a corner to dps.

Proposal Functionality
If players become stronger when together, so do mobs. Design the game around countering stacking and LoSing.

• +10000 toughness when reviving + near 10 allies.
• All mobs can revive each other just like mobs.
• All mobs do 10,000 damage while near 10 of their allies.
• Tons of AoE damage.

Stackfest should be a wipefest.

Associated Risks
Casuals won’t be able to enjoy raiding.

I think you should watch your pejoratives in this thread. You seem to have no clue what stacking is, why it’s done or how it works so the only person revealing himself to be a casual is you.

CDI Rules:

5: Aggression and disrespect to a fellow community member or developer will not be tolerated, and in the extreme could lead to the shutting down of the initiative.

Thanks for quoting your own rules violation. You shouldn’t use terms like “casual” as a pejorative if you don’t want to be called out on it. Additionally, you shouldn’t throw a stone inside of a glass house. If you’d like more advice please PM me.

You seem to have no clue what stacking is, why it’s done or how it works so the only person

In my defense, you didn’t seem like you understood. Generally, when someone says “lolz gw2 is just stack here dps win lolz” I assume they are a simple person who is used to being carried through dungeons and don’t realize what support mechanics are happening to allow that to happen.

Your post fit that mold; yet another person who mistakenly believes that some how it is the act of stacking that makes the content easy or that stacking grants some mysterious invulnerability quality. Neither of these are the case. So either you don’t know that or you pretend not to know to further your sophistry.

There are underlying support mechanics (as well as mob shortcomings) that make stacking possible, but it is still a heavy detractor from the quality of the dungeon experience. It defies the game’s mobile combat system, hurts profession balance (creating even more bias towards and against certain professions), and highlights a lot of the game’s core flaws (highlighting a bad zoomed and corner camera and creating a generally boring style of play).

So while it’s more than just “trololol, stack and dps for easy wins,” it’s still very much a negative aspect of the game that should have been adjusted months ago.

Example Raid Name

Realm of the Gods

Story

The Underworld, The Fissure of Woe, and the other (as of yet unexplored) god realms were connected to The Temple of Ages before the place fell to flood and ruin. It is no longer suitable as a gateway to these realms, but, with the Pact’s march into Orr, Priory scholars have discovered that the Orrian temples can be attuned to these planes of existence, creating temporary portals.

Pre-entry

In order to gain entry to this Raid, players must go through a series of required events.

- All temples must be captured. Including a new event chain at the sunken Abaddon Temple in Straits of Devastation.

- Once every temple is held, there will be simultaneous events at each to defend the scholars while they attune the portals.

- If this is successfully accomplished at every temple, the portals stabilize, allowing entry into the Raid until the temples are lost to the Risen.

- Failure to accomplish the portal attunement events at any temple will de-stabilize them at all temples.

- This steep entry requirement forces a move away from zerg play for the duration of the event and also adds a similar mechanic to traditional raid time gating. Instead of a time gate, however, the community will have control over their entry into the Raid.

*Note – This would also come with a large reward increase to temple defense events and allow them to count towards Trait unlocks.

Group Size

8 minimum.
10 maximum.

Past 10 players, the game’s excessive particle effects tend to weaken the combat experience. It doesn’t help that group sizes past 15 tend to fall into the zerg mindset. As such, you want to lean closer to the 8-10 range.

Map description (Vague)

This Raid is a combination of six tiles, each associated with one of the six human gods. It is entered through the portal attunement events described above and your choice of portal dictates which of the six tiles your group will start on. The group may even choose to split up and tackle multiple tiles at once to speed up the Raid by entering different portals.

Each tile has a number of challenges associated with it. These appear as Dynamic Events when they occur – marked by regular and group events to denote ones that can be feasibly be done by 1-3 people and those that require most or all of the team to complete. These events have much higher rewards than regular ones (of course), and each completed one contributes to the end of the Raid, much like the events of the Underworld and Fissure of Woe in the first Guild Wars.

Success in the Realm of the Gods will require that a large number of the available events be completed, though it will not require all of them. As you move closer to completion, you will draw the attention of Dhuum (or perhaps another powerful figure), who will be the group’s final challenge. He will be incredibly difficult, but the rewards for defeating him are substantial.

The group’s choice of events is important here. Each one provides unique advantages in the final boss fight by freeing up some of the map and garnering favor with the more loyal servants of the (missing) gods.

Associated Risks

This is primarily with the unlocking feature. As more content is added, this content may become less popular and the Raid may be unlocked more rarely. I would argue, however, that this is a positive on both ends. On one hand, the Raid should ensure a continued level of activity in Orr and be readily supported by any Living World renovations to Orr. On the other, rarer unlocks of the Raid will also lend it a form of exclusive status and make it feel like an earned, elite dungeon.

Djinn.9245:

Pandaman.4758:

Djinn.9245:

I agree with a lot of the OP. I don’t care about the nitpicking of the sword – it is a fact that there is no “oriental” culture in GW2. So why are we suddenly getting all kinds of oriental items? (That was a rhetorical question.)

http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Cantha
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Cantha

I said that there is currently no oriental culture…the fact that there might hypothetically be an oriental culture somewhere that isn’t available to our PCs in-game doesn’t negate this fact.

That isn’t a hypothetical. That is a real, existing culture in Guild Wars lore. Cantha is a real nation and we do know the generalities of its current state.

There are Krytans of Canthan descent (though they are few in number). Marjory is one of these.

Furthermore, Canthan culture is an influence on Tengu culture. Much of the Tengu population is comprised of the descendants of Tengu who were driven out of Cantha when the Ministry of Purity attempted genocide on them.

When I complain (and I do put more thought into it than most), it’s because I love the game. Otherwise, I would have left instead.

Yeah. AoE loot is already a thing. This problem is solved.

And I use Shift + F for AoE loot. Works admirably.

Novuake.2691:

Sors Immani.8429:

My major issue pertains to LS: the releases we are getting can be cleared in under an hour for even the most casual of casual gamers. An hour’s worth of content each month is almost insulting, in my opinion. In attempt to try to stretch out the content, an achievement grind-fest has been implemented: wardrobe, collections, crafting, title tracks, etc… With LS 2, we’re treated to this “mid-season finale” crap. I, and I’m sure many other players, hate it. We get 5 or so quests in biweekly intervals for a little over a month and then we have to wait 3 for a new release (August 13 – Nov 4)? It’s infuriating (on top of the gem store debacle that, for me, has yet to be remedied).

How would I remedy this? For starters, “Living Story” would consist of major expansion-like patches every 3 to 6 months (for GW1 veterans, think the Sorrow’s Furnace patch). New quests, dungeons, and events would provide a source of income for players while the new gear skins would allow players to expand their wardrobe if they chose to do so. Expansive new maps (with fewer waypoints) would allow players to explore at their leisure and provide a sense of achievement since defeat would require a long trek back to where you left off (again, harkening back to GW1 with towns/outposts serving as only means of travel).

Tyria itself is rich with lore and locale that we’ve not explored: the Crystal Desert, Dragon’s Lair, Battledepths/Depths of Tyria, Ring of Fire Isles, Tarnished Coast, Woodland/Verdant Cascades, Janthir, Southern Shiverpeaks, Far Shiverpeaks, and every other area on the map that is still in it’s stylized “uncharted” sense. Add to it the continents of Elona and Cantha, the Realm of Torment, and the vast expanse of the Unending Ocean and you’ve got enough material to work with for the next 5 years (easily) at my proposed content size and release schedule. I’m sure most players would be thrilled to see the continent maps have 100% landmass explorable.

TL;DR: ANet, you’ve got more than enough material to work with. Please stop trying to wring every last drop of “content” out of these tiny releases. Slow your schedule down some, give us larger releases and show us new locales with more quests, dungeons, etc. While we’re in “x”, something can be happening in "y"— that’s how you do LS.

I agree the devs could do more and would love them to do more, but you can not expect them to, or even demand they do.
Hell as you put it there is a mountain-load of content to expand on or even start from scratch.

And expect and demand seem to be the prevailing sentiment on the forum.

I think it’s less about doing more and more about doing different.

Let’s say that there is a young wannabe fantasy author, but he spends all of his writing time on fanfiction because that provides immediate gratification. Meanwhile, his major novel goal is pushed back and he loses out for it.

That’s precisely what’s happening here. Instant gratification and short term gain are winning out over the long term improvement and health of the game and Anet are taking some much-warranted flak for it.

And yes, I did just call the Living Story fanfiction.

RoseofGilead.8907:

I honestly like the trait system change. It’s much more like GW1’s trait system, where you also either did particular quests to unlock the traits or bought them for skill points and gold. So, you pick out traits you want, and then find how to unlock them.

My only complaint for how it is in GW2 is the fact that certain events bug a lot, which can be a major pain for players trying to get traits they need.

I think that was the intention. The trait unlocking was meant to encourage exploration of all content and to provide some horizontal progression, as in the first game.

I do not think, however, that it was well-conceived for a few reasons:

Guild Wars 1’s skill capping was an actual hunt for sidegrades (skills), but Guild Wars 2’s is a hunt for dull passive upgrades.

Skill hunting allows one to drastically change their playstyle (but not necessarily improve it) as a reward. Trait hunting does not.

As a feature launched two years after the game, it was particularly jarring. Players have seen and used the alternative and it is much less convenient than the former system.

Unlock objectives are frequently in the wrong level range or are attached to ridiculous objectives (such as the Overgrown Grub or Obsidian Sanctum).