Guild Wars 2

coglin.1496:

Engineers do not use signets, because of 2 reasons. One explanation Anet put out on this question in beta was that engineers do not believe in magic and signets are pure magic. 2, we have elixirs in place of signets. There for we essentially have signets, only they are named elixirs.

There. You directly made the claim.

You directly say this: “we have elixirs in place of signets. There fore we essentially have signets, only they are named elixirs”

You clearly suggested that the two are very similar.

And again, you are so desparate to distract people from the fact that you clearly said “we essentially have signets, only they are named elixirs”, that you are making up kitten about me hating the engineer and nitpicking.

You said it, stop denying it.

coglin.1496:

Lyuben.2613:

But why elixirs? Why not turrets? Why not kits? Why not gadgets? They share the common trait that they have nothing to do with signets, just like elixirs.

Elixirs have nothing in common with signets, at all.

Why not go play a signet class then? The whole point is that they have nothing in common at all.

Seriously, as much as you complain about every single aspect of the engineer and have done so since beta, are you just that much of a masochist, that you continue to play it as much as you hate it?

Learn. To. Read.

I don’t care about signets, I care about your comment
“we have elixirs in place of signets. There for we essentially have signets, only they are named elixirs.”

You directly claim that either by lore, or by mechanics that signets are like elixirs.

Now you seem to be backtracking.

You made a silly claim, and I called you out on it.

I never said I wanted signets. I was just questioning the non existent logic of the quote above from you.

coglin.1496:

Lyuben.2613:

No, but I’m only talking about your silly suggestion that signets=elixirs.

Lore wise, they are nothing alike. Mechanically, they are nothing alike.

Its like saying, turrets=shouts.

It has no meaning.

Silly? Perhaps you need to learn to read.

I never suggested signets = elixirs or that elixirs = signets.

I said we have “elixirs in place of signets”. If you do not want to have a serious conversation, and you prefer to make things up, and claim folks stated things that they did not, then why didn’t you just say so. I will now turn my keyboard over to my 10 year old, and he will finish any further debate with you Lyuben.

But why elixirs? Why not turrets? Why not kits? Why not gadgets? They share the common trait that they have nothing to do with signets, just like elixirs.

Elixirs have nothing in common with signets, at all.

coglin.1496:

Don’t be so dense. I was not making a rock hard literal comparison. I am sayin that they are our version of signets, essentially.

Brutus Tarsi.1283:

So Anet’s idea of balance in this instance is… we will give every class a passive boost in performance, and to the engineers… here is a potion that MIGHT give you something good.. or it might give you something utterly useless for your situation… How does that even make sense?

I mean, there are always oddities in the game, and thats great, but this seems a bit… illogical to me.

I missed the part everything had to be exactly equal between all classes and races. Do you find it reasonable for all classes to demand to have a special class mechanic for each utility as we do?

No, but I’m only talking about your silly suggestion that signets=elixirs.

Lore wise, they are nothing alike. Mechanically, they are nothing alike.

Its like saying, turrets=shouts.

It has no meaning.

Agreed.

I’ve suggested this for ages myself, hope they implement it.

They did remove plague as an option from elixir X, so the obviously can.

coglin.1496:

Engineers do not use signets, because of 2 reasons. One explanation Anet put out on this question in beta was that engineers do not believe in magic and signets are pure magic. 2, we have elixirs in place of signets. There for we essentially have signets, only they are named elixirs.

Signets= elixirs?

I must have missed the part where elixirs have passive and active effects…

No Mel, its not AoE bleeding.

Its a single target bleed.

Its essentially:

4s single target bleed+alright direct damage
vs
2s single target bleed+low direct damage AoE

JsusHdRvive.5829:

Lyuben.2613:

Its very much intended, insofar as it is intended behavior as a bundle.

The trouble is, Arenanet want to have their cake and eat it too. They want kits to have nice things like auto attack, sigils stats and so on… but they don’t seem to be changing them from bundles. So, while they are bundles its working as intended.

I’m sorry but even if we were to go along with your flawed logic bundles not having auto attack enabled by default is not intended.

Then try it on any bundle…

Pick one up, drop it and see if it is remembered.

I’m guessing its there to stop it so if you accidentally set auto attack on a boulder for example, that the next time you pick one up, you immediately throw it.

You can easily test it.

Furthermore, if you are doubting that kits are bundles. Then go to a high spot, in LA for example, equikittent and try toggling the kit off while falling. See what message you get.

MarioMetroid.6953:

Lyuben.2613:

Some of my oddities I guess:

Armour mods is inferior to the warrior version in every way.
Coated Bullets is inferior to the warriors crack shot in every way.
Elixir S is superior to mist form in every way.
Warriors get a minor trait that increases damage against bleeding foes by 10%, engineers get one that does so by 5%.
Elementalists have a minor trait that increases damage per boon by 2%, engineers have one that increases damage by 1% per boon.
Necros have a minor trait that causes bleed on crit 66% of the time, engineers have one that causes it 30% of the time. (Not sure if they have an ICD or its duration though)

Weird how Arenanet allows skills/traits that are functionally the exact same, but balances them differently.

It could be because Elementalists can only stack roughly half as many boons as engineers reliably. For Necros, there is a lot more opportunity cost going for a crit build + that trait than, say, engineer going for a crit build +bleed on crit trait. I don’t think I can rationalize the warrior stuff.

Also, before you possibly shut me down completely Lyuben, I’m just trying to offer what might be ANet’s rationale behind these values, I don’t know if there is actual weight behind my statements – maybe elementalists can stack the same number of boons as an engineer reliably while speccing for that trait. I haven’t looked hard enough at the trait trees for other professions to give a complete, comprehensive opinion.

I understand that there could be some rationale of course.

The problem I have though is… its literally the same skill but balanced differently.

Often the simplest explanation is the right one, and it seems simpler that engineers were the first class to be balanced. As Arenanet famously stated during BWE3, being with shippable traits, and all else came after them in terms of balance.

I’d honestly have skills be equal, if they are copies, or give them something to differentiate them.

Having the same skill but better hurts man. It hurts your soul.

Human.

I had these thoughts too, but in the end, it all comes down to aesthetics. Your story will end, your racial skills are not important, so what matters is looking good.

I think I look good.

I’m just comparing to the engineer version. Would be helpful if anyone knew.

Some of my oddities I guess:

Armour mods is inferior to the warrior version in every way.
Coated Bullets is inferior to the warriors crack shot in every way.
Elixir S is superior to mist form in every way.
Warriors get a minor trait that increases damage against bleeding foes by 10%, engineers get one that does so by 5%.
Elementalists have a minor trait that increases damage per boon by 2%, engineers have one that increases damage by 1% per boon.
Necros have a minor trait that causes bleed on crit 66% of the time, engineers have one that causes it 30% of the time. (Not sure if they have an ICD or its duration though)

Weird how Arenanet allows skills/traits that are functionally the exact same, but balances them differently.

5 kits.
5 Turrets.
5 Gadgets.

Turrets are bad.

Lets not get ahead of ourselves here.

I’m not in favour of copying someone else, but pistols do need a buff.

Their bleeding component is terrible, and their direct damage component is terrible, and the AoE is hardly anything to brag about so…

Buff them up indeed.

Sporadicus.1028:

Well said, Brutus and Lyuben.

We have to sacrifice a utility slot in order to have an extra weapon, so we are hindered from the start with attack and utility options.

A good example of this hindering us very much is PvP.

Many players use a variety of stunlock and conditions to defeat other players. Usually a player will stack a utility effect to remove stuns, a utility effect to remove conditions, and still have a free utility slot to do something else. Yes, some of their healing skills remove conditions, but there are drawbacks.

If an engineer wants a second weapon set, he has to spend a utility slot to get it. This means he doesn’t have an extra utility to use. So if he wants a special effect, he now has to sacrifice either a condition-removal or a stun-removal utility.

We have lose a utility slot in order to have more weapon flexibility.

To be fair, I am fine with this system.

But it is as you described.

Whether it is one that you like or don’t like is down to you really.

achmed.6542:

Lyuben.2613:

Having utility, does not make you a utility skill. You are mistaking one thing, that has a similar name, to something else that it has nothing to do with.

A utility skill, goes in the 7-9 slots.

Thats exactly what i ment with beeing a nitpicker. why care where its placed?

Kits do go there, but they do not contribute to the number of utility skills, since all they do is change skill 1-5, rather than being used WITH your skills 1-5.

With tools:IV they do contribute something and even if not, it usualy just requires a second keypress of the desired skill. Some skills of other classes require them to pre charge them before they can be used. does this disqualify them as utility skill?

And I actualy can use them WITH my 1-5 skills.
if you cant use them with your weapon then you probably just havent figured out how to switch weapons yet.

You can’t use kits with your 1-5 skills because kits are your 1-5 skills.

You have to swap to use both.

I tried a flamethrower build once, compared to grenades it was weak.

Range isn’t there, damage isn’t there, buggy and honestly… not got the same utility.

I liked the chill, the blind, the poison of grenades. Flamethrower didn’t match that.

Buff FT damage a lot. Fix the misses.

Buff it hugely. Getting hit by a FT should not be “oh look, a FT”, it should be “OH KITTEN A FT RUN AWAY”

SixSins.7610:

arcdash.4039:

No i did not read what you posted. Because you’re just trying to tell us how your favorite class is underpowered. There are people in each of the classes forums arguing about how their class is underpowered in one way or another.

Toolbelts are effectively extra utility skills, by choosing one utility skill, you get two skills with different effects. Other classes only get one skill per utility slot, while Engies get 2. Sure, if you pick a kit, you’d get 5 weapon skills and a toolbelt skill, but that’d be like a Thief having grenades in the secondary weapon slot and having grenade barrage as a utility, except you would’ve have nearly as much switching cooldown. Or you could take Rocket Boots and Rocket Kick for what is effectively extra utility, something another class would have. The reason Engies have toolbelt skills is so that they aren’t sacrificing a slot just for the weapon skills, they still get something to use when they’re not using the kit. So basically…the toolbelt skills act in place of the lost utlility skills.

Take for example the healing skill Med Kit. The kit itself is somewhat weak healing wise, and the main self heal, which for another class would be the skill in the utility slot, is actually the toolbelt skill. But the kit itself is still valuable in the healing slot because it also functions as a weapon slot like you’ve said.

So basically…Engies get 4 extra skills to use to their discretion. Most of them tend to stand on their own, especially the kit ones.

Hold on. Just think about this. You say I get 4 extra slots to make up for losing 1. So a net gain of three slots. But the problem I see is that Elementalist gets 20 weapon skills and 3 utility slots. More than all mine put together. Mesmer gets 10 weapon skills, 3 utility skills, and 4 F1-F4 keys that provide them with utility. The Thief gets the ability to have 0 CD on all 10 of their weapon skills for as long as they can keep Initiative up AND some of their BEST utilities and trait trees regen the stuff for them? And they still get 3 utilities. Guardians get 10 weapon slots, 3 utilities, and 3 constant buffs that can become party-wide for a CD providing utility. These other classes get the same or more utility on their bars than us and maintain 3 Utilities to do it. I have to drop one just to match that?

Don’t get me wrong. I like the IDEA of Weapon Kits, but I don’t want to slot them if they aren’t worth it. It’s not losing the slot that I complain about, it’s losing the slot to something that: doesn’t save auto attacks, doesn’t get weapon stats, doesn’t activate swap sigils, AND still has buggy abilities or bad synergy with the class/other skills in the kit. If they fix all that, then I’ll slot them happily. Until then, I will do so unhappily as my support/Condition build makes the most of EG as it is currently because that kit was MADE for builds like that.

That is indeed a fair point.

Kits are, by all means, inferior weapons.

They ought to be weapons. Like attunements for the elementalist.

They recently changed elementalists to use on swap sigils, so change kits to be like attunements, just with a 1s cooldown.

A real shame it looks like a sniper.

Us engineers use our rifle like a shotgun…

Pandering to warriors it seems.

achmed.6542:

Lyuben.2613:

Those aren’t utility skills.
Those are weapon skills.
I don’t count jump shot as a utility… do you?
A utility is a very specific thing, and it is a skill that goes in slot 7-9

By my defintion a utility skill serves passive or defensive purposes or enable me to utilize its effect somehow. So yes, I do call jump shot a utility skill. it can help me closing or gaining a gap.

if you choose the nitpicky way of seeing things then yes, kits are not a utility skill.

But if you see Kits as an extention of utility skills, like i do, you got way more then any other class will ever get.

Yours is the nitpicky way I’m afraid.

Having utility, does not make you a utility skill. You are mistaking one thing, that has a similar name, to something else that it has nothing to do with.

A utility skill, goes in the 7-9 slots.

Kits do go there, but they do not contribute to the number of utility skills, since all they do is change skill 1-5, rather than being used WITH your skills 1-5.

Yup, that works.

You can’t stack the buff though, only make use of it while using a kit.

arcdash.4039:

But by your own definition, Lyuben, kits are utility skills. Which they are.

And how do toolbelt skills not count for anything? There’s one for each utility slot, so even if you’re not counting a kit as a true utility skill for some reason, you still have extra skills on your bar that you were able to choose and make your build around.

No the toolbelt doesn’t count because you get a toolbelt regardless of whether or not you pick a kit. Did you not read anything I posted?

1 kit= 4 toolbelts
0 kit= 4 toolbelts

Therefore, the kit granting you a toolbelt is irrelevant.

And by my definition? No.. kits aren’t utilities. The kit is found there, but it is in reality, access to 5 weapon skills.

An engineer with 3 kits has the following:

5 weapon skills, 1 heal, elite, 4 toolbelts on his bar at any time.

With 0 kits he has:

5 weapon skills, 1 heal, 3 utilities, elite, 4 toolbelts on his bar.

The distinction is, that kits are a ‘dead slot’. The thing that goes on the utility bar, is simply “use kit” and “stow kit”, its not an ability. It simply changes your first 5 by equipping a bundle.

To call a kit a utility, is to call the “Equip Flamethrower” button, a utility. Which it isn’t. It is simply something that facilitates changing your weapon skills, nothing more.

Engineers lose a utility skill, when they add a kit, to gain access to 5 different weapon skills. Why is this concept so foreign and hard to understand?

Its been that way since BWE1.

The way you describe how it works is … pre open beta.

Toss B works completely randomly though.

Red Falcon.8257:

You’re not understanding the reasons behind the health differences.

Relying health pool is the worst possible way of playing GW2.
Ask yourself why a Guardian with 14k health lasts 4 times more than a Warrior with 32k.
Ele has low health pool because he’s got the range advantage, kiting tools, pets, etc.
If we give Eles high health pool and remove his tools he’ll be much weaker.

L2P issue.

Range advantage? Clearly you have no clue what you are talking about.

What about a dagger elementalist? Or a scepter/dagger one? Theirs isn’t long range.

And the reason why the warrior isn’t surviving? Because he sucks. Health isn’t everything, but if you can’t make do with 32k health, then something is very wrong.

Now I value Guardians for their defensive capabilities, but they aren’t THAT amazing or OP.

The virtue of resolve heals you for a very insignificant amount. Aegis triggers extremely rarely and it has no way to know what it will block. Abilities like shelter, are balanced by them healing you for a low amount. And in terms of utilities, you don’t have a lot of self preservation.

While I do understand that the Guardian has a lot of defensive capabilities, I don’t see how they necessarily allow him to last 4 times longer than a warrior with so much health.

Sounds like you are either making things up, or the warrior you are talking about is terrible.

tjeb.6503:

As someone already said, I suspect they fear balancing issues, and may need to seriously nerf the kits themselves. I am not 80 yet, so I don’t know how crippled the current situation really is.

As far as a credible nontechnical ‘explanation’ goes, why wouldn’t kits ‘fit on’ your weapons (e.g. grenades+rifle = grenade launcher) and hence receive their stats as well?

(and wouldn kitten then be even cooler if the kit’s skills would actually mesh and depend on your weapons skills? Guess it’s a bit late in the game for that, and I also guess we are supposed to have enough customizability already as well)

I suspect lack of skill to fix it,and lack of time to do so.

They promised to fix these, but the trouble is that they haven’t… kits are bundles and not weapons. That’s the problem.

achmed.6542:

Lyuben.2613:

@Achmed

People often justify kits by saying ‘But you get a toolbelt! So you don’t lose a utility’

snip

Engineer with 0 kits=
5 weapon skills, 1 heal skill, 3 utilities, 1 elite, 4 toolbelt skills
Engineer with 1 kit
10 weapon skills, 1 heal skill, 2 utilities, 1 elite, 4 toolbelt skills
Engineer with 2 kit
15 weapon skills, 1 heal skill, 1 utilities, 1 elite, 4 toolbelt skills
Engineer with 3 kit
20 weapon skills, 1 heal skill, 0 utilities, 1 elite, 4 toolbelt skills

snip

Its a simple trade off. 5 weapon skills for 1 utility.

But somehow you seem to completly ignore that Kits usualy have utility skills as well
bomb kit – smoke and gluebomb
grenade kit – freeze and blind
Tool kit – shield, snare (and magnet?)
elixir gun – speedbuff, super elixir and acid bomb
Flamethrower – knockback and blind

thats plenty of utility skills. and all these kit have an addition free attack/skill if you choose the right trait. also, we are the only class that actualy has changeable toolbelt skills. This all leaves us more skills then any other class out there will ever have.
this makes up for the so called lost utility slots pretty well for me. especialy since their cooldowns are usualy rather low.

Im running arround with 4 kits BECAUSE it gives me more then double utility skills then i would gain from a normal utility skill.

Those aren’t utility skills.

Those are weapon skills.

I don’t count jump shot as a utility… do you?

A utility is a very specific thing, and it is a skill that goes in slot 7-9

@CptCosmic

Why change to rocket boots? Its how the skill is designed, and how it works.

Its not like you have a shortage of stun breakers… you have 3 others to pick from.

Tassy.5891:

I hate to be the one to say it, but this isnt Warcraft (thank christ)…
We dont need everything to be exactly same, aN I hope to hell devs NEVER!! do so.
“normalization” as blizzard called it, is an insult to anyone’s intelligence. Diversity is what made the real MMO’s so popular an Anet are the first company in a LONG! time to bring back at least a small amount of it.

Strangely enough my 80 Ele didn’t use one single piece of vit gear an I leveled to 80 faster than my Necro did.

Funny that, but then I don’t feel its “unfair” for others to have something I don’t. in fact I hope to see more diversity not less.

That must be quite a feat with your elementalist. Well done.

And on the topic of normalization. I think there are cases where it is appropriate, and cases where it is not. Its a bit short sighted to say that any change is bad, and leave it at that.

As I see it, vitality should be a stat that is equally valued, across all professions, in order to give everyone the same base. I’m only looking at the base remember, not the entire build.

So, what I hope to see is that if everyone has the same base health, then diversity goes up, since lower health classes now are less pigeonholed into vitality, while higher health classes factor vitality more into their equation, as opposed to brushing it off as they usually do.

Didn’t intend this to turn into a discussion of elementalists, but I do see some issues there.

My main problem is with how vitality is perceived by other classes:

Low Health Classes-
10805
Medium Health Classes-
15082
Big Health CLasses-
18372

Now, adding 100 vitality.
It makes a 9% difference on low health.
It makes a 6.6% on a medium health.
It makes a 5.4% difference on a high health.

Simply put… vitality is too important for making builds in low health classes, and not important enough for high health classes.

I’ll agree with magnetic inversion, but the others are pretty much fine.

Speaking of silliness…

Where does the engineer get all his ammo/bombs/grenades.

He goes through so much of the stuff, that it likely exceeds his own mass by several degrees.

Where does supply crate come from? What If I’m in some enclosed dungeon fighting ghosts… it gets teleported?

Why don’t engineers bombs hurt them? Seems logical.

Why does rifle have a 1000 range, but thrown grenades 1200?

Logic would dictate that a rifle is longer range than something that your arm throws.

I honestly agree.

Whenever I hear of a sniper kit, I simply think of all those videos 12 year olds made a while back with that Crawling song… just makes me feel embarrassed for them you know… makes me feel bad.

Firstly: Its a bit impractical. I learnt a while ago, to ask for changes that are reasonable and achievable first, and then after they are fixed, start going into the crazy areas.

A sniper kit is no good to us, if kits are still treated as bundles for example.

Furthermore… it would take a lot of coding, and would either replace an existing elite, an existing utility OR it would be a new one there, and frankly, other professions would be kitten as engineers have one more utility/elite than they do, and they would demand some new thing and it would get crazy. And of course, if you replace something to facilitate the kit, then people who used it before would be kitten

And finally… traits. They would need to be changed up significantly, and or more added, to make a sniper kit viable.

In the end: its a lot of work. Maybe it would have been a good suggestion in the early Betas. But now? Need to be more reasonably.

A better suggestion for filling the gap is changing how grenade kit works:

Change it so it works somewhat similar to jump shot.
The problem with jumpshot of course, is that it has a preset time it has to be in the air. Which leads to you looking silly while you use it for the jump and landing damage.

Well maybe apply something like that to grenades? If the range of grenades is below 600, then they act like they do now, but anything thrown past 600, has a preset flight time on it. Maybe 1.5s maximum.

So, throwing at max range, would be significantly sped up.

GankSinatra.2653:

Lyuben.2613:

Engineer:
5 weapon skills, 1 heal, 3 utilities, 1 elite, toolbelt mechanic

Everyone else (and elementalist):
10(20)weapon skills, 1 utility, 1 elite and a class mechanic(attunements)

lolwat. Attunements just put cooldowns on your current and previously used spells. Toolbelt means you get extra kitten skills. Are you claiming that eles have better utility than engis? Just..no.

But i guess class forums are always a bit whiny so whatevs.

What are you talking about?

I’m saying that all elementalists have 20 weapon skills, 1 heal skill, 3 utilities and 1 elite skill.

I was only making a comment about the number of utilities, and weapon skills.

I’m not making a judgement, I am just comparing numbers.

I mean… honestly. The engineers utilities, in my opinion of course, are better than the elementalists. Literally in one case as I have found out.

Elixir S:
3s evade, instant stun break, can use utilities and heal while evading.
60s cooldown

Mist Form:
3s evade, instant stun break, can use utilities and heal while evading.
75s cooldown.

@Achmed

People often justify kits by saying ‘But you get a toolbelt! So you don’t lose a utility’

For example, when someone says “I don’t like that I lose a utility slot to get a flamethrower, when every other class has 10 or more weapon skills naturally at no cost to their utility slots”, someone might answer “you don’t lose a utility slot, you get incendiary ammo!”

Which is of course, false, but it is a common response.
Lets take a look at a few things to disprove it:

Engineer with 0 kits=
5 weapon skills, 1 heal skill, 3 utilities, 1 elite, 4 toolbelt skills
Engineer with 1 kit
10 weapon skills, 1 heal skill, 2 utilities, 1 elite, 4 toolbelt skills
Engineer with 2 kit
15 weapon skills, 1 heal skill, 1 utilities, 1 elite, 4 toolbelt skills
Engineer with 3 kit
20 weapon skills, 1 heal skill, 0 utilities, 1 elite, 4 toolbelt skills

So, as you can clearly see. The only thing that changes when you add a kit is loss of one utility, and gaining of 5 weapon skills. Now obviously, right now you never gain 5 weapon skills but for the sake of simplicity, lets assume that kits are not bundles, but weapons. As you can see, you always, in every build, get a toolbelt skill, no matter what you do, its present in every build. 0 kits, and 3 kits. So, taking a kit is basically a choice you make. Do I want access to 5 more weapon abilities than usual? And it comes at the cost of a utility slot.

Its a simple trade off. 5 weapon skills for 1 utility.

What OP has identified is that the engineers need to lose 1 utility, to reach the base number of weapon skills that every other class has. And it is true.

Whether or not that concept is one you like or dislike, depends on whether or not you like kits, and think its a worthwhile sacrifice.

Not an issue of warriors having too much and being overpowered, more of an issue of elementalists, guardians and thieves having too little, so their builds are skewed in favour of finding vitality, while on the other hand, warriors and necros have so much of it, that their builds have less importance on it.

Vitality ought to be an equal value stat.

Buck.7562:

Micajah Eriksson, looking like the Grand Marshall of Mardi Gras.

That one does look good.

What gear is that?

Honestly.

I tried an elementalist, and making a proper build for one is nightmare.

Unless you find some way of finding vitality, you are screwed. Either going 20-30 points in water magic, and then its still weaker than a base ranger/engineer/mesmer or by using gear with vitality.

As a warrior or necromancer, concerns about vitality are pretty secondary. Its a nice thing to have sometimes.

I play an engineer with 200 points invested in vitality, and a naked warrior has more health than me.

To me, the difference in vitality simply makes the choice of gear for some classes really narrow, and thus builds, while for others, it makes it very open.

I don’t like that one bit.

I suggest simply going down the middle, and having everyone have a base health of 15082, with the difference in armour being the flavour, rather than huge differences in health.

Please help.

This is really frustrating.

Any ways and tips on finding the last spot?

On the topic of conditions.

Is it possible to go for a power build as an elementalist?

I greatly prefer power to conditions builds for many reasons.

If you examine the engineer, you’ll find that he has a lot of ‘redundancy’, where skills do similar things.

How many stun breaks do we have? 4. That’s a whole lot of stun breaks. Can’t even fit all of them in your bar.

How many melee kits do we have? 3, out of 5. C’mon… and then consider that the rifle is pretty much a melee weapon.

So… counting kits and pistol+rifle, which is 7 total things to choose from.

Engineers have 4/7 of their weapons working best at a melee range.
The rest?
Mid range.

I’m not going to pretend that grenades are viable long range. Maybe against static enemies, but I think being able to hit moving targets, is what makes a long range weapon, a long range weapon.

Ahh, yours is a big bugfix.

I’m not so sure its a bug though, more of a design flaw.

Bugfix:
Either Kits as bundles, or flamethrower aiming issues.

Suggested Change:
Drastically remove the RNG of all elixirs.

Tone it down. Every tossed elixir that is pure RNG, should have one common component. Elixir X needs to be just a pure huge offensive buff. Toss S needs to be reliable stability. Elixir C needs to pick from defensive boons.

Ahh, I remember the good old days when I discovered this.

Fact of the matter is, engineers do technically have 1 less weapon swap (assuming kits ever become weapons) than everyone else.

This is of course, due to the way kits take up utilities.

Engineer:
5 weapon skills, 1 heal, 3 utilities, 1 elite, toolbelt mechanic

Everyone else (and elementalist):
10(20)weapon skills, 1 utility, 1 elite and a class mechanic(attunements)

So in the end, giving up a utility slot, so that engineers have the same number of ‘weapon skills’ as everyone else, means that the engineer suddenly has 1 less utility.

And that’s it I suppose. A choice, you either have less utility, or less weapon skills.

Its not like its a balancing concern, its more of a design concern if you don’t appreciate it. Engineers are in theory equally balanced with 0 kits and 4 kits so… hopefully it isn’t an issue.

And don’t listen to anyone who will tell you “but you get a toolbelt”, its old nonsense. You do lose a utility slot. No getting around it.

I can see it being used in jumping puzzles… I suppose.

But no real application.

The best example of how randomness is a disadvantage is simply looking at elixir U vs all the other quickness buffs.

First of all: its 4 seconds, the tooltip says 5 but it is wrong.

From that base, we can see:

Haste: 4s Quickness+No endurance and no endurance Regen for 4s
Quickening Zephyr: 4s Quickness+no healing for 4s
Frenzy: 4s Quickness+50% more damage taken for 4s

Elixir U: 4s Quickness+ No endurance and no endurance Regen for 4s/no healing for 4s/50% more damage taken for 4s

As you can see, the engineer has a physical disadvantage in that his debuff is random, so he cannot effectively plan, and instead has to react to it. A warrior can rely on a protection buff from himself or allies, a ranger can use his heal before, a thief can take ‘dodge’ utilities and stealth to substitute for dodging but an engineer? He can’t possibly build for all 3 outcomes, and must react.

Its very much intended, insofar as it is intended behavior as a bundle.

The trouble is, Arenanet want to have their cake and eat it too. They want kits to have nice things like auto attack, sigils stats and so on… but they don’t seem to be changing them from bundles. So, while they are bundles its working as intended.

I’ve got a level 8 norn ele that I hope to bring up, but what I’m wondering is… how do I get the best out of him?

I played an engineer to 80 before, and it was a smooth, easy ride. But so far, I’m having trouble with the ele. I use two daggers, and am finding that fire specc annihilates things really well, but you are a wet tissue, and if you don’t go fire spec, you can’t kill anything.

Any strategies, utilities and weapons I ought to look out for?

Where can I find such a list?

And I’ve got all the ones you listed :S

Probably some nameless cave…

Now, I’ve got 100% exploration in these zones, and it is the part when the map expands that counts but… how do I know where to look? I’m lost for ideas on what I can do.

Lets talk about solutions. I don’t think eliminating it is possible, as much as I’d like it, its admitting you are wrong and Mr. Peters wouldn’t do that.

Anyway:
Elixir H- Give regen every time, and either prot or swiftness or vigor.
Toss H- Give regen every time, and either prot or swiftness or vigor.

Toss B- Give Fury every time, and either might, swiftness or retaliation.
Toss S- Give stability (would give engineers a solid source of stability. Which they don’t have. Engineers aren’t in a rush for stealth…)
Elixir C- Lower randomness. Make it only potential defensive boons, so 5s regen, 5s prot, 5s vigor and 5s aegis, as opposed to every type of boon.
Toss C- Same principle as above.
Elixir U- Give it a unique engineer debuff, as random debuffs are terrible for planning. Maybe disable toolbelts while under its effects, or something like that.
Toss U- Remove veil of invisibility from possible choices. So that both possible ones have to do with stopping projectiles. Lower cooldown to 45s then.
Elixir X- No transformations. 8s quickness, stability,fury,3 stacks of might and swiftness. 180s cooldown

It was from someone snipping him talking in /map during the betas.

I’ll look for an image.

Edit: Found it.

http://i.imgur.com/w0mKZ.jpg

Brutus Tarsi.1283:

Why, specifically, don’t they scale well with power? Is it because of a low base damage? I guess I just never fully understood this (though I have accepted it as fact, I have no idea why lol)

Because power isn’t a linear thing.

It is arbitrary in most cases. Abilities have scaling modifiers, and that determines how well power scales.

And its not linear. One skill could scale 0.5, 1.1, 2.5, 0.2 with power. Its all arbitrary.