Guild Wars 2

Chicho Gosho.6507:

They had the same classes, but there was a difference in skills/traits used(don’t remember about weapons). Also there’s wvw and pve as well. A trait might not be used in pvp but used somewhere else and race not having an impact is a pretty good decision.

You’re just mentioning some irrelevant details. Fact is that they used the same teamcomp. That is just as bad as boring.
We’re talking about pvp here. If a trait is not useful in PvP at all, it can either be considered a badly designed trait or there should be more different traits to compensate this.
That race did not play any role seemed a good decision to me too, but now it does not anymore. A game without any variety is dull. You can find variety in PvE but not in PvP, and if a greatly anticipated game like this does not play any role in the Esports market, it can be considered a to be a big design flaw. I don’t see any reason anymore to withold racial skills from PvP (they have to be redisigned for this ofc).

Fivedawgs.4267:

You just don’t get it ?? Do you. Even if they HD diversity, most players would always end up using the same OP builds. It has nothing to do with balance or whatever you want to call it it’s human nature. The way th3 system is setup gives you a choice to create diverse builds; people don’t do it because there is always one build which is going to be stronger than others. It’s the same very where, on league of legebdary or Dota peoplease uses the same build over and over depending on were they are going.

Who’s not getting it? When you have more diversity you also have more different OP builds. I’d rather watch an OP condi mesmer build versus an OP power revenant build than an OP Engi bruiser build versus an OP Engi bruiser build. You talk about ‘’the system’’ as you call it as it is at this very moment, not a system that could undergo some major changes. There are reasons that a big GW2 pvp live tournament is watched by such a low amount of people, and I really think that this is one of them.

The fact that the best two teams in the finals yesterday had exactly the same team composition illustrates the problems this game has perfectly. People are not really motivated to compose their own teambuild because soon after a game-update/patch its already clear which builds are going to be good and which builds not. The creation of a so-called meta is too simple and too fast.

This has everything to do with the lack of appropriate traits, utilities and weapon skills. For example: who needs a trait that triggers when taking falling damage? No one, so the other 2 traits are the 2 options that are left behind. Who uses necro’s axe, while all of its skills are mediocre? No one will, because scepter and dagger are better. These are just 2 examples of narrowing down the possibility to create different builds and playstyles that are or might be effective enough in pvp.

In my opinion, Anet needs to do everything to create a more diverse PvP environment so it won’t be boring to play OR watch. Think about some dramatic changes they could make, for example; why does the race of the character not have any influence on its abilities in pvp? Has it been a good step to make players only choose 3 out of the 6 traitlines, instead of the old system where you could choose traits from all different traitlines? We need diversity! I don’t want to know exactly what build someone is playing before I even fought against him. It should not be an objective to try to give every player or team exactly the same possibilities and try to balance everything out. The trials so far to obtain a good balance have failed. Leave that to shootergames.

Zenos Osgorma.2936:

Tragic Positive.9356:

Zenos Osgorma.2936:

A few Ifs there , for some it may not be worth as that players skill can’t Handle the Pressure and makes that Fatal mistake but for me I’ve had Success in doing so .

its not a matter of its not worth it or it is , its about the play style and if that play can or can not Handle it.

It’s not about playstyle.
It’s that your enemies have to be really bad if they let you live glassy for 4+ seconds.

And if you are forced to evade/retreat/heal/rotate/whatever then you are on defensive and you have 0 use of might.

you know a Rangers methords of evade are not Stop attacking but attack through the attack thats what sword 2>3 dagger 4 is for and a gs is for too , unlike other classes we can attack+evade at the same time thats the whole point of MDG its a Risk each time you attack and it rewards greatly (if a person cant handle that they shouldn’t use MDG ) its not a case of they are bad if they let you stay alive for 4 seconds .

its the fact the ranger Failed to stay alive for 4 seconds with those evades (you dont have to stop attacking to evade on those weapon sets)

You don’t have healing power or thoughness to stay a reasonable amount of time under that 50%, nor do you have any vitality to boost your HP-bar to be longer under 50%. Also, where are your condi cleanses apart from evasive purity? Without staff or GS your escaping possibilities are very limited as well. In any reasonable tier of PvP this build won’t work.

MDG in combination with Viper aint worth it indeed.

Dont know anything about stronghold.
In conquest it would be something like:
- Necro
- Thief
- Scrapper
- Revenant
- Druid

Tragic Positive.9356:

HeadCrowned.6834:

So many topics with sugestions and requests to improve the shortbow, and it keeps being ignored by Anet.

Actually, the next patch will be in ~3 months more or less.
And they did a great job on reworking the shouts. In reality, most of what they implemented… no, I believe all of them were the changes proposed here on forums.

They did a sloppy job but you can’t deny that they are listening.
They can’t re-create a whole class in 9 aspects with 1 balance update. 1 step at a time is what I feel like being best myself.
We don’t want them to start listening to childish Ele and Warrior “buff us, Anet servants!” cryout that will never stop, right? Because if they recreate rangers WHOLE and address EVERY QoL or balance pickle with all weapons and utilities – that basically means they have to do the same for other classes, too. People do not see equality in terms of “who needs stuff”. They see it in “who wants stuff”. And they want a whole heck more and those are nothing but buffs.

So let’s give ANet credit and appreciation for they heard us out once. It might make them actually motivated to keep it going if they hear a positive feedback, shall we?

All you’re saying is true. I am happy with for example the introduction of the druid with HoT and stuff. But Shortbow is something that has been asked for a really long time, this weapon has been unchanged for so long. Shouts in general had a buff with Resounding timbre and making WHaO a shout. Apart from WHaO and SotP the shouts are still not very useful because of how they mechanically work in my opinion.
The shortbow is a completely different story.
I am a big supporter of creating as much freedom as possible for players to create their own effective build. In my opinion this starts with making all the weapons equally worth using. The weapon you use should be the foundation of your build, and the utilities like shouts an improvement on top of this foundation. Improving build diversity can boost this game to higher levels, a small buff to some shouts is not the right start. Start at the bottom, with ranger shortbow, ranger offhand axe, necro axe, guardian staff, and so on. It is a bad thing that you see a lot of specific weapons not being used at all in PvP, and often for a very long period of time.

So many topics with sugestions and requests to improve the shortbow, and it keeps being ignored by Anet.

Sage amulet might be better indeed. It makes the staff a lot more useful.
Although I tried some poison master builds myself, I never was convinced. Especially the Refined Toxins trait is quite disappointing. The ICD is too high if you ask me. Its fun to play a poison build though, but I question the true effectiveness of it.

Just ignore this noob. Complaining all around map chat about necros, but he doesnt run any condi cleanse. Lol. Thats about the same as going outside right now without any clothes on, and complaining that you’re getting cold.

Chill always has been one of the main problems for Ele’s. Finally we got rid of that boring diamond skin, deal with it. Just don’t expect to defeat a necro without condi cleanses.

Although I do understand that you could complain about losing that much HP as an enemy from only staff #2 and #3 with low cooldowns.

My trap build depended on settler amulet, so I have to test new trapperbuilds these days. Although I am quite positive that any ranger trapper build won’t be truly effective in pvp with a decent skill level or teamQ. All the traps except the bleeding spike trap lack too much for that.

The main problem I experience when I use traps in my build, is the fact that you have too less condi cleanses. The skirmishing traitline, which you need for traps, does not involve any condi cleanse traits. We don’t have any utility that removes condi’s directly without traits, except healing spring.

Berserker is underrated.

The auto-attack of the staff is highly undervalued, I tell you. Only on a pure condi build the SB would do better damage, and even then it isn’t worth taking it.

However, I am testing a shortbow build atm in PvP, and I can tell you that is effective for mid-tier or subtop pvp. Imma test it again after the patch is available today. If its still good, I might share it, cuz I love the shortbow as a weapon in essence, it just needs to be buffed a bit to actually make it useful with different kinds of builds, playstyles and opponents.

Main buff needed would be some sort of escape option. If you take the other weapons into account you have GS #3 and #4, Staff #3 and #4, LB #3, sword #2 as escape options. No wonder that the SB and Axe are considered the least useful mainhands.

Main problem is the use of both runes and traits that shortens the duration of any condition, including immobilize. Anyone who uses one of these just walk straight out of the roots as if they aren’t there. Quite an easy denial of a grandmaster trait (ancient seeds) with a good potential.

Fluffball.8307:

HeadCrowned.6834:

The daze doesnt double with ancient seeds, you need the marksmanship traitline for it, which is basically kitteneless traitline for shortbow.

I didn’t mean the duration doubles, I meant it “doubles as” a proc for ancient seeds. You’re thinking of Moment of Clarity.

HeadCrowned.6834:

Furthermore, the staff is overall a much more valuable weapon than the shortbow in PvP.

I totally agree, but that wasn’t relevant to the conversation about staff putting out equivalent condi damage. Staff puts out atrocious, unacceptable damage on any gear set, but it’s still a good weapon. SB puts out a ton of damage when used properly, and is probably our worst weapon.

I have a good pvp build with staff and marauders amulet + fire/air sigils. It does very good damage. The AA nearly outdamages the LB AA without any amulet, but with precision it might be even better than the LB. Havent tested it yet in comparison with the SB.

The daze doesnt double with ancient seeds, you need the marksmanship traitline for it, which is basically kitteneless traitline for shortbow.

Furthermore, the staff is overall a much more valuable weapon than the shortbow in PvP.
- Projectile to heal conversion vs. 1 sec daze (staff better)
- Immobilize + team condi cleanse vs 4sec cripple and a little bleeding (staff better)
- 1200 range dodging leap vs a short dodge and a few secs swiftness (u kiddin me? staff way better)
- Small AoE heal vs AoE spread poison (pretty even, cuz staff #2 is nice for building up AF))
- 1200 ranged beam with 3 procs + ally heal and decent base dmg vs Slower Projectile 900 range with low base dmg, only applying 1 bleed stack while flanking (basically never in an 1v1). (Staff better)

Mainly staff #3 is an irreplacable skill.

Shortbow really needs a buff, especially in PvP.

No shortbow changes?

If the skills #1, #2 and #4 intend to apply condition damage, you should consider it a condi weapon. If it is not a condi weapon as you suggest, it is even more useless.

bump………………………..

It aint a problem that DS counters condition builds, it is a problem that it counters it too hard. Traits like DS stimulate Build Wars 2.

Reapers shroud all the way. The access to stability is something necro’s always needed, and there you have it. And with a good duration too. + the stun on reapers shroud #5 and the insane poison on #4 makes it way more powerful than Deathshroud. Although arguably DS #1 might be stronger than RS #1.

bump. Irenio can you look into the shortbow?

In my opinion the main problem of the shortbow is the fact that its damage is too low. It is considered to be a condi weapon, but in just a regular 1v1 you are almost always facing the opponent, so the bleeds from the autoattack are often not applied. I would rather see that the shortbow #1 skill becomes a chain attack, in which for example the first attack does not inflict bleeding and the second attack does.

skill #2 is fine I think, although the poison duration can be increased a little.

skill #3 is meh at the moment. The evade is nice, but your arrow has to hit, otherwise it wont apply swiftness. Maybe this requirement should be removed, so that the arrow will apply swiftness no matter if it hits. A longer CD or a shorter swiftness duration in exchange would be OK I guess.

skill #4, indeed as suggested above, the next ranger attacks should inflict the bleeding and not the pets attacks. This is way more reliable.

skill #5, a small reduction of the CD would be nice yes.

Although I agree that the shortbow is not in a good position at the moment, I made a build (PvP) with it in which it seems to be quite useful. Anyone can send me a letter in-game if you wanna know more about that.

Not really sure but I would say the Ele, because Druid staff does not have that much on-point utility in terms of cc and damage. Also less condi removal in most druid builds. Will depend on the build of the Druid probably.

Cele might stacking will be more effective if you have any condi damage. I’d drop the warhorn for the torch. With 2 shouts and resounding timbre, staff #3 and sword #2 you have already sufficient mobility.

Agree, its an annoying bug. When we start a spvp match and I use Staff #3 to quickly get to a point and then switch to another weapon, I got slowed down. Weapon swap then also has the 9sec cooldown. Not working as intended.

A fully specced Druid with for example minstrel of settler amulet is pretty much unkillable in a 1v1. Even in a 2v1 its hard to kill them. You have the best chance to kill them by using both dps and condi pressure, since it is harder for them to spec both for condi cleanses and dps mitigation. Still it might take some time then to kill them, so if the point is already in posession of the Druids team and the Druid is on that point, don’t even bother to 1v1 him.

Im talking from a PvP perspective: It is true that investing in Healing power stat was not so rewarding. On the one hand that is a weakness, but on the other hand it made the staff also useful for not full-healing builds. In fact, I probably made the best Ranger build I ever had for pvp with using the staff without going for a Healing Power amulet. In my opinion it would be a pity if the staff gets tweaked to an heal-only weapon. Please keep in mind that we won’t expect the staff to be a raw damage weapon, but improving build diversity can be done by making the staff suitable for more hybrid builds as well. If you scale down the base healing stats of it, you probably should consider increasing the damage as well.

You didn’t even mention guardian.

Although I never play MM because the idea does not attract me at all, they could be the new turret engi as in masters of the 1v1’s. But then again, only being effective in 1v1’s is not enough for top tier pvp. I actually switched a while ago to Ranger, probably together with necro the class with the most issues in PvP. The lack of teamfight abilities of the ranger might be even bigger than with the necro, and it really hurts your usefullness in PvPmatches.

I tried a condi build with the longbow for a little bit as well, but I found shortbow with Light on your feet more useful (in sPvP).

The reliance on the staff is something that bothers too I think. It is our only two-handed weapon, and basically every build uses it, while it is actually not that good although necessary. They buffed it a bit with the patch, but still I see it as a condi oriented weapon, while power builds have to use it very often too.

I managed to create some nice Ranger builds for PvP, but they are mainly effective in 1v1 or 2v2. In true teamfights I feel that the Ranger lacks the most.

Can someone send a link to the video in which they explain the upcoming changes for classes after they explained Ranger?

Or post, announcement, whatever.

Dawdler.8521:

Rym.1469:

Hmm…You say? That’s quite a discovery.
We have amazing defenses. That’s totally why we’re being focused every time we appear in sight. Because we have strong defenses.

Have you ever played with a lf regen bunker Necro? If they are focused, you’ve probably won the match already.

If a zerker Necro is focused, its because its one of the most dangerous +1 on the battlefield. Far worse than a Thief, which loose 50% of his HP just trying to run up to you. Low defenses, sure… That’s sort of what you get when you build for 2 shotting other zerkers at max range.

There is no point in using a necro bunker, since other classes can fill a bunker role much better. You argument is invalid, we are talking about PvP here mate. Bunker necro aint viable from that perspective. Every bunker build do not really need defensive improvements over offensive improvements, you don’t make any point here.

Lets wait a bit first yes. And the changes you suggest are pretty much offensive. Necro’s need defensive improvements.

They need to add several amulets in general. We need build diversity.

First of all, determine whether it is a condi or a power ranger. If he has a longbow he will almost always be power. You need to get close to him, and dodge his entangle (if he doesnt run Rampage). Although, mind his greatsword #2, it can hit you hard. Try to dodge PBS and you will beat him, their condi cleanse aint so good. If the range between you and him is too big, avoid the fight.

If it is a condi ranger, the dodge of entangle is really important, and spare your staff #4 and dagger #4. These 2 skills can really help you turn the fight. Watch out for their burning skills from the torch, they can hurt you alot, especially if you are immobilized in Bonfire (torch #5 skill). As for a condi ranger, you should try to fight him from range.

It depends on your build which skills deal damage. If you run a terrormancer (condi) build, your fears can do a nice amount of damage, however it does 0 damage when you do not use the terror trait. A condi build deals damage over time, mostly with high bleed stacks, burning, poison and fear. However, most objects are invulnerable to conditions.

I do not play WvW, but I do play sPvP. Most necro’s are running a power build at the moment, with the purpose of dealing as much damage as they can. For a standard power build you should look at the metabattle website. The main sources of damage in this build will be Lifeblast (Death shroud skill #1), dagger #1, wells (well of suffering and also well of corruption, they go great with dagger #3), and ofcourse Lich Form. The Lich form can be devastating for the enemy, but you are also very vulnerable while using it.

Thanks for the input so far

Ah yeah I forgot to mention that I meant it for PvP. I use the shortbow as well, I like the ranged option you have with this weapon to get condi’s on the enemy, since the axe doesn’t feel really useful for a condi build on long range. But yes, dagger might be better than torch versus warriors for example

Hi all,

Recently I started playing with my ranger again after a long break. I had quite some fun with my condi build. Now it occurred to me that both torch and dagger seem to be decent offhand weapons for condi builds. I mainly played with the torch because the burning forms an extra condition (which makes enemies condi removals a bit less reliant) and it can do decent (AoE) damage. The dagger however, makes a higher bleedstack easier to get and it has a nice evade.

Which offhand weapon do you prefer and why?

Removing the scoreboard and telling new players that more than 1 person capping the same node is useless would be nice too.

You’re mentioning NONE of the current meta builds. Maybe only infinite health ele, whatever that may be.

Mostly you mention professions/builds that can do quite some damage to you. It takes time and practice to survive them, it has nothing to do with being OP.

Because the meta is boring. Im getting sick of especially shoutbow warriors. Since the start of the game I played necro and ranger, both non-meta classes. The fact that there even is a true meta is a weak point of this game if you ask me. I have been trying to explore and try new or tweaked builds, which brings fun for me into this game. Creating a build on your own and make it effective in PvP is pretty much the best thing to do in this game for me.

Although I can understand where some frustration is coming from; you don’t want to see a full signet warrior on ur team.

Foefire
Kyhlo
Forest
Temple
Courtyard
Spirit Watch
Skyhammer

Agreed with the OP.

As long as it has a leap I would already be pretty happy.