Dungeon Master 8/8 | Fractal 50
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
Generic Ranger build. You’re fine.
Dungeon Master 8/8 | Fractal 50
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
/Sign, I’m all for this.
Dungeon Master 8/8 | Fractal 50
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
big numbers doesnt always mean high dps
look at the way how SB and LB works one does less but shoots faster
and the other does more dmg per hit but shoots slowerour dps is not the best but it is not so bad either
and since everyone compare rangers to warriors i beat them most of the time 1v1
Fun Fact: Shortbow out dps’ Longbows
Ranger DPS is bad compared to EVERYONE. Beating a class (Probably the WORST 1v1 class) =/= higher dps/fair amount of dmg
Dungeon Master 8/8 | Fractal 50
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
How do you plan on removing conditions?
Emphatic Bond would be much better in this build.
The build also seems generic and obvious. I don’t see much creativity in this and this is probably known to a lot of people.
Dungeon Master 8/8 | Fractal 50
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
Ranger is obviously a DPS class and a good one, what does DPS mean? If what you want is flashy big numbers then no, it’s not a “DPS” class…but then…that’s not DPS.
Most people don’t know the definition of DPS, and expect to see big flashy numbers.
Don’t bring logic into our forum. We like to be ignorant, okay? Thanks, but take your logic elsewhere.
I’d much rather have ANet hand me unnecessary buffs instead of nerfing the broken skills on classes like Warriors, and Mesmers.
Why doesn’t my #1 skill hit as hard as the warrior burst skill?!? This is nonsense!! WE NEEDZ BUFFZ URHURHUR!!
you know, because pumping someone full of 3-4k crits coming from both you AND your pet isn’t going to wreck some dude or anything… nope, we gotta deal really big damage with each skill or we’re just bad…
You mean your pet that doesn’t hit?
You mean the arrows that can be swayed back and forth?
You mean Throw dirt, because you used a sword?
The DPS in this class is still garbage even with pets, conditions and whatever else you can think of
Dungeon Master 8/8 | Fractal 50
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
The class in general needs help, we all know this.
Dungeon Master 8/8 | Fractal 50
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
Anything can work for open world PvE, If interested, I can link you a dungeon build
Is there a Dungeon build(s) out there with “strategy breakdowns”?
Every dungeon and every build has a different strategy breakdown. It depends on you to work with your class and know what they do and what you do.
Dungeon Master 8/8 | Fractal 50
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
Anything can work for open world PvE, If interested, I can link you a dungeon build
Dungeon Master 8/8 | Fractal 50
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
Neither, roll a Warrior
Dungeon Master 8/8 | Fractal 50
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
I wonder what the average level would be in this thread…
Dungeon Master 8/8 | Fractal 50
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
is our damage really that bad compared to others??? Ouch…
No.
Yes.
Dungeon Master 8/8 | Fractal 50
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
Bad build is bad.
Dungeon Master 8/8 | Fractal 50
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
Get to level 80 first
Dungeon Master 8/8 | Fractal 50
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
Nothing, because unlike you and majority of the thieves on this forum, I played it with skill and not because it was the strongest and one of the most facerolls in PvP…
Get out
Hey Ranger, please the ranger forum is that way ->
There’s this thing people can do, you know making more than one alt…
Lies, everything about your post history is biased. I’ve already read so please, don’t delete.
You’re a troll or an idiot. Either or a waste of my time. Sit there and wallow in your disdain.
Dungeon Master 8/8 | Fractal 50
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
Nothing, because unlike you and majority of the thieves on this forum, I played it with skill and not because it was the strongest and one of the most facerolls in PvP…
Get out
Hey Ranger, please the ranger forum is that way ->
There’s this thing people can do, you know making more than one alt…
Dungeon Master 8/8 | Fractal 50
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
I can’t even say i’m suprised
Dungeon Master 8/8 | Fractal 50
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
It’s Wed Nov. 14 in Texas, approaching 7pm, so I’m assuming you are the fortunate ones on the other side of the world enjoying Nov. 15 morning. Is this correct?
This doesn’t make much sense…
The OP brought up the 15th being ‘today’ yet it is still the 14th where I am. Just needing the clarification is all, thanks.
The patch would of still came for you if it was the 14th for you…….
Dungeon Master 8/8 | Fractal 50
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
It’s Wed Nov. 14 in Texas, approaching 7pm, so I’m assuming you are the fortunate ones on the other side of the world enjoying Nov. 15 morning. Is this correct?
This doesn’t make much sense…
Dungeon Master 8/8 | Fractal 50
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
Funny thing though, Warriors and Guardians have things they’re BEST at, things that DEFINE the USEFULNESS of their class.
That’s the thing, i don’t think Anet even knows what they want about the classes. In sPvP yes, rangers are below other classes because there is not much of a reason to use a ranger for the most part in paid tournaments but most of the classes are stuck with pretty much a single role/build, i think it’s more a general problem and not just ranger itself (Sure ranger needs A LOT of rework on traits, signets and spirits, but still).
Either way, not every class has to be the best at doing something to be good.
Don’t forget there is a lot of stuff bugged/to be nerfed which might put the ranger on its place without the need of revamping the class completely.
While there are bugs for the Ranger class, it’s utilities are too lackluster and the lack of…. a lot of things. So it’s not JUST bugs, it’s utilities and traits
Dungeon Master 8/8 | Fractal 50
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
I plan not to approach this very optimistically. I feel like it’s going to be lackluster.
Dungeon Master 8/8 | Fractal 50
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
-What sustained DPS? All other classes do this better than the ranger…
-AoE condition removal? You mean the healing skill that limits your movement if you want conditions removed, or the 60 second cool down signet?
-All classes can kite, and most don’t need to because their DPS doesn’t really warrant it
-Glass cannon Rangers have about the same damage as a class spec’ed into survivability/support with a bit of DPS
-Entangle is consistent but good in certain aspectsYour last quote goes for the ranger also, if you haven’t realized…
The same whine comparison can be said about many other classes by that reasoning, so let’s just play warrior/guardian since everything else is pretty much…you know…useless.
Funny thing though, Warriors and Guardians have things they’re BEST at, things that DEFINE the USEFULNESS of their class.
Dungeon Master 8/8 | Fractal 50
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
To name a few…decent sustained DPS, AoE condition removal, perma slow AoE kitting ability (14 seconds chill -66% skill recharge every 24 seconds) , decent survivality even when being glass cannon, entangle is awesome in PvE…what else do you want?
Sure some classes can do one of these things BETTER, but they can’t do all of them at the same time without kittening themselfs in one way or another.
-What sustained DPS? All other classes do this better than the ranger…
-AoE condition removal? You mean the healing skill that limits your movement if you want conditions removed, or the 60 second cool down signet?
-All classes can kite, and most don’t need to because their DPS doesn’t really warrant it
-Glass cannon Rangers have about the same damage as a class spec’ed into survivability/support with a bit of DPS
-Entangle is consistent but good in certain aspects
Your last quote goes for the ranger also, if you haven’t realized…
Dungeon Master 8/8 | Fractal 50
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
This game really doesn’t have an aggro table. Mobs will be on one target and then randomly switch.
Actually it does have an aggro table, but like the rest of the game; it’s inconsistent
Dungeon Master 8/8 | Fractal 50
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
HOLY NECRO Batman!
Dungeon Master 8/8 | Fractal 50
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
Rangers are good, period. That doesn’t change the fact that they need fixes more or less than every other class.
The real “delusion” will probably go away on 15th when the patch is released.
What aspects are they good in?
Dungeon Master 8/8 | Fractal 50
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
-Not viable in serious PvP
-As you said… sword
-Longbow to soften up? Shortbow does it better, other than the AoE cripple; which means you shouldn’t be running in melee anyway
-If it’s a dodging build, it really can’t be great offence, QZ “burst” isn’t enough
-Build is dependent on pets WORKING as INTENDED
Bad build overall, not really a competitor in PvP, WvW or dungeons
Dungeon Master 8/8 | Fractal 50
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
Sleepy still on in his delusion thinking that Rangers are good, let alone efficient compared to anything else.
Fun times
Dungeon Master 8/8 | Fractal 50
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
@Sleepy
Thieves bring much more to a dungeon than Rangers…
For example….? I can only think about stealth and getting a single mob from a pack sometimes.
Thief in dungeons is like ranger’s pets, in theory they are awesome, in reality…not so much.
It’s a matter of taste bringing a class over another one.
-Mass Stealth
-Smoke Screen
-Shadow Refuge
-Caltrops
-Blast Finishers
-Poison Fields
-Rapid Dazes
-Smoke Fields
Dungeon Master 8/8 | Fractal 50
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
All of them
/fifteenwords
Dungeon Master 8/8 | Fractal 50
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
@Sleepy
Thieves bring much more to a dungeon than Rangers…
I’d rather have a thief in my dungeon party than a ranger anytime
Dungeon Master 8/8 | Fractal 50
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
Power
/fiftenwordscap
Dungeon Master 8/8 | Fractal 50
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
axe warhorn / shortbow – weapon swap with the buff/hawk/aoe bleed and aoe sigil
How does this even remotely answer the OP?
In all seriousness OP, no it doesn’t. You will notice a change around 65+ish; that’s when your pet stops taking aggro from mobs, so more kiting involved, traps and conditions to slow them down
Dungeon Master 8/8 | Fractal 50
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
Depends on your build
Plus I also don’t recommend gearing your ranger until the Nov.15th patch
Dungeon Master 8/8 | Fractal 50
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
What ISN’T wrong with pets
But probably a listing error.
Dungeon Master 8/8 | Fractal 50
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
“Were you just faking it?”
Dungeon Master 8/8 | Fractal 50
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
Support roles play a HUGE role in dungeons. Damage mitigation and surviving is so important that a “Feedback” can really help your team.
I suggest running support, you don’t get much recognition, but I feel like it’s really rewarding
Dungeon Master 8/8 | Fractal 50
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
So you’re saying that the TEAM has to play for a each other? Yet you condone and think it’s okay for a warrior to play a glass cannon? Isn’t that double-standards? or something along the lines of that…
If you think that damage is not a vital aspect of team play I don’t really know what to tell you. It’s not unheard of for a glass cannon warrior to deal 50% of the damage in his group, it would only be sensible to try to keep him up as a team.
How would you know if a warrior deals 50% of the damage group if there’s no chart to distinguish that? And to play a team central around ONE glass cannon (especially one who’s using a selfish signet build) is absurd.
“Regardless of what build he runs” really hits the nail on the head of your ignorance. There’s obliviously traits/utilities/armor that provide a greater survive-ability , so that last sentence didn’t make much sense
Just because you can survive 2 more auto attacks doesn’t mean you are gonna be any less dead if you just sit there and tank them instead of playing actively, so that last sentence did make sense. Please, keep spewing your insults at me if you think it supports your arguments.
2-3 more auto attacks can make a huge difference in this game. The dungeons are all about mitigating damage, dodging, TEAM PLAY and survive-ability. It’s much more efficient to be up and doing some sort of damage than to be constantly on the ground needing a revive.
Dungeon Master 8/8 | Fractal 50
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
Can you be more specific? What dungeon foe has a one-shot ability that is spammed too much to be dodged?
Thank you.
Subject Alpha CoE
Also it’s amazing the amount of people who think 5 signet Warrior is an acceptable build in dungeons. Maybe they should stop doing the weaker dungeons and run the harder stuff… but I digress.
You think Subject Alpha is hard, and then you ask people to run the “harder stuff”.
I will just refrain from replying here as I would surely get an infraction >.<.
Sorry, perhaps I wasn’t clear enough— What I meant to say was we have enough dodges to avoid attacks that will annihilate you, as they don’t come very often and they have many tells. The problem lies in the constant damage you’re taking from auto attacks— this is very noticeable if you’re the only one who ever has aggro.
I see. But you are talking as if you are the only one in the group. Are you implying that no one in your group can provide;
Aegis?
Blind?
Regeneration?
Heals?If you still take too much damage then swap out of melee for a few seconds until you can get a heal off / lose aggro. This is why I am saying the SKILL matters a lot more than BUILD.
A bad warrior will die to auto attacks regardless of what builds he runs. A good warrior will play much more actively, and thus survive longer regardless of what build he runs.
No, I was merely answering your question about AoE spam. Please quote exactly when I said Subject Alpha is “harder stuff”.
So you’re saying that the TEAM has to play for a each other? Yet you condone and think it’s okay for a warrior to play a glass cannon? Isn’t that double-standards? or something along the lines of that…
“Regardless of what build he runs” really hits the nail on the head of your ignorance. There’s obliviously traits/utilities/armor that provide a greater survive-ability , so that last sentence didn’t make much sense
Dungeon Master 8/8 | Fractal 50
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
Have a warrior on the side
But I’d most likely quit due to incompetence and such.
Dungeon Master 8/8 | Fractal 50
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
Remake the guild?
I don’t know how you can screw up that royally
Dungeon Master 8/8 | Fractal 50
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
Can you be more specific? What dungeon foe has a one-shot ability that is spammed too much to be dodged?
Thank you.
Subject Alpha CoE
Also it’s amazing the amount of people who think 5 signet Warrior is an acceptable build in dungeons. Maybe they should stop doing the weaker dungeons and run the harder stuff… but I digress.
Dungeon Master 8/8 | Fractal 50
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
Quick Tip: Glass cannons usually get wrecked in this Dungeon.
Dungeon Master 8/8 | Fractal 50
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
Duelist Armor/Named Armor is you’re a humanoid
I personally love it
Dungeon Master 8/8 | Fractal 50
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
There is a Trinity in this game, it’s just less emphasized than other games.
When people stop buying full berserker’s and realize there’s more to this game than DPS DPS DPS, maybe we’d have less people complaining about dungeons, but i digress
Dungeon Master 8/8 | Fractal 50
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
`
We do have a stun breaker, it’s lighting reflex, slot skill. The 6 sec invulnerably is also a skill slot, 3 points I think. The group heal removes conditions.
And who expects their pet to be able to tank a Dungeon Boss, lol? 1st mmo?
Anyway, this could go on forever, and tbqh, I don’t care, was just trying to correct some stuff.
If you can’t do well with it, it’s not for you and you should move on. Every single class forum has many many threads like this, it’s starting to get like Rift, with all this ‘my class is the worst’ nonsense.
To be blunt it’s a bit sad, and I mean that with regard to every thread similar to this, stating ‘class X’ is broken and requires skill to play, did you all get to 80 and think ‘kitten! this class is crap! wtf have I been doing this last month?’, or….what? Anyway, I have no understanding of someone who would invest their time in something that hadn’t looked into to see if it was suitable for them, so I will lightning roll out and leave you to your disappointments.
The amount of ignorance and mediocrity you spew out is astounding
Dungeon Master 8/8 | Fractal 50
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
Dungeon Master 8/8 | Fractal 50
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
Why would you EVER main a longbow? Especially as a warrior?
Dungeon Master 8/8 | Fractal 50
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
Why should you care what people on the INTERNET think. Make your character however you want, whether that be based on you, or however else you want to design it.
RPG = Role Playing Game
Dungeon Master 8/8 | Fractal 50
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
- Get better gear
- Make sure you and your team know the strategy to beating him
- Communicate
- Change utilities and traits
Even though it may seem harsh, I’m trying to say “L2P” :/
Dungeon Master 8/8 | Fractal 50
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro
80Rng – 80Wa – 80Thief – 80Grd – 80Ele – 80Engi – 80Necro