Guild Wars 2

Selo.1250:

Reply to that has already been made kasama

Most of them are massive repetative grinds. Not grinds that takes 2 hours to complete 5 times , but grinds that takes 5 mins to complete, then you have to do it over and over and over 200 times.

The others are just “forced” out by fanboys to try and look like theres things to do.

You are not forced to do anything that you don’t want to. If you feel like something is a grind, then you have the power to change batman! Just don’t do it! Join a Worlds PvP fight, or do anything ells in between farming for gear.

There is nothing forced, this is just our experience with the game. I could also turn that argument around and say “other negative points are just forced out by haters who try to turn the game into another WoW clone”. The point of a forum is to share experiences, and give advice.

“Immerse Yourself In The World, Talk To NPCs” ONLY roleplayers would do that.

Roleplayers are people who create their own stories within a game. The story and the world itself, is meant to be enjoyed by everyone who plays. Immersion is a huge part of any game, whether it’s a FPS or an RPG. The world around you is what makes the game experience, so therefor you should get involved in it. If not, then what do you have left? Clicking buttons and doing chores?

They all pretty much say the same thing.

“Find/Buy All Your Favorite Looking Gear With Gold And Karma” Most already have. Grinding for more gold/karma/tokens to get a set with worse stats and worse looks..doubt to many are a fan of that.

Many of them are the same thing, just using different words. And many of us dislike playing alts, we want to progress with out mains.

I didnt expect there to be raids at the end, but many of uxpected something ele to be there instead. BUt its just like any other mmo without the raiding and only keeping the tedious “pre gearing” boring grind dungeons from those games.
Its like it has 50% less things to do at endgame then any other mmo, and most of it are meaningless to do becouse other then looks, you cant use it for anything.

I can’t tell you want you should, or shouldn’t, like. I can only tell you wants possible to do within the game. If you don’t like what you are offered, then maybe the game just isn’t for you? If that’s the case, then just treat it as a single player game. You got an experience out of it that was pretty fun, and now you are free to move on to the next game.

Here’s a checklist for you.

PvE:
Immerse Yourself In The World, Talk To NPCs
Complete Your Personal Story
Unlock All Skills And Test Different Builds
Get 100% World Completion
Find/Buy All Your Favorite Looking Gear With Gold And Karma
Complete All The Jumping Puzzles
Participate In Optional Events Like Keg Brawl
Max All Crafting Disciplines
Discover Hidden Recipes
Discover Mystic Forge Recipes
Craft A Legendary Weapon
Get Dungeon Armor
Complete All Dungeon Modes, In all Dungeons
Join A Guild
Create A Guild With Only One Type Of Profession
Help Your Guild Earn Influence
Make An Alt Profession And Race
Get Rich, Or Dye Trying (pun intended)

Worlds PvP:
Immerse Yourself In The World
Get 100% Map Completion
Level An Alt To 80 By Only Playing Worlds PvP
Join A Guild And Claim Captured Objectives
Help Your Guild Earn Influence For ‘Art of War’ Upgrades

Structured PvP:
Make Creative Builds, With Different Professions
Get Max Rank
Join A sPvP Guild
Play Tournament sPvP
Get All Your Favorite Looking Gear
Discover Mystic Forge sPvP Recipes

What You Shouldn’t Do:
Play The Game For 10 Hours Every Day (except if you work for ArenaNet :P)
Complete Only One Type Of Content At A Time (<— this is you grinding. Now stop it)
Rush Trough The Game (a game is meant to entertain you, not waste your time, so enjoy it! That’s an order)
Expect A Completely Different Gaming Experience At Level 80 (if you didn’t like the game up to level 80, you most likely won’t like it after)
Only Do Content For The Rewards (again, games are meant for your entertainment. If you want to gamble, then poker is an excellent game)
Expect Other Players To Need You (there is no holy trinity in this game, so no one is forced to talk to anyone that they don’t want to. It’s just like in the real world!)
Compare Guild Wars 2 Content, With WoW Content (Guild Wars 2 is one month old, WoW is seven years old)
Try To Force Yourself To Love The Game (maybe the game just isn’t for you?)

You forgot:

5. Take into consideration that this game just might not be for you, personally. ArenaNet said it best themselves; “If you love MMOs, you want to check out Guild Wars 2. And if you hate MMOs, you really want to check out Guild Wars 2”. Basically, Guild Wars 2 was primarily made for people that really don’t like MMOs. So if you love the original MMO structure, as seen in WoW, SWTOR, or Rift, then that’s probably why you don’t like Guild Wars 2. Which is perfectly fine. What isn’t fine, however, is coming in here and complaining that the game should change, because it’s not what you are use to from other MMOs. There is not going to be raids, or a gear treadmill. This is a game that’s trying to introduce something new to the genre.

I enjoy them. I think people are generally having too high expectations with them, and don’t consider that each dungeon has a story mode, and three exploration modes. And that each of these four modes have at least three bosses in them. So that’s over 90 different boss fights ArenaNet had to make, on top of everything ells there is to do in the game (that still doesn’t have a subscription fee). But many players forget this, and just demands more.

Seems you’re missing the point… and you aren’t willing to look at GW2 subjectively.. as you’d rather blindly defend their choices..
IE: Say that it’s “all in my head” ~
While personally, this isn’t a bad thing.. (you enjoy how it is) at the same time, it’s not constructive nor is it beneficial to helping GW2 evolve over the next few years.
IE: If it ain’t broke, don’t fix it ~ mentality.

I have no reason to look at it subjectively, I see the game for what it is to me. Just because my point of view is different from yours, it doesn’t mean that I’m wrong. It just means we’ve had different experiences. What I’m saying to you is simply; before complaining that the game should force you to do something specific, make the effort to change it yourself first. I.e. if you think that zergs are boring, then stop being a part of them.

Saying that my point of view isn’t constructive is saying that I have no point of view, which is obviously wrong. I’m sure ArenaNet can see that both our points are equally valuable. There is no right or wrong here.

AlexanderFaust.4518:

-snip-

The rewards don’t fit with the challenge, because the focus of the game is not the rewards, but the challenge. Do you expect to get a price after you read a book, as well? No, of curse not, because reading the book is the reward itself. And likewise, playing the game is the true reward, the rewards you get for completing a task is a bonus. The problem is your mentality towards the game, because in other games you are use to getting a biscuit, every time you preform a trick. You should look at it from a perspective and ask yourself; why are you playing a game, if you are only enjoying it for the rewards you get?

It might be that you aren’t suggesting that Guild Wars 2 needs a holy trinity system, but that is still what you expect from it. So the solution is, quite obviously, that you need to change your approach towards the game. If you think that “zergs” kill mobs too easily, then stop being part of one! Gather a group of three to five players, and head of in a different direction. PvE, and Worlds PvP, has never been about skill, but about exploring the world and playing with your friends. That’s why these modes are balanced loosely. If you want to test your skills, then try out Structured PvP instead. It requires much more attention to detail.

I’ve played in dungeons five times now, and I’ve never had any problem finding a group of people. I just run up to the dungeon and asks if anyone has a spare spot. It doesn’t take more then a few minutes (sometimes seconds) before I get a party invite. I’m not sure what you are doing different? Further more, every party I’ve been in has had some great people who were easy to talk to, and to plan tactics with. Everyone would listen to each other, and ask if everyone was ready before proceeding to fight a boss. And everyone were prepared to do what needed to be done, in order to proceed. Including sacrificing yourself in order to revive someone, and changing skills and/or playstyle in order to best take down a boss.

The connection you are making is all in your head. You are just making assumptions based an a bad experience with the game. I don’t recognize the problems you are mentioning. The players I’ve talked to. and played with, have all be prepared to do what was needed to be done, in order to get the most out of the game. I have yet to met any lazy players, who existed on taking the easy way out. And if I do, I won’t be around them for very long.

Grind is all in the hands of the player. The only time a game can force you to grind, is if it doesn’t introduce any other options of playing. In Guild Wars 2, you don’t have to play a dungeon thirty times in a row, you can choose do other things in between. You also have to eat food everyday, but that doesn’t mean you should to eat the same food each time. That would become boring for anyone. Instead, you can choose to eat pizza on monday, and lasagna on tuesday, which is arguably a lot more “fun”. And that mentality is the same in a game. If you can choose not to grind, then why do it?

But what the white knights/fans don’t seem to account for::
1. World Events, Bosses, Dungeons have No risk / Reward loot.
2. Stale (Spamfest/zerg) combat, trivializes encounters, events and even dungeons to some extent.
3. Can’t ever put together a group or find people to actually have “fun” in the world, anyways =/

I’m sorry that you feel this way, but all of these points are personal problems, not problems with the game.

1. If you want risk, then take risks. Everyone can stand at max range and just spam one button in any game, and then claim there’s a minimal risk. If you are making the game boring, you can’t really blame the game for that. You could also choose run around and revive people, or play melee and get up in the bosses face. The game has, and never will be, about rewards. The game is build for people who enjoy the gameplay first, and then consider rewards as a bonus. Computer games are not a gamble, they are meant for entertainment in the same way a book is.

2. The majority of MMOs are about dealing damage, but just like point 1, it doesn’t have to be only about that. It’s a bit ironic that you have a choice to play any role with any profession in Guild Wars 2, yet you make a choice to only play a damage dealer, the role that requires the least risk. Why not make a different choice? Instead if spamming the door until it goes down in Worlds PvP, you could run around all over the map and take Mercenary and Supply Camps instead. A task that revolves a lot more risk.

3. Have you tried having a conversation with people first, and actually get to know them? If a random guy comes up and say “do you want to do a group event”, no one is going to react, because thanks to the removal of the holy trinity, they aren’t forced to anymore. So just like in the real world, you have to actually make friends with other players. Then when you ask if they want to join you, they’ll know you are a great person, and will want to play with you for that reason.

A Thief can hold the attention of opponents just as well. When playing a Thief, I’ve gotten into plenty of 1v2 fights, and sometimes 1v3 fights, where my opponents existed on chasing me around all over the map, because they were convinced that I was an easy kill. At times this meant that I could get them of the objective, when they were trying to catch me, and then go into stealth and double back to take the objective again.

Both skills are fine by design, they just last way too long. Compared to other skills, they should both be reduced to lasting 6 or 7 seconds. No other skill in the game can control the opponent for as long as Moa Morph does, and the longest quickness skill other then Time Warp is 5 seconds. Their duration now is equivalent to Mass Invisibility lasting 8 seconds.

I would suggest using birds instead, since they have the same precision as felines, but more vitality and also swiftness on top. I would also go with Shared Anguish (control effects are transfered to your pet) for some control protection, as control skills are used a lot in Worlds PvP. And use Compassion Training (pets heal for more) to make Carnivorous Appetite even better. This should make your birds nearly impossible to kill.

Other then that it seems like a fun build =)

Saxo.3106:

So its normal for people on your own team to stand and watch as the enemy kill you? I’m not sure I understand what you mean? Or maybe you didn’t read the first post as to why I have a problem with what just happened?

If of course you did read it and it is normal for that to happen I appologise and agree it is very different from WvW and will certainly keep away.

Are you just trolling? No, of curse it’s not normal. The point of sPvP is not to farm glory.

In one word; money. The publisher is worried that if the game is in development for too long, it won’t sell as many copies, and then they’ll lose investors.

Saxo.3106:

So its not somewhere to go to actually have fun and is just used as a place to farm basicly? Ok thanks for the warning, back to WvW I go.

I think you should try to actually play a few games before judging it. sPvP is a completely different game from Worlds PvP. Glory is just a nice bonus reward.

Sangi.5238:

So much of an “ultimate”, crap useless skill.

Why do everyone has awesome ultimates but we get kitten.

Spirit of Nature = Support
Rampage As One = Damage
Entangle = Control

What ells do you need?

What’s the point of having 50 skills on your skill bar, when you are only using a fraction of them? Because it looks pretty? Guild Wars 2 gives you want you need, nothing more.

1. There is not going to be a gear treadmill. It’s one of the key ideas of the game; everyone plays at an equal level, so the gameplay becomes more about skill the item grinding.

2. Not sure what you mean by the overworld? But grouping is not something you are forced to do in Guild Wars 2, but something you do because it adds to the experience. Just like in the real world, if you want to have fun with other people, you need to talk with them first. Hang around other players, talk in chat, and ask people you find fun if you can join their guild.

Sounds like he destroyed the roots after going into stealth. You should have stacked more control (or AoE) skills on him. For instance; use Entangle, then use a pet like the snow leopard to add chill, or put down a trap at your location. The point of the skill is to escape when you are being attacked by multiple foes, to get some breathing room so you can heal and get some distance, or to simply deal AoE damage.

1. Warrior
2. Guardian
3. Ranger

This doesn’t mean that they are less fun to play, though.

Lithos.9560:

Well, with my experience with the ranger I have learned that the pet isn’t really that useful, and they die ALL THE TIME. Do you guys think the rangers pets are really that good?…

The pet is only as useful as you make it. The pet was weak at first for me, but after I added only 5 trait points in Beastmastery, I could feel that it had more survivability. At level 72, with 20 points in Beastmastery, my owl pet deals more damage then me (I don’t have the best gear) and almost has as much survivability as I do. It’s like playing two against one in PvE. But it’s also important to understand that there’s a learning curve to managing the pet, if you want to get the most out of it. Things like remembering to heal it, picking the right pet for the right situation (especially in dungeons), using the F2 skills frequently, and knowing the limits of what the pet can survive. But you can also choose to leave the pet alone, and just use it for it’s damage bonus, just like a Guardian can choose to not give away his virtues.

In PvE and Worlds PvP, the Ranger is the best profession mainly thanks to the pet. In PvE, the ranger can send the pet to attack one mob, while he attacks another. In dungeons, the pet can work as a tank, while the Ranger is dps/healer. In Worlds PvP, the Ranger has great range skills, and can send the pet to attack past the enemy lines. The Ranger also has some great movement and evade skills on top of that. And some great support skills between the pet and himself, mainly mentioning Healing Spring, Spirit of Nature, utility spirits (although they need a buff), and various pet skills like remove a condition, regeneration, swiftness, and interrupt skills.

In sPvP, the Mesmer is the best thanks to clones and stealth. The clones makes the Mesmer able to escape even the most harry situations, and also makes the Mesmer an extremely powerful 1v1 profession. So much so, that I’ve had many players simply choosing to run away, rather then engaging in a 1v1 fight with me. In group fights the Mesmer can easily remove conditions from allies, and add them to foes, while using clones and phantasms to give a damage advantage to the group. The Mesmer is also fantastic at giving out stealth to allies, and they also have the longest stealth skill from the elite Mass Invisibility (5 seconds). With five stealth skills, the Mesmer also only has one stealth skill less then the Thief (not counting steal).

If you really have to ask, you should move on and play something ells, until a Guild Wars 2 expansion comes out. Then play that expansion until you get to the new max level, at which point you will surely have gained all the new rewards, and you’ll have nothing to play for once again. Then quit the game until the second expansion comes out.

Or you could do what a lot of others in this thread does; hang around the forums and complain about a game, that you obviously have no interest in playing anymore.

I love that she thinks her coloring is “not her forte”, when the coloring on Eir Swimming is absolutely gorgeous!

I had an idea about making two elder dragons fight each other. Imagine what a spectacle that would be to see. It could even be attached to your personal story, as a quest where you have to make two elder dragons fight each other, in order to kill them both. The first elder dragon would obviously die from the other one killing it, but the survivor would then be weak enough for the players to kill it. I think that could be a really interesting story.

It’s in the Eternal Battlegrounds, around the top of Umberglade Woods, next to the rocks. It’s the only place I’ve ever seen it.

The Thief “needs” the movement speed because he only has 10k base health, while the Ranger and Engineer has 15k. The Thief is the skirmishing profession. No one has as many movement skills as the Thief. But the Ranger does have more movement (and evade) skills then the Engineer, we just have to work a little harder for it.

Swiftness:
Warhorn
Shortbow
Rampage As One (With a 120 second cooldown, this is viable to use in Worlds PvP)
Storm Spirit (With the “spirits can move and follow you” major trait)
Tail Wind (A minor trait that gives you swiftness on weapon swap, when in combat. But getting in combat is easy enough; just send your pet to attack a nearby mob)
Birds (Aim at a target that’s a great distance from you, and then call the pet back as soon as it gives you swiftness, if you don’t want to agro the mob. Use the major trait Concentration Training to make the swiftness last 15 seconds instead of 10. Practice makes perfect)

Other:
Signet of the Hunt (10% increased movement speed is great)
Shortbow (Use the ‘turn 180’ key to make the jump move you forward, instead of back)
Greatsword (Swoop makes you leap forward. This skill will actually move you forward faster then the warhorn, because of the short cooldown)

This is pretty much how I feel about the game, as well. I’m overwhelmed by all the things there is to explore and learn. In the beta I had planed to level one main to 80 and then play sPvP a lot. But so far the PvE content has taken all my time in the game, because there are so many things to see beyond the beaten path. A lot of times when I try to go from one place to the next, I get distracted by a dynamic event, or an area that just literally looks interesting, which then leads me to something ells. I wasn’t even planing to craft, but after trying out that, it was a ton of fun as well. I’m level 72 right now, and I barely feel like I’ve scratched the surface of the PvE content.

No, not at all. I play games with the same approach as someone that reads a novel. I enjoy it for the fun and experience. More games are casual these days because a much broader audience plays. Games aren’t just for “geeks” anymore, but for everyone who wants to be entertained. The bonus of this is that it’s much easier to play a game today, without feeling like your life has to evolve around it.

I’ve survived encounters, both in PvP and PvE, with only around 50-150 vitality left. Everything can make a difference.

I’m adding in the fact that I have never noticed any of my drake pets perform the Tail Swipe ability on land or water. If it has actually happened it’s occurence is so rare that it might as well not be listed.

I have also noticed this after playing for a while with the River Drake. But when I think about it, I don’t think I’ve once seen this skill being used by any of the drakes.

The overall damage output of the greatsword could use a little buff, but other then that it’s fine. It has an evade skill, the best traveling skill of the Ranger, a block skill with a knockdown, and an interrupt skill. It’s far from being the Rangers weakest weapon.

Durzlla.6295:

There’s a trait that improves your pets health? Or do you mean 30pts in BM and/or masters bond?

And I forgot about signet I stone… That is a very sexy signet…

There are a lot of traits that increases the pets survivability.

• Marksmanship: Signets recharge 20% faster (for Signet of Stone)
• Skirmishing: Pets gain health on critical hits
• Wilderness Survival: You and your pet gains 2 seconds of protection when you dodge roll – You and your pet take 30% less damage when under 25% health
• Nature Magic: Any boon you get is shared with your pet – Regeneration you apply lasts 33% longer
• Beastmastery: Pet swapping recharges 20% faster – Pets recharge their skills 10% faster (some pets has a healing skill) – Increase the pets attributes on each kill – Pets heal for more – Pets F2 skill recharge faster (good for the Brown Bear and Fern Hound) – Pets have natural health regeneration

I disagree. I always use Spirit of Nature in dungeons, as it literally can be a lifesaver. And next to that I often use one utility spirit. Using more then one utility spirit when you aren’t traited for it, is a waste of utility slots, in my opinion.

The thing with spirits is, you can’t just place a them down like a Warrior can do with his banners, you have to be aware of your surroundings, and also when you decide to summon them. They aren’t going to work for every encounter either, and you can’t just run into a boss fight and immediately cast your spirits. That will kill them. Instead, you have to let the fight run for a bit, until you learn to read the bosses attack pattern. Then you can decide whether or not you want to place down a spirit. The timing of this also largely depends on the spirit you are using, as they each have different uses. I usually use the Frost Spirit if there’s a lot of ranged players, the Stone Spirit if there’s a lot of melee players, the Storm Spirit if we are fighting a ranged boss where we need more movement speed, and alternatively the Sun Spirit if there are a lot of condition damage based players in my party.

If you can see an opportunity to place a spirit, then you just have to pick the right time to place it. A wrong time would be when a boss or mobs are chasing you, because bosses and mobs will primarily target spirits over you, and kill them with two or three hits. Instead you have to place your spirits at a time where the boss is focusing on your allies, and when you can see they need some extra support. Placing the spirits down at a later point of the fight, should make the spirit survive for a long time, since the boss will be more interested in killing the players then a spirit at that point. You should then place the spirit close enough that your allies will get the boon, but not so close that the spirit becomes a target itself. Also place the spirit behind your allies, so the boss has to go trough them first to get to the spirit. If you are using a spirit to buff ranged allies, then place the spirit in front of them, so if the boss moves away, they can move with the boss, without moving too far away from the spirit. Think of it as a tennis court, with the net in the middle being the spirit, and the players at each end being your allies.

Just for the record: Having said all of this, I still believe that the spirits needs a vitality/toughness buff, as they die too fast. If you’re playing with a Warrior in your party who is using banners, your spirit will quickly feel redundant.

You could also; use a ranged damage pet (devourer or spider), force your opponent away from the AoE so the pet follows, interrupt your opponent when you can see he’s about to cast a spell, let the pet die and switch to your secondary, put the pet on passive and temporally use it to buff yourself, use the brown bears F2 skill which removes a condition, use the active ability of Signet of Stone to make your pet invulnerable for 6 seconds, or use traits that improves the pets health.

We just don’t want players to grind in Guild Wars 2. No one enjoys that. No one finds it fun. We want to change the way that people view combat.
This is a part which has been subject to a lot of debating. Some people say there shouldn’t be any grind, while others say the grind is entirely optional. Yet, we have this statement from ArenaNet which says they don’t want players to grind. To my understanding (and I’m not claiming my understanding can’t be erroneous), that means there shouldn’t be any grinds at all. However, there are:

Grinding is optional, this is not something you can debate about. The definition of grinding is a player doing the same thing over and over again, without doing anything ells. So grinding is largely determined by how the player chooses to play. Meaning that forced grinding from a game design perspective, can only happen if a player has no other valuable choice then to grind. And this is why Guild Wars 2 has no grinding, because you always have a choice to do something ells. Sure you can play the same dungeon over and over again, until you can get enough tokens to buy the reward you want, but the game is not forcing you to so at any point. You are the one choosing to grind. Instead, you could choose play a dungeon twice, then go play some Worlds PvP, then help a friend level up his character, do a bit of crafting, level up an alt profession, and then maybe do another dungeon run.

Simply put: The game has no grind, because you have a choice of content.

You affect things around you in a very permanent way.
Your completion of a dynamic event has a temporary effect, up until the event or the servers reset. Furthermore, we have seen how the cleansing of Orr doesn’t have any noticeable effect outside the instance. This was impossible to do and was probably an exaggeration on their behalf.

We have still not seen any world changing dynamic events yet, because they have not been implemented. ArenaNet has promised dynamic events that are so big they change the look of a whole area of the map. But so far, they have been too busy fixing various bugs. And if there are still bugs to fix, it’s not very smart to add new content on top of that.

Cause and effect: A single decision made by a player cascades out in a chain of events.
Again, untrue. The only choice a player can make concerning certain events is whether to start them or not. There aren’t choices like the ones in the personal story, where you can pick what quest to do, at least none that I have experienced while doing 100% completion.

Dynamic events work like a pendulum. If players are making the choice to act, the pendulum will swing in one direction (this is where a town is saved). But if no player decides to act, the pendulum will swing in the opposite direction (this is were the town will get taken over, and the mobs will attack the next town). So it is the players choice that affects which way the pendulum swings. Events will start regardless of what the players does.

You can also do AoE heal with the greatsword and sword leap skills. One of my favorite combos. Or get a fire aura by using leap on the torch Bonfire skill. Sometimes my bird will also get the fire aura, as the bird skill Swoop is a leap as well.

Most of the hollow complains bears down to: “I face rolled this profession and it doesn’t play as I want it to, so therefor it sucks”. If people would just take their time to look for a solution in their build first, or ask advise from other players, we could save ourselves a lot of reading here. But it’s much easier to complain about something, then it is to try and find a solution yourself. Or to except that what you’re complaining about is actually a flaw done on purpose, in order to balance your profession.

Edit: Just for the record; The Guardian has two skills on the scepter, one skill on the torch, and three skills on the staff, that each has a range of 1200, which is the same range that a longbow has. So please stop saying the Guardian doesn’t have any range skills.

My current pet names are Captain Claw for my owl (I wish it was a parrot though), and Lazer Drake for my river drake.

thedudebro.7341:

Like I said, they already have medium armor, HP, and pretty darn good utility skills plus a pet. The pet should not act as a damage cushion against ranged attacks. Chill, Knockback, effects will only work on pets that attack in melee. What will that do against pets that just sit at range and attack like spiders and devourers?

This problem is not completely isolated to one class. Mesmer is another class that has this advantage as well.

All I can say is that I haven’t had a problem with this (and I’m not using piercing), since I’m always moving around and the pet is also moving around with my opponent. But I think it’s strange that you think this is an issue, when you say you can kill Rangers without any problem. A problem that only exists in theory, is not a problem at all.

aPutridCorpse.8792:

Personally I don’t find pets to be a pain to manage, thus far I’m level 32 and have solo’d the better part of it. I can’t comment on dungeon content yet though…I plan to stay out of them until my pet can figure out how to stand next to me rather then moving ahead 20 feet and pulling mobs.

Stow the pet when you are moving around in dungeons. Then spawn it back again when attacking. I have played in four different dungeons so far (both story and explosion mode) and I have only experienced one time where my pet accidentally agroed a group of mobs. But we killed them pretty quickly so it wasn’t really a problem at all. So I don’t think your pet should hold you back from playing dungeons.

Mongo.2490:

I’ve played engineer and mesmer to 20, the others to around 15. I’ve also done a bit of sPvP with them. I just really want to find a profession I can enjoy so I can play with my friends. It does sound like there’s more emphasis on pets than I’d like. Also took a look at the trait tree, seems like you really can’t get around the fact that it’s a pet class. Kinda what I expected.

That’s good. I get it though, I’m a bit of a perfectionist too. Yes, the Ranger is a pet class, as a large part of our damage comes from the pet. But it’s important to remember that you don’t have to look after the pet, unless you choose to. If you don’t like the pet, and don’t want to trait into Beastmastery, you can just leave the pet alone. The only thing you need to do is keep one pet alive because, as mentioned, a large pert of your damage relies on your pet. So if you don’t like the pet, then pet switching is the only micromanaging you need to do.

It sounds to me like you didn’t play the other professions enough. First impressions are nice, but they aren’t worth that much when determining how a profession plays at max level. You can’t predict what you are going to dislike, unless you try it first. And it’s very hard to get a feel for a profession if you only test the weapon skills. I suggest you make a build for each profession in sPvP and then play are few matches until they feel comfortable to play. Or you can play each profession you think you could like, to at least level 15 in PvE. -If you haven’t already done this. After that you should have a good insight on how each profession can play. When testing professions in betas, I mixed these two things up a bit. Some professions I played until level 12-15, others I just tested in sPvP. But it’s also important to remember that you have five character slots, so you shouldn’t feel like you only have to play one profession. You only need to be level 2 to play sPvP and Worlds PvP after all.

1. It depends on what you mean by micromanaging. I often tell my pet to attack, and use the pet skill of curse, but I very rarely need to do anything ells then that. Sometimes I do use my heal skill to only heal my pet, even though I could just let the pet die, and then switch it out. But I prefer to have my primary pet out as long as possible. When playing dungeons I also call the pet back (with F3), whenever I see a boss do a damaging AoE attack, and then send it back to attack again. That’s all the micromanaging I do.

2. They are a bit at first, but after I put 5 trait points in Beastmastery I could feel that my pet would survive a little longer (a good example of why you need to play to around level 15 in PvE). I have 20 points in Beastmastery now, so my pet only dies when it gets ganged by a lot of mobs, when a boss hits it too hard, or when I forget to heal it. But I guess it depends on how much you want to deal with the pet. You could just leave it to attack on its own, and only use pet switching when the pets die. It’s up to you.

3. I think it is, but ranged combat is generally just easier in this game. I use a greatsword for traveling mostly (with Swoop), and for the interrupt and block skills. My primary damage comes from my longbow. I do sometimes use the greatsword as a primary when playing PvE, though, as it’s just a really fun weapon.

I never played Guild Wars 1, but I really like the pet control in Guild Wars 2. For instance, when I can see a boss is about to cast a damaging attack, I can instantly call the pet back to me with F3, and then send in back in after the boss has attacked, with F1.

I would love to have some sort of utility skill set that is meant to improve the Ranger as a marksman. Like a skill that says “15 sec. Improve the range of your ranged attacks by 500”. Or “5 sec. Attacks that hit at 900 range or more has a 100% critical chance”.

The pet is meant to block projectiles so you are forced to deal with it, as the pet is a big part of the Ranger. If you could shot through the pet, everyone would just ignore it, and get dealt a lot of damage in return. But it’s not really a problem at all, if you just use control skills like chill or knockback to get rid of the pet, and you remember to always move. Also; AoE attacks.

The Ranger has some great weapons. The problem is that everyone only want to use the absolute best damaging weapons, and don’t really care about other uses that weapons can have. The greatsword is a good example of this. It has the Rangers best traveling skill (Swoop) and also has an interrupt skill and a block. These are some amazing qualities for a second hand weapon, even if the damage is a little on the low side.

Ravel.8145:

-snip-

I have played all the professions. I never said there wasn’t a difference, just that the difference in weapon skills aren’t as huge as you make it sound. Take greatsword as an example. The Rangers greatsword has an evade effect, the Warriors greatsword has a fury (burst) boon, the Mesmers greatsword has a might boon, and the Guardians greatsword has a might and a blind boon. So only the Guardian gets one more boon then the rest. Next to that comes to profession related skills. The Ranger greatsword has a skill that gives 50% more damage to the pet, the Warriors greatsword just adds passive adrenaline, the Mesmers greatsword has a clone and a phatasm skill, and the Guardian has a symbol skill that gives retaliation. Again, only one of the professions gets one more skill effect. Besides that, all the other greatsword skills affect the enemy, just like the Rangers greatsword skills. It’s the same with the longbow. Both the Rangers and Warriors longbow skills has no boons. The Warriors skills also just 1 – “shot”, 2 – “shot three flaming arrows”, 3 – “shot an exploding arrow”, 4 – “shot another exploding arrow”, 5 – “immobilize a foe”. And the shortbow skills are pretty much the same for the Ranger and the Thief as well. They both have bleed, poison, cripple, and an evasion skill. The only difference between weapons are the skill effects that are related to each professions specific playstyle. Other then that, weapon skills are pretty much the same. So no, I don’t see how you can think other professions weapon skills are so much different from the Rangers. It reads like you’re saying that you like the Ranger, but you wish it had skills like an Elementalist. But what you’re describing as uninteresting is not a fault with the Ranger, but with your view of it. I don’t feel like it’s uninteresting, and neither does a lot of other players.

It’s pretty easy to categorize professions in Guild Wars 2, even though there is no holy trinity anymore. Each profession still does one thing better then another, which is rather easy to see simply by looking at each professions skills. The Ranger is primarily a damage dealer because, like the Warrior and the Thief, there is more of an opotunity to be one. Or said in a different way; it’s easier to make a Ranger damage dealer build, then a Ranger support build. That’s not to say it’s all you can do, though, just that it’s the most obvious playstyle, since most of the Rangers skills are build around improving damage, or improve positioning so you can deal damage more easily. Just make a list, and it becomes obvious. Skills that are related to damage: two shout skills, two signet skills, three spirit skills, all four survival skills, all four traps, and two elite skills. Skills that aren’t related to damage: two shout skills, two signet skills, one spirit skill, and one elite skill. That pretty much primarily makes the Ranger a damage dealer.

Ravel.8145:

Maybe I burst a bubble here, but:
- You got to actually land the chill to be able to benefit from it.
- It takes forever for the murellow to cast his poison field, he can’t move while doing it and you actually got to be able to stand correctly to benefit from the field. No easy tasks during a team fight.
- By now, somewhat decent players have learned not to judge the damage of the pet by its size. And will kill birds just as easily as other pets.
I could go on. It’s not about “omg, all pet abilites are bad!”. It’s about “Pets are freaking unreliable, but we desperatly need them, because they define our class, yet they are clumsy and miss as often as they hit with their abilites.”

Not at all, you are just giving up before even trying:
- You land the chill by comboing it with your own control skills. For instance, you use the longbow knockback skill, or a trap, and then you use the pets chill skill.
- Knowing your surroundings and knowing how to positioning yourself, is a part of the learning curve of Guild Wars 2 combat. You can’t blame the pet because you don’t know how to position youself for the skill. It’s you that controls the skill, after all.
- One thing is seeing a bird fly around on it’s own, another thing is being mindful of the bird while you’re fighting another player. A bear gets in your way of hitting a Ranger, a bird just flies around you. Obviously the bird is going to seem as less of a threat.

I think you misunderstood me there. I wasn’t asking for the guardian or mesmer skills or those of any other profession really. What I was getting at is that our spells are way too onesided and straightforwarded in comparison, since most of the time, they do not affect us at all, but only the enemy. Mesmer and Guardian were only used for an example. I just would like to have more depth added to our spells, similar to how other classes spells work.

I am not forgetting the pet, in fact, I rolled this class because of the pet. But, not talking about pve here, since in pve, the ranger is frakking kitten, in pvp, the pet is still to unreliable. There are a lot of situations where the F2-skill still doesn’t work. Often, the casting delay is horribly long. They are slow, even when traited, and their AI is easily fooled by every semi-decent player. Also, giving my pet swiftness with my longbow just isn’t really that much fun. If I actually had control over more of my pets skills, I would totally agree with you that the pet makes up for the boring weapon skills, but this is hardly the case.

I think you have misunderstood the Ranger. When playing a Ranger you are going to largely be a damage dealer, that’s what the Ranger is primarily build to be, just like the Guardian is primarily build to be a support profession. The majority of other professions weapon skills only has one skill that effect themselves too. I don’t know where you see all these fantastic weapon skills that are so amazingly different from the Rangers. The depth of the Ranger primarily comes from the pet.

Yes, the pet AI is still not perfect. There are still times that the F2 skill needs to be pressed twice before activating, and the channel time on some of the pet skills are horribly long. But a lot of it you can play around. The Owl or Snow Leopard give chill that slows your opponents movement, meaning your pet then has a higher chance of hitting. Other pets like the Murellow casts an AoE effect on the ground that you can shoot trough to get bonus damage. There is also the Jaguar who has stealth, so your opponents can’t see it attacking. Or birds pets that are smaller, meaning that opponents often choose to ignore it, because it seems less dangerous. Increased movement speed helps to make the pet hit more often, while Frost Trap, Spike Trap, Muddy Terrain, and Entangle helps to slow your opponent down.

Don’t worry, I still love the ranger! I still think the concept is great and I love the playstyle. But I just think a lot of things aren’t really were they should be right now and that some basics should be improved.

Does only work within 900 range.
If your pet hits before you, your own opening strike is gone.
Can be avoided in numerous ways.
It’s still boring, considering EVERY minor trait in Marksmanship is about opening strike.

It really doesn’t sound like you like the playstyle at all. Some of the posts in this topic (not just yours) makes it sound as if the Ranger is largely bad, when it really only needs some tweaks. The profession is completely viable, it’s just not the most reliable profession right now. But it’s a pet class, so that is to be expected. I have faith that the Ranger will be improved over time, though.

The 900 range limit and losing your Opening Strike when your pet hits first, both sound like bugs to me. All skills can be avoided in a number of ways. Every profession has its own made up “opening strike” that players use to get a headstart on the opponent. Opening Strike on the Ranger just allows you to have two opening strikes. For instance, if you play with a longbow, you can start by using a 1 skill to get the Opening Strike trait effect, and if your opponent blocks that, you still have Hunter’s Shot that can add the vulnerability anyway. So you have a double chance to get the vulnerability on your opponent. I don’t think it’s boring to get more vulnerability, it’s one of my favorite conditions, and critical hits are always fun. Besides, even when spending 30 trait points in Marksmanship, you still have your major traits and 40 points left to make the most out of the Opening Strike bonuses. Even an Adept major trait like Steady Focus (increase your damage by 10% as long as your endurance is full) will make the vulnerability from Opening Strike better. Or how about Spotter that increases precision of nearby allies by 70.

Tigger.8035:

Guardians are far from the “support” profession. That’s engineers job. Guardian is tanky DPS

I meant support as in giving protective boons and healing, which the Guardian does better then any other profession. Virtues, symbols, shouts all does this. The Guardian is like an opposite to the Warrior. The Warrior loves damage boons, the Guardian loves protective boons. That’s not to say that the Warrior can give protective boons, or vice versa, just that it’s what they each have an easy time doing. The Engineer is more on pair with the Mesmer, in that they both can create a lot of confusion and mayhem.

Tigger.8035:

Engineers have more support options than Guardian (3 water combo fields, 2 on 1 weapon with a regenerating mist, a support kit, Toss elixirs, etc, etc, the list goes on and on).

That is nothing to the Guardians virtues, all the consecration skills, all the shout skills, two elite skills, two of the signet skills, two meditation skills, and so on. Even one of the Guardians downed skills is a healing skill. The only time the Guardian really becomes at tank, is when you play it solo.

(had to split this reply in two because of the annoying forum border restriction)

Ravel.8145:

Utilities are also quite lame. Most of the pet shouts are either buggy or just not worth it, because pets still act to unreliable. And die too quickly. Why the frakk would I want to use one of my utility slots to tell my pet to defend a specific location? Or to send him to revive an ally for 200 HP per tick? Signets are freaking lame, even the good ones are more than boring. One third of our utilies are thus either absolutly useless or boring passive stuff.

I think the pets are very reliable right now. Sure they could be better, but so could plenty of other things in this game. They only die quickly if you don’t care to keep them alive, if you equip the wrong pet for a situation (birds aren’t tanks), or you put them in situations they were never meant to survive (like sending the pet to attack two players on its own). The pet shouts work about 9 our of 10 times for me. Setting the pet to Guard a specific location means that you can be in two places at once, without having to worry about giving orders to your pet. This is great if you want to keep a node in check while chasing a player in sPvP, or you need to defend two positions in a PvE situation. The skill has a duration of 180 seconds and also gives the pet stealth (until it attacks) and protection, so as long as the pet doesn’t die, it can be really annoying for your opponents.

Ravel.8145:

To rant even further:
- all minor traits in the marksmanship tree are absolutly useless, horrible and barely noticed. Who ever came up with the idea of these opening strikes needs to…well…just…do something, seriously.
- Too many traits are too good, while others are too mediocre to actually allow for a variety of builds. Whoever uses a bow and does NOT pick up Piercing Arrows for example must really have a good explanation as to why he would choose so.
- There’s no trait in all of the trees that actually grants any !USEFUL! benefit on a dodge roll, something almost every other class has available to them. Don’t you dare say “Companion’s Defense”, because honestly, if you dodge, why would you need to be protected for 2(!) seconds after that? It’s just measly. You would need to spend !30! points in the Nature Magic tree to get a horrible “Dodging removes blind and poison from you (10s cooldown)”. You would also have to deny yourself the still at least decent “Spirits unbound” for that. How bad is that? Just some examples of what other classes can get on dodge: Guardian – Heal nearby allies, Mesmer – create a clone.

- 5 stacks of vulnerability is a nice bonus, 10 stacks is even better, but getting double critical on your first attack is great, when you consider the bonuses your pet can get from a critical hit (30% more damage, bleeding, might, or health), or the bonuses you can get from sigils with a critical hit effect.
- Well I can think of two reason why you wouldn’t use Piercing Arrow. If you’re playing a signet build it makes a lot more sense to pick Signet Mastery and Beastmaster’s Might, or if you want extra condition damage it makes more sense to go with Malicious Training and Keen Edge.
- Your are mixing profession playstyle together again here. The Guardian is the “support profession”, so of curse he adds heals. The Mesmer creating clones on dodge roll is actually slightly overpowered if you ask me (this should at least be a Master major trait), but it makes sense. The Ranger buffs his pet as well as himself, so this also makes sense. The 2 second protection is great when you consider that you also have 50% faster endurance regeneration. Something that only the Engineer has as well, except he has to spend 30 trait points to get it, while the Ranger only has to spend 5.

Ravel.8145:

-snip-

This goes on and on. Other classes have a lot of spells that incorporate a dual nature in their spells, affecting enemies while also granting benefits to you. Guardians block, get protection, build some kind of defensive abilities around them, while damaging foes. Mesmers almost constantly buff themselves in some kind of way while dealing damage and quite a few of their spells change throughout combat (Chaos Storm, Illusionary Leap, Blurred Frenzy etc. Necros depend on the clever use of spells that affect both them and the enemy.

But us rangers we…shoot things. Or we hit them in some kind of way. Most of our abilites only change, when we flank or shoot guys in the back, which doesn’t really happen all that often in a 1on1 and isn’t all that interesting in general (“Guys, look, I just put 2 stacks of Bleeding on that dude over there because for a short time, I could actually shoot him in the backs for two arrows!”). During fights, enemy players don’t really need to learn too much about us. Just don’t step into the red circles on the ground, mind the pet and don’t show the ranger your back and you are fine most of the time. If we start to glow red, we hit a little harder, but it’s pretty much a fire and forget thing. As are the roots. And the spirit just gets pummeled to death when ever you dare to put him up.

Mixing profession playstyles together and saying it means one profession is worse then another, doesn’t make a lot of sense. Each profession has its own strengths, that’s what creates dynamic gameplay. The only reason why the Ranger seems so limited to you is because you’re forgetting the pet. The Ranger can get heals and protection from the pet, just like the Guardian can with weapon skills. But the Guardian gets better protective boons because he is the “support profession”. The Necromancers skills are really not that exciting. You get one skill that ‘moves conditions to foes’ on the staff, and ‘Siphon Health’ on the dagger. But unlike the Ranger, the Necromancer doesn’t have any might or fury boons, and hardly any interrupts or mobility skills. Mesmers adding boons to allies is part of the signature playstyle of the Mesmer. No other profession can buff allies with so many different boons, as easily the Mesmer does it.

No matter which profession you are fighting, you have to be aware of their position, keep an eye on how their character changes, and look for red circles on the ground. That’s pretty much sums up the combat of Guild Wars 2. If you think it’s boring to play with the Ranger, then that’s a personal thing. A lot of people are having fun playing the Ranger, including myself. I think the Warrior is really boring to play, because you don’t have to do anything ells other then buff your own damage. But a lot of other people love that playstyle. It’s simply about personal taste.

The Ranger is the only profession that has a pet with a skill rotation.

You are not required to use any traits. This game requires aim and timing. If you neglect that it’s your own fault. Spirits work fine if you consider your surrounding and place them correctly according to your allies’ position. The point of traps is to lure people into them.

The swords 1 skill is a problem yes. Weapon choice is a personal option, though. If you believe some weapon to be bad, it just means you haven’t considered the options of it enough. Longbow is a great weapon if you use the right rotation. The sword, greatsword, axe, longbow, and torch all have AoE skills. You can get movement speed simply by using a bird, as long as there is someone near you to attack. But if you just want to move across terrain, then even the skill Swoop on greatsword is better than the warhorns swiftness, because it has such a short cooldown time. Plus, Swoop can help you cross gaps that you can’t jump over. The greatsword damage is inferior to the sword though, because it’s so slow.

Lack of overall mobility?
Swiftness:
Warhorn
Shortbow
Rampage As One (With a 120 second cooldown, this is viable to use in Worlds PvP)
Storm Spirit (With the “spirits can move and follow you” major trait)
Tail Wind (A minor trait that gives you swiftness on weapon swap, when in combat. But getting in combat is easy enough; just send your pet to attack a nearby mob)
Birds (Aim at a target that’s a great distance from you, and then call the pet back as soon as it gives you swiftness, if you don’t want to agro the mob. Use the major trait Concentration Training to make the swiftness last 15 seconds instead of 10. Practice makes perfect)
Other:
Signet of the Hunt (10% increased movement speed is great)
Shortbow (Use the ‘turn 180’ key to make the jump move you forward, instead of back)
Greatsword (Swoop makes you leap forward. This skill will actually move you forward faster then the warhorn, because of the short cooldown)

The 30% movement speed for the pet is perfect for PvP, where your opponents are constantly moving around, as it helps the pet to catch up and therefor deal more consistent damage.

I agree that not all our traits are the best, but it’s a good thing we have a choice so we can pick the good ones then. Evasive Purity should really have been on Wilderness Survival, so it could take advantage of the minor traits; ‘increase endurance regeneration with 50%’ and ‘gain 2 second of protection on dodge roll’. The ‘remove poison on dodge roll’ effect still makes it great on it’s own, though.

Me and my new pet…

You want a major trait that only affects one weapon skill? That seems like a waste of a trait.