Guild Wars 2

Anyone else think that no siege should be able to be built on the cliffs and high areas near the spawn Keep?

It’s broken that you can place siege where it can never be harmed at all. Please fix ANet, thanks.

JaironKalach.4938:

Hydrophidian.4319:

So, don’t worry, you can’t possibly lose against us. ‘Cuz that would mean you’re even worse. And that just can’t be possible.

So… Let’s get this out of the way early… You dropped down from T2 where you’ve been sitting for a long time holding out against the likes of FA and Kaening. During the course of that time we were regularly smacked around be DB and either FA and the big K. So, no… no matter how much gloss you put on it, we’re not going to underestimate you. We already expect to get bounced right back down to T4 to give those poor fellows a hard time, so, yeah… try a different tactic.

Actually, we held out against BG (twice) and SOR&SBI remnants, the double-server stuffed version, and then KN for the past few weeks. FA came to visit once then left suddenly.

We’ve learned a lot, and don’t mind sharing the tips and tricks we picked up from T-2. I don’t mean that sarcastically, we learned a ton from all the great guilds we’ve encountered by trying to counter what they did. I’m sure you’ll do the same, and we’ll likely learn things from you guys as well.

Best of luck to everyone, we’ll stop by and say hello soon I’m sure.

Actually I’ve described WvW as a giant, interactive RTS game, because with supply acting as the standard wood/food/money, having to capture/defend specific area’s, it’s exactly that. It even has a giant, shiny, lemming magnet in the middle for all those who can’t get the strategic aspect of things.

Glad someone else made the connection.

RoninDB.9540:

@skin -

I don’t think you read that in the right context! I wasn’t saying you we’re bad players, you know how the good RP TC girls like those bad boys of Blackgate.)) always trying to get us to smoke and stay out late!!

I think this is what you meant?

Magiofdeath.2745:

I know its reset night, but the rankings according to http://mos.millenium.org/matchups#NA at the bottom of the page look hilarious. It looks so f’ed up. Lol.

Bwahahaha, SoR is #14. All that hard work to get into Tier 1…

I know on TC I’ve queued for 45 minutes to get in to WvW and had a friend queue up after I did, wait 10 minutes and get in. To me, that’s very strange, why would anyone who queued after someone else, get in before them?

As for why only 20 people respond on a full map? Not sure, but I have seen a lot of people out roaming around, just hanging out at the keeps or in secluded places; not really participating in the attack/defense of locations. Hopefully things will straighten up and we’ll have more response once the current match is over.

phaneo.4597:

…

Actually I didn’t just insult everyone, but I don’t believe this is the optimal location to discuss. Thanks!

Kerithlan.1659:

Nodrey.3948:

Are you really, really attempting to sell me that having a picnic with the enemy is sound tactics? This is why we cant have victories, or at least more SOR dunking.

And I feel I understand the server quite well. If you wish to RP, RP your hearts out. this is WvW. There is a time for picnics, and there is a time to resist.

You really do not understand Tarnished Coast at all.

I never said that having a picnic was tactical (even in the slightest). I said it was an effective way to end spawn camping and have fun — two things that needed to happen. Capturing camps wasn’t working, we needed to have fun; ergo, picnic.

We can’t have victories because we’re not sitting fat and sassy at the top of Tier 3 and one of our opponents is currently sitting fat and sassy at the top of Tier 2, not because of picnics. Give me a break. I’ll see you for the Dolyak parade on Thursday — bring some fireworks and tonics.

Actually Nodrey has a point…

There is an entire server to go RP in, WvW is not typically the most optimal place to do it, especially when there is usually still a queue to get in. Unless you’re RPing a military company, squad or some other unit out fighting for your homeland from foreign invaders.. Hmm, that sounds like an interesting concept, I wonder if a game company will put it one day.

Why is this not the most optimal idea? You may have taken the spot of someone for whom capturing supply camps, wrecking havok behind enemy lines was fun, or possibly even part of their RP.

All of us who play on TC understand the server. Please don’t try to act as if someone who simply wants to fight for their ‘homeland’ is somehow inferior to someone sitting on a bridge. I fully understand the stress relief factor but seen in another light that “stress relief” tea party could easily be seen as “I’m not winning, I don’t wanna play no more!” and stomping a foot and pouting, low lip atremble and all.

I actually applaud Nodrey’s sentiment. I play WvW not to ‘win’, and most definitely not for any sort of points. I do have a deep pride and appreciation that we’re a plucky bunch and should all want to always resist to the last, stand our ground, never give up, never surrender.

Unfortunately there are quite a few who simply don’t feel this way, and just stop playing; in essence they take their ball and bat and go home. Now let the server win and they come back all smiles, then want to fight, etc. It’s human nature as I’ve said before (in an earlier post) where I think some thought I was from another server. And bad-mouthing TC.

I am from TC, and I’ve loved every minute of my time there since I logged in months and months ago. However, this doesn’t keep me from wanting to win in WvW. Not because it’s some kitten contest, or to get to T1 (we’d never last) but because it’s my home, and always worth fighting for. Especially when things are the worst.

Anyone can fight when things are easy, or equal.. When you’re constantly zerged; 50 vs 5 is possible, all maps flip overnight; it’s like beating your head against the wall. Do you keep fighting? Or go find something else ‘fun’ to do? The choice is made by each of us, but…

If you don’t plan to WvW on the WvW maps, and there is a queue, please also show the respect we’re known for and free up the spot. Someone who does still want to bang around, flail, bite, snarl and howl at the ‘enemy’ may be trying to get in, and maybe for 30+ minutes.. Even if all their struggles don’t matter much in the point spread at the end.

I’m sure others feel differently, but i’d hope that all want to fight for what they hold dear. This could be friends, guildmates, their server, personal pride, or just the satisfaction of ‘winning’ each hour, day or week.

Sometimes, ‘trying’ is the most important thing and should never be scoffed at or somehow implied to be wrong.

I think the “Market Manipulators” are much more visible with anything to do with crafting. I don’t mean only legendary crafting or those single, signature high end items that people make a goal at game’s end.

I don’t know why, but in the past two weeks I have seen low-mid level crafting items, those vials of thin blood, small claws, etc, double in price. A level 35 rare item ranges from 10s – 50s in price.. Each of the single ‘creature drop only’ mat’s cost 1s+ for a single component. A completed insignia can range in the 10s-20s range. The rare’s themselves are from 10s-40s for each.

Now is this a problem with the market traders buying crafting items to make profit and control the market? Or becasue aNet finally banned some bot’s after they roamed the server for multiple weeks? Likely some combination of both.

I do know that ANet has a direct influence in two things: 1) the frequency of which these crafting materials drop from mob’s, since they don’t drop form every one, and also 2) the amount of items needed for each crafting component. I mean, you need FIFTEEN of these for ONE item. Really? Why? For anyone who enjoy’s crafting this is like the “go get 10 bearasses” quest, except you may only get a single bearass from every 1:3 or 1:4 of the mob that normally drops the items.

Yes someone can ‘farm’ the item and I suppose rare’s aren’t needed, but when crafting the third stage of each tier does cost exponentially more than the previous levels. I really think the market manipulators cause that to be much less fun than it could be.

Roy.7405:

Urrid.4593:

TC is on the verge of giving up it seems. (shrugs) have fun in T1 SoR.

I gave up before the week even started. With SoR guaranteed to move up, SBI guaranteed to move down, and TC’s rating practically unchanged regardless of the final score, this week from a score/ranking stand point for TC is irrelevant. That’s why I’m personally using this week to check out PvE stuff (jumping puzzles and Monday’s updates), although I may pop into WvW from time to time.

References: http://mos.millenium.org/matchups#NA

Unfortunately a lot of people feel this way. Apparently if you face any real competition then WvW isn’t “fun” when you’re you’re not stomping everyone else and the maps all belong to you.

I guess it’s human nature to do what’s easiest, but it’s a bit sad when people do that (stop playing when faced with tough resistance), no matter the server they are on.

Shiren.9532:

Vasham.2408:

Shiren.9532:

ArenaNet is really stretching it when they say “January Update”. Sure, the 28th is January, but geese, you are cutting it so close it may as well be called the February update. Every time I read “this month”, I cringed.

I’m excited to see what the Flame and Frost update brings, I guess we will have to wait until next month (the 28th of February would be even more hilarious than January).

I really think they’ve missed the mark with laurels. It’s not immersive, it has built in daily limitations (creating pressure to log in daily and limiting how much you can do on a day you might have more time) and it does very little to improve the existing content – it’s just tacked on top of the existing content. I really hope their goals with expanding the open world rewards and improving on it’s design is a lot more ambitious than laurels. More unique rewards from existing chests (like JP chests, boss event chests from chains, champions etc), maybe make them pieces of a recipe for an item that is currently exclusive to RNG buying on the AH. I’d rather tell people about how I travelled all over Tyria killing giant destroyers, solving jumping puzzles and completing a scavenger hunt to assemble my epic weapons, rather than how I farmed CoF daily for gold and ectos, or flipped items on the TP with my spread sheets just to get enough gold to buy the exorbitantly priced mats for these weapons. It would actually involve me exploring the world, playing through content and it’d actually give a story and sense of real and unique achievement to my gear collecting, rather than encourage me to find the most efficient farms or methods of making gold. Dailies are just another way to turn GW2 into what every other MMO is already doing better.

I wonder if there will be any events added to promote the Flame and Frost: Prelude.

@alcopaul I agree.

I’m pretty sure the Laurels and what you buy with them are the motivation to go back, since if the Holloween patch proved anything it’s that you can add all the content you want to lower level zones and it’s still not going to draw in players unless there’s something worthwhile to get out of it. Same with Southsun Cove, but that suffers from a major lack of events period, not just poor rewards.

Laurels sound as if they are awarded by dailies. What’s to stop people from doing what they already do and just run the easiest dungeon path, do the easiest events, gather in the easiest place and complete the easiest jumping puzzle (read: mesmer portal to the end)? My post isn’t about adding new events or content, it’s about actually integrating (look that word up if you have to, it’s core to the problem of existing content) rewards into unique areas and zones. Rather than tacking on a token token system (both tokens are deliberate) which introduces new rewards but doesn’t truly immerse players in content or integrate the rewards into the content, I’d like to see them do more. Hopefully this is just the beginning and they are going to use the tools the game already has to solve some of these issues better than any token system will.

As far as management speak goes, I know ArenaNet does this kind of thing all the time. When they give a date (read: month, quarter, half, year) they almost always mean very close to the end of that time frame. I was just laughing at how pointless it is calling it a January update, I know they worked hard on it (and what will come later) and I’m not upset, I just think it’s funny that this will be called the January update when the vast 28/31 days of the month went by without it. People will look back on GW2 and read that this stuff came out in January and think to themselves, “I played for almost that entire month and I don’t remember any of that?”. :P

I’d be happy it came out in January as some of the items initially were mentioned as coming in a “February release”…

It’s free content for a game that you paid for one time. If you’re not already into pennies per hour cost of the game you’ve not been enjoying it nearly enough.

Jayne.9251:

Lanthrudar.1437:

I do think it’s puzzling however when some of the same people complain that making things organized is making the server “pro-WvW” are the same people who complain that we’re not winning.. And they either don’t care to show up to help or don’t listen to anyone and do their own thing which can sometimes cause additional problems.

You do realize you just insulted two of our more dedicated WvWers? Coral and Tallisi, like me, are often in there 10-12 hours a day working their butt off.

I wasn’t thinking of them as much as those who voice this idea in mapchat and yet surprisingly never show up when someone ask’s in map/team channel for help to guard a supply depot or escort a yak.

I’ve also seen commanders poo-poo the fact that there was any sort of voice channel where people could listen in to the over-all strategy going on.. I did wonder why anyone with a commander tag would ever discourage trying to let people have more information of overall strategy?

I know all too often I’ve wondered “whats going on??” for over-all strategy, and just being able to listen I felt provided a ton of insight into the flow of how things were going on, and what people were trying to do. From early warnings of attacks, being able to react faster, to getting a glimpse of high level strategy, just having that insight helped a lot.

So if you’re a commander and you’re negative on the idea, of people being able to actually understand what you’re doing beyond a simple “follow me”, I’d have to wonder the reasons why.

Assuming the commander is actually working with others and trying to coordinate things and not just off doing their own thing because they had 100g that is. I’ve seen more than I want who did that also, no idea in WvW and crashed and burned.

Does that apply to the two in question? No idea. I have seen a commander be extremely negative about the very idea of anyone doing more than following their icon, and listening in on any sort of VoIP. Again, makes me wonder why.

When I want to walk to someone when I’m at work I don’t sit there and type everything back and forth, I call them direct, or go talk to them in person. Verbal communication is not a bad thing. Judging by the 40+ people that were in the channel on TCBL yesterday I’d say that a sizable percent of the people on the BL agreed. And all but I think 3-5 of us just listened, that’s all.

Maladon.5760:

Kerithlan.1659:

I’m also sure that there are people on SBI that are burned out from weeks of rough matches.

I’m sure this week’s match is already wearing a bit thin with some people, especially our commanders who are trying to put points on the board. However, we’re winning a lot of fights out there. We just don’t have the resources available to hold many objectives on the map. Doing well in open field fights is going to have to be enough for awhile, at least while we’re up against a server with such a large WvW presence.

And now a couple of pics from a fight earlier tonight to encourage our fellow SBI soldiers. Don’t give up, there’s still plenty of fun to be had…

Pic 1 – Wow that’s a lot of red names

Pic 2 – Hey don’t leave, the party’s just getting started!

First picture.. Lower left corner…

Gangster Gil and his Afro’ed friend “Happy Bob”.

Bob also paints in his spare time, when he’s not with cleaning his rifle or sharpening all those pointy spikes on his arm guards.

Tallis.5607:

Urrid.4593:

I don’t want to win I want to enjoy the community we had. Splitting TC into VoIP and not VoIP has been something I’ve opposed since day one.

I will still be around hoping for good things come February but the state of our WvW community and the state of the game is not helping.

Go ahead and yell at me in game I’ve put in my weeks and months.

Can I hug you instead? :-)

I think that TC’s problem is that some people want this to be a T1 WWW server, with chains of command and common communication networks and daily meetings and what not.

Most of TC is not like that. Most are a group of people for who WWW is fun by itself by itself, not just when we win.

Lately there has been attempts by some to become a pro-WWW server. To be a pro-server you need (due to game mechanics) a zerg-only mentality where people follow orders.

This is never gonne happen on TC. The sooner everyone in TC realises that, the better.

So, no, Coral, I won’t yell at you for voicing the opinion of alot of people on this server. I will yell at your side.

We can make signs and stuff!

Following orders is zerg like? Really? How about volunteering when someone asks for a supply camp to be protected? Or to escort yaks? Both of these actions I’ve heard others instructed to do. Or rather requested in chat. Most agree, at least for awhile.

Is the idea that people on TC are too disorganized and refuse to do anything but follow a zerg? That our TC community refuses to look at overall WvW strategy and think about what needs to get done, without just following whoever has the blue tag turned on?

Is that your premise? It appears to be so.

Perhaps some clarification.. Trying to get everyone who steps into WvW to think of over-all strategy is not a bad thing. It’s not impinging on their rights. It’s a simple acknowledgement, or should be a simple one, that you don’t have to just follow a commander around in a zerg to get anything done.

I know people who disliked WvW until I pointed out them there there was much more to it than following a zerg. That without supply you lose. That the actions each does; building siege in the wrong spots so it can be countered easily, costing not only the support it offered but the supply that’s now gone, and sometimes small little actions (taking a golem for on a joyride and destroying it, when others paid for it and built it) can cause your entire server to suffer.

Once they had a taste of the strategy, how their actions can make a large positive difference, they really enjoyed it. It’s not just running out and beating on more mobs, it can add a whole new dynamic to the game.

Is simply trying to help people understand some of the strategy’s of WvW, that’s it’s really not just the single player out there, but all of us as a team, does that make me some sort of “T-1 pro-WvW” person? If so.. I honestly don’t know what to say..

I always thought that people enjoyed learning new things. That if they just thought beyond themselves, to what the whole group could accomplish, they’d see the big picture.

I guess that just makes me a ‘pro’, and part of some perceived problem with stomping on someone’s fun. Simply because I do want all of the group to do well, as opposed to caring what my personal fun was and doing things randomly.

I do think it’s puzzling however when some of the same people complain that making things organized is making the server “pro-WvW” are the same people who complain that we’re not winning.. And they either don’t care to show up to help or don’t listen to anyone and do their own thing which can sometimes cause additional problems.

gvaughn.4163:

Indo.8629:

I don’t think anyone on SoR is in the mentality of “Let’s dominate T2” but rather the mentality of "Let’s prepare for T1.

(i do not speak for my server or my guild, only myself)

I present to you, Humans, Charr, Norn and Asura alike, the very attitude that is poison to a population and an attitude which, I feel, is poisoning WvW. The rest of this person’s post is worth reading, because it tries, at some length, to justify a strange premise: We should all, eventually, be in T1.

That is the focus. To ‘win’ wvwvwvw. Not to have any sort of fun or any good fights. Indeed, this person goes on to suggest that other servers should be like SoR, or any of the other servers in T1, or any of the other servers clawing their way up to what? Glory? Perfection? A better challenge? We all know it’s a zerg; let’s not pretend.

I would prefer a different goal: that those of us on TC disregard this ongoing clamor for some rarefied air and focus on what we do best. When we make WvWvW a ’player’s club’ we chase off many of the people who make this community bright and beautiful. I bring my thoughts to the Charr present, the Asura present, the Norn present and the Humans present.

Great post. I’d like to respectfully disagree in one aspect however.. Trying to have the TC player community become more organized, and strategy focused, which I’ve heard are apparently causing complaints on the server, does not in any way make it a “players club”.

I thoroughly enjoy the TC server community, and have since I first logged in. However, trying to bring a bit of structure to the herd of cats that can sometimes abound on WvW maps from the TC side of things, shouldn’t be seen in a negative light.

Even roleplayers like to be competitive and even win sometimes you know.

It’s not bad to try to teach and help people learn the strategies of how WvW functions, i.e. there is much, much more to it than blindly following a zerg or waiting for a commander to tell you what to do. I know roleplayers can be very “free spirited” (been known to RP a bit myself) but I just hope that there is a realization that WvW is it’s own type of game, it’s not the same as PvE with more intelligent NPC’s. There is a strategy and method to it.

I think some would really like it if they asked around and tried to learn and didn’t just stop thinking, and blindly follow the commander. These can sometimes also be the same people who complain in mapchat that no one has done anything, when they’ve sat around for hours waiting for someone else to step up.

None of this makes it a “players club”, unless perhaps people feel that any attempt to try to wrangle all the cats somehow is imposing on their freedoms.. Who knows.

Why exactly do we need a new RP server? TC does great at that now. Unless the desire is to be in the last place WvW server so you can fill up the battlegrounds and RP fights and no one care?

ninjambo.3784:

Waffler.1257:

Just a thread to speculate on the new tiers after all the servers settle.
Tier 3: TC-FA-SBI

I would put SBI in tier 4 maybe even tier 5.

CD and DB will most likely be fighting over tier 3 each week, with FA and TC (Oh boy who can wait) duking it out every week for T3 victory.

I see this too. Except TC will have learned a bit more than we used to from our stint in T-2.. Might be interesting. We’re definitely getting a lot of experience handling zerg’s, and how to counter, deflect, and distract them, that’s for sure.

tkalamba.2541:

Sunspots.9861:

Welcome to the new Tier 2! Despite the greater BS going on on all fronts, I’m still having fun on SoRBL, good fights. Here’s your update:

Its good to hear. With the tier imbalance at the moment, might aswell just play to have fun

What imbalance? You mean all the people jumping to SoR? You mean you previously couldn’t field large zergs on 2 maps in dual pronged assaults last week?

ajm.2931:

Matt Witter.6982:

snip…

Currently, some players causing the AoE are able to do more damage to one person while also controlling a portion of the field, compared to a player with single target damage.
…snip

Really, this is what is driving your concerns? If the AoE didn’t damage the person in the field, how would the AoE control a portion of the field?

I think he means they do more damage to a single target than a single target attack would AND they close off a portion of the field. So you have an AOE that’s a little OP compared to single target damage and a terrain take-away, all in one skill. That’s a little too powerful if so.

I still like the idea of a “damage pool” where the AOE does the same damage a single target attack would so in the same time frame, but spread over targets affected. Remove the AOE cap, if it hit’s 25 people in the coverage zone then they’d all take 4% of the total output over the DOT duration. One person would take 100%.

This balances the total damage for AOE vs. ST attacks, and if it takes 3 seconds to channel the AOE and the single attack takes .5 seconds, it would be single target X 6 for total AOE damage applied each tick.

Making this damage take effect each tick, would also solve some issues where condition type damage only takes effect on the last tick, not before.

nekos.2584:

Roo Stercogburn.9671:

Sorry you are having internal troubles but free transfers are killing WvW and need to end as wannabe-winners are hopping from one server to the next.

This probably won’t help you but at least you are finding out who is worth sticking with and who isn’t.

Free transfers are not killing WvW. The guilds that are exploiting it are killing WvW. The saddest part is that paid transfers are not going to fix the problem. From what i understand it will cost $5 – $7 to transfer servers. $28 at most per month for these guilds to continue transferring servers each week. Anet has chosen to profit from the problem instead of fixing it. Sure their PR is that once paid transfers go in it will stop this type of behavior / guilds transferring to lower tiers. The reality is that it will do nothing more then line their pockets and they know it… It’s intentional.

ANet does not have some sort of diabolical software that brainwashes people to do what they want.

People need to stop blaming the game company and blame the players that do these actions. Just because it’s easier to blame an anonymous company for the actions of your friends that doesn’t’ mean the blame is justified or fair. Free transfer’s have to stop. Otherwise most servers will have little community especially in something like WvW.

I’m sorry the OP has encountered problems but as someone mentioned things flow and ebb in life, you lose track with some friends and you gain new ones. If you really want to make soemthing work usually some sort of compromise is made, thus with almost everything we do as people.

Best of luck, but again, ANet is not to blame for the actions of their player base.

Perhaps you should.. er.. transfer.. servers to someplace that has more people? If that will make you happier?

Thobek.1730:

Liquid.9672:

Sunspots.9861:

BG shoud be fighting for second place. Any third place team that is new to a bracket that isn’t clawing and fighting for any success they can get would be foolish. If I played for BG I’d be squeezing the crap out of JQ at all hours because the best way to change the horizon of the T1 landscape is to first take JQ out of the picture. I have no horse in this race, but I do see things shaking up soon.

You can take 2nd place by squeezing PPT out of the leader too, while tightening the score at the same time thus leeching off their rating if you don’t manage 2nd. Win win. Just because a server is in 2nd place doesn’t always make them a softer target.

if you squeeze the leader then all you will get is retaliation from them, while 2nd place tries to create more of a distance between 2nd and 3rd. If BG were smart they would go after JQ while SoS tries to keep JQ from coming 1st. Then BG wouldn’t get doubled teamed and remain very close to 2nd place.

Umm, this is cowardly “logic”… #1 has the most points, yes? Is #2 and #3 take ppt from #1 the spread is double than if they take it from each other, regarding trying to catch up.

If #1 loses 20 points and #2 or #3 gain those 20 points that’s a 40 ppt change. If #2 or #3 take points from each other all they did was swap 20 points, #1 is still gaining their 20 points per turn they started with.

One method the point leader loses double and drops faster, the other method the #2 and #3 may swap positions but neither alters their relation to #1. And if a server wants to win they must make #1 lose points over time. That’s a fairly simple concept and should be easily understood..

It’s in the #1 team interest 100% of the time to have #2 and #3 fighting each other because it helps them keep their lead.

Exarthious.5792:

There is no reason any AoE ability should do more to a single target, than a single target ability. You shouldn’t even argue that, ever.

What you should be trying to get them to do, is make it so that our AEs hit MORE targets, say 15, instead of 5.

But like all MMOs, the majority who play the classes who’re getting changed will fight tooth, and nail against the change, without offering up better alternatives, that are more reasonable.

Sure let my AOE hit more targets for less damage, sure.. If they balance that damage vs the opportunity cost of the time it takes to use an AOE since most of them are chanelled.. Oh wait, and most of them can be dodged out of too.. Hard to dodge a single target, instant attack like the thieves have.

Hey maybe we can all roll thieves?

morrolan.9608:

From dulfy:

dulfy.1493:

• One of the issues brought up a lot in WvW./sPvP is AoE (Area of Effect). We feel like they are too strong at the moment and a lot of people in WvW are gaming the system using AoEs.
• For people that don’t know – max targets for siege weapons is 50 while max targets for AoE is 5.
• Reducing AoE effectiveness to bring them in line with the single target damage skills.
• Major update coming to all the AoE skills – make classes that are good at single target damage stand out a bit more.
• Same thing with dungeons – right now if you have a lot of AoE you can past encounters by just spamming AoE which is not what we want.

http://dulfy.net/2013/01/17/gw2-dev-livestream-jan-17-transcript/

Does anyone here know what they mean about people gaming the system?

So they want single target DPS builds, oh like Thief, to be even better? Really? Is that the direction this is going now? They had better be very very careful in how they handle AOE or they will have a firestorm with complaints about the class as opposed to just the large bonfire they have now. They will require major re-balance once this is implemented or some classes will disappear while some will be even more prolific, and guess what, how do you get a thief out of stealth? AOE. Surprise!

I think “Gaming the system” is when people just target a single area with AOE to the point that if you want into the zone you’re insta-killed. This is especially true if attacking wall tops or sometimes defending.

Be interesting to see how the balance it so we suddenly don’t see all Warriors and Thieves and have people you literally can’t kill due to no way to catch them, slow them down, etc…

Will ele’s and necro’s be useful once they nerf AOE’s?

Niall Illrian.6341:

It’s amazing how many players I talk to in game that hate this visual. Wonder why ANET never discusses the farting issue that we have?

Maybe because there are 99.99999999% other things in the game more important?

Good grief, you have one of the the most powerful class in the game, other classes wish the dev’s paid as much attention to them as warriors get and you’re worried about an animation?

Use a different signet if it bothers you that much.

tkalamba.2541:

Phoenixfudge.5290:

I see…

Those guilds made the right choice xD. One upside of this is having the luxury of SM waypoint. Seems like I hadn’t been able to use that in ages.

One of the guilds actually came down a tier too.

Did they come from BG?

Proumbro.1376:

pot.6805:

tkalamba.2541:

style.6173:

oltouch.2913:

ughh, so Sor just got a guild in it with 9 commanders. Why dont you guys transfer over to 2nd or 3rd place servers -_-

Wait, there are guilds in SoR besides Choo? jk. I do give Choo props for having the best guild name I’ve seen.

We take alot of pride in it. We even /shout Choo Choo! when charging into battle

Coolest thing Ive heard that happens on SoR!

Then you’ll love the train whistle we occasionally blow in TS when we do something awesome

Train whistle? Pft, that’s nothing! Blow a train horn in TS, you know, the one that’s air powered and about 3 feet long? Then, then i’ll be impressed. :P

Heh, it’s amusing that the vast majority of people defending the current thief as-is, play one.. Surprising? Not really..

Fletch.3572:

I don’t get it, I’m not going to complain, but… Why are you even putting her back in if you are going to remover her again in a months time?

To allow anyone who haven’t used the commendations yet to do so. The same reason the WintersDay vendor is still here.

Lazy.2389:

Looks like I’m in a similar position to Unspecified. I’m disappointed but understand that the BLC keys were hurting their sales. I think the fact that I’m not on very often any more has softened the blow.

It’s all still not good the way this was handled. The only comment given about this before was that Lyns would still be here through Wintersday which was massively misguiding. The ability to exchance then removed without warning. No comment given besides she will be back eventually.

Meh, whatever. I hope she has “restocked” with at least something useful to me. Like unspecified said, there’s only so many picks we can carry lol.

Actually, they said she’d be around but would not accept donations. That was in the patch notes. Patch notes are your friend, it helps to read them thoroughly when they come out.

elderan.2638:

elderan.2638:

Considering how strongly Anet reacted to the whole snowflake/ecto “exploit” thing, I think they know that some people made a zillion exotic jewelry pieces (when they only cost 1 ecto) to turn into commendations to get BL keys. I will be surprised if after the “restocking” the BL keys are still there tbh.

…aaand my speculation proves correct. By the way, posting pics showing that you have 76,500 tokens probably didn’t help your case. That’s 268 keys, costing over 24,000 gems, or $300.

If they limited the amount of total keys you could get per account to something low like 5, it would still allow some to take advantage without breaking the system. Players can do this already with gold/gem conversion and buy them outright, this would just be a different way by wrapping extra wood and ore.

If players wanted to spend another $30+ IRL money to buy a second copy and make a new account, hey ANET still get’s a share, win win all around.

Niim.9260:

While they are doing this, they should also make it so that sentries have a point. Whatever the new setup is, they should be able to stop a dolyak from getting through. Dolyaks just walking past them, defeats the point of them even being there imo.

Roving route guards? Hmm, be interesting if a 5-6 pack of mixed vet guards roamed the roads like they do around the supply camps. Independent of the yaks themselves (who would have their own guard party)

Chessrook.8643:

Kerithlan.1659:

I don’t get any sort of reward when I defend a yak from getting killed and get it to barely slip by into a tower portal, but the person attacking the yak does get a reward for killing the yak.

Yeah, that’s because when there WERE rewards, bots were walking the easiest Dolyak routes 24/7 and getting loads of cash and karma while swallowing up space for actual players.

Sounds like it’s a problem ANet needs to fix with bots, not hurting actual players, which is what happens now. I think one of the reason people don’t escort yaks sometimes is because of this. shrugs

MagiKarp.8201:

Just saying, have any of the people agreeing with this post played in T1?

If you don’t defend / heal your own Yak’s thats your servers problem, it shouldn’t be free supply. If this sort of thing was implemented getting Bay to t3 would be a sinch because the Yak literally walks 20 metres.

The only way to deny a bay upg is to snipe the Yaks / flip Vale which can be impossible as it is right on the opposing players spawn.

If you defend your Yaks the guards are invaluable, they chain blind and immobilize, this is overpowered if the attacking player cannot cure stacked conditions it can mean the guards blind and the others immobilise is death for yak slapper.

Supply chain cutting as stated by Anet many times “run in a small group or on your own and cut the supply chain” “WvW is for everyone not just big guilds”

The suggested change would be terrible.

Are you suggesting that in T-1 there is never a single incident where a single Thief can take out a yak guarded by multiple players as well as the guards? Or is the worry that a servers 1-2 person thief teams having to change their strategies?

This change would benefit everyone and force them all to play more strategically. At no point should one character be able to teleport in, kill a heavily guarded target and get out in <3-5 seconds as happens now because they know that the yak is next to defenseless compared to guards/players.

One person can still take out the yak but if they are guarded they have to actually beat the guards first, that’s the point. If Bay is upgraded, that’s what siege is for.

LieutenantGoogle.7326:

Open field monsters nor sentries will actually kill a yak except for the hylek/dredge/orge/skritt and hatarmi invasion mobs.
Those random kraits or bats and sentries serve to slow down the yak, if there is no actual inference then the yak will be fine. The guard upgrade serves to speed up the yak ever so slightly be removing the combat speed when being attacked by the standard monsters.

For actual defense though, they are next to useless.

In addition to giving the yak protection as long as the guards are all up, let the yak break into 33% boosted run speed as soon as they or the guards are attacked as well.

This would at least force people to play small teams to take them down or some sort of cripple/freeze in effect.

Samhayn.2385:

Columba.9730:

Other games have stealth break on damage and break upon attacking. I don’t understand why this game made stealth even more powerful than it is in other games. Even in other games stealth causes mass complaints although it’s less powerful.

Stealth lasts 4 sec (speced) unless its shadows refuge. No other game limits stealth to this short of a duration. Hence the reason it does not break on damage.
If it broke on damage it would be useless and we would be low hp/ low armor warriors with no group support.

Which Stealth? There are multiple skills that grant the ability, or the “teleport” ability and they don’t share a global timer. In case you weren’t counting it “Shadowstep” counts as a ‘stealth like’ ability as well and there are at least three weapons with an ability that uses that as well.

Put them all (all stealth and rapid movement abilities) on the same 10-15 second global and you’d likely see a lot less complaints about the class. I believe someone said HS can be spammed, no timer and the range is how far? That’s about as close to a “teleport out of range” defensive type ability that I’ve seen, even if it was primarily meant as an offensive attribute.

Global timer, drastically shorten the range of any of the SS or HS abilities (450-600 max range, global timer also) and don’t let stealth drop target, but offer something like “protection” and not appearing ont he screen for X seconds and people would be happy. Well, all non thief players would be happy anyway. All the thief players who fully utilize the imbalanced mechanics currently in place wouldn’t like it much I bet..

Give them a better point/vit ratio if that makes them too weak as a compensation. shrugs

Raven Paradox.1860:

And I do agree with Cirus. One issue with Blackgate is we have a ton of PuGs. I just wish they’d understand they’d be more useful if they’d join a WvW guild for when they WvW. But then again, full queues on Friday, now outmanned buffs today.

This is not a problem with the PUG’s. It’s a problem with the Commanders of the WvW guilds if they refuse to work with PUG’s to accomplish server-wide goals.

Otherwise you’re basically spitting in the face of free reinforcements, people who likely want to help but don’t necessarily want to give up their friends for the rest of the game. At that point it’s up to all the commanders on your server side to work with all the people who are in the zone to coordinate and work effectively.

I’ve personally seen one set of commanders that flat out said “We don’t work with PUGs” (there were two in the map, both from the same guild) in map chat and guess what, they received zero help when they asked for it.

akamon.2769:

TheDevilWithinU.7092:

Sunspots.9861:

TheDevilWithinU.7092:

FXLEACH.9436:

;_;777777777777

This error.. I get it all the time yet I cannot find a fix ;w;

Do you have aoe circles set to show? I used to crash alot till I turned this back on.

I do… I may have to try that out and see if it helps.

going to have to give this a shot too. too many times right before a wall or gate comes down, i get this. :///

that being said, just got a new rig! puts laptop aside for now
can’t wait to test it out, especially in WvW.

New rig? Does it have 18 wheels, a diesel engine and haul cargo? If not, it’s not a “rig”, lol..

Conditional Love.8149:

Jayne.9251:

I say this completely selfishly, but I kind of hope SBI comes in third — only to keep them with us for at least another week. The matchups this week have reinvigorated us all — SoR, TC and SBI. It’s been a ton of fun.

As an SoS player, you can keep SBI. I am having a lot of fun crushing BG.

Just some questions. Did blackgate use nonsurvival stacks in T2? Did they ever backstab a SoR v TC fight? Did they QQ about 2v1 and coverage?

Blackgate seems to be a different beast in T1. We call them turtlegate.

FWIW, Blackgate put up quite a fight in the first 2 days, but in my opinion SBI is more skillful and experienced.

Backstab? You mean squash a group that was attacking a location once all the defenders were engaged and the hard work of beating down the door was done? Yep, they did it all the time, and usually pointed and laughed at those they smashed with their zerg when the former attacking force was pinned between defenders and their groups.

Zephyrus.9680:

+1 to OP.

I’ve noticed even fighting 1v1 there’s always (or usually?) like 1 second of ‘culling’ when coming out of stealth where they basically get the first couple hits in before even appearing and it’s not that culling from large numbers of players on the screen.

Last night on my thief I took down 2 ballistas from full in the middle of about 6 people spamming all over. Took 5+ mins and I didn’t die. On the way out, a couple of them left, I killed 2 of the people (probably 1v3 don’t remember), and escaped with my life. Perhaps a little luck too but this shouldn’t really be possible to get away with, with that many people doing all they could to stop me. And this was not the numbers where true culling happens.

With my build now (not D/D), 1v2s are generally not difficult and 1v3s (lvl 80s) are very possible (depends on classes), given enough time.

Blind, block, and dodge rolls are soft counters that can prolong a fight but some harder counters are needed to stealth. Like a conditional mechanic that would bring them out of stealth (say if they took 20% of their total hp in that instance of being hidden).

At least disable the initial cast of Shadow Step while CCed because that just seems like a game breaking escape skill to me.

TL;DR: Reworking the stealth/escape mechanics on theif are needed. More lazy damage nerfs are NOT needed.

IMO.

Add counters to any and all of their stealth skills and “mass-movement” abilities like every other class has, or cut the range on all of them to <450 each with a 5 second global timer and you’d see a lot less abuse of the current mechanics and they’d actually be much more balanced.

I don’t have a problem with the idea of stealth, or the ability to rapidly move and doge, that’s what a thief is, stealth, mobility and damage. However, being able to move beyond 1500 range in <3 seconds from a standing stop where both classes are running the same combat speed, and abusing any system lag, etc to spam stealth via culling or mass-mobility abilities is a bit much.

Master of Timespace.2548:

Thiefs are balanced tbh. I personally have more problems with very agressive warriors or guards with 10 minute burns.
Sure, they use culling a bit but you can just spam “target nearest” to see them. It really isn’t that much of an issue.

What would really “fix” thieves, is to let them stealth so they can’t be hit and can either run or set up their next attack but…

They do not lose targetting. i.e. you don’t have to re-select them when they pop back into view. This would eliminate using culling as “extra stealth” and balance the mechanic to be more like protection and other items that other classes get. I have yet to see anyone not a thief have a problem with this idea..

Note: This doesn’t mean that they can be viewed at all when they are stealthed, so it’s not like their red circle would show when stealth.

I’ve read the new “state of the game” and think it’s very exciting. I’ve played the game for months and enjoyed my time here.

One thing I am very tired of.. For the past three months we’ve had to complete X fractals per month for the completion.. Enough is enough! Change this out please!

" Our goal will be to use our existing reward systems and build new ones that are fun and exciting that step away from the stale gear grind reward systems you see elsewhere."

With this being said, why are you forcing us to do the exact same grind month after month? I dislike the fractals. They are not fun. So please, STOP MAKING IT A MONTHLY REQUIREMENT!

Digivolution.8029:

TC, just let me get Mendon’s Gap poi for map complete alright?…

And what server are you on? Trying to get TC to capture it for you, or on an ‘enemy’ server and want to be let through?

Details, always helps to have more details.. “They’re at the gate!” Ok, what gate, and where? “Hills!” Ok, which, North or South, etc..

Details always help.

Doomdesire.9365:

Lanthrudar.1437:

Doomdesire.9365:

Iohanna.4863:

Doomdesire.9365:

Iohanna.4863:

An affront to Thieves has been detected.

Sir, a little known fact even among Thieves is that the follow-up skill to Infiltrator’s Strike – Shadow Return – is an almost unlimited range teleport. This may look like a hack to those who don’t know about it.

Some Thieves have reported teleporting so far that they had to go through the WvW loading screen. Infiltrator’s Strike is no. 2 main-hand sword, so sword Thieves can do this pretty often.

Actually the range is 10000, it’s an extremely funny skill to use, and yes, it does give you loading screens when you go too far =D

Also, a weird glitch, sometimes if you place it behind an object that would normally block shadowstep, and you go far enough, you will go through it, I’m guessing because it hasn’t rendered any object while it’s loading. I don’t think it works with towers, but it’s interesting nonetheless.

So if we can load Trebuchets with Thieves and fire them, those Thieves can later Shadow Return back to the Trebuchet?

EDIT: Illustrating 10000 range.

Well how it works is that you place down a trap, and in order to shadowstep back, someone must activate that trap, and in actuality, you shadowstep to the person who activated the trap, not the trap itself. In addition, once activated, you only have a few seconds to shadowstep back, otherwise you lose the option too and must restart, but yeah, it is possible, however it’s entirely luck that it would happen. The more likely scenario is using it as an ambush, which I do use sometimes. Place it on a commonly used road and wait behind a bush far away and go for the ambush :P

In actual WvW gameplay, that’s the only real use I found the trap for. I can’t find another use for it, due to the few seconds you get upon someone activating the trap, and the unlikely hood that someone would even activate it.

If anet removed that timer, the trap would be a great skill. We could activate it and stalk someone without being there. If thieves ever get extreme nerfs, I hope traps are given some love, because I really want to see the timer removed and the true potential of this trap revealed.

If they did this they they’d need to put a range of 900-1200 on the ability to warp to it, just like every other ability in the game has a max effective range. Interesting idea for the skill though, sounds like it could be tweaked a bit like most other classes have tweaks to make them a bit more effective.

If the range was only 900/1200, we would be back to square 1 imo, because thieves would just use shadowstep with 1200 range, with acts as a stunbreaker X2 and a traveling tool.

Does it have a timer? If not, put timer’s on all their abilities so they can’t be spammed and people will have to learn to use more than one thing. Shadowstep, being able to leap as far as most weapons shoot is a bit too long anyway, but all this is a discussion for another thread.

Good luck in the WvW this week no matter your side

Not sure how this person was in the wall but…

They were actually deeper inside the wall/under the ramp initially, to the point you could only see part of their name. Luckily AOE’s still work for that sort of thing.

I’ve read the posts by dev’s saying to keep reporting bots, and yet I’ve reported all I see, reported them dozens of times and I still see them daily blipping through zone after zone every day, for weeks..

These are the “teleport in, gather, teleport out” kind, which I’ve taken to ‘friending’ and then reporting over and over.

I am not asking to be told what happens to them, but literally if you see the same toon cycling through the zones after watching them cheat, report it, and weeks later they are still around, why bother?

Talking to my guild they do the same thing and they too still see the bot’s around weeks after they are first reported.. Can something please be done about these? Thanks!

(Sorry if this is a redundant thread)

Akinorix.5107:

ykyk.2740:

covenn.7165:

Anyone been following the T1 scores? I find them quite interesting

It’s almost impossible to be doing that badly during oceanic prime time with the numbers and skill that BG have shown themselves capable of. Either the other 2 servers are absolute monstrosities with 4 full map queues and godlike players or BG gave up. I find that quite a disappointment as I was rooting for them to make a showing after beating T2 so badly =/

Bg were untested all they did was pvdoor, because both TC and SoR has no presents, and now that they have to actually fight to take keeps they can’t keep up

From what I’ve seen, this^.

Not to discount that BG’s Oceanic players/guilds do not have skills, they may just be very rusty after weeks/months of not fighting other large scale active groups. Hopefully their Oceanics will limber up, unfreeze their skills and keep on slugging it out over there. I think they belong in T-1, for more even matching during coverage if nothing else.

And yes, it was nice to not wake up and have everything blanketed by BG simply due to PvDoor.

Doomdesire.9365:

Iohanna.4863:

Doomdesire.9365:

Iohanna.4863:

An affront to Thieves has been detected.

Sir, a little known fact even among Thieves is that the follow-up skill to Infiltrator’s Strike – Shadow Return – is an almost unlimited range teleport. This may look like a hack to those who don’t know about it.

Some Thieves have reported teleporting so far that they had to go through the WvW loading screen. Infiltrator’s Strike is no. 2 main-hand sword, so sword Thieves can do this pretty often.

Actually the range is 10000, it’s an extremely funny skill to use, and yes, it does give you loading screens when you go too far =D

Also, a weird glitch, sometimes if you place it behind an object that would normally block shadowstep, and you go far enough, you will go through it, I’m guessing because it hasn’t rendered any object while it’s loading. I don’t think it works with towers, but it’s interesting nonetheless.

So if we can load Trebuchets with Thieves and fire them, those Thieves can later Shadow Return back to the Trebuchet?

EDIT: Illustrating 10000 range.

Well how it works is that you place down a trap, and in order to shadowstep back, someone must activate that trap, and in actuality, you shadowstep to the person who activated the trap, not the trap itself. In addition, once activated, you only have a few seconds to shadowstep back, otherwise you lose the option too and must restart, but yeah, it is possible, however it’s entirely luck that it would happen. The more likely scenario is using it as an ambush, which I do use sometimes. Place it on a commonly used road and wait behind a bush far away and go for the ambush :P

In actual WvW gameplay, that’s the only real use I found the trap for. I can’t find another use for it, due to the few seconds you get upon someone activating the trap, and the unlikely hood that someone would even activate it.

If anet removed that timer, the trap would be a great skill. We could activate it and stalk someone without being there. If thieves ever get extreme nerfs, I hope traps are given some love, because I really want to see the timer removed and the true potential of this trap revealed.

If they did this they they’d need to put a range of 900-1200 on the ability to warp to it, just like every other ability in the game has a max effective range. Interesting idea for the skill though, sounds like it could be tweaked a bit like most other classes have tweaks to make them a bit more effective.

MiasmicMist.1420:

2 Hour Bay Fight in SBI Map, Reset Night! Both TC and SBI broke in on us! Keep in mind, long fight, lot of footage. Part 1 of 3 !!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TYRhBIAg5fE

In the picture below, this is what we had left on the map when SBI capped it at 7am EST, lol, poor us.

…look at the horde of red names waiting to break through the door.. Ouch!

Xirin.8593:

drwookie.6391:

And yet when I provide evidence to counter your argument, you just claim it is an “exception to the rule”. So it seems we are at an impasse. Continue to complain all you want I guess since you won’t listen to evidence against your stance.

We can continue this over PM if you’d like, but in short: posting one scenario versus virtually countless (we could post a screenshot for every minute over the past 36 hours and they would be almost identical) is not quite overwhelming evidence in your favor. Again, 2v1 is legit. Denying it is not.

Kunagisa.7361:

Hi guys, this is the evidence of SoS and JQ teaming up against BG in EB

/squints at borderlands

I remember that push from earlier this afternoon. I was flabbergasted. Alas, it was fleeting.

Pardon the interruption but, from an outside observer viewpoint, i find it highly ironic that anyone on BG would ever complain about any 2v1 fights. Just last week they were encouraging #2 and #3 to fight against themselves while they of course, rolled over whom they chose (usually #3).

I would suggest those on BG adjust to the new scenario, and enjoy the reaping of the karma of your so judiciously provided former comments. You know, where you offered encouragement for others to do exactly what is happening to you now? Who best to drain points from than the #3 server? You fully encouraged that tactic over the past 8 weeks yourselves.

With that being said the match sounds like it is a lot of fun (for most at least) so I hope everyone is having a good time. Good luck to all!