(edited by Gabriell.4856)
no thank you as much as they are broken I like having fire and air to help kill those pesky cele eles/engis/wars faster rather than watch them press everything and kite in circles till regaining full health.
A broken mechanic shouldn’t justify another broken mechanic. Both should be fixed.
Remove all sigils and runes actually. Your build is defined by your traits and weapon. Why add a variable to the equable to make balancing difficult?
Oh wait we nee dto please the pve crowd.
With mesmer GM being baseline, I don’t see why Sleight of Hand cannot be baseline for thief. We are constantly force to go into trickery to get this trait and arguably Bountiful Thief. If they made SoH and BT baseline, it would open so many more builds.
I say yes! Do it!
I’m the biggest scrub there is in spvp. I lose more than I win. Not even sure why I was matched against them.
Is not fun. Why are you putting the runner up WTS winners vs pugs? Put back team que kitten . I bet they dont want to fight pug scrubs and want a challenge. Why put them and pugs through this BS?
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FG is one of the most broken trait I’ve ever seen. There’s really no point defending it.
The highest skill cap build???? Are you serious? Acro S/D build is the easiest and most forgiving meta build the thief has….And sorry, random dodge because you have extra dodges does not promote skillful play.
It’s comments like these that make me cringe. Just by taking a look at all the passive procs that panic strike build gets carried with completly crushes your argumentation.
One might argue that S/D is easier to play than crit strikes d/p on high level pvp, but panic strike is definitely the easiest thief meta build we’ve had.
“All the passive procs that panic strks build gets…”
Are we talking about true passive procs or “I going to pick this trait because it fits my arguement” procs? Panic strike isn’t truely passive at all. It take an action on your part to apply it. Lol. Now, I can agree wth Last Refuge but that gets thieves killed more often than saving them. In terms of passive procs, both build have the same amount; pain response or last refuge. What is your point?
FG is one of the most broken trait I’ve ever seen. There’s really no point defending it.
The highest skill cap build???? Are you serious? Acro S/D build is the easiest and most forgiving meta build the thief has….And sorry, random dodge because you have extra dodges does not promote skillful play.
I think you guys are missing the point. No other skill in the game hard counter class mechanics. Well maybe Moa. And for the record, stealth is part of the thief class mechanic, stealth attacks.
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There is so much hate for anet I have right now. I am not going to attack them because I can not afford any more infractions points but everyone knows what I am implying
Light’s Judgment trap is ridiculous. Why do thieves get such a hard counter to a WHOLE kitten TRAIT LINE. That is a 1 second reveal every second. If they lock us inside its going to be a disaster.
Tell me now, if I am stealth and run over it, do I get revealed or do I have to be out of stealth to trigger the revealed??
Either way, The only thing I do in this game is roam world vs world because I love it so much. It is fun and I like to 2v1 and 3v1 if I can because it feels good to outplay your opponents when the odds are against you.
Are you going to give us a skill that stops guardians form using their virtues?? Because that is what you are doing anet
GG, if this is as bad as it seems I am done with your game
You just killed thief and now I have no faith in you
Guild Wars 1 devs were much smarter than you… …
The guardian could also place the trap in your SR. Lolz…
To be serious, they should separate reveal into two categories.
One is the reveal thief gets after attacking from stealth. Thief cannot enter stealth until reveal is gone.
The other from Sic Em and Light’s Judgement should be a unique debuff. This still allows the thief to stealth but everyone can see them. They gain full benefits from traits and class mechanics yet enemies can see and attack them.
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Video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KlmgJOkFdfM
At the urging of some friends, I’ve uploaded a sequel to my first weaponless video.
Discussion
Last time, my intent was primarily to entertain, but also to shed some light on just how broken condition thieves are. However, instead of that, the discussion more or less devolved into one big criticism of “your opponents are all bad, so condi teef isn’t OP”.
In an effort to respond to that, I’ve only included clips against players I would consider at least decent, from a variety of WvW tiers. Every one featured in this video is competent, and I’d even go so far as to say that some of them are very good.
Condition thieves (especially dire with perplexity/balthazar/krait) are incredibly powerful in small scale scenarios, with almost no risk attached. The active defenses from acro-trickery allow me to avoid most telegraphed bursts and the passive sustain from full dire lets me straight up tank everything else.
As always, comments, criticisms, suggestions are all welcome.
Addendum
I’d also like to point out a couple of things about last refuge/hard to catch.
1) Last refuge: In a couple of the clips, I would have definitely lost without the last refuge proc. Granted, it’s not as much of an issue for this build because this build doesn’t use weapons, but at higher levels of play, last refuge still saves you more often than it kills you.
2) Hard to catch: It’s actually quite strong in duels. A lot of thieves like to steal + backstab, but hard to catch will automatically shadowstep you away (faster than any human could react), causing the backstab to miss entirely. Similarly, a lot of S/F eles gale —> phoenix mechanically, and hard to catch will move you out of phoenix automatically.
Those players weren’t too bad…its just that your build counter theirs. I believe if given an opportunity to change the build, the results will be different.
This will give your opponents a very high chance of winning.
-Ele going Diamond Skin, Ether Renewal, Cleansing Flames plus minus condi duration gear/food.
-Engi going AR, plus minus condi duration gear/food
-Thief just stay in SB or P/P. No reason to try to get close. Just stay at range and pew pew. Throw in TG elite for the hell of it.
-Ranger, just build for condi removal and pew pew?
-Mesmer, phastasm build with arcane thievery plus null field. Or hybrid build and just create clone with DE. Your GS clones should be able to stack bleed nicely. Proceed to run around in a circle?
-Warrior, shoutbow…enough said?
-Necro, shouldn’t have a problem…
-Guardian, don’t know much about them…At the end of the day, I really don’t see your point other than Feline Grace being strong but that is going to be fixed in the expansion.
And you need to run a “hard counter” to fight a weaponless opponent lol..
Does that tell you something? That with just utilities and gears, thief is still able to dominate regular builds? If he runs a typical P/D+D/P, what then? Diamond skin is a rare case btw.
LOL. Let me bring my ranger condi trap build w/o weapon then. Using even better trap like burning and bleed and if I can hit him with entangle after withdraw then gg. What was your point again?
Again, there are builds that can match that of his build even if he is using weapon.
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Helseth made this vod commentary of 2 games in the monthly ESL GO4 finals which I think is really useful for a mesmer that is new to PvP to see how you play properly as well as to a veteran mesmer. He explains a lot of the things which most people don’t catch on official streams but actually impact the game a lot.
If you’re having troubles using your portal and moa well (which isn’t too straightforward often) I think you will learn a lot from this regarding those two things. Also it has a lot of good information for anyone who wants to compete on high level, no matter which class.
Watch it here
Is it me or is he exploiting stow wpn?
Video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KlmgJOkFdfM
At the urging of some friends, I’ve uploaded a sequel to my first weaponless video.
Discussion
Last time, my intent was primarily to entertain, but also to shed some light on just how broken condition thieves are. However, instead of that, the discussion more or less devolved into one big criticism of “your opponents are all bad, so condi teef isn’t OP”.
In an effort to respond to that, I’ve only included clips against players I would consider at least decent, from a variety of WvW tiers. Every one featured in this video is competent, and I’d even go so far as to say that some of them are very good.
Condition thieves (especially dire with perplexity/balthazar/krait) are incredibly powerful in small scale scenarios, with almost no risk attached. The active defenses from acro-trickery allow me to avoid most telegraphed bursts and the passive sustain from full dire lets me straight up tank everything else.
As always, comments, criticisms, suggestions are all welcome.
Addendum
I’d also like to point out a couple of things about last refuge/hard to catch.
1) Last refuge: In a couple of the clips, I would have definitely lost without the last refuge proc. Granted, it’s not as much of an issue for this build because this build doesn’t use weapons, but at higher levels of play, last refuge still saves you more often than it kills you.
2) Hard to catch: It’s actually quite strong in duels. A lot of thieves like to steal + backstab, but hard to catch will automatically shadowstep you away (faster than any human could react), causing the backstab to miss entirely. Similarly, a lot of S/F eles gale —> phoenix mechanically, and hard to catch will move you out of phoenix automatically.
Those players weren’t too bad…its just that your build counter theirs. I believe if given an opportunity to change the build, the results will be different.
This will give your opponents a very high chance of winning.
-Ele going Diamond Skin, Ether Renewal, Cleansing Flames plus minus condi duration gear/food.
-Engi going AR, plus minus condi duration gear/food
-Thief just stay in SB or P/P. No reason to try to get close. Just stay at range and pew pew. Throw in TG elite for the hell of it.
-Ranger, just build for condi removal and pew pew?
-Mesmer, phastasm build with arcane thievery plus null field. Or hybrid build and just create clone with DE. Your GS clones should be able to stack bleed nicely. Proceed to run around in a circle?
-Warrior, shoutbow…enough said?
-Necro, shouldn’t have a problem…
-Guardian, don’t know much about them…
At the end of the day, I really don’t see your point other than Feline Grace being strong but that is going to be fixed in the expansion.
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@Gabriell.4856 – I’m not very sure why you’re “comparing”. It’s not a comparison between Incendiary Powder and Soothing Mist, it’s a chain reaction from applying Incendiary Powder on crit, to gaining regen when crit, and removing a condition when you gain regen.
I know, its a chain reaction of three traits which are soothing mist, cleansing water, and cleansing wave. Still don’t think your observation worth a review when you are talking about 1 master trait being countered by 3 traits.
/thread
@Gabriell.4856 – No, condition removal is not FIFO in this case. At first, I thought this too. The reason why this is an issue because when burning procs on crit (Incendiary Powder), Regen on crit (Soothing Mist)will also happen at the same time which means it will automatically trigger the Cleansing Wave trait; removing burning instanteously. You will not see this with your eyes.
Still, that doesn’t justify comparing now…3 traits to 1…
Hi there.
For the TL;DR people who don’t want to waste their time – this talks about how Sigil of Torment/Earth can bypass the Incendiary Powder/Soothing Mist nullification
If you are unaware, when an Engi vs Ele using the Engi’s Incendiary Powder against the Ele’s Soothing Mist whilst having Cleansing Wave (6 into Water traitline), Soothing mist will completely nullify Incendiary Powder since they have the both internal cooldown as well as behaving critically.
I have tested a curve around this nullification and have figured out that Sigils that apply a condition on critical hit can work through these two traits:
Sigil of Torment/Earth – When applied, most of the time, Incendiary Powder will be nullified against Soothing Mist. An odd event that the sigil will crit before Incendiary Powder and will break the interval canceling between both traits. This will last a few intervals but will go back to the two traits nullifying eachother again. Note that these 2 specific traits are divisible by 10 seconds (soothing mist/incendiary powder ICD), meaning they are able to occur before or after the trait(as in the condition can be applied before or after burning) – that is why this is able to happen. Sigil of Blight will not work because it is not in the interval divisibility and will never apply when both traits proc.
Even though this is not 100% guaranteed, the meta sigils for the Celestial Rifle engi should still be considered since it does not perform the best overall but only specifically against eles whereas it doesn’t even bypass the two traits nullifying eachother.
Although, I would still consider this as an option because of possible scenarios of a 1v1(engi vs ele) on point, engi would have an upperhand against the ele if the sigil procs before the trait since a good meta cele ele against a good meta cele engi would be stalemate.
Thanks for reading.
I read the TL;DR.
Correct me if I’m wrong but isn’t condi removal FIFO? As an engi, you should be able to cover IP with no problem. I don’t see the point of this thread. You are also comparing a GM and M traits vs 1 m trait…
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Considering classes getting additional class mechanic skill, is ele supposed to get F5 skill, which will be a new attunment? I’cant see any other option than this.
Yes, it will be a new attument called “Heart.”
And the elite will combine all attunements to summon Captain Planet.
Its fairly obvious if a warrior is running kill shot, your animation is very slow compared to say hip shot from a rifle engi that is really hard to get out of the way of.
http://www.humanbenchmark.com/tests/reactiontime
Will you make it in time to avoid getting hit by killshot when youre in melee range to warrior? Cause im not sure if you will be capable to get out of 1500 range considering things like camera, positioning, skill activation (rolls) and to properly aim shadow return. Now outside of reaction time rebember about latency as well.
If you can do that feel free to make a vid of “real” 1v1 where your friend will use killshot in the least excepted moment and we can take a look if you be capable to get out of range. Thats going to be interesing if you can do that in time (1 second).
You dont aim shadow return. If you are using shadow step appropriately, you are aiming into the fight, and use return to get out of the fight. Sometimes I even set it some random place before going into the fight, just to see what really is happening in clock tower and will likely return if its completely out of control and nothing I do will change that or if its completely in control and nothing I will do will change that.
But Shadow return is an instant cast that returns you to the initial place you initiated it, the part where you aim. The same as Infultrator’s return though it doesnt aim just needs a target.
Its the return of Shadow step and doesnt need to be aimed. And yes, that is common to use both behind LoS blocks to get out of dodge and block projectiles.
I do it now.
Now like I said, if you were 1500 a way and I dont see you, well yeah you might just one shot me, but you can do that now anyway.
But my point in all of this as I said, was that everyone is complaining about SA and its benefits to stealth, that will only affect WvW not PvP. I seriously doubt anyone will be running the SA line in PvP its just too much time sitting in stealth and not doing your job as thief in PvP.
Regarding “Don’t Stop,” it says periodically evade attacks…not all attacks. From the looks of it, there is a 1 sec CD so I assume it will be 1 attack per CD. Basically, you will evade 1 out of 8 RF…
Meh.
I bet Anet ran out of things to nerf on the thief. So they decided to buff them only to nerf them even harder a month or two later. I’m calling it now.
Wow…Deadly arts seems overwhelmingly OP at first go. Taking Trapper’s respite (due to INSANE synergy with instant-cast withdraw), Panic Strike, and Improvisation (flat 10% damage increase is statistically the same damage as executioner but with goodies). The automatic, uncounterable immobilize spam with high burst damage is an incredibly strong combination, even before getting the stuff from other trait-lines.
Also, shadow arts is now hilariously OP too, with 50% damage reduction in stealth. Now stealth truly is invulnerability (from practical aspects).
I truly hope that a strong balance pass nerfs a LOT of class traits out of the stratosphere.
I believe the 50% damage reduction stacks with protection.
Lower reveal back to 3 secs and with the trait system change, I will start using D/D again…
Encountered this today. Was not fun….
crit strikes thief= high risk high reward
panic strike thief= medium risk medium reward
S/D thief= low risk low rewardIsint that how it should be? Why do people QQ. Crit strikes is still good but its just hard to play in this meta thats why nobody plays it. Its much better to play an easier build and do something for your team instead of being downstate food and then claim that your hard build is not viable anymore.
Edit: Also nothing is more braindead than a shoutbow warr or a turret engi. If they nerf panic strike cuz it was ‘’too easy to play’ then LOL are you kittening serious.
Yes, that is how it should be. But instead, we have this.
crit strikes thief= high risk high reward
panic strike thief= medium risk high reward
S/D thief= low risk high reward
SOH is far from passive….
What if Improvisation took 5-8 seconds off of the most common utility type equipped, when steal was used? That would keep it pretty in line with a master trait that typically reduces a utility type’s cooldown by 20%.
I think you failed to see the real problem which is critical damage just isn’t worth it anymore.
Fi
Well dhuumfire was nerfed because it didn’t promote skillful play. So…
As a Necro main I’d be totally happy to nerf chill of death along with sigils and many other passive procs. But as much as I get that they are different classes, it’s hard to grasp why it was skill-less for necromancers but it’s fine for engineers.
It was an excuse to nerf dhuumfire and nothing more. Don’t think too much into it.
We have a similar discussion in the general forums, as well. Go here for suggestions on how to report players who use offensive language.
This is an issue we take seriously. We recognize that players can get heated, and competition can bring out less-than-stellar language, but tolerance and understanding are only part of the picture and those who use abusive language often will find themselves warned, suspended, or, in the worse cases, looking at a terminated account.
I don’t think for a second Anet takes this issue seriously. I haven’t seen any changes or action from Anet in the 2+ years I have been playing this game.
Be honest with us. Can you tell me how many verbal abuse reports were submitted? How many of those resulted in a suspension or ban? I’m willing to bet less than 1%.
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Gosh. This is such a simple fix. I don’t know why everyone is even discussing this. Just add 5-10 secs CD to any CD ability that is interrupted. /thread
The mesmers are not satisfied with this because the one class that happens to be in many aspects their hard counter is unaffected by that.
That’s why the thread is so long.
Oh so Mesmers want a buff to a skill that is, by the Devs, working as intended.
If they want a skill to go above and beyond the original intent, what are they willing to give up in exchange for the buff? All I hear is I want this and I want that.
Lets start off with 10 sec CD on DE shall we?
Gosh. This is such a simple fix. I don’t know why everyone is even discussing this. Just add 5-10 secs CD to any CD ability that is interrupted. /thread
I didn’t want to bump an old thread.
Power Block is a Mesmer GM Trait that increases the CD of interrupted skills from 5 seconds to 10 seconds. This does not work on thief weapon skills because, according to ANet, thieves don’t have CDs in the first place.
Anyway, here’s the thing, Power Block doesn’t work on thieves because ANet says thieves don’t have CD. Power Block’s tooltip says it increases the interrupted CD duration, so if it normally increase 5 to 10, then logically it should increase 0 to 5. So I see no reason this shouldn’t work this way. Thieves will get a mere 5 second CD when they usually get none? Meh, I don’t see how it would completely destroy thieves. Oh, but they lose initiative when you interrupt them in the first place, you say? Well, not always[a bug or something, they don’t lose initiative a lot of the time when they’re interrupted] and that goes for everyone[“Aw, but warriors already get a 5 second CD when they’re interrupted~” sounds ridiculous, really. Same thing for thief initiative loss when rupted, in the case that they actually lost it].
So, what’re your opinions, arguments, mesmer-hate, and thief-fanboyism you have for this topic?
PS, I don’t hate thieves, just annoyed about a trait tailored to ignore them.
Because it will break the thief class that is why for the most part PB does not affect thieves.
In general, all classes follow the same rules but Anet makes balancing exceptions in cases where it is appropriate. We call these inconsistencies but at the end of the day it is needed.
Take the Mesmer’s Phantasmal Berserker for example (this applies to almost all phantasm summons). This is a two fold attack; the summon and the phant attack. Your skill will fail if the summon does not connect – you are blind or the target is invul. The last time I check, dodging is pretty kitten close to being invul yet the summon still connects. Inconsistent right? This one is in Mesmer favor. It would break the Mesmer class if I can dodge the summons…
Also, please give us an elite that summons all spirit weapons.
Engineers can’t heal their turrets nowhere nearly as fast as a guardian can heal spirit weapons. Engineers can’t also stack tons of boons on them. Spirit weapons also hit harder than minions. The only downsides spirit weapons have are duration and lower health.
I’m not against changing them, but if you solve any of their downsides, you’ll have to compensate with some other downsides.
Give and take.
Uhm have you ever played guard with spirit weps? They do not heal lol where did you get that idea, they do not even regen ooc. Way back at release they were invuln and guess what most guards didn’t use them even then. ONE turret blast kills all spirits, same goes for any shatter or any AOE attack they die to 1 slice from thiefs lol , anyone that says not to buff spirits has never played them. Also you have to invest points in 3 trait lines just to make them usable at all. Before you guys spout off about them you really should l2Try. DEVS PLS BUFF SPIRIT WEPS JUST LIKE TURRETS
My brother in arms. Yes! Buff spirit weapons!
Their duration is too short. The weapons should last until it is destroyed. It should exploded knocking back and burn nearby enemies when destroyed. It should give nearby allies boons.
Buff spirit weapons!!!!
I understand why people are trying to do this… Nevertheless, players need to understand that Magic Toker is a member of that team.
Playing against Magic Toker only accomplishes one thing…
-
He is the best. Incoming haters who wish they were as good as him.
Lolz
/15 char
This was the first WTS where I felt that I really liked all of the teams. Eurantian made some killer Ranger plays and really showed what the class can do, Heaven and Earth showed real improvement from our Chinese friends, Abjured came in and showed strong, and Orange Logo trained hard, had an epic comeback against TCG in the European qualifiers, and went undefeated in the WTS itself.
These teams were respectable, strong at representing their nations, and very talented. I really enjoyed watching all of the games, and really enjoyed the production and competition.
No one deserved this tournament win more than oRNG, and I say that as a proud American. Great job, and I hope you win many more in the future.
Personally, I feel like it is unfair to the Chinese team to put them against players that have been play GW2 for years….
Orange Logo well done. Also to Heaven on Earth I think they did well.
I’m from NA but I was cheering for EU because they at least had two zerker builds rather than Abjured focusing mostly on defense and condi. Even their thief is full acro for the defense. Its just a testament true to high risk high reward. We need more of that.
\
Best at what? Team pvp? Probably. Thief? No.Toker is probably best thief as well. Unless you’re implying Kronos Xnm is better. Which he isn’t.
Kronos is good but definitely not the best. He runs cheesy SA builds most of the time so its really hard to say what skill he has at all. Toker is also a really good thief but many things determine a good sPvP thief. Playing your role correctly as conquest demands is only one of them. In terms of sheer dueling and mechanical capability, there are a lot of others who are evenly matched.
SA is cheesy but full Acro is right behind it…
Exactly this @Chaith!
You’re basically enforcing my point, the “problem” that people have with d/d it’s not the trait set up; which used also by staff eles; but rather the skirmishing potential and this is real truth behind the nerf requests. It’s not cleansing water, it’s not elemental attunement, it’s not elemental shielding and it’s not the condi clear potential…because staff ele has got them all( even more condi clear) and it’s still not used.
If D/D is 10, other specs ( shatter; terrormancer; s/d+d/p; med guardian ect etc) are 8-9, where staff is 6-7.
If you nerfs the traits , you bring D/D to 7/8 while staff goes down from 6-7 to 3-4 so…STEP 1
The Traits are not the problem and obviously not the solutionThat leaves skills and amulet as possible solution.
-Shall we increase the CD of burning speed, drake’s breath?
-Add wind up animation to updraft and magnetic grasp?
-Shall we reduce the stats on cele amulet by 50 pts?xDudisx.5914
Staff is giving more support but at the cost of having much less mobility and less 1v1 offensive power.
This reinforce my point even more, traits are not the problem, despite sharing the same survival traits, you still lose 1vs1 when using staff, so…
I can understand this PoV – adjusting traits have negative affects on other builds/wpn sets. You mentioned two possible solution such as changing amulets and skills but I also want to mention one more option – Buff other classes to deal with the Cele meta.
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God kitten it. This video is going to get IA, SS, IS, and Steal nerfed.
The dev nerfed Infiltrator Return because we were using it to stomp.
IMO sigils that need a nerf are:
-doom: too strong, gives poisons for classes that should’t have it. easy to apply and covered with condi spaming other condis it is not hard to keep it up
-energy: too strong becuase gives 1 free dodge every 9s
-air+fire combo: gives the ability for people to spec defensive and still do crazy spike dmg (sw+dg thief, mes gs, etc..)
-geomancy: too much condi from a sigil that is so easy to proc. needs to be toned down like sigil of battle was
I totally agree with you on the air and fire sigils combo. 2/0/0/6/6 thieves have ridiculous survivability while doing close to 2/6/0/0/6 damage thanks to the sigils.
When it comes to agreement, engineer has a few skills that everyone pretty much unanimously thinks is OP (Overcharged Shot, Slick Shoes, Gear Block). Even warrior, players can mostly agree that war banner is a very strong skill.
Be careful with the forums. People will say something is OP because it’s the most noticeable ability when they died; not because it’s how they died or what’s too strong.
- Incendiary Powder is too strong because you can’t avoid being hit by it and because it’s difficult to remove with lots of cover conditions. The trait should be completely reworked, but for now, a duration reduction would help a lot
- Slick Shoes is too strong and frustrates players because it’s too easy to knock them down multiple times. However, I would argue that Slick Shoes should retain the ability to knock down twice, but only with good planning.
- Overcharged Shot should be left alone for now. It has no tell for its use, but you can reasonably predict it and it self-CC’s. Unless the engineer uses a stun break, of which they have few, they aren’t going to be able to unleash a ton of damage onto you. You have to anticipate it coming and use blocks, blinds, stability, stun breaks, etc appropriately. It’s not like the old Pin Down (warrior longbow #5) with a 0.25sec cast time and 3sec immob. Fix the first two things before you change this. Overcharged shot doubles as an interrupt and defense against glass cannon melee and adding a cast time breaks that.
- What skills can both sides of this argument agree on are too strong and COULD be shaved for elementalist? I highly doubt a massive nerf to celestial elementalists is going to happen, so what can we agree is OP or lacks counterplay for elementalist?
There’s no consensus because there’s no agreement about what d/d ele’s strenths and weaknesses should be. Is its sustain too strong and damage okay? Or is the damage too strong, but sustain good? Is the group utility right or is it too much? Should it be weaker in 1v1, team fights, or both? All of the above? I haven’t seen a consistent answer about where d/d celestial ele should fit.
Slick Shoes isn’t OP because of the multiple CC, it is OP because of multiple CC plus a short CD stun breaker.
I am asking, pleading, begging you Devs to stand your ground once more.
Do not give in! Let us not reduce further the build diversity in this game; let us send a clear, definitive message to the Vocal minority, the message being : Learn To Play.They need to learn how to adapt to the ever changing environment, they need to learn how to change: tactics, playstyle and even profession if necessary.
Less nerfing and more buffing pls, many builds make the game fun as people can try and play different things, few builds make the game boring and stagnant.
Let us all remember that : creativity, adaptability, humbleness are what divide the good from the bad.
Cheers
Competitive Pvp is kitten so they might as well keep it to retain the pvers.
“Thief -Weakness: Low passive defense (health and armor), limited condition removal, low prolonged sustainability in a fight due to their high burst potential. High skill ceiling – high damage but low survability (i.e. glass cannon). To get survability you need to trade off some damage – opportunity costs.”
Lol.
S/D 2/0/0/6/6 trade very minor damage lost for double if not triple the survivability. Lost damage is recovered through sigil or Air/Fire.
“Guardian: Very good at providing boons and sustained – general group support and very tanky even with a low health pool. Generally act as a frontline support – first in and last out. Different from warriors who have a more of a selfish sustain.
?Weakness: Reliance on boons for damage reduction and survability make them vulnerable to boon striping classes. A lot of the damage reduction is cooldown based so the longer the fight goes on the more they are vulnerable.”
Lol again. Meditation guardian says hi.
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The funny thing is I can beat a cele meta spec engi but not a turret engi….
I can “beat” most “meta spec engis” as well but it takes a huge amount of time and a all my CDs, both being far more useful if spent in other ways.
Being able to “beat” something does not mean it’s the wisest thing to do during a PvP match.
Nor does it mean the worst thing depending on the context. We both have our points?
Does Anet balance at the top level, mid level, or low level of pvp?
Also, what are Anet’s balancing philosophies?
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The funny thing is I can beat a cele meta spec engi but not a turret engi….
…[/b]
Assaulter— Ele
Smuggler—Ele
Shepherd—Ele
Defender—Ele
Trebuchet Master—Ele
Roamer—Ele
Slayer—Ele
Fixed it for you.
Sincerely,
Thief
I watched a little bit of WTS qualifiers the other day, there was a longbow ranger (he was called something like Eurasian), but as the guy commentating said, he was the only power ranger playing at that level, so if this build is so OP and needs balancing, why do virtually none of the teams use it, sounds like a L2P issue…
Because in a team environment, you have structure, You have bunkers you have tactics. In PuG environment (99% of the games) the rangers wreck the game. I stopped counting how many times i’ve played with team with only berserker guardians or berserker warriors that were dropping faster than the speed of light.
You can’t balance a game around people basically not playing the game properly, with random compositions, limited teamwork with no TS, etc.
Yet they still nerfed the hell out of thieves because hot joins couldn’t handle Steal+CnD+BS combo back in the days.
Or how the Devs said thief Sword 3 was too easy so they nerfed it.
They should nerf RF for the same reasons.
if RTW increases range it should show that on the tooltip at the very least. otherwise it appears as an unintended oversight.
for crying out loud. READ THE WIND DOES NOT CHANCE THE BOW’S RANGE. IT SIMPLY DOES ONE THING IN TERMS OF AFFECTING THE PROJECTILE. IT INCREASES THE SPEED OF THE ARROW SO YOU CAN NO LONGER SPAM ADADADADADADADADADADADA TO AVOID ALL THE LB’S DAMAGE
Only trait that INCREASES range for longbow is EAGLE EYE
Eagle Eye has given rangers THE SAME RANGE SINCE DAY ONE. THEY HAVE ALWAYS HAD THAT RANGE, IT WAS NOT SOMETHING GIVEN TO THEM BY MISTAKE.
THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN RANGER PRIOR TO RTW AND NOW, IS THAT PRIOR TO RTW, ANY SHOT BEYOND 1000 RANGE WAS VERY LIKELY TO MISS UNLESS THE ENEMY STOOD COMPLETELY STILL. THAT WAS BECAUSE THE ARROW IS SO SLOW UNTRAITED THAT SIMPLY WALKING CAN MAKE THE SHOT MISS
Now shove this into your thick skulls and get real.
Actually, Read the Wind also increase attack speed by 10% (doesn’t this increase DPS?)
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I highly congratulate “Eurantien” from Team Dankening for being the first Ranger to make a mark in Competitive Scene in GW2 to make it to PAX East!
But in my opinion Rangers are very underused but arent over power nor under powered. Rangers right now in this meta are “Unviable”. Any good teams with proper communications and coordinations can shut down a “Power” ranger due to the lack of utilities for its survivability compared to any DPS profession such as thieves who has access to perma stealth and mobility and Mesmers who also has stealth and multiple invulnerability. Same goes for a “Condi Survival” Ranger, it is a very strong class that can stack multiple conditions in a matter of seconds but due to the fact that the meta has revolved around multi eles or “shoutbow” warriors, those conditions can be wiped in an instance.
Yes people may say it is overpowered or underpowered but in all honesty the profession is in a good place. But with the “meta” right now it is unviable to run.
Your first statement contradicts your entire arguement that power rangers are “unviable”….