Guild Wars 2

silvermember.8941:

Erebus.7568:

ARM.3912:

Zelyhn.8069:

Indeed I won’t admit this, not because it is untrue but because this is not what we are discussing here.

Someone made a claim that no ele can deal damage comparable to that of 100b in a single attack, I proved it wrong.

If we start discussing anything more than this, like class designs, then this conversation will never end. We do not have the skills or the knowledge to solve the “grand equation of classes” across all game modes and in all types of content. All we can do is compare simple concepts.

You didn’t prove anything, you just rattled off some numbers you made up. Find a video or find a new lie.

his always like that -.- no proof all talk and trolling…. its freaking annoying to discuss with him becouse of his bs, so just give it up early.

I feel like he is a paid shill design to give new or uninformed ele misinformation.

yup same feeling or that he simply is paid to keep praising anet to make their bad decision look better on the forums. even though its clear to any person not braindead that they continually choose to ignore the issues with the ele instead of fixing them

zencow.3651:

sorrychief.2563:

Has anyone tried sigil of doom instead of energy/battle?

It’s what I use for this build. Generally all other bunkers use it to kill other bunkers, only ele is pigeonholed to sigil of battle/energy due to low damage/necessity to dodge.

Erebus.7568:

no vids
espected to see some show off, of how good it was with that title :/

Heres some footage
Most warriors are like this: http://youtu.be/gysAUPrILo8
Hence we see why baddies claim warriors don’t need a nerf since they don’t actually use the meta warrior builds. This once lacked Cleansing Ire.

vs decent meta warrior: http://youtu.be/Zu-JkC6Zhoc
Yawn-fest. Lag started kicking as you can see at 19 seconds in so I couldn’t play that well. Would’ve been faster if Aegis/blocks weren’t always up by the time gale/signet of fire finally responded etc.

I can’t record and beat the top-dog warriors at the same time or I’d just eat every stun.

any vid against a half decent war that doesnt miss 60%+ of his stuns/burst becouse he simply sucks? (60%+ of his stuns/burst he uses out into tin air, no dodge or defensive used to negate them, he simply just use them without being close enough or facing the target.. its really sad to see…)
else it doesnt really show much and i would still say vs a decent stun war you got 0 chance to win.

no vids
espected to see some show off, of how good it was with that title :/

ele’s are rediculessly weak compared to other classes. only wasted your time if its becouse you just HAVE TO play a elemental mage type class, else i wouldn’t bother, there is way more fun to have with other classes “power wise”…

FirstBlood.7359:

Ironically, since its golden days the ele has only been slighty nerfed. The current state of the profession is more the consequence of a shifting meta. Buffed necromancers, the introduction of “boon hate” and the dominance of S/D thieves caused the exodus of eles in tPvP.

The ele is fine. The ele does not need buffs. Other professions need to be toned down.

nerf all other classes or buff the ele.. hmm i wonder which would be best and feel best for the playerbase…
people love getting nerfed instead of others getting buffed, thats a great plan -.- no

Wiz.1543:

STRanger.5120:

OP, just to remind you.

“Elementalists are multi-faceted spellcasters that channel elemental forces, making fire, air, earth, and water do their bidding. What they lack in physical toughness, they make up in versatility and the ability to inflict massive damage in a single attack.”

Nowhere near the actual state of our class…..

I have to agree. But how would you buff the Elementalist to that state if you where a developer ?

revamping the base ability since it doesnt work well. maybe like this:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/elementalist/Attunement-and-Traits-Revamp-idea/first#post2825766
as a good start.

ARM.3912:

Zelyhn.8069:

Indeed I won’t admit this, not because it is untrue but because this is not what we are discussing here.

Someone made a claim that no ele can deal damage comparable to that of 100b in a single attack, I proved it wrong.

If we start discussing anything more than this, like class designs, then this conversation will never end. We do not have the skills or the knowledge to solve the “grand equation of classes” across all game modes and in all types of content. All we can do is compare simple concepts.

You didn’t prove anything, you just rattled off some numbers you made up. Find a video or find a new lie.

his always like that -.- no proof all talk and trolling…. its freaking annoying to discuss with him becouse of his bs, so just give it up early.

Knote.2904:

Azunai.5974:

Asking a serious question here.

Were you trolling with the ele, or were you actually that bad? Wait, no, even if you weren’t, who’d admit to being that bad over trolling?

kitten, my head hurts.

I think everyone here is missing the point.

He played terrible with all of them, clicking, just randomly pressing buttons, yet was able to completely faceroll with the last 3 classes lol.

this and it is exactly true, it pretty much shows perfectly how kitten the ele is in comparison to the other classes, the worst is ANY other class you can literally headroll moronicly without a clue to what you are doing and still easily kill him, but ele you simply cant, you are not even close without having a very good understanding of the class, skills and usage, when one class need that just to do something every one else headrolls without ANY knowledge at all, then the balance is broken almost beyound repair…

the problem consist when you get to the top notch players, its the same difference between the skill lvl and the efficiency, just on a whole other scale, but still the same results.

as an ele i feel like we got the finger compared to every one else-.- once more, and we are properly the class who needed a real buff the most… bs

do this:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/elementalist/Attunement-and-Traits-Revamp-idea/first#post2825766

would think towards revamping them and their class ability mostly becouse i think the currrent setup of them is too blend and doesnt add a good flavor or feel to them:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/elementalist/Attunement-and-Traits-Revamp-idea/first#post2825766
something like that

Zelyhn.8069:

So you want to play engi but with fire and ice instead of tech?

if you switched the mechanics 100% so engi now had attunement (with tech names and graphics) and the ele now having “elemental tools” which you equepped to use different elements (same mechanic as engi have now, but with elemental graphics, names and feels)

then i would STILL play the ele! (and so would most other people i would bet you).
the reason people Choose the ele in the first place wasnt becouse of the mechanics but becouse of it being a “mage type” with “elemental magic”
(for the VAST majority, and in the start most people didnt even know how exactly it would all function, people choose on concept they like, you will never see a pure worriar type player play a magic only class and the other way around no matter the mechanic build around it)

Zelyhn.8069:

Well here is my opinion, it is only my opinion so you may discard it as fast as you neurons allow for it:

Removing the attunement cooldown would make us completely over-powered.

This has been stated over and over, that’s why at some point we might as well bring the AK-47 argument. Also if you want to play engi, just go play engi.

ow let me try your type of argumenting:
NOT removing the attunement cd are making the ele COMPLETELY overpowered! thats why ak argument is completely valid to troll with….
-.-

first off NO it wouldnt. secondly the few issue’s which could be created would be EASILY rebalanced to fall within the acceptable mergin.

thirdly: i want to play a SPELL CASTER! using ELEMENTAL spells this is the primary reason most people choose elementalist or mages or wizards etc. in ANY game..
the mechanics which they then bring on top of this concept have little impact to weather or not a person want to play that concept class..

his dps build is based on not using dodge and being within 600 on a staff build -.- and having 25 in earth… i cant really see how that is a serious dps buid..

for kitten farming maybe, but kitten farming you can basicly take almost anything on any class… if its for the harder stuff, you NEED your dodge and your range, which strips this build for 20% of its dps. just by a fast look at it, its not a varible build compared to other classes in the same situation,. just saying

ofc. we need to try it to see, but number wise i think its a lacking, not to mention 0 in arcana which should show some trouble instantly.:)

ThiBash.5634:

Fortus.6175:

The problem;

1. Survivability outside 60 points Water/Arcane and Cantrips.
2. Damage reliability vs targets guided by humans.
3. Traits
4. Staff

If you take Ice Field projectile finishers from example, they only give 1 second of chill. Worthless right? But if you get 4 of them through a single Frozen Ground (fairly common) they suddely provided as much chill as just about all player skills in the game.

YES gEnIuS and you only have to stand auto attacking with ZERO dps for 4 seconds while the enemy “dare not touch you”, its just an AWESOME way of applying chill and much better or on pair with instant cast instant effect skills of other classes weapons. can totally see why this is not bad when you explain it for me like this :P
(and i know you mentioned group play, but in that case every other class combo will be able to have the fields, as a team, that is needed, putting all your field casting on one person would be a bad tactic in itself);

.
joke aside:

the finishers on the staff is ALL on earth, and they are terribly bad to combo with becouse of how attunement switching cd, coupled with the delay on one of the finishers and the zero dps on the other.
the only valid use is to gain fury+might from erupt->firefield before the fight starts (or in rare cases doing it while you are getting your head smashed in by a meleeing enemy)

my idea to revamp the ele:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/elementalist/Attunement-and-Traits-Revamp-idea/first#post2825766

runeblade.7514:

Erebus.7568:

runeblade.7514:

Erebus.7568:

THEN WHAT THE IS THIS STATEMENT SUPPOSE TO BE!?!: it is a problem, it puts a huge focus on survival builds, and change the entire way fighting function.
the balance is much more broken becouse of it since the downed abilities varies so extremely depending on class (effectiveness).

downing system is an annoying gemmick which add nothing positive to the battlefield.
but as said anet is too invested in this gemmick to remove it, so the best we can hope for is a spvp type where we can decide to disable it.

The entire time you are whining about downstate is about people speccing to survive.

The lack of downstate won’t change that. People spec to survive because they do it to protect an objective.

i never complain about people speccing to survive. i am complaining about downing state completely killing dps/fast reaction focused specs.

People speccing to survive =/= killing dps.

If you want to play a DPS/fast reaction focused spec, then play as one. I don’t know why downstate is stopping you.

I play a glass cannon SD engineer, and I do fine in killing tons of players. If you don’t want to stomp players, get other players to stomp them.

and here you just pointed out one of the major issue’s with the down system -.-
still you havent commented on what it is that it adds which is so importent/good and is best added by the downing system?
i really cant find anything, i cant find the reason for the system being in the game in the first place.

runeblade.7514:

Erebus.7568:

it is a problem, it puts a huge focus on survival builds, and change the entire way fighting function.
the balance is much more broken becouse of it since the downed abilities varies so extremely depending on class (effectiveness).

downing system is an annoying gemmick which add nothing positive to the battlefield.
but as said anet is too invested in this gemmick to remove it, so the best we can hope for is a spvp type where we can decide to disable it.

The entire time you are whining about downstate is about people speccing to survive.

The lack of downstate won’t change that. People spec to survive because they do it to protect an objective.

i never complain about people speccing to survive. i am complaining about downing state completely killing dps/fast reaction focused specs.

there is a reason no other game before or after gw2 have a downed mechanic where you can fight in pvp.
becouse its a horrible bad mechanic. if you want people to survive that much longer give them more hp, survive state is just a horrible broken mechanic which only adds to the broken balance and the rewarding of ONE spec and ONE range, while rewarding “zerg play” above “skilled play”, its simply better to roam with more players oppose to less but more skilled players (untill you get to massive zergs which this provokes.).

again i cant get my head around what the downed state adds of positive to the gamestate which couldnt have been achieved without all the downsides which the downed state brings..
but please do enlighten me why the downed state makes the pvp in gw2 better then it would be without it (and possibly some other less game destroying mechanic to add whatever is so importent which the down state supposedly adds. which i really cant see)

and in the end, just allow players to choose weather or not they want it. if nothing else just for spvp type arena choice (even though the complete removal of the system on some servers and small adjustment to one shot mechanics in pve would be soo kittening awesome instead… )

JQKAndrei.8705:

it can be done in sPvP, Ok, but don’t even try to touch WvW, the downed state is a part of the game, of classe’s specific abilities and also strategy (ever heard about “Illusion of Life” ?), and you can’t just ask to cut it out since It’s Not a Problem.

it is a problem, it puts a huge focus on survival builds, and change the entire way fighting function.
the balance is much more broken becouse of it since the downed abilities varies so extremely depending on class (effectiveness).

downing system is an annoying gemmick which add nothing positive to the battlefield.
but as said anet is too invested in this gemmick to remove it, so the best we can hope for is a spvp type where we can decide to disable it.

runeblade.7514:

It will be insanely hard to balance.

There are no healers. So if you get focus fired, you will die. The meta will all be about burst and huge DPS.

Removing downstate will destroy the feel of combat.

No.

l2dodge and use defensive abilities, getting instant bursted won’t happend unless you kitten up but so is it true with the system we got now, in teamfights which is needed to have such an effect if build for survive, the downing system doesnt allow you to do much other then be a nousense when downed.

it would however allow some focus on dps instead of everything being survive.

more importently from my pov it would actually allow TRUE skill to shine through which would result in people insanely skilled taking out many enemies at the same time.
as an example of some of the bad thing: right now you can never win a 1v3 unless you fight people too kittened to ress downed)
another one is that dps ranged focused builds are vastly worse then any survive melee build since you will take extreme dmg by the downed player and the only effective way of finishing them is close up finishing move.
list goes on.

and what positive does the system add which couldnt easily been added in a less destructive way? nothing is the answer

what i found the most off putting in pvp is the downing mechanic. i find everything around that mechanic to be an annoyance which removes the archievement feeling for no good purpose.

what i would like to see is an arena system where it wasnt there, so once you got downed you automatically died.
i think it should be a choice if you wanna do spvp with or without downing mechanics, personally i think that the most popular would no doubt be without downing mechanic..

would love to see wvw without it as well but that would never happend, anet is too invested in the downing mechanic to care at all how it negatively effects the feel of combat. but making an seperate spvp where its disabled wouldnt take any work from their side and then people could play it if they liked (doubt this will come as well since if it was majorly successfull it would leave their other spvp deserted and they wouldnt want that, then rather force a bad mechanic down on every one -.-)

just thought i would give this a little bump for more input

Gorni.1764:

I love your idea with the “Overcast”, haven’t read all the trait changes though

tyvm

if you get time to read the traits don’t be shy to write if there is any of them you find broken. are tweaking them if we find stuff which is broken.

KillMEiDareU.8026:

This is just me ranting cause i have to.
Ok so awhile ago i read something on the forums about Ele’s not surviving in orr from any mob.
Like seriously? i dont see the problem. It just means that you arent playing ele correctly. I play ele, but am only an average one. Yet in orr i can take on about 5+ mobs at once? Of course i have troubles when it comes to the champions thats a no brainer….but seriously if youre dying in orr its cause you arent using your skills correctly.
Sorry if ya read it all, just wanted to rant alittle

i literally can’t gather enough bronze/normal mobs to kill me in orr(lose agro due to range) when i am on my war or necro -.- soo the point you can actually have a challenging fight by a handfull of mobs on your ele kinda sets it in perspective now doesnt it…

ImProVocateur.5189:

Thank goodness it was nerfed. Too bad invisibility is not as limited as it originally was held to. Oh well. Why play a stealth class that isn’t easy?

haha yer now its just perma invis and still 2-3 shots you if you are in zerk mode, 6hits or so if you are full bunker, while being 100% immune to you due to auto evade while attacking and perma stealth while not hitting you xD

like most of these suggestions.
do believe that
Signet of Fire: should be 4 seconds of quickness not 2.

traits i am not quite sure about though, but any buff is welcome

Dadnir.5038:

You don’t get it and you are wrong when you say : assuming it works like every other channel/aoe which can only apply affects once per skill .

even when it does more than once and we assume you got 60% crit rate, that’s 15crit hits over 10 seconds, giving you 11 applying of burning=11 stack of might’s.
not as if its breaking.
(the might stacks is nothing new, you can do the same already with pyromancer fire trait while using a lot higher dps skills) the burn though gets too high too fast I think. The whole issue is easily fixed by simply putting in the description that the burn can maximum proc once per skill.

This basicly eliminates the abusive setup you wanted to make.
Now the setup will be adding burn almost permanently with the channel skills (arc lightning and stoneshard) but will last only as long as the channel 3 seconds, and around 3stacks of might.

not gonna be op, the dps output of this is so low it would barely be able to get through a wars passive regen
But will allow for some new and exciting setup towards condition dmg

However the permanent protection on both earth and lightning could be a bit much that you are right with. Have changed the skill too:
I (obsidian focus) gain 2 seconds protection per second of using a channeling skill up to max 6 seconds. 20 seconds cd.

which should fix the issue which we could have with build focused on only using the channeling skills to abuse this.

edit: condition builds on ele have always been useless and not variable at all.
MAYBE this would give it the edge for a condition build to be variable, doubt it a bit though but it does give the option to try and see if you can make a useful condition build, the problem is you have no way of effectively mass stacking conditions and its incredibly easy to use Condi removal to reset the Condi buildup and you have to restart it. and even at max stacks you can reach you are still subpar to athor condition users and don’t come near to their survive while keeping the conditions up

on the 4 sec invul every 35 sec and forced to use focus. ow yes! its diffinately not op when compared to what other classes gets of equel defense skills. you seriously think that focus will be op with it?, seriously?

.
.
ps: ty for pointhing these out and jumping around on them helps alot to get a better view on the traits and what needs a bit of changes.

yer this is awesome xD and still to some extend true :P

Grok Krog.9581:

Considering how melee oriented dungeons are with stacking and what not, I think you’d get more damage out of 10 points in Earth and taking the 10% damage while within 600 range of your target than the 10 points in Water

this is true in most dungeon runs as people run them right now, since you will rarely be over 90%hp when stacking… kitten i hate the noobish stacking just do the boss normally stupid people :P

without blasting staff you are relying completely on the mob standing still, and in almost all situations your dmg will suffer heavily from lava front not getting its full potential dmg of due to the mob taking 1 step in the wrong direction.

arcane wave will do almost nothing for you, since you should never be on top of an enemy where consistant high dps is needed and the 15second 10% more crit is too little to be worth it.
something as simply as glyph of storm will give you a higher dps then the arcane (and much more relaible), even lesser element if it doesnt instantly die can ramp up a good amount of dps, or glyph of elemental power, which is around 250 extra constant dps. all of these will add up a higher overall dps then arcane wave.

arcane blast, is single target and only ok against stuff standing still on a firefield, but even here it won’t get close to the dps of elemental power overall.

in general the arcane dps skills fall short of the glyphs. arcane+ the trait could maybe be a nice addition to the dps due to the 10% more crit dmg but even here its very low compared to what you sacrifice. the issue is you will lose the blasting staff and attunement recharge on doing so, and for consistant dps the blasting staff and attunement recharge is a most or too much dps is wasted from mobs moving out of the aoe range.

having 30 in lightning i don’t find usefull. you need 10 in water for the 15% dmg increase over 90%hp. you need 30 in fire due to using either persisting flames/pyro (personally i go for flames and think that is the superior option becouse of the almost close to perm 4stacks of might and 50% uptime fury. which goes pretty nicely into the rotation).
so you got 30 points left and blasting staff is a most for everything except very few bosses, so thats 20 points unless you wanna lose that (which you could but the dps from lava front gets extremely unreliable. not to forget your attunement cd’s which is very importent for a consistant skill rotation of ice spike and eruption+shockwave(which will give you blast finisher that gives fury 10sec and might *4 20sec)) and last 10 in air for 20% dmg under 33% hp.

sacrificing blasting staff is an option, i think its a bad choice but with the right team and enough immob it could be ok, but you kill your ability to effectively switch attunement for utility/dps/boons, and you lose 5seconds dps every time you switch, compared to what you would by having arcana points. you do get the 20% crit dmg, but lose 4stack might, 50% uptime fury(20% crit rate) which can be team boon, and lost blasting staff aoe range which is primarily used for lava font.

when all that is said, i think its extremely arrogant and wrong to say this is the ultimate staff dps build. although it is extremely simple and easy to use but extremely lacking of any team support, flaxibility, having unreliable dps output and still falling short on consistant dps.

as answer on why people say the dps of other weapons are better then staff, its simply becouse other weapons can land their dmg garenteed, while staff have a very unreliable dps when mobs actually move around, especially high mobility targets makes the staff dps drop insanely… if the aoe dps lands fully on all skills the staffs dps can become very high, and makes up for the low survivability zerk staff provide (sadly the cases where this happens is very rare and long between)

edit: maybe for massive zerg wvw if you are going pure burst it can be a fine build.

the amount and length of hardstuns the warrior have is completely, utterly and kittenedly broken -.-
hardstun have ALWAYS been an issue in EVERY game where it exist, and allowing this amount of hardstun on a Super tanking class with rediculess high dps while having this amount of stuns is completely broken…..

its beyound words and even on paper you can see how rediculess this becomes…. ever mead just 2 stun wars in spvp? they can literally stun you untill you are dead, 1 stun lands and you are perma stunned till dead no matter how tanky you are, and its around 1 stun every 2-3 seconds lasting longer then the break between the stuns…

in normal games you will only see Really hard cc on extremely Squicy classes (cough wtf dont the ele got stun chains like this bs?) this is made becouse the time you are out of the stuns have to be enough to kill the stunner else it becomes a rediculess gameplay for the enemy for Obvious reasons.

but this is anet kittens. which LOVE wars so no matter how op they become in every aspect they will keep buffing them and nerfing classes they dont like/play.. its rediculess

i really like this. i would still like some kind of activation ability to give us something else then just “weapon swap”, but the ability to decide do i want to go from earth, fire, earth, fire (then fully out of “energy”) or do i want earth,fire,water,lightning, then wait.. this would add alot more tactics and more importently more freedom to the class and remove some of the major handicap that attunement is forcing on the ele right now

roostapro.9827:

There is alot of these “Idea” threads around on the elementalist forum, and many keep popping up.

“All I see is doom and gloom”

The reason you see “Doom & Gloom” is because people have given up on suggesting their ideas due to very little Developer Interaction & Developer Feedback/Discussion.

Developer Interaction/Feedback/Discussion plays a critical role in idea threads as it promotes others to post ideas/concepts as well as giving the developers ideas to play around with, It also plays a critical role as for keeping morale high.

however, having none to very little interaction depletes morale thus causing QQ threads/whine threads and all of the doom and gloom posts and in turn no ideas will be posted leaving the developers empty handed and all out of ideas themselves > this then leaves the player feeling “lost” and “left out” causing them to QQ and go other sections asking for things etc.
this is the main cause of certain areas being full of low morale.

-I have many concepts for the elementalist, but don’t post them as I see no developer interaction.

this is soo true
think i got around 15 pages of well thoughtout idea’s and feedback from just the first months of my gametime… then properly 20 or so the next to months and then it went down to 0 becouse of the zero interaction from the developers..

using our time on making well thoughtout idea’s isnt easy and takes energy, time and some commitment and research. doing all that numerious times to get absolutely no responds from the staff, not even the “we seen it and ty for your efford”, makes us feel very unappriciated and goes to tell us that our idea’s are not wanted.

this is then strengthening by the patches which time and time again seem to completely ignore what the community is saying. staff is a perfect example, from the very beta the main complaint about the staff have been the cst and delay of the dmg making it rediculess easy to dodge and to this day nothing have been done.. the same with general concerns. the survivability of the ele the very low base stats have been the constant concern of the community and yet nothing have happened on this front..

when devs completely ignore good and constructive feedback, then people stop using the time and effort to make it and do the minimum of yelling about the stuff which is still broken.

Dadnir.5038:

honnestly, I take :

Fire (20)
V (burning precision); 75% chance to cause burning for 3 seconds on crits
III (Ember’s might) each applying of burning gives 1 stack of might for 10 seconds.

Earth (10)
I (obsidian focus) gain protection while channeling skills

Water (10)
I (aquamancer’s alacrity) your focus cd’s recharges 30% faster.

And I already know that elementalist are overpowered with your suggestions. because, with a S/F setup in air atunement, you’ve got perma protect, perma burn, at least 15 might stack and when things goes bad, you just have to switch to earth for 4s invul every 35s.

EDIT : Oh and this made me laugh (I don’t think this thing can be done)
VI (vital striking) takes 10% less dmg when target over 90% hp

actually you are missing alot in that setup but ty for bringing it up.

for “perma” or close to perma prtoction you would need to use nothing but arc lightning which have a Terrible dps becouse you are forced to stay in lightning spec permanent then (soo not op at all).
it’s 3,5 seconds cast time, meaning at best you will end up with roughly 3 stacks of might. (assuming it works like every other channel/aoe which can only apply affects once per skill) even if we allow it to do more then once per skill (aoe skills would start to stack crazy amount of might so that would not happend, and doesnt work either in the current system) we are talking 7stacks of might.
.
.
so:
arc lightning with lightning strike as only dps source (perma burn as well but the dps from this is still very low). perma protection and 3-4 stacks of might.
to be honest this would be REALLY weak if that was your tactic to do it like this, it would however add to the S/F build and would be a nice boost to its survivability if that was what you where aiming for, but in no way would it make it op
.
.
VI is 100% durable, they already use the exact mechanic which is needed to do this on everything which requires “over/under” x% hp, just as example “water: VI: does more dmg when you are over 90% hp”, “lightning: VI does 20% more dmg when target is under 33% hp” these two traits is in the game with those effects right now. so its diffinately possible to do this

elithrar.7143:

Azunai.5974:

elithrar.7143:

If “idea posts” are the tens (hundreds, if you include other class forums) of DOA ideas that Daecollo posts on a monthly basis, then I don’t want them.

Otherwise, there are certainly some solid idea posts (e.g. the Focus thread on the first page).

G-give the rifle thread a read if you havn’t yet.

I’ve read it, and believe it to be orthogonal to what the class needs. Our existing mechanics and weapons are mostly fine. We need some sensible fixes; we don’t need to spread ourselves thin with a weapon that doesn’t fit the class thematically (I’d rather MH sword in that case).

orthogonal ?? othogonal is normally a geometric term so makes little sense in this context. assume you mean something else.

as mentioned once before in this thread. there is actually quite a few good suggestions, both on weapon changes, traits changes even full revamps. just go search for them and comment on them to keep those threads alive.

-.- what happened to the notion that legendaries was pure cosmetics and archievement ?!
legendaries was NEVER SUPPOSE TO BE BETTER IN ANY!!! WAY THEN OTHER WEAPONS!!.
the devs made this as clear as it can be from the very start. and now this bs…
if they are gonna make a difference just take the kitten out of their kitten and give legends better stats. if they are going for difference then the notion of “you dont need to ptw” is out the window and they might as well give the stats which a legendary weapon deserves

when that is said which moron came up with the idea that the ascendant weapons is crafted not gain by laural, guild commendation etc like EVERY OTHER ascendant item?…

these facts are just so moronic the subject is null

Ryld.1340:

Fortus.6175:

more “support” for the iconic weapon of ele… just what we asked! yay!

Staff is supposed to be support. It was explained that before the game even came out. I for one, am excited about some of the buffs it is getting.

they said this but then one can wonder why it doesnt have more hard support?.
it got healing rain and geyseer with major CD thats about it for support(which isnt very much other classes have ALOT more tools then this), D/D aura build adds more support then staff in normal fights-.-
and dont say that the “cc” aspect of the staff is the stupport becouse then the WAR is supposedly pure support with the amount of hard cc it got….

as its made right now its more like a pure aoe weapon then a support one. sadly in most cases it failts at this becouse of how easy it is to negate or walk out of the aoe before dmg is applied.
the slowness of applied dps (cst and dmg delay) is what hurts the staff and what is the real issue with it. which is what i personally would like to see fixed….

when that is said, just the notion of forcing a weapon into a specific support role after all their work toward killing the trinity is just idiotic…
they should figure out what their skizofranic minds want, trinity or no trinity and go for it -.-

the trick to winning and having high score is “CHANGE CLASS!” whenever i need the high score and have a hard time or simply are too smashed/tired to play my best, i just switch to my necro and easy mode to #1 -.- totally balanced… moronic devs

well all players that ACTUALLY PLAY AN ELE (all those kitten that doesnt really play it and got no idea wtf is going on which keeps saying its fine but cant back that statement up for kitten, neither on paper or in action -.-) is agreeing that we are crazily weak compared to other class. even the vast majority of players of other classes think we are weak -.-

anet on the other hand seem to think we are fine… but wth do they know from my understanding not a single one of the people who actually got any say in balance changes are maining an ele so yer… gl to us -.-

Fasyx.9347:

ARM.3912:

Yeah, conjures are garbage that ruin any chance of using any other ele mechanic… but then again ele’s are garbage too…

Yeah. Someone should send this post to ANet, it´s sooo true. I dont like using conjured weapons, because I want to use MY weapons which I earned through the game. ANet is forcing us to use them to do at least some DPS. I dont have any hope for elementalists in the future(just look at the leaked patchnotes(next week) and the leaked patchnotes for the “big” Octoberpatch, ANet still think elementalists are fine).

And btw: Yes, warriors are way to overpowered, I have one myself. They will never get nerfed, because most of the ANet Dev Team are playing a warrior.

the actual dps of the conjurer weapons are lower then the dps on your weapon sets, its just an easy mode of doing it(which is where all the dungeon running have gone, no one is actually doing them as intended and as soon as there is something where people need to actually dodge, move and not bug 99% of them fall flat on their face.. its an awfull route the pve dungeons have taken.. gj allowing exploits to kitten up basic skills) -.- (pve related only, since pvp the conjure weapon is as gimmicky and useless as the tornado and will get you killed just as fast -.- )

would be just as horrible -.- the weapon base mechanic is kitten for the ele and its no where near powerfull enough to be of high enough value to use on a teammate.

Myrmidian Eudoros.4671:

/sigh… The blast finisher on Flame Axe coupled with the the bug fix on Persisting Flames which did not work correctly previously would allow you to apply roughly 90s of fury every 40s on an AoE.

sry but this is getting redundant to keep asking the same. you are saying that this path will give the ele the boost it need and you are pointing towards something which does absolutely no difference on the reason ele’s need the buff…

that you are even considering running conjuring weapons as your utility in pvp i find laugheble o.O

and that you believe that such a build would be stronger or as strong as equelly purposed builds on necro/war/engi etc… i .. well i wouldnt know what more to say… clearly we are of different oppinion, and since you cant point on what in the patch note should make this huge change and i am in the vast majority that think these changes means diddely nothing for the ele’s performance issue, there is no real reason to keep on poking you, all i wanted was to point out your bs and i have, no need for me to jump more on that i guess…

..
seriously “conjure weapon build” o.O i can just imagine it.. "will totally show those war/necro/guards/rangers/etc who’s the boss.

matansar.9405:

Badges of honor as well. the fact that I must maximize crafting to obtain those weapons its ubserd. The main thing Im doing is WvW. Im not a crafter and i dont like crafting, But I cant allow myself to stay with the exotics items. Yeah I know you can get those from drops, but ArenaNet said they will add ascendend armors as well. So trying to get 8-10 drops of ascendends its stupid, and probably will take forever. If this game will continue with this path, it will become a grinding game, and I’ll leave this game in sec.

well i completely agree. its undermining everything they have done with items progrgession up untill this point :/

Glenstorm.4059:

Fire Overcast: Final Flame: strong targeted explosion, with burning applied to affected targets when traited.
Water Overcast: Torrent: Moderate targeted heal, removing 1 condition on affected allies when traited.
Air Overcast: Thunderclap: Strong ranged single-target attack, with a short stun applied when traited.
Earth Overcast: Crystal Wave: Strong targeted AoE bleeding, applying Stability to allies when traited.

OR, for a more interesting effect, Overcasts could have effects OPPOSITE to their attunements:

Fire: Rejuvenating Inferno: Moderate AoE heal around you, with 1 condition removed from surrounding allies when traited (healing is typically water-related)
Water: Frostburn: Moderate-strong burning applied to target, AoE around target when traited (burning and AoE is usually fire-related)
Air: Windblade: Strong targeted AoE bleed, adding crippled when traited (AoE DoT/cripple is usually earth-related)
Earth: Obsidian Bolt: Strong single-target damage, stunning target when traited (single-target dps/stun is usually air-related.)

I think they should stay in style with their attunement, trying to do dmg and getting stuck in a healing attunement would majorly suck :P

Spells are more or less the same, like ground target better on flame to keep in line with the aoe theme of it.

Bleed for earth I think would give it too many dmg overcast. And earth is seen as the defensive so I think a good defensive ability is more in line and would add for a more useful overcast

Glenstorm.4059:

Arcana’s secondary stat bonus could then govern Overcast recharge rate rather than attunement recharge rate, and non-Overcast attunement recharge rate could be set at a flat value, although I do think 5 seconds is a bit too low—maybe 10-12 seconds would be better. Arcana could also have its traits modified to affect and improve Overcharge effects. Elemental Attunement could be removed to compensate. In addition, each traitline could have a Grandmaster trait that improves that specific attunement’s attunement as describe above.

…of course, the chances of any of this happening are next to zero, but it’s still fun to theorize I like your ideas a lot.

Well the recharge rate on overcast is already getting lowered by arcana
I set it to 5 seconds because at 10-12 you feel forced to switch attunement when not really needed to insure you get the defense of you might use and it locks you out of your skills for too long. 5sec may be a bit low 6-7 might be better. But I don’t think it should be higher than that because it provokes another type of less reactionary play (simply because once you switched you can’t react and switch back for a very long time which I think is a problem with the current attunement also because of how the skills are divided on it.)

Yer that is true, but which traitlines would you then remove to make room for such a trait. And what more could you add to the overcast without it crossing into the realm of op?

Glenstorm.4059:

I really like the idea of Attunement Activation. If I could suggest an alternative name for this mechanic, it would be “Overcast”—this is something that existed in Guild Wars 1 and was unique to the elementalist, so I think it would be a nice homage

Yes overcast isn’t a bad name for it. Will change it now.

Glenstorm.4059:

I like the idea of Overcast because it really makes the ele a jack-of-all-trades. It’s like the Mesmer’s shatters and the Guardian’s virtues rolled into one, but not quite as strong individually as those mechanics. What I’d also suggest to reduce simply spamming Overcasts is that after activating an Overcast, rather than putting all attunements on a higher cool down, to immediately put all the skills of only its corresponding attunement on a long cooldown called “Overcharge recharge” (say 30 seconds with 0 Arcana investment), forcing you to switch attunements or rely solely on your utilities. So if you spam all your Overcasts, you’ll be extremely vulnerable. This forces tactical use of Overcast, and also enables Overcast effects to be powerful:
.

My reasoning behind putting a global cd on attunement switch is to prevent you from being able to use “several” overcast in very short time.
I imagine the overcast as being Very powerful when used (not op powerful but shroud type powerful), meaning if you can spam 4 different in a row it’s too op. as an alternative the power per skill would have to go down and then they would feel “weak” or like normal which I really don’t envision them as, I envision it as something which would set the ele aside. Like when a necro go in shroud your first instinct is “kitten need to deal with this NOW”, same kind of feeling is needed once you see example “an ele start channeling his lightning overcast which does massive dmg too you if you don’t negate it” but then you know that the ele is stuck in that attunement and you can abuses that if you are really good.

As a bonus I imagine this will remove a lot of the “spammy” nature which the correct attunement system have, where you feel you are wasting rotations if you don’t constantly switch attunements for lingering and field/finisher. I find the extreme switch a bit too much and its part of the issue with the current ele (simply it gets too confusing to keep 100% track of everything with it. Making the ele extremely hard to play and taking away from the reaction able nature of the game because you use more focus on micro managing skills constantly. With the lower base attunement cd I also think this will allow people to switch when needed and else stay in the attunement needed for their purpose)

while i agree on most of these points i see another major flaw.

imagine if the necromancer didnt have his shroud form, or the ranger didnt have his pet, etc, it didnt exist and he got nothing instead… how strong do you think the class’s would be?

my point is that is what have happened to the ele, we got NO special ability which can “reinforce” us in a heavy way… we got attunement which is more of a handicap then a bonus due to all the issue’s you have with trying to mix 4 “weapon switch” abilities into doing something others have to be able to do with 2..

i really do believe there is a serious need for an actual effective bonus mechanic, and activation of some sort instead of just the clear “weapon swap” which all other classes gets for free…

we forget to mention the traits as well, which is CLEARLY splitted up amongst elements made in a way where they buff the element and not all elements, which when we are suppose to constantly use all elements is an inharent issue as well..

made a little suggestion on an active ability for the ele.
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/elementalist/Attunement-and-Traits-Revamp-idea/first#post2825766

its simply said:

when the ele players that does well on ele change to WAR or Necro or ANY other class for just 1 week playing it exclusive, they completely snowball the field and eredicates anything which would have been a challange on their ele…

personally when i want an easy pvp i switch to my necro which i am WORLDS WORSE at then my ele, but always succeed immensely with it….

the people who think ele is balanced should go do just 20 Spvp games with the ele and see how well they do then switch to the standard cookie cutter build of whatever other class they got and see the world difference there is…
.
.
.

on the subject though, i really feel like the devs doesnt main an ele at all and therefore really couldnt care less if it feels extremely weak in comparison to other classes, or if its base mechanics are badly made for what they balance around, simply becouse they have no interest in truly playing one

the buff is useless and conjuring builds is still kitten.. what you sacrifice (on a class which is build 100% over CONSTANTLY attunement swapping and skill spamming through 4 “weapon sets”) will in NO WAY be made up for by anything a conjure weapon can have while not becomming rediculessly overpowered in some situation..
its a “nitche” thing which have no place in the first place on an elementalist. and its kittening sad to look at…

only RIGHT thing to do is REDESIGN all conjuring weapons and make them actually match into the class. maybe make them like the guardians floating weapons which attacks themselve etc… or completely redesign the idea and give us some usefull skills instead which Actually have SYNERGI with the class…

Axelifus.3269:

Mind clearing the clutter a bit?
Mentioning traits that don’t actually change is making this a bit of tl;dr.
Also tricker = trigger, courses = causes.

i only listed the trait if there was an alteration to it. i assume that if we are speaking about balance on a certain class people need to know what the current function of each trait is or check it if you are in doubt.
writting what they do and then what is changed would take ALOT more space and its already a very long post, so thats why i didnt include something which should already be known

:: fixed the spelling error ty

On to the matter at hand, this attunement switching//activation seems a bit excessive when it comes to earth, even tho reflection is quite clutch by nature.
Other attunement effects need more detail about them.

Air training’s description is vague, as there is no indirect or direct spell descriptor anywhere in the game.

on earth: i wasnt quite sure how an activation of an defensive ability should go and defensive boons seemed to be the best way.
been rethinking it and you are right its too clutty like this: have changed it to be a cooler and different effect.

else any suggestion on which effect might be a better active for earth?.

on air trainer its pretty clear when you use a skill if it is a direct skill. direct skills need a target to hit anything and can’t be placed on the ground.
in gw2 we got direct or ground target spells.
maybe i would make that a part of the description but it would get very long again if i set all these explanation for the basics in it so thats why i didnt:)

Axelifus.3269:

What happens to evasive arcana?

nothing it stays as it is only listed stuff which got changed.

Axelifus.3269:

Fresh air might be better off with an ICD clause instead of a crit-based

yes you are right, it needs a CD so it doesnt trigger two, tree times in a row and refrashes the active ability which could become op.

added the cd.

Axelifus.3269:

Arcane lightning is a follow-up perk as the arcane blast for example lands I assume, that would help with hapless warriors or w/e whining about non-telegraphed hits according to the current fresh air trend, however on arcane power it could get rather ridiculous. (Scepter air 3+arcane power.)

i have taken this into consideration.
the amount of dmg this adds is not very large at best we are looking at an extra hit on an arcane skill with 13 second CD (at minimum) which then adds a skill that have a 4 seconds CD. while its a nice boost its not very strong and to do this you would use 2 traits and a utility (or 1 if its 15 sec cd on the arcane skill) this is the highest effect it can have and on some burst build it would be worth taking, but i cant see it breaking anything or making any setup op. however it would add the possibility of this trait being usefull and more reason to use arcane skills.

but i am open to suggestions on this one as well.

and ty for your input would be nice with more

maybe look instead:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/elementalist/Attunement-and-Traits-Revamp-idea/first#post2825766

on the first page mate

and sadly most people ain’t capable of actually reading a longer idea, understanding it and thinking about it and then replaying. people in general are 2seconds thoughts, unless they can read and make fast reply’s they aint gonna bother with it soo yer.. same as you just did

no thoughts on this idea and changes?.
too much text and too many changes to follow maybe?

make them obtainable with laurals and guild commendations like EVERY other Ascendant item.
its just silly you can obtain every other Ascendant item with these but not the weapons. it doesnt make sense and it goes against the system which they have established to obtain these items.

Myrmidian Eudoros.4671:

Erebus.7568:

emm how again would this fix ANY! of the curren issue’s with using an ele in tpvp (even as bunker) instead of lets say guardian, engi, war, necro or ranger ?! which all would do a better job at it.

even IF the situation precented it where you effectively could buff up others permanently (ofc only for the time you are near them. its only variable to buff up right before a fight, and wont last for very long after. so permanent is a bit happy thinking and ignoring cd concerns) in tpvp equel with spvp you would buff 1-2 people at best and besides that be just as freaking useless as you always have…

i dont see how these changes in any way would make the ele valid. so please do enlighten me of to what exactly in the changes would suddenly fix the current issue’s of using an ele over any other class -.-

Ok, I’ll bite.

sooo many words and yet you said nothing new..
you restated your first statement saying “it will work” without saying why, which changes does the difference or even a scenario where change X from the notes would allow such a setup that would be preferrable to what you can make and do with semilar roles on any of the other classes…
which was what i was asking..

in which changes NOW NAME THE ACTUALLY PATCH CHANGES!!!, which you think will FIX the current issues that the ele face and the reason other classes out preform the ele by far, right now!.

becouse i see absolutely nothing in those notes which would even remotely come close to allowing a build which could change the sad state the ele is in right now..

the buffs to the staff is soo minimal it will barely be felt (geyseer still have the same issue, if you couldnt stay in it before you wont be able too now)…

asking like this becouse i am of the completely opposite oppinion when looking at the actual changes. i see nothing which would have any significant impact and nothing which will have an impact on the actual issue with the ele.

PS: creating 25stacks of might when build for it is nothing hard to do for 2+ people working well together, i really dont see why you get all hard becouse of it -.-
and its not like that extra maybe 10 stacks of might is gonna make up for what you sacrifice to get it (rotation time, utility slots, etc) there is much more efficient ways to raise the dps potential when considering timeframe, skill slots and what other classes can do while in themselve being a lot more dangerous as well..